[01:52] <HazRPG> anyone seen this google+ song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGugj1ym594
[02:14] <AyeGiffgaff> Morning folks
[02:16] <ali1234> HazRPG: people who cannot sing like freddie mercury should not cover/parody queen songs
[02:19] <daftykins> i prefer: Queen should not be parodied/covered/etc
[02:22] <ali1234> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tZkouut-9RQ&feature=player_detailpage#t=65s
[03:09] <HazRPG> heh
[03:12] <HazRPG> guessing you don't like any of bob rivers's queen parodies then either?
[03:12] <ali1234> never heard of him
[03:29] <HazRPG> american dude
[04:59] <MartijnVdS> \o
[05:11] <LewisCawte> Why were you guys up so early? :P
[05:27] <MartijnVdS> LewisCawte: HazRPG is always up all night, and I'm in another country (where it's 7:30 now ;)
[05:28] <LewisCawte> Another country very close... Netherlands/France/Belgium are all ones that spring to mind
[05:28] <HazRPG> LewisCawte: heh, I sleep very little lol
[05:28] <MartijnVdS> LewisCawte: Netherlands is correct
[05:28] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: I'm still not convinced you're not a bot :P
[05:29]  * MartijnVdS is off to catch a train
[05:29] <MartijnVdS> \o
[06:44] <HazRPG> MartijnVdS: hehe :P
[07:22] <daubers> Morning
[07:22] <DJones> Morning daubers
[07:27] <daubers> Why is evolution such a big pile of rubbish?
[07:29] <daubers> Change in the calender server requires me to change a calender account, right click on it to fix and it pops up a dialog telling me it can't connect and takes the focus away from the right click
[07:29] <daubers> I know it's broken NOW LET ME FIX IT
[07:30] <DJones> I've not used evolution for quite a while, I started using thunderbird to give me cross platform consistency
[07:31] <smittix> Morning all
[07:50] <MooDoo> hello all :)
[07:52] <smittix> Morning MooDoo, How goes it?
[07:52] <MooDoo> smittix: surprisingly quiet....:S
[07:53] <smittix> heh
[08:09]  * daubers considers going home and hiding in bed until the world ends
[08:09] <gord> blanket forts and cockroaches are the only thing that will survive a nuclear fallout after all
[08:10] <DJones> Don't forget Vegemite, that survives anything
[08:10] <MooDoo> daubers: BIG HUG and a nice Cuppa Tea n Toast....there there ;)
[08:13] <brobostigon> good morning.
[08:14] <MooDoo> moring brobostigon
[08:14] <brobostigon> morning MooDoo
[08:14] <MooDoo> brobostigon: are you well
[08:15] <daubers> oh well, at least the oggcamp videos are slowly making their way onto the interwebs
[08:15] <MooDoo> ooo are they?
[08:15] <MooDoo> linkies?
[08:15] <brobostigon> MooDoo: not perticulerly, no. and you?
[08:15] <MooDoo> brobostigon: i'm awake and at work, does that count?
[08:16] <brobostigon> MooDoo: yes, it does.
[08:16] <daubers> MooDoo: At 500k, each 700MB file might take a couple of hours :) When ones up and working I'll hand out the link
[08:16] <MooDoo> daubers: ah! :)
[08:17] <brobostigon> :)
[08:26] <bigcalm> !ping
[08:26]  * bigcalm thwaps VirginMedia
[08:32] <DJones> Another bad day with the conenction bigcalm ?
[08:33] <MontyMoose> Hello people - having a strange problem with apt-get ... whatever I try and install it always tells me libnet-ssleay-perl / libauthen-pam-perl are required. I try to install these and it fails. I'm running Natty and have allowed all repositires - any ideas thanks :-)
[08:34] <MontyMoose> I've done the obvious things: apt-get update etc...
[08:35] <bigcalm> DJones: I hope not. But my VM modem/router had given my dev server the wrong IP address. The MAC/IP setting had gone for the device and to add it back meant the modem/router rebooted itself
[08:35] <bigcalm> *sigh*
[08:37] <DJones> MontyMoose: What are you trying to install?
[08:37] <MontyMoose> I started off trying to install webmin - then just to see whether it was a webmin only thing I tried a few simple things... the text-based browser links for example... same problem
[08:38] <MontyMoose> (it's a fresh install)
[08:39] <DJones> It could be a problem with trying to install webmin, thats no longer supported in ubuntu and apparantely can cause problems
[08:39] <DJones> !webmin
[08:39] <DJones> Looking at the "likely to cause unexpected issues with your system"
[08:39] <MontyMoose> ok fair enough - I'm not that interested in webmin - just speeds up editing my conf files thats all.
[08:40] <MontyMoose> But I get the same problem trying to install links! - surely that's still supported!?
[08:40] <MooDoo> !links
[08:40] <DJones> Are you able to sudo apt-get install libnet-ssleay-perl as a package on its own?
[08:40] <MooDoo> oops
[08:40] <BigRedS> if Webmin's still broken from trying to install the perl modules it'll winge on every successive install
[08:40] <MontyMoose> nope - same error
[08:41] <MontyMoose> oh I see - so it is installing these things - I'm just getting a stupid webmin message
[08:41] <DJones> I'm not sure how to fix that problem, but hopefully somebody else can help fixing that
[08:41] <BigRedS> it might be
[08:41] <BigRedS> it might instead be crapping out because webmin's broken
[08:41] <BigRedS> I'd try uninstalling webmin if it's suggested that it causes problems
[08:41] <MontyMoose> bloody webmin - so what's the best way to totally remove webmin
[08:42] <BigRedS> apt-get remove webmin
[08:42] <MontyMoose> bear in mind - it never installed succesfully
[08:42] <BigRedS> will remove it
[08:42] <BigRedS> apt-get remove --purge webmin
[08:42] <BigRedS> will remove it and all its config
[08:42] <DJones> Did you install it manually? I'm assuming its not going to be part of the default apt database?
[08:42] <MontyMoose> ok done that - it seems to suggest that webmin has been removed - let me try the perl install again
[08:43] <MontyMoose> ...and now it works -
[08:43] <MontyMoose> thanks guys - I won't be installing webmin again
[08:46] <DJones> !ebox
[08:46] <DJones> That seems to be the replacement for webmin
[08:46] <DJones> with the change of name to zentyal
[08:47] <JamesTait> Good morning!
[08:47] <DJones> Although even that doesn't show up in the apt database
[08:47] <DJones> Ah, still shows under ebox
[08:48] <bigcalm> !links2
[08:50] <BigRedS> MontyMoose: it should work, really, since it is in the repos. Bit crap to have it break on install and then say "oh, but it's not reccomended anyway"
[08:51] <MontyMoose> indeed
[08:51] <DJones> bigcalm: Did you mean webmin then? I couldn't see it in the ubuntu repo's
[08:52] <MontyMoose> I might see if I can manage on the config files on their own - I've always used webmin on my servers in the past. But it's just another port I have to have open on the firewall. Probably better to manage it through the shell
[08:56] <MontyMoose> ok - as you're all here, and I'm setting up my new server - what FTP server do you recommend on Natty? I've always used proftpd - any reason not to continue doing this?
[08:57] <bigcalm> DJones: eh?
[08:58] <DJones> bigcalm: The comment about it being in the repo's but then saying it breaks on on install and its not recommended anyway
[08:58]  * bigcalm points DJones at BigRedS :)
[08:58] <DJones> Whoops, not enough coffee yet
[08:58] <bigcalm> A tab failure hadn't happened for a while, I was starting to miss it ;)
[09:01] <BigRedS> Argh. I meant to hunt bigcalm down at oggcamp to prove that we are two separate people
[09:02] <bigcalm> Heh
[09:02] <bigcalm> I just remembered that as well
[09:02] <BigRedS> In fact, are you in the ubuntu-uk photo thingy out the front?
[09:02] <bigcalm> BigRedS: yes, just at the last moment!
[09:02] <BigRedS> ah, awesome. there's proof there, then
[09:02] <bigcalm> The talk I was attending over ran
[09:03] <bigcalm> http://www.flickr.com/photos/mattdaubney/6041112753
[09:03] <Myrtti> so I trust both of you have tagged yourselves in that picture?
[09:03] <bigcalm> It's a little "Where's Wally"
[09:03] <bigcalm> Myrtti: I did :)
[09:03] <BigRedS> I can tag me?
[09:04] <Myrtti> BigRedS: sure
[09:04] <bigcalm> Myrtti: it looks as though you are wearing a cape :D
[09:05] <BigRedS> aha!
[09:05] <Myrtti> I know, my scarf does that at times
[09:05] <BigRedS> man flickr's changed a bit since I last paid it any attention
[09:05] <Myrtti> ...
[09:06] <Myrtti> WHEN have you last paid attention to it then?
[09:06] <bigcalm> BigRedS: aha, there you are. Wish I had cool hair like yours
[09:06] <BigRedS> er,
[09:06] <BigRedS> apr 8 2010 I think
[09:07] <Myrtti> well, it has changed "a bit" but not much
[09:07] <BigRedS> Myrtti: I don't remember the people tagging, and the zoom view looks new.
[09:07] <BigRedS> but I've never looked for people tagging before
[09:07] <Myrtti> yeah, the zoom defaults to the light box now
[09:08] <bigcalm> People tagging is slightly new, though tagging isn't
[09:49] <daubers> Why are desktop touchscreen still so expensive?
[09:51] <bigcalm> Because not everybody has them yet
[09:51] <bigcalm> Once we do, they will become cheaper
[09:51] <gord> not sure, would of thought that laptops with touchscreens would of been big this year
[09:53]  * daubers suspects the "tablet" market appearing has made things worse
[09:57] <gord> though, using a touchscreen with windows sucks, i'm sure that plays out quite a bit
[09:57] <Daviey> daubers: nah, IMO it makes the technology more of a commodity and gets users used to interacting with computers with touch, making it more of a wanted feature.
[09:58] <daubers> Daviey: However if I'm a large tablet manufacturer with a fruit as my logo, I would buy up as much touchscreen stock as possible in order to make sure the price points stay where I want them

[09:59] <daubers> :p
[09:59] <daubers> Doesn't help that HP just ordered loads and then more or less ditched them all
[09:59] <Daviey> daubers: normally, the more sold, the more that get created. :).  multi-touch is an example of this :)
[09:59] <Ng> gord: any laptop with a touchscreen would suck
[10:00] <daubers> Daviey: There's only so much silicon being manufactued at any one time
[10:00] <gord> Ng, what makes you say that?
[10:00] <MontyMoose> I remember a time when a ubuntu installation worked as a webserver right out of the box... not any more sadly. Every time I get a new server I have to do more fannying around before it actually works *grumble grumble*
[10:00] <Ng> gord: if you're not holding the screen in your hand, it's probably in a position that's pretty unnatural to touch
[10:00] <Ng> try holding your arms up in front of your screen and pretend you're using it like a touchpad, for about 10-15 minutes
[10:01] <gord> Ng, right i don't think that you would use it like that
[10:01] <Daviey> Ng: have you actually tried that as an experiment?
[10:01] <gord> Ng, you would be sitting there watching youtube or whatever, you hit a pause button because you are going to make some coffee, come back and unpause. instead of faffing about with the touchpad
[10:01] <Daviey> Ng: If so, did you do it in public? That would have been a kodak moment.
[10:01] <BigRedS> MontyMoose: is that because you're doing more exciting things with it?
[10:01] <gord> it would be for casual interaction, not as the main input device
[10:02] <MontyMoose> I suppose... although with my new Natty box the "exciting thing" thing I'm trying to do is to turn MySql on! - fairly standard one would have thought.
[10:02] <daubers> MontyMoose: turn it on? If you've installed mysql the service should be running
[10:02] <BigRedS> surely that's just apt-get install mysql-server?
[10:02] <Ng> gord: so just for occasional casual interaction you're going to redesign the entire interface paradigm so everything is at least the size of a fingertip? :/
[10:02] <MontyMoose> yup - done that and it says it's installed and up to date...
[10:02] <Daviey> I can see tablets totally replacing laptops eventually.  I regulary see people on the train using ipads with hardware keyboards.
[10:03] <Daviey> The atrix i thought was a good proo of concept.
[10:03] <Ng> I can almost touch type on my ipad now :)
[10:03] <MontyMoose> however when I try and connect to it (to add users and stuff) it just says: Can't connect to local MySQL server through socket
[10:03] <daubers> MontyMoose: What are you trying to connect to it with
[10:03] <MontyMoose> at this point I'm just trying to connect through the shell with 'mysql' command
[10:04] <daubers> MontyMoose: mysql -uroot -p ?
[10:04] <gord> Ng, you can be smarter about things than that, the user is not likely to want to touch things in MS Word with their finger, but is likely to want to control their media player with their finger for example
[10:04] <MontyMoose> yup - that's what i'm doing...
[10:04] <MontyMoose> ERROR 2002 (HY000): Can't connect to local MySQL server through socket '/var/run/mysqld/mysqld.sock' (2)
[10:04] <Ng> gord: that's not smart, that's lazy ;)
[10:05] <daubers> MontyMoose: sudo service mysql restart
[10:05] <MontyMoose> I tried /init.d/mysql start - and that doesn't seem to work either! have things moved on since the days of init.d?
[10:05] <BigRedS> yeah, there's a new way of doing it
[10:05] <MontyMoose> daubers: restart: Unknown instance
[10:05] <brobostigon>  /etc/init.d/*
[10:05] <daubers> MontyMoose: itym /etc/init.d/
[10:05] <bigcalm> MontyMoose: is mysql running?
[10:05] <BigRedS> which I appear unable to remember until /etc/init.d/* stops working
[10:05] <daubers> MontyMoose: sudo service mysql start
[10:06] <bigcalm> ps aux | grep mysql
[10:06] <MontyMoose> well... it's thinking...........
[10:06] <bigcalm> Oh dear
[10:06] <daubers> MontyMoose: Is this the same box that had webmin on it?
[10:07] <bigcalm> MontyMoose: I do hope you don't have the upstart issue I had: http://www.myrant.net/2010/05/21/upstart-failing-to-manage-mysqld-on-ubuntu-10-04/
[10:07] <Ng> gord: also "their media player" is not likely to be their route to your example of youtube, a browser is (unless you're going to include a touchy friendly youtube app like certain popular tablets do), and you can't make the youtube flash thing suddenly be touch friendly
[10:07] <MontyMoose> well it sort of half had webmin on it - but it never installed properly so I apt-get removed it
[10:07] <gord> Ng, it wasn't a specific example, it was hypothetical - if touchscreen laptops took off, i'm sure youtube would provide support
[10:08] <MontyMoose> sudo service mysql start = hang until ctrl+C
[10:08] <Ng> gord: my personal opinion is that ipad works so well because it turned the chicken&egg problem of making laptops touchable by just throwing out all the paradigms that are confusing in a touchy laptop world and defining a new experience
[10:08] <Ng> gord: I think touchy laptops would be a mostly hacky, ugly, confusing, painful experience :)
[10:08] <MontyMoose> bizarre never had any problems getting mysql going before
[10:08] <Ng> and expensive
[10:09] <bigcalm> MontyMoose: sounds like you have the upstart issue I had, read the blog post I pasted
[10:09] <Ng> adding a touchscreen to a 13"+ LCD is not going to be easy or cheap atm
[10:09] <MontyMoose> ok - thanks
[10:09] <bigcalm> MontyMoose: what version of Ubuntu are you running?
[10:09] <bigcalm> BTW, read the comments as well. That's where the real fix is
[10:10] <MontyMoose> 11.04
[10:10] <bigcalm> Most strange then
[10:10] <MontyMoose> (fresh install this morninig)
[10:11] <bigcalm> It would be horrible if this issue has returned then
[10:12] <MontyMoose> Right I've run the code as suggested in the comments - and I'm now rebooting - so we'll see
[10:12] <gord> Ng, i don't think it would be cheep either :) but i also think you can build a nice interface around it too - frankly gnome has had giant buttons since 2.0 anyway ;)
[10:12] <davmor2> morning all
[10:14] <MontyMoose> ok - so now it doesn't hang and says mysql start/running
[10:16] <bigcalm> Morning mrevell
[10:16] <MontyMoose> something still isn't right - I started it and it seemed to suggest it was running - but still wouldn't let me in. Then I stopped it and it stopped properly. Then tried starting it again and it hung again.... weird
[10:18] <mrevell> howdy bigcalm
[10:18] <czajkowski> peeka boo
[10:18]  * davmor2 gives czajkowski a big hug
[10:19]  * TheOpenSourcerer thinks davmor2 must be after something
[10:19] <czajkowski> ello
[10:20] <MontyMoose> any other suggestions - I've followed the fix in your post so the service should now have root access to  /usr/sbin/mysqld - but it still doesn't work! help!
[10:21] <BigRedS> MontyMoose: is it the same error message? About not being able to connect?
[10:21] <MontyMoose> yup
[10:21] <davmor2> TheOpenSourcerer: No just freakin czajkowski out it's fun to throw in from time to time :D
[10:21] <BigRedS> does mysql show up in ps?   ps aux | grep mysql
[10:21] <MontyMoose>  1807  0.0  0.1   7932  1056 pts/0    S+   11:21   0:00 grep --color=auto mysql
[10:21] <MontyMoose> does that make any sense at all?
[10:21] <BigRedS> cool, so it's not running
[10:22] <BigRedS> you've just returned the grep for it. You'd expect another line with the mysql process in it if it was running
[10:22] <MontyMoose> oh I see
[10:22] <MontyMoose> so if I try to start the service again following the fix and reboot - lets see what happens....
[10:22] <BigRedS> yeah
[10:23] <MontyMoose> start: Job is already running: mysql
[10:24] <MontyMoose> odd - so grep suggests it isn't running - but if I try and start it - it says it already is!
[10:27] <BigRedS> I'd be very tempted to find and delete the lockfile/pidfile and try again, though this is a tad underhand
[10:27] <MooDoo> hello all
[10:27] <davmor2> MooDoo: morning me owld mukka
[10:27] <MontyMoose> I'm quite happy being underhand - how do I go about doing that?
[10:27] <BigRedS> MontyMoose: does    cat /var/run/mysqld/mysqld.pid    return anything?
[10:28] <MooDoo> hi davmor2 :S
[10:28] <MontyMoose> no such file or directory
[10:28] <BigRedS> hm
[10:28] <BigRedS> I was rather hoping that was how upstart or whatever it is deduced the run state of mysql
[10:29] <davmor2> MooDoo: that monday morning feeling? Give czajkowski a hug it will soon go away as she beats you unconscious :D
[10:29] <BigRedS> (it should be a file that, when MySQL starts, is created containing the PID of the MySQL process. On stopping the MySQL daemon it's deleted. any attempt to start it would check for the existence of that file and, if it exists, assume it's already started and so abort)
[10:30] <MontyMoose> got ya - if this is going to be a big issue I'd be tempted to downgrade. This server is all about MySQL the whole purpose of it is to hold millions and millions of rows of mysql data!!
[10:30] <czajkowski> davmor2: as of tomorrow I won't be here :d
[10:31] <BigRedS> MontyMoose: once you've got over whatever's causing it to not start now it should be fine, I'm just not sure what that hiccup is
[10:31] <BigRedS> And I should be doing the work I'm paid to do :/
[10:32] <MontyMoose> ok thanks. Well I'll go trawling Google then... one more day like this and I'm off to buy a big shiny red hat - Ubuntu is pissing me off!
[10:32] <MooDoo> davmor2: i'm in a mood so i can't even be bothered to torment czajkowski
[10:32] <BigRedS> red hat? ew.
[10:32] <BigRedS> Go Debian if anywhere :)
[10:32] <MontyMoose> Just need something which will run a LAMP quickly and easily with no headaches
[10:33] <davmor2> czajkowski: You got a job?
[10:33] <MooDoo> davmor2: keep up man, she's going back to ireland
[10:33] <BigRedS> MontyMoose: Usually all Linuxes will do that. We routinely get Debian and Ubuntu boxes up doing that with no issues. Much more debian than ubuntu at the minute, but they're pretty similar at that sort of thing
[10:33] <czajkowski> davmor2: nope I head to ireland
[10:34] <MontyMoose> ok thanks man - I'll keep pressing on
[10:34] <BigRedS> you might have hit a release-specific bug, where downgrading to the previous Ubuntu will render yourself unaffected, or switching to a debian (or anywhere else, but RedHat's downright insane ;) )
[10:34] <daubers> MontyMoose: Did you not just select the lamp stuff in the installer?
[10:34] <MontyMoose> yup
[10:34] <MontyMoose> it's all installed - just mysql won't start
[10:34] <davmor2> czajkowski: nuts :(
[10:34] <czajkowski> indeed
[10:34] <czajkowski> :)
[10:34]  * daubers has been considering moving to postgres recently
[10:35] <BigRedS> yeah, I've stuck a couple of things on postgres
[10:35] <BigRedS> it's definitely less easy than MySQL and I'm not convinced that's entirely down to familiarity
[10:37] <daubers> I've started moving a lot of my arduino stuff over to mqtt, so I've considered writing a postgres thing to capture the mqtt stuffs and store it in a db. I have one for mysql, shouldn't be hard to convert
[10:39]  * daubers is pondering building a geiger counter for his office
[10:39] <BigRedS> where do you work?
[10:39] <daubers> BigRedS: Just over the road from AWE
[10:40] <BigRedS> ahhh. I'd invoke the principle of not asking questions to which you'd rather not know the answer there
[10:40] <daubers> BigRedS: heh, I'm just intrigued :)
[10:43] <BigRedS> Plug it into /dev/random :)
[10:44] <daubers> BigRedS: One in my house, one in the office, one in my parents house, one in my mates house down the road. See if any patterns appear
[10:49] <DJones> AlanBell: TheOpenSourcerer Is this of interest http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/08/22/cabinet_office_ict_asset_services_procurement/
[10:49] <AlanBell> I nearly got sucked in to that
[10:50] <AlanBell> open source suppliers dodged a bullet there IMHO
[10:57] <DJones> AlanBell: Expensive or just time consuming & time wasting
[10:58] <AlanBell> not much money in it, and they wanted *lots* of bespoke interfaces to random asset tracking systems
[10:59] <AlanBell> so masses of work to do, with no scope, no budget and they wanted a fixed price
[11:00] <TheOpenSourcerer> I read that story too. Sounded like a good price to me.
[11:00] <TheOpenSourcerer> £1ook for 3 years
[11:01] <Daviey> AlanBell: Fixed price is BS.. as in it will not happen.  Fixed price for the spec.. then the contract will double in cost for all the unconsidered features.
[11:01] <MartijnVdS> sounds like government contracts
[11:01] <MartijnVdS> (it's the same here in .nl)
[11:04] <AlanBell> yeah, I don't know the full details, I was just asked if I wanted to get involved, but as it was something that IBM had already failed at and other larger suppliers were competing for and the whole thing sounded toxic I backed off
[11:05] <AlanBell> plus I couldn't see the open source element of the project
[11:06] <MontyMoose> Ok - I'm giving up on this mysql problem. Which version would people recommend I downgrade to with Ubuntu? I need a version where apache/php/mysql work properly?
[11:06] <Daviey> MontyMoose: They should all work.
[11:07] <Daviey> MontyMoose: People tend to prefer the LTS releases, so Lucid.
[11:07] <MontyMoose> Lucid ok - I'll hunt for an iso
[11:07] <AlanBell> MontyMoose: install phpmyadmin and see if that works, it will pull in everything you need and you can test it all
[11:07] <AlanBell> then remove it
[11:07] <BigRedS> it'll be on ubuntu.com - it's the current LTS release
[11:07] <MontyMoose> nice idea
[11:07] <MontyMoose> right oh - good plan
[11:08] <MontyMoose> shoudld have done that to start with really
[11:08] <MontyMoose> download underway - thanks for all your help
[11:31] <Venko> Hey guys
[11:32] <DJones> Afternoon Venko, seems a long time since I've seen you in the channel
[11:32] <dogmatic69> o/
[11:36] <Venko> Yeah, to be honest I'm using Windows on this computer :-o
[11:36] <Venko> It's a gaming computer you see, you know for evil time wasting games
[11:37] <DJones> If it makes you feel any better, I'm using Windows as well, its an evil freedom wasting work machine
[11:42] <Venko> Oggcamp was so awesome though. It's inspired me to properly use FOSS again :)
[11:44] <Venko> Hey, I don't suppose you know of any FOSS webmail clients? I've got some ideas for a client I want to make but I don't want to build a backend if I can borrow one from somewhere
[11:44] <andylockran> howdy
[11:44] <MartijnVdS> roundcube
[11:44] <MartijnVdS> Venko: ^
[11:44] <Venko> I suppose the downside is if it's GPL licensed it'll prevent me from using affero GPL for my project but it'd be a fair trade-off to avoid the extra work
[11:44] <BigRedS> roundcube is awesome
[11:45] <andylockran> guys, I'm hoping to run a wireless test to check the wireless setup over a period of a few days - is there any wireless monitoring software any of you would recommend?
[11:45] <BigRedS> It's teh first webmail client I've found that's basically a web-based proper mail client
[11:45] <andylockran> BigRedS: RoundCube FTW
[11:45] <MartijnVdS> andylockran: write a small script that greps in the output of "iwlist", plug into your favourite monitoring tool (nagios?)?
[11:46] <andylockran> MartijnVdS: ta
[11:54] <dwatkins> andylockran: what kinds of tests do you want to do?
[11:54] <dwatkins> Just curious, wondering if it's response time, signal strength etc.
[11:59] <andylockran> dwatkins: many
[12:03] <daubers> urgh, uploads take too long
[12:08] <daubers> at least I seem to have got the format right for blip
[12:49] <MooDoo> bloomin mondays
[12:51] <bigcalm> Moomin Mondays \o/
[12:53] <popey> \o/ Monday!
[12:53] <MooDoo> pah!
[12:54] <daubers> MooDoo+1
[12:54]  * daubers notes the oggcamp video he uploaded as a test has had 5 viewers and he hasn't published the URI yet
[12:55] <shauno> spies everywhere
[12:55] <daubers> also, did I mention, upload speeds suck
[12:55] <BigRedS> Downside of shared spotify playlist for music in the noc: Aqua - Barbie Girl has just come on
[12:56] <MooDoo> BigRedS: GET OUT!!!! points....----- >
[12:56] <davmor2> BigRedS: what and you forgot what a great tune it was and are now playing it repeatedly right?
[12:58] <BigRedS> well, I've a feeling it was me who added it to the playlist
[12:58] <davmor2> BigRedS: It could be worse it could be Sam Fox Touch Me,  if that helps
[12:59] <davmor2> BigRedS: in that case I redirect you to MooDoo's earlier statement
[12:59] <BigRedS> haha, I've had a habit of putting, er, questionable music on just as I go to leave
[13:01] <davmor2> BigRedS: Too redeem yourself now go and listen to Josh Wink Highest State of Consciousness :D
[13:01] <BigRedS> but today someone's put the whole playlist on shuffle, so it's all over the place
[13:02] <BigRedS> ooh, there's a "Tweakin' acid funk mix" of that
[13:02] <BigRedS> sounds interesting
[13:03] <BigRedS> Hm. I'm not convinced this is better than Aqua
[13:03] <davmor2> BigRedS: When your ears start to bleed then you can listen to The Prodigy Firestarter :D
[13:03] <BigRedS> yeah, that sounds rather more appropriate :)
[13:04] <daubers> BigRedS: just put some Mahler on and be done with it
[13:05] <BigRedS> daubers: there's a lot of very long song names there
[13:05] <BigRedS> with words like 'symphony' and 'C sharp'
[13:05] <BigRedS> ew. Mono
[13:10] <BigRedS> Oh. The shared playlist is apparently now entirely Mahler
[13:12] <daubers> 734786924 bytes sent in 9314.28 secs (77.0 kB/s) :(
[13:15] <daubers> BigRedS: My missus glared at me yesterday when I said that any song that relies on a wall of sound is essentially rubbish because they couldn't be bothered to do anything interesting with rythem, temp, or anything other other than MAKE LOUD NOISES
[13:15] <daubers> like 5 year olds with their parents saucepans
[13:15] <daubers> s/temp/temp
[13:15] <daubers> s/temp/temp
[13:15] <daubers> o
[13:15] <daubers> Stupid muscle memory
[13:15] <BigRedS> haha
[13:15] <bigcalm> :D
[13:16] <BigRedS> I had an 8-hour journey to Geneva with a soundtrack composed entirely of drum and bass last week
[13:16] <daubers> think she was playing nickelback at the time
[13:16] <BigRedS> that was, er, not very fun
[13:17] <bigcalm> Goa Trance appears to be my thing for the month
[13:19] <krimzon2> modern drum and bass sucks cause they all have the exact same drums
[13:20] <krimzon2> and it's more like drum, bass and a ton of other house crap to get rid of that nasty dynamic range
[13:22] <gord> popey, found an actual arm server :) http://www.ztsystems.com/Default.aspx?tabid=1483
[13:23]  * popey falls over
[13:23] <bigcalm> Goodness
[13:24] <DJones> "popey falls over" .... Powered by bigcalm's VM connection :)
[13:24] <bigcalm> LOL
[13:24] <bigcalm> I think that popey's own VM connection can do that at times as well :P
[13:24] <bigcalm> popey: have you been tempted by the TiVo offer yet?
[13:25] <DJones> Yeah, but popey's VM connection is powering the whole of the interweb's as well
[13:26] <popey> bigcalm: saw an advert at the weekend and did ponder
[13:27] <daubers> You people and your "tv".
[13:27] <TheOpenSourcerer> w00t! England just got 2 quick wickets. India 262-5
[13:28] <bigcalm> popey: I _think_ that we can have it, but CS aren't very clued in, in our experience
[13:28] <bigcalm> 99 quid for the box, 3 quid per month for the service
[13:28] <bigcalm> The tivo box has its own 10mb modem in it so your tv becomes an 'internet tv'. According to an engineer, it doesn't impact upon ones 30mb connection...
[13:30] <popey> so could plug my openwrt into the tivo to share wifi to the house
[13:32] <bigcalm> No idea if it shares the internet connection outside of the box
[13:32] <bigcalm> Share the 10mb to everybody else and keep the 30mb for yourself? ;)
[13:33] <popey> ya
[13:33] <bigcalm> You could just limit bandwidth to selected MACs
[13:36]  * daubers makes coffee
[13:38] <Daviey> bigcalm: yeah, cause spoofing mac is too hard :)
[13:41] <bigcalm> Daviey: if his kids and wife can spoof macs, good on 'em ;)
[13:41] <bigcalm> Actually, the cat tweets, so it might be in with a chance
[13:46] <popey> Well..
[13:47] <popey> I came home once from work and clare said she'd found one of Sophies little jotter pads with "mum wii " and our pin number written in it
[13:47] <christel> haha
[13:47] <popey> she watched mummy put it in once, and remembered it
[13:47] <popey> i said to sophie "how come you've got the pin number of the wii written down?" she burst into tears
[13:47] <popey> she thought I was cross, which I wasnt, I was impressed
[13:48] <mgdm> well played, that girl
[13:48] <christel> aww bless
[13:48] <TheOpenSourcerer> popey: Is a thug - upsetting little children like that.
[13:48] <TheOpenSourcerer> lol
[13:49]  * TheOpenSourcerer notes his son (10) now uses upper/lower/numeric and non-alphas for his passwords! 
[13:49]  * MooDoo 's son is loving tuxpaint, hasn't quite figured out how to use the mouse yet
[13:51] <Daviey> nah, turn on the tears early and often.. avoids getting itno trouble.
[13:51] <Daviey> into*
[13:52] <daubers> still works for Daviey apparently
[13:53]  * daubers spots some potential 9.7" touchscreens hitting the market at < £100
[13:54] <bigcalm> I think I should block all mention of "cheap" gadgets. It's unhealthy for my wallet
[13:55] <davmor2> gord: I just got my confirmation to book for UDS P :D
[13:55] <gord> davmor2, cool :) i'll be there for only a few days though
[13:55]  * MooDoo will go to a UDS one day...
[13:56] <davmor2> gord: I'm there before UDS till after judging by the flight tickets
[13:56] <gord> davmor2, when is before?
[13:57] <davmor2> gord: I'll be getting in on the Wednesday before cause Thurs-Sat there will be some QA training on
[13:57] <gord> davmor2, ah neat, i'm there the entire week before : )
[13:59] <BigRedS> Firefox/Thunderbird should really ship with a kill-everything-mozilla-and-give-me-back-my-memory tool...
[14:00] <mgdm> BigRedS: it's in coreutils, surely
[14:00] <mgdm> 'killall' :)
[14:03] <MartijnVdS> mgdm: try on aix :)
[14:04] <MartijnVdS> mgdm: http://publib.boulder.ibm.com/infocenter/aix/v7r1/index.jsp?topic=/com.ibm.aix.cmds/doc/aixcmds3/killall.htm
[14:04] <MartijnVdS> mgdm: killall as root on aix = instakill :)
[14:05] <BigRedS> ah yeah, I've heard that one
[14:05] <BigRedS> but, yeah, just a short form of killall firefox-bin && killall thunderbird-bin
[14:06] <davmor2> BigRedS: I thought it was called Chromium!
[14:07] <BigRedS> pft. I did toy with opera again last night after FF irritated me again
[14:07] <BigRedS> it's not half bad
[14:13] <gord> i hear they are taking some big steps to get rid of the memory usage in the next firefox
[14:13] <gord> which is very welcome :)
[14:15] <BigRedS> Haha, I'm sure they did that for the 3.0 release, too
[14:16] <BigRedS> but, yeah, I really like firefox, it's just that sometimes it stops me working for ten minutes while I get to another tty to kill it...
[14:16]  * hamitron has changed to IE 9 :(
[14:16] <BigRedS> Lucky HazRPG
[14:16] <BigRedS> er
[14:16] <BigRedS> tabfail
[14:16] <hamitron> :D
[14:17] <BigRedS> but, yeah, lucky you
[14:17] <bigcalm> BigRedS: we're not allowed to tab fail :P
[14:17] <BigRedS> no, I did feel particularly bad after all the stick we've given everyone else :)
[14:17] <hamitron> improper highlighting
[14:26] <Azelphur> woo, tecknet say my headset hack should work
[14:27] <Azelphur> they did say "However please make sure the power input requirement of your headset meets the output range from Iep380."
[14:27] <Azelphur> isn't USB just one stable power requirement?
[14:37] <hamitron> Azelphur: different devices draw different currents
[14:37] <Azelphur> I see
[14:37] <Azelphur> any way to tell / negative side effects if I'm wrong?
[14:38] <hamitron> if you draw too much current (and power) from a power source, it is not healthy for the power source
[14:38] <hamitron> can lead to damage to the power source, a drop in voltage, or it cutting out
[14:40] <hamitron> I'm not sure what the max current draw in USB specs is, or that of your device
[14:40] <hamitron> s/device/power source
[14:41] <shauno> 500mA is meant to be standard, 1A isn't unusual anymore tho.  how it manifests itself differs from device to device
[14:41] <shauno> eg, my phone will just take longer to charge on 500mA.  an ipad won't charge while it's 'awake' on 500
[14:41] <dogmatic69> usb max is 500mA
[14:42] <Azelphur> the charger has a 1A and 500mA socket
[14:42] <Azelphur> and the headset is designed to charge off a cable plugged direct into the PC
[14:43] <dogmatic69> shauno: that is why there is http://www.amazon.co.uk/LINDY-USB-Cable-Dual-Power/dp/B000FKP7XA
[14:43] <hamitron> Azelphur: you looked at the specs in your manual?
[14:43] <Azelphur> for the headset? nope
[14:43] <hamitron> worth looking
[14:43] <hamitron> :)
[14:44] <Azelphur> anything to ctrl+f for? :P
[14:44] <hamitron> power
[14:44] <hamitron> or mA
[14:44] <hamitron> or current
[14:45] <Azelphur> hamitron: doesn't seem to be anything in there, http://www.logitech.com/assets/32824/g930-620-002766003403gsamr.pdf :(
[14:46] <hamitron> gimme 10 mins to download it
[14:46] <hamitron> ;/
[14:46] <Azelphur> lol
[14:47] <popey> MOO!
[14:48] <davmor2> popey: how do
[14:48] <daubers> I see popey has beef this afternoon
[14:50] <hamitron> Azelphur: does it power a mobile phone?
[14:51] <hamitron> my guess is wireless headsets will use less power
[14:51] <Azelphur> hamitron: yea
[14:52] <Azelphur> so I probably wanna plug it into the 1A port
[14:53] <hamitron> dunno :)
[15:14] <JonTheNiceGuy> Does anyone know whether there's still a mirror around of the Jaunty packages for Arm? A friend has a box he's not able to upgrade, but needs to add a package to.
[15:16] <shauno> JonTheNiceGuy: you might luck out on http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/releases/ports/releases/jaunty/release/  somewhere.
[15:17] <shauno> (or in /ubuntu/pool/ if you know exactly what version you're fishing for)
[15:18] <JonTheNiceGuy> He's looking for mc
[15:23] <andylockran> guys, is it possible to have multiple authorized_keys files
[15:24] <JonTheNiceGuy> andylockran: Have all the lines in one file
[15:25] <JonTheNiceGuy> Thanks for that Shauno. Worked for me - now all I need to do is to teach him how to use it :)
[15:26] <davmor2> directhex: so you have a new work phone and you've broken it already
[15:26] <directhex> davmor2, ?
[15:26] <andylockran> hmm, less than helpful
[15:27] <daubers> andylockran: What are you trying to achieve?
[15:27] <davmor2> directhex: Rooted a pre3 by the look of the twitpic :)
[15:27] <directhex> davmor2, rooting a pre3 just involves typing a NES cheat code. that's xorg running xterm
[15:28] <davmor2> directhex: as I say and broke it already ;)
[15:28] <andylockran> daubers: I want to make 1 key valid on all servers, and a subset of keys valid on different servers.  i.e authorized_keys1 valid all the time, and authorized_keys2 only present on a few servers
[15:30] <daubers> andylockran:  There is an AuthorizedKeysFile option in the ssh config
[15:33] <daubers> andylockran: Otherwise, it doesn't look like it, unless you seperate them out by user
[15:37] <andylockran> yeah, no worries
[15:37] <andylockran> tbh, from a security perspective I shouldn't be doing what I was planning, so probably for the best that it's not possible :D
[15:38] <daubers> heh
[15:38] <andylockran> daubers: putting an authorized_key file in a vcs for dev machines
[15:39] <daubers> ahhhh
[15:40] <daubers> andylockran: Can't just create a user/key per machine and tweak the groups of those users?
[15:40] <andylockran> daubers: yeah, will end up doing that
[15:47] <DJones> This is tempting http://www.pocket-lint.com/news/41625/hp-touchpad-uk-price-drop
[15:49] <BigRedS> Mmm, for that sort of money I could justify an experiment in tablets
[15:49] <BigRedS> with the worst-case scenario being something to fart around with applying the myriad hacks that the Internet is likely to come up with for it
[15:49] <DJones> Making it more tempting is https://twitter.com/#!/trsohmers/status/104788233908531200
[15:51] <BigRedS> oooh
[15:55] <DJones> I wonder whether it has java in its browser and whether it'd play minecraft
[15:56] <daubers> Since marxjohnson put the uri on twitter..... http://oggcamp.blip.tv all videos are now very slowly uploading. Please be patient! They will get there eventually
[16:00] <bigcalm> And since you just pasted it in channel, it'll go even slower :P
[16:00] <daubers> bigcalm: have to slow down some to beat the last upload (734167918 bytes sent in 8506.99 secs (84.3 kB/s))
[16:00] <bigcalm> Ouch
[16:01] <daubers> They'll get there in the end....
[16:02] <ubuntuuk-planet> [Jonathan Riddell] Desktop Summit 2011 Group Photo - http://blogs.kde.org/node/4472
[16:03] <bigcalm> Sod sod sod
[16:04] <bigcalm> Must not buy touchpad
[16:04] <MooDoo> wassup bigcalm
[16:04] <MooDoo> ?
[16:04] <MooDoo> lol
[16:06] <Cuediin> #quit
[16:11] <daubers> bigcalm: An wasy way to stop you buying a touchpad, pay for some tyres for my car and my motorbikes MOT in the next week please
[16:13] <MooDoo> daubers: and brakes for my bike :)
[16:13] <bigcalm> daubers: I recently had my read discs replaced the the aircon fixed. Had enough of motor repairs for a while ta :P
[16:13] <daubers> :(
[16:13] <daubers> I get a bit antsy when I _have_ to change the tyres and to do the front two is going to cost £1x0
[16:14] <daubers> Having said that, someone at work is paying nearly £400 a tyre for his silly sports car, and they're verging on not being road legal after just 900 miles
[16:14] <gord> so you *could* buy a touchpad, or you could buy 100 kinder egg surprises.
[16:14] <gord> i think we know what is the better option
[16:15] <daubers> gord: kinder egg surprises are rubbish. The one I got last week was 3 hologram stickers
[16:15] <gord> daubers, did you not find that surprising? ;)
[16:15] <daubers> gord: Just disappointing. I wrote in and complained
[16:16]  * peng42phone suspects touchpad would run Ubuntu well with a bit of force
[16:17] <bigcalm> People say otherwise, but I say that Unity was designed with the touch interface in mind
[16:17] <davmor2> peng42phone: once you figure out how to get it on there
[16:18] <peng42phone> Davmor2: that's the bit of force
[16:19] <davmor2> peng42phone: aggravated GBH requires less force ;)
[16:19] <MooDoo> i'm using the force now!
[16:20] <MooDoo> santa vader uses the force at christmas with luke.....feeling his presents ;)
[16:21] <davmor2> MooDoo: I think you're confused it's Darth Vader or Santa Claus I know it confusing but do keep up ;)
[16:22] <MooDoo> davmor2: sorry, i haven't poked czajkowski in ahile so i'm out of touch with these things...
[16:22] <peng42phone> Davmor2: I don't know, but it's Linux already, so should only need a light hammer
[16:22] <daubers> peng42phone: Better chance of android running on it I'd imagine
[16:24] <peng42phone> Daubers: why?  I think webos is much closer to std Linux
[16:24] <davmor2> MooDoo: sometimes you're just wrong! this isn't one though poke away :D, /me locks himself in a bunker so czajkowski can't get him
[16:24] <czajkowski> knock yerselves out lads
[16:24] <czajkowski> on me holidays
[16:25] <czajkowski> :)
[16:25] <MooDoo> czajkowski: poke pke poke poke poke
[16:25]  * peng42phone awaits a train at Hope station
[16:25] <MooDoo> davmor2: on crud she's on hols so she's happy...pah denied
[16:25] <MartijnVdS> peng42phone: station names like that are always a bad sign :)
[16:26] <peng42phone> Indeed
[16:27] <peng42phone> Very few stop here
[16:27] <davmor2> MooDoo: were you trying to call czajkowski a pyke then
[16:28] <MooDoo> davmor2: O_o with my reputation ;)
[16:29] <davmor2> MooDoo: czajkowski would kill you if you were ;)
[16:29] <MooDoo> davmor2: i'm not scared of czajkowski [as long as thre are miles in between us]
[16:29] <davmor2> HA
[16:30] <MooDoo> brb all
[16:30] <czajkowski> and no rugby matches
[16:36] <scoundrel50a> bug 827198 anybody worked out if there is a fix for this.....I still cant get it to work, and the .deb package install wont intall
[16:39] <scoundrel50a> anbody any ideas? the bug fix seemed to stop after that was suggested from what I can see, and no updates have appeared since then
[16:52] <czajkowski> scoundrel50a: no idea have you tried asking in #ubuntu-bugs
[16:53] <popey> scoundrel50a: I commented on the bug and you made the same mistake again
[16:53] <popey> scoundrel50a: you need to "escape" the ~ character in the package when you install it
[16:54] <popey> scoundrel50a: dpkg -i <press tab> to fill in the name of the package for you
[16:59] <scoundrel50a> I tried the dpkg -i and tab and that didnt work, I just looked in the url and didnt see the ~ sign either, ok, will give it a try again, one sec
[17:01] <popey> you need to have the files downloaded in a folder, open a terminal, navigate to the folder they're in and then dpkg -i the files
[17:02] <scoundrel50a> ah
[17:02] <scoundrel50a> now you tell me
[17:03] <scoundrel50a> I have the .deb file on my desktop, I will see if that works
[17:07] <popey> now I tell you!?
[17:08]  * czajkowski hands popey a bucket of tea 
[17:08] <scoundrel50a> sorry figure of speach, my appologies
[17:09] <scoundrel50a> its working
[17:09] <scoundrel50a> at least I think itn is it says its downgrading package
[17:10] <scoundrel50a> ok, so I got to reboot, and see if that works, brb
[17:15] <HazRPG> BigRedS: heh, was about to ask what I was lucky for... while scrolling back... so instead read ahead, and yeah... tab fail ^_^
[17:16] <scoundrel50a> ok, I am really sorry, I still havent got used to the terminal enough to reaslise that you have to cd to the directory, when you install something, but it seems that GC might be working ok, the message that it closed incorrectly and do I want to restore has gone, or at least it hasnt appeared again, which could be a good sign...so far, after playing a bit, no freezing, and it was freezing on every page
[18:04] <Azelphur> Anyone happen to know if something exists to use your android as a secondary display?
[18:04] <Azelphur> that'd be pretty cool o.O
[18:10] <MartijnVdS> Azelphur: IDisplay (http://www.shapeservices.com/en/products/details.php?product=idisplay&platform=android)
[18:10] <Azelphur> we're #ubuntu, that's Windows or OSX :P
[18:11] <MartijnVdS> Azelphur: it's a start
[18:12] <Azelphur> *shrug*
[18:29] <ali1234> Azelphur: vnc
[18:50] <HazRPG> interesting, a 7y.o. has had an idea for an app, and has managed to get it made by others: http://goo.gl/4fr7Y
[19:14] <ali1234> HazRPG: not particularly interesting, it won't be repeated
[19:14] <ali1234> like most gimmicks it only works once
[19:16] <HazRPG> this is true
[19:17] <HazRPG> (recalls the million dollar pixel website)
[19:17] <ali1234> or the paperclip guy
[19:17] <HazRPG> I had the same idea at one point around the same idea as the dude who did that website, but I thought it was just too stupid that it wouldn't take off
[19:34] <MartijnVdS> HazRPG: remember -- IQ 100 is the median (stddev 15) :)
[19:45] <ali1234> yes, by definition
[19:55] <daubers> evening
[19:58] <MartijnVdS> \o daubers
[20:23] <marsilainen> if I enable the connection sharing thing using network-manager gui, does that mean that my machine will act as a dhcp server on that interface?
[20:23] <marsilainen> or does it only work for one machine connected to it or what?
[21:02]  * penguin42 hasn't used it, but I think it should let you share a bunch of machines
[23:17] <penguin42> ok, who was arguing before about the difficulty of getting Ubuntu onto a Touchpad: http://liliputing.com/2011/08/how-to-install-ubuntu-linux-on-an-hp-touchpad.html
[23:18] <Azelphur> penguin42: DAM YOU MAKING ME SPEND 90 QUID.
[23:19] <penguin42> OK, where can I buy one for 90 quid ?!
[23:19] <Azelphur> comet but it's out of stock
[23:19] <Azelphur> :(
[23:19] <directhex> everywhere is out of stock
[23:19] <Azelphur> http://www.comet.co.uk/p///740314#errorMessageDisplay
[23:19] <directhex> actually, comet have some in stock online, but their site is down
[23:19] <directhex> argos is down
[23:20]  * penguin42 will have to go to some that are in less visited places
[23:22] <Azelphur> amazon have stock
[23:22] <Azelphur> ordered
[23:22] <Azelphur> :D
[23:22] <directhex> my hot tip, if you want it: debenhams
[23:23] <directhex> Azelphur, nope.
[23:23] <penguin42> Azelphur: Nice, ordered!
[23:23] <Azelphur> http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0054689MQ/ref=oss_product
[23:23] <Azelphur> see 18 new from £89
[23:23] <Azelphur> penguin42: fun :D
[23:24] <directhex> "Temporarily out of stock"
[23:24] <Azelphur> click 18 new from £89 and then click top one
[23:24] <penguin42> damn, says temporarily out of stock, we'll notify you when available
[23:24] <Azelphur> I just ordered it right now
[23:24] <Azelphur> HAHA
[23:24] <Azelphur> I GOT THE LAST ONE
[23:24] <Laney> huh, it let me order it
[23:24] <penguin42> Azelphur: What does it say on the estimated delivery?
[23:25] <Azelphur> free super saver delivery
[23:25] <Laney> don't hold out much hope of that working, though
[23:25] <directhex> the touchpad game is the best ARG *ever*
[23:25] <penguin42> it let me order it as well, but the it stated during the ordering process temporarily out of stock and at the end 'Estimated delivery: not yet available'
[23:26] <Laney> Delivery estimate:We'll notify you via e-mail when we have an estimated delivery date for this item.
[23:26] <penguin42> yet the search page says only 5 left in stock
[23:27] <Laney> reminds me of trying to get a wii for launch day
[23:27] <penguin42> oh, I get it - the 18 new is total new, not the £89 one
[23:28] <Azelphur> Delivery estimate: We'll  notify you via e-mail when we have an estimated delivery date for this  item. It will ship separately. You can cancel at any time.
[23:28] <Azelphur> same
[23:28] <Azelphur> I'm cool with waiting, I got one that's what matters.
[23:28] <Azelphur> :)
[23:28] <penguin42> well, we don't know that
[23:28] <directhex> if they don't get more stock, you got nothing
[23:29] <Azelphur> oh :(
[23:29] <Azelphur> they just leave me in limbo forever?
[23:30]  * penguin42 wonders what Amazon do when they realise they have about a zillion orders for something on deep discount that they don't have
[23:30] <Azelphur> lol
[23:32] <directhex> penguin42, first come first served fulfilment, with all the stock they have & can get
[23:32] <popey> hehehe
[23:32] <penguin42> anyway, it's Amazon themselves rather than one of their dodgier resellers so I guess it has a chance
[23:34] <popey> 74.17 minus the VAT :D
[23:34] <popey> (if they get some)
[23:34] <popey> (which they wont)
[23:36] <directhex> the questions, really, are: "how many touchpads did HP make?" "how many were sold already?" "where is the remaining stock?" "what is going to be done with the remaining stock?"
[23:36]  * penguin42 wonders if some part of that could be predicted from analysing MAC addresses on the wireless
[23:44] <popey> they're a lot busier inside than an ipad
[23:46] <penguin42> got pictures?
[23:46] <popey> http://www.ifixit.com/Device/HP_TouchPad
[23:46] <directhex> http://www.techrepublic.com/videos/dojo/hp-thttp://www.techrepublic.com/videos/dojo/hp-touchpad-teardown-and-hardware-analysis/6254112ouchpad-teardown-and-hardware-analysis/6254112
[23:46] <directhex> gah
[23:46] <directhex> http://www.techrepublic.com/videos/dojo/hp-touchpad-teardown-and-hardware-analysis/6254112
[23:49] <penguin42> does seem to have a scary number of connectors