[01:07] <robinetd> Hey guys. What do I have to do to get unbanned from -ot?
[01:25] <robinetd> Pretty quiet in here. :O
[01:28] <elky> Yes, I suspect people are being otherwise social on the weekend.
[01:29] <robinetd> Could be. What is the recommended course of action in this situation?
[01:30] <elky> Wait for someone to return, since I suspect you really don't want this decision resting in the hands of someone who you've previously decide to harass in channels on a different network for being an op here.
[01:30] <robinetd> The past is the past, is it not?
[01:31] <elky> That wasn't the case at that time, so I see no reason why it should be now.
[01:31] <robinetd> No, at the time it was the present.
[01:31] <elky> No, it wasn't.
[01:31] <robinetd> ?
[01:32] <elky> Unless "the previous fortnight" or similar time distance qualifies as "present", in which case I'd like the blueprints for your time machine.
[01:33] <robinetd> No blueprint. You just travel around a black hole multiple times.
[01:33] <robinetd> I'll return in a minute. I have to make a pit stop. Let me know what I can do to resolve this issue between us.
[01:35] <elky> This isn't something that I alone can decide one, since it impacts the rest of the op team. Someone will get back to you when it's time to discuss it.
[01:35] <elky> s/one/on/
[01:38] <robinetd> elky: I meant the private issue you have with me which might be better discussed in a private message, or if you prefer, not at all. I just want you to know that what happened was quite a while ago, and I'm sorry for it and wish that I hadn't done it in retrospect.
[01:39] <robinetd> The issue regarding the ban I can wait for others. Don't know who to wait for though.
[01:39] <elky> The way you can resolve it is to make sure it doesn't happen in the future. No need for private discussion.
[01:39] <elky> I'm still going to defer the ban resolution until it's been discussed with someone else.
[01:40] <robinetd> Do you know who I should wait for then?
[01:40] <elky> Probably rww or flannel
[01:41] <elky> I suspect they're dinnering around now.
[01:41] <robinetd> Is it okay if I wait for them in this channel? Or how do you suggest I know when they're around?
[01:42] <elky> Someone will pm or memoserv.
[01:43] <robinetd> Alrighty. It'll probably have to be a memoserv. rww can contact me on G+ if that's appropriate. I'm not on freenode as much as I used to be.
[01:56]  * rww hrms, open BT to refamiliarize himself
[02:43] <robinetd> rww: Greetings.
[02:44] <rww> g'day
[02:45] <rww> I took a look at your bantracker record when I noticed you dropped by before, and I'm fine with removing it if you do the usual "I've read the IRC Guidelines and Code of Conduct and will follow them." thing.
[02:45] <rww> !guidelines | convenient link
[02:47] <robinetd> I'll read it. It appears to have changed.
[02:53] <robinetd> rww: Most of the guidelines seem sane. I'll abide by them in ubuntu channels.
[02:54] <rww> both the sane and insane ones? :P
[02:54] <robinetd> In ubuntu channels, yes.
[02:55] <robinetd> I assume that this agreement doesn't require me to follow the guidelines in other channels also.
[02:56] <robinetd> For example. The whole "No obscenities" clause is one I deem not sane. I'll abide by it in ubuntu channels, but I don't exactly have the intention of actively doing so in other non-ubuntu channels.
[02:56] <rww> right
[02:57] <rww> Follow the rules of whatever channel you're in, but what I'm specifically talking about right now is #ubuntu-offtopic.
[02:57] <rww> what you do outside the Ubuntu namespace is none of my business :)
[02:57] <robinetd> Makes sense.
[02:58] <robinetd> So, problem is resolved then?
[02:58] <rww> yup, have a good evening
[06:56] <IdleOne> !coc > OmegaForte
[06:56] <jpds> OK, OmegaForte is being random.
[06:56] <IdleOne> random and annoying/rude/a pita
[06:56] <rww> bread
[06:57] <IdleOne> sorry for the bad word acronym. I know better.
[06:57] <Myrtti> there are some weird mushrooms being eaten by some it seems
[06:58] <rww> someone was driving 30kph too slow on the freeway today. so yes.
[06:58] <Myrtti> fail
[06:59] <Myrtti> hold on
[06:59] <rww> nope, it's a fail
[07:00] <Myrtti> a briton living in us talking about iso standard measurement units? I lubs u
[07:00] <rww> I also write dates correctly.
[07:01] <jpds> Myrtti: In you? Who did you eat?
[07:01] <Myrtti> you are my hero, kind sir!
[07:02] <IdleOne> Someone please lart OmegaForte
[07:02] <Myrtti> jpds: mobile phone vkb is ... mobile phone vkb
[07:02] <rww> do it yourself to make up for you dismal first attempt
[07:02] <rww> jpds did it better
[07:03] <IdleOne> rww: took me a couple minutes to realize what the fail! was for.
[07:03] <rww> go to sleeps, IdleOne
[07:03] <IdleOne> I should.
[07:03] <rww> oh goddess, jpds is sending them this way
[07:03] <Myrtti> fun times for all
[07:04] <rww> Myrtti: were you aware that cellphones sometimes have keyboards? also something about serial buses.
[07:06] <Myrtti> dundundun
[11:08] <Myrtti> someone could have a look at Zendmaster or whatever
[11:08] <Myrtti> I need to go for a while
[11:12] <elky> !guidelines > zenmaster
[13:15] <F-B-T> hey guys...
[13:16] <bazhang> F-B-T, hi
[13:16] <F-B-T> I need help.
[13:16] <bazhang> with?
[13:16] <F-B-T> I can't change the default nick I log in with and it's going to continually get me removed from #ubuntu
[13:16] <bazhang> ?
[13:16] <F-B-T> I even registered my current nick so that I could use it instead.
[13:17] <bazhang> take #ubuntu off the auto join list
[13:17] <F-B-T> My original nick is FatherBadTouch
[13:17] <F-B-T> Which, earlier this week it was brought to my attention how it can be seen as offensive.
[13:17] <bazhang> yep. that won't change.
[13:17] <F-B-T> I'm not saying it will, nor do I expect it.
[13:18] <bazhang> remove #ubuntu from the auto join list, problem solved.
[13:18] <F-B-T> What I need help with now is changing what it uses my nick as when it logs in.
[13:18] <bazhang> which client
[13:18] <F-B-T> XChat
[13:18] <bazhang> #xchat
[13:18] <F-B-T> I know how to remove it from my auto-join list, provided I'm in the channel.
[13:18] <F-B-T> ohhhh
[13:19] <bazhang> since this is not a support channel, ask there
[13:19] <F-B-T> I need a ban lifted though
[13:19] <F-B-T> I have a support problem again.
[13:19] <F-B-T> specifically with Ubuntu.
[13:19] <F-B-T> if you can say that.
[13:21] <bazhang> no ban in #ubuntu that I can see.
[13:22] <F-B-T> ty
[13:23] <Myrtti> there is one, but I left it on purpose
[13:23] <Myrtti> it's to prevent him to use that nick
[13:23] <bazhang> ok
[13:23] <bazhang> how anyone could think that's NOT offensive is beyond me
[13:23] <Myrtti> indeed
[13:43]  * jrib passes the patience tea to Pici
[13:51] <Pici> O____O
[13:55] <Pici> hrm
[13:55] <jrib> you're so eager ubottu
[13:56] <Myrtti> if he was muted, then why did I see the flood
[13:59] <marienz> irc's racy like that (it'll only reliably work right if the thing setting the mute is on the same server as the thing getting muted)
[14:39] <knome> is Darkmode banned in #ubuntu?
[14:39] <knome> he's asking ubuntu (network) stuff in #xubuntu
[14:39] <Pici> Do you remember seeing a ban?
[14:40] <knome> no
[14:40] <Pici> I see a mute that was set and then removed.
[14:40] <knome> is it recent?
[14:41] <Pici> Last week.
[14:41] <knome> okay... is there any notes about mutes?
[14:41] <Pici> Looks like it was a floodbot mute, nevermind.
[14:41] <knome> heh, okay :)
[15:54] <xvilo> hai
[15:54] <xvilo> can somebody delete my bann
[15:56] <Pici> xvilo: Have you looked over the channel guidelines like I asked?
[16:13] <Myrtti> xvilo: hello
 Iḿ allowed in here again :P
[16:17] <oCean> ?
[16:43] <ikonia> xvilo: can you please respond
[16:45] <Myrtti> *chomp*
[17:23] <oCean> AcidRain> well if im not back in 2 hrs. you know that ocean screwed me
[17:50] <Myrtti> yupyup
[18:13] <Pici> We're going to have a big problem with Unity come release day.
[18:13] <jrib> Pici: why's that?
[18:13] <Myrtti> need to do a straw poll on how many of us actually use it :->
[18:14]  * jrib has never even tried unity
[18:14] <Myrtti> I have
[18:14] <Myrtti> it was horrid
[18:14] <Pici> I tried using it and then I remembered that I don't like docks.
[18:14] <jrib> are the rumors about classic being gone in 11.10 true?
[18:15] <Pici> Yes.
[18:15] <Myrtti> "welcome to Xubuntu"
[18:15] <Pici> I've actually been using KDE :/
[18:15] <charlie-tca> !yay Xubuntu
[18:16] <jrib> see you should have all jumped ship to a more obscure wm before unity was even thought of
[18:16] <Pici> Xubuntu is nice, but I wanted to try something different.
[18:16] <jrib> Pici: do you prefer kde to gnome 2?
[18:16] <Myrtti> it actually doesn't really matter what I'm using, lubuntu would probably be a better fit for me
[18:17] <Pici> jrib: No, it doesn't run that well on my laptop.
[18:17] <jrib> oh
[18:17] <ikonia> it's shame that the resources of canonica/ubuntu are not being put into developing gnome3
[18:17] <charlie-tca> Just replace the window manager in Xubuntu to get something different
[18:17] <ikonia> gnome3 is the most realistic "future" but it's too early and needs input
[18:18] <jrib> is gnome 3 available in oneiric, ikonia?
[18:18] <ikonia> gnome shell isn't
[18:18] <ikonia> not as a core product
[18:19] <jrib> hmm
[18:19] <Pici> Its in the repos.
[18:19] <ikonia> gnome 3 is ofcourse what unity is built on, so it is there
[18:19] <ikonia> Pici: which repo ?
[18:19] <jrib> I meant shell, yes
[18:19] <ikonia> jrib: I get caught out miss-using the gnome3/gnome-shell combo
[18:19] <ikonia> that was my fault for bad wording
[18:19] <topyli> gnome-shell is in universe afaik
[18:19] <ikonia> better than multiverse
[18:20] <topyli> it's free software :)
[18:20] <ikonia> I'm just a little dissapointed that the resources haven't been put behind such a big and undoubtedly big player project
[18:21] <topyli> i'm sure gnome is still seen as important as ever, it is after all the very core of the ubuntu desktop
[18:22] <Pici> Anyway, my point in bringing this up was to perhaps discuss what we can do as ops to help people either use Unity or easily transition away from it.
[18:22] <ikonia> yes, gnome is, but the default shell, which is really what makes the desktop is pretty much zero interest
[18:22] <ikonia> Pici: discuss.......
[18:23] <Pici> ikonia: I don't know, we have a few months, maybe we should pester the documentation team or someone for some good wiki pages detailing how to move to $OTHERDE
[18:23] <charlie-tca> Xubuntu really appreciates any mention
[18:23] <ikonia> charlie-tca: I think it will gain a lot of traction in the Ubuntu world very quickly
[18:23] <topyli> as for using unity, i did move back to ubuntu and used unity until it stopped starting with my session
[18:23] <ikonia> Pici: I guess a cheat sheet of gnome->unity mapping would be a good start
[18:24] <topyli> maybe i should add it to the 'startup applications' or something to remind it
[18:24] <ikonia> a common problems page, eg: nvidia version $X doesn't work, pulse has a problem with $Y
[18:25] <ikonia> swapping to another desktop, that's a touch call, I think a re-install is the most simple way to deal with that to not leave tons of gnome stuff around
[18:26] <ikonia> or the creation of a meta package to strip gnome out of the system once another DE is in place
[18:26] <ikonia> I could look into that ?
[18:26] <jrib> there must exist a basic unity 101 document somewhere
[18:27] <ikonia> there is stome stuff on https://help.ubuntu.com - but it's more how to use, rather than how to swap from gnome
[18:27] <topyli> we don't need to remove gnome, what kind of problems do you have in mind?
[18:27] <ikonia> topyli: if you swap to say xubuntu, you don't want gnome on your system
[18:27] <jrib> personally, I think just telling people they can install xubuntu-desktop to try something more classical (and then swap back and forth at gdm) is good
[18:27] <Pici> xubuntu still uses gtk, doesn't it?
[18:27] <Myrtti> yup
[18:27] <topyli> xubuntu uses most of gnome anyway :)
[18:28] <Pici> As does lcde.
[18:28] <Pici> lxde*
[18:28] <ikonia> topyli: I wasn't saying remove gnome, I was suggesting a meta package that cleaned up gnome once you'd installed another system
[18:28] <ikonia> how much does it use ?
[18:28] <ikonia> I didn't think it was much
[18:28] <Myrtti> abiword and gnumeric
[18:28] <jrib> "unity wiki pages" on http://unity.ubuntu.com/projects/unity/ just links to wiki.ubuntu.com -_-
[18:28] <Pici> :(
[18:28] <ikonia> jrib: thats teh kind of sloppyness that shouldn't be inplace,
[18:29] <ikonia> Canonical are launching a major product, and this stuff should be top notch before release.
[18:29] <Myrtti> gtk screensaver perhaps
[18:29] <Myrtti> not much
[18:29] <Myrtti> gtk yes
[18:29] <Myrtti> gnome, no
[18:31] <topyli> it runs the gnome-settings-daemon to keep the apps sane, no?
[18:31]  * rww reads scrollback
[18:32] <rww> * Oneiric uses GNOME 3 by default, with Unity instead of GNOME Shell. Shell is in universe. * It's possible to install GNOME 3 fallback and pick that in GDM, it's probably the cloest we have to GNOME Panel in oneiric.
[18:32] <rww> !find fallback oneiric
[18:32] <rww> that package ^
[18:32] <ikonia> rww: what does that take you to ?
[18:33] <jrib> yes, I'm curious how that panel differs from the one in classic now if anyone knows
[18:34] <rww> ikonia: GNOME 3 Fallback
[18:35] <Myrtti> topyli: well I do have gnome-settings-daemon, but I'm not too sure about when has it entered my system
[18:35] <topyli> jrib: it's similar to the gnome2 default panel arrangement, but not quite as good. in 3.0 anyway, i suppose they're improving it form 3.2 along with everything else
[18:35] <rww> jrib: it's GNOME 3 instead of GNOME 2, looks completely different, etc. It's malleable into something that looks like GNOME 2, though
[18:35] <Myrtti> that sounded wrong
[18:35] <Myrtti> sorry
[18:35] <rww> looks/works
[18:35] <jrib> other than looks, is there a functional difference?
[18:35] <rww> you need to hold down the Alt key to actually config anything. Apart from that, it works similarly for me
[18:36] <topyli> jrubyes, the panels aren't really gnome-panel and can't run gnome applets etc.
[18:36] <rww> (alt-right-click on things instead of right-click)
[18:36] <jrib> topyli: oh
[18:36] <rww> yeah, that too. I don't use applets much though
[18:36] <jrib> I guess that would bother people
[18:36] <rww> Amaranthus: your client pinged out, /nick and identify svp :)
[18:40]  * jrib makes note of what to program bots to say
[18:40] <Pici> 'I am not a bot'
[18:43] <jrib> yeah, maybe with a '-_-' at the end for some emotion
[21:46] <Jordan_U> synapse is attempting to troll #ubuntu-offtopic.