/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/09/16/#ubuntu-au.txt

=== sagaci_ is now known as sagaci
head_victimsagaci: down for maintenance08:36
sagaciyeppers08:36
head_victimI got new toys!08:37
head_victimThis keyboard is blissful to type on compared to the old one.08:37
sagacithat mechanical one?08:40
head_victimIt's still rubber dome, but it's done well08:42
sagacidid you pick up that piece of kit08:47
head_victimYep, loud as hell but damn cheap for a 48 port cisco switch. Fortunately I was only planning to use is "as required" rather than 24/708:47
head_victimIf there's one beef about decent quality networking equipment of any brand is, it's damn loud.08:48
paul_hi guys.. is this ubuntu for australia?09:16
benonsoftwarepaul_: Yeah09:16
paul_cool.  anyone know how  do dvb netwok streaming?  preferably with lightweight application, so not mythTV.09:17
benonsoftwareNo sorry, just wait around and someone can help you09:18
head_victimpaul_: don't know how to do it but vlc might be worth a look09:18
paul_okay... i posted something in whirlpool and ubuntuforum.  but so far nothing anywhere.  i heard of use dvbstream, but i'm unsure how to use it exactly, i.e. configuration.09:19
paul_yeah, i had a look at vlc.  i can stream a file, but live dvb-t didn't work.09:19
sagacior mplayer/smplayer09:20
paul_also, i don't know all the "appropriate and tweaking" configuration to make it stream well.09:20
paul_when is this room most active?09:20
benonsoftwareAround 8-10pm AEST09:21
sagacimeetings, once a month... you might have some luck posting an email to the mailing list09:21
paul_okay...09:21
paul_where do you guys meet, for the meeting you just said, sagaci?09:22
sagacihere, the #ubuntu-au channel09:22
paul_okay.  lol.  i thought you meant like a real life meeting.09:22
sagacibut it's not really for support, rather the normal things that the team does as a whole09:22
sagaciwell there's a Sydney release party in about 3 weeks09:23
sagacialso one in Brisbane too09:23
paul_like upcoming 11.10 release party?09:23
sagaciyeppers, the Sydney one is the Saturday before the actual release09:24
benonsoftwareI haven't read the list latley, is anything thinking about a Melbourne release party?09:24
sagacithere might have been thoughts but nothing on paper yet, nothing concrete09:24
sagacilately*09:24
benonsoftwareAh ok, thanks :)09:24
sagacisorry, thought I made that typo :)09:25
benonsoftware:)09:25
paul_by the way, is there an equivalent for KMess?  i don't like pidgin or evolution or aMsn.  i like KMess, but want a Gnome version of it.09:25
sagaciif the sydney release goes ok and we get a handful, we'll hopefully plan something for december/january too ..09:26
sagacipaul_: straw search - http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=dvb&searchon=names&suite=natty&section=all09:27
paul_with the ubuntu-au, if we want to volunteer to provide support, what can a volunteer do?  please don't say desktop.  >.<09:27
benonsoftwareNice09:27
paul_thanks sagaci.  i am aware of different dvb packages.  the problem isn't so much as to choosing which one to use, but more so as to knowing how to use it, and use it effectively.09:29
head_victimpaul_: I just use me-tv but that's a standalone not streaming09:32
paul_i'm currently using vlc to watch dvb-t.09:33
sagacipaul_: umm, might be an idea to ask in #mplayer or something?09:36
paul_with respect, are there total linux/ubuntu newbs that are part of ubuntu-au membership?09:36
sagacipaul_: yep09:36
paul_yay!  i'm another  lol09:37
head_victimWe're all newbs here ;)09:37
paul_so no veteran linux hackers?09:38
paul_is there any recommend irc client besides xchat?09:46
head_victimirssi is what the cool kids in cli land use. I stick to xchat myself09:46
benonsoftwareWhat OS?09:46
benonsoftwareSorry wrong channel :)09:47
paul_haha benon09:47
paul_yeah, i fail command line.  lol09:47
paul_i wanted to explore linux, and chose ubuntu only because it ran "off the shelf"  lol09:47
head_victimpaul_: that's what I did about 5 or 6 years ago and tried a whole bunch of others and always come back to Ubuntu09:48
paul_i felt the learning curve was easier coming from windows.09:49
paul_i've even got my brother to use ubuntu, and he's less computer savvy.09:49
benonsoftware:)09:50
paul_are you all official or registered member of ubuntu au?09:50
head_victimI hang around a bit ;)09:51
head_victimSpeaking of hanging around though, I'm off to get some dinner09:51
benonsoftwareNa I'm not a Ubuntu Member yet :)09:51
paul_lol09:51
benonsoftware:)]09:52
paul_i had a look at the website, and wanted to contribute in some way, but it seem like wanted contribution seem to be about "desktop support" in some way.  lol09:52
benonsoftwarepaul_: Na you can help from anything like dev to translations09:53
paul_cool.09:54
paul_it has been quite some time since i touch C programming.09:54
paul_and pointer scares me!  haha09:55
benonsoftware:)09:55
benonsoftware:) I'm into Python dev09:55
paul_eww... i prefer C-like language.  :D09:56
benonsoftwareNa too hard :)09:56
paul_if only ubuntu keeps up to date with Mono.09:56
benonsoftware:)09:57
paul_C# is beautiful.  it is a pity that microsoft charge ridiculous price for it. :(09:57
benonsoftware:) Sure is09:58
paul_blue tic tac looks like illicit drug that is refreshing.  ahaha09:58
paul_i just saw an ad.09:58
* benonsoftware had a blue tic tac during camp10:00
benonsoftwareSee ya all10:29
head_victimpaul_: the team in general is always glad to have any sort of contribution. Our main focus is to promote Ubuntu to the general population but also as a means of socialising with people who share a common interest, Ubuntu.11:24
head_victimWhat city do you hail from?11:24
head_victimjaddi27: am I looking in the wrong spot or is the Oneiric edubuntu stuff they asked us to translate already done for us a long time ago12:07
head_victim?12:07
head_victimhttps://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric/+source/kubuntu-docs12:07
jaddi27head_victim, Which edubuntu stuff is that?12:08
jaddi27I don't remember translating any edubuntu strings, but I also don't remember seeing anything about it recently either12:08
head_victimAh do you hang on the translators ML?12:09
jaddi27No, I don't think I am on that one12:10
jaddi27If you can point me in its direction, I might sign up to it12:11
head_victimGetting there, I'd archived it :/12:11
head_victimhttps://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-translators12:12
jaddi27I will sign up once the page loads12:14
jaddi27I am currently using a temporary wireless setup, due to my router stopping working last night12:14
jaddi27so internet speeds are very slow12:14
head_victimAh I have a spare router in the cupboard from my last upgrade12:15
jaddi27Hopefully we can get a new one tomorrow - looking at the Cisco E420012:17
head_victimI picked up a 48 port cisco switch today12:17
head_victimMy usual network gear of choice is blue boxed netgear12:18
head_victimI find it the best price/quality point for home networks.12:18
jaddi27Do you find netgear or cisco better generally?12:18
jaddi27Because my other option was the netgear wndr400012:19
head_victimAh I haven't ever bought a router with wifi on it12:19
jaddi27I have just been looking at the latest high-speed routers12:19
head_victimI have an FVS336G12:19
head_victimDual wan and quad gigabit lan12:19
jaddi27ah, ok12:19
head_victimThroughput is enough for NBN but high speend NBN might push it12:19
head_victimI have a wireless access point separate.12:19
jaddi27Wireless is fairly crucial for my house - all except one computer are wireless12:20
jaddi27and i think for us an all in one wireless router is easier than two separate devices12:21
head_victimYeah, for some reason the wireless routers seem to have higher throughputs as well which i can't work out.12:22
head_victimObviously just putthing higher specced stuff in for the wireless.12:23
jaddi27I would have thought that plain routers would have faster throughput12:24
jaddi27Yes, I guess they must be12:24
head_victimThe only problem with business grade networking, is they're usually loud.12:24
jaddi27That is true. I would want equipment as quiet as possible where it will be going12:26
head_victimJust take that into consideration when you're buying "enterprise" stuff. My switch is pretty loud, my cisco switch I got today is even louder.12:27
head_victimDoesn't bother me as it's in the study and we always have multi other computers running anyway but it might bother some.12:27
jaddi27We do have other computers running in the room it is going, but I try to make it as quiet as I can12:28
head_victimYeah I'm trying to swindle our 24/7 computers down to 112:28
jaddi27I think the E4200 is a cross between enterprise and home equipment, so it hopefully will be fairly quiet12:29
head_victimOnly reason I go enterprise is the lifetime warranty and the phone support is heaps better12:29
head_victimI had an RMA on my 24 port gigabit switch within 5 minutes of dialling technical support. Despite it being a configuration issue on my end (it's a "Smart" switch, not quite a real managed one but more than your dumb ones)12:30
jaddi27I didn't realise they had such good warranty on the enterprise equipment12:30
head_victimThat's $500 bucks they were going they gave me a return number to go back to the local store and exchange over the counter12:31
head_victimSo idiot (me) assigned the same IP to multiple computers so that was the cause of the issue.12:31
jaddi27Sounds like a simple error to make if it is new equipment12:32
jaddi27It is good they were so helpful - not all companies would be like that12:32
head_victimYeah well for that simple error they were willing to swap for a new one (despite it being over a year old at the time)12:32
head_victimThat 5 minutes included the hold time.12:32
jaddi27That is certainly very good service12:33
jaddi27was that netgear or cisco?12:33
head_victimThe first ever dealing with them I had I called the number in the phone book and it went to an asian call centre. I gave them the model number and they apologised but they had to transfer me to their business section in Australia.12:33
head_victimNetgear12:33
head_victimIt's a crapload cheaper than the real cisco stuff12:34
head_victimSo I'd say aimed at soho12:34
jaddi27Yes, it certainly is12:34
head_victimLast I was looking the enterprise netgear is all called "pro safe"12:34
jaddi27The Cisco E4200 is $250, while the netgear is $175 (personal, not enterprise)12:34
jaddi27I will look into the enterprise equipment now12:35
head_victimDepends on what you're looking for. If you're going to replace it in a year or two anyway, just do the cheaper stuff12:35
head_victimI was actually looking at making my network completely gigabit capable so I wanted multi port gigabit lan on the router as my main requirement.12:35
head_victimIt's not necessarily THAT much quicker but it's not bad either.12:36
head_victimJust look at what the expected peak of the NBN speeds are going to be in the next 5 years (no idea where to look though) and make sure your wan to lan and reverse throughput is high enough.12:36
jaddi27We have had our current router for nearly 6 years, so we don't normally upgrade regularly12:36
jaddi27but I don't think we will be spending too much on it either - the $250 is probably the upper bound12:37
head_victimI always suggest doing the budget first, then looking. I used kevin rudd's 900 dollar bonus to buy my current router and switch12:43
paul_hey12:53
head_victimGday paul_ 12:54
paul_just answering your earlier question head victim, i'm in bris.  where are you?12:54
jaddi27paul_, Good to find more people in Brisbane12:55
paul_i take it, you're in bris too jaddi?12:55
jaddi27Yes, I am12:55
jaddi27head_victim is also based up here12:55
paul_where abouts?  i'm on northside.12:55
jaddi27I am on the southside12:55
head_victimI live in Annerley, so just on the southside12:55
paul_zzzzzzzzzz12:55
paul_lol12:56
paul_everyone is on southside 12:56
head_victim5km from the CBD, 5km from work12:56
paul_lucky you.12:56
paul_by the way, jaddi and head, are you linux/ubuntu experts?12:56
head_victimjaddi27 is, I'm just someone who plays with them12:57
paul_ah...  cool.  so any of you give recommendation for a dvb-t network stream setup?12:57
paul_and i don't want to use mythTV, too heavy and thick.12:57
head_victimpaul_: I'd start with http://www.videolan.org/doc/streaming-howto/en/ch09.html and go from there12:59
paul_yeah i have had a look at vlc... and it was funny.  i can stream file video, but dvb didn't work.13:00
head_victimhttp://www.videolan.org/doc/streaming-howto/en/index.html is the full document13:00
head_victimWell those 2 links have all the details on the settings13:00
paul_i'm currently use vlc to watch dvb.  i just want to stream it on network.13:01
paul_have any of use try out ubuntu 11.10 pre-release?13:02
head_victimYeah I run it in a virtual box13:02
paul_how it is so far?13:03
jaddi27paul_, I don't think I am an expert, but enjoy using linux/ubuntu13:03
head_victimIt's starting to come together. I will probably even try Unity on my main desktop by 12/0413:03
head_victim12.0413:03
head_victimBut I'm what you call a "slow adopter"13:04
jaddi2711.10 is looking good, but my tests in virtual box do not work with the proper unity 3d, so it is hard to fully see what it is like13:04
head_victimjaddi27: really? I got 3d working fine13:04
paul_i haven't had a look at it yet.13:04
head_victimThe only issue I had with 3d was remembering to click the "3d acceleration" box in the VB setup13:04
paul_but 11.04 unity didn't suit me, i am using gnome metacity.13:05
jaddi27I am using virtual box on Mac OSX, but I wouldn't think that should stop it working13:05
jaddi27It goes automatically into Unity 2d, even when the 3d acceleration is enabled13:05
head_victimYou have the additional drivers installed?13:05
sagacii'm running 11.10 on my laptop, it's got a couple of program crashes here and there but they usually get fixed within a couple of days - they aren't breaking the desktop13:06
head_victimsagaci: I've poked the xchat coordinators this time13:07
head_victimre the translation13:07
head_victimFingers crossed I have some response this time13:07
sagaciyeah, hopefully... I still need to get into the chromium-browser package :/13:07
head_victimNah there's a feature freeze on now isn't there as well, so the focus is fixing.13:07
sagaciwell my wireless broke after feature freeze for a couple of days 8)13:08
paul_lol wireless broke, must the carbon in the atmosphere :P13:08
jaddi27head_victim, Yes, I have the additional drivers installed. I have tried the Ubuntu restricted drivers, as well as the proper virtual box ones13:09
paul_by the way, how do quickly do reference to user?13:09
head_victimjaddi27: odd13:09
jaddi27paul_, If you are using xchat, start typing their name, and press tab13:10
paul_ah cool13:10
sagacipretty nifty eh13:10
paul_is xchat the recommended or defacto irc client using GUI?13:10
jaddi27head_victim, I might try reinstalling tomorrow. Do you think running it in virtual box on ubuntu would be better?13:10
jaddi27I like xchat, but there are quite a few to choose from13:11
head_victimjaddi27: not sure tbh, i know 3d works though13:11
jaddi27Using the virtual box driver 'cd', or the restricted drivers?13:11
paul_i'm a windows fail, and bound to be linux fail too.  so i'm after programs with easy to use GUI  :D13:11
paul_is 11.10 software centre as easy to use as synaptic?  i heard they are getting rid of synaptic.13:14
jaddi27the software centre is supposed to be easier, as it is more like the 'app store' on iOS for example13:15
jaddi27I still prefer synaptic though, as I know the package names a bit better, and prefer its layout13:16
paul_lol... i don't use apple stuff.  they are evil conspiracy :P13:16
sagaciI'm looking to buy an apple keyboard soon13:16
jaddi27but Synaptic will still be available in the repositories, so can quickly be installed13:16
paul_yeah, initially i use software centre.  but felt more comfortable with synaptic.13:16
sagaciyep, it's on my install list13:16
jaddi27sagaci, I have a wireless apple keyboard - it works very nicely13:16
head_victimI have moved back to wired desktop items13:17
head_victimI've had cheap wireless and I've had expensive wireless desktops. They all fail13:17
paul_wireless gets annoying when battery dies on you during gaming.  lol13:17
jaddi27head_victim, Going back to your kubuntu-docs translation page from earlier - It looks like there are still some strings to be translated in a couple of the docs packages13:18
head_victimI had to power reset my mouse and keyboard daily.13:18
head_victimjaddi27: ah I couldn't find anything to do :/13:18
jaddi27head_victim, https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric/+source/kubuntu-docs/+pots/kubuntu-docs-audio shows 8 strings13:18
head_victimHmm yeah, unless they're still changing strings on us13:19
jaddi27I think it is probably close to finished for us, and yes, the string count has been changing recently13:19
head_victimYep, they've had a string update since I looked13:19
jaddi27I have been keeping a spreadsheet with enAU translation stats13:19
paul_i maybe wrong on this, but does KDE use Qt?13:19
head_victimAh you guys are far too organised for this :P13:19
jaddi27Yes, KDE does use Qt13:20
sagacijaddi27, have you got the magic mouse and/or trackpad working with ubuntu?13:20
jaddi27Unity 2D is written in Qt partially13:20
paul_and Gnome doesn't eh?13:20
jaddi27sagaci, I only have ubuntu in a virtual computer on my mac at the moment, so cannot properly say. I do have a trackpad though, so I might eventually try it out (maybe on my laptop)13:21
jaddi27paul_, Gnome doesn't use Qt normally, but Qt can still be installed so Qt apps can run under Gnome13:22
paul_cool, i am cautious with Qt because some of it is not complete free.  and i want to stick to complete free software :D13:22
sagacipaul_, trisquel?13:23
paul_what is trisquel?13:24
jaddi27I will be off now I think. Nice to meet you paul_ - I hope we see you around here regularly.13:24
paul_nice to meet you jaddi :D13:24
paul_i'll try to hang around. :D13:24
sagacipaul_, depends on your idea of free software. For some, ubuntu isn't completely free. Trisquel is FSF-approved free. Depends on how mad you are13:26
paul_oh... how do i know whic software is not free on ubuntu?13:27
paul_all the software i get is from synaptic, unless it is a game, and that i pay for anyway.13:27
sagacipaul_, sudo apt-get install vrms13:28
sagacithough it's kinda tongue-in-cheek13:28
paul_what is vrms?13:28
sagacivirtual Richard Stallman13:28
paul_yep, i just read about it.13:29
paul_is vrms command line or GUI or both?13:29
sagacioutputs the packages that aren't considered free software, i've got unrar, libfaac0, and ms-tt-fonts13:29
sagacigui but it's easy, it just outputs text on your screen13:29
sagacicli*13:29
paul_i use ms font for gaming.  in that case, does that mean i'm infringing copyright?13:30
sagacino, they're free for personal use13:31
paul_ah...  okay, that's fine then.13:31
sagacican't remember the proper license, i'll check it out13:31
paul_i just installed vrms, how do i access it from desktop?  i can't find it in the desktop menu.13:32
sagaciopen up a terminal and type vrms13:34
paul_understood.13:35
paul_generally speaking what does non-free and contrib package means?13:35
sagacipaul_, fyi, on ms fonts - http://paste.ubuntu.com/690793/13:36
sagaciiirc, they're repo sections in debian13:37
paul_thanks sagaci13:37
sagacipaul_, I should know this but wikipedia explains it - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debian#Additional_repositories13:37
paul_awesome, i love this chatroom. :D13:39
sagaciI'm not advocating against ubuntu but if you're really into the free part of software, debian squeeze, their latest stable is supposed to be totally free, without extra little proprietary bits... depends if that really matters to you I guess13:40
head_victimOr try gnewsense13:40
sagaciis that still being developed?13:40
head_victimNo idea to be honest13:41
paul_well, i do play games, and i guess i rely on non-free graphics driver.13:41
paul_but i do like to keep it to a minimal.13:41
paul_by the way, where are you base sagaci?13:42
sagaciall my base are belong to nsw13:42
paul_go Barry (O'Farell)  lol13:42
sagacimeh, can't stand either side on the state level here :P13:43
paul_lol wasn't kristine good enough?  :P13:43
paul_she's on QA next week, will be a lol.13:43
sagacipaul_, I dual boot, using that non-free OS called windows13:43
paul_i dual boot too, but only use window when i really have to.13:44
jargonfactorysagaci: someone @ #debian-au might know about gnewsense i think (can't remember his name).13:44
sagaciI get a kick each time I update windows, it has a tagline line something like - Learn about and download more free software from Microsoft.13:44
paul_lol13:44
sagaciyeah I've been in the channel a bit but it's not bookmarked for me13:45
paul_there are "express edition" that entice, and then get slam by a huge price tag for just the "standard edition"  hahah13:45
sagacipaul_, Windows?13:46
paul_well, windows, .NET, SQL Server etc...13:47
paul_well there isn't express Windows.13:47
sagaciyeah depends what you need/use it for13:47
sagacithought you meant upgrade/student edition vs full retail or something13:47
paul_yeah, i know the student edition of stuff.  :D13:48
paul_what a recommended virtual machine?13:49
head_victimI use virtualbox but that's just because it's the first one I tried and it worked easily13:50
head_victimbrb, need to check something with a log out and in13:50
paul_i don't like virtualbox 'cause it from oracle, and i got the shits with oracle.  :P13:51
sagaciI only use virtual machines early in the release cycle when isos are too whacked to run on a production machine13:52
paul_lol --  i'm watching SBS - How Much Do You Love Me?  it's funny13:53
paul_lol spammer?13:59
jargonfactorydidn't wave today \o. to all.13:59
head_victimGday jargonfactory 13:59
jargonfactoryhi head_victim how's it going.14:00
head_victimNot too bad, trying to get some domestic duties done while playing with my new toys14:01
jargonfactoryahh nice. mind me asking what's your new toy? :)14:02
paul_does it involve insertion into a hole?  o.O  14:03
head_victimNew keyboard and network switch14:05
head_victimhttp://www.flickr.com/photos/45015261@N04/14:06
paul_any of you play HoN/14:07
sagaciyep14:07
head_victimI play bugger all games but when I do it's usually Urban Terror14:07
paul_i get graphics lag after a while.   maybe 'cause i'm running dual screen.14:07
sagacivia windows, not ubuntu - graphics have never worked for me so I always avoid14:08
paul_so do you reboot into windows to play?14:08
sagaciyeah14:11
sagacitrust me, for me it's much easier than configuring/tweaking graphics and wine14:11
sagaciimo14:11
paul_for me, once the graphics starts lagging, i just have to relog my session.14:12
paul_i think HoN doesn't properly utilise openGL14:12
sagacimaybe, I don't know14:12
paul_i don't know either... just using fixes i know.  :D14:13
head_victimAnyway, I'm off for a while, see you all later14:13
sagacicya14:13
paul_is Unity a rewrite from ground up, or is Unity an further development from Gnome?14:13
jargonfactoryhead_victim: ahh not bad. have fun mate.14:14
jargonfactorylater14:14
paul_see you HV.14:14
sagacipaul_, further development, it uses part of gnome 3 but doesn't use gnome shell14:16
sagacimay be wrong but that's a very top-down view of it14:16
paul_okay...14:16
sagaciunless you really really had to, would you really want to write a whole desktop environment from scratch in this day and age14:20
paul_depends... :P  maybe not.14:21
paul_wow it's 00:30 already!14:33
ikt=o14:45
iktbbs14:46
xannen_so... all still asleep?23:02

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