[01:27] <lifeless> apw: hi; I'm curious if you think bug 729338 will have a fix before oneiric is released, or should we look for alternative workarounds ?
[01:27] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 729338 in linux "yama hardlink restriction misbehaves under aufs" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/729338
[07:30]  * apw yawns
[07:30]  * smb waves (a coffee)
[07:31]  * apw reposts with a cup of english breakfast
[07:44] <RAOF> Capitol!
[07:49] <apw> A
[07:53] <smb> B
[07:54] <RAOF> No, capital is where the government lives.  Capitol is the accepted response for english breakfast tea.
[07:55]  * smb was hoping to score 7 for doing a cab... :-P
[07:57] <apw> RAOF, i have have heard the sound of "capital" used in the context of "capital idea" i didn't think it spelt differently though
[07:58] <RAOF> My version is!
[08:00] <apw> heh, well i assumed a miss-spelling and worked with that.  but indeed it is a capit[oa]l idea, so much so i need another
[08:04] <tjaalton> RAOF: just to confuse some more, Capitol Hill is where the US government lives ;)
[08:06] <apw> tjaalton, ahh but that really is a differnt spelling (with an o)
[08:08] <tjaalton> apw: yeah, just a reply to the "capital is where.."
[08:09]  * smb thought it was capital hill... well until they nearly went out of it now... :-P
[08:09] <jk--> hey RAOF, tjaalton, smb, and apw.
[08:09]  * apw waves to jk-- -----
[08:09] <smb> hi jk-- 
[08:09] <tjaalton> jk--: o/
[08:09]  * jk-- makes use of the Oxford Comma while it still exists
[08:10] <smb> jk++ ? ;)
[08:10] <jk-> :D
[08:11] <jk-> smb: too similar to c++
[08:11] <smb> jk-, Oh, you did not accidentally type code when setting the nick then... ;-)
[08:13] <jk->  /nick intmain(void)
[08:13] <jk->  /nick intmain(void){return0;}
[08:13] <jk-> :)
[08:14]  * apw calls you initmain from now on
[08:14] <apw> intmain even
[08:14] <jk-> only if I can call you EXIT_FAILURE
[08:15] <jk-> or maybe EXIT_SUCCESS, less bad connotations
[08:17] <apw> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/821157
[08:17] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 821157 in linux "intel 5300agn in Oneric leads w722v to reboot" [Undecided,New]
[08:17] <apw> if i am reading this right oneiric causes their wireless router to reboot ... 
[08:18] <jk-> nice
[08:19] <lilstevie> apw: how odd
[08:20] <apw> indeed.  and i am unsure how i am meant to help with it ... your router is clearly broken if a client can crash it
[08:21] <lilstevie> yeah
[08:21] <lilstevie> I mean like what, if an ATM went out of order when you put your card in, there is something wrong with the atm not your card
[08:22] <apw> when my car drove over the bridge it collapsed, your car is clearly faulty please fix it
[08:22] <lilstevie> heh
[08:23] <jk-> "but it worked with my previous car!"
[08:24] <lilstevie> some people have a hard time with cause and effect
[08:32] <apw> jk-, on the nail
[09:35] <lilstevie> got anymore info
[10:04] <bullgard6> Natty writes at startup in a virtual console: "[1.581365] mmc0: no vmc regulator found". I suppose that this message originates from the MMC kernel subsystem. What kernel routine or program does cause this message?
[10:26] <apw> bullgard6, what h/w is that from
[10:27] <apw> bullgard6, and is that verbatim copy?  ie could it be vmmc in the middle ?
[12:15] <bullgard6> apw: The hardware is a Thinkpad T61. Yes, I made a mistake. It should read "vmmc". I beg your pardon.
[12:18] <bullgard6> apw: In the mean time I found out that /usr/src/linux-source-2.6.38/drivers/mmc/host/sdhci.c includes a printk line of this text.
[12:42] <apw> bullgard6, i am trying to understand if there is an issue associated with this, or if you just are querying the error
[13:08] <bullgard6> apw: Once I tested this computer using an SD card, and it worked. I would like to know what this warning means to me.
[13:16] <apw> bullgard6, from what i am reading your mmc slot can have an option power regulator, if that is found we enable it else we emit that message
[14:20]  * ogasawara back in 20
[14:58] <sforshee> cnd, I have a question for you about input multitouch protocol when you have a minute
[15:01] <cnd> sforshee, sure
[15:03] <sforshee> cnd, I'm working with a touchpad driver, 2-finger touch seems to be working fine but 3-finger events aren't
[15:03] <sforshee> comparing the output from this driver to that from synaptics, the only thing I see different is that this driver only reports 1 MT position whereas synaptics reports 2
[15:03] <cnd> which touchpad?
[15:03] <sforshee> elantech
[15:04] <sforshee> the tripletap event is reported, but the device only gives a single position for 3 touches
[15:05] <sforshee> cnd, in ubuntu a 3-finger tap just acts like a 1-finger tap
[15:05] <sforshee> and a 3-finger drag like a 1-finger drag
[15:06] <cnd> sforshee, this is typical for multifinger touchpads
[15:06] <cnd> are you sure it's actually multitouch?>
[15:07] <apw> yeah multi-finger is not the same
[15:07] <sforshee> cnd, it reports the number of contacts (up to 3) and with 2 fingers it reports 2 positions
[15:07] <cnd> sforshee, oh, and then it drops down to one position for three touches?
[15:08] <sforshee> yep
[15:09] <sforshee> cnd, would it help to see a dump of the events?
[15:09] <cnd> hmm
[15:09] <cnd> it wouldn't hurt
[15:10] <cnd> so what questions do you have?
[15:10] <sforshee> cnd, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/659348/
[15:11] <sforshee> cnd, I guess my question is what events the driver needs to spit out to have 3 contact gestures properly supported
[15:11] <cnd> ok
[15:11] <apw> sforshee, do you know that it can even do three touch
[15:11] <sforshee> cnd, that dump is for dragging on the touchpad with 3 fingers
[15:11] <apw> just cause it can tell you that there are three fingers touching doesn't mean i knows where they are
[15:11] <sforshee> apw, it reports that there are 3 contacts, but only reports one position
[15:11] <sforshee> right
[15:11] <cnd> sforshee, can you provide me the full dump that includes the transitions from 1 to 2 to 3 touches
[15:11] <apw> that as they say tells you nothing
[15:12] <sforshee> but isn't that enough for a 3-finger tap or drag?
[15:12] <cnd> sforshee, multifinger mode, which this looks to be, would be enough
[15:12] <apw> now that is a different thing, and likely it should be
[15:12] <cnd> except we don't actually have the support for it
[15:12] <sforshee> cnd, let me get that dump for you
[15:12] <apw> c
[15:13] <cnd> we gave it a shot about a year ago, and it broke devices
[15:13] <apw> cnd we gett
[15:13] <apw> cnd we getting anything new for this cycle?
[15:13] <cnd> and we never tried again
[15:13] <cnd> apw, kernel patches or?
[15:13] <apw> functionality in touch
[15:13] <apw> from a user perspective
[15:13] <cnd> yes
[15:13] <cnd> so we're still working on eog and evince to get smooth scrolling and rotate and pinch to zoom
[15:14] <sforshee> cnd, with a synaptics touchpad I'm getting 3-finger taps == middle click and 3-finger drag moves the window around
[15:14] <cnd> hopefully those land before FF next week
[15:14] <cnd> we just published utouch-qml to universe
[15:14] <cnd> that will make writing new qml applications with touch really easy
[15:14] <cnd> sforshee, yeah, that's with sem-multitouch
[15:14] <cnd> which is a step up from multifinger
[15:15] <cnd> apw, that's also something new this cycle
[15:15] <cnd> semi-multitouch synaptics trackpads have some gesture support
[15:16] <sforshee> cnd, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/659355/
[15:16] <sforshee> let me know if that isn't what you meant
[15:18] <cnd> sforshee, in this event stream, did you go from 0->1->2->3 or from 0->1->0->2->0->3?
[15:18] <apw> sforshee, is that ... heh waht he said
[15:18] <sforshee> cnd, the latter
[15:18] <sforshee> I guess you want the former?
[15:18] <cnd> yep :)
[15:18] <sforshee> okay, just a sec
[15:19] <cnd> but this does help too :)
[15:19] <sforshee> cnd, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/659356/
[15:19] <sforshee> now you should have plenty of data :)
[15:20] <cnd> indeed :)
[15:21] <cnd> sforshee, is this really 0->1->2->3?
[15:21] <cnd> cause the data is still the other way
[15:21] <apw> sforshee, its the exact same data including timestamps
[15:21] <sforshee> rats, let me try again...
[15:22] <cnd> heh
[15:23] <sforshee> cnd, apw: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/659357/
[15:23] <sforshee> I just got the wrong file
[15:23] <cnd> ok
[15:25] <cnd> sforshee, is this the upstream elantech driver, or from somewhere else?
[15:25] <davmor2> sforshee: Hey dude, you know the fix that you put into the proposed kernel that made the atheros driver work, the latest natty kernel seems to of removed it again I think
[15:25] <sforshee> cnd, it's upstream plus some work I've been doing to support a new model
[15:26] <cnd> sforshee, does the hardware cease to give two points when you put three fingers down?
[15:26] <sforshee> davmor2, do you have a bug number that I can refer too?
[15:26] <sforshee> cnd, yes
[15:26] <cnd> or is it something in the driver that is causing that to happen
[15:26] <cnd> hmmm
[15:26] <davmor2> sforshee: just tracking it down
[15:27] <sforshee> cnd, the v2 support in the upstream driver is pretty similar to what I have, the difference largely being how 2-touch coordinates are reported
[15:27] <sforshee> by the hardware that is
[15:28] <cnd> sforshee, if the hardware ceases to give two coordinates when there are three touches, then I suppose this is the best you can do
[15:28] <cnd> I don't know what our stack would do in this case, but I'm guessing it won't see three finger gestures
[15:29] <davmor2> sforshee: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/710738
[15:29] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 710738 in linux "Regression latest kernel breaks my Atheros AR5001 wifi" [High,Fix released]
[15:29] <cnd> you can run geistest (in utouch-geis-tools) to see what gestures are emitted
[15:29] <sforshee> cnd, okay, that's what I wanted to know -- whether I needed to do something different in the driver
[15:29] <cnd> sforshee, if it's something you are interested in, you could also add support to our stack for it :)
[15:29] <sforshee> cnd, thanks -- that answers another question I have, what tools to use to test multitouch :)
[15:29] <cnd> there are multiple tools, but that's the easiest to use and read
[15:30] <sforshee> cnd, thanks a lot!
[15:30] <cnd> sure, np
[15:30] <davmor2> sforshee: nevermind I've just fired it up again and now it's working so meh
[15:32] <cnd> ok, time to actually get up for the day
[15:32] <sforshee> davmor2, I just checked and the patches are definitely still in natty
[15:33] <sforshee> hopefully it keeps working for you :-/
[15:33] <davmor2> sforshee: yeah I think there might just of been a glitch after the initial install, seems fine now :)
[16:17]  * apw takes a risk and updates one of his machines
[16:17] <apw> if you don't see me again you know why
[17:52] <jjohansen> ogasawara, apw: sorry about the ipv6 patch, it was done Friday at the sprint and somehow I dropped it.  /me swears it was sent then :/
[17:53] <ogasawara> jjohansen: no worries.  I had it on my todo list to review, so thanks for doing the work!
[17:53] <ogasawara> jjohansen: I'll get applied for the upload I'm preparing
[17:54] <jjohansen> ogasawara: I am going to drop an apparmor patch next week, would you prefer revert patches for current stuff, or do you plan to just rebase?
[17:55] <ogasawara> jjohansen: probably easier for me if you revert patches for current stuff
[17:56] <jjohansen> ogasawara: okay, then that is what I will do
[18:14] <manjo> pgraner, do you have root on tangerine? can you install unzip ?
[18:42] <sforshee> anyone around that can approve my nominations on bug 583760 ?
[18:42] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 583760 in gentoo "[PATCH] Mouse cursor dissappears with nouveau" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/583760
[18:43] <ogasawara> sforshee: done
[18:43] <sforshee> ogasawara, thanks!
[19:52]  * ogasawara lunch
[20:10] <pgraner> manjo, nope I sure don;t
[20:11] <manjo> cool np 
[20:17] <cnd> sforshee, I remembered one other thing that you need to be sure to do with the elantech driver
[20:17] <cnd> be sure to set the maximum slot value at 1 so that it matches what the device gives, and set the INPUT_PROP_SEMI_MT property for the device
[20:19] <sforshee> cnd, thanks for the tips
[20:19] <sforshee> testing with geistest didn't go so well
[20:21] <cnd> no?
[20:21] <sforshee> most gestures were just detected as drags
[20:23] <sforshee> cnd, the driver already does both of those
[20:34] <cnd> sforshee, ahh, great :)
[20:34] <cnd> sforshee, what did you expect for gestures?
[20:34] <cnd> you should only be able to get two touch drags and pinchs
[20:35] <sforshee> cnd, oh, really? then it didn't do so bad
[20:35] <sforshee> cnd, I saw this page and tried to run through those tests: http://testcases.qa.ubuntu.com/Hardware/Touchscreen/Multitouch
[20:37] <cnd> sforshee, SEMI_MT alone limits you so you can't do rotate
[20:37] <sforshee> cnd, that explains it then :)
[20:37] <cnd> SEMI_MT means you have a bounding box, but you don't actually know where the touches are
[20:38] <cnd> the actual touches could be at (x1, y1) (x2, y2) or (x1, y2) (x2, y1)
[20:38] <cnd> and if you don't know where they are, then you can't do rotation
[20:38] <cnd> but you can do pinch by watching if the bounding box's area is changing
[20:39] <sforshee> cnd, that makes sense, and seems entirely appropriate for this device
[20:39] <cnd> sforshee, can you get three touch drags?
[20:39] <cnd> you may not see them in geistest
[20:39] <cnd> because unity may be grabbing them
[20:39] <cnd> but if you run geistest in gnome 2 then you could get them
[20:40] <sforshee> cnd, no
[20:40] <cnd> ok
[20:40] <sforshee> it's behaving like a one touch drag
[20:41] <cnd> there's some logic in utouch-frame that emits the number of touches based on BTN_TOOL_*TAP events for SEMI_MT devices
[20:41] <cnd> if you are interested, you could poke at it to generate the correct number of touches for these devices
[20:41] <cnd> and then three finger drags may work
[20:41] <sforshee> cnd, it's sending the tripletap event
[20:41] <sforshee> but only one touch point
[20:41] <cnd> yeah, that would be enough for drags, but not pinches of course
[20:42] <cnd> there's probably a bit of logic in utouch-frame that needs to be tweaked
[20:42] <sforshee> cnd, in the pastebin from earlier you can see the events: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/659357/
[20:42] <sforshee> but no triple touch drag
[20:47] <cnd> sforshee, the driver is working properly
[20:47] <cnd> it's a matter of "fixing" utouch-frame to make it emit three touches when the driver emits BTN_TOOL_TRIPLETAP
[20:47] <cnd> utouch-frame does this already for synaptics, but synaptics emits 2 slots from the driver when there are more than 2 fingers
[20:48] <cnd> elantech emits 1 slot from the driver when there are more than 2 fingers
[20:48] <sforshee> cnd, okay, I get you now
[20:48] <cnd> something about that is throwing off utouch-frame
[20:48] <cnd> you don't have to look into utouch-frame if you're busy, I'm not trying to push work on you :)
[20:48] <cnd> but if it interests you, that's where you would look
[20:49] <sforshee> cnd, I probably won't have time to anytime soon, but I might take a look later on
[20:49] <cnd> ok
[20:51] <cnd> sforshee, I'm just happy to have one more person who speaks the language of the input subsystem :)
[20:51] <sforshee> cnd, I've got more touchpad work queued up for next week too :)
[20:52] <cnd> you better watch out though, you could get slurped into the multitouch team :)
[20:52]  * sforshee shudders
[20:52] <cnd> that's an appropriate response
[20:52] <cnd> :)
[20:52] <bjf> cnd, i know where you live
[20:53] <cnd> bjf, I need to be careful too, cause my only get-away vehicle is a bike...