itnet7AlanBell: ping00:34
sammmOH NO two of my university modules clash. :(02:04
sammmHazRPG: What shall I do? I can't go to both lectures if they're at the same time02:04
AzelphurStep 1) Record one of them, Step 2) Record the other one too, Step 3) Sit at home with your feet up and watch them while munching popcorn, Step 4) Congratulations you have now beaten university02:04
sammmAzelphur: I have a feeling you aren't taking this seriously.02:05
* Azelphur never takes anything seriously02:05
Azelphurstill, I don't see why you can't just record one and watch it later \o/02:06
HazRPGsammm: you could just check to see if there's an alt. day for the same lecturer/class... that's what I use to do :P02:07
sammmHazRPG: Neither lecture is double taught. :(02:07
* Azelphur has the best approach02:07
Azelphurhigh school dropout \o/02:07
sammmAzelphur: Shhhhh troll02:07
Azelphurmy life isn't a troll :(02:08
sammmHazRPG: I guess I should just drop one of the modules and pick up one which doesn't clash?02:08
HazRPGsammm: Azelphur isn't a troll :/02:08
AzelphurHazRPG: he called my life a troll :(02:08
HazRPGAzelphur: I saws :(02:08
sammmHazRPG: I don't care, he's not helpful02:08
AzelphurI can live with that ^02:08
sammmHazRPG: What do students normally do when they have a timetable clash?02:09
HazRPGsammm: err... look for the alt?02:09
ali1234i only went to about 20% of my lectures in university02:09
sammmHazRPG: Alt lecture? I'm not sure there is one.02:09
HazRPGsame class will be repeated several times in a week for different groups :/02:09
ali1234that's probably why i got a third though02:09
sammmHazRPG: But I can ask my tutor or something if there is.02:09
HazRPGsammm: indeed, or ask them for advise as to what you could do02:10
sammmHazRPG: Okay, I've emailed my tutor and hopefully he'll get back to me later today and give me some solutions.02:10
sammmHazRPG: Yeah, but I can't do that for at least 6 hours02:10
Azelphurali1234: you have higher attendance than me :P02:10
ali1234what are the two modules?02:10
ali1234they probably assumed nobody want to do both of them02:10
sammmali1234: Issues in Macroeconomic Policy and Decision Making in Business02:11
ali1234are they elective modules?02:11
ali1234cos decision making in business sounds like a joke module to me02:11
sammmali1234: I chose it based on the module code02:12
HazRPGali1234: at UCLan, none of the lecturers clashed, it was mainly the practicals/lessons that would clash, but had several different ones of the same thing because there would be about 5-6 different courses with similar modules - tutors don't mind you sitting in on those, as long as you have those modules on your course02:12
sammmReminds me of Battlefield02:12
sammmali1234: And also, it sounds like an easy 10 credits. :)02:12
ali1234at manchester, there were probably clashing lectures, but it wasn't ever possible to pick both clashing modules because you couldn't ever have the prerequisite modules for both02:12
HazRPGsammm: alt. you could just ask your classmates for notes ^_^02:12
HazRPGor ask them to video it for you ^_^02:13
sammmHazRPG: My friend/soon-to-be-fuck-buddy has notes. :)02:13
AzelphurHazRPG: ninjaing my ideas :p02:13
HazRPGAzelphur: don't you know, there's like 134 ninjas in here, 127 of them are failing ;D02:14
Azelphurhttp://demotivationalblog.com/demotivational/2008/09/ninjas-there-are-four-of-them-in-this-picture.jpg \o/02:14
HazRPGCTRL+C or ALT+F4 is the easiest way to be a ninja (quick tip for everyone \o/)02:14
HazRPGAzelphur: haha, exactly like that xD02:15
sammmPressing the power reset button is even easier02:15
sammmAnd faster02:15
sammmUSB takes 8 ms to react02:15
sammmPlus operating system latency02:15
HazRPGwall switch is even easier xD02:16
HazRPGinsta-all off!02:16
sammmI can ninja faster than you because my USB is overclocked :)02:16
HazRPGsammm: I use USB3 ;D02:17
AzelphurI can ninja in more ways than you, I have 102 extra keys ontop of my keyboard02:17
sammmHazRPG: Exploding the sun is even easier because it destroys your computer, the internet, and anyone on the internet02:17
sammmAzelphur: But they take 8ms to do anything02:17
HazRPGdude you both fail, easiest way is dividing by zero02:17
HazRPGits like mega fuuuuuuuu power right there!02:17
sammmHazRPG: What's the polling rate of USB3?02:17
Azelphurwhen in doubt, add more buttons02:18
HazRPG5Gb/s transmission speeds?02:18
sammmMore buttons !=better keyboard02:18
AzelphurI have the Keyboard (G19) and the Gamepad (G19) and the wireless version of the headset (G930), I use a different mouse though :p02:18
sammmHazRPG: Bandwidth and latency are two different things02:18
sammmHazRPG: Gawd, I thought you knew more about this stuff than me02:18
HazRPGsammm: I code...02:19
HazRPGsammm: hardware isn't my forte ^_^02:19
sammmHazRPG: Yay I probably know more about hardware than you :)02:19
Azelphur^ this also applies to me02:19
HazRPGI know the hardware I need, and want... bout it :P02:20
sammmAzelphur: Wireless keyboards, headsets and mice suck02:20
HazRPGif it works, then score \o/02:20
Azelphursammm: the keyboard, mouse and gamepad arn't wireless02:20
HazRPGsammm: I'm sure Azelphur will agree - if it works, then score \o/02:20
AzelphurI opted for a wireless headset because I keep snagging and breaking the cables :)02:21
sammmAzelphur: Added latency and compaction02:21
Azelphuryea, I don't use wireless for input, the only wireless device is the headset02:21
sammmAzelphur: But it's compressed02:21
Azelphurso's any music you ever listen to on a computer anyway02:21
HazRPGsammm: doesn't matter what latency you get from your hardware... it'll all not matter cos your speed between HDD->RAM->CPU will also have slowdowns02:21
ali1234that doesn't matter when you only use it for micspamming on TF2 :)02:21
HazRPGali1234: good point ^_^02:22
Azelphuralso I believe the codec used is lossless anyway02:22
Azelphurso in summary... nope it's great :D02:22
sammmHazRPG: Yes, which is why I turn down graphics02:23
sammmHazRPG: Less load on hardware=higher framerate=less latency02:23
sammm100+ FPS FTW02:23
sammm60 FPS is for scrubs02:23
sammmHazRPG: I'm really going to struggle with my maths this year :(02:23
AzelphurI'm happy with 60, my monitors refresh rate is 60 and I have vsync turned on in most things02:24
ali1234i don't like watching HDTV cos it;s all 30FPS and it looks really juddery02:24
Azelphurand I don't need to turn down my graphics, WoW is quite happy running at 3840x1200 via wine :D02:24
Azelphurali1234: lil02:24
sammmAzelphur: Scrub02:24
Azelphursammm: what games you play?02:24
ali1234would much prefer blurry, but 50fps SDTV any day02:24
HazRPGali1234: heh, indeed02:25
ali1234the picture on TV shows was much better back in the day02:25
ali1234back when live meant live02:25
ali1234not stuffed through a mpeg encoder02:25
sammmAzelphur: Counter Strike, Dota, CoD402:26
Azelphursammm: used to do CS:S now I'm a TF2 person :)02:26
HazRPGAzelphur: my monitor only does 72Hz, or so... so anything more than that is a waste really02:26
sammmAzelphur: TF2 can be fun02:26
AzelphurI play WoW and Minecraft too, fun fun02:26
daftykinsHazRPG: C...R...T D: ?02:26
sammmAzelphur: Lame games02:26
sammmAzelphur: Guild Wars>WoW and anything>Minecraft02:27
AzelphurI played guild wars and didn't much like it tbh02:27
AzelphurI played all the way up to max level and got bored and left it02:27
sammmAzelphur: Why not?02:27
sammmAzelphur: The game takes more skill02:27
sammmAzelphur: It's not an MMORPG02:27
AzelphurI didn't find anything to do at max level02:27
sammmAzelphur: It's a competitive third-person action fighting game02:28
sammmAzelphur: Compete in tournaments02:28
Azelphur*shrug* You can do that in WoW anyway?02:28
ali1234WoW does suck02:28
HazRPGdaftykins: nope... TFT (possibly LCD?)02:28
sammmAzelphur: Not really, WoW is just about who has the highest numbers on their axe02:28
ali1234but then so does guild wars02:28
sammmAzelphur: And who is highest level and has best gear02:28
ali1234and all FPS games02:28
daftykinsHazRPG: ah. not really refresh rates then02:28
Azelphursammm: that's actually really wrong lol02:28
sammmAzelphur: And who has the most unbalanced setups02:29
daftykins72 is odd though 0o02:29
sammmAzelphur: Shhhhh troll02:29
AzelphurI actually play the game, unlike you guys clearly :p02:29
Azelphurbut the fact is is that in PvE someone that knows the tactics, and knows how to play their class, is far better/more useful than someone who is geared02:29
Azelphurand the two often don't come hand in hand02:29
sammmAzelphur: PvE scrub02:30
ali1234the problem with WoW is the whole world is so locked down you can't do anything interesting02:30
HazRPGdaftykins: ah, my old monitor was 72Hz, seems these ones are 60.02Hz according to NVIDIA X Server Settings...02:30
Azelphurnah, I'm a PvP scrub too, I beat a level 60 guy when I was level 40 once :p02:30
Azelphurand I used to take out people that was better geared than me all the time, although now I actually have gear so it's a faceroll most of the time :P02:31
Azelphurbut yea, gear is a factor, but gear is as much of a factor as knowing your class, and having decent reaction times is too02:31
Azelphurany one is useless without the others.02:31
HazRPGAzelphur: much agreed!02:32
HazRPGI currently play SC2... and well, I hate it when people say "such and such race is so OP!" when its not really true...02:33
ali1234of course it's not true02:33
ali1234people never say that when it is actually true02:33
HazRPGwhen said player has an APM of around 15 average :/02:33
ali1234over powered02:34
HazRPGtrying to beat someone who has APM of 70-80 odd APM02:34
HazRPGali1234: beat me to it :P02:34
AzelphurI'm quite good at WoW, Currently I'm the ranked the 38th mage on my server :p02:34
ali1234if they really think that race is over powered, why don't they just play it?02:34
ali1234but here's the thing02:34
ali1234having every team exactly equal makes a boring game02:35
HazRPGali1234: that's what I always tell them, and their excuse "don't like that race..." lol02:35
Azelphur^ this too02:35
ali1234it;s like when you're playing street fighter02:35
ali1234everyone complains ryu is over powered02:35
ali1234then you thrash them with e honda02:35
ali1234and then they have nothing to say02:36
* Azelphur is an akuma pro02:36
HazRPGhowever, in things like SC2, each race is /roughly/ equal... however, the order in which things are built, or the order of when you can get the same type of units vary considerably02:36
ali1234lol, akuma is deliberately over powered, he's a boss damnit :)02:36
ali1234you need characters like that too02:36
Azelphursome days I'll go into 2v2's and have my ass handed to me, other days I'll go in and we'll kill them, laugh, resurrect them and kill them again02:36
Azelphur(Actually did that once, so funny)02:36
ali1234apparently street fighter has changed a lot since i last played it02:37
Azelphurali1234: yea, it's going the way of sonic02:37
Azelphurthe latest street fighter is seriously like playing in slow mo02:37
Azelphurand they jump less distance than my grandma can.02:37
ali1234so like tekken then?02:38
HazRPGsf4 isn't fun imho... bought it, wished I didn't... tried to sell it on... but would have gotten much less than I paid for it (even though I only had it about a month)... so I kept it regardless, but its collecting dust :/02:38
Azelphurali1234: yea pretty much02:38
Azelphursf4 is collecting dust in my steam account, doesn't even work in Linux :(02:38
Azelphurinstalled vista on my laptop just to try it, it made me a sad panda.02:38
ali1234marvel vs capcom is the best street fighter game02:38
ali1234on dreamcast ofc02:39
HazRPGali1234: ofc! I still own both those \o/02:39
ali1234my dreamcast broke :(02:39
Azelphurmine did too02:40
Azelphurit keeps rebooting itself02:40
* HazRPG stares at his DC to the left of me connected to my old CRT TV :)02:40
ali1234you can connect them to VGA you know02:40
AzelphurI'm going the way of emulation with everything console now anyway02:40
Azelphurgot rid of most of my old consoles02:40
HazRPGali1234: I know... this is just more old-school for me02:40
ali1234DC emulators don't work :(02:40
ali1234even gamecube emulators work better02:40
ali1234even wii emulators...02:41
HazRPGali1234: if your talking about linux emulators... yeah, sadly ;(02:41
Azelphurdolphin works quite well from what I've heard02:41
Azelphurdolphin sounds pretty awesome02:41
ali1234yeah it works well02:41
ali1234can't run at full speed on my system though02:41
HazRPGali1234: there's a few windows DC emulators that work well - but not for all games :(02:41
ali1234it keeps improving though02:42
HazRPGI looked into DC emu's for linux... and so far I haven't gotten any of them to do anything but boot the BIOS02:42
ali1234i got powerstone working, just, with slightly messed up graphics02:42
ali1234and messed up sound02:43
ali1234and bad framerate02:43
ali1234but it was just about playable02:43
HazRPGI never understood why the DC died so abruptly like that... I mean so much work into the emu's went well... until like early to mid 2000... and then just halted :/02:44
daftykinsperhaps crow syndrome took over02:45
daftykins"oh look, new shiny thing!"02:45
daftykinsi remember seeing that DC-on-a-PCI-card02:45
HazRPGdaftykins: oh?02:48
daftykinsyeah, i'd have guessed it was for devs but i think it came years after02:52
sammmHazRPG: Are you any good at maths?03:16
HazRPGsammm: erm... use to be at school/college, why?03:17
ballHazRPN <- calculator joke ;-)03:18
sammmHazRPG: Just wondering03:18
daftykinsnn all o/03:18
sammmHazRPG: You're my friend :)03:18
daftykinsdon't stay up too... much earlier 0o03:18
HazRPGdaftykins: night dude \o03:18
HazRPGball: ^_^03:19
AlanBellitnet7: hi05:51
brobostigonmorning everyone.06:55
imexilAnyone already on 11.10 beta? I'm struggeling to find the font and colour settings to modify the theme07:01
MartijnVdSyou can't?07:08
imexilwell the buttons for modifying a theme are gone07:11
imexilYou can only choose from a list of predefined settings but no change of the fonts or colours. I guess the settings are still there somewhere but now hidden from the user :(07:12
* popey sighs at sammm last night07:20
imexilPerhaps somebody know what the actually app is called that normally takes care of changing theme fonts etc. That way I could directly launch that instead of relying on the new settings interface which doesn't give me the options I'm looking for.07:23
popeyi dont think such an app exists in the default install07:25
popeyit maybe you have to (for now) fiddle with xml files07:25
imexilAnd I thought Unity was getting better ;)07:26
popey"patches welcome" as they say07:28
imexilWell I'm on the user side so it's hard to provide a patch.07:28
imexilOn the other hand, some one must have removed that funcionality on purpose without an alternative ... :( that way users get stuck in their workings07:29
imexilOK enough complains, I just hoped someone might know how to access the settings even in the new Unity07:30
AlanBellimexil: I suspect that is a gnome thing rather than a unity thing07:31
imexilRight. But that doesn't help me either ;)07:32
gordonjcpimexil: the real answer is to switch to XFCE4 until either gnome or unity are usable07:32
AlanBelltrue enough07:32
imexilWell that was the option for 11.04 but I thought should no longer be necessary for 11.1007:33
popeyho ho ho07:33
imexilSo why do they "force" all users to Unitiy already in 11.10 again? :)07:34
MartijnVdSNobody is forced.07:34
gordonjcpevery so often I try unity but I just can't work with it07:34
popeyindeed, hence the scare quotes07:34
imexilThe thing is, I like dog fooding. So when I migrated my wife to Unity in 11.04 I also like to stay on that one even though I might be more comfortable with XFCE etc. This is purely for support reasons (she likes the interface).07:36
AlanBellmy kids seem to cope with the interface just fine07:36
imexilBut I also need to be able to do some customisations which I can no longer do in 11.1007:37
imexilAlanBell: which one Unity of XFCE?07:37
popeyimexil: you can do07:37
popeyimexil: you just do it in a different way07:37
imexilhence my original question... where can I find it now :)07:38
gordonjcpAlanBell: right, but presumably they haven't been using Unix desktops for 20 years07:38
popeyimexil: well, you didnt actually tell us what setting you wanted to change07:39
imexilI need to change the background colour of text boxes since some qt apps don't work properly07:39
popeyisnt that a qt theme setting?07:39
imexilwell in the past it was simply via "rightclick on desktop --> change background --> modify theme etc"07:40
imexiland that helped07:40
popeythat probably fiddles something in gconf / gsettings07:41
imexilI'm not saying that it is not the fault of the qt app but at least changing the background colour helped in the past07:41
popeyhey ikonia you know that thing that you said I 'liked' on facebook. i see you 'like' it.07:42
popeymarked as spam07:42
imexilAnd you think the tool to do this without knowing html colour codes is gone?07:43
popeypass. i am not at an ubuntu machine so cant look07:44
imexilok. Well I try to copy the colour code of "text_color" to "tooltip_fg_colo" (this is the actually setting I needed to change) and just hope I don't have to explain to a Windows/mac user what I had to do to get my tool tips back ;)07:46
hoovergood morning07:57
czajkowskiGood morning all08:09
selinuxiummorning czajkowski   o/08:15
bigcalmGood morning czajkowski and other awake peeps08:15
selinuxiumMorning all    o/08:15
DJonesOff topic windows question, does anybody know if its possible to install IE8 alongside IE9 on windows 708:21
bigcalmDJones: add 'standalone' to your search terms08:23
DJonesThanks, looking now, from what else I've read though, IE9 seems to replace IE8 regardless08:25
bigcalmPretty much, yes08:27
DJones*%$**&$£ system, browser based database/finance/etc system, only works in IE6/7/808:28
* DJones looks for firefox & user agent switcher08:29
DJonesbigcalm: No need to be so polite about it, I'm not happy with it08:31
JamesTaitMorning all!08:32
oimonhas a question about IRL...08:33
oimonif you friends parent dies and you are sending a sympathy card to him and his remaining parent, how would you address it?08:33
oimonto fred + mrs bloggs? to fred?08:34
popeyi would send to fred08:34
popeyand mention we're thinking of him and his family08:34
oimonhe also lives with his mum. don't know if that changes stuff08:35
popeydo you know her at all?08:35
oimonsounds sensible08:35
oimonnot really08:35
bigcalmSend to Fred then08:35
oimoncheers guys08:35
bigcalmI hope his name is Fred08:36
oimongoig to the funeral aswell i think :-\ time to learn this etiquette thing08:36
popeyluckily I haven't been to a funeral for years08:36
oimoni've only ever been to 2 , one each for granparents08:37
popeyguess we all go to more as we get older08:37
oimonsorry for depressing everyone!08:38
oimonnew subject08:38
bigcalmKittens please08:38
oimonnext best thing:08:38
bigcalmSomething for web devs: http://placekitten.com/08:38
* popey has a migrane08:38
oimona doggy that watches TV http://ubuntuone.com/4lPPF5NDswRaneNKEHtqZc08:39
oimonMr Benn to be exact08:39
* popey sings the mr benn theme to himself08:39
TheOpenSourcererHope it clears soon popey - I have never had one myself but those I know who get them make it sound really nasty.08:39
oimonit was the pirate episode08:39
popeyis that an hp touchpad?08:40
oimonpopey: yes08:40
oimonmy son loves it08:40
oimonits a great childrens entertainment device08:40
TheOpenSourcererThought this was quite funny: http://news.techeye.net/mobile/apples-iphone-4s-a-lemon Apple fanboys need not read it.08:41
popeyhaha, trolololo08:42
popey"antenna which dropped a phone call when you touched it,08:42
TheOpenSourcerer"you get locked into Steve Jobs' Walled Garden of Delights which is like  being jailed for life in Disneyland in a Kafkaesque nightmare.08:42
TheOpenSourcererRead more:  http://news.techeye.net/mobile/apples-iphone-4s-a-lemon#ixzz1ZtYCc78D"08:42
popeyonly people who _dont_ have an iphone4 repeat that line over and over08:42
popeyi have one, my wife has one, about 5 people in my office have one, none of us suffer from dropped calls the way anti-apple people claim08:43
oimonphone calls? wow i remember those08:43
TheOpenSourcerer(09:41:25) TheOpenSourcerer: ... Apple fanboys need not read it.08:44
* popey sighs08:44
oimonsome swine nicked my choc milkshake from the office fridge :(08:44
popeyget tired of being called an apple fanboy08:44
MyrttiI cant believe people still care what phone others have08:46
DJonesIf it works and does what you want, its the ideal phone for you08:46
AlanBellmy blackberry is not working http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAG39jKi0lI08:46
oimonhas anyone else noticed a reduction in facebook traffic since their changes last fortnight ago? either less of my "friends" using it or i'm seeing less updates08:47
shaunoI've noticed that I miss the vast majority of updates unless I pull people's pages up one by one.  which is a bit of a pain, since my family use it for most their communications now :/08:48
DJonesMy mother-in-law has the cheapest, simplest mobile phone going, big buttons, she makes & receives calls, sends & receives texts. Thats all she wants08:48
oimonshauno: since the changes?08:48
shaunooimon: yeah.  since they decided it's up to them to decide what's news-worthy and what isn't08:48
oimoni thought i saw an option to subscribe to all of a person's updates, but you could only do that on a one-by-one basis08:48
popey\o/ Jabber08:50
MattJJabber \o/08:50
* MattJ is back from an IRC holiday08:50
popeyDid you go anywhere nice?08:51
MattJNew York08:51
MattJThough I'm not convinced about the "nice", I'm glad to be back :P08:51
* MattJ adds popey08:51
MattJ</joke> (I stopped using ICQ years ago)08:52
oimontbh i'm surprised that irc still works ;)08:52
DJonesoimon: I only see facebook updates via gwibber at home08:52
Seeker`Jabber \o/08:54
MattJJabber \o/08:54
TheOpenSourcererOuch - http://piana.eu/08:55
MartijnVdSThat page offends me. Now it has to go offline.09:03
MartijnVdSoimon: new (proposed?) italian law that demands that stuff gets taken down if it's offensive, even if it's true09:04
MartijnVdSi.e. censor ALL THE THINGS09:05
popeyyou're offending me09:05
* popey shuts down freenode09:05
oimon"offensive" is subjective09:05
MartijnVdSoimon: Exactly09:05
* gord crosses fingers and hopes pulse will play nice after an upgrade09:05
gordwhy is pulse still so crap :(09:06
oimoni wonder if the vatican comes under italian juridisction09:06
AlanBellno, it doesn't09:07
shaunoisn't the sensible answer to simply not host it.wp in italy?09:07
AlanBelloimon: it has italian law forked as of 192909:08
MartijnVdSBefore fiddling with young boys was illegal?09:09
AlanBellfunnily enough, the age of consent in the Vatican is 1209:09
oimonthere's lots of bribes and stuff to pass around in the italian parliament before any law is made anyway09:09
TheOpenSourcererYou are joking? AlanBell09:10
oimon"As a result, the age of consent is 14, the same as Italy's."09:10
* AlanBell blames Stephen Fry09:13
shaunoseems that's relatively recent; as of 1st jan 200909:13
davmor2morning all09:50
bigcalmMorning davmor209:52
davmor2bigcalm: so we'll all met up in the coffee shop I think will be the easiest09:53
davmor2bigcalm: in through the main door up into the main area and then it's on the right09:54
bigcalmdavmor2: perfect09:55
gordare you guys having a secret meeting without me? because that is mean09:55
davmor2gord: if you lived closer you'd be expected to turn up09:56
gordyou should always be expecting gord, to do otherwise would be a fatal mistake09:56
gordonjcpno-one expects the... oh.09:57
davmor2gord: the lighthouse where LRL was for a couple of years has a basically disused works space area we thought we'd start using it once a month-ish and then they can publicise it etc we'll see how it goes09:58
bigcalmI'm relying upon a lift from my lovely lady in the morning to get to the train station. If she is awake in time, I can get the 08:08 train and be in for 08:36. If not, then it'll be the 08:51 and be in for 09:08 :S09:59
bigcalmConsidering that she doesn't usually leave the house until 08:10, I will have to be extra nice to her tonight09:59
davmor2bigcalm: nice10:00
bigcalmI'd rather be on time for the 1st meeting10:01
bigcalmIf this works out, are we looking for it to be a monthly thing?10:01
gordonjcpwhat's it a meeting about?10:02
davmor2bigcalm: yeap I think that was the general plan meet up once a month probably always a on Thursday10:02
davmor2gordonjcp: nope just meet up and do you're normal day job but from there instead of at home10:02
bigcalmSeems resonable10:02
gordonjcpdavmor2: oh, instead of working from home10:03
gordonjcpyeah, that's a really neat idea10:03
bigcalmTold my boss about it and he thinks it's a great idea. I wonder if I can get him to pay the train fair ;)10:03
gordonjcpI bet mine won't10:03
davmor2gordonjcp, bigcalm: hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha10:03
bigcalm7.10 for a return fair. Think I can afford that10:05
bigcalmBah, Synergy doesn't transmit shift + 310:05
bigcalmOr shift + `10:05
selinuxiumHmmm linux.com has been down for days...10:20
AlanBellanyone want to go to a potentially interesting interactive workshop with the Cabinet Office transparency team on Monday in Whitehall?10:31
AlanBellit relates to this in some way -> http://data.gov.uk/opendataconsultation10:31
AlanBellmonday afternoon, 1pm-4pm10:32
czajkowskiAlanBell: tempting but I'd likely throttle people10:35
AlanBellooh please go!10:35
davmor2czajkowski: prod10:36
davmor2czajkowski: you throttle mp's you need to go :)10:36
AlanBellthis will just be civil servants to throttle10:37
czajkowskiAlanBell: not what I had in mind10:37
czajkowskidavmor2: do not poke me I'm liable to kill10:37
czajkowskiwindows ate all my pencil work10:37
czajkowskiMost flipping annoying10:37
davmor2Yeah but you used windows that was your first mistake :P10:38
bigcalmdavmor2: I need you to stay alive until at least Friday. Please be careful :P10:39
AlanBelldavmor2: are you coming down for the replease?10:39
davmor2czajkowski: here have a biscuit and remember to save every change you make as you make it10:39
davmor2AlanBell: I'm hoping too just depends on funds currently10:39
davmor2AlanBell: besides someone needs to be there to rag on czajkowski :D10:40
* AlanBell looks up the verb to rag10:40
AlanBell6. break into lumps before sorting10:41
davmor2AlanBell: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=rag%20on10:42
bigcalmThe urban dictionary does amuse me, but the language used in some of the meanings is less than pleasant when it doesn't need to be10:43
bigcalmThe Imperial is in Wolverhampton. How will I resist tomorrow?10:44
kirrusbigcalm: you're doomed.10:44
bigcalmkirrus: my wallet and weight are, yes10:44
czajkowskidavmor2: you must be due a millbank invasion soon10:45
czajkowskiI will remember10:45
czajkowskiand I will throttle you10:45
bigcalmHappy families :)10:46
czajkowskibigcalm: look when we're nice to one another it freaks people out10:52
czajkowskiit's best to be consistent if nothing else10:52
brobostigonafternoonings GirlyGirl11:22
DJonesArghhhh. Comment from new system developers, the reason its not working well is because your computers aren't up to required standards.......OK, that would explain why the 6 year old P4, 512Mb ram runs the system perfectly, but the 6 month old i5, 4Gb ram machines take 5 minutes to connect to the system.....11:48
davmor2czajkowski: indeed there is also a testing meeting on the 13th too that might be interesting11:50
davmor2czajkowski: MooDoo is the one you need down Soufff anyway being as he still owes you a drink11:50
gordi don't quite get why there are so many people that suggest you use mint whenever anyone suggests ubuntu11:55
oimongord: mainly kids i guess :)11:59
oimonis there something you can suggest in return thats "cooler" or better than mint?11:59
gordmaybe i should make a derivative of mint that just changes the background to blue, call it "cool mint"12:00
oimonmint ice :P12:01
GirlyGirlgord: I've seen those a lot ... mainly directed at people who like the Gnome 2x look12:01
GirlyGirlover unity and shell that is12:01
GirlyGirlI think mint does not have unity12:01
oimonthere's really only one showstopper for me using unity :(12:02
GirlyGirloimon: What would that be?12:03
oimonGirlyGirl: quicklist support for showing open terminal windows like docky does. i usually have 30-50 open and the expose view just isn't useful for that many. tabbed terminal and terminator don't cut it either12:05
GirlyGirloimon: So what DE do you use then?12:05
oimongnome2 right now12:05
GirlyGirloimon: What is this docky thing?12:06
* GirlyGirl has no idea how docky works being a long time kde user12:06
oimonit's a launcher/dock a bit like the unity one.12:06
oimonmost other docks have the same functionality.12:07
oimoni need a dock because the window chooser on the gnome panel becomes . . . . . instead of descriptions when you have a lot12:08
GirlyGirloimon: What about windows 7 style icon only indicators12:09
oimonGirlyGirl: not sure what they are12:09
popeywhy do you have so many open?12:09
GirlyGirloimon: Like this http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/291/snapshothd.png/ (see the kde bar)12:12
oimonpopey: getting things done, multitasking etc12:13
popeyyou have at least 4 there on the same box12:14
GirlyGirloimon: Can't you use tabs12:14
popeysurely screen is more efficient?12:14
popeyin fact there's about 10 on one box12:14
oimonthat's my own box12:15
oimonthe rest are servers and user's boxes12:15
oimonthis is a typical use case for many sysadmins12:15
popeysysadmins who don't know screen ☺12:15
oimonscreen has its uses12:15
gordi think having eight billion items in a quicklist is the optimal solution here :)12:15
gordis not *12:16
gordenglish sucks :(12:16
oimongord: it's dynamic though12:16
Seeker`it looks like oimon is doing it....oh....whats the word12:16
gorda tab completable screen instance sounds like a better idea12:16
Seeker`ah, thats it, "wrong"12:16
popeyi was learning english at school yesterday12:16
popeyjolly phonics12:17
gordso say you wanted to get to foo@rawr:/home/bar you'd just do <somekeyboarcombination>:fo<tab>/ho<tab> and get there12:17
oimonthis quicklist shows me all the terminal windows i have open on my box currently12:17
oimonthey aren't shortcuts for getting to boxes, they are windows12:18
gordyup, you are very used to the way you do things now, i get that12:18
popeyi still fail to see why you need 10 local terminals12:18
popeyone and the CTRL+A, C.12:18
popey*bam* new window12:18
oimontailing logs, running pings, copying files,12:18
oimoncopy pasting12:18
GirlyGirloimon: Tabs??12:19
Seeker`popey: or terminator (if that still exists)12:19
popeyok I will rephrase12:19
popeyi still fail to see why you have 10 shells in completely separate windows12:19
gordbut say you had a screen instance, which has all your ssh sessions you setup, going everywhere, then got around them using tab completion, it sounds like a much easier way of handing the same problem without changing your ui12:19
Seeker`screen also means that if you accidentally close the window, you can still get your windows back12:19
gordthis would be why people for example, get around irssi with numbers, instead of having one window open per channel they go to, because that would be a pain for all infolved12:19
oimoni can see why some people do that, but having multiple windows open is easier12:19
oimonespecially for comparing data and copy pasting12:20
Seeker`oimon: terminator12:20
popey\o/ split screen12:20
oimondoesn't work for 30 windows12:20
oimoni've tried12:20
* oimon wonders where all the sysadmins are to back me up12:20
* popey notes that he is a sysadmin12:20
popeydont think that just because you do this and you're a sysadmin, and I don't, that I'm not one12:21
popeywe have ~200 boxes I ssh to12:21
popeyhaving 200 windows open is nuts12:21
popeyoooo, it's time for the watch wallpaper!12:22
GirlyGirloimon: popey: The IE6 way lol12:22
gordwatch wallpaper?12:22
* BigRedS is a sysadmin using terminator + screen12:22
BigRedSI tend to have a few xterms knocking around, but only from when I'm imatiently wanting to host or dig something12:23
popeygord: the new wallpapers in 11.1012:23
popeythe watch one is lovely12:23
popeydunno if that will work12:24
popeybah, no12:25
oimontabs kind of solves the problem because you can click tabs and see a list of open sessions. but you get an ugly row of tabs12:26
GirlyGirloimon: Your way you get an ugly list on the dock12:29
gordoooh right yeah12:29
gordi'v only really checked out the new wallpapers fleetingly to check my colour matching code worked with them12:29
BigRedSI have that row at the bottom of screen with all my screens on it, terminator split so it's mostly that screen session, with a box for irc and a box for a local shell, and sometimes tabs, too, if I'm feeling particularly perverse12:29
Seeker`gord: colour matching code?12:30
popeySeeker`: the launcher and dash background changes colour based on the desktop12:32
popeyits quite nice12:32
GirlyGirlScared to go on #ubuntu now, yesterday this guy sends me the danger command by pm when I never asked him anything and then goes and complains to ops that I sent him the command12:34
BigRedSthe danger command?12:34
popeydont make a big deal out of it, and go in and help people12:34
popeyor get helped12:34
popeyBigRedS: rm with /12:35
Seeker`I think there are a few things that prompt a !danger response12:35
Seeker`I think triggering it for rm with / is superfluous now, isn't it?12:35
BigRedSyeah, it doesn't let you12:36
popeyGirlyGirl: as I said, move on, go in and help or dont, dont make a big deal out of it12:36
GirlyGirlpopey: I will12:36
BigRedSI always read that as 'I R clogs'...12:36
* popey puts his wood shoes on12:36
shaunogetting a good chuckle out of popey being a fanboi ;)12:40
Seeker`anyone that doesn't hate apple is a fanboi?12:41
Seeker`Or are you talking about his love for clogs?12:41
popeymmmm clogs12:41
oimoninfra red clogs12:42
shaunoI gotta say you're not very good at it.  we need to sort that podcast out for a start.  nowhere near enough apple there12:42
Seeker`the people that are complaining that they should have done a "5" instead of a "4s" are only annoyed because it has the same case so people can't see they have the latest/greatest from a mile off12:42
popeyonce ios5 comes out I'll probably slap ubuntu on the kitchen computer12:43
popeymaybe :D12:43
shaunoI'm kinda glad they only went with the S.  for once, I don't feel so oddly compelled to run out and throw my money at them12:43
Seeker`and the people that are saying "zomg galaxy s ii" don't get the point that an iphone works well for me, does everything I need/want it to, at a price I am willing to pay12:43
popeybut you're directly funding terrorism!12:44
popeyI mean, Apple12:44
popeyNo, wait.12:44
popeynever mind.12:44
Seeker`shauno: it's kinda obvious they are doing an intel-esque tick-tock routine atm. Given that phone contracts are at least 18 months long atm, they don't really expect people will be buying a new phone every year12:44
popeysome do12:44
shaunomostly just getting kicks out of it because I sit in more than one mac-orientated channel.  so popey is *tame* compared to what I'm used to12:44
brobostigonout of curiosity, how much does a recent iphone cost, network free, and unlocked?12:45
Seeker`popey: some do, but they are the people that will buy them whatever they produce12:45
shaunocontract/simlock free, I think around the 750 euro mark12:45
brobostigonshauno: nothing at all, so i can use my current sim in it?12:45
popeySeeker`: see, i disagree with that12:45
oimondidn't apple ban giveaways of their products in case it damaged the "reassuringly expensive" element of their brand?12:46
Seeker`they just need to do an appearance refresh one year and a hardware refresh the next. That way people that upgrade every other model when their contract expires12:46
shaunobrobostigon, yup, as required by law in a small handful of european countries12:46
brobostigonshauno: so with both those conditions being true, handset alone, £750~ ?12:46
shaunoI believe so.  haven't looked for over a year12:47
brobostigonthat is pretty expensive.12:47
popeyiphone 3gs is 320 quid12:47
brobostigonoh, i see.12:47
popeyiphone 4 is 429 unlocked12:47
popeybrobostigon: he said 750 EUR, not GBP12:47
brobostigonah, thats alot of difference.12:47
brobostigonpopey: ah, i misunderstood.12:48
oimonhtc desire S sim free £30912:48
brobostigonsorry shauno .12:48
davmor2popey: Iphone 5 then is 520-ish quid then yes?12:48
Seeker`popey: There are people that will upgrade every year regardless. There are also people that will upgrade every time if they change their appearance, and there are people (probably companies) that don't "care" about the cost of buying out contracts / spend enough to be able to upgrade their contracts nearly12:48
popey4S, not 512:48
shaunoI was looking around 700-750 when the 4 was new.  and I was specifically looking for factory unlocked instead of aftermarket.  just offering it as the only pricepoint I found (for those conditions)12:48
davmor2popey: I was going by the number and the general change to the first digit :)12:49
popeyyeah, i got my iphone4 unlocked direct from apple12:49
oimonbecause you're a known fanboi :)12:49
popeybecause I already had a contract12:49
popeybut lets not let facts get in the way12:49
popeysilly facts12:49
shaunoI think at the time I could only find orange.fr and one other .. I think belgian or dutch?12:50
Seeker`hey miss Myrtti12:50
davmor2popey: The Samsung Galaxy II isn't that much nor the Moto Atrix, nor some of the tablets you can get infact12:51
popeythinking about it, I am due for a free upgrade soon12:51
* popey phones orange12:51
gordgeez iphones are damn expensive for what they are12:52
gordwonder how much it costs them to produce12:52
gordwonder if the packaging costs more ;)12:52
davmor2gord: £20 and a whip12:52
DJonespopey: Up/down-grade to an Xperia Play to give you minecraft pocket edition :)12:52
MyrttiSeeker`: ohai12:53
oimonif you open a packet of crisps and find they are stale, do you carry eating?12:53
popeyi tend not to12:54
popeyjust because i dont like soft crisps12:54
oimoni nearly always do, but then eat another packet to erase the memory12:54
oimonstale niknaks are actually OK if a little polystyreney12:54
popeyi want crisps now12:55
* popey goes to the cupboard and will return with crisps12:56
popeyand a candle, some chalk and a chicken to sacrifice to damn oimon12:56
gordman... why don't i keep crisps in my cupboards12:56
oimoni have another unopened 10 pack of nik naks12:56
davmor2gord: you do it's just you eat them12:56
gorddavmor2, those don't even make it to the cupboard :P12:57
* oimon also has harbio12:59
shaunohm, unlocked from apple is 500eur for the 8GB model here.  that probably explains my 200eur gap; I went for the 3212:59
popey\o/ pringles & dips13:02
popeyhim and his crazy eur currency13:03
shaunoit was like that when I got here :/13:04
oimonindian $35 tablet news: http://www.ndtv.com/article/technology/basics-of-worlds-cheapest-tablet-aakash-13884313:04
brobostigonvery weird, my phone reports acceleration, when it is stationary on my lap.13:04
shaunoaltho I dare say if they were still using the irish pound, it'd make the conversation even more confusing13:04
oimonbrobostigon: gravity is acceleration towards the centre of the earth13:05
Seeker`brobostigon: is it reporting 1g downwards?13:05
brobostigonSeeker`: .18 g13:05
brobostigonoimon: yes, that i knew, but if it is standing still, then why is it reporting such.13:06
MartijnVdSbrobostigon: because it can't know the difference13:07
MartijnVdS"We" (humans) don't know of a way to distinguish between "acceleration" and "gravity"13:07
MartijnVdSbrobostigon: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/198982/how-to-do-gesture-recognition-using-accelerometers13:08
brobostigonso it is reporting acceleration, even if it stationary. because it cant tell the difference, between being in acceleration and being staionary?13:08
oimonmaybe your house is in freefall right now13:09
MartijnVdSor that ;)13:09
Seeker`brobostigon: there is a downwards force acting on it, is there not?13:09
MartijnVdSbrobostigon: check the stackoverflow link13:09
brobostigonSeeker`: correct, yes,13:09
brobostigonMartijnVdS: i am doing so. :13:09
Seeker`and force = mass x acceleration?13:09
MartijnVdSyou can deduce orientation from the gravity vector :)13:09
MartijnVdS(because you _know_ gravity)13:10
MartijnVdS(unless you plan on moving between planets/moons often)\13:10
MartijnVdS(and even then, you could detect the change from the local GPS environment, and update the "g" constant)13:10
MartijnVdS("Moon-GPS", "Mars-GPS" etc)13:10
popeyMartijnVdS: we considered moving to mars. the moving costs were fine but the atmosphere stinks13:11
brobostigonMartijnVdS: minute, i am reading that link.13:11
MartijnVdSpopey: 8-)13:11
oimonthe bandwidth  is probably a bit ropey too13:12
shaunoI'd imagine their latency would be on par with ntl's :/13:12
ubuntuuk-planet[Dave Morris] Ubuntu and Android for whole house audio - http://davemorris.wordpress.com/2011/10/05/ubuntu-and-android-for-whole-house-audio/13:17
brobostigonMartijnVdS: that was a good read. it makes sense now.13:32
* AlanBell is heading into london soonish14:05
czajkowskiwhy the invasion14:05
AlanBellOpenERP partner community meetup14:05
AlanBellWaxy O Connors14:05
czajkowskiAlanBell: TAYTOS!!!!!14:07
AlanBellyeah, and water at £5.50 a bottle14:07
czajkowskiAlanBell: dont have water14:08
AlanBelldon't worry, I will stick to the black stuff14:08
AlanBellgood, and I hope Apple retaliate14:10
AlanBellinjunctions are good for making people realise that the patent system is broken and not working in the interest of society14:11
czajkowskihmm how do I get a p60 when the company will not send me one I want to claim my tax back14:11
AlanBellwait for the tax return, it will all come out in the wash14:12
czajkowskithe what ?14:12
AlanBellself assessment tax return, you fill out everything on that, takes ages and you get a refund14:13
AlanBellI think you can ask for one of them if you don't get sent one14:14
DJonesAlanBell: Don't always get a tax return if you only have salaried employment though14:15
AlanBellyou can ask for one though14:15
oimonp60 only contains a summary of information that has been supplied on your payslips though?14:16
czajkowskioimon: which I need to send to HRM or a letter of earnings on headed notepaper to claim my tax back14:16
czajkowskime giving my payslips doesnt count for sugar14:16
oimonah :-(14:16
DJonesczajkowski: Just realised, a P60 is only issued at the end of the tax year14:16
oimonmy employer has gone electronic with payslips and p60 in their wisdon14:17
czajkowskiDJones: aye last May14:17
oimonthey should send a p45 when you left tho14:17
DJonesInfo should be on the P4514:17
czajkowskiwhich I never got a copy of14:18
czajkowskipoh I could g on14:18
czajkowskibut I cant drink atm as not at work14:18
DJonesAre you able to request a duplicate of the P45? I'm guessing not14:18
czajkowskithen I went on job seekers so got a P45 from them for here so am ok in that regard14:19
czajkowskijust got a letter from them saying they want to give me tax back but need my p6014:19
czajkowskiand around in circles I go14:19
DJonesMust admit, I've never seen a company send out a P60 for an employee thats previously had a P4514:20
czajkowskiDJones: you still get one and technically I was thre when a P60 should ahve been issued before i left by about a week14:20
DJonesRight, so this is tax for a prior year before the P45 was issued14:21
czajkowskiDJones: mind if I pm14:22
DJonesGo for it14:22
oimonyou can tell a CEO of a company by the way they type entire emails on the subject line , with no body.14:36
DJonesoimon: The directors here do the opposite, no subject & a one line email in the body14:40
bigcalmDJones: is it 'UNSUBSCRIBE' ?14:40
oimonjust as bad, especially when sorting mail by subject14:40
oimonbigcalm: lol14:40
oimoni love it when people reply to list with personal stuff "hey barry how's the rash?"14:41
DJonesbigcalm: Thankfully not14:41
oimonremind me not to upgrade stuff unless there's a compelling feature14:42
oimonthunderbird 6 is laggy compared to the smooth v314:42
shaunooimon: you mean you don't want firefox 10 yet?14:47
* Myrtti has had a day full of frustration and anger14:49
gordso overcast that i have to turn on the big light in the middle of the day, this is the uk autumn i'm used to14:49
Myrttitopped up with a headache, I feel altogether miserable14:49
DJonesI wish you hadn't mentioned headaches14:51
czajkowskiDJones: *hugs*14:52
DJonesDid that idea work14:52
oimonSAD lamp FTW14:54
AzelphurIs there an archive manager for XFCE that doesn't suck? After things like drag/drop and updating files inside an archive14:55
czajkowskiDJones: rang em, plan B send job center letter stating they want to give me tax back but missing p60 to liverpool so I can get new tax code for employer14:57
=== Girly-Girl is now known as GirlyGirl
DJonesRight, sounds like progress anyway14:58
brobostigoninteresting, cameron claiming supporting gay marriage, is the conservative thing to do.14:58
directhexcovering table legs because legs are sexually provocative is the conservative thing to do14:59
gordAzelphur, can't you just use file-roller like everyone else?14:59
directhexsaying "yeah, sure, whatevs" is liberal14:59
Azelphurgord When you try and drag and drop with file roller, it glitches out, and then totally locks down the mouse pointer rendering the entire system unusable14:59
Azelphurhave to drop to a tty and kill it to get your pointer back15:00
brobostigondirecthex: it was simply somewhat unexpected, really.15:00
gordsounds like a bug to me15:00
czajkowskiDJones: 600 quid is a lot to walk away on15:00
DJonesczajkowski: Certainly is, I don't think anybody would be happy doing that15:01
czajkowskiDJones: indeed15:02
czajkowskithere was a why didnt you get it15:02
czajkowskihave you tried to get it15:02
DJonesSounds typical15:08
oimonanalysis of most vulnerable windows programs. top 3 are also linux ones too. thankfully we have ability to update from repos. http://net-security.org/malware_news.php?id=186315:12
Azelphurhow would I create an alias so that gtk-update-icon-cache always runs with the -t param?15:26
Azelphurugly workaround for a package not installing, will undo it once the package is installed15:26
Laneycan't you edit the package's maintainer script which is running the program to add it?15:28
Laneyalternatively, dpkg-divert.15:28
AzelphurLaney: doesn't seem easy :/15:28
Azelphurwhat's dpkg-divert?15:28
Laneylets you move the original file out of the way so you can install a script which calls it with the modified options15:29
mag123Hello, does anyone know how to make ath5k in buntu 8.10 work? I used this tutorial first time few years ago, and it worked(usinf madwifi and ath pci) : https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WifiDocs/Driver/Atheros but this time i cant make it work, any ideas?15:33
lubotu3Ubuntu 8.10 (Intrepid Ibex) was the ninth release of Ubuntu. End Of Life: April 30th, 2010. See !eol and !upgrade for more details.15:33
brobostigonit is EOL, unsupported.15:33
mag123yeah but i ve really bad equipment and it sucks with newer versions ;/ thats y i decided to go back to 8.1015:34
brobostigonhave you installed, the reuired packages for that kernel module, and then insmod'ed it?15:36
mag123u mean  linux-backports-modules-intrepid ?15:38
brobostigoni canot remember, probebly best to do a search on packages.ubuntu.com15:39
mag123thats wht they recommend but most of it cant be found ;/15:39
DJonesIf its EOL, the packages will have been removed from packages.ubuntu.com15:40
brobostigonah, good point, isnt there the eol package repo?15:40
DJonesThere is http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/releases/ butI'm not sure what the format is to amend your sources.list to use that15:41
brobostigongood question.15:41
mag123;/ how about 9.04 is it still supported?15:42
DJonesAh, may help (different version, but should be same format) http://soniahamilton.wordpress.com/2009/05/02/apt-sourceslist-for-old-versions-of-ubuntu/15:42
lubotu3Ubuntu 9.04 (Jaunty Jackalope) was the tenth release of Ubuntu. End Of Life: October 23, 2010. See !eol and !upgrade for more details.15:42
lubotu3Ubuntu 9.10 (Karmic Koala) was the eleventh release of Ubuntu. !End-Of-Life on April 29th 2011, see http://goo.gl/UUTAB for details.15:43
lubotu3Ubuntu 10.04 LTS (Lucid Lynx) was the twelfth release of Ubuntu. Download http://releases.ubuntu.com/10.04/ - Release Info: http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/1004 - Supported until April 2013 (Desktop), April 2015 (Server)15:43
mag123ok guys, thx for ur help, will give it a try and bother u again if dont succed ;)15:44
brobostigonwe didnt give a complete solution?15:44
DJones10.04 is probably the oldest version still supoported15:44
bigcalmIt is15:44
bigcalmAnd it's the last version that my viglen mpc-l will support15:45
bigcalmOr the other way around :)15:45
brobostigonif it is a old hw as he suggested, i would have used debian insted pf ubuntu, as it is lighter.15:45
DJonesI'd be tempted to try xubuntu or lubuntu15:46
brobostigonand he could use the most recent version.15:46
oimonbigcalm: what doesn't work on newer versions with your viglen?15:47
bigcalmoimon: I think the CPU isn't supported past 10.0415:47
* bigcalm shrugs15:47
bigcalmIt's acting as a file server for my parents. No need to upgrade it really15:48
oimonbigcalm: http://appleby.is-a-geek.net/mpcl/index.html15:50
oimonthis guy reckons it works15:50
oimonmight just need some kernel params  "pnpbios=off pci=noacpi"15:52
bigcalmIt's always needed noacpi, otherwise it doesn't boot15:52
bigcalmDown side to that is that if the power button is knocked some how, the machine turns off instantly15:53
oimoni'm about to hide a acer aspire revo into a wall cavity15:54
gordcareful it doesn't overheat15:54
oimonhope that it is stable since i don't fancy unscrewing the wall panel to reboot manually15:54
gordrevo's like to produce a loot of heat15:54
bigcalmThey do15:54
oimonit's next to an air vent15:55
bigcalmBut then I'm maxing out mine most of the time. It's my web dev server15:55
oimonmy will show a firefox page in kiosk mode15:55
gordtry not to hit the gpu15:55
gordie: don't use compositing15:55
gordforce the cpu to underclock15:56
czajkowskigord: one for you http://twitpic.com/6vi13115:56
oimonhad it running on my desk for 6 months and seemed ok for heat, although my room is bigger than the ceiling cavity at work15:56
gordwhy do you torment me so =\15:57
DJonesI don't know why, but I was expecting that to be a picture of a cat15:57
czajkowskigord: because I've no davmor2 to torment and Moodoo we've been through this15:58
gordczajkowski, my rebuttal http://ubuntuone.com/0iIVefCBJtSIqslsJxcrUi16:01
davmor2czajkowski: Stop picking on gord or so help me I'll tickle you16:09
* czajkowski peers at davmor2 you_wouldn't_dare16:09
=== Lcawte is now known as Guest46372
davmor2gord: see I'll stick up for you bud :)16:10
* gord hides behind davmor2 16:10
czajkowskigord: think that'll save you do you16:10
davmor2czajkowski: You're daring me to tickle you that's like waving a red flag at a bull :P16:10
gordczajkowski, i think it will put davmor2 between you and me, the perfect distraction16:11
davmor2czajkowski: no but it'll slow you down greatly so he can run away :P16:12
gorddon't need to be faster than the polar bear, just faster than the davmor2 and all that16:14
davmor2gord: hahaha16:15
davmor2just need to be further away to start with oh wait you are16:15
czajkowskigord: so I'm a polar bear eh16:15
* czajkowski peers at gord 16:16
gordwas being nice, typed grizzly bear at first :P thought polar was the nicer of the two16:16
davmor2gord: hahaha wise man say when in hole stop digging :)16:17
* czajkowski pushes gord into the hole he has dug with davmor2 and throws grit down! now shrup ye pups 16:20
MartijnVdSdavmor2: depends on where you want to go ;)16:20
davmor2MartijnVdS: To hell obviously :D16:21
MartijnVdSdavmor2: not Australia? :)16:21
davmor2MartijnVdS: you'd need to hit the core of the earth at some point to do that and burn in hell for the privilege16:22
MartijnVdSdavmor2: minor inconveniences16:22
czajkowskiwhy is it the last 20 mins DRAG!16:36
bigcalmThey only drag if you aren't enjoying the work16:38
czajkowskiI#'m writing a document on how to lay out a testing plan for future reference for all platforms16:39
davmor2czajkowski: they only drag if you're not dong work :P16:39
* czajkowski kicks davmor2 oi 16:39
czajkowskibehave you16:39
ali1234i think i need some tool to reap out of control flash processes http://paste.ubuntu.com/702846/16:40
davmor2czajkowski: Really who do you think you just said that too ;)16:42
* bigcalm spends the last 20ish mins getting things ready for tomorrow16:43
bigcalmWould be a pita if I forgot a power cable16:43
davmor2bigcalm: too right :D16:46
davmor2czajkowski: prod16:48
=== OmNomDeBonBon is now known as OmNomDePlume
* jacobw is unimpressed with young voter's question time18:56
jacobw'we are totally live from salford'18:56
jacobw'send questions in and i'll read out absolutely as many as i can'18:56
jacobwalso, the banner is similar to nevermind the buzzcocks18:57
AzelphurI've never bothered to vote because none of them actually talk about anything that ever interested me18:57
AzelphurThe only politician I've ever seen that'd get my vote if I could actually vote for him would probably be Obama xD18:57
MartijnVdS\o/ ##politics-uk19:12
DJonesok, so this is the 12.04 animal :) http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/42/Pangolin_borneo.jpg/413px-Pangolin_borneo.jpg19:13
MartijnVdShas it been announced?19:13
MartijnVdSand, as I said19:14
MartijnVdSevery time someone suggests a name, it's struck from the list of potential names, not added to it :)19:15
shaunothat doesn't look much like a penguin to me :/19:33
xr1anyone know where firefox 7 stores temp files.. youtube videos19:41
=== mike_ is now known as Guest31818
Guest31818Hello all - quick question, is there any way of telling how fast my usb wi-fi dongle is connecting to my wireless router?19:56
Guest31818hi anyone?  is there a quick command to test your wifi adapter's connection speed?20:06
Azelphur!patience | Guest3181820:06
lubotu3Guest31818: Don't feel ignored and repeat your question quickly; if nobody knows your answer, nobody will answer you. While you wait, try searching https://help.ubuntu.com or http://ubuntuforums.org or http://askubuntu.com/20:06
Guest31818sorry - was only asking :)  im on the ubuntu pages as we speak20:08
MartijnVdSGuest31818: you can check with the "iw" command, I think20:10
MartijnVdSyou'll have to look up which option yourself :)20:10
shaunoxr1: youtube videos are really awkward.  flash creates a file in /tmp, opens it, and then deletes it immediately.  so you end up chasing dangling filehandles, rather than copying temp files20:21
shaunomuch easier to just find any of the 7 million tools that have been invented to handle just that20:22
Azelphurif GetActionBarPage() == 2 then is valid LUA right? they don't use a strange symbol for comparison? o.O20:22
ali1234you can get those dangling file handles from /proc/<pid>/fd20:23
ali1234for example20:23
ali1234tail -f -c +0 /proc/<pid>/fd/<filedes> > whatever.flv20:23
ali1234also helpful if you accidentally delete a file while it is still downloading20:24
gordi thought flash stopped making files in /tmp?20:32
Azelphurwhat else besides cheese can I use to record webcam?21:13
Azelphurcheese is bugging out for me :(21:13
MattJAzelphur, let me know if you find something that works well21:22
MattJI had similar issues with Cheese for long videos21:22
MattJI Googled and found other solutions like VLC, but none of them worked well enough21:22
AzelphurI found guvcview but it just segfaults when I hit record21:23
popeyAzelphur: guvcview21:24
popeyoh, heh21:24
popeyyou want stills or video?21:24
AzelphurI can't see what I'm doing if I use ffmpeg21:25
popeysure you can, mplayer it too21:25
popeyheh, that works too21:27
popeyI'm playing a video with a delay21:27
AzelphurI'll just cheat and use my phone \o/21:27
popeyffmpeg -an -f video4linux2 -s 1280x720  -r 15 -i /dev/video0 -vcodec mpeg4 -vtag DIVX /tmp/out.avi21:27
popeythat worked for me21:28
popeychange resolution accordingly21:28
popeythen mplayer /tmp/out.avi21:28
Azelphurpopey: worked sort of but no sound and mplayer exited because it got to the end of the file21:30
Azelphurso yea, phone job at least until cheese or uvcview is fixed :P21:30
popeyyou filed bugs in both?21:30
AzelphurI should do :)21:33
AlanBellevening all21:37
daveycakesjust installed ubuntu on my HP laptop. even when i disable the track pad the mouse jumps around, cant seem to fix it. any ideas?21:42
szymon_gcould anyone tell me how can i change the fr*cking font in ubuntu11.10? "appearance" doesn't adjust fonts22:11
dogmatic69_szymon_g: http://tinyurl.com/3rv23sp22:13
szymon_gthanx dogmatic69, really helpfull. now explain me, please, why the duck i'm supposed to install gnome-shell (it's one of gnome-tweak-tool), ok?22:14
szymon_goh, 39 packages to install- just to change a font. yeah, great22:16
shaunoI didn't think gnome-shell was in the repo.  have you added a third-party repo that it's trying to pull tweak-tool from instead?22:17
dogmatic69_if you spent 15 seconds looking at the system menu you would have seen "appearance"22:17
dogmatic69_since you are trying to change the appearance that would be a good start22:18
szymon_gyeah. and can you see a font settings there?22:18
dogmatic69_the first link in google also has a step by step (about 2 steps in total) guide22:20
szymon_gwhere http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/692/screenshotat20111005231.png/ ?22:21
szymon_gthe first link tells me to install gnome-tweak-tool, which pools as dep gnome-shell22:21
szymon_gthe almighty appearance program do not mention any fonts at all, i'm afraid. its ubuntu 11.10 if that matters22:22
popeydogmatic69_: i see no option to change the font in the appearance dialog22:28
dogmatic69_its called advanced now http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-v9PXJAtN2d0/TnkI4aqJaAI/AAAAAAAAAhU/EjiuP5FKBjI/s400/Screenshot%2Bat%2B2011-09-21%2B04%253A41%253A13.png22:29
popeyi see nothing when searching for advanced22:30
popeyand if you look at the package name...22:31
popeyand there's no way I'm installing that, it pulls in gnome shell22:31
szymon_gdogmatic69, the link you provided, is a screenshot of gnome-tweak-tool22:36
shaunowhy does this sidebar jazz scroll past it's extents :/  that seems a bit … off22:40
shaunoI forgot how bad this had actually gotten on the desktop22:58
shaunoit's using my " key for the ¨diacritic, so I can't quote things in a terminal?23:02
dogmatic69_ctrl + c -> ctrl + v :D23:03
shaunoheh.  I haven't found those yet.  if I right-click a terminal window, it doesn't show me the accelerators for copy/paste.  Which usually means there aren't any23:04
shauno(I'm apparently not allowed to resize the terminal window either?  other than maximize)23:04
shaunohah, it's using tilde for the ñ diacritic too, so to type ~ I have to hit the key twice23:07
popeyshauno: is this ubuntu on a mac?23:12
popeyi had this too23:13
shaunoapparently UK-mac-international is the wrong keymap to pick if you have a UK-International layout on a mac23:13
popeyI have English (UK, Macintosh)23:13
popeyand it works23:13
popeyalthough still wrong23:13
shaunoI'm used to wrong.  I just really need my quote key  lol23:14
popey` that one? or " that one?23:14
shaunoideally, both.  " was the one I couldn't figure out how to type23:14
popeywith mine the squiggle in the top left is ` and ~23:15
shaunohitting " twice gave me a standalone umlaut, which looked almost convincing (to me, but not to bash)23:15
popeyand the ' and ~ key gives me < and >23:15
shaunolooking thru my trashpile trying to see if I can find anything from the last 20 years that uses that as a UK keymap23:16
shaunooh, it is a regular PC keyboard.  forgot the spare I have is USian  (it doesn't have \/ positioned correctly for pinball games)23:17
popeyif i file a bug will you confim it shauno ?23:17
shaunowould I get my wrist slapped for doing so via a VM?23:18
popeythe behaviour is the same AIUI23:18
popeyi just tried mac internatinoal23:18
popeyI have to press " twice and I get special quotes23:18
popeyif I press " then space I get normal ones23:19
shaunostill waiting on #782389 before I can install 'for real'23:19
shaunooh, quote-space does give me the right character23:20
popeybug 78238923:21
lubotu3Launchpad bug 782389 in linux (Ubuntu) "DVD drive doesn't work on MacBookPro8,2" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/78238923:21
shaunohm, shift-6 does it too  (defaults to a diacritic, have to use it twice to get the marked glyph out of it)23:23
MonsterwizardSo Linux is based on Unix?23:26
MonsterwizardThe linux kernal is based on the unix kernal? :S23:26
directhexMonsterwizard: no23:27
AzelphurMonsterwizard: it's a "unix-like" OS, meaning that it took some of the concepts of Unix and made them into an entirely new OS23:27
directhexMonsterwizard: conceptually, linux is a UNIX-like kernel (and there are many unixes)23:27
MonsterwizardWell I need to learn UNIX23:28
directhexMonsterwizard: it's a kernel for the GNU operating system, which stands for GNU's Not UNIX23:28
AzelphurMonsterwizard: ...why?23:28
Monsterwizardso using ubuntu for bash scroting and command line would be a bad idea?23:28
Azelphurthis isn't 199623:28
directhexMonsterwizard: which unix? Solaris isn't AIX isn't IRIX isn't HP-UX isn't Mac OS X23:28
directhexbut all of those are unix23:28
MonsterwizardWell my teacher hasn't said linux23:28
Azelphurthe term "Unix" is too vague for you to actually learn23:28
MonsterwizardI should ask him23:28
Azelphuryes, you should :)23:29
Azelphurit also sounds like your teacher doesn't know very much, Unix isn't really used much now days23:29
shaunoI was just typing that.  asking would be spot on there.  since there is no one 'unix' for a *long* time23:29
directhex"unix" on its own could refer to several dozen completely different operating systems23:29
PernigMonsterwizard: at the time there were issues with the various unix flavours legally etc23:29
MonsterwizardWe connect to a server running linux while logged into windows23:29
Monsterwizardhe has never said linux23:29
Monsterwizardjust unix23:29
AzelphurMonsterwizard: but yea, "Linux" and "Unix" are incredibly vague terms23:30
Azelphurboth of them are just kernels23:30
MonsterwizardWe've been learning the command line and bash scripting23:30
AzelphurA Linux kernel can power anything from a nokia brick phone, to a fully fledged PC like Ubuntu23:30
Monsterwizardis it generally universal23:30
MonsterwizardNot sure what we use in school23:30
Azelphurit's somewhat universal, not all commands exist in all distros23:30
Monsterwizardbut at home I use ubuntu 10:0423:30
directhexAIX, HP-UX, Solaris (SunOS), UNICOS, Mac OS X, OpenBSD, FreeBSD, NetBSD, DragonflyBSD, Tru64, UNIXware23:30
directhexmore entries, guys23:30
Pernigmost command line tools that you will be learning will work on most distros23:30
directhexthat's all i have right now23:31
Azelphurif you tried to use your bash knowledge on my Linux powered router for example, you'd get nowhere23:31
Monsterwizardin fact, there was a gnome terminal23:31
Azelphurbecause there is no bash on there :D23:31
Azelphurbut you can probably share your knowledge between most Linux based pc-style distributions easily23:31
shaunounix is more of a 'grand design' than a kernel these days.  some things conform closer to that design, some things less.  and some have paid to be allowed to say they conform to it.  and others haven't.23:31
MonsterwizardI have a terminal on my andorid23:32
MonsterwizardI can't seem to do things like pwd23:32
Monsterwizardor sudo apt-get install23:32
AzelphurMonsterwizard: yea that's pretty much what I was saying, just because it's linux powered, doesn't mean it's gonna be like anything else at all23:32
directhexMonsterwizard: what ties different UNIXes together is a standard called POSIX. any POSIX-compliant features can be assumed to be present on any POSIX-compliant system. for example, you can't assume that a given UNIX has bash installed, but you can assume that it has a POSIX-compliant shell (bash is a POSIX-compliant shell).23:32
shaunoI don't believe android uses a posix userland23:32
AzelphurMonsterwizard: apt is installed on very few systems23:32
directhexMonsterwizard: android has a linux kernel, but no POSIX at all23:32
Azelphurapt isn't at all universal :)23:32
shaunocurious, does apt-get work at school ?23:32
Monsterwizardbut I wasn't allowed to go23:33
MonsterwizardI got a message saying23:33
PernigMonsterwizard: i am surprised you can't use cd, but apt-get won't be there, although funnily enough you can get apt onto an iphone!23:33
Monsterwizardthis is for sys admins only23:33
MonsterwizardI wanted Irssi23:33
directhexPernig: the android security model is highly segmented. android is a crap choice if you want mobile linux23:33
Monsterwizardfor android :P23:33
shaunothen unless he hates himself enough to use debian's kfreebsd or hurd variants, you're probably using linux at school.  try 'uname -a' at school (requires no rights) for some juicy specifics23:34
MonsterwizardI choose it for that reason directhex23:34
directhexoh, Minix, that's another one23:34
directhexMinix is UNIX isn't it?23:34
directhexor just UNIX-like...23:34
shaunoit is & isn't as much as linux is & isn't23:34
MonsterwizardIt's called Ming?23:34
Monsterwizardthey call the server milly23:34
directhexMonsterwizard: Linux isn't UNIX. but it's as close to UNIX as anyone in 2011 needs to care about.23:34
MonsterwizardI'll see if I can connect from here23:34
shaunoxming is an X server for windows; usually used as a local terminal to something better running elsewhere23:35
MonsterwizardI see23:35
shaunothat's just going to confuse things even more  lol23:36
Monsterwizardhow come?23:36
MonsterwizardGot to tell you, it's terrible23:36
Monsterwizardit's putting people new to linux off23:36
shaunoI would honestly just ask your teacher if ubuntu, or linux in general, would make for a suitable environment to follow along in23:36
MonsterwizardI'm like "Oh no honestly it is good23:37
MonsterwizardThere's rooms with fedora23:37
directhexXMing is an Xorg for Windows isn't it?23:37
shaunopretty much23:37
shaunoit's not what most people new to linux would see.  It's most likely a choice your teacher has had to make, rather than install linux on all the classroom terminals (which are probably used for plenty other than just linux/unix tutorials)23:38
MonsterwizardI' going to remote connect to a PC in the comp lab23:38
Monsterwizardonly to connect to that linux server :P23:38
shauno(these days I'd be a lot more tempted to just burn a stack of livecds myself)23:40
MonsterwizardI've got bored of that23:40
directhexassuming the livecds are correct out-of-the-box e.g. UK keyboard by default23:40
MonsterwizardI always always carry around a flash drive with ubuntu.10.04 :P23:41
shaunoI know this is wildly off-topic here, but appears Mr Jobs is finally out of your way - http://www.apple.com/stevejobs/23:41
Monsterwizardoh no23:41
directhexAssociated Press reports the end of steve jobs23:41
Monsterwizardi feel terrible for his family23:42
ali1234unix is posix23:59
ali1234unix is C stdlib23:59
ali1234unix is shells and pipes23:59

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