[03:32] <RAOF> Bah!  What has suddenly caused Do to no longer be able to register <super>+space as a keybinding?  UNITYYYYYYY!
[03:33] <smspillaz> RAOF: register or use ?
[03:33] <RAOF> Register, it seems.
[03:33] <smspillaz> also, screaming on #ubuntu-desktop doesn't make your bug get fixed any faster ;-)
[03:33] <RAOF> No, but it *does* make me feel better :)
[03:34] <smspillaz> RAOF: someone is using super-space then, so its not a unity thing as unity doesn't register keybindings with gnome
[03:35] <RAOF> Hm.
[03:39] <RAOF> Hah.  Of course, the other option is that Do's broken :/
[03:39] <smspillaz> did Do ever work ?
[03:39] <smspillaz> also, synapse ?
[03:39] <desrt> smspillaz: i've found screaming on #ubuntu-desktop to be an effective way of getting bugs fixed :)
[03:39] <smspillaz> desrt: sadly, it seems to be the case
[03:40] <smspillaz> desrt: just /nick ${some_important_person} STACKING!!!!1111one!!1one!1!(shift+1) and my adrenaline levels go through the roof
[03:40] <desrt> :)
[03:41] <RAOF> :)
[03:41] <smspillaz> :(
[03:41]  * RAOF screams STACKIIIIIING! at the moon.
[03:41] <RAOF> Bottoms.
[03:41] <smspillaz> you know what
[03:42] <RAOF> smspillaz: You're familiar with the abomination that is cmake - how do I get it to #define a variable at build time?
[03:42] <smspillaz> I'm going to go an entire day at UDS where all I say is either "STACKING" "REPARENTING" "CRASHING"
[03:43] <smspillaz> RAOF: 1) it is not an abomination 2) configure_file (config.h.in config.h) 3) in that config.h.in #cmakedefine SOME_THING ${CMAKE_VAR}
[03:43] <RAOF> You'll probably need a larger vocabulary than three words.  Might I suggest that you add CORRUPTION, DUAL-HEAD, and GL_MAX_TEXTURE_SIZE? :)
[03:43] <smspillaz> no, those are your three words
[03:44] <smspillaz> :)
[03:44] <smspillaz> RAOF: http://www.cmake.org/cmake/help/cmake-2-8-docs.html
[03:44] <smspillaz> also, I am trying to use QtQuick
[03:44] <smspillaz> it is really hard to use for some reason
[03:45] <smspillaz> I wrote the same thing in GObject/GTK+ in less than an hour
[03:45] <RAOF>  Hm, I think that maybe -D is the invocation I'm after.
[03:45] <smspillaz> ohh right
[03:45] <smspillaz> RAOF: add_definition
[03:45] <smspillaz> http://www.cmake.org/cmake/help/cmake-2-8-docs.html#command:add_definitions
[03:45] <smspillaz> add_definitions (-DFOO -DBAR)
[03:46] <smspillaz> it does it at a source level for the current CMAKE_CURRENT_SOURCE_DIR though, so make sure that you don't have files in the same source dir with different #define requirements
[03:47] <smspillaz> desrt: oh, I was going to ask, is there a release of glib out with the key maximum size bumped ?
[03:47] <smspillaz> err key name maximum size ?
[03:47] <desrt> smspillaz: yes.  should be the one in oneiric
[03:47] <smspillaz> cool
[03:47] <smspillaz> I can remove the truncation in the gsettings backend
[03:48] <desrt> patch was included in 2.29.12
[03:48] <desrt> so 2.30.0 should definitely have it
[03:48] <smspillaz> this next two weeks is like "distro week", the only purpose is to do stuff for didrocks :)
[03:48] <smspillaz> eg, upstreaming distro patches etc
[03:48] <smspillaz> since apparantly I finished my SRU lists really early
[03:48] <smspillaz> desrt: awesome :)
[05:18] <pitti> Good morning
[05:19] <TheMuso> Morning pitti.
[05:26] <Nafai> Hi pitti, TheMuso!  Great job on Oneiric!
[05:27] <TheMuso> Nafai: Thanks, already starting to plan for Precise.
[05:32] <BigWhale> Morning.
[05:36] <pitti> hey Nafai, thanks
[05:36] <pitti> yeah, got my first two uploads in :)
[05:37] <didrocks> good morning
[05:37] <pitti> bonjour didrocks
[05:37] <didrocks> guten morgen pitti, how are you?
[05:37] <pitti> pretty well, thanks! how about you?
[05:37] <pitti> feeling precise today
[05:39] <didrocks> pitti: heh, I'm fine thanks! No more oneiric stories? ;-)
[05:39] <pitti> there's still SRUs :)
[05:40] <didrocks> of course :-) speaking of which, once I can get dx adding test case to all their bugs, probably a nux and unity SRUs for today!
[05:40] <didrocks> I finally have the crach fix and reverted the UI change
[05:50] <pitti> didrocks: FWIW, if some of the fixes are hard to reproduce, a regression test suffices
[05:51] <pitti> didrocks: i. e. "ensure that maximizing firefox window still works as expected" or something like that
[05:51] <pitti> didrocks: with yesterday's compiz I noticed a weird regression wrt. resizing
[05:51] <pitti> but haven't investigated it more closely yet
[05:51] <didrocks> pitti: yeah, that's the advice I gave them already. I'm just chasing them to at least having them filling the easy to reproduce one
[05:51] <didrocks> pitti: indeed, there is one with some maximized app
[05:51] <didrocks> sam fixed it
[05:51] <pitti> I got stuck with an orange resize frame on the left of the screen that used to be my firefox window, with no way to recover
[05:52] <didrocks> not sure it worth reset the counter though
[05:52] <didrocks> oh?
[05:52] <didrocks> not that one
[05:52] <didrocks> no way to recover? if you take another window and try to snap at the same place?
[05:52] <pitti> ah, I didn't try that
[05:53] <pitti> I tried to click on the firefox icon in the launcher, press alt+f10 etc.
[05:53]  * pitti plays around with this and sees whether he can reproduce
[05:53] <didrocks> I think you should try to resnap, that's what fixed it for me 3 months ago when we had glitches there
[05:54] <pitti> but there was a compiz proposed upload yesterday, perhaps that changed things
[05:54] <didrocks> not for that one I guess
[05:54] <pitti> some casual tests work fine
[05:54] <pitti> so perhaps just bad luck and it's not a regression
[05:54] <didrocks> yeah, that's more than possible
[05:55] <didrocks> it's been a long time I didn't get glitches with snap though
[05:56] <didrocks> pitti: sorry, restarting unity crashed my gnome-terminal and so weechat
[05:57] <pitti> I seldomly use it
[05:57] <pitti> I just needed to unmaximize yesterday because of firefox' bug of not scrolling down on text marking when maximized
[06:00] <didrocks> pitti: would be interesting to know if you can get that reliably (and if it's only with firefox or not)
[06:01] <didrocks> as some apps have weird behavior, like reasking to set their weight/height after a resize
[06:01] <pitti> right, I tried, but I was unable to reproduce it now
[06:01] <didrocks> (that's what prevented before the terminal to get well snapped on the right/left)
[06:01] <didrocks> doesn't seem scary though :)
[06:08] <smspillaz> didrocks: we can now drop all the settings distro patches \o/ :)
[06:08] <smspillaz> didrocks: I've got compizconfig so that it reads /usr/share/compizconfig/defaults/profile.defaults when looking for default values
[06:08] <didrocks> smspillaz: great! we'll see that at the pre-UDS :)
[06:09] <smspillaz> next item is the settings transitions. I'm going to see if I can make that into a generic module, so you just specify the key names that have changed and what they are supposed to map to
[06:10] <smspillaz> pitti: you can reproduce it by going into expo mode, dragging a window to a workspace and then double clicking that workspace
[06:11] <smspillaz> pitti: I've fixed it upstream, but yeah, we'll have it in the next SRU
[06:11] <pitti> smspillaz: hm, that seems to work fine here
[06:12] <smspillaz> it was something along those lines
[06:13] <smspillaz> didrocks: (we'll have something like this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/707758/_
[06:13] <smspillaz> compiz in precise is going to be awesome
[06:14] <smspillaz> precisely zero distro patches in the goal for me
[06:17] <didrocks> great :)
[06:48] <didrocks> smspillaz: is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fglrx-installer/+bug/763005 in the latest compiz tarball?
[06:48] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 763005 in compiz "Compiz's "Sync to Vblank" makes display stutter/slow with some drivers (like fglrx)" [Undecided,In progress]
[06:48] <didrocks> smspillaz: well, the patch isn't
[06:48] <didrocks> am I right?
[06:57] <smspillaz> didrocks: no, it isn't
[06:58] <BigWhale> hmm... right-click on unity icons is behaving a little weird. one click to open the menu and one more to close it... clicking on a different icon should open the menu of that icon
[06:58] <BigWhale> right?
[07:00] <didrocks> smspillaz: and bug #864963 ?
[07:00] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 864963 in unity "Titlebars for semi-maximized windows appear off the workspace" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/864963
[07:03] <smspillaz> doesn't look like it, no (just checked all the patches)
[07:03] <smspillaz> do you want new patches again or do you want to wait till sru1 ?
[07:03] <didrocks> smspillaz: will be SRU1, trying to close all your bugs and ensure the right components are subscribed
[07:03] <didrocks> smspillaz: can you take care of that for next time?
[07:03] <didrocks> smspillaz: they were still a lot of downstream unity task
[07:03] <smspillaz> I can move all the stuff that we didn't ship to SRU1
[07:04] <smspillaz> right .. my understanding was that we were meant to leave the unity tasks there ?
[07:04] <smspillaz> or do we need to mark the downstream task invalid and leave the upstream task there ?
[07:04] <didrocks> smspillaz: not the downstream one
[07:04] <smspillaz> ok
[07:04] <didrocks> smspillaz: the dowstream is there because it was opened
[07:04] <didrocks> smspillaz: so rather than adding a compiz downstream task
[07:04] <didrocks> take the unity one
[07:04] <didrocks> and rename it
[07:04] <smspillaz> ok
[07:04] <didrocks> my think script knows what to do :)
[07:04] <didrocks> sync*
[07:05] <didrocks> smspillaz: ok, I have a reproduceable bug where a window can disappear, let me restart to check
[07:05] <smspillaz> didrocks: I wonder if its possible to make "team" milestones, hijacking the unity milestones for compiz bugs doesn't seem right
[07:05] <smspillaz> didrocks: ugh, just can't win with these bugs
[07:05] <didrocks> smspillaz: no, other we wouldn't have those unity milestones
[07:05] <didrocks> otherwise*
[07:06] <didrocks> but yeah, that's what we need, team milestones…
[07:06] <smspillaz> right, but they are milestones for the unity proejct not the unity team
[07:06] <didrocks> smspillaz: yeah, we need to create another meta-project IMHO
[07:06] <didrocks> dx-whatever
[07:06] <smspillaz> ok
[07:06] <didrocks> but dx people have to be rigorous then
[07:06] <didrocks> and remove/invalid all invalid tasks then
[07:07] <didrocks> (like a compiz bug opened against unity -> should be set to invalid)
[07:09] <didrocks> smspillaz: can definitively reproduce, can you test that:
[07:09] <didrocks> 1. open two terminal, one on ws 1, one on ws 2
[07:09] <didrocks> 2. minimize one
[07:09] <didrocks> 3. click on the launcher -> no terminal visible
[07:10]  * didrocks downgrades to unity 4.22
[07:10] <smspillaz> uhh, not right now. I'm on upstream compiz and cant run unity
[07:11] <didrocks> smspillaz: same with it
[07:11] <didrocks> so not due to latest unity
[07:11] <didrocks> maybe compiz?
[07:11] <smspillaz> it's probably been there for a while. let me give it a try on my netbook
[07:11] <didrocks> smspillaz: yes please :)
[07:11] <didrocks> smspillaz: try with the archive version firsrt
[07:11] <didrocks> smspillaz: and then, the -proposed version
[07:12] <smspillaz> didrocks: things like this are very likely a unity thing as that's where the minimization hack happens (why oh WHY did design make me do that)
[07:12] <didrocks> this one means: if you have more than one window opened and one of them is maximized, you can't see it anymore
[07:12] <didrocks> (in scale)
[07:13] <didrocks> worse, if it has focus, you can't bring it back
[07:13] <smspillaz> minimized or maximized ?
[07:13] <didrocks> minimized*
[07:13] <smspillaz> I give up with this minimization hack
[07:13] <smspillaz> I really want to go back to having no previews for minimized windows
[07:14] <smspillaz> didrocks: oh, eh
[07:15] <smspillaz> didrocks: that's been around for ages
[07:15] <didrocks> smspillaz: really? and nobody targeted it as something to fix?
[07:15] <didrocks> it seems a major issue IMHO
[07:15]  * didrocks finds that there is too much things dx passes under cover, until distro finds the bugs…
[07:15] <smspillaz> didrocks: guess nobody has noticed it
[07:16] <didrocks> how do you know it's been around for ages then?
[07:16] <smspillaz> but I know that's probably been a problem for a while, considering how it works
[07:16] <didrocks> smspillaz: any workaround? it's pretty serious, and it was working on natty (even if it was a different behavior)
[07:16] <smspillaz> I can try fixing it today
[07:17] <didrocks> smspillaz: great! I will delay the unity upload on that I guess
[07:17] <didrocks> worrying that we let that pass finale :/
[07:17] <smspillaz> didrocks: well, you didn't see it till just now ;-)
[07:17] <didrocks> smspillaz: because I never minimize windows
[07:17] <didrocks> smspillaz: users usually do
[07:17]  * smspillaz never saw any bugs about that either
[07:18] <didrocks> smspillaz: are you looking unity bugs?
[07:18] <smspillaz> yes
[07:19] <didrocks> smspillaz: isn't it linked to https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/868185 ?
[07:19] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 868185 in unity "cannot unminimize windows" [Critical,Fix committed]
[07:19] <smspillaz> didrocks: no, that was something different
[07:19] <smspillaz> I broke something for a day and then fixed it :)
[07:19] <smspillaz> anyways, try to understand that the minimized window hack is tricky :)
[07:20] <didrocks> smspillaz: bug #682769
[07:20] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 682769 in unity "the launcher doesn't focus minimized dialogs on empty workspaces" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/682769
[07:20] <didrocks> as it's linked
[07:20] <smspillaz> because its not really supposed to work :p
[07:20] <smspillaz> didrocks: nope, different bug
[07:20] <smspillaz> didrocks: and that's fixed :)
[07:21] <smspillaz> didrocks: by fixing that it caused a bunch of other bugs, again, this stuff is obscenely difficult to get right ;-)
[07:22] <didrocks> bug #863114 ?
[07:22] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 863114 in unity "Cannot raise window from panel after minimize" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/863114
[07:22] <didrocks> smspillaz: ^
[07:22] <didrocks> smspillaz: this is the case if you don't have any other app on the same workspace
[07:23] <didrocks> so yeah, we got some warning about minimization issue in unity bugs, despite you looking at them
[07:23] <smspillaz> that bug is still really unclear, but whatever, I'll fix it
[07:23] <smspillaz> keep in mind that I can't see and fix everything ;-)
[07:24] <didrocks> smspillaz: this is the bug, I'm rephrasing it
[07:24] <smspillaz> "After minimize a window, i can't re-raise it by clicking on its icon on the panel. I have to use super+w or click on another icon before...
[07:24] <smspillaz> For example, if I minimize firefox, first i have to click on nautilus icon and next i'm able to raise the firefox window by clicking on its icon."
[07:24] <didrocks> smspillaz: yeah, but don't claim nobody reported it when people are reporting it :)
[07:24] <smspillaz> doesn't say anything about switching workspaces
[07:24] <smspillaz> anyways, I'm going to stop arguing about this and just fix it
[07:24] <didrocks> smspillaz: I'm adding the two test cases now
[07:27] <didrocks> smspillaz: see bug #863114, is it more clear now?
[07:28] <ubot2> didrocks: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/863114)
[07:29] <smspillaz> I'll file a separate bug for the other thing
[07:32] <didrocks> smspillaz: the other?
[07:32] <didrocks> smspillaz: I put both test cases
[07:32] <didrocks> as they are linked
[07:33] <smspillaz> ok
[07:36] <didrocks> hum, nobody in dx subscribed the SRU team on any of the 20 bugs… :/
[07:36]  * didrocks headdesk
[07:36] <didrocks> more than 2 hours of just fixing bug tasks and papework… and counting…
[07:38] <rickspencer3> hi pitti didrocks ... Oneiric is out, what's the word on the street?
[07:38] <pitti> rickspencer3: heise.de had a nice review yesterday
[07:39] <rickspencer3> it's been working great on both of my computers, fwiw
[07:39] <didrocks> rickspencer3: hey, people seems to like the new version. A lot of positive comments on the french forum contrary to 6 months ago :)
[07:39] <pitti> behaving here :)
[07:39] <rickspencer3> \o/
[07:39] <kamstrup> working well here - except on my eee1001 where the installer hangs
[07:39] <kamstrup> (on keyboard selection)
[07:40] <rickspencer3> Oneiric comes with the didrocks and pitti seal of approval
[07:40] <smspillaz> didrocks: dx should use my autobug-script :)
[07:40] <didrocks> pitti: FYI, I finished the French CD and it's going to be pressed on 10 000 CDs right now
[07:40] <smspillaz> didrocks: lp-im-working-on bugno
[07:40] <pitti> didrocks: wohoo!
[07:40] <didrocks> smspillaz: it doesn't check that the right downstream components are subscribed though
[07:40] <didrocks> smspillaz: can you fix that? 45 minutes to fix everything just for compiz there :/
[07:40] <smspillaz> and it subscribes sru, assigns the right person, subscribes the right downstream desk
[07:40] <smspillaz> *task
[07:40] <smspillaz> (only wrote it yesterday though)
[07:40] <pitti> RAOF, bryceh: it's sooo true! http://xkcd.com/963/
[07:41] <smspillaz> didrocks: um, sure
[07:41]  * didrocks is bored of doing dx paperwork because they don't care, not real interesting engineer work
[07:41] <smspillaz> didrocks: I think the solution to that is to find a way so that nobody has to do the paperwork ;-)
[07:41] <didrocks> pitti: just a small issue, the CD check is failing
[07:41] <smspillaz> eg, get some clever launchpad scripts in the hands of DX
[07:41] <pitti> didrocks: got a bug report about that yesterday, yes
[07:41] <pitti> didrocks: bug 873401
[07:41] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 873401 in ubuntu-defaults-builder "Check disc for defects failed with a iso images built using ubuntu-defaults-image" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/873401
[07:42] <smspillaz> didrocks: also, I can't reproduce your first "bug"
[07:42] <didrocks> smspillaz: well, when someone subscribe the wrong component and don't attach any branch to it (and it happens on compiz as well), how the script will know what to target?
[07:42] <didrocks> smspillaz: are you on an empty workspace?
[07:42] <smspillaz> yes
[07:42] <didrocks> with oneiric up to date with compiz proposed ?
[07:42] <smspillaz> I just switched to trunk unity now
[07:42] <didrocks> smspillaz: I'm on 4.0
[07:42] <smspillaz> ok, I'll try 4.0
[07:42] <didrocks> smspillaz: and it happens with older version
[07:42] <smspillaz> didrocks: I can reproduce the second one though, and have fixed it locally
[07:43] <didrocks> pitti: can you try reproducing bug #863114, please?
[07:43] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 863114 in unity "Cannot raise window from panel after minimize" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/863114
[07:43] <smspillaz> didrocks: out of curiousity, does the terminal window stay" active after its minimized ?
[07:43] <smspillaz> or does the focus go to the desktop
[07:43] <didrocks> smspillaz: no, the desktop is focused
[07:43] <smspillaz> and you can't unminimize the terminal
[07:43] <didrocks> right
[07:44] <didrocks> clicking on the launcher icon do nothing
[07:44] <smspillaz> ok, let me give 4.0 a try then
[07:45] <didrocks> smspillaz: your script doesn't seem to work well btw: bug #868930
[07:45] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 868930 in unity "Automaximization happens on unminimize" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/868930
[07:45] <didrocks> no team subscribed
[07:45] <pitti> didrocks: I suppose I need to do that with not having any previous terminals open?
[07:45] <smspillaz> didrocks: probably didn't run it on that bug ;-)
[07:45] <didrocks> pitti: no, you can even if you have other terminals opened there
[07:46] <didrocks> smspillaz: if you have to specify on every bugs, there is something wrong :)
[07:46] <pitti> didrocks: ah, can reproduce -- nothing at all happens if I click on the button
[07:46] <smspillaz> I suppose I can make it run on milestones
[07:46] <didrocks> smspillaz: ^^
[07:46] <smspillaz> no need to ping me :)
[07:47] <didrocks> smspillaz: you are quite unlucky to be ever *never* able to reproduce bugs :)
[07:47] <smspillaz> I'm using trunk unity
[07:47] <smspillaz> give me the 20 minutes it takes to rebuild 4.0 please :)
[07:56] <didrocks> smspillaz: why did you set the downstream task on bug #865051 "Fix Released" ?
[07:56] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 865051 in unity "unity launcher loses track of deja-dup windows" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/865051
[08:03] <smspillaz> didrocks: was running through my bug lists and thought that was was released. it wasn't, sorry about that
[08:03] <didrocks> smspillaz: ok, fixing then
[08:04] <didrocks> smspillaz: so, to sum up, SRU bug list cleaned, just waiting for you to reproduce the 1. case
[08:04] <smspillaz> awesome, currently rebuilding unity (going to take a bit)
[08:05] <smspillaz> didrocks: so in future, I guess the point is that we should open the downstream task, but don't touch its status ? (except marking it in progress) ?
[08:05] <smspillaz> that's what I do now
[08:05] <didrocks> smspillaz: yeah, and ensure we only have the right downstream tasks attached
[08:05] <didrocks> smspillaz: I think I'll raise that at the mini sprint and we should merge your tool and unify
[08:05] <smspillaz> ok
[08:06] <smspillaz> kind of, my tool is supposed to be run whenever you work on a bug
[08:06] <didrocks> smspillaz: I guess we can automate that if you link your branch with a bug when merging
[08:07] <smspillaz> right, although you don't want to subscribe the SRU team for everything :)
[08:07] <smspillaz> at the moment, I'm doing stuff like
[08:07] <smspillaz> bzr make-bug -m 0.9.6 -s ubuntu-sru -d compiz -a unity 4.26.0
[08:08] <smspillaz> which opens a bug, subscribes the right person, affects the right packages, updates the status, milestones it etc
[08:33] <didrocks> smspillaz: have you been able to reproduce it?
[08:37] <glatzor> morning mvo
[08:40] <smspillaz> didrocks: nope, still rebuilding :(
[08:44] <hyperair> smspillaz: does unity blacklist some .desktop files or something?
[08:44] <hyperair> smspillaz: virtualbox isn't showing up in the dash.
[08:46] <hyperair> smspillaz: interestingly, neither is pointing devices
[08:48] <hyperair> as in gpointing-device-settinsg.
[08:49] <smspillaz> hyperair: I don't write bamf, so you are best asking DBO that
[08:49] <hyperair> ah okay
[08:52] <mvo> hey glatzor, good morning!
[08:53] <glatzor> mvo, I am currently working on separating the AptWorker into three threads (download, worker, committer)
[08:54] <glatzor> mvo, this will allow to preform the download of queued transactions during install time of another one
[08:54] <mvo> glatzor: !!!
[08:54] <mvo> glatzor: that sounds awsome
[08:54] <mvo> glatzor: anything I can look at already?
[08:55] <mvo> glatzor: it will be task based, right? so ideally instead of "commitpackage" u-m would give you a split up list of tasks?
[08:55] <glatzor> mvo, I am currently pushing the work to the threading branch: lp:~aptdaemon-developers/aptdaemon/threading
[08:56] <glatzor> mvo, the client API won't change
[08:56] <glatzor> mvo, the worker thread use queues to put the currently processed transaction to each other
[08:57] <glatzor> see the doc string for aptdaemon.worker.AptWorker
[08:57] <glatzor> mvo, the test suite seems to be broken.
[08:58] <mvo> glatzor: right, so in order to utilize this best, e.g. update-manager would submit a bunch of self contained transactions instead of one huge CommitPackages ?
[08:59] <glatzor> mvo, this could be a very good use case
[09:00] <glatzor> mvo, I missed your point previously.
[09:00] <mvo> glatzor: thanks, and no worries :) just making sure I understand this correctly
[09:01] <glatzor> mvo, another problem is ListUpdate. The acquire instance is not accessible. So I would have to reimplment it in python
[09:01] <mvo> glatzor: oh, hm, so python-apt needs tweaking to make this availalbe?
[09:03] <glatzor> mvo, actually libapt :/
[09:04] <glatzor> mvo, But ListUpdate is a quite small and simple function.
[09:04] <glatzor> mvo, it would be nice to have the RunScripts method availabe in python-apt. But even this one could be reimplemented purely
[09:05] <glatzor> in python
[09:06] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[09:07] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson
[09:07] <chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
[09:07] <didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
[09:07] <chrisccoulson> hi didrocks
[09:07] <pitti> chrisccoulson: pretty well, thanks! how about yourself?
[09:08] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, good thanks
[09:09] <mvo> glatzor: well, I think we should expose this in libapt/python-apt to make the amount of duplicated code smaller
[09:10] <rodrigo_> hi chrisccoulson
[09:11] <chrisccoulson> hi njpatel. is there any reason why unity doesn't pass a launch context to g_app_info_launch when launching applications?
[09:11] <chrisccoulson> hi rodrigo_
[09:12] <njpatel> chrisccoulson, because it wreaks havoc with raising of the app window as we're in the window manager
[09:12] <mvo> glatzor: could you file a (small) bug with the requirements?
[09:13] <glatzor> mvo, I will do so
[09:13] <mvo> thanks glatzor (and no rush :)
[09:13] <chrisccoulson> njpatel, i've been trying to figure out one thing which bugs me constantly (focus stealing prevention never works properly when launching applications), and that is probably why :/
[09:13] <chrisccoulson> nothing adds a DESKTOP_STARTUP_ID to the launched applications environment
[09:13] <chrisccoulson> and that embeds the timestamp of the event which triggered the launch, which the launched application uses to initialize _NET_WM_TIME
[09:14] <chrisccoulson> so, in the case where i click on the icon for libreoffice and then go and do some other work whilst it's starting, libreoffice shouldn't steal focus when it opens
[09:14] <chrisccoulson> but it does everytime in unity
[09:14] <chrisccoulson> and i thought it was a compiz bug
[09:24] <njpatel> chrisccoulson, riiight, if DBO is feeling better today, you guys can figure it out as it was his decision to drop it due to do the issue we were having
[09:26] <czajkowski> njpatel: were you at the release party last night
[09:33] <njpatel> czajkowski, I was planning to be, then got into a discussion at millbank and it got too late and needed to get home :(
[09:33] <njpatel> so, yeah, fail
[09:33] <njpatel> or, njpatel fail
[09:33] <njpatel> czajkowski, how was it?
[09:33] <czajkowski> aye I only heard you should have been there when talking to rickspencer3
[09:33] <czajkowski> njpatel: great turn out
[09:34] <czajkowski> lots of people turned up good fun
[09:34] <njpatel> sweet
[11:01] <rickspencer3> hi czajkowski
[11:03] <czajkowski> rickspencer3: morning :) nice talking to you last night.
[11:03] <czajkowski> rickspencer3: on a quick note would you mind if I drop a quick pm to you
[11:05] <rickspencer3> czajkowski, ditto, last night was fun
[11:38] <rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, just answered to https://bugs.launchpad.net/desktopcouch/+bug/872639
[11:38] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 872639 in thunderbird-eds-extension ""Cannot open book: Could not create DesktopcouchSession object"" [High,Confirmed]
[11:39] <chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, thanks
[12:15]  * rodrigo_ lunch
[12:19] <pitti> have to run out for some errands, bbl
[12:21] <didrocks> ok, I just renamed the french unstable forum to "Precise", it really started :)
[12:21] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: I like the conversation view in thunderbird
[12:22] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i've forgotten what it's like without that ;)
[12:22] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: but for bug reports, it's not quite well, it shows the launchpad bot as the sender of every emails :/
[12:23] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i noticed that too. i'll ping protz about that
[12:29] <didrocks> thanks :)
[12:30] <didrocks> apart from that, I love it
[12:30] <didrocks> I don't have to expand the discussion view anymore
[12:50] <glatzor_> mvo, it seems that old gobject crashes quite a lot if using threading with python2.7
[12:50] <glatzor_> mvo, the threading code is stable on my squeeze system :/
[12:50] <glatzor_> mvo, so I uncommitted the merge of the first threading changes to trunk
[13:04] <mvo> glatzor_: ok, the old gobject? did you try with gi.repository already?
[13:07] <glatzor_> mvo, no. the dbus server side is not ready yet
[13:08]  * mvo nods
[13:23] <glatzor_> mvo, oh, it is the flNotDir function that causes crashes apt-pkg/contrib/fileutl.cc
[13:25] <mvo> glatzor_: that is suprising, that is a really small function
[13:25] <mvo> glatzor_: and looks safe at least from first glance
[13:27] <glatzor_> mvo, Program received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault.
[13:27] <glatzor_> [Switching to Thread 0x7ffff12bc700 (LWP 8778)]
[13:27] <glatzor_> 0x00007ffff2e07029 in std::string::rfind(char, unsigned long) const ()
[13:27] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libstdc++.so.6
[13:27] <glatzor_> (gdb) bt
[13:27] <glatzor_> #0  0x00007ffff2e07029 in std::string::rfind(char, unsigned long) const ()
[13:27] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libstdc++.so.6
[13:27] <glatzor_> #1  0x00007ffff30b5b80 in flNotDir(std::string) ()
[13:27] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10
[13:27] <glatzor_> #2  0x00007ffff30fdaa2 in pkgAcqArchive::Done(std::string, unsigned long, std::string, pkgAcquire::MethodConfig*) () from /usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10
[13:27] <glatzor_> #3  0x00007ffff30e7739 in pkgAcquire::Worker::RunMessages() ()
[13:27] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10
[13:27] <glatzor_> #4  0x00007ffff30e90a7 in pkgAcquire::Worker::InFdReady() ()
[13:27] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10
[13:27] <glatzor_> mvo, another one: Program received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault.
[13:27] <glatzor_> [Switching to Thread 0x7ffff12bc700 (LWP 8778)]
[13:27] <glatzor_> 0x00007ffff2e07029 in std::string::rfind(char, unsigned long) const ()
[13:27] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libstdc++.so.6
[13:27] <glatzor_> (gdb) bt
[13:27] <glatzor_> #0  0x00007ffff2e07029 in std::string::rfind(char, unsigned long) const ()
[13:27] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libstdc++.so.6
[13:27] <glatzor_> #1  0x00007ffff30b5b80 in flNotDir(std::string) ()
[13:27] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10
[13:27] <glatzor_> #2  0x00007ffff30fdaa2 in pkgAcqArchive::Done(std::string, unsigned long, std::string, pkgAcquire::MethodConfig*) () from /usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10
[13:27] <glatzor_> #3  0x00007ffff30e7739 in pkgAcquire::Worker::RunMessages() ()
[13:27] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10
[13:27] <glatzor_> #4  0x00007ffff30e90a7 in pkgAcquire::Worker::InFdReady() ()
[13:27] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10
[13:28] <glatzor_> #0  0x00007ffff6aa1bb5 in ?? () from /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libc.so.6
[13:28] <glatzor_> #1  0x00007ffff2e08682 in std::string::_Rep::_M_clone(std::allocator<char> const&, unsigned long) () from /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libstdc++.so.6
[13:28] <glatzor_> #2  0x00007ffff2e08d9c in std::basic_string<char, std::char_traits<char>, std::allocator<char> >::basic_string(std::string const&) ()
[13:28] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libstdc++.so.6
[13:28] <glatzor_> #3  0x00007ffff30fda8d in pkgAcqArchive::Done(std::string, unsigned long, std::string, pkgAcquire::MethodConfig*) () from /usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10
[13:28] <glatzor_> #4  0x00007ffff30e7739 in pkgAcquire::Worker::RunMessages() ()
[13:28] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10
[13:28] <glatzor_> #5  0x00007ffff30e90a7 in pkgAcquire::Worker::InFdReady() ()
[13:28] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10
[13:28] <glatzor_> #6  0x00007ffff30e086b in pkgAcquire::RunFds(fd_set*, fd_set*) ()
[13:28] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10
[13:28] <glatzor_> #7  0x00007ffff30e2500 in pkgAcquire::Run(int) ()
[13:28] <glatzor_>    from /usr/lib/libapt-pkg.so.4.10
[13:43] <mvo> glatzor_: hm, confusing
[13:43] <mvo> glatzor_: in #1, what happens if you try to print the string inside gdb?
[14:36] <desrt> good morning, all
[14:37] <pitti> hey desrt, how are you?
[14:38] <chrisccoulson> hi desrt
[14:38]  * ogra_ sees the desrt and goes for some water 
[14:38] <ogra_> or is it pronounced dessert ?
[14:38] <didrocks> hey desrt
[14:38] <ogra_> :)
[14:42] <desrt> pretty good
[14:43] <desrt> preparing to do the unthinkable -- install glib 2.31.0 release candidate onto my stable system :)
[14:43] <desrt> ogra_: most people don't try to pronounce it :)
[14:43] <ogra_> heh
[14:43] <ogra_> will i see you in orlando ?
[14:43] <desrt> yup
[14:43] <ogra_> awesome :)
[14:43] <desrt> maybe i'll beg you for a pandaboard some more :)
[14:43]  * desrt still didn't get off his ass to order one
[14:44] <ogra_> i didnt plan to bring a panda
[14:44] <ogra_> i have my arm netbook, no need for carrying fragile dev boards
[14:44] <desrt> nod.
[14:45] <ogra_> (and oneiric has official images for the netbook now :) )
[14:47] <chrisccoulson> hmmmm, i'd like to buy an arm netbook
[14:48] <chrisccoulson> but i ended up spending money on a new laptop instead, after i broke my old one
[14:49] <ogra_> chrisccoulson, well, the ac100 is cheap but you cant buy tehm new anymore
[14:49] <ogra_> i bought my last new one for 170€
[14:50] <ogra_> and 8h battery life on a 3 cell that weights nothing are pretty awesome :)
[14:51] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i'd quite like that
[14:51] <dobey> too bad they're all freakin' huge still
[14:51] <ogra_> dobey, ??
[14:51] <dobey> except for the netwalker thing, but it's a bit too small
[14:51] <ogra_> my ac100 is slimmer and lighter than the smalles macbook air
[14:51] <dobey> ogra_: 10"+ screens
[14:51] <ogra_> yeah indeed
[14:51] <dobey> 7" would be perfect
[14:52] <ogra_> to small for day to day work imho
[14:52] <czajkowski> ogra_: I got a funky new tablet! advent vega very flipping fast!
[14:52] <dobey> ogra_: depends on how fat your fingers are We suppose :)
[14:52] <ogra_> with android i suppose ... everything is fast with android
[14:53] <dobey> except for the phones
[14:53] <ogra_> dobey, well, i prefer a full sized kbd
[14:53] <ogra_> which the ac100 has
[14:53] <dobey> ogra_: don't get a fujitsu u820 then :)
[14:53] <ogra_> does it have an arm cpu ?
[14:54] <dobey> ogra_: and with 7" it could have a butterfly keyboard, which would give you a full size keyboard in small package
[14:54] <dobey> ogra_: nah, atom; but awesome battery life, and awesome screen dpi
[14:54] <dobey> but it is 5.6"
[14:54] <ogra_> pfft
[14:54] <ogra_> then i'm not at risk
[14:54] <ogra_> atom is crap
[14:55] <Laney> 14/10 15:53:07 <dobey> except for the phones
[14:55] <dobey> nah, atom means not having to spend all my time trying to make all the hardware work :)
[14:55] <dobey> what's really crap, is GMA500 :(
[14:56] <dobey> and the fact that oneiric broke my laptop
[14:56] <ogra_> well, you will never squeeze 7-8h out of a 3 cell battery with it ...
[14:56] <ogra_> you can be lucky if you get 2h
[14:56] <dobey> ogra_: mm, think this one is 4 cell, and it gets 7-8 hours
[14:56] <ogra_> if intel is capable to build devices with less than 800 grams that last over 7h we can talk again :)
[14:57] <ogra_> and that dont burn my lap when using tehm for 18h in a row :)
[14:57] <ogra_> (i.e. a typical canonical employee workday)
[14:58] <dobey> ogra_: this laptop is about the same size as Our hand. :)
[14:58] <ogra_> oh, and does it have any moving parts ?
[14:58] <dobey> 260 dpi 5.6" screen is not something you use by having it sit on yoru lap
[14:58] <dobey> lap
[14:58]  * ogra_ is so spoiled by arm :) 
[14:59] <dobey> it does have a very small fan, yes
[14:59] <ogra_> heh
[14:59] <dobey> and the hard disk isn't solid state
[14:59] <dobey> but eh
[14:59] <dobey> 1.8" SSD are not cheap
[14:59] <ogra_> so you cant buy it for less than 200€ either i guess
[15:00] <dobey> 2.5" SSD are dime/dozen
[15:00] <ogra_> or 500$ (or whats the equivalent atm ?)
[15:00] <dobey> but 1.8" is hard to come by
[15:00] <dobey> cheapest 1.8" SSD We've seen so far was about 750$
[15:00] <ogra_> i measn the device
[15:00] <ogra_> not an SSD for it
[15:00] <ogra_> whats the price atm
[15:00] <dobey> oh, this laptop was $1000, but that was new 2 years ago
[15:01] <ogra_> right
[15:01] <dobey> well, 2.5 years now
[15:01] <dobey> and 260dpi screens not cheap :)
[15:01] <ogra_> i guess i'll just wait for the arm based chromebooks
[15:01] <ogra_> and see that we get them supported
[15:01] <dobey> this dell duo thing was cheaper
[15:02] <dobey> but it's big, heavy, crappy dpi, and horrible battery life
[15:02] <ogra_> yeqah
[15:02] <dobey> really, will probably have to make Our own laptop
[15:03] <dobey> next time We decide it's time for a new one
[15:06] <chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, i didn't realize how much that libgnomeui pulls in (re, bug 867424)
[15:06] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 867424 in thunderbird "Oneric: On boot up Firefox always displays the “Well, This Is Embarrassing” screen." [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/867424
[15:06] <chrisccoulson> eg, bonobo :(
[15:06] <pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, that's why I said it's really just a bad workaround for SRU, not for precise :/
[15:07] <pitti> chrisccoulson: for precise it's certainly better to talk to dbus directly?
[15:07] <chrisccoulson> pitti - that's never going to fly upstream, as the gnome-session dbus interface is gnome-specific
[15:07] <chrisccoulson> it doesn't work in any other DE
[15:07] <chrisccoulson> it needs to use the xsmp interface really, but the problem is a lack of a good replacement for GnomeClient
[15:08] <pitti> chrisccoulson: but libgnome certainly is as well?
[15:08] <pitti> i. e. gnome specific
[15:08] <chrisccoulson> pitti - right, but it uses xsmp, which isn't gnome-specific
[15:08] <chrisccoulson> so it will talk to session managers in other DE's just fine
[15:10] <vuntz> chrisccoulson: are you aware of eggsmclient?
[15:10] <chrisccoulson> vuntz, yeah. are people still embedding that everywhere?
[15:10] <vuntz> yes
[15:11] <chrisccoulson> which isn't ideal either ;)
[15:11] <tkamppeter> Anyone can look at bug 874268? Seems that there are cases where one cannot access system-config-printer, or where it is too dificult to find it.
[15:11] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 874268 in system-config-printer "hidden in GNOME 3; prevents users from finding it" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/874268
[15:11] <chrisccoulson> but probably better than directly using the dbus interface, and better than GnomeClient
[15:11] <dobey> chrisccoulson: dude, copy+paste code is the future!
[15:11] <chrisccoulson> i was actually thinking of going the metacity route and just using libsm directly ;)
[15:11] <chrisccoulson> i'm hardcore....
[15:11] <chrisccoulson> :)
[15:12] <dobey> chrisccoulson: the sm in libsm doesn't stand for sado-masochism
[15:12] <chrisccoulson> it doesn't?
[15:12] <chrisccoulson> oh, i'm not interested now!
[15:12] <chrisccoulson> :)
[15:13] <dobey> chrisccoulson: feel free to dominate it.
[15:15] <tkamppeter> pitti, WDYT about bug 874268? Do we need to change anything?
[15:15] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 874268 in system-config-printer "hidden in GNOME 3; prevents users from finding it" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/874268
[15:17] <pitti> tkamppeter: we need to ensure that it doesn't appear in control-center when running under gnome-shell
[15:17] <pitti> I'm not sure how independent that is, rodrigo_?
[15:17] <pitti> tkamppeter: right, it's just one desktop file
[15:18] <tkamppeter> pitti, where will s-c-p be accessible for gnome-shell (I assume this is the GNOME Classic desktop) users?
[15:19] <pitti> tkamppeter: command line at least, I figure; but gnome 3 upstream uses the control-center print applet, not s-c-p
[15:19] <pitti> that was their design decision
[15:21] <tkamppeter> pitti, and what do we serve to our GNOME classic users? s-c-p hidden and gnome-shell print manager instead?
[15:21] <pitti> tkamppeter: that was the idea, yes
[15:21] <pitti> tkamppeter: but we didn't want to use that for oneiric, as it wasn't on feature parity yet
[15:21] <pitti> (as you know)
[15:22] <pitti> so this preserves s-c-p under unity, and provides the vanilla gnome 3 upstream experience for shell users
[15:22] <pitti> (or classic)
[15:22] <tkamppeter> pitti, as my idea was to make printing as easy as possible to all users and I was assuming that all our decisions from the Blueprint were applied to all GNOME3 users, not only to Unity.
[15:23] <pitti> seems there was some misunderstanding then?
[15:23] <tkamppeter> pitti, would it be simple, feasable via SRU, to let s-c-p also appear for GNOME shell users?
[15:24] <pitti> tkamppeter: I'm not 100% sure how much it takes (rodrigo would know more), but it's not simple
[15:24] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, ping
[15:24] <pitti> if we drop GNOME from NotShowIn, we need a way of not showing s-c-p in the control-center under unity
[15:24] <pitti> erm, sorry, under GNOME
[15:25] <pitti> and then I don't know how s-c-p interferes with gnome upstream's print system
[15:25] <tkamppeter> pitti, what is the problem if s-c-p shows in the g-c-c of GNOME?
[15:25] <pitti> tkamppeter: then there will be two "print" applets, and users don't know which one is right
[15:26] <pitti> but anyway, I wouldn't change it
[15:26] <tkamppeter> pitti, is Unity not GNOME only with the menus replaced by the Launcher?
[15:26] <pitti> GNOME deliberately said that they don't want s-c-p, but their own simplified applet
[15:26] <pitti> tkamppeter: I mean "gnome shell" or "gnome classic" in this context
[15:26] <tkamppeter> pitti, in addirion we would need to patch out the original print icon in g-c-c of GNOME.
[15:26] <pitti> tkamppeter: but yes, the shell is upstream's counterpart to unity; the libraries etc. are the same
[15:27] <pitti> tkamppeter: that would dramatically change things, though; that's not what we do in SRUs
[15:27] <tkamppeter> pitti, is g-c-c the same in both Unity and shell?
[15:27] <pitti> tkamppeter: the package, yes; it's behaviour is slightly different depending on which desktop it's running under (determined by OnlyShowIn etc. in desktop files)
[15:28] <tkamppeter> pitti, could one not reach with a small change that it shows s-c-p instead of the original tool for both environments then?
[15:28] <pitti> tkamppeter: technically yes
[15:29] <pitti> well, I guess -- I don't know how shell integrates with printing
[15:29] <pitti> i. e. printing status, etc.
[15:29] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, pong
[15:29] <pitti> tkamppeter: the shell doesn't provide a systray either AFAIK, so s-c-p probably w ouldn't work there correctly
[15:29] <tkamppeter> pitti, I would even count as a regression if a gnome-shell user clicks on "Printing" and gets a much inferior tool than in Natty.
[15:29] <pitti> tkamppeter: *shrug*, gnome design decision..
[15:30] <tkamppeter> pitti, the printer setup tool would work without problems, it does not need the systray.
[15:30] <pitti> tkamppeter: that part, yes; but I don't know how it affects status notifications
[15:31] <pitti> actually, seems we have a bug there
[15:31] <pitti> /etc/xdg/autostart/print-applet.desktop:
[15:31] <pitti> NotShowIn=KDE;LXDE;
[15:31] <pitti> rodrigo_: ^ shouldn't there be "GNOME" as well/
[15:31] <pitti> ?
[15:31] <pitti> rodrigo_: seems we start s-c-p under gnome shell, but never see it because it only has a systray icon
[15:31] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, it is about bug 874268. It seems Users of the GNOME shell (classic) have no access to system-config-printer and only get the new GNOME printer tool which is much inferior than s-c-p. This can be seen as a regression.
[15:31] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 874268 in system-config-printer "hidden in GNOME 3; prevents users from finding it" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/874268
[15:32] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, see my discussion with pitti.
[15:32] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, yes, it's known
[15:33] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, we decided to have the printer panel in gnome.shell, although yes, still not as complete as s-c-p
[15:33] <Nafai> Hey, is there a place where what is required in the gnome-session .session files?
[15:34] <pitti> Nafai: parse error, I'm afraid
[15:34] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, so I should tell the users to switch to Unity and mark any bug report "wontfix", introduction of full-featured print support to GNOME classic is Precise-only?
[15:34] <Nafai> What are the required lines in /usr/share/gnome-session/session/* files?
[15:34] <Nafai> (that more clear?  sorry, I haven't slept well lately)
[15:35] <pitti> Nafai: from the existing files I'd say Name, RequiredComponents, DesktopName
[15:35] <Nafai> I'm trying to document how to integrate xmonad with Gnome or Unity 2D in 11.10 and want to be correct
[15:35] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, or tell them to run system-config-printer if the panel doesn't do what they want
[15:35] <pitti> Nafai: haven't looked for docs, though
[15:35] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, no need to switch desktop for running s-c-p
[15:35] <Nafai> pitti: ok, just curious, cause I did get something working, but was wondering if there was a source with exactly what was required :)
[15:35] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, is it not a simple and small change to make g-c-c open s-c-p when clicking on "Printing" always, independent whether the user uses gnome-shell or Unity?
[15:35] <chrisccoulson> vuntz, does eggsmclient just depend on libsm?
[15:37] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, it is, yes
[15:37] <pitti> tkamppeter, rodrigo_: as I already said, it'd technically be a small change, but would change the UI tremendously, and we actually do want to provide the upstream experience under shell
[15:37] <rodrigo_> yes, that's why we did it this way
[15:37] <rodrigo_> gnome-shell = upstream experience
[15:37] <pitti> in fact, it would have been easier to always use s-c-p
[15:37] <rodrigo_> yes
[15:39] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, OK, so could we consider system-config-printer as an independent desktop app under gnome-shell then and let it appear in the menus only and not in g-c-c? This way the user can at leat use it without the command line.
[15:40] <pitti> I think this should be possible by providing a second .desktop file with OnlyShowIn=GNOME and dropping the X-GNOME-Settings-Panel= key, right?
[15:40] <pitti> rodrigo_: ^
[15:40] <rodrigo_> pitti, in s-c-p you mean?
[15:41] <pitti> rodrigo_: yes
[15:41] <pitti> rodrigo_: so that under shell it doesn't show up in the control-center, but in the app search
[15:41] <rodrigo_> yes
[15:44] <tkamppeter> pitti, rodrigo_, should I implement this in s-c-p, and then replace the last queued up s-c-p package in -proposed by a new one which contains the original bug fix (driver for HP LJ 12xx/13xx) and the additional .desktop file?
[15:45] <pitti> tkamppeter: fine for me; please just make sure that the changelog contains the bug refs for the currently uploaded one as well
[15:45] <pitti> tkamppeter: if you want you can re-use the same version number
[15:46] <tkamppeter> pitti, OK, then reject the one which is on the top of the stack (waiting for the other to make its 7 days) and I will upload a new one before the queue clears for it.
[15:47] <pitti> tkamppeter: done
[15:47] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, do I need to do something special in the second .desktop file so that s-c-p lands in the correct menu? I use Unity on all boxes currently.
[15:48] <pitti> tkamppeter: replace NotShowIn with "OnlyShowIn=GNOME;", and drop X-GNOME-Settings-Panel
[15:48] <pitti> that should do it
[15:48] <vuntz> chrisccoulson: I don't remember, but I'd say yes
[15:49] <chrisccoulson> vuntz, ok, i opened mozilla bug 694570. lets see what upstream think :)
[15:49] <ubot2> Mozilla bug 694570 in Startup and Profile System "Stop using libgnome and libgnomeui on Linux" [Normal,New: ] http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=694570
[15:53] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, yes, what pitti said
[15:54] <tkamppeter> pitti, rodrigo_ are you sure that system-config-printer is then also correctly recognized by the users in the GNOME3 menus? Especially that there are not two undistinguishable "printing" entries, one pointing to s-c-p and the other to the new GNOME tool?
[15:55] <pitti> tkamppeter: I'm not sure whether the shell app search exposes control-center modules; that needs to be tested in shell
[15:55] <pitti> and classic mode (gnome-panel), too
[15:58] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, can you make a quick test copying s-c-p's desktop file and making your proposed changes in it and after that look in GNOME shell whether the intended behavior occurs? Thanks.
[15:59] <tkamppeter> pitti, is s-c-p not unregistered as g-c-c module by using a .desktop file without X-GNOME-Settings-Panel?
[15:59] <tkamppeter> pitti, rodrigo_, I have prepared bug 874268 for the SRU.
[15:59] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 874268 in system-config-printer "system-config-printer not reachable in menus of GNOME shell" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/874268
[16:01] <pitti> tkamppeter: ah, right
[16:03] <rodrigo_> the shell exposes g-c-c panels in the menus, yes
[16:04] <pitti> then we lose
[16:04] <rodrigo_> but since we use the OnlyShowIn, only one should show in each
[16:04] <pitti> we'd have two printer tools in the menus again then
[16:04] <pitti> rodrigo_: no
[16:04] <pitti> rodrigo_: with tkamppeter's propsal, we'd see the upstream capplet plus the duplicated s-c-p desktop file
[16:04] <rodrigo_> oh right
[16:07] <tkamppeter> pitti, rodrigo_ so please tell me a way how to make either the menus only showing s-c-p or the menu showing both but in a way that they can be easily distinguished and the user will know what he gets.
[16:08] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, not sure how to do that really, unless you change the description to s-c-p to 'advanced printer settings'
[16:08] <rodrigo_> or something like that
[16:08] <pitti> in the copied file?
[16:08] <pitti> how about "system-config-printer"?
[16:09] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, problem is only that this description is translated into something like 40 or 50 languages, so all non-English users will continue to have two times "Printing" in their language.
[16:09] <rodrigo_> right, too late to get translations
[16:10] <rodrigo_> so, there's no other way to distinguish them in the menu
[16:10] <rodrigo_> except that the shell shows the panel from g-c-c as 'settings'
[16:10] <rodrigo_> and I guess it would show s-c-p as apps
[16:10] <rodrigo_> that's the only difference, and too subtle to tell users anything
[16:12] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, pitti, or should we then suippress the original tool in the menus of GNOME shell and so have the original tool only in g-c-c and s-c-p only in the menus?
[16:13] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, not sure how to achieve that using only .desktop files, we'd have to patch gnome-shell
[16:14] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, or can we find in existing translations "Advanced Settings" somewhere and then make the new English menu entry for s-c-p "Printing (Advanced Settings)" and compose the translations by adding " (<translation of "Advanced Settings">)" to each translation in the .desktop file?
[16:14] <rodrigo_> that won't work for lots of languages
[16:15] <rodrigo_> well, maybe it would, but not sure
[16:15] <pitti> nice weekend everyone!
[16:15] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, are there languages which do not use parantheses?
[16:15] <pitti> time for dinner and cinema
[16:15] <didrocks> have a good week-end pitti
[16:15] <rodrigo_> bye pitti
[16:15] <tkamppeter> pitti, have a nice weekend!
[16:15] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, I don't know all languages, but I'd say yes
[16:16] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, could you construct and test the new .desktop file for me and if you have it working attach it to the bug?
[16:17] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, but that won't solve the problem, we'd get 2 entries in the menu
[16:17] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, we would get "Printing" and "Printing (Advanced Settings)" then.
[16:18] <rodrigo_> but then there's the translations problem
[16:19] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, did you not say "I don't know all languages, but I'd say yes"?
[16:19] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, I said "yes, I'm pretty sure there are languages which don't use parentheses"
[16:20] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, OK, so we need to find a completely different solution.
[16:20] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, as for the .desktop file, just do what pitti said, replace NotShowIn with OnlyShowIn=GNOME; and remove the X-GNOME-Settings-Panel= key
[16:20] <rodrigo_> tkamppeter, yes
[16:21] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, and the rest of the fix, to avoid the duplicate entry, will happen in gnome-shell or somewhere else?
[16:21] <rodrigo_> yes, it depends
[16:21] <rodrigo_> but we need to find a good solution 1st
[16:22] <rodrigo_> I'll think about it a bit more
[16:22] <rodrigo_> but now need to go out for a bit, so bbl
[16:22] <tkamppeter> rodrigo_, so tell me when you have a solution, post in the bug for example.
[16:51] <jjardon> Hi, if there is a problem with the upgrade process to oneiric, what is the  package/team to file bugs?
[16:56] <kenvandine> jjardon, i guess that depends on the package that failed
[16:57] <jjardon> kenvandine: indicator-datetime: https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-datetime/+bug/835297 seems that /etc/timezone get removed in the update process
[16:57] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 835297 in indicator-datetime "Time not being shown, substituted by the word "Time""" [Medium,Confirmed]
[17:00] <kenvandine> jjardon, maybe tzdata
[17:02] <kenvandine> jjardon, yeah, the tzdata package has a postinst that messes with that file
[17:03] <kenvandine> probably the most likely candidate
[17:03] <jjardon> kenvandine: ok, thanks. I'll add tzdata to the report then
[17:26] <unit3> Anyone seen an issue with the annoying "upgrade to 11.10" popup not disappearing after clicking "ask me later"?
[17:30] <unit3> I can't figure out what package that's a part of to report a bug.
[18:12] <htorque_> smspillaz: hi! opera showing its tooltips and menus on the primary screen in a multi-monitor setup is a compiz bug i guess?
[18:13] <htorque_> with opera not on the primary screen of course
[18:22] <broder> hmm...are the launcher and the panel supposed to get stacked on top of the screensaver?
[18:24] <OwaisL> Does anyone know a proper workaround for nautilus3 search-as-type behavior? I don't even understand how to use it.
[18:29] <dobey> workaround for what exactly?
[18:29] <dobey> it works the same as it did in nautilus 2.x no?
[18:30] <dobey> OwaisL: ^^
[18:36] <OwaisL> dobey, nope! not for me at least. Sometimes it works fine but most of the time it just fails to select any item and keystrokes get queued up + the input widget looks like it has focus but actually does not and when you hit backspace, nautilus goes one level up instead of deleting char in the input box.
[18:37] <OwaisL> probably, I should make a screencast
[18:37] <dobey> file a bug
[20:39] <Beret> hey guys
[20:39] <Beret> my apologies but no one seems to know the answer to this so I'm gonna try here
[20:39] <Beret> Can someone tell me what to remove from my home directory to completely nuke all unity/gnome/desktop settings? An upgrade to Oneiric has left me with a non-functional desktop that even unity --reset doesn't fix.
[20:40] <Beret> it's getting stuck somewhere I see nothing in the logs
[20:48] <hyperair> Beret: .config/dconf, i reckon.
[20:48] <Beret> alright
[20:54] <Beret> hyperair, nope
[20:54] <Beret> I get a blank screen with a top bar (nautilus)
[20:54] <hyperair> O_o
[20:54] <Beret> no indicators, no unity panel, no kb shortcuts, etc
[20:54] <hyperair> what happens if you log into another session?
[20:54] <hyperair> e.g. a guest session
[20:54] <Beret> unity 2d worked fine
[20:54] <Beret> I'll try a guest session
[20:54] <hyperair> then it sounds like a driver issue.
[20:57] <Beret> that seems odd
[20:57] <Beret> why would I have a driver issue in 11.10 when 11.04 worked fine
[20:57] <Beret> shouldn't that show up in X.org.log?
[20:58] <dobey> Beret: are you sure you're up to date? there was a lightdm bug fix that should fix that
[20:58] <Beret> alright
[20:58] <Beret> let me try to update
[20:59] <dobey> you can switch to a vt to update (network should work there)
[20:59] <Beret> dobey, I'm up to date
[21:00] <Beret> [   36.110896] type=1400 audit(1318625821.259:33): apparmor="DENIED" operation="open" parent=2282 profile="/usr/lib/lightdm/lightdm-guest-session-wrapper" name="/proc/ati/major" pid=2372 comm="compiz" requested_mask="r" denied_mask="r" fsuid=120 ouid=0
[21:00] <Beret> a ton of those in dmesg
[21:01] <Beret> (guest session isn't working as you can tell)
[21:01] <dobey> Beret: check your ~/.xsession-errors
[21:01] <dobey> Beret: and given the hour, you'll probably have better luck on monday :)
[21:02] <Beret> hah
[21:07] <dobey> with that
[21:07]  * dobey is off :)
[21:08] <Beret> looks like I fixed it
[21:09] <mdeslaur> Beret: could you please file a bug with that apparmor denial in it?
[21:09] <Beret> yes
[21:10] <mdeslaur> Beret: thanks
[21:10] <Beret> np
[21:26] <Beret> is there a bug already about the alt-tab popup going behind applications?
[21:27] <Beret> heh
[21:27] <Beret> n/m, I'll search