| rww | freenode has always been run by trolls, kthx. | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| IdleOne | not according to the whois output I have | 00:00 |
| IdleOne | I keep reaching for my empty cup :( | 00:00 |
| IdleOne | maybe I need to fill it | 00:00 |
| IdleOne | !away > Wilcon_afk | 00:45 |
| ldunn | ugh. Let me go fix that. | 01:15 |
| PerfM | Last time I'll be in here today, PROMISE | 04:38 |
| PerfM | Omg! | 04:40 |
| PerfM | I was typing! | 04:40 |
| IdleOne | PerfM: this is getting boring. what are you going to pretend to need now? | 04:41 |
| PerfM | I agree, this is getting tiring. | 04:41 |
| PerfM | rww is dealing so hang ten, and we'll see if he can get the job one | 04:41 |
| PerfM | done* | 04:41 |
| rww | IdleOne: Given that PerfM recently PMed me the entirely-reasonable question "am I supposed to be banned from #ubuntu-offtopic?", I suggest that autokicking her is a bit premature. | 04:41 |
| PerfM | ^ | 04:42 |
| PerfM | HAHA | 04:42 |
| PerfM | PerfM-1 IdleOne-0 | 04:42 |
| IdleOne | next time I suggest you come in with " Hi, I'm here at rww's request" | 04:42 |
| PerfM | IdleOne, next time you should kick me ;) | 04:42 |
| rww | IdleOne: she isn't here at my request. I suggest you catalyze better. Or at all. | 04:42 |
| PerfM | shouldn't** | 04:42 |
| rww | PerfM: yes, you're banned by PerfieM!*@*. I'll add your current nick to the list so you don't accidentally join. | 04:43 |
| PerfM | ^ | 04:43 |
| PerfM | cool bean, you might wanna do the same to the women's channel too | 04:43 |
| PerfM | beans*, it's to late to spell | 04:43 |
| IdleOne | my apologies for having removed you but after the 3-4 time today. | 04:43 |
| PerfM | or infact all the #ubuntu channels. | 04:44 |
| PerfM | IdleOne, we all make mistakes | 04:44 |
| PerfM | thanks rww! | 04:44 |
| PerfM | night team! | 04:44 |
| rww | PerfM: done. I think #ubuntu already had both. | 04:44 |
| PerfM | lol okaaay | 04:44 |
| rww | IdleOne: If she shouldn't be in here, ban her. If she should, at least pretend to be professional :P | 04:45 |
| rww | </lecture> | 04:45 |
| elky | Did she just ask for a namespace ban? | 04:50 |
| IdleOne | She did. | 04:51 |
| elky | ubuntu.com does indeed appear down. | 07:19 |
| ikonia | nice to know it's a drupal site | 07:20 |
| elky | i already knew that bit | 07:20 |
| ikonia | I don't actually care really | 07:20 |
| Myrtti | yeah old news | 07:20 |
| ikonia | just surprised, it's a bit of a sloppy thing to do, not change the maintenance page | 07:20 |
| Flannel | Apparently Ubuntu is switching to Kubuntu, just look at the blue! | 07:20 |
| ikonia | Flannel: well done on starting a rumour | 07:21 |
| ikonia | give it 5 minutes and vibhav will be announcing it as fact | 07:21 |
| Myrtti | or 39 minutes | 07:21 |
| Flannel | ikonia: Gotta wait for the logs to tick over first | 07:21 |
| Myrtti | +1 | 07:21 |
| rww | obviously my irritating complaining about its front page took effect and they've taken it down to appease me | 07:22 |
| rww | OBVIOUSLY | 07:22 |
| elky | looks like the database fell over | 07:22 |
| Flannel | rww: I'm happy for you. | 07:22 |
| Flannel | rww: Now, what shall we make you complain about next? | 07:23 |
| rww | Flannel: everything else | 07:23 |
| elky | rww, the fact that it's down, perhaps? | 07:23 |
| rww | quick, find a way in which drupal is non-free so i can complain it's not using wordpress | 07:24 |
| Flannel | rww: lefthand close buttons? dselect being gone? no more CLI tools by default? the potential list is endless! | 07:24 |
| rww | or maybe they're moving the pages around again so i can complain about broken links again | 07:24 |
| rww | Flannel: dselect was awful | 07:24 |
| Flannel | rww: This time they broke *all* the links! | 07:24 |
| Flannel | ubuntu.com has been rerouted to a random other domain, good luck findin it! | 07:25 |
| rww | Microsoft bought Canonical and are shutting Ubuntu down, obviously | 07:27 |
| Flannel | oh goody. At least hyperthreading will work now. | 07:27 |
| Tm_T | uh hey, I thought you were talking about ubottu.com, not ubuntu.com ... | 07:27 |
| rww | Flannel: hyperthreading doesn't work? | 07:28 |
| Flannel | rww: No, I haven't been able to get it to work since Breezy. | 07:29 |
| Flannel | Every time I upgrade I spend a few hours with it before giving up again. | 07:29 |
| rww | what | 07:30 |
| rww | HT works fine on Linux, what are you talking about ;( | 07:30 |
| Flannel | It works on Linux, it doesn't work on my machine, for whatever reason. -smp kernel or non (well, obviously I stopped trying -smp kernels once we stopped making them) | 07:32 |
| popey | Flannel: what cpu? | 07:32 |
| Flannel | Pentium 4... something. It lists ht in its flags, I'd have to go find the paperwork. Unless there's some way to tell from cpuinfo (I didn't think family/model/etc were that unique) | 07:34 |
| ikonia | some vibhav returns to quoting wikipedia at people as if it's his own | 07:35 |
| ikonia | why will this kid not stop it | 07:35 |
| rww | Flannel: model name is unique for me | 07:40 |
| rww | though I'm on Core 2, not P4 | 07:40 |
| popey | Flannel: odd. | 07:41 |
| Flannel | popey: after spending a few days on it, I just gave up. It's a server anyway. | 07:42 |
| popey | heh | 07:42 |
| rww | ubuntu.com's back up. | 07:47 |
| rww | my personal cloud is still got bigger. | 07:47 |
| Tm_T | is still "got bigger" ? | 07:52 |
| elky | i'm going to guess that he doesn't like the phrasing of the statement | 08:59 |
| Myrtti | lolhelp | 09:25 |
| Myrtti | unity in kde? | 09:25 |
| popey | bastard child of two unwanted desktops ;) | 09:26 |
| Myrtti | word | 09:26 |
| === gryAway is now known as gry | ||
| ActionParsnip | hey guys | 20:02 |
| ikonia | hey | 20:02 |
| ActionParsnip | qq about asking users to "google" stuff | 20:02 |
| ikonia | ok | 20:02 |
| ActionParsnip | earlier, A user was asking about updating video drivers on Lucid and I said there was the xorg edgers update ppa | 20:02 |
| ActionParsnip | so the user requested a link, but i was doing a billion other things, so I advised they websearch it and they would find it | 20:03 |
| ikonia | (I've been out of the channel for about 15 minutes, thanks to my isp - so I may need context) | 20:03 |
| ActionParsnip | oCean however thought this was bad and that tyelling users to try and help themselves a little was not to happen | 20:03 |
| ActionParsnip | despite me pretty much giving them the direction they needed | 20:03 |
| ActionParsnip | user also managed to find the ppa and add it ok | 20:04 |
| ikonia | this comes up a fair bit, for me it's two parts | 20:04 |
| ikonia | 1.) what they are asking and what their limitations are | 20:04 |
| ikonia | 2.) how you tell them to google it | 20:04 |
| ActionParsnip | was it bad I told the user to try and use his own initiative - seeing how I had pretty much nailed the answer | 20:04 |
| ikonia | I have no idea abou the specific example you're talking about, so just apply common sense | 20:04 |
| ikonia | pushing the user in the right area for google if they obviously know what they are doing but are not quite there seems ok | 20:05 |
| ActionParsnip | limitations I can accept but I had given the thing they needed so they could find what I was on about and free me up to help others | 20:05 |
| ActionParsnip | teach a guy to fish etc | 20:05 |
| ikonia | telling a user you've not got time to search for the page yourself but if they try the phrase Blah it normally comes up is "ok" | 20:05 |
| ActionParsnip | ocean was very blunt and said I was not to do it | 20:05 |
| ikonia | but saying "just google it" doesn't | 20:06 |
| ikonia | the fish tales a bit annoying to be honest | 20:06 |
| ActionParsnip | i never say that :) I like to give direction so users learn, rather than just handing out URLs | 20:06 |
| ikonia | I think as long as you apply common sense to give help to suit that user, I don't see an issue | 20:06 |
| IdleOne | IMO it all depends on the ability of the user, if you can tell the user knows what they are doing and just needed a push in the right direction then yeah I think it is ok. | 20:07 |
| ActionParsnip | ocean said I should join here to discuss it, so I just wanted clarification and such | 20:07 |
| ikonia | if a user has no idea what's going on and wants to know how to enable time travel in ubuntu, saying "google it" isn't helpful | 20:07 |
| ikonia | getting them %90 of the way and offering a phrase for the remaining %10 as you're a bit busy is also reasonable | 20:07 |
| ActionParsnip | that's what I was getting at, but teh user immediately asked for a link, which I find pretty poor | 20:07 |
| ikonia | I do feel your pain on that | 20:07 |
| ActionParsnip | i also informed the user the merit of finding ones own guides based on direction, rather than asking for handouts | 20:08 |
| ikonia | that's not really useful | 20:08 |
| ikonia | the user probably knew they can google, just couldn't be bothered | 20:09 |
| ActionParsnip | i'd have to agree | 20:09 |
| ikonia | a lecture isn't going to help, if you think the users too lazy, don't help | 20:09 |
| ActionParsnip | but ocean said it was strictly to not happen ever, which I'd disagree with, hence me being here | 20:09 |
| ikonia | maybe a wording issue ? maybe worth discussing with him personally | 20:10 |
| ikonia | I don't know the history | 20:10 |
| ikonia | but for me, just common sense, if your help actually helps the user or acts in the users best interest, I don't see an issue | 20:10 |
| ActionParsnip | http://pastebin.com/F2V3piBj | 20:13 |
| ActionParsnip | I am AndChat| helping Benb | 20:13 |
| ActionParsnip | there is stuff above asking about how to get newer stuff in Lucid as he wanted to keep LTS but get newer drivers to support his newer hardware | 20:14 |
| ActionParsnip | oh and add: [17:54] <oCean> AndChat|: let me explain it this way: don't do it again | 20:14 |
| LjL | ActionParsnip, you came across as if you were snapping. you could've said "sorry i'm on my phone, have difficulty searching but it's easy to find on google" or something | 20:14 |
| ActionParsnip | I guess :( | 20:14 |
| ikonia | I suggest you speak to ocean as I'm not getting involved in log quoting | 20:14 |
| ActionParsnip | hectic and stuff, but yeah coutesy and stuff | 20:15 |
| ActionParsnip | ok i'll see what I can do, but just wanted a second opinion | 20:15 |
| ikonia | and that was the common sense bit I was suggesting earlier, just saying you didn't have time to google for them | 20:15 |
| ActionParsnip | ikonia: agreed | 20:15 |
| ActionParsnip | the 'don't do it agin' bit is not appropriate though | 20:16 |
| ikonia | well, not if he's asking you to not do it again | 20:16 |
| ikonia | again, don't know the context, but you seem pretty comfotable with it now ? | 20:17 |
| LjL | ActionParsnip: well i do suggest you discuss it with oCean, he's a reasonable guy | 20:17 |
| ActionParsnip | ikonia: oh yeah, I hust hate the whole handout url thing. | 20:17 |
| ActionParsnip | LjL: sometimes, not this time imho | 20:18 |
| ikonia | I don't like it either. | 20:18 |
| ActionParsnip | thanks for your attention guys :) | 20:18 |
| LjL | ActionParsnip: best of both worlds, "the URL is http://blah/, by the way i found it by searching for 'foo bar' on google" | 20:18 |
| ActionParsnip | LjL: I guess but was on my phone which is dog slow on the web unless i'm on 3g :) | 20:18 |
| LjL | ActionParsnip: yeah i realize that, in that case it's fine not giving the URL, but i was saying the way you worded made it sound more like "meh, don't bother me and search for it yourself!" than "sorry, on phone and can't provide atm" | 20:19 |
| ActionParsnip | LjL: gotcha, will use that in future | 20:19 |
| === IdleOne is now known as IknowNotUbuntu | ||
| === IknowNotUbuntu is now known as IdleOne | ||
| IdleOne | ActionParsnip: if there is nothing else please /part | 21:18 |
| ActionParsnip | sure | 21:18 |
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