| * andres-kain smiles | 00:07 | |
| andres-kain | \o/ finally learnt a bit of irc | 00:07 |
|---|---|---|
| andres-kain | good night! | 00:08 |
| MartijnVdS | 20 minutes to F1 | 04:38 |
| MartijnVdS | well 22 | 04:38 |
| daftykins | you're awake early to see it? :) | 05:25 |
| GirlyGirl | Morning | 06:15 |
| AlanBell | morning | 07:14 |
| AlanBell | my upgrade is still going | 07:14 |
| AlanBell | got stuck on a modified config file | 07:14 |
| AlanBell | restart tme! | 07:25 |
| AlanBell | not good :( | 07:38 |
| AlanBell | lets try unity 2d | 07:38 |
| AlanBell | ok, that mostly works | 07:41 |
| AlanBell | compiz was having issues getting started with unity3d | 07:41 |
| AlanBell | I got the nautilus desktop but no unity | 07:42 |
| AlanBell | http://paste.ubuntu.com/704769/ | 07:48 |
| AlanBell | yay, fixed it | 07:55 |
| AlanBell | in ccsm enabled unity and turned off some conflicting keybinding options | 07:55 |
| czajkowski | Aloha | 08:25 |
| AlanBell | morning czajkowski | 08:27 |
| czajkowski | AlanBell: hows things | 08:27 |
| AlanBell | fine, nice quiet house and I have upgraded to Oneiric | 08:27 |
| czajkowski | :) | 08:28 |
| AlanBell | how is London this morning? | 08:28 |
| czajkowski | not raining | 08:28 |
| AlanBell | this is building up :) http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1283/detail/ | 08:29 |
| czajkowski | aye poked jono last night to mail internally as they all are there this week | 08:30 |
| czajkowski | so no reason not to use the sign up really | 08:30 |
| czajkowski | and give people an idea of numbers | 08:30 |
| AlanBell | yus | 08:30 |
| knightwise | morning | 08:33 |
| GirlyGirl | AlanBell: How did the upgrade go? | 08:39 |
| knightwise | hey GirlyGirl AlanBell | 08:41 |
| knightwise | morning | 08:41 |
| GirlyGirl | knightwise: Morning | 08:41 |
| AlanBell | GirlyGirl: I am upgraded | 08:48 |
| AlanBell | unity3d failed a bit | 08:48 |
| GirlyGirl | AlanBell: What are the changes to unity .. how do you find it | 08:49 |
| AlanBell | gord: unity --reset doesn't seem to resolve conflicts in compiz | 08:49 |
| AlanBell | GirlyGirl: it is OK, I can launch applications and navigate between them | 08:49 |
| AlanBell | the apps lens is a pile of fail for not grouping stuff by category, but I wrote my own lens to do that | 08:50 |
| AlanBell | at least it is now offering me slightly relevant apps for download when I filter by category | 08:52 |
| brobostigon | morning everyone. | 09:04 |
| AlanBell | thunderbird has prettier buttons | 09:05 |
| Lcawte | Thunderbird needs microsoft exchange support... I have wubi on my sisters PC and tried the 11.04 mail app, and was suprised that I could get my school emails at home... | 09:24 |
| StevenR | Lcawte: there are some plugins or exchange for TB | 09:28 |
| Lcawte | Really? Oh cool, haven't been able to find them though.. | 09:28 |
| AlanBell | banshee just triggered a thermal shutdown | 10:04 |
| MartijnVdS | cool | 10:04 |
| * AlanBell gives up listening to music for another year | 10:04 | |
| MartijnVdS | AlanBell: it likes to go into <number of cpus> * 100% CPU eating loop if you apt-get upgrade while it's running | 10:04 |
| MartijnVdS | AlanBell: Laney and I filed a bug about that | 10:04 |
| MartijnVdS | AlanBell: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=659841 | 10:05 |
| AlanBell | I clicked a track in the music lens and it did it | 10:05 |
| lubotu3 | Gnome bug 659841 in general "Hang when GConf can't be called(?)" [Major,Unconfirmed] | 10:06 |
| MartijnVdS | AlanBell: Clicking on banshee (or trying to control it some other way) after a (dist-)upgrade tirggers it for me | 10:06 |
| Laney | it is a gconf problem | 10:07 |
| MartijnVdS | Laney: yeah I saw the link at the bottom -- its SIGHUP handler is broken or something? | 10:08 |
| Laney | pretty much | 10:08 |
| gordonjcp | heh | 10:16 |
| gordonjcp | tbh I still can't see past audacious for music playing | 10:16 |
| gordonjcp | start it up, click on a directory with some audio files, click play | 10:17 |
| gordonjcp | sound comes out | 10:17 |
| * StevenR uses mpd | 10:40 | |
| knightwise | hey everyone =) | 10:49 |
| knightwise | hey s1m0nsk1 | 10:52 |
| s1m0nsk1 | hey knightwise | 10:52 |
| s1m0nsk1 | quiet in here, isn't it? | 11:01 |
| gordonjcp | s1m0nsk1: sunday lunchtime, eh | 11:11 |
| kvarley | the time/calendar applet has vanished from the indicator area, how can I restart it? | 11:26 |
| gordonjcp | the installer doesn't really tell you much about what's going on, does it? | 12:00 |
| gordonjcp | it's been saying "Downloading packages (<some time> remaining)" for about ten minutes now | 12:01 |
| gordonjcp | every so often the time jumps up by a couple of minutes, presumably as it works out it needs something else | 12:01 |
| gordonjcp | if it does it again, I'm cancelling this install and sticking Arch on | 12:01 |
| gordonjcp | clicking on the expander arrow reveals a black textbox with a cursor | 12:02 |
| AlanBell | gordonjcp: it is even less informative if you are using orca, it reads out stuff like "234% complete . . ." | 12:24 |
| gordonjcp | AlanBell: heh | 12:24 |
| AlanBell | after the upgrade my firefox search engines have mostly gone awol | 12:25 |
| AlanBell | only one remaining is ask.com | 12:25 |
| gordonjcp | the colours are horrible | 12:25 |
| AlanBell | colours in the installer or default theme or what? | 12:26 |
| gordonjcp | default theme | 12:26 |
| gordonjcp | purple, yellow, green and brownish-grey | 12:27 |
| gordonjcp | looks like my monitor has septicaemia | 12:27 |
| gordonjcp | the new fonts are cool | 12:27 |
| AlanBell | colours are somewhat distinctive, yes | 12:28 |
| AlanBell | I would like more dramatic changes each release | 12:28 |
| gordonjcp | I quite liked the orangey-brown scheme | 12:29 |
| AlanBell | I am fine with the aubergine/orange, just think the default wallpaper should have been the one with the yellow ocelot on it | 12:30 |
| gordonjcp | that Mac Menu thing is annoying | 12:31 |
| AlanBell | yeah, it is | 12:31 |
| AlanBell | they half fixed it for dual monitors | 12:31 |
| gordonjcp | how do you get rid of it? | 12:32 |
| penguin42 | hmm that ocelot almost looks like it's origami | 12:32 |
| AlanBell | there are some things that are good to copy from the mac | 12:32 |
| gordonjcp | AlanBell: RoundRects Are Everywhere | 12:32 |
| gordonjcp | but other than that, not very much... | 12:32 |
| AlanBell | gordonjcp: I am living wtih the global menu for a week or two, apparently it grows on you | 12:32 |
| gordonjcp | AlanBell: well, it's the thing that utterly prevents me from using Macs | 12:33 |
| penguin42 | it does save screen real estate which is good | 12:33 |
| penguin42 | but with sloppy focus it's a bit of a pita | 12:33 |
| gordonjcp | "oh, I need something from the menu" | 12:33 |
| gordonjcp | <CRASH> | 12:33 |
| gordonjcp | concentration gone | 12:33 |
| AlanBell | Bug #764905 is a great example of copying a mac where you shouldn't | 12:34 |
| lubotu3 | Launchpad bug 764905 in Ayatana Design "Drag and drop a USB key into the trash should eject the USB key" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/764905 | 12:34 |
| gordonjcp | AlanBell: that never made sense, even on the Mac | 12:35 |
| gordonjcp | even the guy that designed it said it didn't make sense, it just ended up that way because people got used to doing it | 12:35 |
| Monsterwizard | sunday roast...anyone? | 12:35 |
| gordonjcp | Monsterwizard: I'm thinking pub lunch actually | 12:36 |
| AlanBell | Monsterwizard: duck here :) | 12:36 |
| * penguin42 just had breakfast | 12:36 | |
| Monsterwizard | fish here???? :S | 12:36 |
| Monsterwizard | up late penguin42? | 12:36 |
| penguin42 | Monsterwizard: I always do odd times at the weekend | 12:36 |
| Monsterwizard | fair deal | 12:37 |
| gordonjcp | AlanBell: I may go back to trying global menu, but I want to stage my changes | 12:37 |
| gordonjcp | AlanBell: the unity desktop is a lot to get used to | 12:37 |
| Monsterwizard | What cool things can I do with Ubuntu in a virtual box? | 12:37 |
| gordonjcp | I still haven't figured out how to get windows to show up without closing whatever is on top of them | 12:38 |
| DJones | AlanBell: Do you have any issues with brightness on boot? My brightness is at the lowest point at boot & I have to manually adjust brightness to get a usable screen every time, it doesn't save the updated setting | 12:40 |
| AlanBell | DJones: I have not noticed any issue with that | 12:40 |
| gordonjcp | how do you fix the close/minimise/maximise button at the top of the window? | 12:40 |
| ali1234 | what's the bug for when the launcher doesn't pop out? | 12:41 |
| MartijnVdS | gordonjcp: "fix" how? | 12:41 |
| gordonjcp | MartijnVdS: they're on the wrong side | 12:41 |
| MartijnVdS | gordonjcp: no they're not. You windows-user you :) | 12:41 |
| ali1234 | gordonjcp: install human-theme and use it | 12:41 |
| gordonjcp | MartijnVdS: what? | 12:41 |
| penguin42 | brightness bugs are very often specific bios/hardware issues | 12:41 |
| AlanBell | ah, now that you do get used to! | 12:41 |
| gordonjcp | MartijnVdS: I haven't used Windows, I wouldn't know | 12:42 |
| DJones | AlanBell: Odd, the other thing I've noticed is that the terminal window font can't be changed on a permanent basis, each time it defaults to larger than I want & the setting doesn't stay fixed | 12:42 |
| gordonjcp | MartijnVdS: every other GUI I have used has them on the right side | 12:42 |
| gordonjcp | MartijnVdS: well, except NeXTSTEP which sort of did its own thing there | 12:42 |
| gordonjcp | but still had a close button on the right | 12:42 |
| AlanBell | DJones: my laptop key for changing brightnes does all or nothing, just a fast fade from one extreme to the other | 12:42 |
| * MartijnVdS never uses the buttons anyway | 12:43 | |
| MartijnVdS | Ctrl+W :) | 12:43 |
| gordonjcp | DJones: yeah, the terminal font is huge | 12:43 |
| gordonjcp | AlanBell: I'm not really interested in "getting used to it" | 12:43 |
| ali1234 | you never get used to it, trust me | 12:43 |
| ali1234 | i've been using unity for 6 months, and i still haven't got used to it | 12:43 |
| gordonjcp | none of my other machines have got it like that, I don't want it on this one | 12:43 |
| ali1234 | anyway i already told you how to fix it... | 12:44 |
| ali1234 | you can't fix it for maximized windows though | 12:45 |
| AlanBell | sudo apt-get remove appmenu-gtk indicator-applet-appmenu indicator-appmenu | 12:45 |
| penguin42 | gordonjcp: I have my terminal font sensible and it seems to be remembering it | 12:45 |
| AlanBell | ^^ breaks the global menu | 12:45 |
| gordonjcp | penguin42: I haven't tried adjusting it | 12:45 |
| Monsterwizard | is virtual bbox the best virtual machine? | 12:46 |
| AlanBell | Monsterwizard: it is a decent desktop virtual machine tool | 12:46 |
| penguin42 | gordonjcp: I think there may have been a recent change in how X tries to guess the size/dpi of the monitor which changes some font sizes - I think it's given up believing what the monitor sometimes told it | 12:46 |
| gordonjcp | penguin42: heh | 12:46 |
| gordonjcp | I take it banshee is the new, improved rhythmbox? | 12:47 |
| AlanBell | no, banshee is the new rhythmbox | 12:47 |
| gordonjcp | oh :-/ | 12:48 |
| gordonjcp | well it actually starts and runs, which is an improvement over rhythmbox any time I've tried it in the past couple of years | 12:48 |
| AlanBell | well, I dunno really I am hardly an expert on music things | 12:48 |
| * penguin42 pats Exaile | 12:48 | |
| AndroUser | re all | 12:48 |
| AlanBell | hi AndroUser | 12:48 |
| === AndroUser is now known as pr0ph3t | ||
| pr0ph3t | sorry | 12:49 |
| pr0ph3t | it's just me | 12:49 |
| Monsterwizard | this is outragous | 12:49 |
| Monsterwizard | there's not IMAP for hotmail | 12:49 |
| pr0ph3t | I was wondering what do you use for vnc connections on the server side, I use Android vnc and I thought of using X11VNC server | 12:51 |
| jacobw | i don't think there's POP for hotmail either.. | 12:51 |
| penguin42 | x11vnc is for sharing existing desktop as I remember | 12:51 |
| pr0ph3t | there's POP3 Yes | 12:51 |
| gordonjcp | right, gnome-terminal is using the system fixed width font | 12:52 |
| Monsterwizard | :O Pop is useless, | 12:52 |
| pr0ph3t | get a Google account, or yahoo | 12:52 |
| gordonjcp | is there a way to change the fonts? IIRC it used to be in "appearance" in the settings but that's just got wallpaper stuff | 12:52 |
| pr0ph3t | you can get IMAP with those | 12:52 |
| pr0ph3t | so going back to my question, do you use ssh access instead to control the box from remote? | 12:53 |
| ali1234 | yes, of course | 12:54 |
| jacobw | !ssh | 12:54 |
| lubotu3 | SSH is the Secure SHell protocol, see: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SSH for client usage. PuTTY is an SSH client for Windows; see: http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/putty/ for it's homepage. See also !scp (Secure CoPy) and !sshd (Secure SHell Daemon) | 12:55 |
| jacobw | !sshd | 12:55 |
| lubotu3 | SSH is the Secure SHell protocol, sshd is the server (or daemon) of SSH. For setting up the SSH server, please see: https://help.ubuntu.com/10.04/serverguide/C/openssh-server.html . Advanced SSH uses: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SSH/OpenSSH/Advanced . For SSH client information, see !ssh . Related: !scp (Secure CoPy) | 12:55 |
| gordonjcp | if I've got two terminals open, then clicking the box on the left side makes them both appear and whoosh about the screen | 12:55 |
| gordonjcp | how do I get them both to show up in the sidebar? | 12:55 |
| pr0ph3t | thanks jacobw | 12:56 |
| ali1234 | you can't | 12:56 |
| ali1234 | you can't do any of this stuff with unity | 12:56 |
| gordonjcp | :-/ | 12:57 |
| gordonjcp | that is rapidly approaching dealbreaker-levels of annoying | 12:58 |
| ali1234 | how did you possible only just notice this? | 12:58 |
| gordonjcp | ali1234: it's the first time I've used Ubuntu for about a year | 12:58 |
| pr0ph3t | so if setup properly ssh is much more secure than vnc, or is it just more powerful, i.e. gives you more control? | 12:58 |
| gordonjcp | and I didn't really use it much before that | 12:58 |
| gordonjcp | ali1234: well, not since the last LTS but one ;-) | 12:59 |
| ali1234 | pr0ph3t: both, yes | 12:59 |
| gordonjcp | ali1234: the windows-whooshing-about thing is really irritating | 12:59 |
| gordonjcp | if I wanted to play Duck Hunt, I'd play Duck Hunt | 12:59 |
| ali1234 | yes i know, it's rubbish | 13:00 |
| jacobw | different instances of the same program don't even number differently if you hold <super> | 13:00 |
| ali1234 | it wouldn't be any where near as bad if they stayed in the same place each time, but they don't | 13:00 |
| gordonjcp | well, I'll give it another 20 minutes | 13:01 |
| gordonjcp | that'll be me having used it for an hour | 13:01 |
| gordonjcp | I think it's wipe and reinstall time though, this is bordering on unusable | 13:02 |
| jacobw | what did you use previously? | 13:02 |
| gordonjcp | XFCE4 on Arch | 13:02 |
| gordonjcp | I could probably just install xubuntu but that rather defeats the purpose of installing Ubuntu at all | 13:02 |
| ali1234 | it would also be much less annoying if it didn't show every terminal window from every desktop, but again, it doesn't | 13:03 |
| gordonjcp | there is no way in hell I could ever explain how to use this to my Mum | 13:03 |
| gordonjcp | that's generally my basic criterion for working out what I'm going to install on computers for people | 13:04 |
| ali1234 | i just ask them what they want | 13:04 |
| gordonjcp | ali1234: most people want "the Internet" | 13:05 |
| gordonjcp | which is why the iPad and various Android tablets are taking over from desktops | 13:05 |
| gordonjcp | but that's a whole 'nother can of worms | 13:05 |
| ali1234 | yeah well if they say that i just tell them to buy a mac | 13:05 |
| gordonjcp | I don't really see the point in Macs unless you need Final Cut Pro | 13:06 |
| gordonjcp | you're paying over the odds for a cheap crappy Intel PC | 13:06 |
| jacobw | 'normal' people don't try to switch between terminal windows very often ;) | 13:06 |
| gordonjcp | in a cheap crappy case | 13:06 |
| gordonjcp | with an ugly and hard-to-use OS | 13:06 |
| ali1234 | yeah well that's not my problem | 13:07 |
| * jacobw also doesn't find macs easy to use | 13:07 | |
| gordonjcp | jacobw: I don't, mostly because the dock is incomprehensible to me and I find having the menu bar at the top of the screen incredibly distracting | 13:08 |
| gordonjcp | jacobw: it was fine in like System 7 when it was single-tasking to begin with ;-) | 13:08 |
| KrimZon | I don't like the application-oriented workspace-ignoring grouping of the dock | 13:09 |
| AlanBell | gordonjcp: you can middle click things in the launcher to create new instances of them, like terminal windows | 13:11 |
| ali1234 | but there is no reasonable way to switch between them after you have done that | 13:12 |
| AlanBell | no, not if you like workspaces | 13:12 |
| ali1234 | whether you use them or not | 13:12 |
| ali1234 | also unity now gets slower and slower the longer you use it | 13:12 |
| AlanBell | don't see why they are not listed in the right click menu of the launcher | 13:12 |
| ali1234 | anyone else had windows get stuck? | 13:12 |
| ali1234 | where you drag the window... and it just doesn't move at all? | 13:13 |
| AlanBell | yes, I had some windows get non-draggable earlier | 13:13 |
| ali1234 | it's really annoying | 13:13 |
| ali1234 | also the expose is showing white rectangles instead of the window contents | 13:13 |
| MartijnVdS | alt+drag tends to always work for me | 13:13 |
| AlanBell | thought it was because I was messing with ccsm at the time | 13:13 |
| ali1234 | basically unity is now more buggy than it was in natty | 13:13 |
| ali1234 | and not even any attempt to fix any of the design flaws | 13:14 |
| jacobw | does anyone own an x220? | 13:14 |
| gordonjcp | this is really slow, too | 13:14 |
| gordonjcp | at least they've toned down the eyewatering drop shadows from natty | 13:14 |
| ali1234 | they still show up in screenshots like they did before though | 13:14 |
| gordonjcp | hm, no UPNP in banshee, but it *does* have DAAP? | 13:15 |
| gordonjcp | weird | 13:15 |
| ali1234 | it has upnp as well | 13:15 |
| AlanBell | I miss the big shadows :) | 13:15 |
| ali1234 | look for dlna or something | 13:15 |
| gordonjcp | yeah, I was | 13:15 |
| MartijnVdS | ali1234: only in alpha right? | 13:15 |
| ali1234 | what is only in alpha? | 13:15 |
| MartijnVdS | UPNP+Banshee? | 13:16 |
| AlanBell | I do think unity is better than it used to be | 13:16 |
| MartijnVdS | I type too fast for alt+F2 | 13:17 |
| gordonjcp | hm | 13:17 |
| ali1234 | unity design hasn't changed since natty | 13:17 |
| ali1234 | some bugs have been fixed | 13:17 |
| gordonjcp | ah, okay | 13:18 |
| ali1234 | like the displayed maximized windows | 13:18 |
| ali1234 | but there are a whole load of new ones that are just as bad/worse | 13:18 |
| gordonjcp | Banshee apparently doesn't support UPNP according to a mailing list posting from June | 13:18 |
| ali1234 | weird, i'm sure i have seen a dlna plugin for it | 13:18 |
| ali1234 | maybe i imagined it | 13:18 |
| gordonjcp | so I need to use a non-standard and patent-encumbered DAAP server to play music on my Ubuntu system ;-) | 13:18 |
| ali1234 | banshee sucks anyway | 13:18 |
| MartijnVdS | ali1234: it's a GSoC'11 item | 13:19 |
| MartijnVdS | ali1234: http://topfs2.wordpress.com/2011/04/29/gsoc-2011-banshee-upnp-serverclient-integration/ | 13:19 |
| ali1234 | slowest audio player i've ever used | 13:19 |
| MartijnVdS | ali1234: maybe you remembered that bit | 13:19 |
| ali1234 | no i probably remembered it from rhythmbox | 13:19 |
| MartijnVdS | yay coherence. Makes rb as stable as banshee | 13:19 |
| ali1234 | i've never seen a upnp system that works properly anyway | 13:20 |
| MartijnVdS | ali1234: My Synology NAS + my PS3 and TV work fine together | 13:20 |
| ali1234 | and besides, if you want to stream music on ubuntu, you are supposed to buy a ubuntu one account | 13:20 |
| ali1234 | can't have anything interfering with the revenue stream now can we? | 13:20 |
| MartijnVdS | cynical much? | 13:21 |
| gordonjcp | this all reminds me of the dashboard on the Berlingos at work | 13:21 |
| ali1234 | go ask any upnp developer about how much workarounds they need to make ps3 work | 13:21 |
| MartijnVdS | ali1234: sure | 13:21 |
| jacobw | gordonjcp: citroen? | 13:21 |
| gordonjcp | ye | 13:21 |
| gordonjcp | five firmware updates later, and you can control the MP3 player from the GPS screen, the steering wheel buttons, the display softkeys or the front of the stereo | 13:22 |
| ali1234 | basically any device that does not sell as much as the ps3 needs just as many workarounds, but doesn't get them because there is no interest | 13:22 |
| gordonjcp | but you still cannot tell it that you want to avoid motorways | 13:22 |
| gordonjcp | and you can't disable the reversing beeper any more | 13:23 |
| gordonjcp | what's especially annoying is three updates ago you could have it automatically not beep in reverse depending on what time it was | 13:24 |
| gordonjcp | I want an open-source car | 13:24 |
| MartijnVdS | so don't get the firmware updates? | 13:25 |
| ali1234 | just buy a car from 1993 | 13:25 |
| ali1234 | no computer control | 13:26 |
| gordonjcp | ali1234: I have a car from 1988, and a car from 1981 | 13:26 |
| ali1234 | well, there you go then | 13:26 |
| gordonjcp | the only electronic thing in the one from 1981 is the clock on the dashboard, and I know it doesn't work | 13:26 |
| * MartijnVdS has one from '02 | 13:26 | |
| gordonjcp | (actually, the clock in the '88 one is broken too) | 13:26 |
| ali1234 | great, you can no longer use human theme because it's gtk2 | 13:27 |
| ali1234 | so where can i get a theme for gtk3 that is actually good? | 13:29 |
| ali1234 | ah, gnome-themes-standard | 13:31 |
| ali1234 | which installs only 1 theme | 13:31 |
| ali1234 | hmm | 13:32 |
| ali1234 | you now have to log out and log in again to make the window decoration update | 13:33 |
| ali1234 | not that you'd ever want to change it since there are no good themes for gtk3 | 13:34 |
| ali1234 | all i want is a theme where the focussed window title bar is a different colour | 13:40 |
| gordonjcp | all I want is for music playback to work in Ubuntu, but I'm not there yet | 13:43 |
| gordonjcp | oh, sod it, I'll just use sshfs | 13:43 |
| gordonjcp | this is just ridiculous, banshee doesn't do upnp, *nothing* does DAAP apart from banshee | 13:56 |
| ali1234 | there is no way to maximize a window on the second monitor with gnome-shell. genius | 14:06 |
| X3N | gordonjcp: totem, rythmbox and media-explorer all do upnp | 14:06 |
| X3N | ali1234: double click the title bar | 14:06 |
| X3N | or drag to the top of the screen | 14:07 |
| ali1234 | not only that but multiple workspaces don't affect the second monitor | 14:07 |
| ali1234 | so any window on the second monitor is always on the screen | 14:07 |
| X3N | yep, one of my favourite features | 14:07 |
| gordonjcp | X3N: weirdly enough, disabling daap and re-enabling it in banshee has brought it to life | 14:07 |
| ali1234 | lets see how well it handles full screen apps | 14:08 |
| ali1234 | i notice the gnome-shell makes it even harder than unity to open two terminal windows on at the same time | 14:09 |
| X3N | "open new window" ? | 14:11 |
| ali1234 | where is that? | 14:12 |
| X3N | right click on the icon | 14:12 |
| X3N | or middle click to open new window on new workspace | 14:13 |
| AlanBell | friend brought round a broken windows laptop, now installing oneiric on it :) | 14:14 |
| AlanBell | one way or another they won't come back with it | 14:14 |
| ali1234 | lol | 14:14 |
| ali1234 | "worst computer repair ever, would not use again" | 14:15 |
| AlanBell | or, yay, my laptop just works | 14:15 |
| AlanBell | one or the other :) | 14:15 |
| AlanBell | it was an ebay purchase apparently | 14:16 |
| AlanBell | old tecra with 256MB ram and a celeron processor (now has 1GB from my box of bits) | 14:16 |
| ali1234 | looooool | 14:16 |
| ali1234 | ubuntu will not run well on that | 14:16 |
| AlanBell | better than a second hand windows | 14:17 |
| AlanBell | live CD works ok | 14:17 |
| ali1234 | it won't run better than XP on that | 14:17 |
| ali1234 | it will probably run significantly worse | 14:17 |
| ali1234 | booting up to a desktop doesn't say much | 14:17 |
| AlanBell | it has a broken XP on it, which hasn't run since purchase | 14:18 |
| ali1234 | so it has all the old owners files on it? | 14:18 |
| AlanBell | yeah, and their malware no doubt | 14:18 |
| ali1234 | yeah | 14:18 |
| ali1234 | just wipe it and restore windows | 14:18 |
| ali1234 | nothing else is gonna work on a machine that old | 14:18 |
| AlanBell | don't have windows restore disks | 14:19 |
| ali1234 | you don't need them | 14:19 |
| ali1234 | if it isn't on the HD just get them from MSDN | 14:19 |
| AlanBell | don't have MSDN | 14:19 |
| AlanBell | and don't really want windows | 14:20 |
| Monsterwizard | how come? | 14:20 |
| Monsterwizard | windows is ok | 14:20 |
| AlanBell | it might come back! | 14:20 |
| gordonjcp | stick Haiku on it | 14:20 |
| Monsterwizard | Windows is the misunderstood OS | 14:20 |
| ali1234 | put gnu hurd on it | 14:20 |
| AlanBell | I don't support windows | 14:20 |
| ali1234 | i guarantee it wont come back | 14:20 |
| AlanBell | ali1234: I want it to at least *leave* | 14:21 |
| ali1234 | i will support windows if the price right | 14:21 |
| ali1234 | but only until it leaves my possesion | 14:21 |
| ali1234 | if it comes back it's wipe time | 14:21 |
| ali1234 | billable hours \o/ | 14:21 |
| ali1234 | gnome-shell notifications pop up ad disappear as soon as you press a key | 14:21 |
| AlanBell | "friend of wife" is not a billable customer | 14:22 |
| ali1234 | annoying if one pops up while you are typing | 14:22 |
| gordonjcp | thunderbird totally fails to work | 14:22 |
| ali1234 | thunderbird is rubbish | 14:22 |
| gordonjcp | well yeah | 14:22 |
| ali1234 | it's still better than evolution though | 14:22 |
| gordonjcp | tbh it was a bad choice including it | 14:23 |
| ali1234 | well what else are they going to do? "sorry, there is no good email client on linux" | 14:23 |
| gordonjcp | well evolution has had a bug with HTML email that has made it unusable for about five years | 14:23 |
| ali1234 | evolution just crashes every time i try to use it | 14:23 |
| gordonjcp | receive an HTML email, try to reply to it as non-HTML, get all sorts of crazy formatting | 14:23 |
| ali1234 | sometimes it doesn't even crash. sometimes it doesn't even respond to any input at all | 14:23 |
| gordonjcp | something that was as usable and functional as Eudora about ten years ago would be nice | 14:25 |
| AlanBell | I use thunderbird as my main email client | 14:26 |
| AlanBell | lack of exchange support is either a dealbreaker for some people, or of no relevance whatsoever to everyone else | 14:27 |
| ali1234 | wow even the gnome fallback is terrible now | 14:29 |
| ali1234 | why is the clock in the middle of the panel? | 14:29 |
| ali1234 | and why is the panel so ugly? | 14:29 |
| jacobw | ali1234 in wonderland :P | 14:30 |
| ali1234 | lol notifications are messed up as well | 14:30 |
| ali1234 | well i guess linux no longer has a usable desktop enviroment | 14:31 |
| AlanBell | people have put a lot of time and effort into breaking that stuff | 14:32 |
| ali1234 | no doubt in gnome 3.4 they will claim that they are removing it because "nobody uses it" | 14:32 |
| ali1234 | which will be true | 14:33 |
| AlanBell | probably | 14:33 |
| ali1234 | nobody will wnt to use this because it is completely crippled | 14:33 |
| ali1234 | does xfce use gtk3 now? | 14:34 |
| ali1234 | the quality of free software was much higher when developers were writing it just for themselves | 14:35 |
| AlanBell | unity with a sane lens for launching applications and more predictable window management would be just fine | 14:35 |
| ali1234 | instead of some imagined, half-retarded "normal user" | 14:36 |
| AlanBell | now they write it for people who think dragging a USB device to the rubbish bin should "eject" it | 14:36 |
| ali1234 | hah | 14:38 |
| ali1234 | if it were up to me,dragging a usb device to the rubbish bin would permanently brick it | 14:38 |
| AlanBell | when they get people in for user experience testing you would think they would allow them to sober up first | 14:38 |
| ali1234 | right time to try xfce | 14:39 |
| AlanBell | how are you planning to do that? | 14:39 |
| gordonjcp | is there a way to make a specific terminal (or any other window, really) have a separate square on the strip at the side? | 14:40 |
| ali1234 | oh dear | 14:40 |
| ali1234 | is it really so hard to pick the right font size? | 14:40 |
| AlanBell | gordonjcp: I don't think so, I think gord did the stacking logic | 14:41 |
| ali1234 | any idea what DPI i have to use to make this ubuntu font not look dirty? 96, hinting slight? | 14:45 |
| ali1234 | what font size does gnome use? | 14:46 |
| AlanBell | I set my terminal to Ubuntu Mono 10 | 14:46 |
| ali1234 | ugh, this is total fail | 14:46 |
| ali1234 | 10 pt font is about 3 millimeters high in xfce | 14:46 |
| ali1234 | even when i force dpi it is still significantly small than it is under gnome | 14:47 |
| ali1234 | and of course only about 50% of the programs in xfce actually honour the font size | 14:47 |
| ali1234 | so everything looks like a mess if you change it from the default | 14:47 |
| ali1234 | if i wanted this i would use KDE | 14:47 |
| ali1234 | haha xfce has a theme called "ambiance" that looks nothing like the ubuntu one | 14:48 |
| ali1234 | and also, i can tell it is using gtk3 because all the programs have a blank square in the bottom right where the resizer thing should be | 14:49 |
| penguin42 | ali1234: Ah that's happened for years; it's normally after you've done an update or a theme change | 14:49 |
| ali1234 | it has't happened for years | 14:49 |
| ali1234 | it only started happening when gtk3 introduced the mandatory resizer | 14:50 |
| penguin42 | fine, it's happened to me for years | 14:50 |
| ali1234 | then you have been using gnome3 for years | 14:50 |
| ali1234 | xfce is the first desktop i;ve tried where it is possible to tell which window is focussed | 14:51 |
| ali1234 | so it has that going for it | 14:51 |
| ali1234 | pity about the font rendering | 14:51 |
| ali1234 | hey look at that, notify-osd doesn't respect font settings | 14:53 |
| X3N | whining >> /dev/null | 15:06 |
| ali1234 | whining about whining ^ | 15:07 |
| ali1234 | whining^2 | 15:07 |
| AlanBell | metawhining | 15:07 |
| AlanBell | X3N: discussing issues discovered prior to filing informative bug reports | 15:08 |
| ali1234 | i've already reported all these bugs | 15:08 |
| AlanBell | chances are that the reports already exist | 15:09 |
| ali1234 | i reported them when natty was released | 15:09 |
| * AlanBell finds a problem with the grid snap thing and dual monitors | 15:10 | |
| AlanBell | if you try to do a half maximise on the edge between the two monitors it shows the yellow highlight where it is going to put it, then half maximises it on the other monitor | 15:11 |
| ali1234 | AlanBell: i reported that bug against natty during beta phase | 15:11 |
| AlanBell | sometimes | 15:11 |
| ali1234 | grid plugin is so messed up it is unbelievable | 15:12 |
| ali1234 | supposedly it causes the no show launcher too | 15:12 |
| ali1234 | i suspect it causes the "1 pixel over the edge so i'm not going to show you that window" problem | 15:12 |
| jacobw | cal lightman is using openoffice with bluecurve icons in lie to me :| | 15:18 |
| * AlanBell tries to parse what jacobw said | 15:19 | |
| jacobw | i'm not sure if recognising icon sets in tv programmes is healthy :P | 15:19 |
| Joeb454 | probably not the healthiest of things, no | 15:19 |
| Joeb454 | but at least you have good eyesight and memory ;) | 15:19 |
| AlanBell | "lie to me" is a TV programme? "cal lightman" is a character? | 15:19 |
| === MattJ101 is now known as MattJ | ||
| jacobw | correct AlanBell | 15:20 |
| AlanBell | parsing win \o/ | 15:20 |
| jacobw | :) | 15:20 |
| ali1234 | bah i give up | 15:21 |
| ali1234 | going back to unity | 15:21 |
| ali1234 | why is gnome the only system that can set fonts to a consistent size? | 15:24 |
| ali1234 | is libreoffice supposed to work with appmenu? | 15:33 |
| stgraber | yes, if you install an additional package | 15:33 |
| ali1234 | which package? | 15:33 |
| stgraber | lo-menubar | 15:33 |
| ali1234 | what other apps need a special package? | 15:33 |
| ali1234 | except for firefox | 15:34 |
| stgraber | I think that's pretty much it for what's supported. gtk/qt already have it, firefox/thunderbird have an extension and libreoffice has a plugin (though that's the only one that's not installed by default for some reason) | 15:35 |
| gordonjcp | what's really annoying is how if you've got music playing and something noisy pops up in firefox, you hear that too | 15:35 |
| gordonjcp | also, the "online accounts" thing is a bit useless | 15:36 |
| gordonjcp | it only supports google | 15:36 |
| ali1234 | it supports google? | 15:36 |
| ali1234 | what does it do if you add your google account? | 15:37 |
| ali1234 | how do i get rid of these damn scrollbars? | 15:37 |
| gordonjcp | no idea, I couldn't give a toss about google | 15:37 |
| gordonjcp | yahoo! messenger would be nice though | 15:37 |
| ali1234 | gnome-settings-daemon has started refusing to hand out themes. reboot time i think | 15:40 |
| Joeb454 | ali1234: gordonjcp it syncs contacts and calendars from Google, I believe, and Google Talk | 15:40 |
| ali1234 | syncs them with what? | 15:40 |
| ali1234 | i removed empathy and thunderbird | 15:40 |
| gordonjcp | Joeb454: great, now how do I get Yahoo! messenger? | 15:40 |
| Joeb454 | your local contacts/calendar, afaik. | 15:41 |
| Joeb454 | gordonjcp: pass, I haven't used Yahoo messenger for years, sorry | 15:41 |
| gordonjcp | Joeb454: I can't think of any combination of circumstances where I'd ever find syncing stuff with Google useful | 15:41 |
| ali1234 | lol yahoo | 15:41 |
| ali1234 | all the privacy concerns of google, except the services are worse | 15:41 |
| gordonjcp | the only reason I have a Google account at all is because I have an Android phone, and when I get shot of that I'll get rid of google | 15:41 |
| * penguin42 likes being able to get to his calendar, and bookmarks remotely | 15:42 | |
| ali1234 | but how do i see my google calendar with this? | 15:42 |
| ali1234 | or email... or chat | 15:42 |
| gordonjcp | okay, so the long and short of it is, Ubuntu 11.10 is broken | 15:43 |
| ali1234 | yeah | 15:43 |
| ali1234 | so was 11.04 | 15:43 |
| ali1234 | this is not really news to anyone | 15:43 |
| gordonjcp | it's like any other Linux, but it does less, and what it does manage to do, it does badly | 15:43 |
| ali1234 | well here's the thing | 15:45 |
| ali1234 | unity is better than KDE, and it is better than gnome3 | 15:45 |
| ali1234 | and it shouldn't be necessary to even mention that it is better than all the half finished, 10 years out of date window managers | 15:46 |
| ali1234 | but i will anyway | 15:46 |
| AlanBell | I think it is now at the point where 6 months work could make it really good for 12.04 | 15:46 |
| ali1234 | because otherwise someone will suggest i switch to fluxbox or something | 15:46 |
| ali1234 | or windowmaker | 15:46 |
| ali1234 | or fvwm95 | 15:46 |
| gordonjcp | I give up | 15:46 |
| ali1234 | AlanBell: iow exactly where it was 6 months ago? | 15:46 |
| KrimZon | I was trying the xubuntu beta | 15:46 |
| gordonjcp | I want to send a link to someone who uses Yahoo! messenger, and there is literally no way to do it | 15:47 |
| KrimZon | it's alright except seems to overheat my laptop more easily | 15:47 |
| ali1234 | gordonjcp: install pidgin | 15:47 |
| ali1234 | empathy is rubbish | 15:47 |
| KrimZon | and I couldn't get it to connect by sftp to my server in the file manager | 15:47 |
| KrimZon | which is important because I stream all my actual stuff from it | 15:47 |
| gordonjcp | ali1234: there's already a thing that looks like it should be for chat stuff | 15:47 |
| gordonjcp | why doesn't it work? | 15:48 |
| ali1234 | yes, it's called empathy, it's garbage, uninstall it | 15:48 |
| ali1234 | it doesn't work because the whole way it is architected is broken | 15:48 |
| ali1234 | empathy is a frontend for telepathy | 15:49 |
| ali1234 | telepathy was designed by nokia to use for messaging on mobile phones | 15:49 |
| ali1234 | telepathy is really good at that | 15:49 |
| ali1234 | empathy is a frontend that tries to make it into a general purpose instant messaging system, but completely fails | 15:49 |
| ali1234 | because it is designed by mac users who love adium | 15:49 |
| shauno | I love adium :) | 15:50 |
| ali1234 | do you use it for irc? | 15:50 |
| shauno | hell no | 15:50 |
| shauno | I've never seen an IM make the transition to irc gracefully | 15:51 |
| ali1234 | pidgin handles irc as well as anyone could need | 15:53 |
| ali1234 | anyway i need to reboot | 15:54 |
| ali1234 | the session thingy is telling me i need to reboot to finish the upgrade that i didn't do | 15:54 |
| ali1234 | what ever happened to gimp single window mode? | 15:57 |
| ali1234 | gimp is unusable with unity :( | 15:57 |
| ali1234 | single window mode would work much better | 15:57 |
| gordonjcp | ali1234: presumably the people working on it had a sudden flash of cluefulness and realised what a shockingly poor idea it would be | 15:57 |
| ali1234 | not really | 15:58 |
| gordonjcp | since every mockup seems to be falling into the same trap as Photoshop | 15:58 |
| gordonjcp | which is the most astoundingly retarded user interface in the world | 15:58 |
| ali1234 | i can't see a reason why i would want to put the toolbox on a different workspace than the image i'm working on | 15:58 |
| ali1234 | which is what always ends up happening | 15:58 |
| ali1234 | i suppose i could just run it inside xephyr | 15:59 |
| gordonjcp | YO DAWG I put a window manager in your window so it looks like you've got a root window in your root window | 15:59 |
| ali1234 | but that breaks menus | 15:59 |
| penguin42 | gimp seems to run OK in it here | 15:59 |
| penguin42 | ali1234: What particular breakage ? | 15:59 |
| ali1234 | last time i tried to run anything in xephyr on ubuntu, it had no menu because there was nothing to receive the global menu nonsense | 16:00 |
| ali1234 | i reported a bug about it | 16:00 |
| ali1234 | bug 774586 | 16:01 |
| lubotu3 | Launchpad bug 774586 in appmenu-gtk (Ubuntu) "Applications have no menu when run in a nested X session" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/774586 | 16:01 |
| ali1234 | yep, still happens | 16:03 |
| ali1234 | also xephyr is now incredibly slow for some reason | 16:03 |
| ali1234 | unsetting that var actually works | 16:04 |
| ali1234 | sadly it doesn't work in the main desktop | 16:05 |
| ali1234 | hmm maybe it does... | 16:06 |
| ali1234 | yeah, it does, as long as no windows from that app already open :) | 16:06 |
| gordonjcp | well, I'm getting way more graphics corruption in Ubuntu than on Arch | 16:11 |
| gordonjcp | http://askubuntu.com/questions/50966/screen-corruption-with-946g-82945g-gz <- pretty much this | 16:12 |
| penguin42 | gordonjcp: Which graphics card? | 16:12 |
| gordonjcp | Intel 82945 | 16:13 |
| ali1234 | who can explain what is going on here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/704953/ | 16:13 |
| penguin42 | gordonjcp: Hmm I run with a 945gm here and it's OK - do you run multiple monitors ? | 16:14 |
| gordonjcp | ali1234: you're still using the first ls it found | 16:14 |
| gordonjcp | penguin42: nope | 16:14 |
| ali1234 | gordonjcp: see output of 'which ls' | 16:14 |
| penguin42 | ali1234: Try doing hash -r | 16:14 |
| ali1234 | nice | 16:14 |
| ali1234 | thanks :) | 16:14 |
| penguin42 | ali1234: It doesn't bother searching the path every time if it already knew where it was from last time | 16:15 |
| ali1234 | next question: why doesn't this work: http://paste.ubuntu.com/704956/ | 16:16 |
| ali1234 | just running "/bin/sh gedit" does the same thing, ie nothing, it just hangs | 16:17 |
| ali1234 | probably better if i do this with the .desktop actually | 16:18 |
| ali1234 | hmm is synaptic supposed to have global menus? | 16:20 |
| ali1234 | maybe it can't cos it is running as root | 16:21 |
| ali1234 | oh i see the problem, infinite loop, lol | 16:23 |
| ali1234 | yay | 16:25 |
| ali1234 | great. so now i can decide on a per app basis, if the app uses global menus or not | 16:27 |
| ali1234 | with the default being to use them | 16:27 |
| gordonjcp | o_O | 16:28 |
| gordonjcp | python *2*? | 16:28 |
| ali1234 | yes, python 2 | 16:28 |
| ali1234 | python 3 is weird | 16:28 |
| gordonjcp | ugh | 16:29 |
| ali1234 | you can install it if you want | 16:29 |
| ali1234 | python is good like that | 16:29 |
| ali1234 | side by side installs | 16:29 |
| gordonjcp | yeah, that's how Arch does it | 16:29 |
| ali1234 | it's not installed by default because nothing uses it | 16:29 |
| gordonjcp | Python 3 for normal stuff, with Python 2 for unsupported legacy stuff | 16:29 |
| Azelphur | Python 2 isn't unsupported o.O | 16:30 |
| ali1234 | isn't arch basically gentoo for people who think gentoo is too stable? | 16:30 |
| gordonjcp | it's going away pretty soon | 16:30 |
| Azelphur | ...no it's not | 16:30 |
| ali1234 | lol no | 16:31 |
| ali1234 | python 2 is not going anywhere | 16:31 |
| Azelphur | There are many major huge libraries that are vitally important, that havn't even begun to be ported to python 3 yet | 16:31 |
| penguin42 | why do scripting libraries insist on making themselves unfortunately incompatible just as lots of stuff starts using them | 16:32 |
| ali1234 | because if they didn't we'd still all be stuck with perl | 16:32 |
| gordonjcp | Azelphur: like? | 16:33 |
| gordonjcp | Python 2 is supposed to be EOL by the end of this month... | 16:33 |
| ali1234 | that'sa good one | 16:33 |
| gordonjcp | http://www.python.org/download/releases/2.7/ | 16:35 |
| ali1234 | Python 2.7 is scheduled to be the last major version in the 2.x series before it moves into an extended maintenance period. | 16:35 |
| ali1234 | that doesn't sound like EOL to me | 16:35 |
| gordonjcp | oh, it is | 16:35 |
| ali1234 | EOL = we're never going to touch that code ever again | 16:35 |
| gordonjcp | which is pretty much the case | 16:35 |
| ali1234 | except that it isn't | 16:36 |
| gordonjcp | "bug fixes, if someone can be bothered submitting patches" | 16:36 |
| gordonjcp | right, fine, stick with your obsolete Python 2 stuff | 16:36 |
| ali1234 | i don't see twisted for python 3 | 16:37 |
| gordonjcp | you say that like it's a bad thing | 16:37 |
| ali1234 | django doesn't work on python 3 either | 16:38 |
| ali1234 | it's extremely bad if you run a large service which is totally dependent on it | 16:40 |
| ali1234 | here's a handy list i just found http://python3wos.appspot.com/ | 16:40 |
| ali1234 | hmm i didn't even know mock was written in python | 16:41 |
| gordonjcp | I used to use django but I'm moving away from it | 16:42 |
| MunkyJunky | Hey all - I had a HDD as ext4, put 120Gb of media on it, then Ubuntu decided it was an unrecognised file type and I can't mount it. Is there any way I can get my data back? Force it to mount as ext4? | 16:47 |
| ali1234 | as always it depends | 16:48 |
| ali1234 | the first thing you should do is copy the raw partition to another drive so you can work on it without causing further data loss | 16:48 |
| MunkyJunky | There's the thing - I have 80Gb free on my Ubuntu partition, and 50Gb free on my Win7 partition, but I dont have 120Gb on 1 disk spare. | 16:49 |
| ali1234 | "delete windows" | 16:49 |
| MunkyJunky | Tempting, but it has more stable wireless than Ubuntu | 16:49 |
| ali1234 | stop using wifi as well, wifi sucks | 16:49 |
| MunkyJunky | I don't have the option of not wifi, in student accommodation | 16:50 |
| ali1234 | well you can try to repair it live but don't blame me if you just make it worse | 16:51 |
| ali1234 | you should at least backup the mbr/partition table | 16:51 |
| MunkyJunky | If it all breaks, it'll be a mjorr pain, but it's all DVD rips ad such. I *can* rerip if I have to | 16:51 |
| MunkyJunky | I'd just really rather not, because it took a while to do | 16:51 |
| gordonjcp | MunkyJunky: is there an alternate superblock you can use? | 16:52 |
| ali1234 | does the disk have read errors? | 16:52 |
| ali1234 | does it make funny sounds? | 16:52 |
| ali1234 | is it external USB? | 16:52 |
| MunkyJunky | The disk only appears if I go into admin > disk util. It's not appearing as a mountable drive in nautilus, and there are no funny sounds. Doesn't sound like it's dying. | 16:53 |
| gordonjcp | MunkyJunky: forget the GUI tools | 16:53 |
| MunkyJunky | Internal, SATA, exactly the same mode as the other 2 drives in my PC | 16:53 |
| gordonjcp | put them utterly from your mind | 16:53 |
| MunkyJunky | Just saying, that's the only place I can see it | 16:53 |
| ali1234 | dump partition table and pastebin it | 16:53 |
| gordonjcp | MunkyJunky: okay, what ali1234 says about copying the raw image onto another disk is a Good Idea right now | 16:53 |
| gordonjcp | even if you have to go and buy another disk | 16:54 |
| gordonjcp | 2TB is about 60 quid these days | 16:54 |
| gordonjcp | it's not like you're never going to need the space | 16:54 |
| gordonjcp | *anyway* | 16:54 |
| ali1234 | it has to be bigger then the whole disk, not just the data on it | 16:54 |
| MunkyJunky | Yea, I'm thinking I'll be getting a new disk. I just want my data back first. ali1234, how do I get my partition table? | 16:54 |
| ali1234 | sudo fdisk -l /dev/whatever | 16:55 |
| MunkyJunky | I assume thats some cmd I don't know. | 16:55 |
| MunkyJunky | http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/704969/ | 16:55 |
| ali1234 | ok that looks fine | 16:56 |
| ali1234 | sda1 really? | 16:56 |
| ali1234 | it's really the primary? | 16:56 |
| MunkyJunky | That wasn't my coice, ubuntu throught that was a good idea. | 16:56 |
| MunkyJunky | *choice | 16:56 |
| ali1234 | ok | 16:56 |
| MunkyJunky | my install is running of sdb | 16:56 |
| gordonjcp | ali1234: makes no odds really | 16:57 |
| ali1234 | now do "sudo mount -t ext4 /dev/sda1 /mnt" | 16:57 |
| MunkyJunky | "mount: /dev/sda1 already mounted or /mnt busy" | 16:57 |
| ali1234 | actually dont do that | 16:57 |
| ali1234 | or... whatever | 16:57 |
| ali1234 | it's already mounted? | 16:57 |
| ali1234 | "mount" | 16:58 |
| ali1234 | look for sda1 | 16:58 |
| MunkyJunky | Nothing about sda1 in there | 16:58 |
| ali1234 | what about mnt? | 16:58 |
| MunkyJunky | nope | 16:59 |
| ali1234 | look on dmesg | 16:59 |
| ali1234 | anything about sda, filesystems, etc | 16:59 |
| MunkyJunky | nothing about anything related in there that I can see | 17:01 |
| ali1234 | pastebin all of it | 17:01 |
| MunkyJunky | just lots about my wireless | 17:01 |
| MunkyJunky | http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/704975/ | 17:02 |
| ali1234 | are you using wireless channel 13? | 17:03 |
| MunkyJunky | God I hope not, should be on 11 | 17:03 |
| ali1234 | you might get better results on a different channel | 17:03 |
| ali1234 | looks like you have CRDA problems | 17:03 |
| MunkyJunky | Is that wireless or HDD related? | 17:04 |
| ali1234 | wireless | 17:04 |
| ali1234 | i don't see any HDD problems | 17:04 |
| ali1234 | can you pastebin the mount output as well please | 17:04 |
| MunkyJunky | http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/704978/ | 17:05 |
| ali1234 | hmmmmmmm | 17:06 |
| ali1234 | sudo mount -o ro -t ext4 /dev/sda1 /mnt | 17:07 |
| ali1234 | pastebin full output of that please | 17:07 |
| MunkyJunky | "mount: /dev/sda1 already mounted or /mnt busy" | 17:08 |
| ali1234 | try to mount it somewhere else | 17:09 |
| MunkyJunky | Wherever I try mount, it's the same error | 17:10 |
| ali1234 | sudo fsck -N /dev/sda1 | 17:10 |
| ali1234 | i mean -n | 17:12 |
| MunkyJunky | fsck from util-linux-ng 2.17.2 | 17:12 |
| MunkyJunky | [/sbin/fsck.ext2 (1) -- /dev/sda1] fsck.ext2 /dev/sda1 | 17:12 |
| feisar | can I use --without-recommends with apt-get? | 17:13 |
| feisar | I'd like to install the ubuntu desktop and login screen on a server but not all the office stuff | 17:13 |
| MunkyJunky | So now I see why wireless sucks so much :/ | 17:21 |
| ali1234 | why? | 17:21 |
| MunkyJunky | I posted the last output you asked for, and then nothing happened, THEN I realised my wireless conked out. | 17:21 |
| MunkyJunky | Bloomin' thing. | 17:21 |
| gordonjcp | is there some way I'm missing to get Firefox to save its config between sessions in Ubuntu? | 17:30 |
| ali1234 | what config? | 17:30 |
| gordonjcp | ali1234: just basic stuff, like setting middle-click-paste to load a url | 17:30 |
| ali1234 | where do you configure that? | 17:31 |
| gordonjcp | about:config | 17:31 |
| ali1234 | http://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2006/06/msg00650.html | 17:33 |
| gordonjcp | ali1234: tbh that's about the last broken thing I'm prepared to put up with | 17:36 |
| gordonjcp | it's easier just to nuke this machine and put Arch back on it | 17:36 |
| gordonjcp | ali1234: it's also not storing cookies, so I have to disable google instant every time, log into sites every time | 17:43 |
| gordonjcp | it doesn't store passwords | 17:43 |
| ali1234 | your system sounds pretty messed up | 17:43 |
| penguin42 | odd, I've never seen a ff be so disobedient - mine generally remembers previous state | 17:43 |
| gordonjcp | I deleted and recreated .mozilla | 17:43 |
| ali1234 | mine remembers previous state even when i don't want it to | 17:44 |
| penguin42 | ali1234: Can be very embarrassing | 17:44 |
| ali1234 | any time i quit and restart it, i always get back all 800 tabs | 17:44 |
| ali1234 | even though i specifically told it not to save tabs | 17:44 |
| penguin42 | oh oh, ali1234 is another one that has the entire internet loaded into his browser | 17:44 |
| ali1234 | the only time i quit FF is when i have too many tabs and don't want to close them all 1 at a time | 17:44 |
| ali1234 | so it is annoying when they all come back | 17:45 |
| ali1234 | i think the problem is that FF crashes 50% of then time instead of exiting normally | 17:45 |
| ali1234 | so it thinks it crashed and tries to restore | 17:45 |
| mark_b | @ali1234 try the close all other tabs option | 17:45 |
| ali1234 | but i have 20 windows as well | 17:45 |
| ali1234 | unity makes window management so difficult that i just open new windows and forget about the old ones | 17:46 |
| ali1234 | it's easier than trying to find the old one | 17:46 |
| gordonjcp | this is just rubbish | 17:52 |
| shauno | boy this place is cheery today | 18:12 |
| MartijnVdS | *\o/* | 18:12 |
| AlanBell | setting up oneiric for a 13 year old boy, what stuff should I put on it? | 18:18 |
| MartijnVdS | the internet | 18:18 |
| chrisccoulson | AlanBell, http://projects.gnome.org/nanny/ ? ;) | 18:19 |
| MartijnVdS | Humble Indie Bundle 1-5 | 18:20 |
| MartijnVdS | or whatever they're called | 18:20 |
| zleap | AlanBell, games, | 18:24 |
| Pernig | possibly Skype and some way of getting on MSN? | 18:25 |
| Pernig | although the kids don't seem to use MSN so much these days | 18:25 |
| zleap | its msn live messenger or somethijng | 18:25 |
| AlanBell | chrisccoulson: not *my* 13 year old, I don't care what he looks at on the internet :) | 18:25 |
| AlanBell | zleap: yeah, I put the scummvm games and openarena on it so far | 18:26 |
| zleap | i guess that is his parents responsibilkity, however are they able to set up content filtering | 18:26 |
| MartijnVdS | AlanBell: World of Goo? | 18:26 |
| zleap | open arena is popular at the rugby club, had a few kids playing that today (under 11's) | 18:26 |
| AlanBell | doubt it zleap, but really I have no guilt about letting him use the real internet | 18:27 |
| zleap | ok | 18:27 |
| AlanBell | MartijnVdS: good suggestions, but I want to stick to stuff in the repos initially | 18:27 |
| zleap | and filterng can get int eh way sometimes, i remembher helping at a primary school trying to research the plymouth blitz was a real issue | 18:28 |
| MartijnVdS | AlanBell: WoG is in the "paid" software-centre bit | 18:28 |
| Pernig | AlanBell: i can lend you the key to my humble bundles if you like | 18:29 |
| AlanBell | ah, and that is not populated on oneiric yet it seems | 18:29 |
| AlanBell | Pernig: I will tell him about the humble bundles | 18:29 |
| Pernig | ok | 18:29 |
| zleap | scratch is good if he wants to learn programming / animation stuff | 18:30 |
| AlanBell | can't find that in the search oddly enough, I am sure scratch is in the repos somewhere | 18:31 |
| shauno | a 13yo? rename firefox to facebook. set fb as the home page. you're set. | 18:31 |
| zleap | AlanBell, yeah think it is, otherwise its scratch.mit.edu i think | 18:31 |
| AlanBell | ah, DVD playback, need to set that up | 18:32 |
| zleap | what about iphone or mp3 player stuff | 18:33 |
| shauno | I kinda miss the days where a valid answer was "nothing, the built-in basic interpreter will keep them entertained years" | 18:33 |
| zleap | no ipad | 18:33 |
| zleap | ipod | 18:33 |
| zleap | whjat ever the music thingy is | 18:33 |
| AlanBell | banshee, but that is installed by default | 18:33 |
| shauno | you don't really need an mp3 player anymore. as long as flash works, they'll use youtube as one big jukebox | 18:33 |
| AlanBell | youtube and bbc iplayer both work fine | 18:34 |
| zleap | i click on install in software centre to install a game and noting happens, could this have something to do with somepackages being in an inconsistant state | 18:34 |
| AlanBell | yes | 18:35 |
| AlanBell | !dvd | 18:35 |
| lubotu3 | Ubuntu's default installation and repositories do not include packages needed to play commercial DVDs for legal reasons. For information on adding them, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedFormats/PlayingDVDs | For information on the legalities involved, see the "DVD" section of https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FreeFormats | 18:35 |
| zleap | AlanBell, thanks i need t find some instructions that work to fix that | 18:37 |
| popey | of all the video formats why is it that nautilus can thumbnail my flv, mkv and mp4, but _not_ the OGV! | 18:44 |
| GirlyGirl | popey: Really? | 18:46 |
| GirlyGirl | bye | 18:54 |
| popey | yes GirlyGirl, really. | 19:06 |
| faiob | Hi all I have a problem with authentication of the update of synaptic esque someone has a solution to this problem? | 19:23 |
| brobostigon | faiob: pastebin the exact error messages for us please. | 19:24 |
| faiob | http://paste.ubuntu.com/705012/ | 19:24 |
| faiob | :) | 19:26 |
| brobostigon | faiob: yes, apt is trying to pull packages from a repo, you dont have the ssl keys for. | 19:26 |
| brobostigon | just add the keys. | 19:26 |
| faiob | yes | 19:26 |
| faiob | but for dépot ubuntu lucid i don't know to do ... . | 19:27 |
| brobostigon | what is the repo addr, you are using? | 19:27 |
| faiob | http://archive.canonical.com/ubuntu | 19:27 |
| === hcfd__ is now known as hcfd | ||
| brobostigon | faiob: i would ignore the error, that is a valid and trusted repo. but there must be a matching key, for apt. and i dont remember what it is, or where to find it, but i would start with looking with help.ubuntu.com and the wiki. | 19:30 |
| faiob | OK the key for my ubuntu archive Automatic Signing Key is 437D05B5 | 19:32 |
| brobostigon | faiob: add that, with the software sources app, i think. | 19:34 |
| Azelphur | hmm, Anyone know how to get keyboard volume control to work in XUbuntu? | 19:36 |
| faiob | who i do ? | 19:37 |
| Azelphur | default install when I use the volume control I get a slider, but no volume change. | 19:37 |
| directhex | faiob: archive.canonical.com is not an ubuntu repo. it contains only a few closed-source apps | 19:37 |
| directhex | i.e. the packages you're getting complaints about are *not* from archive.canonical.com | 19:37 |
| faiob | directhex: wget -q http://download.tuxfamily.org/glxdock/repository/cairo-dock.gpg -O- | sudo apt-key add - | 19:39 |
| faiob | it's for cairo but i'haven't cairo in my ubuntu | 19:39 |
| directhex | faiob: that adds the key for that specific cairo-dock repo. still doesn't host xulrunner-1.9.2 | 19:39 |
| faiob | for my dépot ubuntu i do http://???.gpg -O- | sudo apt-key add - | 19:40 |
| directhex | the ubuntu-keyring package contains the ubuntu keyring files. reinstalling that should ensure that any valid ubuntu-signed repos are fine. http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=ubuntu-keyring | 19:40 |
| faiob | thank | 19:41 |
| faiob | thank-you very much i do | 19:43 |
| faiob | it's run after download the ubuntu-keyring with apt-update | 19:51 |
| faiob | :-D | 19:51 |
| faiob | good for me | 19:52 |
| constrictor | about to upgrade!!! | 20:44 |
| silner | constrictor, to the beta? | 20:45 |
| constrictor | it's past beta though isn't it | 20:45 |
| silner | Probably I haven't looked. I'm waiting | 20:46 |
| constrictor | sliner according to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricReleaseSchedule we are in pre-release images with final coming out next week | 20:46 |
| constrictor | around this time it's generally stable | 20:46 |
| constrictor | but that's just me | 20:47 |
| ali1234 | apport has been switched off in the last update | 20:48 |
| ali1234 | so it's pretty much done | 20:48 |
| silner | Yeah I ought to grab it actually. I didn't really get on with 11.04 so I've lost touch a bit | 20:48 |
| ali1234 | there isn't much difference | 20:49 |
| ali1234 | if you didn't like 11.04 you won't like this either | 20:49 |
| silner | I've been using Lubuntu 11.04 and Fedora 15 Xfce - bit of new era refusenik I'm afraid | 20:50 |
| ali1234 | i cannot get xfce to use the right font size | 20:51 |
| constrictor | ali1234: 11.04 or 11.10 | 20:51 |
| ali1234 | any | 20:51 |
| constrictor | are you using xubuntu or did you just install xfce? | 20:52 |
| ali1234 | i just installed xfce | 20:52 |
| silner | ali1234, I've been with it too long to remember how I changed it now. I think I read something about changing it system wide including cli fonts | 20:52 |
| constrictor | i had to do mine individually | 20:53 |
| constrictor | so i went to system settings and changed the fonts there | 20:53 |
| ali1234 | yes well the problem is that half of it... you can't change the fonts | 20:53 |
| silner | Actually I think I changed the sizes - was quite happy with font families | 20:53 |
| constrictor | and I had to change my font in the terminal profile settings | 20:53 |
| constrictor | as well as desktop settings | 20:53 |
| ali1234 | so you can make the panels etc all use nearly the right font size | 20:53 |
| constrictor | that did it for me | 20:53 |
| constrictor | yeah | 20:53 |
| ali1234 | but it is a tiny bit off and that totally screws up the hinting | 20:53 |
| ali1234 | and then you have gaps in the middle of words and it just looks bad | 20:53 |
| ali1234 | like KDE on a bad day | 20:54 |
| constrictor | mine seems fine | 20:54 |
| constrictor | lol | 20:54 |
| silner | But I'm using Xfce with Fedora. Probably not that different though | 20:54 |
| constrictor | ahhh | 20:54 |
| constrictor | i'm on xubuntu but that should not be an issues should it | 20:54 |
| constrictor | ? | 20:54 |
| ali1234 | and then there's a bunch of things that don't have modifiable font size and those are unreadable because the font is abut 3mm high | 20:54 |
| constrictor | lol | 20:55 |
| silner | I have been told it's harder to find help for the buntus cos they change more from the default Xfce system, but I can't say I've noticed | 20:55 |
| ali1234 | i don't need help | 20:55 |
| ali1234 | all i require is that the software works properly | 20:55 |
| silner | I can't remember anything out of the ordinary with F15 Xfce ali1234 - what exactly was wrong with the fonts? | 20:56 |
| ali1234 | well, you know hinting? | 20:56 |
| ali1234 | it's wrong with xfce | 20:57 |
| ali1234 | because the screen dpi is totally wrong | 20:57 |
| ali1234 | and even if you override it | 20:57 |
| ali1234 | you can't get the font to be the right size | 20:57 |
| ali1234 | 10 pt is too small and 11 pt is too big | 20:57 |
| ali1234 | and since it is off by less than 1 pixel that screws up the hinting | 20:58 |
| silner | I don't think that problem exists in F15 ali1234 - sorry I misunderstood you earlier | 20:58 |
| ali1234 | yeah but i won't touch fedora | 20:58 |
| silner | I didn't know what the term hinting meant. I was ignorant there :( | 20:59 |
| constrictor | I use 9 pt | 20:59 |
| constrictor | :) | 20:59 |
| silner | I'll have to look to see what I use | 21:01 |
| silner | Looks like 10pt | 21:01 |
| silner | I used Fedora for the laptop mainly cos it supported my pcmcia wifi card and Ubuntu 11.04 didn't | 21:02 |
| ali1234 | that makes no sense | 21:04 |
| ali1234 | drivers are a question of kernel support | 21:04 |
| ali1234 | picking a whole distro on the basis of which kernel version is has is just silly | 21:04 |
| constrictor | ali1234: i'll have to agree with silner that it's not just about the kernel | 21:05 |
| silner | Do they defintely have the same kernel version number though? | 21:05 |
| ali1234 | it doesn't matter | 21:05 |
| ali1234 | backporting drivers is easy | 21:05 |
| constrictor | if it was there'd be only one linux distro | 21:05 |
| silner | Surely things get added in later kernels? | 21:05 |
| ali1234 | there's a whole package for it | 21:05 |
| silner | It's not a big deal to change distros though ali1234 ? | 21:05 |
| ali1234 | of course not | 21:06 |
| ali1234 | but what you've done is like choosing a car based on the tyres it comes with | 21:06 |
| silner | Besides, I could find any info on Edup pcmcia cards ali1234 | 21:07 |
| silner | So it wasn't easy for me to see hw to make it works | 21:07 |
| ali1234 | cardbus is plug and play compatible | 21:07 |
| ali1234 | the brand name of the card is irrelevant | 21:07 |
| ali1234 | all that matters is what chipset it uses | 21:08 |
| silner | All I can say it I tried it in both and only one worked and it was dual booting at the time | 21:08 |
| === hcfd_ is now known as hcffd | ||
| === hcffd is now known as hcfd | ||
| davmor2 | czajkowski: hello fancy putting Ireland and England out of the cup you muppet :D | 21:12 |
| faiob | hi all always me, after setup with synaptic the packtage elfutils, i don't found elfutils source directory in my ubuntu 10.04 LTS , peapol know? | 21:13 |
| faiob | http://paste.ubuntu.com/705068/ | 21:14 |
| davmor2 | faiob: the ii at the front means that the package is installed | 21:17 |
| silner | ali1234, I found some solutions but they all involved using ndiswrapper http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1369920 | 21:17 |
| davmor2 | faiob: the source folder might not be called elfutils | 21:18 |
| ali1234 | well the first thing you should know is that ubuntu forums are full of bad advice | 21:18 |
| faiob | davmor2 thank you | 21:18 |
| davmor2 | faiob: try opening synaptic and right click on the package and select installed files | 21:18 |
| faiob | but who i doing for found | 21:19 |
| davmor2 | faiob: that should give you a break down of what files and folder were installed by the package | 21:19 |
| silner | ali1234, I don't doubt it, but what I did notice was on Ubuntu users were having the problem - that's what got me curious to try another distro - as you say it should be easy to solve - but I failed and I couldn't see any successes, by searching | 21:19 |
| ali1234 | like i said the only thing that matters is what kernel modules you have | 21:20 |
| silner | ali1234, Then Ubuntu must have skipped the right kernel because it worked with F14 and F15 and Zenwalk actually | 21:21 |
| silner | ali1234, I always meant to try it with Debian unstable out of curiosity but I never got around to it | 21:23 |
| silner | ali1234, Anyway that's the only hardware issue I've had, so I'm not up in arms about it and I've grown to like Fedora (without hating Ubuntu) so it was a useful experience | 21:24 |
| bigcalm | What happens in 2 days, 7.5 hours? | 21:30 |
| AlanBell | we don't know yet bigcalm | 21:31 |
| bigcalm | That's terrible | 21:31 |
| AlanBell | or didn't know, last time I checked in #awholenewworld | 21:31 |
| AlanBell | it might be the aliens landing | 21:31 |
| bigcalm | I for one welcome our alien overlords | 21:32 |
| ali1234 | i'm guessing the answer won't be "hey, we fixed all the bugs" | 21:33 |
| bigcalm | heh | 21:33 |
| * constrictor is away: Coffee break | 21:34 | |
| bigcalm | 6am Wednesday. Don't think I'll get up early just to find out | 21:34 |
| === LjL is now known as funkyHat5 | ||
| === funkyHat5 is now known as LjL | ||
| gord | i think he is broken... | 22:31 |
| phillw | I'm sure the nice people @ freenode would explain :P | 22:35 |
| phillw | that's a good k-line :) | 22:35 |
| daftykins | what's that? | 22:35 |
| popey | ask LjL | 22:37 |
| daftykins | no i'm asking here! | 22:38 |
| popey | he is here | 22:38 |
| daftykins | nevermind then. | 22:39 |
| phillw | daftykins: for people to be k-lined, there is a good reason. That is the best I can say without knowing why. A K-line is a full ban from freenode (not just ubuntu channels etc). | 22:41 |
| shauno | having 12 copies of the same person is usually a good reason | 22:42 |
| daftykins | nah i just joined so i don't even know who got k-lined, let alone why ;) | 22:42 |
| gordonjcp | gord: ping? | 22:42 |
| phillw | daftykins: none of the channel OPs bite, the last thing we want is to ban people. above channel OPs there is also governance. But if someone gets K-lined... it is for a darn good reason. | 22:43 |
| LjL | funkyHat was k-lined because he's a terrible troll and a danger to freenode | 22:44 |
| LjL | also, because his connection was misbehaving :P | 22:44 |
| daftykins | i have absolutely no idea what you're talking about | 22:44 |
| LjL | i dunno, i was summoned | 22:44 |
| daftykins | nevermind then, i'll go back to other channels :) | 22:44 |
| phillw | LjL: That was what I was thinking, but I do not hang around on the freenode area & only pop on briefly when summonsed... same as for the ubuntu-ops-team area. most of the time, we can hold our own areas and use our Ops. | 22:45 |
| daftykins | someone needs to get permanently assigned to rework #u-offtopic | 22:47 |
| daftykins | ;) | 22:47 |
| * LjL starts by banning you :P | 22:48 | |
| daftykins | weee \o/ | 22:48 |
| phillw | daftykins: I'm on #lubuntu-offtopic, there are only so many channels any of us can get involved with. We ask that the channels run themselves reasonably. :) | 22:49 |
| daftykins | to be honest i should remove it from my join | 22:49 |
| hamitron | what is the point in a room for ubuntu, where people talk about "other things"? | 22:51 |
| LjL | that's a good question, and one that has created more uprising than you can imagine :) | 22:51 |
| daftykins | well actually, if you talk about Linux'y stuff that isn't Ubuntu specific, in #ubuntu, you get moaned at | 22:53 |
| daftykins | so i thought that's what that channel should've been for ;x | 22:53 |
| hamitron | ah | 22:53 |
| daftykins | but instead people trashtalk 24/7 instead \o/ | 22:53 |
| hamitron | worst I've done in #ubuntu is paste my password | 22:53 |
| hamitron | :/ | 22:53 |
| LjL | daftykins: that's one possible intepretation | 22:53 |
| daftykins | hamitron: wewps! | 22:53 |
| LjL | daftykins: but not the one currently used | 22:53 |
| daftykins | LjL: naw? | 22:54 |
| hamitron | daftykins, I was expecting a kick, as it was a rude password | 22:54 |
| hamitron | :D | 22:54 |
| daftykins | ^_^ | 22:54 |
| LjL | hamitron: sometimes when ops rolls eyes too hard they become unable to kick properly :< | 22:55 |
| hamitron | haha | 22:55 |
| LjL | it happened to me, i was looking for my eyes all over the room | 22:55 |
| LjL | well, not *looking* for | 22:55 |
| hamitron | feeling? ;/ | 22:55 |
| LjL | twas squishy | 22:56 |
| hamitron | tbh, I never stayed in #ubuntu after that | 22:56 |
| hamitron | was too embarased | 22:56 |
| hamitron | and it felt cold in there | 22:56 |
| hamitron | but it gave me reason to change passwords anyway :) | 22:58 |
| phillw | hamitron: the idea for offtopic channels is for that. We have exchanged some wonderful recipes on ours. Some of which I've cooked... lovely! | 23:05 |
| hamitron | oh | 23:06 |
| hamitron | you've just won me over | 23:06 |
| hamitron | food ;) | 23:06 |
| daftykins | :D | 23:08 |
| daftykins | tonight i may do some more nutella on toast | 23:08 |
| phillw | hamitron: it was getting that much fun, that I did joke that I'd be holding a darning session for socks, and people were interested! But, yeah we do like swapping recipes.... As to getting the ingredients, the does need to internet :P | 23:08 |
| daftykins | O_. | 23:08 |
| phillw | Essence of smoke took a bit of finding :) | 23:09 |
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