[00:35] <fbot_> need help
[00:38] <szal> can't have been important ^^
[00:40] <OerHeks> not as important as  Kernel.org Server Rooted and 448 users credentials compromised :(
[00:41] <szal> :o
[00:41] <OerHeks> can i post a url ?
[00:45] <OerHeks> news it is on the site itself
[01:59] <mifsgo> ola pessoal
[01:59] <mifsgo> alguem pode me da uma ajuda
[02:04] <mifsgo> pessoal eu to querendo entra en um circuito interno de cameras com o kubuntu mais não conecta diz que esta fatando um plugin chamado  nissinplug-in alguem sabe como resolver o poblema???
[02:05] <claydoh> !pt
[02:06] <number4> Resuming in non X mode: glxinfo not found in path
[02:06] <number4> System:    Host ham-Latitude-D410 Kernel 2.6.38-11-generic i686 (32 bit) Distro Ubuntu 11.04 natty
[02:06] <number4> CPU:       Single core Intel Pentium M (UP) clocked at 1067.00 MHz
[02:06] <number4> Graphics:  Card Intel Mobile 915GM/GMS/910GML Express Graphics Controller tty res: N/A
[02:06] <number4> Disks:     HDD Total Size: 80.0GB (7.7% used)
[02:06] <number4> Info:      Processes 131 Uptime 2:50 Memory 408.6/993.1MB Runlevel 2 Client Quassel [M] v0.7.2 (dist-f93ace0) inxi 1.4.8
[02:07] <DaemonFC> ewww, quassel
[02:07] <DaemonFC> I wish they'd back that out and go back to Konversation already
[02:07] <DaemonFC> just what I need, an IRC client that grinds my hard disk loading and saving its stupid mandatory logs :)
[02:08] <number4> i thought the sysinfo command would just paste that to my window not the channel
[02:09] <number4> i'm just trying it out, this is my first time using it, it seems to be eating up more memory than xchat
[02:25] <Daskreech> DaemonFC: You can just install Konversation
[02:51] <shane2peru> ok, I have a question about using pulse audio and pavucontrol? or maybe padevchooser?  I'm not real familiar with either, however I have skype and want to set what it uses all the time for input and output audio devices.  How do I do that?
[03:02] <shane2peru> ok, I got it, had to run skype, then chose the audio device with skype running in-order for it to select the device, all through pavucontrol, pretty simple, and slick.
[03:23] <myhra> I am unable to turn on the wifi adapter due to ubuntu not supporting the button on an acer laptop, anyone know how to manually activate it another way - the driver is installed and activated
[04:49] <david1234567890> hi
[04:49] <david1234567890> bulldog98 are u there
[04:50] <david1234567890> i have PRO/Wireless 4965 but it's not working right
[04:50] <david1234567890> i need help plz
[04:52] <david1234567890> i have PRO/Wireless 4965 but it's not working right
[04:53] <david1234567890> plz help me fix it
[04:53] <riff> okay how do you see your hard drive setup and what file system your useing?
[04:55] <well_laid_lawn> riff: sudo fdisk -l
[04:55] <dacresni> is there a way to get Gnome_Shell installed on kubuntu?
[04:55] <well_laid_lawn> that's a L on the end
[04:56] <dacresni> david1234567890: thats in intel card right?
[04:56] <dacresni> well chipset anyway
[04:56] <david1234567890> yes
[04:56] <well_laid_lawn> dacresni: install ubuntu-desktop maybe
[04:56] <well_laid_lawn> !find gnome-shell
[04:56] <riff> l means list? (recognizes fdisk from dos scary stuff if not sure what it does)
[04:56] <david1234567890> i can't find my router anymore
[04:56] <well_laid_lawn> dacresni: yes -l means list
[04:57] <david1234567890> idk what happend every setting is 100% fine
[04:57] <well_laid_lawn> or mount should show it too
[04:57] <well_laid_lawn> use mount dacresni
[04:57] <dacresni> huh?
[04:58] <dacresni> im not the one asking about hard drives
[04:58] <well_laid_lawn> in a terminal type   mount
[04:58] <well_laid_lawn> oops riff ^^
[04:58] <riff> hey i'm trackin thanks for the help
[04:58] <dacresni> heh
[04:58] <well_laid_lawn> not the last time I'll do that..
[04:59] <dacresni> according to this http://intellinuxwireless.org/ i think that's a supported wireless chipset
[04:59] <dacresni> how do you know its not working right? david1234567890
[04:59] <david1234567890> Well it show all other lans but not my lan
[05:00] <david1234567890> it did before
[05:00] <riff> doesn't list the file system type
[05:00] <david1234567890> idk what happend
[05:00] <dacresni> riff: what does it list  ? paste please?
[05:01] <riff> Disk /dev/sda6: 26.5 GB, 26457669632 bytes
[05:01] <riff> 255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 3216 cylinders
[05:01] <riff> Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes
[05:01] <riff> Sector size (logical/physical): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
[05:01] <riff> I/O size (minimum/optimal): 512 bytes / 512 bytes
[05:01] <riff> Disk identifier: 0x00000000
[05:01] <FloodBotK1> riff: Please don't flood; use http://paste.ubuntu.com to paste; don't use Enter as punctuation.
[05:01] <well_laid_lawn> mount lists the filesystem type
[05:01] <dacresni> what does ifconfig list ? paste please ( on  a pastebin)
[05:01] <riff> sorry
[05:01] <well_laid_lawn> heh
[05:01] <well_laid_lawn> mount lists the filesystem type
[05:02] <david1234567890> like this http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-994817.html
[05:02] <riff> got it thanks alot
[05:03] <dacresni> wait, what am I asking? if you see any networks at all the chipsets working properly
[05:03] <dacresni> i thought you ment network devices by "lan"
[05:04] <david1234567890> sorry
[05:04] <dacresni> unless you have other devices detecting wireless access points, there is nothign wrong with the wireless device
[05:05] <david1234567890> but i can see all the Wifis but my
[05:06] <david1234567890> but not my wifi
[05:06] <david1234567890> sorry for the typos
[05:07] <dacresni> well, the problem is definately with the access point and not your computer's wireless device
[05:07] <dacresni> what IS the configuration on your access point ?
[05:07] <david1234567890> hmm w8 i try some thing
[05:08] <david1234567890> brb change the settings for a sec
[05:12] <dacresni> also, what kind of device is it? whats the name and manufacturer  of the wireless access point ? is it a router? a modem/router combo?
[05:15] <david1234567890_> ok back
[05:16] <david1234567890_> what Channel do i set?
[05:16] <dacresni> also, what kind of device is it? whats the name and manufacturer  of the wireless access point ? is it a router? a modem/router combo?
[05:16] <david1234567890_> from 1 to 13
[05:16] <david1234567890_> oh
[05:16] <dacresni> is there an automatic setting?
[05:16] <david1234567890_> d-link
[05:16] <david1234567890_> DSL 2640t
[05:17] <david1234567890_> in my router what channel?
[05:17] <david1234567890_> do i set
[05:19] <dacresni> hmm
[05:19] <dacresni> again, is there an automatic setting?
[05:19] <dacresni> otherwise i normally use 1 or 13
[05:20] <david1234567890_> w8 i restart
[05:24] <dacresni> was there an automatic setting?
[05:24] <david1234567890> ok back
[05:24] <david1234567890> in my router?
[05:24] <dacresni> right?
[05:24] <david1234567890> no
[05:25] <dacresni> oh :-(
[05:25] <dacresni> well, i doubt channel is the issue. How are you connected now?
[05:25] <david1234567890> what is  backports package
[05:26] <david1234567890> do i have to install them all in the list
[05:29] <dacresni> no,
[05:30] <david1234567890> ok
[05:30] <dacresni> http://backports-master.debian.org/
[05:31] <dacresni> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backporting
[05:32] <david1234567890> w8
[05:35] <david1234567890> i added deb http://backports.debian.org/debian-backports squeeze-backports main
[05:36] <bazhang> david1234567890, thats not for kubuntu
[05:37] <david1234567890> ah are u sure
[05:37] <bazhang> david1234567890, very. never mix distro repos
[05:38] <david1234567890> ah ok
[05:38] <david1234567890> what do i do then
[05:39] <david1234567890> how i get to fix it
[05:41] <dacresni> why did you add them anyway? did you ever fix your router situation ?
[05:42] <david1234567890> my router is fine
[05:42] <david1234567890> works with anything
[05:42] <dacresni> ok,
[05:43] <david1234567890> even my phone
[05:43] <dacresni> what was your problem earlier
[05:43] <dacresni> wireless router
[05:43] <dacresni> ?
[05:43] <dacresni> anyway https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Repositories/Kubuntu this link should help you with changing kubuntu's repositories
[05:44] <david1234567890> see i can't see my Wifi in the list
[05:44] <david1234567890> i worked before but i think after the update stoped
[05:44] <dacresni> but how are you connected to the internet now?
[05:45] <david1234567890> oh
[05:45] <david1234567890> with
[05:45] <david1234567890>  Wired Ethernet
[05:45] <dacresni> oh, that explains a lot.
[05:46] <david1234567890> lol
[05:46] <dacresni> anyway, your wifi may just not be in range. try moving the computer closer to it just as a sanity check
[05:46] <dacresni> is it a laptop or desktop?
[05:47] <david1234567890> look the router and the laptop now is like 1mm close lol
[05:48] <david1234567890> idk it was working fine before the update :(
[05:50] <david1234567890> how i  install linux-backports-modules
[05:52] <well_laid_lawn> !backports
[05:54] <dacresni> that would be unfortunate if an updated kernel module changed the way it detects beacon frames from access points ...
[05:55] <dacresni> you see why that seems a little far fetched, If your still convinced that the problem is with your computers wireless configuration and not with the device itself, i'm going to bed
[05:56] <david1234567890> well
[05:56] <dacresni> http://tinyurl.com/4y8k2tj
[05:56] <david1234567890> some ppl said installing that it helped
[05:56] <well_laid_lawn> if it works with other devices...
[05:56] <david1234567890> yah it do
[05:56] <dacresni> even your phone detects it you say
[05:56] <david1234567890> yap
[05:57] <david1234567890> tell me how i install that for kubuntu this is for ubuntu https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Repositories/Kubuntu
[05:58] <david1234567890> no this one https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports
[05:58] <dacresni> https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ppa/+archive/backports
[05:58] <dacresni> at the bottom of that page was this link
[05:58] <dacresni> ^^
[05:59] <dacresni> along with 4 other repositories,
[05:59] <david1234567890> ok
[06:00] <david1234567890> do i add this ppa:kubuntu-ppa/backports
[06:00] <david1234567890> is it safe
[06:04] <david1234567890> brb
[06:05] <dacresni> k
[06:05] <dacresni> night
[06:05] <dacresni> take care of him
[06:06] <david1234567890> ok
[06:06] <david1234567890> back
[06:08] <LINKSWORD2> Hello, all. :)
[06:09] <david1234567890> idk what backport-modules i must install and i am rly new on linux
[06:09] <david1234567890> idk anything can anyone plz help me
[06:10] <david1234567890> hi
[06:10] <LINKSWORD2> Sweet..... Docky works. :)
[06:11] <david1234567890> what is linux-headers-lbm-2.6.27-14-generic
[06:12] <LINKSWORD2> Hello, all. :)
[06:13] <david1234567890> hi
[06:14] <david1234567890> brb
[06:14] <LINKSWORD2> Chat seems pretty quiet tonight.
[06:20] <LINKSWORD2> Anybody know of a Synthesia alternative for Kubuntu?
[06:20] <david1234567890> ok back
[06:20] <david1234567890> i rly need help
[06:21] <david1234567890> after the updates my kubuntu wont work with my bluetooth and wont connect to my wifi
[06:22] <david1234567890> no one?
[06:22] <david1234567890> :(
[06:22] <LINKSWORD2> Hang on a second. I'm checking something.
[06:23] <LINKSWORD2> Hold Alt and hit F2 then type in BlueDevil
[06:23] <david1234567890> ok
[06:23] <LINKSWORD2> I don't know the name of the wireless system manager off the top of my head. It's 1 AM here and I feel like I've been hit by a train.
[06:24] <david1234567890> wow
[06:24] <david1234567890> here is 10am
[06:24] <LINKSWORD2> But BlueDevil is your Bluetooth manager.
[06:24] <david1234567890> wont open
[06:24] <LINKSWORD2> Hold on.
[06:25] <LINKSWORD2> Hey crew, who all is awake?
[06:25] <LINKSWORD2> ... Figures. The duck ain't here.
[06:25] <david1234567890> ah ok
[06:26] <LINKSWORD2> It appears there aren't many people awake right now.
[06:26] <LINKSWORD2> I'm sorry that I can't be more help to you.
[06:26] <LINKSWORD2> ... I need sleep. :(
[06:26] <david1234567890> oh it's ok
[06:27] <david1234567890> i will fix it
[06:27] <david1234567890> gn :)
[06:27] <LINKSWORD2> And with that....
[07:02] <ww_> hi
[07:39] <alvin> Is kivio still in development? I'm looking for a program to draw simple network diagrams.
[07:40] <alvin> kivio is no longer in the repositories it seems.
[08:17] <onebitxajax> hi to all
[08:17] <onebitxajax> if i burn a miltisession DVD with K3b can i use Nero to continue the multisession? and is that possible if i did viceversa?
[09:07] <david1234567890> why i have to set the channel to 6 or 7 for linux?
[09:07] <david1234567890> for my router
[09:09] <well_laid_lawn> david1234567890: wireless? you can set the channel for your nic
[09:10] <david1234567890> in my router i had to set channel to 6 or7
[09:10] <david1234567890> the WiFi
[09:10] <david1234567890> if i set it to 12 or 13 wont connnect
[09:10] <david1234567890> do u know why
[09:10] <david1234567890> ?
[09:11] <well_laid_lawn> set the network device in your computer to use the same channel as the router
[09:11] <david1234567890> oh how??
[09:11] <well_laid_lawn> man iwconfig knows all
[09:12] <david1234567890> whats that
[09:12] <well_laid_lawn> iwconfig wlan0 channel 12
[09:12] <well_laid_lawn> in a terminal - and use sudo
[09:13] <david1234567890> oh
[09:13] <david1234567890> thanks a lot
[09:13] <well_laid_lawn> luck :)
[09:14] <david1234567890> Error for wireless request "Set Frequency" (8B04) :
[09:14] <david1234567890>     SET failed on device wlan0 ; Invalid argument.
[09:14] <david1234567890> this was my command sudo iwconfig wlan0 channel 12
[09:15] <well_laid_lawn> yep looks fine
[09:15] <david1234567890> do i have turn the wifi off?
[09:16] <david1234567890> then run the command
[09:16] <well_laid_lawn> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WifiDocs/WiFiHowTo
[09:17] <well_laid_lawn> is it wlan0 david1234567890 ?
[09:17] <well_laid_lawn> your device
[09:17] <david1234567890> yah
[09:17] <well_laid_lawn> k
[09:18] <well_laid_lawn> david1234567890: what does     ifconfig -a   return?
[09:18] <david1234567890> w8
[09:18] <david1234567890> brb
[09:20] <david1234567890> ok back
[09:20] <david1234567890> i had to stop my wifi
[09:20] <david1234567890> then i did sudo iwconfig wlan0 channel auto
[09:20] <david1234567890> with no error
[09:20] <david1234567890> :)
[09:21] <david1234567890> this is good http://kwifimanager.sourceforge.net/?
[09:22] <david1234567890> http://kwifimanager.sourceforge.net/
[09:23] <david1234567890> well_laid_lawn u there
[09:27] <david1234567890_> hey sorry
[09:27] <david1234567890_> thanks a lot for the commands
[09:28] <david1234567890_> do u know anything good but not commands
[09:32] <david1234567890> anyone know anything like  iwconfig with GUI?
[10:51] <Meph> Hi all. I'm pretty terrible at linux. I've installed Kubuntu on my laptop. That worked fine, but when I set up my wireless connection it's just not working. It finds the right network, connects with the WEP password, but will not give me access to the internet.
[10:51] <susundberg> !wireless
[10:52] <susundberg> and https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WifiDocs/WirelessTroubleShootingGuide
[10:52] <susundberg> See if those help
[11:30] <Meph> I'm going through the network troubleshooting documents linked before, and one of the suggestions is to disable IPv6. It states "Open the file /etc/modprobe.d/aliases" but in the /modprobe.d folder there is no file or folder named "aliases".
[11:32] <susundberg> Oh, they might unfortunately be bit out-dated
[11:33] <susundberg> Did you get IP from the Wireless connection ok ?
[11:33] <susundberg> or could you ping the wireless router?
[11:33] <Meph> I can't ping the wireless router.
[11:33] <susundberg> So problem is forming the WEP connection ?
[11:34] <susundberg> Are you 100% sure your password etc are proper? And have you tested the router with other clients?
[11:34] <Meph> But I checked my DNS, subnet and gateway and they are fine.
[11:34] <Meph> The password was working on my windows machine before I formatted.
[11:34] <Meph> And on my iphone.
[11:34] <susundberg> DNS should have nothign to do with pinging the wireless router
[11:35] <susundberg> Ok, so problem is with your linux and wireless
[11:35] <susundberg> Umm, i guess you do not have possibility to try another network in range?
[11:35] <Meph> Unfortunately not.
[11:35] <susundberg> open network would be fine -- just to test that the card & drivers work well
[11:36] <susundberg> have you googled the card and ubuntu for possible driver problems & solutions?
[11:36] <Meph> I do have a USB wireless card I can try instead of my onboard...
[11:36] <Meph> I haven't. It's the onboard for my laptop.
[11:36] <well_laid_lawn> can you ping the router?
[11:36] <Meph> Nup.
[11:37] <susundberg> I would guess for driver problems -> lspci to find out what card are you using and google for possible solutions
[11:37] <well_laid_lawn> and ifconfig -a says the wirless is up?
[11:39] <Meph> ifconfig -a seems to think the wireless is up, I think... But I can't ping the router.
[11:39] <James147> Meph: do you have an ip?
[11:39] <Meph> Yes. But it's just saying the IP I assigned myself.
[11:40] <well_laid_lawn> tried   sudo iwlist scan   ?
[11:40] <James147> Meph: does your router do dhcp? if so try using that
[11:41] <Meph> Hang on. I've googled my wireless card (atheros AR5001) with ubuntu and there are some forum posts from people who have had issues.
[11:41] <well_laid_lawn> they'd be old afaik
[11:42] <James147> how old are they? atheros generally just works these days
[11:42] <Meph> May 2010
[11:43] <well_laid_lawn> old enough - atheros has kernel support now
[11:44] <well_laid_lawn> your card being up says that
[11:44] <Meph> It's so frustrating, because I installed ubuntu and my wireless worked fine. But I didn't like the GUI and am not proficient enough to figure out how to change it, so I just formatted and installed kubuntu, and it doesn't work...
[11:44] <James147> Meph: my guess is its a problem with the config you have set up
[11:45] <Meph> Same. But I can't see where my error is.
[11:45] <James147> Meph: i would suggest trying to use dhcp and see if that works
[11:47] <operator89> hi @ all
[11:48] <Meph> Ok I'm a bit out of my depth here, so just let me know if I did something wrong and I'll change it. I went in to my router and unticked the "use Router as DNS server" then added a primary and secondary DNS server (192.168.1.50/51). The DNS name is home.gateway.
[11:49] <Meph> Now in KDE control modul I've change the Method from Manual to DHCP addresses only, set the dns servers as 192.168.1.50,192.168.1.51, DHCP client ID as home.gateway. Do I need to put something in Search Domains ?
[11:50] <Meph> Now when I try to connect to my wireless network it gets stuck on "setting network addresses".
[11:52] <James147> Meph: dont put anythig in client id ^^
[11:57] <alvin> I could have sworn it was possible to indent/unindent blocks of text with kate. Anybody knows how?
[11:58]  * James147 knows how in vi mode :D
[11:59] <James147> alvin: tab works here just a selection (when not using vi)
[11:59] <James147> and shift tab to unindent
[12:00] <alvin> James147: aaah, nice. I couldn't find it in the menu or the KDE help (without a search function)
[12:00] <James147> (that is tab works with a selection ^^ )
[12:00] <alvin> tyvm. I never even tried tab :-)
[12:00] <James147> alvin: also crtl+i
[12:01] <alvin> Indeed!
[12:01] <alvin> It should be put back into the menu, but I think I can remember that.
[12:02] <James147> alvin: for any real reason? tab or ctrl+i are normally the way to indent and are quicker then menus
[12:02] <James147> and there is already allot of stuff in the menus
[12:03] <alvin> Well, to remind me of course. Where else could you find the shortcuts? The help is getting better, but it's still not there yet.
[12:03] <James147> alvin: settings > configure shortcut
[12:03] <alvin> Yes, already did :-)
[12:03] <James147> ^^ though it dosnt list tab thats generally what the tab key does (indents or inserts a tab)
[12:04] <alvin> Unless the text is selected. In that case you'd think the tab would place a tab. Not that I'm complaining.
[12:05] <alvin> Kate is a pretty nice editor. The only thing I'm missing from the good ol' KDE4 days is the HTML Tidy plugin.
[12:05] <alvin> *KDE3
[12:07] <James147> alvin: in kate you can configure how the tab key behaves
[12:08] <James147> by default i think it indents if in the leading blank space
[12:21] <Meph> I tried using DHCP, still no dice.
[12:24] <Meph> I think the universe is telling me I'm too old to try a new OS. I should probably just reinstall windows and be done with it.
[12:57] <BluesKaj> hey folks
[12:58] <szal> moin BluesKaj
[13:00] <James147> heya BluesKaj
[13:01] <BluesKaj> hi szal , James147
[13:04] <BluesKaj> kwin is still in a mess ..but that's what I get for using a dev alpha OS...the beta version is supposed to come down the pipe today ..it'sll be interesting to see if any graphical fixes are in the mix.for kde . I think gnome is getting all the attn tho
[13:07] <szal> KDE and Gnome are 2 different beasts anyway, and I guess that KDE has their own developers
[13:08] <alvin> BluesKaj: Are you talking about Oneiric?
[13:09] <BluesKaj> alvin, yes'
[13:09] <alvin> Isn't that just KDE 4.7 like in the natty ppa?
[13:10] <BluesKaj> nope
[13:10] <BluesKaj> I have no natty ppas
[13:12] <James147> alvin: its not that simple :) allot of other packages also get upgraded and various other things get changed
[13:13] <alvin> James147: Even on the KDE layer? I mean: I basically see Kubuntu as Ubuntu (unstable anyway) with KDE on top. During a 6-month Kubuntu lifecycle KDE gets its monthly update.
[13:14] <alvin> Isn't Oneiric at this point just an even more unstable Ubuntu with the same KDE on top? (+kdepim)
[13:16] <BluesKaj> alvin, kdepim is still optional
[13:16] <James147> alvin: Its not that simple as kde can be compiled and packaged in different ways and there are some components that arn't part of kde but still reply on it ^^
[13:16] <alvin> Oh? So, it's not another version, but it's differently packaged?
[13:17] <alvin> and what kdepim version will Oneiric have?
[13:17] <James147> alvin: ^^ not vastly, but things like kdepim have to be tested and tweaked untill they work so it varies slightly
[13:18] <EvilRoey> Haiiiii
[13:18] <EvilRoey> anyone here using VirtualBox?  I've tried googling this but am not sure I found a description of the problem I have:  Kubuntu host, VirtualBox 4.0.12, Windows 7 guest, trying to access Sharepoint shares off our Sharepoint server is really slow.  Specifically, opening a folder takes 10 seconds; why could this be?
[13:18] <Drakmor_> hey, I was messing around with dual monitors a few days ago but I decided to stick with just one. Thing is, this seems to have left a hidden X screen, and the fact that it also had a system tray on the panel seems to be causing issues... anyone know how I can remove it?
[13:19] <James147> Drakmor_: what driver?
[13:19] <Drakmor_> I'm using a nvidia card with the proprietary drivers
[13:19] <Drakmor_> I had set up separate X monitors instead of twinview also
[13:19] <Drakmor_> if that makes a difference...
[13:20] <James147> Drakmor_: seperate monitors dosnt really work yet with kde ^^
[13:20] <Drakmor_> ah
[13:20] <Drakmor_> but how do I undo it?
[13:20] <Drakmor_> what's happening is all my apps are docking in the other tray
[13:20] <Drakmor_> so I can't see any of them
[13:21] <James147> Drakmor_: twinview should work though...
[13:21] <Drakmor_> it didn't for what I was trying to do :/
[13:21] <James147> Drakmor_: hmm, if you have disabled the other monitor then you could try resetting plasma (by moving ~/.kde/sahre/config/plasma-desktop-appletsrc)
[13:21] <Drakmor_> that being having a small crt monitor for terminal and email while running fullscreen games and the like on the nice one
[13:21] <Drakmor_> okay
[13:22] <Drakmor_> I'm just trying to find a way to remove all the system trays on the desktop
[13:23] <Drakmor_> could I theoreticallly edit that file and delete out the second system tray as well?
[13:23] <mudassar> Hello people, I have a question relating to image processing ...... can you tell me how can I search and join the related channel ?
[13:23] <James147> Drakmor_: yes, though i would copy it first :)
[13:24] <Drakmor_> okay
[13:24] <Drakmor_> but yeah, two system trays are showing up
[13:24] <Drakmor_> so I'll delete both then add a new one
[13:26] <Drakmor_> gotta relogin to change it right?
[13:27] <James147> Drakmor_: just kill and restart plasma-desktop
[13:27] <Drakmor_> kk
[13:27] <Drakmor_> brb then
[13:32] <Drakmor_> sweet, that worked! thank you!
[13:37] <Wojtulas> hey, when kubuntu 11.10 will be released?
[13:37] <dacresni> is kubuntu dev on freenode or ubuntu's irc network?
[13:38] <James147> dacresni: #kubuntu-devel?
[13:38] <dacresni> thanks
[13:39] <dacresni> i didn't think that existed
[13:39] <James147> Wojtulas: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricReleaseSchedule
[13:39] <dacresni> cannonical put ubuntu support on its own irc network
[13:39] <Pici> no
[13:39] <James147> ^^ hmm didnt know aobut that... but then again I dont follow #ubuntu :)
[13:40] <dacresni> i've been there, im pritty sure they did
[13:40] <Pici> dacresni: you're on freenode right now. irc.ubuntu.com is a CNAME to irc.freenode.net
[13:40] <dacresni> oh,
[13:40] <dacresni> well. thats kind of obtuse
[13:41] <Pici> lots of communities do it.
[13:41] <dacresni> sure
[14:25] <chompg> hello, how can i use a shortcut to turn off the sound (or decrease/increase it)? (kde 4.6.2)
[14:29] <James147> chompg: look at the golbal shorcuts for kmix
[14:29] <James147> global shortcuts ^^
[14:31] <hplpb> chompg: looks like system settings > shortcuts & gestures > global keyboard shortcuts > kde component: kmix will do it
[14:38] <chompg> thanks
[14:53] <akpower> hello
[14:53] <akpower> i have a boner
[14:54] <akpower> OW YOU NIGGERZ
[14:54] <akpower> okamura
[14:54] <James147> akpower: please stop
[14:54] <akpower> ok :(
[14:55] <akpower> :((((
[14:59] <Alarm> hello. i got a problem with my wireless (on my laptop) after installing the compact-wireless driver .
[15:00] <Alarm> the ifconfig does not show anymore any wlan
[15:00] <Alarm> furthermore the on my NetworkManager widget the "Wireless connections" checkbox is disabled
[15:00] <Alarm> so i cannot see any available networks
[15:01] <James147> Alarm: was it woprking before installing teh dirvers?
[15:01] <Alarm> yes, they were totaly fine. i might have unloaded something by mistake
[15:01] <James147> Alarm: then why install the drivers?
[15:02] <Alarm> i needed to fix a bug
[15:02] <Alarm> the bug was fixed.
[15:03] <Alarm> but i it seems that i somehow change the configuration. after the installation manual i remember typing some make unload , or something like that
[15:03] <Alarm> and unloading some iwlan ? i dont know if those things have to do with
[15:05] <Alarm> echo options iwlagn swcrypto=1 >> /etc/modprobe.d/options
[15:05] <Alarm> this is one of the commands that i used
[15:06] <Alarm> and did some modifications in scripts/update-initramfs , which i am unsure if that is the case
[16:29] <h2o> hola a todos
[16:37] <dav> hi
[16:39] <dav> hardware question
[16:41] <ubuntu_> some GRUB help please
[16:54] <cher> ubuntu_: Maybe if you'd actually ask a question...
[16:56] <ubuntu_> How can I recover my Kubuntu after Windows installation
[16:56] <kbroulik> which drivers are more stress-free and capable for all the KDE effects? Intel Sandy Bridge HD Graphics (open source driver), or a cheap AMD graphics with open source, or with proprietare (which I want to avoid)
[16:57] <kbroulik> with stress-free I mean: supports KMS, is configurable through KDE's own config utilities, without stupid messy 3rd party amdcccle or whatever
[16:57] <rekcuFniarB> ubuntu_: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RecoveringUbuntuAfterInstallingWindows
[16:59] <cher> kbroulik: On Kubuntu 11.04, AMD sucks. On Kubuntu 9.04, AMD rocks.
[17:00] <cher> kbroulik: All or at least most of the effects of Kubuntu 11.04 KDE work on AMD if you use the proprietary driver, but it involves some hassle and workarounds for some bugs.
[17:01] <hplpb> cher: desktop effects worked perfectly for me with the proprietary driver with no workarounds on 11.04
[17:02] <hplpb> previous versions of kubuntu always seemed to give me problems so I was rather suprised
[17:02] <kbroulik> but the proprietary has the downside, it has no KMS which is annoying, and you can only configure it through that [insert many swearing words here] amdcccle
[17:02] <kbroulik> same goes for the nvidia propr
[17:02] <kbroulik> all my other machines have Intel graphics which works so nice
[17:02] <kbroulik> but I was wondering whether a cheap AMD would also be as stress-free as the intel open source (because theyre cheaper?)
[17:02] <cher> Strange: On Kubuntu 9.04, configuring the amd proprietary driver through KRandR worked.
[17:03] <hplpb> I've always had better luck using nvidia cards
[17:04] <kbroulik> cher: on my friend's computer it did not work using the systemsettings randr module
[17:04] <kbroulik> hplpb: that's why my new machine was given a nvidia card when I bought it :D
[17:04] <kbroulik> because the old ATI was just a mess
[17:04] <cher> I have 4 AMD E-350, 1 AMD A8-3850 and a Mobility Radeon HD 3850. The proprietary driver works on all of them. Using Kubuntu 11.04 KRandR works on none of them. And on the Llano, you get this "unsupported hardware" watermark.
[17:05] <kbroulik> hm, so I think I will stick with Intel :D
[17:05] <cher> Plus, using a 3D screensaver behaves very strange on all of them.
[17:06] <kbroulik> cher: I dont use screensavers at all :) they just waste power and serve no purpose for me :)
[17:06] <cher> I use keuphoria.kss, and on all of them when you move the mouse after the screen saver, the password dialog is invisible. It is there, you can enter the password, but you don't see the dialog. And after entering, you don't see the desktop until you do Ctrl+Alt+F1 and Ctrl+Alt+F7 to switch back and forth to X.
[17:07] <cher> That multi-display settings can only be changed in amdcccle as root and require a reboot also is extremely inconvenient. It renders the combination of AMD + Kubuntu, or maybe AMD in general, pretty much useless on Laptops for presentations.
[17:11] <ubuntu_> Thanks for the link )(
[17:17] <Kumatzin> hola
[17:19] <chompg> hello, where can i find firefox 3.6? (which package?)
[17:38] <jmichaelx> kde 4.7 sucks
[17:42] <SporkWitch> Could be worse, it could be gnome (or windows...)
[17:43] <hplpb> jmichaelx: then don't use it :)
[17:45] <cher> jmichaelx: Why does kde 4.7 suck?
[17:45] <rekcuFniarB> KDE rocks
[17:45] <jmichaelx> cher: i could make you a list
[17:46] <jmichaelx> cher: KDE is great, etc etc... but 4.7 is so buggy that it is clear that the quality control system is broken
[17:47] <James147> jmichaelx: its less bugy the the previous version here ^^ sounds like an issue with your system/distro
[17:47] <cher> I think the same about whole Kubuntu 11.04. The previous version that I used was Kubuntu 9.04. However, I can't tell whether it's the distro or the upstream packages or both.
[17:48] <James147> jmichaelx: and kubuntu hasnt offically packaged 4.7 in a release yet ^^
[17:49] <jmichaelx> James147: 4.6 was much better on my 3 machines at home...
[17:49] <jmichaelx> James147: that is true
[17:50] <James147> jmichaelx: I suggest creating a new user ^^ see if they behave any better, some times config errors can cause all sorts of issues
[17:50] <jmichaelx> James147: i have done all of that
[17:50] <James147> jmichaelx: and your using 4.7 from the backports?
[17:50] <jmichaelx> James147: it is just that i am discovering new bugs every day. just realized that the keyboard layout switcher is broken
[17:51] <jmichaelx> James147: yes, i did not complite it myself (i have thought about it, though)
[17:52] <jmichaelx> compile*
[17:52] <James147> jmichaelx: The problem with backports is that they dont go through as much testing as the version that comes with the next release does ^^
[17:52] <jmichaelx> James147: i am sure that is the case
[17:52] <kbroulik> jmichaelx: in what respect is the keyboard switcher broken?
[17:53] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: right now, i have a german layout if i set it to 'en' and an english layout if set to 'de'
[17:53] <kbroulik> hm maybe the labels are misconfigured
[17:53] <kbroulik> ;;;;;;;;;; now i have english lazout
[17:53] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: i have to test more to see if the problem is not bigger than that
[17:53] <kbroulik> öööö now german. i did not touch the configs when moving over
[17:54] <kbroulik> jmichaelx: check your configs and/or try deleting and adding the layouts, maybe it got confused somehow on update :)
[17:54] <jmichaelx> english lazout?
[17:54] <kbroulik> jmichaelx: layout :) in english Y and Z are swapped in contrast to german ;)
[17:54] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: i know that.... and if i select 'en', y and z are wrong
[17:55] <jmichaelx> i have used english, german and arabic keyboard layouts in KDE for years
[17:55] <kbroulik> if you select 'en' Z should be in the lower left corner of the keyboard?
[17:55] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: yes
[17:55] <kbroulik> and what's the problem then? :)
[17:55]  * jmichaelx rolls eyes
[17:56] <kbroulik> YXCVBNM;:_ is german, ZXCVBNM<>? is english ..
[17:56] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: i already explained to you that the y and z are reversed from what they should be
[17:57] <kbroulik> i dont get it
[17:57] <jmichaelx> i have an american english keyboard, but if i set the layout switcher to 'en', i get a 'z' when i press 'y' (and also the reverse)
[17:58] <kbroulik> ah okay
[17:58] <jmichaelx> actually, it is appearing that the 'de' keyboard layout just is not working...
[17:59] <jmichaelx> ok, none of them seem to be working correctly
[18:01] <jmichaelx> if i set it to 'de', i get something at least similar to 'us'... if i set to 'us', i am not sure what i have... y and z are reversed, but the characters with umlaut are not present
[18:01] <kbroulik> hm it seems the keyboard thing indeed is broken in 4.7. I can not add any layouts than the default. My neo 2 is gone -.- and although I have "eliminate deadkeys" german I cannot add it
[18:01] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: MANY things are broken in 4.7
[18:01] <SporkWitch> jmichaelx: did you tell it that it is physically an english qwerty?  I don,t know if the physical zkey sends the same messafe on both keyboards, maybe that could be throwing it off?  Guessing, and doing a poor job of explaining
[18:02] <SporkWitch> Hard to type quickly and clearly on a tablet lol
[18:02] <jmichaelx> SporkWitch: i believe that is how it is configured, but i need to check again
[18:02] <kbroulik> SporkWitch: :D i got used to it on my vacation 3,5 weeks :D
[18:02] <jmichaelx> SporkWitch: yes, it can be lol
[18:02] <SporkWitch> kbroulik: i'm not too bad touchtyping on the default keyboard on this xoom, but when you're used to 97wpm, it's frustrating lol
[18:02] <jmichaelx> i just got a touchpad a week ago... my first experience with any tablets
[18:02] <cher> Woah I finally found out what to do in order to make gimp not crash at startup.
[18:03] <kbroulik> jmichaelx: it is android? do you use Smart Keyboard? :D
[18:03] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: no, it is webOS
[18:03] <kbroulik> SporkWitch: umm, where do I tell it what kind of keyboard it is? it just is set as "Generic PC keyboard with 101 keys"
[18:03] <jmichaelx> i do use swype on my android phone
[18:03] <SporkWitch> Kbroulik, do you want it to behave like a german keyboard or english?
[18:04] <kbroulik> SporkWitch: it works fine, just wanted to know how I could tell it to be an english keyboard ;)
[18:04] <SporkWitch> Ahh lol
[18:04] <SporkWitch> I can't remember where im the menus lol
[18:04] <jmichaelx> god i wish i had just been ever so slightly conservative, and stayed with 4.6.5.... it was buggy, but nothing like this
[18:04] <SporkWitch> Is it a brand name keyboard? I think logitech makes linux drivers and software
[18:05] <kbroulik> I did the mistake of upgrading to KDEPIM2 :D good if you have backups :D
[18:05] <cher> Ouch gimp just crashed in a way that X was kind of halted. Nothing moved, only cursor visible. Change to console back to X: Black screen, only cursor visible. I had to kill -9 gimp on console to get everything working again.
[18:05] <SporkWitch> Might help to use the official software instead of the generic, maybe?
[18:06] <jmichaelx> cher: are you using gimp from the official repos?
[18:06] <kbroulik> jmichaelx: and what else is broken in 4.7? :D
[18:07] <cher> jmichaelx: Yes.
[18:07] <kbroulik> that Kickoff no langer has a back button is a "feature" *duck*
[18:07] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: task manager icons remain, after windows are closed... calendar widget partially broken, and does not respond to changes in settings, weird spacing issues in task manager (not a huge deal)
[18:08] <cher> Ah this is reproducible. Run konsole. From konsole, run strace gimp -> X hangs, only mouse works. Go to console, kill -9 gimp, and everything works again.
[18:08] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: yes, i do not like that change, but at least it works
[18:08] <kbroulik> cher: weird thing. what kind of graphics and mesa version do you use?
[18:08] <cher> still might be a race condition on accessing X.org.
[18:08] <cher> Mobility Radeon HD 3850 with proprietary driver. (MSI GT735 laptop)
[18:09] <jmichaelx> now i noticed keyboard layout switcher is broken
[18:09] <cher> I can have a look if this is reproducable on AMD E-350s and a Llano as well.
[18:09] <cher> But I will not look right now.
[18:09] <kbroulik> jmichaelx: I cannot reproduce any of your bugs (un)fortunately. okay that calendar thing is indeed a bit broken, but thats if you dont use KDEPIM2 and those settings changes, well, do you mean changes to the locale or to the widget itself?
[18:09] <SporkWitch> Ack, ati linux drivers are the worst i've ever seen; on got better performance from on-board than a high-end ati card before
[18:10] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: i cannot disable 'display events'.... which i want to do to get rid of that awful split window
[18:11] <kbroulik> jmichaelx: ah, that split thing is also a feature in 4.7 :)
[18:11] <kbroulik> it does not get rid of the split view
[18:11] <kbroulik> it just disables the events
[18:11] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: that split thing is really stupid
[18:11] <kbroulik> holidays remain in the right column
[18:11] <kbroulik> I like it :) at least if you use kdepim2, then it shows all your calendar appointments there right away, which is handy
[18:11] <kbroulik> unfortunately it has some issues when you resize it (just dont touch its size and youre all set :P)
[18:12] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: for me, i wind up with the calendar itself being squished to the side, and only halfway readable
[18:12] <jmichaelx> plus, i use google calendar, not any of the KDE stuff
[18:12] <kbroulik> try holding alt and right clicking it, so you can freely(!) resize it
[18:12] <kbroulik> jmichaelx: google calendar works with akonadi? I use google calendar only, and it displays them just fine
[18:13] <cher> Hmm, I guess it's oxygen-gtk that's broken. When I use Raleigh, I  cannot reproduce the gimp-X-hang.
[18:14] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: interesting, did not know that.
[18:14] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: alt+right click is not allowing me to resize the left half... only the right
[18:14] <kbroulik> jmichaelx: it's actually nothing you should be able to, but they are (not yet) able to prevent this because KWin doesnt care whether it is a plasma extender or a real window, so you can resize ANY plasma extender with that ;)
[18:14] <kbroulik> you can move it around freely on the screen when pressing alt and dragging it with the left mouse, maybe you can move it to another position or something
[18:15] <kbroulik> only widget that you can not resize with that method is the notifications history which is really a bummer because that has NO resizing capability at all which really ... me off since 4.6
[18:15] <jmichaelx> kbroulik: i do appreciate this info... althoug i'd love to lose the slit window, and be able to resize the actual calendar
[18:16] <kbroulik> jmichaelx: just use the 4.6 Calendar :D like i do with kickoff (because I cant stand the loss of the back button)
[18:16] <jmichaelx> how do you use the 4.6 calendar in 4.7
[18:16] <kbroulik> jmichaelx: check out KDE/4.6 branch from git, compile the plasmoid, install it, restart plasma and it's gone ;)
[18:16] <jmichaelx> (sorry if that is a silly question)
[18:16] <kbroulik> jmichaelx: I query you for a detailed description?
[18:17] <cher> I think I have found quite a lot of bugs and issues in Kubuntu 11.04. Is it still worth reporting, or should I rather go for bug hunting in the Kubuntu 11.10 beta?
[18:18] <cher> (A list can be found here: http://www.riedquat.de/blog/2011-08-21-02)
[18:24] <jmichaelx> cher: i have though about doing something very similar! i'll be interested to read your list. in the long run, i'd love to be more involved with kde beta testing
[18:31] <kbroulik> cher: hmm, let's have a look at your list :D
[18:37] <kbroulik> Line 1: didnt test, dont have AMD; Line 2: confirmed; Line 3: confirmed but amdcccle issue?; Line 4: dunno; Line 5: I hate Java :D; Line 10: I dont think this is natty related?; Line 11: confirmed but I could workaround it somehow; Line 12: didnt test; Line 14: works here WITH oxygen-gtk; Line 16: not experienced here, try another Phonon Backend such as vlc? Line 17: You need to restart any application that should use a new
[18:37] <kbroulik> language or try manually changing it in the Help menu. Line 18/19: I dont have audio cds :D and if: I rip them using audiocd kio slave direcvtly from dolphin :D Line 22: what about upstart? Okay, they should go to systemd but well, it works fine here? Line 23: think that is a amd issue; Line 24: dunno; Line 25: I use bleeding edge X server, not experienced here; Line 26: I just have that the lock takes a second to appear when
[18:37] <kbroulik> switching terminals leaving the desktop visible for a brief moment; Line 27: dunno; Line 28: didnt test/watch out for; Line 29: dunno; Line 30: dunno; Line 31: never experienced; Line 32: maybe there is a ppa like for chromium? Line 33: I dont do such stuff :D; Line 34: hmm, krfb/krdc works fine here
[18:37] <FloodBotK1> kbroulik: Please don't flood; use http://paste.ubuntu.com to paste; don't use Enter as punctuation.
[18:37] <kbroulik> oh, sorry, seems my irc client split the messages up :(
[18:38] <szal> well, it has to, otherwise it would've been truncated
[18:43] <kbroulik> mh, ok, so IRC is from the middle age? okay :D
[18:43] <kbroulik> unfortunately quassel doesnt show this and just shows it as one single mesage
[18:44] <cher> kbroulik: On line 17: Language issues persist even after reboot. The restart thing is obvious since the locale settings usually are environment variables.
[18:46] <cher> kbroulik: The remote admin stuff: krfb / krdc? Lmao. How do you use them if it's X what crashes?
[18:47] <cher> kbroulik: Thanks for your feedback. It shows what headlines are ambiguous, I'll improve them.
[18:51] <cher> On upstart: When X crashes on SuSE Linux, I have two options: a) if X crashes, so that keyboard and display are corrupted, but networking still works, I can ssh into it. b) I can boot without X by booting into runlevel 3 instead of runlevel 5. Neither option works on out-of-the-box kubuntu, because per default there's no sshd, and because of upstart.
[18:52] <cher> I actually had to boot from CD to recover one of my Kubuntu 11.04 boxes although I already had far better recoveribility possibilities 10 years ago on SuSE Linux.
[18:54] <kbroulik> cher: and could you please use an ordered list, so it has line numbers? :D hmm, okay, I am not that sort of stuff, I dont even touch the console and never experienced X problems, so.. ^^
[18:55] <cher> kbroulik: Changed to ordered list now.
[18:55] <cher> And I updated some of the descriptions so they are (hopefully) less ambiguous.
[18:57] <kbroulik> cher: could you please rant about the kubuntu installer as well, thanks :D
[18:57] <cher> I think I'll buy another Zotac Zbox AD02 to make a really good and reliable comparison which issues are AMD driver related.
[18:58] <cher> Ah yes, the installer... I think it has something like 8 default package group selections, and only 3 or 4 of them actually were working. Of my 10 or so Kubuntu 11.04 installations that I did so far there was not a single one without trouble, right.
[18:59] <cher> But I'm only going to write about things for which I have at least shown to myself how to reproduce them.
[19:01] <cher> Woah... lucky. Amazon.de still has a stock of Logitech MX-518 mice. Alternate already has none.
[19:02] <Pici> .36
[19:20] <kbroulik> cher: hmm, well, the partitioner is still slow as hell even on a four core 3,7 ghz processor :D
[19:20] <kbroulik> in the installer
[19:26] <avihay> I've always had issues with sound recording. in the past, the internal mic's output shifted about 1/3  of the scale away from the center of the scale, entering alot of noise while connecting an external mic worked fine. ( suspect that that's a feature of the soundcard that isn't supported by the linux driver, somth like electronic disturbance noise reduction that I saw in my parents twon windows machine where the mic works fine. a while passed of not
[19:26] <avihay> useing the microphone, and pulse audio has arrived... now when I try to record in audecious, if I record mono, only loud voices are recorder. if I record sterio, it looks like the microphone's zero is at the lower edge of the right channle, and as I raise my voice, I can se the half wave pattern reach all the way from negative right to positive right to negative left to positive left. that's abnormal, and I don't know what to do. advice please.
[19:42] <Rexona> uhm i have one little question for someone??
[19:42] <Rexona> is someone here?
[19:44] <avihay> Rexona: just ask. if someone knows he'll help you
[19:44] <OerHeks> :-)
[19:44] <Rexona> okay
[19:46] <Rexona> just want to know if my wireless network card would work on kubuntu its a SMC WPCI-G 54mpbs
[19:48] <avihay> you can try it with a livecd/usb
[19:48] <hallman> Anyone know why xorg sucks up 25-100% of my cpu? Seems to be a common problem, yet the many suggested solutions doesn't seem to work for me.
[19:49] <hallman> I've also looked through the ubuntu wiki on X troubleshooting, HighCPU in particular.. I find it hard to believe that it's a client application. It's not software rasterizing. I've tried various drivers. Logs seem fine.
[19:54] <cher> Rexona: I had some SMC equipment running successfully on Linux. It was Prism-GT based 54 mbps PCMCIA cards. This doesn't mean yours will run, but I think it is quite likely.
[19:55] <cher> My Kubuntu bug hunting setup is nearly done. I'll be back on again in 15 minutes or so, and then I'll start to hunt down the bugs that I've found real hard.
[19:55] <Rexona> but mine is a PCI card so
[19:55] <Rexona> and where do i find those livedvd?
[19:56] <cher> Rexona: Usually whether PCI, PCIe, PCMCIA, PC-Card, Mini-PCIe or whatever doesn't really matter, usually it's mostly the chipset that matters.
[19:56] <Rexona> oh okay
[19:56] <Rexona> desktop dvd is that the livedvd?
[20:06] <Rexona> am i right? desktop dvd is supposed to be the livedvd?
[20:21] <avihay> Rexona: the live cd should be a smaller download
[20:22] <avihay> just download the desktop CD
[20:23] <avihay> also read http://www.kubuntu.org/getkubuntu/download#desktop-dvd
[20:23] <andybrine> hey everyone
[20:24] <andybrine> does anyone know a good application for webcams on ubuntu
[20:38] <cher> My kubuntu bug hunting hardware setup is done: http://www.riedquat.de/blog/2011-09-01-03 - now let's hunt bugs!
[20:51] <bodom> Hi there. Does anybody knows how kdm is started in kubuntu?
[20:51] <bodom> How and when
[21:00] <cher> bodom: upstart starts kdm. What exactly do you need to know?
[21:01] <bodom> cher: what I'm trying to achieve is having KDM started earlier
[21:01] <James147> bodom: for what reason?
[21:02] <cher> One of the good things about upstart is that it has a dependency system. It will start everything as soon as possible, just not before the dependencies are not fulfilled. So I think it wouldn't work to start kdm earlier.
[21:02]  * cher can't believe he actually said something good about upstart.
[21:02] <bodom> James147: because I have some early task (probably the firmware loading into my DVB card) that holds it from starting for about 120 secs.
[21:03] <bodom> cher: damn, I hope there's also a way to tell im "send deps to /dev/null and start kdm when I tell you"
[21:03] <bodom> *him
[21:04] <cher> I don't know if upstart allows you to ignore dependencies.
[21:04] <bodom> if not, I want the good old and trustworty init back :P
[21:05] <bodom> btw, you pointed me to the right direction, I'm reading upstart doc now. ty!
[21:16] <yofel_> bodom: feel free to edit the 'start on' statement in /etc/init/kdm.conf , it can be tricky to get right though
[21:17] <bodom> yofel: yes, I was just trying to understand that statement before editing it :)
[21:19] <cher> bodom: I want good old and trustworthy init back, too. I have my issues with upstart :D
[21:23] <bodom> well', I'm gonna try a reboot, cya
[21:26] <BarkingFish> cher, join the club.  I'm not too keen on upstart either - in fact I have an even bigger issue - the fact that (k)ubuntu only provide pulseaudio as a sound server without giving people an alternative, like artsd, which kicked pulseaudio's butt :)
[21:27] <cher> I miss artsd, too. I know artsd from SuSE Linux.
[21:27] <BarkingFish> Every computer I have had on which I've used linux, I've done my best to rip old plugins from elsewhere, update them and switch my systems from pulseaudio to artsd
[21:27] <BarkingFish> I've tried that on kubuntu to no avail.
[21:28] <BarkingFish> It's either pulse or nothing - really pulseaudio should be called flatlineaudio, since it's effectively dead.
[21:28]  * szal does fine w/ Pulse
[21:29] <BarkingFish> szal, you're one of the lucky ones.
[21:29] <BarkingFish> Enjoy it :)
[21:29]  * James147 also has no issues with pulse
[21:31] <SIR_Taco> I guess I'm lucky too
[21:31] <SIR_Taco> should be playing the lottery I guess
[21:32] <BarkingFish> I had no issues with artsd in the past.  With pulseaudio, I have no control over my mic volume in audacity, my mic won't work through firefox / flash pages, I can't use paltalk's flash version because I can't talk to anyone, and the mic on my webcam has feedback which could deafen an elephant
[21:32] <cher> I hate today's BIOS. They are so awfully slow. My Llano takes ~25 seconds to boot into Kubuntu login screen. But 14 seconds or so is the BIOS until it loads the OS.
[21:32] <BarkingFish> None of those things occurred on systems where I've had arts.
[21:34] <SIR_Taco> BarkingFish: like it or not, the idea behind it is sound... the implimentation has caused problems for some
[21:35] <BarkingFish> SIR_Taco, I don't mind the idea. The idea is good.  It's just that it's been thrown together like a badly made stuffed toy, and it's about as usable as chocolate suncream on a wasp infested beach.
[21:36] <BarkingFish> And until it's rewritten and built in such a way that it doesn't interfere with the normal operation of a pc or laptop, it should be dropped and we should go back to something which worked.
[21:38]  * szal wouldn't go as far as speaking of no problems w/ Pulse
[21:38] <szal> e.g., I couldn't get a mic to work on my PCI soundcard
[21:39] <cher> Amazing. An A8-3850 with an SSD and Kubuntu is so frightening fast that I can forgive all the quirks of Kubuntu.
[21:39]  * cher is forced to work with Windows and regular hard disks at work.
[21:39] <bodom> I've removed almost any upstart constraint for kdm, leaving only filesystem. Now my sistem boots up fast as a shark and everything works fine. Ty
[21:40] <cher> bodom: You could've also instead bought an SSD :-D
[21:40] <SIR_Taco> BarkingFish: It adds a lot of features that ALSA/OSS didn't have, but I admit that there are cases of it being bad for some
[21:41] <bodom> cher: I've almost bought it, but price and write count kept me away
[21:42] <BarkingFish> And for that reason there should be alternatives for people who can't use pulseaudio, SIR_Taco.   We offer alternatives for everything else almost, I mean damn, there's over 30 different media players.  We have 2 progs (kate and kwrite) as basic text editors...
[21:42] <BarkingFish> but we can't offer an alternative to a sound system which is far from sound...
[21:42] <cher> bodom: write count is not a reason. Even with 3000 erase/write-cycles MLCs and a flash translation layer with only mediocre wear levelling you'd have to write multiple gigabytes per day to trash it within its first 5 years.
[21:43] <cher> As soon as the Llano does multitasking, I miss the level 3 cache :(
[21:43] <bodom> cher: Mhhh that's interesting. Didn't knew that. I'm gonna check prices once again :P
[21:43]  * James147 notes that kate just embeds kwrite (as with many other applications) and adds some more advanced featurers ontop
[21:43] <SIR_Taco> BarkingFish: there are ways to revert to ALSA, but they aren't exacly user friendly (ie. you can't just click a button)
[21:44] <bodom> Just to let you know, I have pulseaudio too :P
[21:44] <James147> SIR_Taco: not as simple as uninstalling it then?
[21:44] <bodom> and hate it hard ^^
[21:45] <SIR_Taco> James147: for instance http://www.jeffsplace.net/node/12 (a little older, not sure if it works with the current)
[21:46] <BarkingFish> SIR_Taco, I don't really care if it means having my goolagongs removed without anesthetic, I need to completely annihilate pulseaudio on this machine :)
[21:47] <cher> Forget what I said about the level 3 cache. There's a bug in the application that I'm using for performance profiling.
[21:49] <cher> Is there a recommendation on how to use Kubuntu when I have multiple PCs and want to share my user settings between them? Should I use an NFS server?
[21:50] <cher> (The best setup would be a setup that's comparable to Sun Ray.)
[21:53] <SIR_Taco> BarkingFish: wether you like it or not, PulseAudio just translates things to ALSA (or OSS if you have an older card) anyway... it could be possible, as James147 brought up, to just remove the PulseAudio packages
[21:53] <SIR_Taco> just make sure it's not going to remove important packages
[21:55] <BarkingFish> If you have the instructions on how to completely trash pulse on here, please, please link me to them :)
[21:55] <BarkingFish> If I could reach through the monitor, I'd hug you.
[21:56] <mark___> I'm having some really strange issues with my sound... For some reason the audio that plays is really high pitched, like someone turned the bass off and the treble to max. Anyone have any clue as to how to fix this?
[21:56] <kbroulik> weird, i have 750 MB of free memory and still it is doing stuff on the hard drive and has used 17% swap space o.O
[21:56] <SIR_Taco> haha
[21:57] <mark___> Nevermind it fixed itself somehow
[21:57] <mark___> I am so confused
[21:57] <SIR_Taco> kbroulik: swap space is used for pages that the OS has deemed to not be useful for the near future
[21:58] <kbroulik> ah, okay, thought it would just keep everything in swap till it is used or so
[21:58] <James147> kbroulik: ^^ and will keep files in memory that have been recently used incase they are needed again
[21:58] <kbroulik> it is okay that it does this way but if swapping slows down the system so extremely, it should just make the ram full as hell (like it used to normally)
[21:58] <James147> (at elast untill that memory is needed by something else)
[21:59] <SIR_Taco> kbroulik: it is possible that it was sent to swap because another program needed the ram space at that time... and hasn't been called back because it hasn't been needed, yet
[21:59] <James147> kbroulik: if the swaped memory isnt being used why load it? then the memory can be used for actual stuff (like loading data) and the swap be broght back when its actually needed
[22:00] <James147> kbroulik: if swapspace is emptied as soon as it can and the process dosnt actually need it back yet then it could just be swapeed out again if another process needs the memory... slwoing everything down
[22:00] <kbroulik> but it is still insane how much memory chromium actually consumes
[22:01] <kbroulik> and the worst technology ever invented: Flash. it consumes … damn!
[22:01] <bodom> kbroulik: if you want, you can tune system "swappiness"
[22:01] <James147> kbroulik: thats why you should encrouage people to use html5 :)
[22:02] <kbroulik> tell those the stupid people just putting preview on youtube (which does support html5) and then linking to another page, that5 does not -.- like blip of gtametrailers or so
[22:03] <bodom> kbroulik: changing vm.swappiness value on sysctl.conf and/or /proc/sys/vm/swappiness
[22:04] <James147> bodom: unless your actually having a problem with it that isnt advised... it can just make programs slower
[22:04] <kbroulik> I think the problem is more the hdd which has some bad transfer rates which seem to cause all sorts of trouble
[22:04] <kbroulik> such as slow as hell dolphin browsing, etc
[22:04] <kbroulik> but I think I will replace it next week anyway when I buy lots of stuff
[22:04] <kbroulik> and yes, I have back ups :p
[22:04] <bodom> kbroulik, James147: In my experience, setting a value of 15-20 instead of default (60) speed up things on desktops
[22:05] <James147> bodom: depends on the amount of ram you have/use :)
[22:05] <kbroulik> 12 gig? :D
[22:06] <cher> On most of my boxes, I do not configure swap spaace.
[22:06] <SIR_Taco> kbroulik: a quicker HD will help with speeding up swaping pages from the disk to ram and visa-versa, but it won't stop paging... only more ram will stop/decrease swapping
[22:06] <bodom> James147: That's true. We can say the rule is lot of ram and slow hd -> low value, less ram and fast hd -> high value
[22:06] <James147> cher: same :)
[22:07] <cher> In the long run, having 8 GiB instead of 4 or 16 instead of 8 usually is cheaper if the PC would swap otherwise and the user time = money.
[22:07] <bodom> cher: as long as you don't use suspend-to-hd, this could be a solution too
[22:07] <kbroulik> I dont use suspend-to-hd, as this takes like 10 times longer than a complete start :D
[22:08] <James147> kbroulik:  :D
[22:08] <cher> so true :)
[22:08] <BarkingFish> i don't believe it.
[22:08] <bodom> kbroulik: it depends on how many windows/app you got opened when you decide to suspend :D
[22:08] <kbroulik> writing/loading 12 GB of ram from drive vs. a SSD? :D
[22:08] <kbroulik> my system starts in 20 seconds of which 10 are the bios POST
[22:09] <BarkingFish> Debian have been a huge help to me :)  I've just nabbed all the main packages and deps from debian, for arts and artsd, and installed them without so much as a moan from kubuntu :)
[22:09] <kbroulik> or lets say 30 seconds and then it is fully usable with Kopete, Amarok, Chrome autostarted
[22:09] <cher> Similar here. My Llano takes 25 to start, of which 14 seconds are the BIOS.
[22:09] <kbroulik> my mother's pc is even quicker with EFI
[22:09] <James147> kbroulik: and a wake from hibernate has to load through th bios anyway ^^
[22:09] <BarkingFish> And if we want to be really good, we can chuck pulseaudio - nothing, and I mean *nothing, in debian, needs pulseaudio to run.
[22:09] <kbroulik> yep :D
[22:09] <SIR_Taco> you need to keep in mind also, that the more ram you have, the more the system will use (because it's faster than swap)... a lot of people complain that they have X amount of ram and it's using 60% of it.... they don't get that it's better to have most/everything in ram than in swap
[22:09] <kbroulik> hm okay I use pulseaudio
[22:09] <kbroulik> I hated it but now I love it :D
[22:09] <cher> swap is something for systems with in-memory databases or laptops that need suspend-to-hd for usability reasons.
[22:10] <kbroulik> SIR_Taco: that's what I always tell em
[22:10] <bodom> Well, usually I got about 20-30 windows opened at the end of a work day and I don't want to spend 15 min or emore next mrning to get them back
[22:10] <bodom> suspend-to-hd works fine for me
[22:10] <kbroulik> maybe one day I will have a computer with coreboot and systemd which will be ready in 10 seconds :D
[22:10] <James147> SIR_Taco: I like how my computer (6gigs) slowly fills up to about 98-100% full over a few hours :)
[22:10] <SIR_Taco> BarkingFish: so you have it working?
[22:11] <SIR_Taco> James147: exactly :)
[22:11] <kbroulik> once i figured out how to move around audio streams, I will never stop using pulse again :D
[22:11] <SIR_Taco> James147: I only fill my 8 gigs when I'm doing 3D rendering
[22:11] <BarkingFish> SIR_Taco, Give me 5 minutes and I'll tell you, I'm going to reboot now
[22:11] <BarkingFish> See you in a bit
[22:11] <cher> Now let's see if a Llano can do 3 monitors.
[22:12] <cher> Ah no let's not see this, I have no HDMI cable... :(
[22:12] <SIR_Taco> kbroulik: I agree.... but there are the odd card that doesn't like Pulse... usually older OSS drivers
[22:13] <James147> SIR_Taco: but is that just application memory? or with buffers/caches?
[22:14] <cher> You know what would be cool... if I could change the window of a running application to appear on another PC. Does X.org support something like this? (I.e. the same semantics as changing the value of the DISPLAY variable during runtime would have if this would be possible.)
[22:14] <SIR_Taco> James147: what are we talking about? swap, or audio? haha
[22:15] <James147> SIR_Taco: just ram :)
[22:15] <SIR_Taco> James147: ah, no that's buffers and cache
[22:16]  * kbroulik can't wait for systemd, wayland, coreboot, whatever :D
[22:18] <SIR_Taco> speaking of audio... I remember walking to the computer store.... barefoot, in the snow, uphill both ways, to get a SoundBlaster Live card, because it had kernel drivers... ;)
[22:19] <cher> That's pretty cool :)
[22:19] <James147> SIR_Taco: uphill both ways?   :)
[22:19] <SIR_Taco> James147: yea... there was no google maps or map quest.... I took a wrong turn :P
[22:19] <James147> :D
[22:21] <BarkingFish> James147, I'm not quite there yet.  I've killed pulseaudio by segfaulting it, and started artsd - I still have no sound though, I suspect I need to find a phonon backend for arts, and I'm sure there's one somewhere.
[22:23] <SIR_Taco> anyway... lol.... my point is that I find the contrast of then and now kind of funny. When we got QT upgraded, or got a peice of hardware working on a Linux system, it was awesome.... an achievement even... Now everyone expects things to work out of the box, which is not a bad thing but not what I'm used to
[22:25] <SIR_Taco> BarkingFish: can you change the "backend" setting under Multimedia in System Settings?
[22:26] <BarkingFish> yes, but i only have a gstreamer backend right now
[22:27] <BarkingFish> SIR_Taco, What is wrong with expecting things to work out of the box?  I know most if not all of linux's stuff comes with no warranty, but it shouldn't be too much to expect things to work like they're meant to, surely.
[22:29] <BarkingFish> Linux as a whole has clearly lost the KISS philosophy.  Instead of making bigger and better things which may actually be totally and utterly useless, we should be looking at improving on the stuff which we *knew* worked.
[22:29] <SIR_Taco> BarkingFish: I wasn't saying that things working out of the box was a bad thing.... I was just saying that when I started with Linux, half of the fun was getting things to work
[22:29] <BarkingFish> It was for me too, SIR_Taco
[22:29] <SIR_Taco> It's much more KISS than it was over a decade ago
[22:30] <BarkingFish> It took me 9 weeks to get my first usb wifi stick to work on linux.  Fun? Not entirely, but once I learned how to do it properly, the next stick I got (my new one just 2 days ago) took 4 minutes to install and start scanning.
[22:31] <SIR_Taco> I'm not going to argue with you that Linux is trailing as far as new hardware goes
[22:31] <BarkingFish> It just annoys me we have so many different types of other things, and so few of others.
[22:32] <BarkingFish> I'd be delighted to see us go the way of debian, their entire distro does not use or rely on pulseaudio anywhere.  Everything runs without need of it.
[22:32] <SIR_Taco> we have many different options for things we have control over.... we don't have control over drivers for the most part
[22:32] <BarkingFish> If only kubuntu was like that, I'd have a friend for life
[22:33] <BarkingFish> Hell, I may even migrate to Debian just to get rid of it :P
[22:33] <SIR_Taco> Debian sticks with older, yet reliable, software.... but if there was not innovation we'd be stuck on windows 3.1
[22:34] <BarkingFish> reliable being precisely my point.
[22:34] <BarkingFish> There's a difference between innovation, which is good, and sending out stuff which doesn't work right and not appearing to attempt to fix it (which is bad) :)
[22:35] <SIR_Taco> if what you want/need is super stable, but a little behind the times... than go with debian. You might not have the newest browser or some of the apps
[22:35] <BarkingFish> I'm not arsed with stable, SIR_Taco :D  What I want is *working* :P
[22:38] <SIR_Taco> BarkingFish: I agree, but you need to look at the larger picture.... for a large proportion of the Kubuntu community, pulseaudio works as intended. Without feedback though, they can't do anything about it. If someone tries Kubuntu and says "crap, my sound doesn't work, screw this" then no on knows.... if someone says "hey my sound doesn't work, here's my card and here's  the problem" that helps them
[22:40] <BarkingFish> sorry about that, plasma crashed :P
[22:40] <SIR_Taco> did you get my last message?
[22:40] <BarkingFish> yes
[22:41] <BarkingFish> it's in my scrollback :)
[22:41] <BarkingFish> You see, I'm one of those kind of people, SIR_Taco - I expect **** to work when I want it to work, and I don't expect people to issue stuff which is broken from the word Go.
[22:41] <BarkingFish> For me, across 2 different distros, pulseaudio has been broken.
[22:43] <BarkingFish> On mandriva, I was shown by one of their devs, Thiago, how to completely strip pulseaudio out of my system and revert to alsa only.  It worked like a charm.
[22:43] <BarkingFish> I don't have the instructions to do that here, the ones I had from the other distro don't work.
[22:43] <cher> Cu guys
[22:44] <BarkingFish> If I could find out how to do it, believe me SIR_Taco - I'd be all over it like chickenpox in a kindergarten
[22:44] <SIR_Taco> ok.... let me see if I can find something to get you back to ALSA.... what verion of Kubuntu do you have?
[22:44] <BarkingFish> 11.04
[22:49] <SIR_Taco> ok, after removing PulseAudio, did you install alsamixer?
[22:50] <BarkingFish> on the other distro? yes
[22:50] <BarkingFish> I haven't been able to nuke PA here yet
[22:50] <SIR_Taco> are we talking about 2 different things now?
[22:51] <BarkingFish> I don't think so
[22:51] <BarkingFish> I thought you were referring to me removing PA on the other distro, which I mentioned above.
[22:51] <BarkingFish> When I did that, I installed alsamixer after doing so.
[22:51] <SIR_Taco> ah ok
[22:52] <SIR_Taco> do you know the sound card?
[22:52] <BarkingFish> off the top of my head, no. I'll lspci and find out for you
[22:53] <SIR_Taco> great thanks
[22:53] <BarkingFish> 00:1b.0 Audio device: Intel Corporation 82801I (ICH9 Family) HD Audio Controller (rev 03)
[22:53] <BarkingFish> how do I find out the actual model?
[22:55] <BarkingFish> alsamixer tells me the chip is an Intel Cantiga HDMI
[22:59] <SIR_Taco> is your system settings -> multimedia -> set to HDMI as default?
[23:00] <BarkingFish> what, for output?
[23:00] <SIR_Taco> yes
[23:00] <BarkingFish> the output device just says "Internal analog audio stereo"
[23:00] <BarkingFish> er, Internal Audio Analog Stereo
[23:01] <SIR_Taco> BarkingFish: ok, and it's not muted?
[23:01] <BarkingFish> no
[23:01] <SIR_Taco> you get absolutely no sound from any application and/or start-up/shutdown?
[23:01] <BarkingFish> i get nothing from nowhere, whatsoever.
[23:02] <BarkingFish> It's so quiet I could here a cockroach blow off in the hallway :)
[23:02] <BarkingFish> *hear
[23:02] <SIR_Taco> haha ok
[23:03] <BarkingFish> my fan is making more noise than my speakers :(
[23:04] <SIR_Taco> in a console (or Konsole) "aplay -l" might give you more information about your sound card
[23:05] <BarkingFish> it does, lots more. I'll pastebin it
[23:05] <SIR_Taco> also, you don't have two sound cards? (ie. one on board and one as a card?)
[23:05] <BarkingFish> no, one card, built in to the laptop
[23:05] <SIR_Taco> ok
[23:06] <BarkingFish> http://paste.ubuntu.com/680189/
[23:08] <BarkingFish> there are 2 output devices available, one is the regular sound (STAC92xx) and device 3 is for the hdmi socket on the side, for when I plug into my hd tv
[23:11] <SIR_Taco> http://paste.ubuntu.com/680191/
[23:12] <SIR_Taco> you'll likely have to reboot
[23:13] <BarkingFish> done
[23:13] <BarkingFish> I hope this gives me some sound, but I'd still like pulse off here if I can figure out how :)
[23:13] <BarkingFish> I'll see you in a mo, SIR_Taco
[23:20] <BarkingFish> sorry dude, i got nothing.
[23:21] <BarkingFish> been end to end on alsamixer, turned everything up as high as it will go and i have nada.  I've tried a sound test in systemsettings/multimedia and i still hear nothing.
[23:22] <SIR_Taco> what laptop do you have?
[23:23] <BarkingFish> Compaq Presario CQ61
[23:24] <BarkingFish> 105-SA version
[23:24] <SIR_Taco> likely close to my HP laptop, that I had audio problems with
[23:25] <SIR_Taco> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/alsa-driver/+question/63526 try reply #2
[23:25] <BarkingFish> this one is mine - http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/gizmodo/2009/10/Compaq1_01.JPG
[23:28] <BarkingFish> I can't follow those instructions too well, they appear to be made out for a gnome based system
[23:28] <BarkingFish> I'll give them a shot though
[23:28] <SIR_Taco> yes, they are... just replace gedit with nano, or whatever you use
[23:32] <SIR_Taco> BarkingFish: it really isn't a PulseAudio problem... it's a driver problem
[23:32] <SIR_Taco> like my laptop... HP added some "unique" features to a normal soundcard from Intel.... and it breaks things
[23:32] <BarkingFish> well I sorta have a problem now, I'm looking at the HD Audio model codes under STAC92 types, and my laptop isn't listed in the STAC92 set
[23:33] <BarkingFish> http://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/sound/alsa/HD-Audio-Models.txt
[23:33] <billy__> what?
[23:33] <SIR_Taco> but, HD audio isn't what you're after
[23:33] <BarkingFish> no, but I need the model type for one of the commands in that list
[23:34] <BarkingFish> options snd-hda-intel model=
[23:34] <SIR_Taco> let me dig my laptop out
[23:37] <SIR_Taco> ha, it is the same sound card for my HP :)
[23:38] <SIR_Taco> give me a second and I'll put it to pastebin and you can copy it and see if it works
[23:38] <BarkingFish> All I need is the model id of the card if you can pull it please :)
[23:43] <SIR_Taco> BarkingFish: paste.ubuntu.com/680204/
[23:44] <BarkingFish> okies, one sec
[23:45] <SIR_Taco> BarkingFish: that should be close to the same laptop, if not the same sound card atleast. which the alsa-base.conf files should be the same
[23:46] <BarkingFish> ok, I've done that. Is a reboot needed?
[23:46] <SIR_Taco> reboot is the easy way yea
[23:46] <BarkingFish> ok then, back in a bit.
[23:46] <BarkingFish> hopefully with sound :)
[23:55] <BarkingFish> we're getting further from the goalmouth here, SIR_Taco
[23:55] <BarkingFish> now I have no sound, and aplay -l is saying DeviceList:240 - no soundcards found
[23:56] <SIR_Taco> you'll likely have to have your evil pulse audio installed again :)
[23:56] <BarkingFish> **** that, I'd rather have my balls passed over barbed wire :P
[23:56] <SIR_Taco> haha ok
[23:57] <BarkingFish> I still have my evil pulseaudio installed, I haven't been able to take it off yet :)
[23:57] <BarkingFish> That's what I wanted the help with!
[23:58] <BarkingFish> The next question is, how do I get my alsa-base.conf back to how it was?
[23:58] <SIR_Taco> I'm not sure, that at this point (11.04) you can pull pulse audio out... without breaking KDE
[23:59] <BarkingFish> i.e, do we have alsaconf or a gui setup for alsa, detects card, etc