[00:08] <Machtin> night guys!
[01:20] <Ian_Corne> hrmf, bootchart doesn't create a /var/log/bootchart dir for me...
[01:21] <Ian_Corne> ah
[01:21] <Ian_Corne> It's because I'm running an ssd with optimized fstab
[01:23] <toori> heey
[01:24] <toori> hii
[01:24] <Ian_Corne> hello
[01:27] <dr_willis> Moo!
[01:27] <Ian_Corne> :D
[01:27] <Ian_Corne> silly bootchart thingies
[01:28] <dr_willis> boot them in the charts!
[02:48] <jhouse5266534> update-manager is giving me download errors.  Has anyone seen this or better yet, know how to fix it?
[02:50] <jhouse5266534> example: Failed to fetch http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/u/update-manager/update-manager-core_0.152.9_i386.deb 404  Not Found [IP: 91.189.92.171 80]
[02:53] <micahg> jhouse5266534: 1:0.152.10 is the latest version, your cache is out of date
[02:53] <jhouse5266534> michahg, how do I update the cache?
[02:54] <micahg> jhouse5266534: check for new pacakges?
[02:54] <micahg> s/new/updates/
[02:56] <jhouse5266534> micahg, what command should I run?
[02:57] <micahg> jhouse5266534: just click check in update-manager
[04:52] <bullgard4_> I just installed the package »ubuntu-desktop«. I obtain "Failed to load session "gnome". Log Out" How can I fix this?
[06:06] <bullgard4_> After Alt+F2 I run 'sudo apt-get install tilda'. GNOME 3 does quit this command without an excuse. Repeating, the History shows an exclamation mark next to this command. What does that mean?
[08:27] <wrongturn> anyone have any problems with 11.10? i just now downloading and fixing to try
[08:32] <bullgard4_> wrongturn: Yes. Me. I just installed the package »ubuntu-desktop«. I obtain "Failed to load session "gnome". Log Out" How can I fix this?
[08:33] <wrongturn> idk sorry i'm trying this for first time
[08:33] <wrongturn> your using gnome 3 in this right?
[08:33] <bullgard4_> Yes sir.
[08:34] <bullgard4_> I'd like to, that is.
[08:34] <wrongturn> well im logout and load see what happens lol
[09:23] <bullgard4_> Oneiric > Ubuntu How can I access the Startup dialog window?
[11:14] <zniavre> goood afternoon
[11:15] <zniavre> does dnd to launcher is working right now please ?
[11:43] <dr_willis> Hmm. Just copied terminator.desktop to my desktop so i have a launcher. it was not made executable.. tried to run it. it ran "Untrusted application launcher'  saying..
[11:43] <dr_willis> The application launcher "terminator.desktop" has not been marked as trusted. If you do not know the source of this file, launching it may be unsafe.
[11:44] <dr_willis>  Since when did the term 'executable' become the same as 'marked as trusted'   :)  Sort of  changing the definitions of terms here isent it?
[11:45] <dr_willis> shouldent the dialog at least give a user a clue as what to do..    So launching it may be unsafe.. well.. what if i want to launch it anyway.. no info on that in the dialog.
[11:45] <dr_willis> Done ranting now.. :)
[11:46] <M0hi> dr_willis: is there any new features to be added to the untrusted application launcher?
[11:46] <dr_willis> M0hi,  not that ive seen.. then again.. its only feature was basically to nag and annoy people it seemed. :)
[11:47] <dr_willis> did it have any features besides that?
[11:47] <M0hi> lol :P
[11:47] <M0hi> but is used to give a warning though =]
[11:47] <dr_willis> dont get me on the missleading stuff it does with wine apps....
[11:47] <dr_willis> I wonder if its differnt in Unity vs gnome-shell also.. using gnomeshell right now.
[11:48] <dr_willis> I just put that terminator.desktop icon on the desktop as a fallback. :) and noticed it dident get made executable by default and gave that untrusted info.
[11:48] <M0hi> hmmm
[11:48] <dr_willis> Its little things like this that can use the polishing that ubuntu really needs to focus on soon.
[11:49] <M0hi> dr_willis: when we are getting unstable packages from Debian, we will be having some devs of the packages here too? like working both on debian and *buntu?
[11:50] <M0hi> err too right?*
[11:50] <dr_willis> M0hi,  ive not really seen any of the developers in here.  not really seen any in #ubuntu either. They may hang in other channels
[11:51] <M0hi> But if they remain here and see whats going on that package, they can help easily right?
[11:52] <dr_willis> I imagine they stick to the bug reporting sites and so forth.
[11:52] <dr_willis> They need to be coding!  :)
[11:53] <dr_willis> I imagine i dont understand 1/10th the work the developers actually do.
[11:53] <dr_willis> thats why i hang in here and on #ubuntu helping the beginners and so forth.  just adding help in what ever way i can.
[11:54] <M0hi> cool :)
[11:55]  * M0hi also belongs to help and support grouped peeps =]
[11:55] <M0hi> Have to install alpha 3. Too late :[
[11:57] <dr_willis> Been helping out on askubuntu.com also.  The site has some neat features and ideas, but lacking in some other ways.
[12:01] <M0hi> I do love sites who work for the prmotion of Ubuntu and not the people who has the main aim of earning money by posting some ads of proprietary OS
[12:01] <bullgard4_> I installed Oneiric and the package »ubuntu-desktop«. I obtain "Failed to load session "gnome". Log Out" How can I fix this? Is http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1750430 applicable to Oneiric?
[12:04] <M0hi> GNOME rollbacks are same in case you tried upgrading the version to 3.0.1. #5 might help I think
[12:06] <dr_willis> bullgard4,  there was a bug about it. but it got fixed for me a day or so ago.
[12:07] <dr_willis> bullgard4,  you have done a 'sudo apt-get update' 'sudo apt-get dist-upgrade' recently?
[12:07] <dr_willis> bullgard4,  in my case it was because my 3d drivers were not working properly.
[12:08] <bullgard4_> dr_willis: I did 'sudo apt-get update'and  'sudo apt-get dist-upgrade' this morning.
[12:09] <dr_willis> whats your video chipset?
[12:09] <bullgard4_> M0hi: Please tell me what a "GNOME rollback" is.
[12:11] <bullgard4_> dr_willis: Intel GM965
[12:15] <dr_willis> You could try starting gnomeshell by hand and see what error messages happen bullgard4. you are not using nvidia. so you cant be having the same issue i was having.
[12:17] <bullgard4_> dr_willis: How to start GNOME shell by hand?
[12:18] <M0hi> bullgard4_: do the step #5 in the link you mentioned. That will help I believe. Sorry for the late response
[12:18] <dr_willis> i think its gnome-shell --replace
[12:18] <dr_willis> or make a custom .xinitrc and stop gdm, and use 'startx' and look for error messges
[12:27] <bullgard4_> M0hi: I followed the suggestions of #5. The error message remains the same.
[12:38] <bullgard4_> dr_willis: Now it works! Thank you! --  I had to install a missing package.
[12:42] <bullgard4_> I just installed GNOME 3 and am running it for the first time ever. How can I install the tilda program and run it?
[12:44] <dr_willis> use the pacakge manager . and install it... then run it.. :)
[12:46] <bullgard4_> dr_willis: Is "the package manager" Synaptic? How can I invoke Synaptic in GNOME 3?
[12:52] <bullgard4_> [solved]
[12:52] <dr_willis> bullgard4,  let me say this in the nicest way.. .. its sort of scary you are using the Alpha 3 release and dont know the  basics of  the ubuntu package manager system or command line...
[12:52] <dr_willis> :)
[12:53] <dr_willis> package manager = any of the tools to the apt system you like. :)
[12:53] <dr_willis> synaptic is not installed by default I belive any more. but its what i install and use most of the time..
[12:54] <bullgard4_> dr_willis: No. You misunderstood. I did not know how to access them. The layout is different in GNOME 3.
[12:54] <dr_willis> A+  You gain Ubuntu Skill Points today!
[12:55] <dr_willis> alt-f2 is still there. :)  but thats old-skool
[12:55] <dr_willis> first thing i did was drag a terminal icon to the side panel in GNomeshell
[12:56] <dr_willis> I did see some indicator-applets that added a classic gnome menu to Unity in 11.04 - i imagine it may work in 11.10 also. that  would be handy...
[12:57] <dr_willis> be nice in gnome shell if i could just hover over a window after moving to the top left,  then back to the window.. so i dont need to click.. :)
[12:58] <dr_willis> but thats lazy i guess.. but hay.. i dident need to click to get to the   layout of all the windows. :)
[13:00] <dr_willis> I do seem to perfer gomeshell to unity.. it just makes more sence to me..
[13:16] <yofel> does someone have an idea why apt takes so long to read the package lists in oneiric? It seems to have to regenerate the package cache on everything it does here. So a simple apt-cache policy bash takes several seconds
[13:19] <ior3k> $ time apt-cache policy bash
[13:19] <ior3k> ...
[13:19] <ior3k> 1.025 secs
[13:26] <yofel> real    0m3.436s
[13:26] <yofel> I do have quite a few sources enabled, but on the same apt setup the command takes "real    0m0.051s" in natty
[13:27] <yofel> so oneiric takes about 67x as much time as natty
[13:39] <bullgard4_> In Lucid GNOME 2 I could click System > Administration > Keyboard > Keyboard Preferences > Layouts. What is the equivalent in GNOME 3?
[13:40] <zniavre> ior3k,  what this commandline is suposed to demonstrate please ?
[13:40] <coz_> bullgard4,  isnt it under system settings  ,, upper right  of the screen?
[13:40] <ior3k> zniavre: time is used to calculate the time it takes for a command to run
[13:41] <zniavre> it can be considered as a test performance for computer ?
[13:41] <zniavre> (sorry for my bad english)
[13:43] <ior3k> zniavre: well, it's a pretty crude way to do it, but I guess it can be used for that, yeah
[13:44] <zniavre> ok thank you  verry interresting
[13:44] <ior3k> my pleasure
[13:45] <zniavre> btw > i can't drag and drop icons from dash to launcher that is known  ?
[13:48] <bullgard4_> coz_: I found it there. --  Thank you for your help.
[13:48] <coz_> bullgard4,  cool
[13:51] <BluesKaj> Hiyas all
[13:54] <yofel> mvo: do you know if apt uses compressed indexes again in oneiric or if I need to look for a different cause of apt-cache's slowness?
[13:56] <mvo> yofel: maybe that enabling of multiarch for amd64? that doubles the amount of packages it look at by default
[13:57] <yofel> mvo: that would mean a factor 2 slowdown, 'apt-cache policy bash' has a factor ~67 slowdown here from natty to oneiric (using time ... as measurement)
[13:58] <mvo> hm, that does not sound right, what is the test case you use?
[13:58] <mvo> oh, nevermind
[13:59] <mvo> yofel: what timming data d you see? what does time apt-cache policy bash -o Debug::pkgcachegen=true
[13:59] <mvo>  how?
[14:02] <yofel> mvo: with debug: natty "real    0m0.202s" and says "pkgcache.bin is valid - no need to build anything"
[14:03] <yofel> on oneiric I get http://paste.ubuntu.com/661143/
[14:05] <mvo> yofel: ok, there we go, thanks! so it appears to be a bug in the code that checks for sources.list vs cache freshness
[14:06] <yofel> I'll try to remove the files and let apt-get re-create them, but with the wifi here at desktop summit this will take a while...
[14:08] <mvo> yofel: I can reproduce it here on one machine, I have a look now, I suspect its something silly
[14:08] <yofel> thanks! :)
[14:09] <bullgard4_> [GNOME 3] How can I change the format displayed for date&time in the upper middle of the screen from "Mon 16:07" to "Mon Aug 8, 16:07"? -- System Settings > Date and Time does not seem to allow such an adjustment.
[14:13] <mvo> yofel: and so it is, a < where a > needs to be, I commit a fix, thanks for letting me know about it
[14:18] <coz_> bullgard4,  not sure  maybe gnome-tweak-tool ?
[14:18] <coz_> dconf-editor?
[14:18] <coz_> i will have to reinstall gnome3  to test
[14:19] <coz_> bullgard4,  did you try clicking the clock for settings?
[14:25] <bullgard4_> coz_: Right-clicking on the clock applet opens a window. This includes a button »Date and Time Settings«.Clicking on it will open a window »Date and Time«. This does not let me adjust the display format of date&time.
[14:25] <coz_> bullgard4,   ok   I am going by last month's memory of gnome3,,, sorry
[14:26] <escott> bullgard4_, if this is gnome3 install gnome-tweak-tool gives you a couple more options
[14:26] <coz_> bullgard4,   try  gnome-tweak-tool... or maybe dconf-editor,, not sure about the latter one on gnome3 thought
[14:26] <coz_> though
[14:35] <dr_willis> My clock says 'Mon Aug 8, 10:35'
[14:36] <dr_willis> Must have been a gnome-tweak-tool setting  i used
[14:43] <bullgard4_> coz_, escott Tweak Tool > Shell > Show date in clock did the trick. --  Thank you.
[14:45] <bullgard4_> dr_willis: Thank you.
[14:45] <dr_willis> one of the few features of that tool that work :)
[14:45] <dr_willis> but its a work in progress...
[14:46] <jbicha> dr_willis: what part of gnome-tweak-tool doesn't work?
[14:48] <dr_willis> 'Shell extensions" is totally blank here. and i did install some by hand.
[14:48] <dsathe> dr_willis: you have not installed necessay depnds
[14:48] <dsathe> gnome-shell exts common
[14:48] <dr_willis> and the package name is what exactly? i couldent find it the other day when i was looking
[14:48] <dsathe> needed for other hand made one to run too
[14:48] <dsathe> one sec
[14:49] <dr_willis> Windows->current Theme ->   dosent seem to change here either..
[14:49] <dsathe> gnome-shell-extensions-common
[14:50] <dsathe> i recomend adding ricotz ppa for the shell
[14:50] <dsathe> :)
[14:50] <dr_willis> ill look again. but it wasent there/installable the other day.
[14:50] <dr_willis> I dident really feel like risking using a PPA on  an Aplha :)
[14:50] <dsathe> yeah my bad
[14:50] <dsathe> its from ricotz ppa
[14:50] <dsathe> its as stable as the rest of oneric :P
[14:50] <dr_willis> Hmm I adjusted the fonts size. and now xchat is all messing up
[14:50] <dsathe> dr_willis:
[14:51] <dsathe> use dconf -editor
[14:51] <dr_willis>  apt-cache search gnome-shell
[14:51] <dr_willis> gnome-shell - graphical shell for the GNOME desktop
[14:51] <dr_willis> libmutter0 - window manager library from the Mutter window manager
[14:51] <dr_willis> :)
[14:52] <dr_willis> so it seems its not in the repos yet.
[14:52] <dsathe> nope
[14:53] <bullgard4_> [GNOME 3] Are there things like "workspaces"? How can I move  the Synaptic window to workspace 2?
[14:53] <dr_willis> just drag it over to the left side...
[14:53] <dr_willis> mouse to upper left... click on synaptic.. drag it to right side.
[14:53] <dr_willis> it auto adds new workspaces as needed
[14:55] <dr_willis> i wonder if theres some 'gnome-shell' in use  videos on Youtube..
[14:58] <jbicha> that's not a bug in gnome-tweak-tool, it's because gnome-shell-extensions hasn't made it into the Debian/Ubuntu repositories
[14:58] <jbicha> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=627515
[15:00] <escott> is synaptic completely messed up for others. the quick search no longer returns results
[15:00] <dr_willis> escott,  i had a similer bug a few weeks back in 11.04 ... not seen it in 11.10 yet.
[15:00] <jbicha> one of the Debian GNOME maintainers really doesn't like that if an extension is installed, it is activated for everyone on the computer
[15:01] <mvo> escott: do you still have apt-xapian-index installed? does it help if you run "sudo update-apt-xapian-index" ?
[15:01] <dr_willis> escott,  it seems to be working here.
[15:02] <escott> its driving me nuts. what package should i remove to remove the unity session
[15:02] <dr_willis> escott,  what are you going to use instead?
[15:02] <escott> mvo, yes the apt-xapian-index is installed
[15:02] <escott> dr_willis, gnome-shell. i'd be happy with switching the default to gnome-shell on the gdm screen, but it keeps going back to unity
[15:03] <dr_willis> escott,  odd.. its staying at gnome-shell here.. perhaps your .dmrc somehow got owned by root instead f the user
[15:03] <dr_willis> .dmrc file -> [Desktop]
[15:03] <dr_willis> Session=gnome-shell
[15:04] <dr_willis> gdm? You mean Lightdm? or are you actually using gdm?
[15:05] <escott> dr_willis, Session is gnome in dmrc. ill change it to gnome-shell and see if that makes it work. i am using gdm, i don't get the point of lightdm
[15:06] <escott> dr_willis, stuff like unity/lightdm is making me strongly consider fedora
[15:07] <BluesKaj> escott, that won't get you anywhwere gnome is gnome no matter which distro
[15:07] <dr_willis> dont see how the DM matters much...
[15:08] <dr_willis> fedora gnomeshell looked itendical to  whats on 11.10 when i tested the fedora live cd the other day. :)
[15:09] <escott> dr_willis, by why? what was wrong with gdm that we so desperately needed lightdm? i haven't seen a convincing case for that. there seems to be a big not-invented-here attitude. anyways i'm getting !ot
[15:10] <bjsnider> what they'd said was gdm contained a lot of extra complexity that was unneeded
[15:10] <bjsnider> did canonical invent lightdm?
[15:11] <dr_willis> with that logic why change from  anything to anything else. :)
[15:11] <dr_willis> !info slim
[15:11] <dr_willis> !info lightdm
[15:11] <dr_willis> Golly. that is a big diff. :)
[15:12] <dr_willis> !info xdm
[15:14] <bjsnider> canonical was encouraging gnome to also switch to lightdm although i don't know what gnome's response to that is
[15:16] <tensorpudding> lightdm is a freedesktop.org thing iirc
[15:17] <bjsnider> gnome has at least as much of an "it-wasn't-invented-here" culture as canonical
[15:19] <dr_willis> if not more so.. :)
[15:19] <dr_willis> I still rember the big gnome and ximian gnome  fun time ages ago...
[15:20] <dr_willis> I do recall that GDM2 also trimming out features that were in GDM.. so its a trend.
[15:29] <jbicha> gnome definitely won't switch to lightdm, it would be a regression from their design perspective and it's not been tested yet
[15:33] <BluesKaj> KDE here ,  the igital clock shows 12 hr time AMPM on the KDE Control Module , but shows 24 hr time format in the panel ...any method to fix this ?
[15:33] <BluesKaj> digital
[15:34] <Pici> BluesKaj: I'm pretty sure that you can change the widget's preferences and set whatever format you want in there.
[15:34] <escott> BluesKaj, gnome and kde use different settings systems. you need to go into the settings system for the other desktop environment and change it there
[15:37] <BluesKaj> Pici, I did that , but the plasma/panel clock doesn't change , and escott I already set it up in system settings , no change in the panel after that setting either
[15:39] <BluesKaj> the panel options dialog aka the kde control panel shows the correct format , but it just doesn't display it
[15:42] <dr_willis> I recall once that some apps had to be restarted after you changed the system time/format..
[15:42] <dr_willis> which ment you had to log out/back in basically
[15:42] <dr_willis> never have understood why they couldent just put a checkbox in the clock menus to do 12/24....
[15:43] <dr_willis> Then again i never could understand why a disrto that targets beginners and 'common people'  would not be defaulting to the 12/am/pm format anyway. :)
[15:44] <BluesKaj> dr_willis, well, at least in the Noth American time zones
[15:44] <dr_willis> So people in  China use 24hr clocks normally?
[15:45] <BluesKaj> yes and europe
[15:45] <dr_willis> cant say ive ever noticed it...
[15:45] <dr_willis> but then again.. i dont travel there. :)
[15:45] <dr_willis> 24hr clocks and the metric system! no wonder its all chaotic over there. :)
[15:46] <BluesKaj> excpt for uk , I think ..but I can stand corrected on the IK time
[15:46] <BluesKaj> UK
[15:46] <dr_willis> I suppose next they will want a standard currancy :)
[15:47] <BluesKaj> metric hasn't got anything to do with that dr_willis ...we use the metric system here in Canada , but we still prefer AMPM
[15:47] <patdk-wk> yen?
[15:51] <dr_willis> We need a metric clock. :) 100 sec per min.. 100 min per hr...
[15:51] <dr_willis> actually i think there is such a thing.  :)
[15:53] <Ian_Corne> i'd love that dr_willis
[15:53] <genii-around> My principal once played an April Fools joke like that, on announcements told the teachers to come collect their new metric clock from the office. Surprising how many showed up.
[15:53] <Ian_Corne> and it would be hectoseconds instead of minutes
[15:53] <Ian_Corne> :D
[15:54] <dr_willis> Then.. the Metric Alphabet!
[15:55] <dr_willis> http://snltranscripts.jt.org/75/75rdecabet.phtml          Metric Alphabet :)
[15:56]  * dr_willis goes back to sleep now.
[16:15] <bullgard4_> cul!
[16:23] <bullgard4_> [GNOME 3] Where is the Shut Down (software) button to be found?
[16:23] <escott> bullgard4_, logout and then shutdown from the display manager
[16:24] <escott> bullgard4_, there is an extension but 11.10 doesn't have the extensions packaged yet
[16:24] <bullgard4_> escott: Hm. Why so complicated?
[16:30] <escott> bullgard4_, they "want" you to suspend and not shutdown. its supposed to be less confusing or something. silly considering most peoples suspend functionality is broken
[16:31] <urlin2u> I noticed the no shutdown when I installed yesterday, oh and no gnome3
[16:31] <bullgard4_> escott: Ah! Understood. --  Thank you for explaining.
[16:31] <jbicha> bullgard4_: just hold down the alt key while the usermenu is open and the suspend key magically transforms!
[16:32] <urlin2u> jbicha, ah like fedora
[16:32] <Ian_Corne> wth :p
[16:32] <urlin2u> it is a gnonm3 thang
[16:34] <dr_willis> but is suspend... a suspend to disk.. or to ram....
[16:35] <bullgard4_> jbicha: That reminds me somewhat to WindowsXP. --  I'll test that later.
[16:36] <escott> dr_willis, ram
[16:36] <escott> hibernate would be to disk
[16:37] <dr_willis> still wondering where that got defined at.. :)   i recall it used to be 'suspend to ram' and 'suspend to disk'  but then.. whats sleep .. :) to ram i guess...
[16:37] <dr_willis> its soo confuseing... Ill just unplug it from the wall!
[16:37] <dr_willis> :)
[16:38] <dr_willis> sleep -> hibernate -> fossalize...
[16:38] <escott> dr_willis, there are actually other power states between on and sleep, that are seldom used (but probably will be used more in the future)
[16:39] <dr_willis> seen asked befor.. 'can i access my windows shares while my pc is sleeping.....'    :)
[16:39] <dr_willis> guess theres a 'napping' mode...
[16:40] <dr_willis> I rarely have the sleep/suspend stuff work right in windows.. theres always some game/service/icon/tool/somthing that gets confused.
[16:40]  * BluesKaj searches for kermodule name for BCM57781 Gigabit Ethernet PCIe
[16:40] <BluesKaj> kernel module name
[16:45] <wrongturn> I guess everyone is really happy with 10.10
[16:45] <BluesKaj> you mean 11.10 of course ;0
[16:46] <wrongturn> oh yeah right
[16:46] <rww> or everyone's 11.10 is broken so they can't IRC
[16:47] <wrongturn> im using it but had some download problems with softeware center for xchat
[16:47] <BluesKaj> !quassel
[16:48] <wrongturn> definitely a new look for the OS
[16:49] <BluesKaj> !info quassel
[16:49] <wrongturn> oh
[16:52] <wrongturn> software center closed unexpectedly
[16:52] <BluesKaj> !irc
[16:59] <wrongturn> is anyone else expericing (spelling?) having problems downloading in the software center
[17:00] <wrongturn> i mean problems downloading?
[17:01] <wrongturn> i did a clean install
[17:04] <wrongturn> first install though took like 1 1/2 hours to install and had to reinstall because it wouldn't accept my root password :(
[17:06] <wrongturn> second install got it though :)
[17:09] <wrongturn> i was thinking that during first install i used the encryption to protect root so this time i skipped that
[17:11] <escott> !root | wrongturn
[17:11] <dr_willis> been using apt-get to install stuff today fine wrongturn
[17:11] <dr_willis> havent heard of any other people mentionj issues today
[17:14] <wrongturn> hmmm maybe my connection also set up new router seems slow
[17:20] <wrongturn> obselete packages on a full fresh install
[17:23] <wrongturn> well apt-get works
[17:23] <wrongturn> bummer what's name of all the packages again lol
[17:24] <wrongturn> ok trying synaptic see if that's ok
[17:28] <wrongturn> ok synaptic works
[18:14] <BluesKaj> was about to upgrade after an update , The following packages have been kept back:apt apt-transport-https apt-utils libegl1-mesa libegl1-mesa-drivers libept1 libgl1-mesa-glx linux-image-generic qapt-deb-installer, I obviously aborted the upgrade ...looks dangerous to me !
[18:14] <dr_willis> You are running an Alpha.. :) what do you expect...
[18:15] <dr_willis> lets see what mine says
[18:15] <BluesKaj> alpha?
[18:15] <dr_willis> Ubuntu+1... the testing release....
[18:15] <dr_willis> !11.10
[18:16] <dr_willis> currently in Alpha3 state i think.
[18:16] <BluesKaj> I thought it was beta ...oops :)
[18:16] <dr_willis> Plus it said those were held back.. so not upgraded.. :)
[18:16] <dr_willis> sudo apt-get dist-upgrade to make it upgrade them as well.
[18:16] <dr_willis> The following packages have been kept back:
[18:16] <dr_willis>   apt apt-transport-https apt-utils libegl1-mesa libegl1-mesa-drivers libept1 libgl1-mesa-glx libglapi-mesa libqapt-runtime libqapt1
[18:16] <dr_willis>   linux-generic linux-headers-generic linux-image-generic python-apt qapt-deb-installer transmission-common transmission-gtk
[18:17] <dr_willis> getting similer messageit seems
[18:17] <BluesKaj> not running dist-upgrade ... that's what broke my setup the last try
[18:17] <Pici> Don't go through with it until you're okay with what its going to remove.
[18:18] <dr_willis> i always do dist-upgrade.. otherwise you dont get all the updates.. :)
[18:18] <Pici> BluesKaj: You'll need to run a dist-upgrade if you plan on being at all updated while using an alpha.
[18:18] <dr_willis> I tend to do a update, upgrade, then dist-upgrade just so i can see whats getting updated at each state easier..
[18:19] <BluesKaj> yeah, I do the same , but I'm leery
[18:20] <Pici> I do a dist-upgrade every time, but I read the changelogs and what is being removed before I tell it to go.
[18:21]  * dr_willis dives in like a Manly man! and dist-upgrades....
[18:21] <magn3ts> Whats the deal with "_Install" and the weird mouse cursors in the latest alpha?
[18:21] <magn3ts> snapshot!
[18:21] <dr_willis> I dident notife anything getting removed..  but i may of overlooked it.. :)
[18:21] <dr_willis> lettitng it run.. bbl
[18:23] <BluesKaj> heh, this dist-upgrade is gonna remove the whole kubuntudesktop and whole lot of other kde stuff and only upgrade a few libs ...some dist-upgrade that is
[18:24]  * BluesKaj aborts dist-upgrade
[18:25] <jbicha> magn3ts: bug 811642
[18:26] <magn3ts> Oooh.
[18:26] <magn3ts> I see.
[18:35] <dr_willis> Hmm. I got kubuntu-desktop here.. and did not see it remove  any kde stuff at all.
[18:35] <dr_willis> well time to reboots and see if it uses the new kernel
[18:41] <dr_willis> Hmm... Theres a 'gnome classic' entry now in the Login Screen...
[18:43] <BluesKaj> that's the first dist-upgrade this setup has survived in 3 tries ... things are looking up :)
[18:43] <dr_willis> heh - i seem to have a gnome-classic-shell  going on.
[18:43] <dr_willis> i dist-upgrade every day... never had an issue.
[18:43] <BluesKaj> I did , mostly with nvidia graphics
[18:44] <dr_willis> nvidia issues went away now that im using nomodeset as a default option...
[18:44] <BluesKaj> ok,bbl...postbox check
[18:45] <BluesKaj> even nomodeset  didn't work previous to nvidia  280.13 driver
[18:53] <BluesKaj> nomodeset option works now tho , otherwise I'd still be on irssi :)
[18:57] <BUGabundo> bRoas
[18:57] <BUGabundo> how does one get dual monitor to work with nouveau?
[18:57] <BUGabundo> with diff screens?
[18:58] <BUGabundo> clone works... kinda
[18:58] <escott> BUGabundo, xrandr should work with nouveau
[18:58] <BUGabundo> one screen is chopped at 1024 while the other goes up to 1280
[18:58] <escott> BUGabundo, it should be adjustable with the gnome-display-properties tool (the monitors tool)
[18:59] <BUGabundo> gnome-display-properties: command not found
[19:00] <BUGabundo> escott: any advice?
[19:01] <BUGabundo> or at least what xrandr commands to pass
[19:01] <escott> BUGabundo, not sure exactly what the binary is, just go to the normal application search and type in "monitor" and go to monitor settings
[19:13] <BUGabundo> FYI
[19:13] <BUGabundo> $ synaptic
[19:13] <BUGabundo> Segmentation fault (core dumped)
[19:13] <BUGabundo> close(7)                                = 0
[19:13] <BUGabundo> stat("/etc/apt/apt.conf", 0x7fff65741b00) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
[19:13] <BUGabundo> --- SIGSEGV (Segmentation fault) @ 0 (0) ---
[19:13] <BUGabundo> +++ killed by SIGSEGV (core dumped) +++
[19:13]  * BUGabundo files
[19:14] <jpds> Nice.
[19:17] <BUGabundo> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apt/+bug/822876
[19:17] <BUGabundo> if anyone can reproduce this
[19:17] <BUGabundo> It would be a good idea letting ppl to halt their upgrades
[19:18] <BUGabundo> so, who wants to be a test subject?
[19:21] <dr_willis> $ synaptic
[19:21] <dr_willis> The program 'synaptic' is currently not installed.  Y
[19:22] <dr_willis> BUGabundo,  it gets even more interesting ...
[19:22] <dr_willis> willis@CowBuntu:~$ sudo apt-get install synaptic
[19:22] <dr_willis> synaptic : Depends: libapt-inst1.2 but it is not installable
[19:22] <dr_willis>             Depends: libapt-pkg4.10 but it is not installable
[19:22] <BUGabundo> ah
[19:22] <trism> it may have to do with: http://mvogt.wordpress.com/2011/08/08/new-apt-hits-oneiric/ , might want to hold off on the upgrades for a bit
[19:22] <BUGabundo> miss depends
[19:22] <BUGabundo> trism: to late for me
[19:22] <dr_willis> willis@CowBuntu:~$ sudo apt-get install aptitude
[19:23] <dr_willis>  aptitude : Depends: libapt-pkg4.10 but it is not installable
[19:23] <dr_willis>             Recommends: libparse-debianchangelog-perl but it is not going to be installed
[19:23] <BUGabundo> libapt-inst1.3:  Installed: 0.8.16~exp5ubuntu1
[19:23] <BUGabundo> libapt-pkg4.11:  Installed: 0.8.16~exp5ubuntu1
[19:23] <BUGabundo> dr_willis: you are kinda outdated :s
[19:24] <dr_willis> I just update/upgrade/dist-upgraded like 10 min ago.
[19:24] <BUGabundo> !info  libapt-pkg4.11
[19:24] <BUGabundo> dr_willis: humm maybe your mirror is old ?
[19:25] <BUGabundo>  *** 0.8.16~exp5ubuntu1 0
[19:25] <BUGabundo>         500 http://mirrors.fe.up.pt/pub/ubuntu/ oneiric/main amd64 Packages
[19:25] <BUGabundo>         500 http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ oneiric/main amd64 Packages
[19:25] <BUGabundo>         100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
[19:25] <dr_willis> us ubuntu.com mirrors...
[19:25] <charlie-tca> dr_willis: did synaptic remove during your upgrades?
[19:25] <charlie-tca> It is being removed by current updating
[19:25] <dr_willis> I dident see where it said it was removeing anything..
[19:25] <dr_willis> but it must have.
[19:25] <BUGabundo> not here
[19:26] <bullgard4_> GNOME 3 keeps me annoying: "Passwords or encryption keys are required to access the wireless network 'foo' for hours. GNOME 2 did stop bothering me in that way after a while. How can I program GNOME 3 to do likewise?
[19:26] <dr_willis> you are connecting to foo? or is that some other network?
[19:26] <zzzz_zzzz> hello everyone
[19:27] <dsathe> use as root
[19:27] <dsathe> :D
[19:28] <zzzz_zzzz> i have a problem with gdm(?). it does not start any session after i enter credentials for account. Any thoughts where i can get more info on what is going on ?
[19:28] <dr_willis> zzzz_zzzz,  well lightdm is the default dm now. are you sure you are using GDM?
[19:28] <zzzz_zzzz> sudo stop dgm ends x session for me
[19:28] <zzzz_zzzz> *gdm
[19:29] <zzzz_zzzz> so should i try to install it manually ?
[19:29] <dr_willis> you could try a simple 'startx' after stoping gdm and see if you get to the desktop
[19:29] <dr_willis> zzzz_zzzz,  i wouldent suggest installing anything right now..  theres some big changes hitting the package listings it seems. :)
[19:30] <escott> lovely this partial upgrade just sucked in the kdecore thats just terrific
[19:30] <zzzz_zzzz> startx starts desktop with nautilus in global menu, no indicators, no unity panel :/
[19:30] <BUGabundo> anyone that has a apt search still working
[19:31] <BUGabundo> can you find me any tool to try getting my screens side to side?
[19:31] <BUGabundo> thanks
[19:31] <dr_willis> zzzz_zzzz,  make a .xinitrc that starts up a terminal.   then try starting  untity from the terminal perhaps?
[19:31] <zzzz_zzzz> will try, ty
[19:31] <dr_willis> screens side by side?
[19:31] <dr_willis> BUGabundo,  theres some big changes happening in the apt/synaptic/area right not it seems.. :) search not working will be a trivial thing.. heh.
[19:31] <dr_willis> right now..
[19:32] <dr_willis> http://mvogt.wordpress.com/2011/08/08/new-apt-hits-oneiric/
[19:32] <BUGabundo> funny
[19:32] <BUGabundo> dr_willis: dual monitor. right now they are in clone
[19:32] <BUGabundo> I want VGA to the left, and DVI right
[19:32] <dr_willis> BUGabundo,  whats your video chipset?
[19:32] <BUGabundo> nvidia
[19:33] <BUGabundo> with nouveay
[19:33] <dr_willis> No idea with nouvea if it can do it or not.. try the monitors setting tool.
[19:33] <dr_willis> I use twinview/nvidia driver.
[19:33] <BUGabundo> -.-
[19:33] <dr_willis> nouveau does not work very well for me
[19:33] <BUGabundo> the current monitor tool I've found in gnome-do
[19:33] <BUGabundo> only allows to enable and set resolution
[19:34] <BUGabundo> I could try nvidia blob
[19:34] <escott> BUGabundo, when you go to the application search and type in monitor don't you have a display settings tool
[19:34] <BUGabundo> BUT with apt unstable, I rather not
[19:34] <dr_willis>  gnome-control-center   ---> displays
[19:34] <escott> BUGabundo, otherwise try xrandr --output VGA1 --left-of DVI0 or whatever the variant would be
[19:35] <BUGabundo> thanks
[19:35] <Ian_Corne> apt unstable?
[19:35] <Ian_Corne> haven't noticed..
[19:35] <dr_willis> http://mvogt.wordpress.com/2011/08/08/new-apt-hits-oneiric/
[19:36] <dr_willis> apt seems to be working.. synaptic.. no.. aptitude.. no..
[19:36] <BUGabundo> YAY
[19:36] <dr_willis> lets try the software center.. :)
[19:36] <BUGabundo> grandr Works
[19:36] <BUGabundo> :D
[19:36] <BUGabundo> well, its totally broken
[19:36] <BUGabundo> but still manages to let me drag the VGA to the right
[19:36] <BUGabundo> *left
[19:37] <histo> ?
[19:38] <dr_willis> ubuntu softwre center seems busted also right now for me
[19:39] <Ian_Corne> where's my restart button? :o
[19:40] <dr_willis> under the couch?
[19:40] <BUGabundo> Ian_Corne: long press power
[19:44] <Ian_Corne> ah :p
[20:03] <Ian_Corne> still can't believe how ugly the chat interface of empathy is compared to 11.04...
[20:04] <Ian_Corne> and then it magically turned back to normal when i accessed the preferences..
[20:04] <Ian_Corne> all's well ends well
[20:12] <Ian_Corne> om26er: should I mark it invalid or fix released?
[20:12] <Ian_Corne> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/822333
[20:13] <om26er> Ian_Corne, invalid
[20:13] <Ian_Corne> ok
[20:31] <bullgard4_> GNOME 3 keeps me annoying: "Passwords or encryption keys are required to access the wireless network 'foo' for hours. GNOME 2 did stop bothering me in that way after a while. How can I program GNOME 3 to do likewise?
[20:32] <KNUBBIG> Hey, anybody knows why gs looks like this: http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=aa4ffd-1312832926.jpg
[20:44] <BUGabundo> Ian_Corne: that would be a GTK bug
[20:45] <Ian_Corne> what would be?
[20:45] <bullgard4_> KNUBBIG_: You better emphasize verbally what you are interested in particular.
[20:45] <Ian_Corne> the bug I showed?
[20:46] <BUGabundo> (08/08/2011 09:04:26 PM) Ian_Corne: and then it magically turned back to normal when i accessed the preferences..
[20:46] <Ian_Corne> aah
[20:46] <Ian_Corne> well it's fixed for now
[20:47] <Ian_Corne> maybe some old cfg files needed to be updated
[20:47] <Ian_Corne> If i run into it again, i'll file
[20:52] <BUGabundo> anyone knows how to create a swap file with more then 2GBs?
[20:59] <dr_willis> you could make 2 swap files of 1gb each.. if you wanted to.. or a dozen of them....
[20:59] <dr_willis> :)
[20:59] <dr_willis> not sure theres a 2gb limit to swap file size really.
[21:02] <Ian_Corne> there is not
[21:02] <Ian_Corne> I've got 10GB swap on my desktop
[21:02] <BUGabundo> dr_willis: I already have 2 of 2GBs
[21:02] <Ian_Corne> oh file
[21:02] <BUGabundo> but I want to make a 10GBs on my NAS over giganet
[21:03] <BUGabundo> dr_willis: seems to be hardcoded to the kernel parameters
[21:03] <dr_willis> a swap file over the network? that seems... weird.. :)
[21:04] <dr_willis> cant say ive used a swap file in .. years...
[21:04] <dr_willis> back when 2gb of swap would be HUGE
[21:04] <BUGabundo> dr_willis: its enough time for me to kill what ever is mem leaking
[21:04] <BUGabundo> without causing local disk IO
[21:05] <BUGabundo> dr_willis: 4GBs of RAM isn't enough to run 11.10 and two browsers
[21:05] <dr_willis> http://www.xenotime.net/linux/doc/swap-mini-howto.txt
[21:05] <BUGabundo> I got *regular* OOM
[21:05] <dr_willis> seems to mention a bug in mkswp  but thats an OLD doc...
[21:05] <BUGabundo> I had to add two 2GBs swap files (on SSD)
[21:05] <yofel_> I did manage to create a 6GB swap file yesterday, on a regular HDD that is, copied it over to my SSD after that
[21:06] <BUGabundo> yofel: you did?
[21:06] <BUGabundo> and it swap on fine ?
[21:06] <yofel> works fine so far
[21:06] <yofel> I'm using it with uswsusp
[21:07] <BUGabundo> crazy guy
[21:07] <yofel> well, some idiot designed the sandforce chip in my SSD in a way that it likes to not wake up after suspend. So I'm left with shutdown and hibernate
[21:07] <BUGabundo>  3218      20365          0      58639K       2.3G        1.4G      4116K       6812K     bugabund      bugabund      37%     chromium-brows
[21:07] <BUGabundo> I need MORE ram
[21:08] <dr_willis> googling now a bout swap files.. finding some neat articals on swappiong.. :) like setting up a swap 'raid' with several files...
[21:08] <dr_willis> http://www.gentoo.org/doc/en/articles/maximum-swappage.xml
[21:09] <BUGabundo> NAS> dd bs=11000 count=1M if=/dev/zero of=swapfile4
[21:09] <BUGabundo> $ cat /proc/swaps
[21:09] <BUGabundo> Filename				Type		Size	Used	Priority
[21:09] <BUGabundo> /var/local/swapfile2                    file		2097140	11640	-1
[21:09] <BUGabundo> /var/local/swapfile3                    file		2097140	0	-2
[21:10] <dr_willis> im finding a lot of mentions of swap limits of 2gb max....
[21:10] <dr_willis> but its in a ot of old old docs
[21:11] <dr_willis> Until Red Hat Enterprise Linux 2.1 there was a limitation on the partition size of 2GB for each swap space. This was due to the mkswap command not supporting creation of a swap partition larger than 2GB.
[21:11] <dr_willis> Seems it may be a mkswap bug.....
[21:11] <dr_willis> more then it is a kernel limit.
[21:12] <BUGabundo> Setting up swapspace version 1, size = 11534331904 bytes
[21:12] <BUGabundo> lets see if I can swapon over ether :D
[21:12] <yofel> well, there is a check in mkswap for the PAGE size, but then I don't get why it worked for me when it didn't before
[21:13] <BUGabundo> $ sudo swapon /mnt/NAS/homes/bugabundo/disks/swapfile4
[21:13] <BUGabundo> swapon: /mnt/NAS/homes/bugabundo/disks/swapfile4: swapon failed: Invalid argument
[21:13] <dr_willis> Oh.. somthing nifty.. archlinux wiki mentions how you CAN resume from a swap file. and not a partition.. i did not even think that was possible... :)
[21:13] <dr_willis> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Swap
[21:14] <dr_willis> how is that NAS shareing that file?
[21:14] <BUGabundo> cifs
[21:14] <dr_willis> it might be a cifs limit.. I cant recall ever hearing of someone having a swap file on a share like that..
[21:14] <dr_willis> NFS perhaps...
[21:15]  * dr_willis googles for CIFS swap file
[21:15] <BUGabundo> I had lots of problems trying to get NFS working with 11.10
[21:15] <BUGabundo> ended up moving every machine to CIFS
[21:15] <dr_willis> https://forum.openwrt.org/viewtopic.php?id=6514
[21:15] <BUGabundo> only to find out that 11.04 hangs on shutdown
[21:15] <dr_willis> In order to swap to a cifs share, you need to mount it and then use the loopback module to create the swapfile.
[21:15] <yofel> dr_willis: you can resume from a file, with uswsusp. You just need to tell it the offset from the partition beginning so it knows where to read/write to. There's a tool to find that out
[21:16] <BUGabundo> and its not fixed yet, not the workaround works if you have more then one mount point :(
[21:16] <yofel> just that uswsusp is broken in oneiric and doesn't install the update-initramfs stuff. You'll find solution on the debian BTS
[21:16] <dr_willis> I just never shutdown . :)
[21:16] <yofel> *find a
[21:17] <dr_willis> BUGabundo,  well that url i just pasted has a potential work around.. but it is a bit old.. and for  a totally different disrto. :)
[21:17] <BUGabundo> dr_willis: ill try it
[21:17] <BUGabundo> I swapoff one of my files and was almost at OOM
[21:17] <BUGabundo> damn
[21:18] <BUGabundo> [ 2766.452226] chromium-browse[19489]: segfault at 40 ip 00007ff95f361e09 sp 00007fff0c9edff0 error 4 in libX11.so.6.3.0[7ff95f322000+134000]
[21:18] <dr_willis> Put the swap file on your UbuntuOne account. :)
[21:19] <BUGabundo> what the.....
[21:19] <BUGabundo> [  545.323741] exe (3274): /proc/3274/oom_adj is deprecated, please use /proc/3274/oom_score_adj instead.
[21:19] <BUGabundo> [ 1116.630373] SGI XFS with ACLs, security attributes, realtime, large block/inode numbers, no debug enabled
[21:19] <BUGabundo> [ 1116.632418] SGI XFS Quota Management subsystem
[21:19] <BUGabundo> [ 1116.644036] JFS: nTxBlock = 8192, nTxLock = 65536
[21:19] <BUGabundo> [ 1116.681329] NTFS driver 2.1.30 [Flags: R/O MODULE].
[21:19] <BUGabundo> [ 1116.697993] QNX4 filesystem 0.2.3 registered.
[21:19] <BUGabundo> dr_willis: LOOOOOL
[21:19] <rww> lolwat QNX4
[21:20] <dr_willis> I rember QNX...
[21:20] <dr_willis> :)
[21:20] <dr_willis> I just cant find a lot on putting a swap on a network share.
[21:22] <BUGabundo> sudo aptitude install  kmod-loop  losetup
[21:22] <BUGabundo> I forgot.... I don't have APT anymore
[21:24] <dr_willis> !info dwww
[21:24] <dr_willis> that was a 'reccomends' for synaptic i just now reinstalled....   never heard of that one befor
[21:24] <BUGabundo> eheh
[21:24] <yofel> it essentially lets you view manpages and other docs in a browser
[21:25] <yofel> I *think* that runs on some debian.org server too, can't remember the URL
[21:25] <dr_willis> its pulling in apache it seems. :)
[21:25] <rww> http://manpages.ubuntu.com/ exists too :)
[21:27] <dr_willis> theres often all theese docs.. all hidden away... :)
[21:27] <dr_willis> dwww is interesting at least...
[21:27] <dr_willis> gave me a -->  http://cowbuntu/cgi-bin/dwww/usr/share/doc/xterm/xterm.faq.html?type=html
[21:28] <BUGabundo> $ sudo mount -o loop /dev/loop0 /mnt/NAS/homes/bugabundo/disks/swapfile4
[21:28] <BUGabundo> cpu lock!!! OMG
[21:28] <BUGabundo>      1         3.01s         0.45s       23628K         620K           0K           0K          ?          ?        69%       mount
[21:29] <dr_willis> gee  even with dwww - the info pages look... terriable.. :)
[21:29]  * dr_willis throws water on BUGabundo 's cpu.
[21:30] <BUGabundo>  sudo  losetup /dev/loop0 /mnt/NAS/homes/bugabundo/disks/swapfile4
[21:30] <BUGabundo> does nothing
[21:35] <BUGabundo> $ cat /proc/swaps
[21:35] <BUGabundo> Filename				Type		Size	Used	Priority
[21:35] <BUGabundo> /var/local/swapfile2                    file		2097140	26620	-1
[21:35] <BUGabundo> /dev/loop0                              partition	11263996	0	-2
[21:35] <BUGabundo> thank you dr_willis
[21:38] <BUGabundo> now I need to translate this to ftab
[21:42] <BUGabundo> funny thing is, I don't see  the loop mount on mtab
[21:44] <dr_willis> old skool docs helped eh...
[21:44] <dr_willis> I dont knwo a lot.. but i know how to googles the nets!
[21:46] <BUGabundo> :)