[15:01] <ara> jedimike, not sure how many people will show up for the UF meeting :)
[15:02] <victorp> o/
[15:02] <ara> victorp, schwuk, brendand, akgraner?
[15:02] <schwuk> ara: ?
[15:03] <brendand> hi
[15:03] <victorp> ara?
[15:03]  * schwuk only just joined
[15:03] <akgraner> o/ I'm here
[15:03] <ara> schwuk, I was just counting :)
[15:03] <jedimike> o/ here too
[15:03] <ara> OK, let's get started
[15:03] <ara> #startmeeting
[15:03] <meetingology> Meeting started Mon Oct 10 15:03:28 2011 UTC.  The chair is ara. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlanBell/mootbot.
[15:03] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[15:03] <ara> Today we don't have a fixed agenda, just a Q&A + general discussion
[15:04] <ara> so, if you want to participate, just raise your hand
[15:04] <ara> ..
[15:04] <victorp> o/
[15:04] <victorp> has everyone submitted their systems yet? ..
[15:04]  * ara has submitted hers
[15:05]  * brendand has
[15:05]  * victorp got 4+ stars
[15:05]  * brendand needs blank cd's and a firewire device ;)
[15:06] <ara> jedimike, I have seen that my system still shows vga external monitor result
[15:06] <jedimike> ara: what's the url for your system?
[15:06] <ara> http://107.20.216.30/11.10/LENOVO/4171CTO/I:D8Wuop:Ek:I8g:CPe:B9ip:EZ0:I8g:BI3:I8g/
[15:06] <victorp> brendand, is blanks CDs not a skipeable core test?
[15:06] <victorp> jedimike, ^^
[15:07] <jedimike> victorp, brendand, yes it is skippable
[15:07] <victorp> brendand, oh you mean for 5 stars
[15:07] <brendand> victorp - exactly
[15:07] <victorp> ara - so small community then ;)
[15:08] <brendand> o/
[15:08] <jedimike> ara: can you raise that as a bug, it shouldn't be in there now
[15:08] <ara> jedimike, mmm, didn't I raise a bug about that before?
[15:09] <ara> jedimike, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-friendly/+bug/868972
[15:09] <ara> you lied!
[15:09] <ara> :D
[15:09] <ara> brendand, go ahead
[15:10] <jedimike> ara: yes and we got it fixed, but this is a different bug. The problem is that the powersaving test is in 'monitor' which is 'vga external video' in UF
[15:10] <brendand> i just wanted to ask how many people are seeing the annoying problem with checkbox hiding when running tests?
[15:10] <brendand> ..
[15:10] <ara> jedimike, OK, I'll raise a bug
[15:10]  * ara sees the annoying bug
[15:12] <victorp> me
[15:12] <victorp> brendand, is it a checkbox issue or unity?
[15:14] <brendand> victorp - i don't think it is a checkbox issue
[15:14] <brendand> victorp - same thing doesn't happen in unity 2-d for example
[15:14] <victorp> so do we know if it affects other tools/dialogs?
[15:14] <victorp> brendand, ah
[15:15] <ara> victorp, but it might be a corner case that appeared because the gtk architecture of checkbox is weird
[15:15] <ara> the main window is a gtkdialog, and the progress dialog is actually a gtkwindow
[15:16] <victorp> yes yes
[15:17] <brendand> i was about to say. yes
[15:17] <brendand> i haven't found an existing bug yet
[15:18] <brendand> we could change the ui to avoid the necessity to repeatedly hide the dialog (e.g. by building the progress bar into the main dialog)
[15:18] <brendand> but no quick fix it seems
[15:19] <ara> akgraner, did you have the opportunity to give submit your system lately?
[15:22] <ara> seems like akgraner is not around
[15:23] <ara> OK, any other comments?
[15:23] <ara> going once
[15:24] <ara> going twice
[15:24] <ara> #endmeeting
[15:24] <meetingology> Meeting ended Mon Oct 10 15:24:51 2011 UTC.
[15:24] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2011/ubuntu-meeting.2011-10-10-15.03.moin.txt
[15:25] <ara> OK, thanks all! and tell your friends to submit their systems! :)
[15:25] <akgraner> I'm sorry I lost wifi and had to run cable right quick...:-(
[15:26] <ara> akgraner, no worries, actually I was asking you if you had had the opportunity to submit your system lately
[15:27] <akgraner> ara upgrading now and will be doing that once I get the install completed
[15:27] <ara> akgraner, awesome, let us know how that went
[15:27] <akgraner> will do
[18:59]  * micahg looks for people waiting for the DMB meeting...
[19:00] <Laney> hello
[19:02] <micahg> bdrung, cody-somerville, persia, stgraber meeting?
[19:02] <cody-somerville> Hi
[19:04] <micahg> hi geser, here for the meeting?
[19:04] <geser> am I wrong?
[19:04] <Laney> oh so right
[19:04] <micahg> well, at least we have quorom now
[19:04] <Laney> do youw ant to chair? :-)
[19:05] <Laney> at least we have no applicants
[19:05] <micahg> right (which isn't a good thing per se)
[19:06] <cody-somerville> I think it is the first time thats happened in the history of the DMB :P
[19:06] <cody-somerville> However, today is a stat holiday in the US and Canada which might provide a partial explanation.
[19:07]  * micahg will be on next meeting's agenda hopefully
[19:07] <Laney> exciting!
[19:07] <Laney> bah
[19:07] <Laney> #startmeeting
[19:07] <meetingology> Meeting started Mon Oct 10 19:07:40 2011 UTC.  The chair is Laney. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlanBell/mootbot.
[19:07] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[19:07] <Laney> you slackers :P
[19:07]  * micahg hugs laney
[19:08] <Laney> #topic Review of previous action items
[19:08] <micahg> Laney: I chaired last week :P
[19:08] <Laney> #subtopic Laney to start thread on ubuntu-devel about renaming UCD
[19:08] <Laney> done, did everyone see it?
[19:08] <micahg> yes, I still need to respond
[19:09] <Laney> i think we should let it run until the next meeting and then look before than
[19:09] <Laney> can someone volunteer to prepare a summary?
[19:09] <Laney> and/or proposals
[19:11] <Laney> erm, ok, never mind
[19:11] <Laney> #subtopic jono to ask Daniel to update https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers to be easier to read
[19:11] <Laney> he did this, the url is at http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/JzyYyxw0Qb
[19:12] <Laney> please edit it at your leisure, at some point i imagine daniel will commit it to the wiki
[19:12] <Laney> #subtopic cody-somerville to write some documentation on how to endorse someone
[19:12] <Laney> not done?
[19:12] <cody-somerville> I've started this but haven't had much time to work on it since.
[19:13] <Laney> ok, hopefully next time
[19:13]  * bdrung arrives.
[19:13] <cody-somerville> I'm wondering, is most folks on the DMB going to be at UDS?
[19:13] <Laney> yep
[19:13] <cody-somerville> *are
[19:14] <micahg> well, I'll be there and I assume stgraber will be as well
[19:14] <cody-somerville> I think it would be a good idea to schedule a private meeting for the DMB.
[19:14]  * geser is not at UDS
[19:15]  * bdrung will not at UDS
[19:15] <Laney> haven't seen persia in an age, don't know if he is still around
[19:16] <geser> he is probably busy with other stuff and will reappear in a couple of weeks (like last time)
[19:16] <cody-somerville> geser, bdrung: Would you be able to participate remotely in such a meeting?
[19:16] <bdrung> cody-somerville: depends on the time
[19:17] <Laney> would have to be late I guess
[19:17] <geser> depends on the time (and if I need to get any special tools setup to participate)
[19:17] <Laney> for .euers
[19:17] <bdrung> how late?
[19:17] <bdrung> late is good in most cases
[19:18] <micahg> well, we'll be at UTC-4
[19:18] <Laney> right, well let's work it on on list
[19:18] <Laney> will we have a scheduled meeting then?
[19:18] <Laney> no
[19:18] <Laney> cody-somerville: can you mail marianna and such to get a room?
[19:19] <cody-somerville> Laney, Aye.
[19:19] <Laney> I think they usually have conference call facilities, but no idea how it works
[19:19] <Laney> carrying on
[19:19] <cody-somerville> I'll see what I can come up with.
[19:19] <Laney> #subtopic stgraber to publish packageset generation script so the rest of the DMB can help maintain it
[19:20] <Laney> not here, does anyone know if this happened?
[19:21] <cody-somerville> I think it may have
[19:21] <cody-somerville> can't say for sure though
[19:21] <geser> the page with the results was mailed, but not the script itself IIRC
[19:21] <Laney> a branch under ~developer-membership-board on LP would be good
[19:21] <Laney> i'll poke him to publish it
[19:22] <Laney> #action Laney to poke stgraber about publishing package set script
[19:22] <meetingology> ACTION: Laney to poke stgraber about publishing package set script
[19:22] <Laney> #subtopic James Page
[19:22] <Laney> approved for core-dev
[19:22] <Laney> micahg: where do we stand with motu?
[19:22] <micahg> that was taken care of
[19:22] <Laney> application falls?
[19:22] <micahg> Laney: well, yeah, I didn't send out the second vote for MOTU since it seemed pointeless
[19:23] <Laney> ok, as long as there is nothing left to do
[19:23] <Laney> i want to get this position statement out though
[19:23] <Laney> can you take care of it, if everybody is ok with the proposed text?
[19:23] <cody-somerville> Laney, Position statement on what again?
[19:23] <micahg> before the next meeting?  yeah, I can do that
[19:23]  * bdrung is ok with it.
[19:23] <Laney> how we handle people applying for redundant permissions
[19:23] <Laney> 'social' applications
[19:25] <cody-somerville> Is there any pressing reason to release a statement ASAP? I haven't read it yet.
[19:25] <Laney> not ASAP, but I want it to happen
[19:25] <Laney> please do comment
[19:26] <cody-somerville> Without reading it, I'm inclined to say it is probably something that I'd like for us to discuss at our meeting at UDS.
[19:26] <Laney> ok, well...
[19:26] <Laney> #action cody-somerville to follow up on position statement
[19:26] <meetingology> ACTION: cody-somerville to follow up on position statement
[19:26] <Laney> (on-list)
[19:26] <Laney> :-)
[19:26] <Laney> #topic Administrative Matters
[19:26] <Laney> do we have anything left to discuss about the survey?
[19:27]  * cody-somerville doesn't at this point.
[19:28] <Laney> let's leave that
[19:28] <Laney> onto the meat
[19:29] <Laney> #subtopic Continue discussion about our package set management workflows
[19:29] <Laney> I had a proposal that I typed out somewhere, but I can't remember where
[19:29] <Laney> basically
[19:30] <Laney>  - As a matter of policy, each package set has a single uploader, which is a team. The DMB can either handle applications to the team or delegate to an appopriate council if one is set up.
[19:31] <Laney>  - Applications for new package sets must come with some clear criteria that the DMB can apply when adding subsequent packages in future
[19:32] <Laney>   - Package additions are done by requesting on devel-permissions. Any DMB member will check against the criteria and add if it matches (or feed back if not).
[19:32] <Laney> possibly some kind of objection raising period?
[19:32] <bdrung> sounds good so far
[19:33] <Laney> so the only real change is that we require these criteria when approving new sets
[19:33] <Laney> I really dislike making people come to meetings for these kind of additions which in most cases should be a formality
[19:34]  * bdrung agrees.
[19:35]  * micahg also agrees
[19:35] <geser> I agree too but unless we have a policy how to manage package sets, I prefered to have it done in the meeting just to be sure (as the original list of packages was also vote on in a meeting)
[19:36] <Laney> what kind of policy?
[19:36] <Laney> you mean, unless we agree on something like this?
[19:36] <geser> any policy, till now there is no policy at all
[19:36] <Laney> aye
[19:38] <Laney> so I suppose a policy should be added to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers/TeamDelegation ?
[19:38] <Laney> or is there some other page?
[19:39] <ScottK> Since you're delegated from the TB, it might not be bad to have them approve the policy.
[19:39] <ScottK> Then there's no question about are you doing it right.
[19:39] <geser> IIRC there is no documentation of package sets at all (besides many people knowing that they exist)
[19:39] <Laney> that is true, I will copy them in
[19:39]  * Laney thinks TeamDelegation is what we have
[19:41] <Laney> so if I do that, and the TB thinks the idea is ok, can someone else volunteer to mail people running existing package sets and ask them to come up with criteria?
[19:41] <Laney> #action Laney to write down proposal for streamlining packageset changes and mail DMB and TB
[19:41] <meetingology> ACTION: Laney to write down proposal for streamlining packageset changes and mail DMB and TB
[19:43] <Laney> :(
[19:44] <micahg> Laney: I can talk to the packageset owners'
[19:44] <micahg> just might not happen before UDS
[19:45] <Laney> no massive rush
[19:45] <Laney> just ping them all "hey, you can make it easy to get new packages if you tell us how to evaluate them"
[19:46] <Laney> #action micahg to ping packageset owners to write down criteria for package membership
[19:46] <meetingology> ACTION: micahg to ping packageset owners to write down criteria for package membership
[19:46] <Laney> #topic AOB
[19:47] <micahg> next chair?
[19:48] <Laney> ah yes
[19:48] <Laney> #topic next chair
[19:48] <Laney> we should become more systematic
[19:48] <Laney> alphabetical rotation or so
[19:49] <micahg> well, I did last week ,so stgraber? (also not here :))
[19:49] <Laney> well volunteered!
[19:50] <ajmitch> poor stgraber
[19:50]  * Laney cackles 
[19:50] <Laney> #topic aob again
[19:50] <Laney> going
[19:50] <Laney> going…
[19:51] <Laney> gone, thanks all
[19:51] <Laney> #endmeeting
[19:51] <meetingology> Meeting ended Mon Oct 10 19:51:21 2011 UTC.
[19:51] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2011/ubuntu-meeting.2011-10-10-19.07.moin.txt
[19:53] <micahg> thanks Laney
[19:53] <micahg> Laney: now that I think about it, we could've gone reverse alphabetical order
[19:53] <Laney> ah well
[19:57] <Laney> micahg: looking forward to seeing you on the other side of the fence again next time!
[19:57]  * Laney turns up the heat
[19:58] <micahg> Laney: hehe, I guess I'll be doing some jumping next meeting, I better warm up :)
[19:58]  * bdrung want to have the 'reverse alphabetical order' card
[19:58]  * micahg wonders if it was wise to volunteer the chair for the next meeting when he's an applicant...
[19:59] <broder> omg canonical biases :-P
[19:59] <geser> micahg: you can interview then yourself :)
[19:59]  * ajmitch regrets not volunteering for a DMB nomination now :)
[19:59] <micahg> geser: no, I volunteered someone else
[20:01] <geser> ajmitch: your next chance is around Jan/Feb 2012 when 5/7 of the DMB expire
[20:03] <ajmitch> no doubt most will stand for reelection
[20:03] <micahg> geser: the term was only 1 yr?
[20:04] <geser> micahg: I'm not sure anymore if it's 1 or 2 years
[20:04] <micahg> the next election should be for bdrung's seat next year sometime
[20:05] <geser> micahg: cody-somerville, persia, Laney, stgraber and me expire on 2012-02-13 (a good chance to ajmitch to get a seat)
[20:05] <geser> bdrung has time till Nov 2012
[20:06] <Laney> launchpad thinks we are 1, which is fine by me
[20:07] <ajmitch> why is Laney the only special one with a short term on LP?
[20:07] <geser> only micahg got elected for 2 years :) (not sure about bdrung)
[20:07]  * micahg also has 2 yrs, thinks there was an error seeding the elected from Feb
[20:07]  * bdrung got elected for 2 years
[20:08] <geser> ajmitch: the others got re-elected Feb 2011
[20:08]  * micahg will write the TB about the error unless asked not to
[20:08] <ajmitch> as long as the team stays with enough members, it shouldn't  matter too much
[20:13] <geser> micahg: I don't mind but I hoped to have my term end in Feb 2012. 4 years of MC/DMB are enough for now.
[20:13] <geser> ajmitch: I can nominate you for my seat when my term ends :)
[20:13] <ajmitch> gee thanks :)
[20:13] <micahg> geser: in that case, do you want to send the e-mail to the TB and request your term to be left alone?
[20:14] <geser> micahg: I will mail the TB and ask about the term for the DMB and let the other ones get updated
[20:14] <micahg> geser: thanks
[20:15] <geser> ajmitch: we need more timezones in the DMB to make finding a meeting time more challenging :)
[20:16] <micahg> we already have 3 disparate time zones, we need more?
[20:18] <ajmitch> I'm an expert in that area - noone can  meeting time to accomodate UTC+13, US & europe