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| === ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Current Session: Q and A with Jonathan Lange - Application Developer Programme - Instructors: jml | ||
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| ClassBot | Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/08/05/%23ubuntu-classroom.html | 16:08 |
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| === ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || | ||
| === ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Current Session: Q and A with Jonathan Lange - Application Developer Programme - Instructors: jml | ||
| ClassBot | Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/08/05/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session. | 16:17 |
| jml | Hello! | 16:30 |
| jml | Before I take your questions, please allow me to introduce myself | 16:30 |
| jml | My name is Jonathan Lange, and I work at Canonical on our developer programme | 16:31 |
| jml | I used to work on Launchpad, now I don't. | 16:31 |
| jml | Feel free to ask Launchpad questions on #launchpad :) | 16:31 |
| jml | The developer programme stuff is fairly new, but I'm happy to answer any questions you have on it, or application development more generally | 16:32 |
| ClassBot | nigelb asked: What does the new developer program comprise of? How do you envision helping app developers more? | 16:33 |
| jml | Good question | 16:34 |
| jml | Very specifically, what I'm working on *right now* is making it much easier for people who want to distribute binaries to get that software packaged, in a PPA and in the software center | 16:34 |
| jml | automagic binary packaging | 16:34 |
| jml | More broadly, there's a lot of stuff going on in the Ubuntu project & in Canonical that is directly or indirectly related to helping app developers | 16:35 |
| jml | e.g. A bunch of people are working on developer.ubuntu.com | 16:36 |
| jml | nigelb: yeah, like pkgme | 16:36 |
| jml | nigelb: in fact, that's where I'm landing lots of my work | 16:36 |
| jml | nigelb: but a pkgme for binaries rather than source | 16:36 |
| jml | nigelb: I think so :) | 16:37 |
| jml | another part of what we want to do is make it safer to run binaries | 16:38 |
| jml | another thing that's not officially part of the programme but just something that motivated community members are doing is writing up posts & content about how to actually *write* apps | 16:40 |
| ClassBot | jsjgruber asked: Isn't it important from a security point of view that everything be introduced to the repositories through source? | 16:40 |
| jml | jsjgruber: I guess that's the ideal from a security point of view. | 16:41 |
| jml | jsjgruber: but ultimately, some people will want to install some binaries, and we need to figure out how to make that as safe as possible | 16:41 |
| jml | apparmor, maybe running stuff inside arkose etc. | 16:42 |
| jml | jsjgruber: does that answer the question? | 16:42 |
| ClassBot | nigelb asked: apps that are in through the developer program will only be for the latest release or do developers have the option to release to all currently supported Ubuntu versions? | 16:42 |
| jml | The automagic binary packaging stuff is aimed toward getting stuff into the software center for versions of Ubuntu that support the software center | 16:43 |
| jml | In general, when bosses & stakeholders talk to me, they are most interested in current release of Ubuntu. | 16:44 |
| jml | nigelb: do you think it's important to enable people to distribute their new apps to people running older versions? | 16:44 |
| jml | tbh, I think it'll be driven by demand. If devs think that they'll get more users from older versions, we'll hear about it pretty quickly. | 16:46 |
| jml | and there's not really any philosophical or technical reason not to. | 16:47 |
| jml | anyone actually writing apps aimed at Ubuntu? | 16:47 |
| ClassBot | deuxpi asked: What is the benefit (to Ubuntu as a project) of promoting the publication of binaries only? | 16:48 |
| jml | It's more enabling than actually promoting. | 16:48 |
| jml | And the benefit is for users. | 16:49 |
| jml | e.g. A lot of the games you can get in the software center are released only as binaries | 16:49 |
| jml | I have to confess to very much enjoying World of Goo | 16:49 |
| jml | It would be better if the source were available, but gosh it's great to play a game like that without having to dual boot. | 16:50 |
| jml | deuxpi: does that answer your question? | 16:51 |
| jml | deuxpi: my pleasure | 16:52 |
| jml | one possible fallout of the binary packaging work I'm doing now is that it'll be really easy to submit open source apps, even if they aren't packaged. | 16:52 |
| jml | that'd be something we work out with the ARB | 16:53 |
| ClassBot | jsjgruber asked: Have you any feel for how Debian and other upstreams would feel about adopting these ideas? | 16:54 |
| jml | I have no idea :) | 16:54 |
| ClassBot | nigelb asked: A follow up to my last question. If I get my app into a version of Ubuntu, will it automatically be included in the next? | 16:56 |
| jml | At the moment, it depends. | 16:56 |
| jml | I'm pretty sure that if you go through the ARB, the answer is 'yes' | 16:56 |
| jml | If you're going through the proprietary apps system, then the answer is 'no, but it doesn't matter, because it'll appear in the software center' | 16:57 |
| jml | am being kicked out of the room I'm in. back in a tick. | 16:58 |
| jml | back. | 16:59 |
| jml | *ahem* | 17:01 |
| jml | they've closed off the wifi at this event, welcome to 3G powered Ubuntu Q+A | 17:01 |
| jml | No more questions? | 17:01 |
| ClassBot | nigelb asked: What more do you expect to happen in this space before this cycle is over? | 17:02 |
| jml | If I knew my manager weren't watching, I'd say I'm optimistic that I can finish off this dang binary stuff. | 17:03 |
| jml | By the time we release oneiric, I also want us to have a pretty clear picture & plan, something that everyone can be excited by & that isn't just a weird internal Canonical thing. | 17:04 |
| jml | Umm, also developer.ubuntu.com up-and-running and awesome and people submitting content to it | 17:05 |
| jml | That's about it. tbh, I've been pretty focused on one thing. | 17:06 |
| ClassBot | nigelb asked: Since we have binaries the packages, would it support all the platforms Ubuntu supports? Specifically ARM. | 17:08 |
| jml | No. It'd be up to the app developer | 17:08 |
| jml | So, if you wrote a game, | 17:08 |
| jml | and it was a really excellent game | 17:08 |
| jml | and you compiled it for armel and released that | 17:09 |
| jml | then it would only work on armel | 17:09 |
| jml | If you caved into peer pressure and instead compiled it for i386, then that's all it would be available for | 17:09 |
| jml | for the first cut, we're not even allowing you to provide binaries for multiple arches | 17:10 |
| jml | but that's definitely on the radar | 17:10 |
| jml | Umm, actually, on the earlier 'upstreams & Debian' question | 17:11 |
| jml | I'd like to point out that it's not conceptually different to what we do already, in having a partner archive that includes fluendo and so forth | 17:12 |
| jml | just basically making it way less work to do that | 17:12 |
| jml | ... and my favourite author is Dostoyevksy | 17:14 |
| jml | Any more questions? | 17:15 |
| jml | Anyone writing an app for Ubuntu as we speak? | 17:16 |
| jml | dropped again. back, this time on hotel provided internet. | 17:18 |
| ClassBot | aquarius asked: what's the rough length of time between submitting an app for review (http://developer.ubuntu.com/publish/freestable/) and the app appearing in software centre? | 17:18 |
| jml | I don't have direct experience in this, but allison informs me it takes 3 months | 17:19 |
| jml | and that most of those months are spent getting a good screenshot | 17:19 |
| jml | Which is obviously terrible. | 17:19 |
| jml | So I think the ARB has plans afoot to use the same system that commercial apps use | 17:20 |
| ClassBot | There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session. | 17:20 |
| jml | which I think would be a great idea, but I'm not 100% sure, and I'm not on the ARB, so you shouldn't take that as gospel. | 17:21 |
| jml | aquarius: does that answer your question? | 17:22 |
| jml | The commercial process is you submit an app in a fancy web form that allows you to upload a screenshot, and then someone packages it & uploads it into a PPA for you | 17:23 |
| jml | main difference is nicer UI & dedicated folk | 17:24 |
| jml | and the work I'm doing atm is changing the 'someone' to 'something' | 17:24 |
| jml | which will make it way easier for us to deal with the flood of apps that you guys are going to write | 17:25 |
| jml | aquarius: I don't know if attaching the screenshot helps, sorry, I can only assume it does. | 17:25 |
| ClassBot | There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session. | 17:25 |
| jml | aquarius: But I can say that you should expect better news & answers for this soon. | 17:26 |
| jml | 4 minutes remaining, 10 minutes of battery life. | 17:26 |
| jml | anyone have any questions that consume unusual amounts of battery life? | 17:27 |
| jml | OK. I'm wrapping up now. | 17:29 |
| jml | Thanks all for the chat & questions. | 17:29 |
| jml | Next time we talk, I hope to have way more to say | 17:30 |
| jml | And you guys to be asking questions like, "My app is getting too many users, what do I do about it?" | 17:30 |
| jml | cos I can really help with that one | 17:30 |
| ClassBot | Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/08/05/%23ubuntu-classroom.html | 17:30 |
| === ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || | ||
| nigelb | yay, thanks jml! | 17:34 |
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