[01:17] alecu - thanks - I try to catch all those things but often miss a few [01:17] I'll get that fixed [09:06] Good morning all! [11:00] hi all, anyone know how i can get u1 to share a folder without using nautilus? its nautilus integration broke on this machine for some reason (on 11.10) so i don't get any options to do it [11:15] hi everyone [11:39] good morning everyone! [11:39] nessita, good morning [11:39] gatox: hi there. I owe you reviews, I'll do them now :-) [11:42] nessita, ok, i'm finishing with a branch for a high bug too [11:44] gatox: did you ever finished/submitted the branch that replaces some of the mock tests in sso? [11:45] nessita, not yet... i couldn't because i was working in some high bugs [11:45] gatox: is ok, you can tackle that next, since we're not targeting a date now [11:46] nessita, ok, let me finish with this bug which is important and then i will finish that [11:46] of course [11:46] gatox: no hurries at all [12:03] morning all! [12:03] mandel, hi! [12:07] gatox, hello, I own you a diff, but I ccould not buidl yesterday the package cause I had to reinstall xcode for that :( [12:07] gatox, I'll have it in a few mins :) [12:08] mandel, no problem!!! i red your twit about xcode :P [12:09] gatox, yeah, is terrible, the problem I had is that my pyqt on the mac did not have webkit (must be and old version) so I had to compile sip and pyqt and make was not there, WTF?!?! [12:09] mandel, yacks!!!! it seems that pyqt is always a few versions below in mac [12:11] gatox, well, they don't have a package so you have to keep track of it and compile it when needed, is not as easy as apt-get :P [12:11] :P [12:18] mandel: good morning! [12:18] gatox: did you talk to mandel re: editor and blank spaces? [12:18] good morning everyone! [12:18] nessita, nop [12:19] nessita, but i'm ninja-evangelizando anyway [12:19] mandel: USE A REAL EDITOR PLEASE? [12:19] nessita: there :-) [12:19] mandel: hey, seems like (some of) your editor(s) are not configured to trim trialing spaces... could you please check that? [12:19] ralsina: or that :-) [12:20] like......... i don't know...... ninja [12:20] jeje [12:20] * ralsina looks forward to the first file committed with \\r EOLs [12:20] * ralsina switched to ninja on windows today [12:21] ralsina, I use vim with the settings from the python core developers, so what is the problem? [12:21] nessita, ^ [12:21] mandel: doesn't trim spaces [12:21] I forgot to pep8-check your merge into -installer on friday and it had a bunch of those [12:21] mandel: your last branch of autoupdate added lines longer than 79 chars and trailing spaces [12:21] ralsina, cool :P [12:22] I wonder if we should just have a set of pre-commit hooks [12:22] mandel: these were added by your branch http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/697852/ [12:24] ralsina, autocmd BufWritePre *.py normal m`:%s/\s\+$//e [12:24] `` does the trick for me [12:24] mandel: in my editor, just clicking "save" does the trick ;-) [12:24] mandel, ralsina: can you please review https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu-sso-client/no-more-deprecated-service/+merge/77241 ? [12:25] nessita: on it! [12:26] ralsina, that is what that line does :) [12:26] mandel: it clicks save in my editor???? Vim is almighty! ;-) [12:27] nessita: I suppose you checked nothing uses that, right? If yes, the branch is trivial and I will approve it as soon as the tests are done [12:28] ralsina: I made a grep over all our projects, and found that somce utilities scripts from u1-servers were using it, but I have a branch in progress to fix that (will not breake until sso version in ubunet source tree is bumped) [12:28] nessita: cool [12:35] nessita, sure [12:36] nessita, can you let me know the branch that added the pep8 issues so that I can fix it [12:36] mandel: gatox fixed all the issues already. The branch was your last installer branch. [12:41] ralsina: pre-commit hooks in bzr are pain [12:41] ralsina: it would be nice if we could tell pep8 to exit with a non-zero return code though, then problem would be solved :) [12:42] dobey: it's kinda easy, since it's never supposed to print anything unless there is an error [12:42] like [ -z `pep8 whatever`] [12:43] true, but having to do that is kind of lame [12:44] it should just exit 1 or something if it prints things [12:44] like everything else on the planet does [12:44] dobey: yeah [12:45] I wonder if pep8 has an issue tracker somewhere [12:46] i don't know. i want to get all our stuff on pyflakes + pep8, and get rid of pylint; it was also mentioned before that there's a flake8 or something that's basically pyflakes+pep8 already [12:47] dobey: hey there! I saw an email this morning saying "1140 revisions were removed from the branch. " where "the branch" is u1client, and I freaked out. Then I saw that nothign was missing in u1client... any idea what happened? [12:48] nessita: yes; i screwed up yesterday. then promply fixed it when i saw what i did [12:48] dobey: oh, ok. Everything is fixed now then? [12:48] yep [12:49] :-) [12:50] side effect of urgency driven development ;) [12:51] pyflakes is easy to use because it misses way too much stuff [12:51] pyflakes is easy to use because it's extensible and not compltely batshit insane like pylint [12:51] OTOH, pylint finds way too much stuff and is semi-broken on windows (reads PYTHONOATH wrong) [12:52] anyway [12:54] hrmm, alecu no aqui [12:57] dobey: he should be entering any time now === m_conley_away is now known as m_conley [13:00] me [13:00] meh [13:01] dobey: hey, I see no client nightlies build since 2011-09-08, are we still havng the "reached the limit of builds" error? [13:02] me [13:02] ralsina, mandel, alecu: standup? [13:02] me [13:02] nessita: yes, i haven't had time to file a bug against LP for that yet; it's been a lower priority than dealing with oneiric [13:03] dobey: of course, can I help somehow? [13:03] mandel: say me [13:04] DONE: Email catch up, bosses catch up, open-heart meeting, proposed branch for bug #859635 [13:04] TODO: finish bug #859635, start ussoc cleanup! :-D [13:04] BLOCKED: nopes [13:04] NEXT: dobey [13:04] Launchpad bug 859635 in ubuntuone-servers (and 1 other project) "Remove the deprecated DBus iface (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/859635 [13:04] λ DONE: releases/uploads/stable branches [13:04] λ TODO: tickets, debugging [13:04] λ BLCK: None. [13:04] gatox: go [13:04] DONE: [13:04] Reset Password and some work on the flow related to forgotten and current user sign in too. [13:04] TODO: [13:04] Start migrating test to not mocker. [13:04] BLOCKED: [13:04] No [13:04] ralsina, go [13:04] DONE: release stuff, administrivia, reviews, organizing my head, call, mgmt call [13:04] TODO: finish thinking what we should work on [13:04] BLOCKED: no [13:05] me [13:05] mandel: go [13:06] DONE: Implemented code to uninstall msi (I need to clean the pep8 issues) Look at migrating data from old beta to new (we need to make sure we do nto brake things when we generate lots of uplaods." [13:06] TODO: as said, clean code and junt people for reviews [13:06] BLOCKED no [13:07] mandel: you with alecu? [13:12] nessita, I'm at his office but not with him [13:13] nessita, maybe he is taking amelia to the kinder or something [13:13] mandel, or something [13:13] alecu: hi there! dobey was looking for you, and I was eager to read your standup [13:13] nessita, were you looking for me? [13:14] nessita, I pasted my standup a few lines above [13:14] alecu: you did? I don't see them... have a timestamp? [13:15] mandel: trying to help a user with a stuck windows download. So far the only thing i can find is this exception. https://pastebin.canonical.com/53489/ [13:15] nessita, 10:06 [13:15] hrmm [13:15] dobey, you were looking for me? [13:15] alecu: I don't have that, actually I see you coming in at 10:11 [13:15] (10:11:33 AM) alecu [~alecu@186.19.234.137] entered the room. [13:15] alecu: can you please re-paste? [13:16] alecu: you didn't paste your standup after joining the channel at least :) [13:16] nessita, above that! [13:16] duanedesign, let me take a look [13:16] alecu: i was wondering if you were going to fix your ubuntuone-client branch so it will land :) [13:16] DONE: read a lot on proxies, discussed proxy issues with mandel, started a design document for the proxy features [13:16] TODO: more proxies [13:16] BLOCKED: no [13:16] alecu: this is all I have above! http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/698486/ [13:17] dobey, which branch are you referring to? [13:17] alecu: I don't see it either [13:17] duanedesign, can you get me a longer log please [13:17] duanedesign: is that on windows? [13:17] alecu: the unicode one [13:18] nessita: +1 on deprecated_interface [13:18] alecu: https://code.launchpad.net/~alecu/ubuntuone-client/unicode-usernames/+merge/76145 [13:18] ok, probably my irc client thought it was connected, but it was not [13:18] nessita, ralsina: I've repasted my standup (10:16) did it show up now? [13:18] alecu: yes, thanks [13:18] cool [13:19] alecu: yes, thanks [13:20] ralsina: yes mandel, i can [13:20] dobey, oh, I see that it's failing with a UnicodeEncodeError now. I'll take a look in an hour or so. [13:21] nessita, ralsina: I still have the server-timestamp branches to finish, but as we discussed with ralsina I'm using the mini sprint with mandel to plan the proxy work. [13:22] alecu: the main issue is that oneiric final freeze is tomorrow [13:22] alecu: so if there is something to ship to Ubuntu, it has to be today [13:22] nessita, this is not for oneiric, it's for windows [13:23] alecu: right, and the hash queue delay is server only? [13:24] nessita, no, the hash queue delay is a client side branch, and it was merged a few weeks ago. [13:25] nessita, the server fixes were just for the failing server tests. [13:25] also, regarding the other branch, the server-timestamp feature I'm still implementing, we need to test it a lot, and mrPresi already pointed out a few server caching problems with it. [13:26] (mrPresi == pindonga) [13:27] alecu: ack, thanks for that info [13:28] no prob. [13:28] yes, the timestamp branch is at least a week off [13:28] and in linux, we do have a "simple" solution (install ntp!) [13:28] also, the timestamp branch may be critical on windows, but it's "medium" on windows. [13:29] ralsina, we should suggest the GPLd ntp client on windows too. [13:29] alecu: yes [13:30] gatox: ping [13:30] ralsina, since I installed it on my devel VMs, I never had that issue anymore. And I used to have it a lot. [13:30] nessita, pong [13:30] gatox: I'm IRL testing the captcha loading branch in installer [13:30] nessita, ajap... [13:30] gatox: and what I see is that as soon as I open the installer, the overlay is shown, even if I did not click on register [13:31] gatox: that should not be there: the loading overlay shoul only be shown in the register screen (when loading captcha) [13:31] that's because we are loading the captcha in __init__ [13:31] nessita, can you send me an screenshot?? i don't quite follow [13:31] and we should load it in initializePage [13:31] that's a sso fix [13:32] gatox: open the installer with your captcha branch, having the sso captcha branch in the PYTHONPATH [13:32] gatox: you will get the overlay in the first screen of the installer [13:32] * gatox testing... [13:33] gatox: and that's not good, we need that overlay only in the registration screen [13:33] dobey, nessita, gatox, mandel, alecu (and eric, if you come back to the team at the time): december sprint is official [13:33] ralsina, cool [13:33] ralsina: meaning book tickets? [13:33] so, start booking [13:33] ralsina: ah, eh when? where? [13:33] we have hotel then? is it same as everyone else? [13:34] was there mail about this? [13:34] gatox: you need to do a branch in SSO that delays initialization of the captcha until the page is initialized [13:34] thisfred: sorry, we discussed it on mumble :-/ [13:34] np [13:34] thisfred: and by we, he means "not us" [13:34] thisfred: since you are on loan, you are not coming unless the loan ends [13:34] dobey: SORRY OK ;-) [13:35] it's official since 2 minutes ago. Consider this "discussion" ;-) [13:35] ralsina: ok, then I don't know yet, I guess. I think the idea is I come back after UDs [13:35] the hotel is not booked yet, but will surely be either the same as the other sprints or 1 block away [13:35] thisfred: cool, then I'll add you! [13:35] well even if he was still on loan, i think he'd still be going under a different guise to a different sprint :) [13:35] dobey: yeah, there is that :-) [13:36] ralsina: let's confirm this with Chipaca and jdo [13:36] mandel: tried to innclude what i thought was relevant. I got a whole archive of logs from the user. It has two exception logs and a status.log at the end. https://pastebin.canonical.com/53512/ [13:36] so either way, he should be booking tickets :P [13:36] nessita, ahhhhhh now i see [13:36] so, question remains, where and when? [13:36] duanedesign, ok, thx [13:36] * mandel looking [13:37] thisfred: buenos aires [13:37] thisfred: december 5-9 [13:37] ralsina, is that 100% sure, I'd like to book my tickets so I dont have to go around the globe :) [13:37] mandel: it is [13:37] ralsina, cool [13:37] uh oh, that's my anniversary... This is not gonna sit well :) [13:38] thisfred: romantic tango vacation? [13:38] I doubt my wife can get time off, but I'll certainly propose it [13:38] thisfred: i hear your wife liked buenos aires :P [13:38] hell yeah [13:38] december is nice. Hot bot not horribly hot [13:39] but* [13:39] confirm what with who? [13:39] Chipaca: thisfred and sprint [13:39] duanedesign, that looks terrible :( [13:39] Chipaca: when the loan to accounts expires, basically [13:40] sprint is confirmed, I am deciding if I want to piss eric's wife by making him travel on his anniversary [13:40] ralsina: well, he'll be there either with desktop or with accounts. Here's hoping it's accounts. [13:40] dates are the same exactly? [13:41] you are hoping it's accounts? [13:41] thisfred: yeah, dates are same [13:42] ralsina, everyone is runing away from the desktop :P [13:42] Not me. [13:42] the "desktop" is dead; i don't know why people can't see that [13:42] mandel: oh no :\ terrible is not good. [13:43] duanedesign, is there a bug for this? [13:43] ralsina: we need to rename our team to awesome+, because it's really what we do. [13:44] mandel: no this was a user that contacted us through support [13:44] duanedesign, mandel: looks like screwed metadata to me [13:44] hmm [13:45] guys and gals, I need to make the run for the kinder, see you in a half hour or so. [13:45] mandel, I'll be there soon [13:45] bye alecu! [13:45] gatox: let me know when is fixed [13:46] nessita, ok [13:47] oh, ralsina. Thanks for contributing to the facebook page. Any comments are greatly appreciated. [13:48] duanedesign: np, I just take a look every now and then to see if I can help :-) [13:48] :) [13:50] ralsina, it does look like that except for the fact that we got this 'failure: I/O operation on closed file' [13:50] mandel: that could be just a logging problem [13:50] or that a file got locked while syncdaemon was writing (much scarier) [13:50] or rather, reading [13:50] ralsina, that is why I'm thinking [13:51] I say reading because it was an upload [13:52] duanedesign: speaking of help; why is the link to the interview with chipaca posted 3 times from facebook (on twitter)? :P [13:52] because I'm 3x awesome, clearly [13:53] gatox: added Needs Info to ubuntu-sso-client/network-detect [13:54] gatox: also, I think the commit message for the sso branch is not accurate, since what that branch is fixing is provide a new method in the linux side [13:54] nessita, ok, i'll review that in a while, i'm fixing some test in pass recover [13:54] gatox: ack [13:55] dobey: ugh, i will look at that. [13:55] ralsina, duanedesign I'm moving this conversation to #chicharra so that verterok can give us a hand [13:56] mandel: cool, good luck! [13:56] mandel: I'm here [14:01] ralsina: have any ideas for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntuone-windows-installer/+bug/860700 ? [14:01] Launchpad bug 860700 in ubuntuone-windows-installer "Error message when starting PYTHON27.dll not found (affects: 2) (heat: 10)" [Undecided,New] [14:01] nessita: not really [14:02] nessita: that seems to indicate that a file got deleted but he says he reinstalled [14:02] I'll ask for some info [14:02] ralsina: thanks [14:02] np [14:18] who needs a rview from me before I start a non-interruptible task? [14:18] gatox, nessita, dobey, mandel: ^ [14:18] ralsina: not here [14:21] ralsina, me! [14:21] gatox: where? [14:22] ralsina, let me give you the links [14:22] not yet [14:22] ralsina, https://code.launchpad.net/~diegosarmentero/ubuntuone-windows-installer/network-detect - https://code.launchpad.net/~diegosarmentero/ubuntu-sso-client/captcha-refresh/+merge/76621 [14:23] ralsina, I do [14:23] ralsina, give me a sec I'll get the mp [14:24] mandel: shoot [14:24] ralsina, https://code.launchpad.net/~mandel/ubuntuone-windows-installer/check-old-app [14:25] nessita, if you can give me an extra one it would be greatly appreciated ^ [14:25] mandel: ack [14:25] mandel: I will! [14:25] all pep8 issues should be fixed [14:33] gatox: isn't captcha-refresh the branch we were talking about a while ago that causes the installer to show the overlay on startup? [14:34] mandel: OldBetaUpdateTestCase should also test are_updates_present and perform_update, no? [14:35] ralsina, yes, there are two captcha refresh, one for sso and one for the installer..... don't review that yet, i have to look where i should apply the change [14:35] ok, queuing then [14:35] ralsina, yes, there are two captcha refresh, one for sso and one for the installer..... don't review that yet, i have to look where i should apply the change [14:36] nessita, let me take a look [14:37] gatox: sso is doing the refresh_captcha a bit early, in setupUi [14:37] ralsina, ok, i'll check there then [14:37] gatox: OTOH, moving it to later means that the UI is a bit less responsive, since the user will have to wait for the captcha [14:37] nessita, the tests for that are in a previous branch, this is for the migration from the old to the new while the autoupdater is for everyone [14:38] gatox: ideally, we should do it in setupUi but not show the overlay unless somehow the user is already on that page [14:38] gatox: sot of checking for a flag on initializePage, and show the overlay if the captcha is not ready yet [14:38] s/sot/sort/ [14:39] mandel: ah, then I'll start with the other one [14:39] ralsina, yep [14:39] mandel: no, wait [14:39] nessita, AutoupdaterTestCase is the test case for auto-updating, the idea is that the migration code will be deprecated rather quickly [14:39] mandel: I started with the first branch, the one that does not depend on any other branch [14:39] nessita, :) [14:39] mandel: so, these methods: [14:39] 92+ are_updates_present = lambda *args, **kwargs: False [14:39] 93+ perform_update = lambda *args, **kwargs: None [14:40] mandel: are added but have no tests [14:40] gatox: on network-detect, why only when using --installer? You need network on the other case too! :-) [14:40] mandel: you're saying those are meant to be used in another branch? [14:41] ralsina, in every next??...... i based that in your branch where that was only being checked on the next from License Page [14:41] nessita, no, are_updates_present and perform update are in trunk, and have their own tests (on linux are_updates_present is tested to return always false) [14:41] mandel: then why the diff is showing those as new addings? [14:41] nessita, I removed a trailing white space [14:41] ah! [14:41] :P [14:43] mandel: added NF so we do a better error handing in is_old_beta_installed. Defaulting to True for any return code other than ERROR_UNKNOWN_PRODUCT is too error prone [14:44] mandel: from http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/aa370130%28v=vs.85%29.aspx, I see we should be checking against ERROR_SUCCESS [14:47] nessita, for that I'd say is better to do a if error in (ERROR_SUCCESS, ERROR_MORE_DATA) since in our case the mean more or less the same [14:48] nessita, ERROR_MORE_DATA is returned when the buffer allocated is to small but the property is indeed there (there is no way to know the size upfront) [14:48] and we remove the if [14:48] mandel: if we get ERROR_MORE_DATA we need to call again with more buffer space [14:49] mandel: do not assume the old beta is installed if we get more data [14:51] nessita, we do not need to call it again, the thing works in the following way, we query for the information of a uid, the information is stored in a COM property (que es una mierda) y the uid is present in the system, that is the msi was installed, we either get a sucess (yeas, the property is small) or a need more that [14:52] nessita, both errors state that the uid is indeed know by the system ergo we do have the app installed [14:52] mandel: ok, please add a big and clear comment stating that :-) [14:52] nessita, sure :) [14:52] mandel: so when we read a couple of months from now we don't think is a bug [14:52] nessita, changing the code now then :) [14:53] mandel: and I think you also meant "adding tests"! :-) [14:54] gatox: sorry for the delay: not on every next() but on the beginning even if called without --installer [14:54] gatox: when I did my branch there was no --installer option :-) [14:54] ralsina, ah ok! [14:57] yes, and that hehe [14:58] mandel: i'm glad you approved my branch that landed 2 days ago, today :P [15:06] dobey, yeah, I did not see it was merged hhehe [15:06] dobey, I finished the tests and then went to approve without refreshing the page :P [15:09] mandel, http://blog.robbowley.net/2011/09/21/estimation-is-at-the-root-of-most-software-project-failures/ [15:23] mandel: http://twitpic.com/6rwkgi/full# [15:25] alecu, interesting [15:31] nessita, ralsina review please: https://code.launchpad.net/~diegosarmentero/ubuntu-sso-client/pass-recover/+merge/77346 [15:32] gatox: I will queue that up after the current ones [15:32] nessita, ok [15:32] ok, must get lunch; bbiab [15:40] nessita, I pushed the changes already (sorry I forgot to ping you) [15:48] czajkowski, hahahaha === m_conley is now known as m_conley_away [15:56] mandel: if I have to ue windows it's gonna be my way! [15:58] gatox, mandel: just in case you want a new android phone, I can get this one for you when I go to the UK sprint: http://bit.ly/nqhjJD [16:00] ralsina, nop...... but if you want to get something like this: http://www.arroba.com.mx/byte/blog/wp-content/uploads/dell_m17x_alienware_front.jpg PLEASE LET ME KNOW! :P [16:00] ralsina, I might ping you from spain about it, I dont know if I'm getting a new one from vodafone [16:00] gatox: missed the name of the place? ;-) [16:00] mandel: orange phones are unlocked. That's nice [16:01] ralsina, ah right..... i don't know where to get it :P [16:01] ralsina, hahaha I missed it, nice one! [16:02] gatox: an alienware? Who are you, sheldor the magnificent? [16:02] ralsina, jejejee i want super hardware! :P [16:02] gatox: that's just too hard to bring back [16:04] ralsina, i know.... odio los problemas de importaciones!! :P [16:04] I could ddo it, but I am already brining one for my wife [16:05] ralsina, no problem!! i can wait, there's no rush [16:10] nessita is out of power [16:10] meaning her lights are out, not that someone deposed her government [16:14] i thought Buenos Aires was the seat of power for AR anyway :) [16:14] a coup in cordoba probably wouldn't accomplish much? [16:14] well, actually... there is historical precedent [16:14] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cordobazo [16:15] ah [16:15] I mean, not *successful* precedent ;-) [16:16] given all the smoke in the pictures on that page, it doesn't seem like it was a *civil* uprising :P [16:17] cordoba is pretty flammable [16:17] so it would seem [16:21] anyway [16:22] webkit is such a pain === beuno is now known as beuno-lunch [16:26] meh, gdb [16:41] ralsina, when you have time, this is also for review: https://code.launchpad.net/~mandel/ubuntuone-windows-installer/uninstall-old-app [16:42] mandel: will get to it, but I have a queue :-) [16:44] ralsina, sure, no problem :) [16:44] gatox: lint problems in pass-recover, adding them to the MP [16:44] ralsina, ok, i'm finishing with captcha-refresh.......... and that involve 2 branches [16:51] ralsina, ping [16:51] mandel: pong [16:51] ralsina, when getting the special folders, why do you use SHGetSpecialFolderPathA insteand of SHGetSpecialFolderPathW ? [16:52] mandel: ignorance! [16:52] ralsina, ok, I'll fix that in my branch, since you are not getting the unicode one [16:52] I was young and naïve! [16:52] the dog told me to! [16:52] ok, thanks. [16:53] ralsina, and here: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/bb762204(v=vs.85).aspx [16:53] ralsina, read the remarks, are we using the right function? [16:53] mandel: including a redistributable is a pain [16:53] ralsina, ok [16:54] so, I would say "yes we are" :) [16:54] i wish it wasn't so hard to build code written in a real language, on windows [16:54] at least until we deprecate XP. Maybe you can add a comment to that effect [16:54] ralsina, will do [16:54] dobey, you mean c? [16:55] C++ is pretty easy to build, it's just annoying to write! [16:55] mandel: well, vala [16:55] Oh, "real" ;-) [16:55] well it outputs C, so only the C needs to be built on windows [16:56] but we can easily write code in vala and immediately have bindings for pretty much every language anyone actually uses, on linux [16:56] but on windows, well… :( === beuno-lunch is now known as beuno [17:00] dobey, I have been told that shotwell can just compile with certain versions of vala, is that correct? [17:00] and if it is, do we want that problem? [17:01] mandel: i don't know [17:01]