[02:09] valorie: Thank you for that quite unexpected +1 on my rant [02:16] you are most welcome -- honest speech is always welcome [07:54] morningo [09:59] Hey all - hope your morning is going well...I am going to re-send invitations to all the leadership councils in the community the invitation to join this team...I think it's important that we are all working together in this effort [10:00] akgraner: there were some interesting things brought up in the CC meeting earlier about leadership as well you might want to read [10:01] head_victim, I know [10:01] I read it all and have already send emails to some folks and working on a blog post now :-) [10:01] akgraner: cool, just checking, figured it might be useful/relevant :) [10:02] completely :-) [10:02] * head_victim has a habit of reading scrollbacks a bit too much [10:02] sorry didn't mean to be short - need to find my coffee cup... [10:02] Coffee is always high on my priority list as well so don't stress, as long as it's found [10:02] totally :-) [16:01] * bkerensa works on Ubuntu Oregon's Ocelot T-shirt designs [16:02] :-) [16:04] indeed fun :( [16:05] so much backlog of stuff to do [16:21] always :-) [17:33] bkerensa: doing a tshirt for each release ? [17:34] Yeah thats the plan [17:34] and every global jam [17:34] :) [17:34] expensive [17:34] :D [17:34] * bkerensa also will try and have catering provided for every release party and global jam [17:34] :D [17:37] yes, it's expense to make one time tshirts :] [17:37] expensive [17:37] c'est cher quoi :D [17:40] YoBoY: $200-$300 each time [17:40] :D [17:42] paid by the team or the participants ? [17:42] neither [17:42] :D [17:42] Sponsors [17:43] cool :) [17:45] we don't have sponsors in France :] perhaps we are doing something wrong ^^" [18:04] bkerensa: Sponsors pay for the shirts directly, or donate funds to the group? [18:05] bkerensa: (Where in Oregon? I grew up in Portland) [18:18] bkerensa: how many tshirts do you make each time ? [18:21] 10 to 15 depends on the design (because cost varies by design) [18:22] Cheesehead: They pay directly.... We do not accept any funds :) [18:22] Cheesehead: Our release party will be in Portland at Backspace or Ground Kontrol [18:22] :D [18:23] Cheesehead: However I'm encouraging various other users in rural areas to kickstart Ubuntu Hours [18:25] bkerensa: We're trying to grow Ubuntu Hours across Wisconsin, too. [18:25] ok easier to sponsor a small quantity I suppose :) [18:27] YoBoY: Direct payment from sponsor to vendor has a tax advantage in the US, especially if the sponsored group is not regiesteered with those tax authorities! [18:28] For example, my store sponsored 40 T-shirts for a school class. Direct payment to vendor makes it an "Advertising & Promotion" expense on the tax form. Donation to the school would make it a "Charitable Contribution", for which the audit requirements are quite strict. [18:29] (US only) [18:31] clearly, but I need to find sponsors to make around 150 tshirts, it's a just more difficult :D [18:31] Depends on the advertising budget of the sponsor. [18:32] yes [18:33] Most places I'm familiar with have setup-cost + cost-per-shirt. 150 is doable in my budget every two years or so, and my store is *tiny*. [18:33] Instead of asking one sponsor for 150, ask 15 for 10 tshirts each [18:33] I'm usually more concerned about the shirt quality - lousy thin shirt reflects poorly on us. [18:34] charlie-tca: and my time machine? where is this awesome time machine to let me do that ? :D [18:34] What does the sponsor get? Logo on the back? [18:34] (fear) [18:35] I have them put their logo on the backs, myself. It gives them free advertising for a long time. [18:37] Problem with backside is then you pay double the setup cost. That adds up fast on small orders. [18:37] 150 tshirts, every 6 month, for the volunteers (and with a model for women ;) ) with no other logo than Ubuntu (and just a small ubuntu-fr.org, new team guidelines, the product first) [18:37] this is true, too [18:38] YoBoY: that seems like a lot to ask for [18:38] YoBoY: What about blank shirts, and a button or badge instead of silkscreening? [18:38] Cheesehead: American Apparel Shirts for the win [18:39] Cheesehead: blank shirts ? no fun :] [18:39] Just thinking options. [18:40] American Apparel shirts can be good. My preferred embroiderer/silkscreener uses them. [18:41] our last tshirt http://www.flickr.com/photos/rock-n-pol/5916332733/in/photostream/lightbox/ B&C 150g [18:43] YoBoY: It is surprisingly cheaper to have shirts made ourself then buy from Canonical [18:43] YoBoY: I totally agree that your group is big enough and organized enough to need printed shirts. [18:44] If you want a sponsor to mass-buy all 150, what should they get out of it? [18:44] bkerensa: yes [18:44] I like the photo. Great shirt design! [18:45] Cheesehead: don't know... [18:45] the design is really simple, if you want it, i can give you ^^ [18:45] we have also this black model http://enventelibre.org/t-shirt-ubuntu-noir-special-1010 [18:47] Drat. [18:47] * Cheesehead ducks out for a couple hours [18:53] bkerensa: I asked a discount to buy 150 official lanyard in May, and they responded me they don't do that, it's the store price or nothing ^^ [18:54] yeah [18:54] YoBoY: Did you have to ask Canonical to sell shirts? [18:54] we have an old agreement yes [19:18] and now... I present the Precise Pangolin, destined to become Xubuntu 12.04 LTS [19:19] http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/784 [19:19] s/Xubuntu/Ubuntu [20:37] akgraner: Hi, is it planned to add further information to Chapter 6, ex. giving more info on each on communication means at it's end? [20:38] ashams, there is more information needed for all the chapters [20:38] I was hoping to get chapters 1 and 2 done before UDS so I that there are completed chapters to use to teach me to add stuff to NZR [20:38] bzr even [20:39] will take a look on both [20:39] then I can create a how to based on that - and then everyone will know how to do it [20:40] ashams, please free to add information [20:40] or point to resources you think would be good to use for a chapter [20:41] can I add a new chapter too? I'm thinking of something like case studies describing some problems a team leader may run through and suggested solutions, what you think? [20:41] ashams, proofing and feedback of course is needed too [20:41] I suggest adding case studies to the existing chapters. [20:41] ashams, yep I was think those would be good for appendix information [20:42] (Since that's what I already did) [20:42] gr8 :) [20:42] so make it an appendix - I think one or two in a chapter is fine - others should be in an appendix and in an online resource [20:42] akgraner: yeah, I second this [20:43] but that's just the editor in me - :-) [20:43] case studies on each chapter will take a lot of time, Cheesehead , what you think? [20:43] yes - a lot... [20:44] but that can be added over time [20:44] remember this isn't something that needs to be done all at once [20:44] yes but also keeping in mind that a lot of ppl in a need for this :) [20:45] getting the core information in is important then we just add to it as people can...this way we don't add to much pressure onto those helping - feel free to create Appendix Foo Chapter Bar [20:45] ashams, totally [20:45] ashams: I think akgraner has put together an excellent skeleton for us to flesh out. Whether examples go in a chapter or an appendix is really the editor's preference. [20:45] Since the editor is akgraner, I defer. [20:46] Cheesehead, people can add stuff wherever and in the final stages we can flesh it out [20:46] Hey, I think there's some kind of misunderstanding [20:46] I wasn't talking about examples [20:47] I'm not picky - (yet) :-) I am just excited and encouraged by everyones enthusiasm and willingness to help out [20:47] but, about a a problems that existed locos ran through and possible solutions [20:47] some problems* [20:47] ashams, nods - but the problem is some haven't voiced these problems [20:48] * Cheesehead is confused by the difference [20:48] I mean when things go bad and leaders can't deal with it [20:48] so I am going to ask the loco contacts/ loco council to help document those - I'll cc you on the email if you'd like to help sorting that out [20:48] Cheesehead, some things are this has occurred [20:48] akgraner: sure [20:48] others are this might happen here's how to prepare [20:49] So...examples of things that have gone wrong? [20:49] Cheesehead: yeah [20:49] and how to fix it [20:49] yep [20:49] * Cheesehead seems to understand better now [20:49] :) [20:50] slight difference [20:50] yes, but should we add it to each chapter on somewhere else? [20:50] ashams, I'll work on that over the next day or two [20:50] or* [20:51] let's just add them separately then we can work them into the chapters [20:51] Case studies of that sort are precisely what I hope to bring to the IRC workshops as well [20:51] (as needed) [20:51] aha [20:51] Cheesehead, I love the online workshop ideas [20:51] Always nice to be able to re-use good material [20:52] akgraner: Quick publishing question for you. [20:52] akgraner: When I have time later this week, I plan to get more aggressive about recruiting some trainers. [20:52] Cheesehead, nice! Let me know how I can help :-) I am working on open getting through open week right now [20:53] DarkwingDuck, shoot [20:53] akgraner: when submitting an ad. Does Ubuntu User require the color and percision markers on the edges and corners? [20:54] depends on what it's for...but generally not [20:54] what ad are you submitting - print or online? [20:54] Okay. It's a full page ad for SCALE. :) Want a sneek peek? [20:55] Print I believe. [20:55] ahhh - and of course... [20:56] It's still SVG but, I'm getting it ready for print once it's 100% approved. http://people.ubuntu.com/~david.wonderly/SCaLE10/Ads/UbuntuUser.svg [20:57] DarkwingDuck: it's nice :) [20:58] Thanks. [20:58] NIce [20:58] I have not done any graphic design for almost 10 years. Feels good to get back into it. [20:58] Nice [20:58] I love SCALE [20:58] :D [20:58] Me too. [20:58] it's one of my favorite events to 1) speak at 2) attend 3) interview the planners [20:59] which reminds me I need to submit my talk [20:59] :) I'm doing most of the graphic planning this year. [20:59] that's great [20:59] those folks are an awesome group [20:59] Yes they are. [20:59] You coming in January Amber? [21:00] ashams, back to your question - just create either an appendix or New Chapter [21:00] it's a quick fix no matter how we decide to incorporate and use them. :-) thank you for being willing to work on this part [21:01] DarkwingDuck, yep [21:02] Hoping my talk will get picked up [21:02] akgraner: woot! [21:02] I am submitting a few.... [21:02] akgraner: thanks, I'll create a list of cases on 2-3 next days then start working on them [21:02] too many ideas :-) I want to talk about [21:03] ashams, great! thank you and I'll CC you on the email and tell people you are the POC but that they an drop in here or the mailing list etc - but sometimes just having a POC makes people feel easier with submissions etc [21:04] some people will want to talk about things but may not want their name associated with the problem [21:04] so they will have to know if they ask for confidentially that it will be respected [21:04] (not saying you wouldn't - just mentioning you may get/see some of that) [21:06] np at all, it will be fully respected and handled with care, would you please hint for this in the email? [21:07] just mention that they can reply privately whenever needed [21:08] will do :-) [21:10] thanks [21:33] hey there [21:34] akgraner: ping === DarkwingDuck is now known as Darkwing === Darkwing is now known as DarkwingDuck === DarkwingDuck is now known as Darkwing [23:00] Disney has formally requested that I stop using the trademarked name DarkwingDuck. [23:02] ha your first cease and desist go you! [23:04] :D [23:05] did they write you a letter or something? [23:05] geez [23:05] They called me. [23:06] The standard used to be consumer confusion (see Apple Records v. Apple Computer) [23:07] If you're simply using the name as an online alias, they are just bullying and have no real standing. [23:08] (I am not licensed to practice law in Califonria) [23:08] indeed -- how are you making money from it? [23:08] you aren't [23:09] that said, you have a family and probably don't want to risk legal action [23:09] ugh [23:09] Darkwing isn't trademarked and so I'm using it. [23:10] :D [23:10] Have them mail you a letter, then forward it to your favorite TV stations. [23:10] LOL [23:10] ...purely for the entertainment value, of course. [23:10] Nope.. I dont' want to be a pain. [23:12] Drat. I was going to make you into *real* trademark-defying logo. [23:12] * Cheesehead hits the delete key [23:13] rebels! [23:13] :-P [23:17] against the unholy corporate DRM alliance? [23:17] YEAH [23:18] * Darkwing sighs [23:18] This nick is everywhere. [23:18] GPG, SSH, Wow... [23:19] * Cheesehead debates changing his nick to ScroogeMcDuck [23:20] Or perhaps ScroogeMcDuck{$obscenity} [23:20] * Cheesehead decides to stick to TheHamburglar [23:32] What about DarkwingDuckNotTheDisneyOne ? [23:33] Okay, I'm dropping it. [23:34] LOL!!! [23:34] DarkwingGoose? [23:34] I wonder if I need to do something with darkwingduck.org.... [23:34] Yes, offer to sell it. [23:35] for $10 billion. [23:36] XD [23:37] Honestly, you need change nothing. From your (limited) description, the trademark holders must prove they attempted to enforce it. But they are very unlikely to sue - you are making no money from the trademarked phrase, and there is no consumer confusion [23:37] So they did what they must. [23:38] But that doesn;t mean you must do what they want. [23:39] Sleep tonight unworried by this. It will make a great party story someday, and very likely no more. [23:40] Conversely, they have much to lose. [23:41] Or, I can just change and be a the nice guy :) [23:41] I've actually changed 99% of everything already. [23:41] If they hire you, it would be cheaper than suing you... [23:44] * Cheesehead admits it's easy to be aggressive if your'e not the one staring at an open-ended lawsuit from a multi-billion-dollar corporation [23:45] * Cheesehead would probably do exactly what Darkwing is doing [23:45] hehehe. They didn't threaten me. They actually kinda requested that I change. [23:48] Hopy crud! [23:48] Steve Jobs is dead. [23:49] * Cheesehead offers a respectful moment of silence [23:49] Steve Jobs Dies: Apple Chief Created Personal Computer, iPad, iPod - http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/steve-jobs-apple-ceo-dies/story?id=14383813 [23:50] Say waht you want about methodoligy... He was a true visionary. [23:50] that he was! [23:50] huh [23:56] http://www.apple.com/