| ScottK | tumbleweed: done. | 01:42 |
|---|---|---|
| === jincreator1 is now known as jincreator | ||
| === micahg_ is now known as micahg | ||
| micahg | jbicha: I saw your blog post, have you seen backportpackage? | 03:11 |
| jbicha | micahg: no, so many tools to learn :) | 03:15 |
| jbicha | micahg: so it works the same way, just with one command instead of 2 or more? | 03:16 |
| micahg | jbicha: yep | 03:17 |
| === almaisan-away is now known as al-maisan | ||
| dholbach | good morning | 07:10 |
| Q-FUNK | dholbach: morning! | 07:16 |
| dholbach | hi Q-FUNK | 07:17 |
| Laney | greetings | 08:04 |
| * tumbleweed waves | 08:04 | |
| Laney | will hopefully find time to review the queue shortly | 08:06 |
| tumbleweed | it's eempty | 08:06 |
| Laney | (yessssssssssssssssssssss) | 08:06 |
| === al-maisan is now known as almaisan-away | ||
| === almaisan-away is now known as al-maisan | ||
| === dholbach_ is now known as dholbach | ||
| Laney | who let me upload? | 10:44 |
| * Laney hopes the darcs fiasco is over | 10:44 | |
| === dholbach_ is now known as dholbach | ||
| === Zic_ is now known as Zic | ||
| === al-maisan is now known as almaisan-away | ||
| Laney | tumbleweed: can I sync haskell-hashed-storage? | 12:16 |
| === medberry is now known as med_out | ||
| === almaisan-away is now known as al-maisan | ||
| Laney | and upload darcs to disable that broken test to fix arm/ppc | 13:08 |
| === dholbach_ is now known as dholbach | ||
| ScottK | Laney: You can. | 14:03 |
| Laney | thanks! | 14:07 |
| Laney | should appear in the queue shortly | 14:08 |
| ScottK | Approved the sync. | 14:11 |
| tumbleweed | ScottK: thanks | 14:25 |
| ScottK | No problem. | 14:25 |
| Laney | bah, I finally got directory specific profiles working and now I'm forced to run update-maintainer again :P | 14:42 |
| === al-maisan is now known as almaisan-away | ||
| Laney | ScottK: darcs in queue | 15:32 |
| ScottK | I'll have a look in moment. | 15:32 |
| Laney | merci | 15:32 |
| Laney | now I can scrub my head of the knowledge of its testsuite internals | 15:33 |
| Laney | for all the good looking at it did | 15:33 |
| ScottK | Is it going to hurt my eyes to look at the diff once it arrives? | 15:34 |
| Laney | no | 15:34 |
| Laney | you'll see why my studying was worthless :-) | 15:34 |
| ScottK | OK. Good. | 15:35 |
| ScottK | Laney: Accepted. | 15:39 |
| Laney | thank you | 15:39 |
| ScottK | No problem. | 15:40 |
| === micahg_ is now known as micahg | ||
| pmjdebruijn | hi all | 16:48 |
| pmjdebruijn | can anybody here give me some pointers on how to package an .xpi file? (containing themeing info) | 16:48 |
| pmjdebruijn | I have general packaging experience | 16:49 |
| pmjdebruijn | but it seems xpi files are both in /usr/lib/firefox-7.0.1/extensions/ and /usr/lib/firefox-addons/extensions/ | 16:50 |
| micahg | pmjdebruijn: use mozilla-devscripts, there's an install-xpi binary | 17:30 |
| micahg | pmjdebruijn: BTW, we're not accepting new extensions in Ubuntu, but Debian does take them | 17:31 |
| Laney | What if everyone working on the ARB process instead worked on reviewing packages and backports for the main archive? | 18:40 |
| Zhenech | Laney, ubuntu would suck less? *duck* ;) | 18:41 |
| Laney | I think "let's throw man hours at bypassing the distribution" is absurd | 18:42 |
| micahg | Laney: I don't think that would be good | 18:42 |
| Laney | because these packages are so bad that we'd never want them in? | 18:43 |
| * micahg thinks he needs to catch up on mail | 18:43 | |
| tumbleweed | Laney: considering that we have two published ARB apps, I'm not quite worried yet :) | 18:43 |
| Laney | I've been worried since Brussels | 18:43 |
| micahg | Laney: no, because backports being properly staffed could possibly help a lot of people keep popular apps updated | 18:44 |
| Laney | ? | 18:45 |
| tumbleweed | although I see 15 review requests | 18:45 |
| Laney | I don't understand how that is a disagreement with my position :-) | 18:45 |
| tumbleweed | arguably, if we can't staff our current processes, something is broken, and new processes may help. Then again, just "doing something" isn't the cure | 18:48 |
| Laney | well the new process in this case is basically just a combined archive + backports queue | 18:48 |
| Laney | for some reason people want to review these packages but not those rotting in revu | 18:49 |
| tumbleweed | because it's new and shiny? :) | 18:50 |
| tumbleweed | and they get to sit on a board | 18:50 |
| tumbleweed | clearly we aren't making MOTU sexy enough. (or maybe we are just whining) | 18:51 |
| Laney | poor old sad motu :( | 18:52 |
| * Laney curls up on it | 18:53 | |
| ajmitch | poor Laney :) | 18:53 |
| * Laney gets in between ajmitch's legs | 18:54 | |
| ajmitch | uh | 18:54 |
| * Elbrus bets it is way too late to have any change in getting bug 871332 fixed (is not a high-impact bug, just very annoying that I will get the bug reports) | 18:54 | |
| Laney | hahahaha | 18:54 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 871332 in winff (Ubuntu) "[oneiric] presets shipped with winff should be updated to match ffmpeg in oneiric" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/871332 | 18:54 |
| Laney | i didn't mean that to sound sexy | 18:55 |
| * ajmitch goes back into hiding | 18:55 | |
| Laney | i wanted to be a cat :( | 18:55 |
| Laney | oh god right that is it i am never speakig again BYE | 18:55 |
| tumbleweed | Laney: actually probably far simpler than that. ARB is trying to recruit. MOTU is twiddling its thumbs | 18:55 |
| Elbrus | should I still file the debdiff to fix it? (Nearly done). | 18:55 |
| Laney | that is true | 18:57 |
| Laney | Elbrus: we can get it in if you're quick with the debdiff | 18:58 |
| Elbrus | uploading now | 19:00 |
| Elbrus | attached | 19:00 |
| Elbrus | Laney, that would be great. | 19:01 |
| * Elbrus is glad he is asking ;) | 19:01 | |
| ScottK | Laney: I suspect that Debian will be gaining some new users soon. The ones that like the idea of an actual release. | 19:01 |
| Laney | at least that is one thing I can be thankful for MOTU for. Making me appreciate the release, and Debian even more. | 19:03 |
| Laney | geser: dmb? | 19:03 |
| Laney | Elbrus: where did you get the patch from? why does a soname bump imply these changes? | 19:05 |
| Elbrus | I made the patch (as part of my help to upstream) | 19:07 |
| Laney | have they applied it there? | 19:07 |
| Elbrus | the soname changed the interface to ffmpeg | 19:07 |
| Elbrus | it is in the download section (will find the url) | 19:07 |
| Elbrus | http://code.google.com/p/winff/downloads/detail?name=presets-libavcodec53-v1.xml.gz&can=2&q= | 19:08 |
| Elbrus | that is where I base the debian and ubuntu presets on in the package | 19:08 |
| Elbrus | I don't use it as is because libaac is not supported by default in ubuntu and debian | 19:08 |
| Elbrus | and the diff between ubuntu and debian was because long time debian didn't have the libavcodec-extra-xx package (but now they do | 19:09 |
| Elbrus | ) | 19:09 |
| Elbrus | next debian package will have one preset file for both debian and ubuntu, exactly containing the presets as they are now in the debdiff | 19:10 |
| Laney | nice | 19:11 |
| Elbrus | but if it was slightly possible I wanted to have these changes in Oneiric | 19:11 |
| Elbrus | so decided to do that first now | 19:11 |
| * Elbrus will probably create the new debian package tonight or on wednesday. | 19:11 | |
| Elbrus | Laney: do you want me to add the above expaination to the bug report? | 19:12 |
| Laney | no that's fine | 19:12 |
| Laney | i am in a meeting now, maybe someone else can upload it | 19:12 |
| ajmitch | ScottK: you don't agree with the recent suggestions then? :) | 19:15 |
| ScottK | ajmitch: No, but I don't find them suprising. | 19:15 |
| ajmitch | I'm surprised that there'd be this push to use extras.u.c instead of universe for far more applications | 19:17 |
| ScottK | It's completely the opposite thing from making sense. | 19:19 |
| ScottK | "Oh, there's not enough people to review new packages and many of the existing packages are crap" | 19:20 |
| ajmitch | it also won't scale at all with the current processes for the ARB | 19:20 |
| ScottK | "Hey, we can fix that by creating an entirely new process to allow more crap in after more detailed review." | 19:21 |
| ajmitch | it's more like moving the piles of crap from one heap to another | 19:21 |
| ScottK | No, the rules are relaxed, so it's actually inviting increasing levels of crap. | 19:21 |
| ajmitch | at a cost of more review time, and more pain on the part of packagers & reviewers | 19:22 |
| * ajmitch really wishes he could log in to his work desktop sometime today | 19:22 | |
| ScottK | Like I said: It does the opposite of solving any actual problems. | 19:22 |
| ajmitch | this laptop keyboard is annoying | 19:22 |
| ajmitch | one mitigating factor to cut down on the crap levels is that packages in extras.ubuntu.com don't get carried over from one release to another | 19:25 |
| ajmitch | that's also something that increases reviewing time when it comes to the next version | 19:25 |
| micahg | ajmitch: not everything needs an update every 6 months | 19:26 |
| jbicha | the extras repository never made much sense to me, I don't see how it really helps Ubuntu or the developers | 19:26 |
| lifeless | ajmitch: whats wrong with your work machine ? | 19:26 |
| ajmitch | lifeless: thrashing | 19:26 |
| micahg | jbicha: it was pitched as something for apps that didn't have a lifespan beyond a few months | 19:26 |
| lifeless | ajmitch: \o/ | 19:27 |
| ajmitch | lifeless: I can get as far as connecting & getting the host key, but ssh is hanging after that | 19:27 |
| * ajmitch needs more than 8GB of RAM :) | 19:27 | |
| tumbleweed | ScottK: well, volunteer motivation isn't man-hours that can be moved around by managers. People feel more or less motivated to work on projects. And providing an interesting project can draw people. | 19:27 |
| lifeless | ajmitch: thats tricky to get w/out server hardware | 19:28 |
| lifeless | ajmitch: I *just* managed 16GB for my dev workstation | 19:28 |
| ScottK | tumbleweed: True, which is another reason moving stuff to extras doesn't make sense. | 19:28 |
| ajmitch | lifeless: nah, you can get laptops with 16GB of RAM now, it's becoming more common in workstations | 19:28 |
| tumbleweed | :) | 19:28 |
| lifeless | ajmitch: laptops w/16? I haven't seen that (in the x201 space that is :P) | 19:29 |
| ajmitch | micahg: not having a package carry over from one release to the next because of lack of reviewer time, even if the package doesn't change, doesn't feel good | 19:29 |
| micahg | lifeless: system76 :) | 19:29 |
| ScottK | micahg: I think it was pitched by people who think 22 crap versions of solitaire is why Android is successful. | 19:29 |
| lifeless | ajmitch: the latest <blah codename> from intel will do 32GB tops in the desktop range | 19:29 |
| ajmitch | lifeless: it was either zareason or system76 that had one like that | 19:29 |
| jbicha | or by photobomb's rapid release cycle where the dev doesn't want to support old versions | 19:29 |
| lifeless | ajmitch: and to do that you need some crazy arse hard to get dimms | 19:30 |
| micahg | ajmitch: some stuff just works, I like Debian's policy of at least one upload per cycle (2 yrs), some stuff doesn't really need more than that | 19:30 |
| jbicha | I really like submitting to Debian first, it was confusing and frightening at first to figure out who to talk to, to get my app reviewed | 19:31 |
| jbicha | but it seems a better process than revu or especially the extras idea | 19:31 |
| tumbleweed | yeah, debian-mentors is *way* more active than revu | 19:31 |
| ajmitch | micahg: at the moment each arb submission needs a code review & then a majority vote from arb members | 19:32 |
| * ajmitch has to note that the requirement for /opt/extras.ubuntu.com is a bit of a pain to get right | 19:36 | |
| tumbleweed | yeah I don't really get the point of that | 19:36 |
| tumbleweed | I suppose it makes reviewing easier, though | 19:37 |
| SpamapS | hrm, how does one get a wiki page on help.ubuntu.com renamed? | 19:37 |
| ajmitch | I haven't seen one submission get it right first try | 19:37 |
| ajmitch | it's meant so that there won't be a conflict with anything shipped by the distribution | 19:38 |
| ajmitch | but what it means is that there's some hackery to work in | 19:38 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: log in | 19:38 |
| * tumbleweed thinks I got quite close on the first try, but I cheated by being an ubuntu developer :P | 19:39 | |
| ajmitch | & yours was dead simple | 19:39 |
| tumbleweed | that too, although I had to bundle a library | 19:40 |
| Laney | :O | 19:40 |
| * ajmitch watches Laney wince | 19:40 | |
| ScottK | With enough automated QA testing we could have automated removals and allow anyone to upload and eliminate the requirement for distro developers completely. | 19:40 |
| ajmitch | sounds great, then we could all just relax | 19:41 |
| lifeless | bwaha | 19:41 |
| tumbleweed | ScottK: stop scaring us | 19:41 |
| SpamapS | lifeless: am logged in, Rename is greyed out | 19:42 |
| ScottK | tumbleweed: Please plan for this at the next UDS. Sorry I won't be there to help. | 19:42 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: odd | 19:42 |
| jbicha | in Soviet Russia, Ubuntu packages you! | 19:42 |
| tumbleweed | ScottK: plan an ARB discussion? | 19:42 |
| lifeless | SpamapS: did you logout and in again ? (per the moin openid fail) ? | 19:42 |
| Laney | UDS can happen without ScottK? | 19:42 |
| ScottK | tumbleweed: No, the automatic one. | 19:42 |
| tumbleweed | aah, automated removals sounds useful. Right now, our QA lags behind debian, badly | 19:43 |
| ScottK | SpamapS: h.u.c is a separate wiki from w.u.c, so you may have limited permissions. I think you need to docs team person like jbicha. | 19:43 |
| jbicha | I don't even have permissions for the wiki yet, maybe I should ask though... | 19:43 |
| ScottK | jbicha: If you don't, you know people who do ... | 19:43 |
| jbicha | SpamapS: you might be able to just create a new page and change the old one into just a redirect | 19:43 |
| SpamapS | Ok, that makes sense | 19:43 |
| SpamapS | Need to rename https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Orchestra/JuJu to https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Orchestra/Juju | 19:44 |
| SpamapS | Ok yeah I'll try that instead | 19:44 |
| SpamapS | ok, done w/ a redirect | 19:49 |
| === yofel_ is now known as yofel | ||
| c_korn | is there a documentation about the changes between debhelper 7 and 8 ? | 20:02 |
| jtaylor | c_korn: man debhelper? | 20:04 |
| c_korn | yeah, I know this. but maybe changes regarding the new fance options in debian/rules for example? | 20:06 |
| tumbleweed | Elbrus: your debdiff looks reasonable, I'll sponsor it | 20:21 |
| Elbrus | tumbleweed: great | 20:27 |
| Laney | there we go, got my meeting duties out of the way in record time | 20:28 |
| * Elbrus is going to bed with a good feeling | 20:34 | |
| Laney | dang, I wanted to ask him if he was a climber | 20:40 |
| tumbleweed | ScottK: talking of automated removals. I did something about monitoring merge age: http://corelli.tumbleweed.org.za/ubuntu-qa/oldmerges/ | 20:42 |
| tumbleweed | (hacked up ages ago, but never got around to running it. It also hammers lp rather hard :/ ) | 20:43 |
| ajmitch | sorting by the superseded column is an interesting read | 20:43 |
| tumbleweed | yeah, that's the main aim | 20:43 |
| * Laney nmued hp-ppd recently | 20:44 | |
| * ajmitch looks at gallary2 in debian & sees 4 RC bugs | 20:45 | |
| Laney | poor poor webapps | 20:45 |
| Laney | not that it's in unstable any more | 20:45 |
| Laney | s/unstable/stable/ | 20:45 |
| ajmitch | I thought it was just removed from testing | 20:45 |
| Laney | & testing | 20:45 |
| ajmitch | since we get all the cruft from unstable, we get these wonderful packages | 20:46 |
| milli | ScottK: what kind of koolaid have you been drinking today? ;-) | 20:46 |
| pmjdebruijn | micahg: thanks | 20:47 |
| micahg | Laney: well, next time, we'll do a precise sync from testing | 20:48 |
| tumbleweed | which also means we should look at what debian has currently removed from testing | 20:48 |
| micahg | yep | 20:49 |
| Laney | i imagine the normal process-removals script can/will be tweaked | 20:49 |
| Laney | maybe s/imagine/hope/ :-) | 20:51 |
| tumbleweed | which means parsing all the debian release team's hint files... | 20:52 |
| ScottK | milli: It's more likely I was being sarcastic. | 20:52 |
| milli | ScottK: ;-) | 20:53 |
| ScottK | tumbleweed: It would have been nice to have this before now ... Definitely something to attend to for precise QA. | 20:54 |
| Laney | reasons aren't readily available indeed, but we can do it on a best-effort basis | 20:55 |
| jtaylor | why is jython in main? oO | 20:55 |
| tumbleweed | ScottK: sorry, had it a month ago :( | 20:55 |
| Laney | please get that on some kind of QA index | 20:55 |
| * tumbleweed gets the feeling he needs to get into an ubuntuwire team | 20:55 | |
| geser | tumbleweed: should it be easier now as LP has proper published state for Debian? | 20:56 |
| ajmitch | tumbleweed: what do you need & where? | 20:56 |
| * ScottK points tumbleweed at #ubuntuwire .... | 20:56 | |
| Laney | also the FTBFS graphs that you've got | 20:56 |
| * tumbleweed moved the conversation to #ubuntuwire | 20:58 | |
| * Laney entrusts | 20:59 | |
| Laney | can we have a report for "packages in universe not in debian with bugs with severity >= high"? | 21:21 |
| ajmitch | Laney: patches welcome ;) | 21:23 |
| ajmitch | it shouldn't be too hard, actually | 21:23 |
| Laney | quite | 21:28 |
| tumbleweed | if lp bugs were in UDD, that'd be so easy... | 21:30 |
| === jpds_ is now known as jpds | ||
| === kentb is now known as kentb-afk | ||
| OwaisL | Guys, I added a patch to python-distutils-extra for auto detection of gobject-introspection modules. Anyone interested in testing?? | 23:11 |
| ScottK | You should probably talk to pitti when he's around. | 23:12 |
| ScottK | He can usually be found on #ubuntu-devel. | 23:13 |
| OwaisL | Thanks ScottK, actually I looked for him but he was not around :) Anyways, need to sleep. Good Night all! | 23:14 |
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