[01:07] <noob2> I have a question about the ligitamacy of a ban I got
[01:10] <noob2> anyone here?
[01:23] <noob2> anyone here?
[01:23] <rww> hi
[01:23] <noob2> rww i believe I was unjustly banned
[01:24] <rww> are you the... ah, yes.
[01:24] <noob2> So i was in ubuntu-offtopic
[01:24] <rww> come back in 24 hours and we'll talk about your attitude issue
[04:32] <bazhang> clean out unused nodes?
[04:32] <rww> inodes, I guess
[04:33] <rww> translates to "wipe free space" in English, I think
[04:34] <bazhang> no idea why he would want that. some imaginary security gain or somesuch
[04:35] <rww> personally, wiping hard disks falls under my "doing it yourself means you'll probably screw it up" rule for encryption and other such things
[04:35] <rww> the glorious internet made DBAN to do it for me, so yeah.
[04:36] <bazhang> was I right about zombiex' question?
[04:37] <rww> I'd throw a caution about doing backups first in there. Otherwise, yes.
[04:37] <rww> also, the "minecraft?" and "minecraft or bitcoin?" question I see occasionally amuse me
[05:17] <Myrtti> spidersense tickles on #u, but dont know why
[06:48] <bazhang> ur...
[06:51] <Myrtti> ur?
[06:51] <rww> Myrtti: theadmin in #ubuntu
[06:52] <Myrtti> right
[06:52] <Myrtti> I was in my backlog
[06:54] <bazhang> that would be a good ban forward channel
[06:54] <bazhang> more than one ignore on the !u factoid
[06:56] <rww> The Akkadian Empire doesn't have an ISO code. I am flabbergasted :(
[06:57] <bazhang> hehe
[07:44] <bazhang> what a surprise. truepurple causing issues again
 how long do you plan to mute me?
[07:54] <truepurple> I have done nothing wrong, yet bazhang has muted me and will not tell me why
[07:54] <bazhang> truepurple, depends entirely on you
[07:54] <truepurple> dont BS me!
[07:55] <truepurple> dont try to blame me for what is your abuse of power!
[07:55] <bazhang> !coc | truepurple
[07:55] <truepurple> yeah, read it yourself!
[07:55] <bazhang> !guidelines | truepurple
[07:55] <truepurple> read it yourself!!!!
[07:56] <truepurple> It is totally unreasonable for you to mute me in the first place, but to refuse to give me reason as well...
[07:56] <truepurple> Is there anyone else awake in this channel?
[07:57] <bazhang> truepurple, you are adding unknown factors to using unetbootin and the like, then accusing others of making you defensive.
[07:57] <truepurple> BS
[07:57] <truepurple> that is not at all true
[07:57] <bazhang> truepurple, nit-wit in this (of many) instance (s)
[07:58] <truepurple> that is a random string of words
[07:58] <bazhang> !1984 | truepurple have a read
[07:58] <truepurple> Since your not paying attention and I know I did nothing wrong
[07:59] <bazhang> truepurple, thats not for you to determine.
[07:59] <bazhang> truepurple, you were disrupting the channel (again).
[07:59] <truepurple> your abusing your powers, that is why I am in this channel
[07:59] <truepurple> abusing/misusing, whatever
[07:59] <truepurple> I was not disrupting the channel
[08:00] <truepurple> Your just wrong on many levels
[08:00] <bazhang> truepurple, then your +q cannot be resolved at this time. come back when you wish to discuss.
[08:00] <truepurple> I asked for help getting "live CD" for usb flash drive to work
[08:00] <bazhang> and you were given help. help that works.
[08:01] <truepurple> instead of helping me, I was told "use unetbootin"
[08:01] <truepurple> WHen I said unetbootin didn't suit my needs, you guys demanded to know why
[08:01] <bazhang> truepurple, you were given that option, and the usb link
[08:01] <truepurple> I explained my reasons, then you wanted to know the reasons behind those reasons
[08:01] <bazhang> truepurple, thats two
[08:01] <truepurple> And I told you I had followed those instructions before even coming to the channel!
[08:01] <bazhang> ?
[08:02] <truepurple> You will need to elaborate on that question if you want me to answer
[08:03] <truepurple> And I didnt say anyone else made me defensive, that other guy was acting defensive
[08:03] <bazhang> truepurple, it's not simply the matter at hand.
[08:03] <truepurple> I did not understand that
[08:03] <bazhang> truepurple, you have a very long recent history of disrupting the channel.
[08:03] <truepurple> Oh
[08:03] <truepurple> Not really
[08:03] <bazhang> so shall we address that or not
[08:04] <truepurple> You guys decide a apple is a orange, so its a orange, even though it was a apple
[08:04] <truepurple> And this happens several times, so its a history of oranges, even though most of them were apples
[08:04] <bazhang> truepurple, channel moderation is important in such a large channel, something you seem to be unused to
[08:04] <truepurple> I agree
[08:05] <truepurple> I wish you know how to do the job
[08:05] <bazhang> disrupting the channel is not acceptable in this case
[08:05] <truepurple> I wasn't disrupting the channel
[08:05] <bazhang> truepurple, then there is no resolution to the issue.
[08:05] <truepurple> How long do you plan to mute me?
[08:06] <truepurple> Anyway, maybe we cant resolve it, but I hope to appeal it
[08:06] <bazhang> truepurple, come back when you wish to address the issue.
[08:06] <truepurple> I wish to address my unfair treatment right now
[08:06] <bazhang> !appeals | truepurple
[08:07] <bazhang> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/AppealProcess   truepurple
[08:07] <truepurple> Ok, but that still doesnt answer my question
[08:07] <truepurple> How long do you plan to mute me?
[08:07] <bazhang> I've already said.
[08:07] <truepurple> You said nothing
[08:08] <truepurple> You said "truepurple, come back when you wish to address the issue." which amounts to nothing
[08:08] <bazhang> truepurple, you were being disruptive, thus the mute.
[08:08] <truepurple> No I wasnt
[08:08] <truepurple> "come back when I want to address the issue", that is now
[08:09] <bazhang> truepurple, when it seen that you can be in the channel and not cause the issues that you have been doing so much recently, then we can resolve it.
[08:09] <bazhang> truepurple, and I gave you links to read, the code of conduct and the guidelines. which you refused to read.
[08:09] <truepurple> Beyond the fictional BS of most of that statement, if I am muted, it won't matter what it seems like, I will be muted!
[08:10] <truepurple> I won't be able to speak, so how will I be able to show anything?
[08:10] <bazhang> truepurple, given your attitude, there is not a removal of the mute in the foreseeable future
[08:10] <truepurple> So forever, on a whim from you?
[08:10] <truepurple> This is such a raw deal
[08:10] <bazhang> hardly.
[08:11] <truepurple> No, exactly
[08:11] <truepurple> How was I being disruptive?
[08:11] <truepurple> Not answering your irrelevant questions was disruptive?
[08:11] <bazhang> truepurple, no need to re-trod that ground.
[08:11] <truepurple> there is need, I have been muted indefinitely, that makes for need
[08:12] <bazhang> truepurple, then read the links given above, and we can move forward.
[08:12] <truepurple> I will give the appeals process a read
[08:12] <bazhang> truepurple, that is fine.
[08:12] <bazhang> truepurple, step 1, visiting here, is complete.
[08:13] <truepurple> And you should read the rules, and the words of the people you mute unfairly
[08:13] <bazhang> truepurple, there is not a way to move forward, here.
[08:14] <truepurple> Then how do you recommend we "move forward" other then appeal?
[08:14] <bazhang> read the links above.
[08:14] <truepurple> I have before
[08:14] <truepurple> I was following the rules
[08:14] <bazhang> take time to read them again.
[08:14] <truepurple> And if I come back and say I did latter on?
[08:15] <bazhang> truepurple, there seems to be a lack of understanding on your part. you were being disruptive (yet again) in #ubuntu
[08:15] <truepurple> Is what your looking for, graveling and confirmation from me that your treatment of me was justified?
[08:15] <truepurple> What do you want from me?
[08:17] <bazhang> truepurple, there is really nothing further to discuss. you seem to believe you are a victim in all this (and all the other cases as well).
[08:17] <truepurple> I mean you say "come back when your ready to talk about it" and I was ready to talk about it, yet you werent and it wasn't good enough for you
[08:17] <truepurple> Only in the circumstances where I was a victim, not in those where I was not
[08:20] <truepurple> Of course coming to this channel to resolve such a issue isnt much use when your the only one here, not that the rest of the group has proven themselves to be the type that listens, considers and understands that much.
[08:20] <truepurple> You all seem to believe your so much better then us
[08:21] <bazhang> ?
[08:21] <truepurple> maybe not all, but many
[08:22] <truepurple> That is what really happened behind this incident, I was trying to do something, and you two felt you knew better. So instead of trying to help me do what I wanted, you tried to make me justify what I wanted to you
[08:23] <bazhang> truepurple, then you know exactly what you want to do, that's great.
[08:23] <truepurple> And when I didn't let your suggested actions override my own, you got angry
[08:23] <truepurple> and defensive
[08:23] <truepurple> and muted me
[08:27] <bazhang> truepurple, that stands at odds with what actually happened. since this will not be resolved, I suggest you follow through with the appeals process.
[08:28] <truepurple> I could go through it event by event and show that is what happened
[08:28] <truepurple> Maybe not precisely, but mostly.
[08:29] <bazhang> the channel is logged, you have a link to them.
[08:29] <truepurple> link to who?
[08:29] <truepurple> oh, you mean the channel log
[08:30] <bazhang> the channel ( #ubuntu ) is logged, you have a link to the channel #ubuntu logs.
[08:30] <truepurple> where is that link?
[08:30] <bazhang> !1984 > truepurple
[08:31] <truepurple> I have the actual logs in my client too, so shall I go over them and show what happened?
[08:32] <truepurple> bazhang,
[08:32] <bazhang> truepurple, no need.
[08:32] <truepurple> There seems to be alot of need
[08:32] <bazhang> truepurple, the mute will not be removed.
[08:33] <truepurple> Lets see, your lying, your (essentially) calling me a lier, and you got me on indefinite mute. That strikes me as a LOT of need
[08:33] <truepurple> For these appeal things, how much detail are they generally looking for?
[08:35] <truepurple> bazhang, and when generally are there people in the irc council room?
[08:35] <truepurple> I mean not sleepers
[08:35] <bazhang> truepurple, sorry, no idea.
[08:35] <truepurple> bazhang, on both accounts?
 bazhang, and when generally are there people in the irc council room?  <---- sorry, no idea
[08:37] <truepurple> bazhang, Yes, and I also asked you how much detail they generally want with appeals
[08:55] <bazhang> truepurple, please follow through with the appeals process. there is nothing further to be said here. Please do not idle in this channel.
[09:26] <truepurple> Someone here besides baz?
[09:26] <bazhang> truepurple, whats the issue
[09:26] <truepurple> You know the issue
[09:26] <truepurple> My issue is with you, so I need to speak to someone else of ops
[09:27] <bazhang> truepurple, you were following the appeals process
[09:27] <truepurple> I talked to someone in the council channel, I was told I should give a bit of effort to resolve it in ops too
[09:27] <truepurple> I was told this wasn't mandatory, but it seemed reasonable anyway.
[09:28] <truepurple> So is there someone else here?
[09:28] <oCean> truepurple: you can talk to me, but since you have been pointed to the appeals process, I'm not going to change anything about your current mute
[09:28] <truepurple> oCean, as I said, it was suggested that I try to resolve it through ops first
[09:29] <oCean> truepurple: in the end, that's bazhang's choice, not mine.
 hopefully you can get this fixed in -ops, but if not, just email
 so i suggest you try once more in -ops tomorrow, and failing to get your issue fixed, mail irc-council@lists.ubuntu.com with your side of the story. we will then have a look
[09:30] <truepurple> oCean, might I tell you what happened and then would you please try to render fair opinion?
[09:31] <oCean> besides the fact that now is probably not tomorrow, I read the logs from #ubuntu and I got the idea that you were purposefully not giving appropriate feedback
[09:31] <oCean> truepurple: sure
[09:32] <truepurple> I was not answering irrelevant questions to what I was trying to do, and not answering questions is in no way shape or form "disrupting the channel"
[09:32] <truepurple> How can I disrupt the channel by what I DON'T say?
[09:33] <oCean> let me answer that
[09:34] <truepurple> Plus I did answer a few such questions at first, and they just got more and more irrelevant and off topic
[09:34] <oCean> hang on
[09:34] <oCean> the helpers in the channel have their own knowledge and experiences with a lot of issues, software, tooling and such
[09:35] <oCean> from that knowledge they try to build the idea of what you are actually trying to do
[09:35] <oCean> so they have to ask some "check" questions
[09:36] <oCean> Sometimes - I admit that - it may seem that those are not relevant at all
[09:36] <oCean> but
[09:36] <truepurple> I was trying to make a USB flash "live CD", I couldn't be more clear on that point. Now tell me how them knowing why I want more then 4 partitions is at all pertinant to helping me make that usb flash "live CD"?
[09:37] <oCean> not answering the questions that those helpers ask you, is a waste of their time. We cannot allow that
[09:37] <oCean> that's the general idea - nothing in particular to your issue. Ok?
[09:37] <truepurple> No, asking me irrelevant questions and never ending up helping me is a waste of my time. I have gone down this road before
[09:38] <truepurple> Also, it smaks of a elitism that I get, especially from ops, that makes me see red sometimes
[09:38] <oCean> Have you considered other means then IRC? It seems you care a lot about your time, but not about the others'?
[09:38] <truepurple> That I have to justify to them what I want to do
[09:38] <oCean> it has nothing to do with 'justify'
[09:39] <truepurple> Whos taking up whos time is not really that pertinent here. The conversation all told was very short before I got muted
[09:39] <oCean> I don't agree with that
[09:39] <oCean> you asked how you could have been disruptive
[09:40] <oCean> I'm explaining that
[09:40] <truepurple> I was being forced to justify my wanting to make a USB flash "live CD". When I refused I was punished for not justifying my objective on my own PC(yes, my PC, not theirs)
[09:41] <oCean> it is not about what you want to do, it is about the time/effort you require from the helpers
[09:41] <oCean> you can do whatever you feel like on your machine, but there's only so much that the channel can help you with
[09:41] <truepurple> You explained that it was "disruptive" of me to not answer questions. But you still havent shown how that is a disruption to the channel
[09:42] <truepurple> It takes less of their time to just help me make a usb flash live cd then it doesn to force me to justify wanting to make one first
[09:43] <truepurple> So if they value their time, they should have just helped me out.
[09:44] <oCean> Ops also have the responsibility to prevent the helpers from wasting their time. That's why - for example - ops sometimes have to point out an offtopic discussion
[09:44] <truepurple> Questions needed to help me out would be about my efforts to make the live CD, not why unitbootin isnt a effective replacement.
[09:44] <truepurple> Why do you bring offtopic into this?
[09:44] <oCean> because it is an example (as stated) when OPs have to do something
[09:45] <truepurple> If you want to bring offtopic into this, it is off the topic of making a live cd, to ask why I want more then 4 partitions
[09:45] <oCean> In this case, OP action was required also, but we seem to differ on that point
[09:45] <truepurple> oCean, but "I" wasnt off topic.
[09:45] <oCean> correct
[09:45] <oCean> it was an example
[09:45] <oCean> as stated
[09:45] <truepurple> I actually was punished for trying to get back to my topic
[09:46] <truepurple> If a old lady wants help crossing the street, you don't have to help the old lady. But you shouldn't demand answers about why she wants to cross the street and where she is going before you help her
[09:47] <truepurple> And then punish her if she says its none of your business
[09:47] <oCean> I don't see that this discussion is going to solve anything - we disagree about the fundamentals here: not giving appropriate feedback to helpers is a waste of their time, and thus affects the quality of help in the channel
[09:47] <truepurple> And punish her saying "she is being disruptive to the road"
[09:48] <oCean> truepurple: but what if she wants to cross that street backwards?
[09:48] <truepurple> appropriate feedback, you mean not answering why I want more then 4 partitions trying to make a live CD?
[09:49] <oCean> with the knowledge the helpers have, they know crossing the street backwards is dangerous, and not necessary
[09:49] <oCean> so that would be a totally valid "check" question
[09:49] <truepurple> oCean, in that case, demanding to know why she wants to cross the road and where she is going is still not productive.
[09:49] <truepurple> Anyway, there is nothing unusual about wanting to make a usb flash live cd
[09:49] <oCean> indeed
[09:50] <oCean> I think we're not going to solve this
[09:50] <oCean> I'm sorry
[09:50] <truepurple> and definitely nothing dangerous about it
[09:50] <truepurple> I dont understand though, you seem to get the individual points, yet fail to see how they combine.
[09:51] <oCean> That was going to be my next line
[09:52] <elky> truepurple, you seem to be missing the fact that because you wanted to make it in a non-standard way you were, as bazhang said to you, "adding some unknown factor t o a very simple operation". And until you understand that this means the helpers need to clarify things so they know how to approach the task, then you're not going to be satisfied with their lack of mind-reading.
[09:53] <truepurple> I was asking advice on how to do something reasonable and usual. I was given advice to do something else instead. I said that something else was not right for me. I was asked why. I explained. I was asked about things even further and more irrelevant. I finally bulked at this because I saw where this was going, having followed this path before.
[09:53] <elky> I am certain I said to you last time that you were here that your apparent needs are better served by paid support rather than volunteer support. I believe this to still be the case.
[09:53] <truepurple> A usb flash live CD is not "non-standard"
[09:54] <elky> 4 partitions *is* nonstandard.
[09:54] <truepurple> It wasnt relevant to what I was trying to do
[09:54] <truepurple> Nothing about the number of partitions I wanted to eventually make down the road had anything to do with why I was having trouble making the live CD.
[09:54] <elky> It matters greatly if you're wanting to separate out different parts of a single filesystem, or if you're wanting to have 4 separate live environments on the same device.
[09:55] <truepurple> How could knowing why I want more then 4 partitions help anyone, help me make a live CD?
[09:56] <elky> I cannot, even with having read the discussion, understand which of these you are trying to achieve. They have different instructions involved. Your answer would differ the instructions given to you.
[09:57] <truepurple> That is the thing, I explicitly said off the bat that I wanted to make a live cd without it being interrupted every 5 minutes by authentication password
[09:58] <truepurple> Its because I answered their irrelevant questions elky that you don't even know which task I was trying to accomplish. This is what answering those kind of questions leads to!
[09:59] <truepurple> You are demonstrating in person the very reason why it was a bad idea to continue answering those increasingly off topic questions
[09:59] <elky> You seem intent on maintaining a belligerent attitude here despite our reasoning being explained. You seem to not be compatible with this mode of support.
[10:00] <truepurple> You are being confrontational by using those inaccurate words with their negative connotations. Like the word belligerent does not apply. How am I being belligerent? By not just saying you are right and I am wrong?
[10:01] <truepurple> And that statement about needing paid help was pretty confrontational too
[10:02] <truepurple> Because it is very insulting, you could even say trollish
[10:02] <elky> You are insisting on arguing.
[10:02] <elky> And being aggressive.
[10:02] <truepurple> I am trying to help you see reason, I would presume you were trying to do the same thing, except that you speak to me so badly
[10:03] <truepurple> Well, rather badly, rather then "so badly"
[10:04] <ikonia> truepurple: you cross-posted again
[10:04] <ikonia> after being told not to do it and warned you did it agai
[10:04] <bazhang> ikonia, something different
[10:04] <ikonia> if it makes you feel any better - you're banned for cross posting after being warned
[10:04] <truepurple> Well since you just called me aggressive, you have demonstrated the truth of your statement that we aren't going to get any where. I would say the reason includes using words like aggressive
[10:04] <truepurple> ikonia, what cross posting?
[10:04] <ikonia> truepurple: you know what it is, posting the same questions in multiple ubuntu channels
[10:05] <truepurple> I am asking what incident you are talking about
[10:05] <ikonia> in #ubuntu
[10:05] <ikonia> 07:41 < truepurple> Making a start up disk on a usb flash, every 5 minutes or
[10:06] <ikonia> in #ubuntu beginners
[10:06] <ikonia> 07:31 < truepurple> Making a start up disk on a usb flash, every 5 minutes or
[10:06] <truepurple> 10 minutes earlier
[10:06] <truepurple> and noone replied
[10:06] <truepurple> Wasnt it you yourself that said 10 minutes?
[10:06] <ikonia> as you had exaplined to you, just because no-one replies doesn't mean you cross-post
[10:06] <ikonia> and no, I didn't say 10 minutes
[10:07] <truepurple> someone did
[10:07] <truepurple> Your abusing that word
[10:07] <truepurple> I was not discussing two issues in two channels
[10:07] <truepurple> Since noone was there, there was no discussion
[10:07] <ikonia> you where discussing 1 issue in 2 channels
[10:07] <elky> truepurple, what i see in #ubuntu is you asking your original question, you being informed how to make a startup disk with the startup disk creator. you said you had. you were then informed that your issue was an unknown one. You were suggested a different method, unetbootin. You then informed that unetbootin was unsatisfactory. You were asked how. You said because of partitioning. You were asked in what way partitioning was wrong
[10:07] <elky> so as to help you fix that issue in the hope it would fix your former issue. You got defensive and aggressive towards the helpers and you ended up in here.
[10:07] <truepurple> Asking a question to a empty room is not a discussion
[10:07] <ikonia> I'll leave elky and bazhang to finish it,
[10:08] <ikonia> but personally, I'd suggest not allowing you to use the channel
[10:09] <truepurple> I also explained the other reason that I wanted to use it as a live cd and not just for installing elky
[10:09] <elky> that changes none of what i said.
[10:09] <truepurple> I with that rather accurate synapses, I can't see how you can't see how I did answer the questions.
[10:10] <elky> If you think being horrible to nit-wit was answering any question, you are wrong.
[10:10] <truepurple> it goes on from there, I explained because the partitioner in unetbootin did not seem to know how to make logical drives,
[10:11] <truepurple> How was I horrible?
[10:13] <truepurple> I answered that USB live cd was indeed what I wanted to do. I answered what aspects of unetbootin was insufficient. I further elaborated on one of those reasons. Then I was asked why I would ever want to do something like make more then 4 partitions.. which was way off subject from what I was looking for help for
[10:13] <elky> you stopped answering his questions and started telling him he was misunderstanding you, when rather he was asking those questions so as to better understand you.
[10:13] <elky> That's the way it works. If you already knew the answer, then you wouldn't be asking for it.
[10:14] <truepurple> What was there to understand, I wanted to make a live CD, but the authentication thing kept poping up and may have had something to do with why it wasnt working.
 It matters greatly if you're wanting to separate out different parts of a single filesystem, or if you're wanting to have 4 separate live environments on the same device.
[10:14] <truepurple> Not if your goal is to  make a usb flash live CD
[10:15] <truepurple> Number of partitions has nothing to do with why the authentication  screen for password kept kicking in every 5 minutes.
[10:16] <elky> No, which is why this was to solve your inability to use unetbootin, and hence lead to a potential resolution for the password issue.
[10:16] <truepurple> And if helpers value their time, it would be good to limit yourselfs to just helping people with what they want to do. That saves time and stress on the person asking for help
[10:16] <truepurple> I can use unetbootin
[10:16] <truepurple> I never said I couldnt
[10:16] <truepurple> But that is not what I wanted to do
[10:17] <elky> This is not going to be solved if you're not going to grasp that getting you satisfied with unetbootin was a blocker for a potential fix for your password issue.
[10:18] <truepurple> So if the person providing the help, or supposedly trying to provide help, does not believe that he is superior to everyone else and can just accept that someone (me) wants to make a live CD usb drive and probably for a very valid reason
[10:19] <elky> This is not about one-upping you. This is about people trying to unblocker and issue that was preventing you investigating an option that could fix your initial issue.
[10:19] <elky> s/and/an/
[10:19] <truepurple> The instructions on making USB live CDs is very easy to find on the ubuntu download page. So clearly this is a common thing. My wanting to make one is not all that extraordinary. And because its common place, the solution should not be that hard to find either
[10:20] <elky> This is not going to be solved whilever you are dismissing the reasoning wholesale like this.
[10:20] <truepurple> elky, I explained why unetbootin was insufficient, and then I explained again further down the line and farther away from the issue, and then a third even further away inquiry was made, and I drew the line
[10:20] <truepurple> elky, That is rich, not one of you seems to be trying at all to see this through my eyes
[10:21] <elky> I am, hence why i've outlined with detail the reasoning behind each statement.
[10:21] <elky> You are dismissing it all.
[10:21] <elky> You are insistant that this is us trying to "be better than" you.
[10:21] <truepurple> And elky As I have pointed out before here tonight, I have been down this road of off topic inquiries
[10:21] <elky> This is not true.
[10:21] <elky> This is not helpful.
[10:21] <truepurple> I know from experience where it leads
[10:21] <truepurple> Nowhere good
[10:22] <elky> You are again dismissing outright the very key aspect of why the secondary issue was discussed with you.
[10:22] <elky> If you know better, then you don't need us.
[10:22] <truepurple> Because the person responding was too lazy or ignorant of how to get usb flash drive to work? Why else not just help me figure out what was going wrong
[10:23] <elky> You are again dismissing the secondary blocker issue. If it's so easy, then why did you need our help?
[10:23] <truepurple> unless its that the person responding thinks so highly of their way of doing things, that they can't stomach someone doing something else.
[10:23] <truepurple> Because I am a linux noob
[10:24] <elky> Then why are you dismissing the answers given to you by non-noobs.
[10:24] <truepurple> Because maybe I am not all that smart. But I am smart enough to know the reasons for the very thing I am attempting
[10:24] <elky> The discussion above is evidence to the contrary.
[10:24] <truepurple> Because, they werent answers, but redirects
[10:25] <truepurple> The contrary of which thing I said?
[10:25] <elky> This discussion is over. You clearly need more than this IRC service is able to provide.
[10:25] <truepurple> No, I just need fair polite OPS, oh wait are you saying that you can't manage that?
[10:26] <truepurple> Its amazing how you worked in that last insult against me too.
[10:26] <elky> The operators involved have been fair and polite. Your dissatisfaction is not an indicator to the contrary.
[10:26] <truepurple> No, your behaviors have been to the contrary
[10:27] <elky> !appeals
[10:27] <truepurple> Yes, it does seem that I am left with that, I have given it the ol collage try
[10:27] <elky> This conversation is over. As you are still dissatisfied with this fully logged discussion, you may take the log and escalate it.
[10:27] <elky> !logs
[10:28] <elky> This discussion is now over. You should part the channel as is protocol.
[10:28] <truepurple> Thank you for your time BTW elky, it does seem like you and ocean (especially ocean) were giving some kind of effort.
[10:28] <truepurple> And for that I thank you
[13:49] <elky> when did -ot turn into #debian?
[13:49] <ikonia> ?
[13:49] <jrib> not sure that's bad?
[13:49] <elky> does this mean we can give #debian the annoying offtopicers?
[13:49] <elky> fair trade, right>
[13:50] <elky> ikonia, <omid> bazhang i installed debian and i'm now typing this from debian. but it cannot detect my wireless
[13:50] <elky> immediately after joining
[13:51] <elky> so he's now being trained to return to #ubuntu-offtopic whenever he has debian support questions.
[13:51] <oCean> earlier there was some discussion on various distributions. He might have interpreted that as, hey this is the multi-distro-sup-chan I've always been looking for
[13:51] <ikonia> amazing
[13:52] <ikonia> ask him to take it to #debian
[13:52] <ikonia> easy enough
[13:53] <elky> yah, i was about to do the same
[13:53] <oCean> does that mean we have to keep the annoying offtopicers?
[13:53] <elky> I think so :(
[13:53] <oCean> trade's off :(
[14:28] <ikonia> hello noob
[14:29] <noob> hello
[14:31] <ikonia> noob: would you like to discuss your ban in #ubuntu-offtopic now ?
[14:31] <noob> sure
[14:32] <ikonia> well, the issue was that it's unacceptable to call people names and you didn't seem to get that after being warned about it before
[14:33] <ikonia> are you able to contribute to the channel without insulting people ?
[14:33] <noob> Yes
[14:33] <ikonia> ok,
[14:33] <ikonia> the second issue was, as soon  as you where banned, you tried to dodge the ban and get around it
[14:33] <ikonia> why did you do this ?
[14:35] <noob> Because I wanted to appel the ban to the other 2 mods who were in the channel who saw me first but didnt ban me
[14:36] <ikonia> so why did you not come here ?
[14:37] <noob> I did
[14:37] <ikonia> no, you tried to dodge the ban in #ubuntu-offtopic
[14:37] <ikonia> you didn't come to this channel
[14:37] <ikonia> you used freenode chat and changed your nickname to noob2
[14:37] <noob> I did after
[14:37] <ikonia> yes, so why did you do it in the first place
[14:38] <noob> I didnt know about this channel
[14:38] <ikonia> then how did you know to join it straight after you where removed fro ban dodging ?
[14:39] <noob> I read the rules again becasue I  was banned for something thats not against the rules
[14:39] <noob> a s I believe I was not banned for langue
[14:40] <noob> but banned by you from saying there is a difference between mocking and calling someone something
[14:40] <ikonia> noob: ok, so you where banned for being rude to people and using phrases such as retard which is quite offensive
[14:40] <ikonia> rww banned you, not me
[14:40] <ikonia> I banned your webchat access as you where trying to dodge a ban
[14:41] <noob> oh
[14:42] <ikonia> noob: so if I remove the ban, are you confident that a.) you can interact with people without the insults/mocking/etc b.) if there is a problem join this channel to discuss it ?
[14:43] <noob> yes
[14:43] <ikonia> @login
[14:44] <ikonia> one moment please.
[14:48] <ikonia> noob: I've removed the ban in #ubuntu-offtopic,
[14:48] <ikonia> noob: you're welcome to leave this channel and re-join #ubuntu-offtopic, please keep in mind what we've discussed
[14:49] <noob> I still have one questioon
[14:49] <ikonia> sure
[14:49] <noob> rww banned me for correcting you
[14:49] <ikonia> no
[14:49] <ikonia> I've explained why you where banned
[14:50] <noob> fine
[15:14] <Myrtti> what is jluc doing?
[15:14] <Myrtti> 18:12] < JLuc> cp -r *.* /dev/sdb
[16:42] <IdleOne> funkyHat: y u no -ops-team
[16:42] <rww> because it didn't exist last time he was paying attention? :P
[16:42] <funkyHat> ⢁)
[16:42] <IdleOne> right
[19:17] <oCean> we have g0t again in #u?
[19:22] <oCean> there's a *!*doe@*.zg3.cable.xnet.hr ban
[19:23] <oCean> not wide enough apparently
[19:23] <ikonia> lets see,
[19:26] <rww> change it to *.xnet.hr ?
[19:26] <oCean> what about *!*doe@*-cbl.xnet.hr ?
[19:26] <oCean> or that
[19:37] <LjL> rww: why would you ban a whole isp
[19:42] <oCean> LjL: what would you suggest?
[19:48] <LjL> oCean: what you just suggested seems fine. and/or by nickname
[19:57] <rww> LjL: I meant *.xnet.hr instead of *.zg3.cable.xnet.hr.
[19:58] <LjL> rww: you haven't gone crazy then, good.
[19:58] <LjL> rww: but you will.
[20:00] <rww> LjL: nah, I got bored of #ubuntu-offtopic, so there's hope for me.
[20:03] <LjL> rww: that just means there's little hope for #ubuntu-offtopic
[20:04] <oCean> nah
[20:04] <rww> LjL: That was the case anyway.
[20:17] <oCean> we need more questionmarks
[20:19] <Flannel> oCean: Alright????????????????
[20:40] <ikonia> |proliant|: hello
[20:40] <ikonia> LjL: ping
[20:40] <LjL> pong
[20:41] <ikonia> LjL: may need a little italiano help please
[20:41] <LjL> sure
[20:41] <ikonia> worried the issue with |proliant| maybe language related, but I doubt it, but it's worth giving the benifit of the doubt
[20:42] <LjL> you speak i translate
[20:42] <ikonia> well, looks like he's not responding
[20:43] <ikonia> |proliant|: can you respond please
[20:45] <ikonia> |proliant|: I can see you active in other channels, if you do not respond this cannot progress
[20:45] <|proliant|> ah ikonia i checking other situation ask me
[20:45] <|proliant|> what i the problem
[20:46] <ikonia> |proliant|: I removed you from #ubuntu and put you in this channel due to your comments
[20:46] <LjL> ikonia dice: ti ho rimosso da #ubuntu e portato in questo canale a causa dei tuoi commenti
[20:46] <ikonia> |proliant|: you seem to have some sort of issue with me asking if I'm nervous and if I need a man for the night
[20:47] <|proliant|> lLjL finalmente qualcuno che parla italiano
[20:47] <LjL> sembra che tu abbia un qualche problema con me, chiedendome se sono nervoso e se voglio un uomo per stanotte
[20:47] <|proliant|> I thinking you be a woman pensavo tu eri una donna
[20:47] <LjL> |proliant|: aggiunta mia: lo sai che esiste #ubuntu-it per avere supporto in italiano?
[20:48] <LjL> |proliant|: non giustifica il chiedere se cerca qualcuno per stanotte... #ubuntu è un canale di supporto tecnico, commenti del genere non sono appropriati
[20:49] <|proliant|> LjL si me l'hanno accennato devo vedere se trovo il canale per adesso mi sono iscritto al forum ubuntu in italiano e funziona ora vedo come fare a trovare il canale irc in italiano
[20:49] <LjL> |proliant|: semplice, /join #ubuntu-it
[20:49] <|proliant|> si lo so ma visto che era stato leggermente provocante
[20:51] <LjL> |proliant|: può darsi (non ho letto i log e non sono in grado di dirlo), ma non mi sembra il caso di dire cose del genere.
[20:52] <LjL> |proliant|: altra cosa, è importante su #ubuntu rimanere on topic. il canale ha 1500 persone circa, ed è *molto* incasinato, quindi dobbiamo chiedere di rimanere strettamente sull'argomento Ubuntu-supporto-tecnico
[20:53] <|proliant|> Ljl ho provato l'italian support come dicevi tu e funziona benissimo 58 utenti soltanto pero' ti ringrazio avrei solo 2 domande da farti 1 questo canale in inglese in che stato offre supporto e 2 una mia curiosità visto che mi hai aiutato anche tu ti dedichi ad ubuntu server????
[20:55] <LjL> |proliant|: 1 in che senso in che stato? è il canale ufficiale di supporto di Ubuntu, ufficiale nel senso che gli operatori sono scelti dal Community Council, ma non è ufficiale nel senso che chi offre supporto è legato in qualche modo a Canonical.   2 no, sempre usato Ubuntu solo come desktop, sul mio server personale uso Debian quindi non mi sono mai interessato di Ubuntu server
[20:56] <LjL> |proliant|: il fatto che #ubuntu-it abbia pochi utenti non è necessariamente uno svantaggio, comunque
[20:57] <|proliant|> LjL ok grazie su ubuntu italia channel infatti gli argomenti sono strettamente attinenti ad ubuntu ma anche tu sei legato a Canonical o sei un normale utente chat??????????????
[20:58] <LjL> |proliant|: devo chiederti un'altra cosa, evita i duecento punti di domanda. qui magari non sono un problema, ma su #ubuntu (e immagino anche #ubuntu-it) danno fastidio. io non sono legato a Canonical, però sono un operatore qui e quindi sono stato scelto dal consiglio IRC, a sua volta scelto dal community council
[20:59] <LjL> |proliant|: comunque ikonia stava cercando di aiutare, non di essere nervoso o provocante. siamo d'accordo che se dovessi avere dei problemi con utenti od operatori in futuro, li risolvi o in privato o, se credi che sia il caso, venendo qui?
[20:59] <|proliant|> ah amazing che figata ( figata parolina un po' spinta  )
[21:00] <|proliant|> eh scusa per parlare di discussioni non strettamente relative al supporto tecnico che canale mi consigli
[21:00] <|proliant|> sul forum ubuntu mi hanno messo ad ubuntu bar
[21:02] <LjL> |proliant|: per l'inglese, #ubuntu-offtopic, per l'italiano, #ubuntu-it-chat
[21:04] <|proliant|> ok thank you very much for the attention provero' con questi 2 canali dammi ragione pure una chat  è fatta per parlare di discussioni pure generiche non solo strettamente tecniche a parte come mi hai riferito sui canali appositi di ubuntu supporto tecnico
[21:06] <LjL> |proliant|: mi piacerebbe risolvere la questione e far togliere il ban da #Ubuntu, comunque. se sei d'accordo che su #Ubuntu, nel caso ti capitasse di usarlo ancora, eviterai offtopic o commenti personali, non dovrebbero esserci problemi
[21:09] <|proliant|> ok se puoi farlo adesso ho imparato come si usano i canali l'ho installato da 1 ora mirc un'altra delucidazione pero' che succede se uno ha un ban a carico su queste chat???????????????
[21:09] <LjL> |proliant|: che non puoi entrare nel canale, tutto lì.
[21:12] <|proliant|> scusa per quanto tempo io sono rientrato subito forse bisogna avere piu' di un ban
[21:12] <LjL> |proliant|: hmm? al momento non sei su #Ubuntu
[21:14] <|proliant|> un'altra delucidazione vvisto che in questi giorni dovro' completare la procedura d'installazione di ubuntu server i canali #ubuntu-it ed #ubuntu-ops sono del gruppo canonical tanto per capire perche' mi sono iscritto al forum ufficiale ed è di altissimo livello
[21:15] <LjL> |proliant|: sono sempre canali ufficiali, ma #ubuntu-it ha il suo gruppo di operatori diverso da quello dei canali inglesi
[21:17] <|proliant|> alto livello un'ultima delucidazione e poi passo magari a quegli altri canali che mi hai consigliato tu per discorsi generici . In ambito sistemistico ubuntu server è una delle piattaforme server piuì utilizzate o devo concentrarmi piu' su un'altra specifica edizione di linux????
[21:18] <LjL> |proliant|: penso che altre distribuzioni siano più utilizzate in ambito server, ma Ubuntu Server ha comunque tutto il suo team sicurezza e le versioni LTS sono supportate per 5 anni
[21:19] <LjL> |proliant|: però vogliamo parlare del ban su #ubuntu, sì o no? :P siamo d'accordo su quello che ti ho detto in proposito?
[21:20] <|proliant|> ti ringrazio per l'attenzione LjL sei stato estremamente gentile ti auguro un buon lavoro
[21:20] <LjL> grazie
[21:21] <LjL> |proliant|: se non vuoi discutere altro ti devo chiedere di uscire da questo canale, è la regola.
[21:22] <|proliant|> si siamo d'accordo su quello che hai detto in proposito non sono un ragazzino guarda se puoi togliere il ban ora esco dal canale tornero' magari quando vorro' domandare qualcosa di tetcnico in inglese grazie
[21:23] <LjL> |proliant|: nessuno dice che sei un ragazzino, però per togliere il ban, anche per rispetto degli altri operatori, devo assicurarmi che siamo sulla stessa lunghezza d'onda
[21:23] <LjL> gah
[21:24] <LjL> ikonia: anyway he eventually said that he agrees about what i said. not in a pleasant manner, though, he ignored my inquiries about the ban for most of the time and only right before leaving he said "yes we agree, i'm not a little child, if you can remove the ban now maybe i'll come back later"
[21:25] <ikonia> thanks LjL
[21:26] <Myrtti> right, so, just useless flapping of fingers on the keyboard
[21:26] <LjL> and what's more in italian, now i'm all confused :<
[21:26] <Myrtti> did he even really acknowledge the fact that #ubuntu is English only?
[21:26] <LjL> i donta knowa howa to typea anymora
[21:27] <LjL> Myrtti: yeah
[21:30] <Flannel> Myrtti: He was speaking english in #u, but we thought it might be a language barrier thing, so it was -it here for a short time
[21:34] <Myrtti> right
[21:34] <Myrtti> well I'm too tired to understand any of this anyway
[21:35] <Myrtti> gnite
[22:39] <tonyyarusso> Hey, check it out - Facebook finally listened to all of the comments about the site getting too cluttered!  http://files.tonyyarusso.com/CleanFacebook.png
[22:44] <rww> You didn't hear the news? Social networking websites only work on Google Chrome now.
[22:48] <tonyyarusso> rww: But Facebook is part-owned by Microsoft - shouldn't it hate Chrome?
[22:51] <bazhang> p579766E1.dip.t-dialin.net  <---- derder , looks like lars Torben
[23:19] <bazhang> multi crossposting seems the norm now
[23:24] <bazhang> don't see how booting the alternate iso will work though
[23:25] <Flannel> Who?
[23:25] <bazhang> nsadmin2
[23:25] <bazhang> copied to hdd, boot from grub2