[15:29] <charlie-tca> Good morning
[15:30] <charlie-tca> Xubuntu session for OpenWeek starts in about 30 minutes
[15:32] <scott-work> good morning charlie-tca , i declined this year to do one on ubuntu studio, just too damn busy with work, family at the moment
[15:35] <charlie-tca> I took one to fill in the schedule, when they needed the slots filled. Then they added a whole extra hour
[15:36] <scott-work> lol, that's slightly horrid
[15:38] <charlie-tca> heh, yeah
[15:38] <charlie-tca> but the sessions usually help get word out about the distribution, so it's okay
[16:25] <madnick> hm, my friend just installed 11.10
[16:25] <madnick> And he tells me, only the mouse works, and the UI is non responsive
[16:26] <madnick> He cannot switch TTY
[16:26] <madnick> I cant find a bug report on this
[16:26] <madnick> But, he cannot report it, since IO does not work
[16:29] <madnick> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1862210
[16:40] <Unit193> Wish I could make it :/
[17:02] <genii-around> charlie-tca: That went reasonably well.
[17:03] <madnick> It was a good talk :)
[17:04] <charlie-tca> madnick: I get that freeze on this laptop, usually it is firefox to blame, but I had to remove geany in 11.10 because it seems to be taking as much of the cpu as it can, also
[17:05] <charlie-tca> I don't know why firefox does it, but it grabs cpu up to 100% when some scripts run, and it will take several minutes to unfreeze
[17:05] <charlie-tca> geany was freezing the entire computer, not even the mouse would move here.
[17:06] <madnick> Oh I see
[17:06] <charlie-tca> twitter seems to have one of those scripts
[17:06] <madnick> He reports he was using 
[17:06] <madnick> the network applet in the panekl
[17:06] <madnick> panel*
[17:06] <madnick> so it might be a larger issues
[17:06] <madnick> issue
[17:07] <Unit193> I did miss a lot...
[17:07] <charlie-tca> He could keep the Task Manager open, and maybe he will be able to spot the runaway application with it
[17:07] <madnick> yup
[17:08] <charlie-tca> That's how I caught geany. It showed geany using 56% of the cpu, and firefox had 46%
[17:13] <madnick> I managed to get test-mode working for my LDM greeter :)
[17:13] <charlie-tca> great!
[17:13] <madnick> But Im unsure if its wise to start development already, if ldm api will change alot
[17:13] <charlie-tca> Now we will have a new greeter, right?
[17:13] <madnick> yes
[17:13] <charlie-tca> It should change, but not too bad
[17:13] <madnick> Question is when to start :P
[17:14] <charlie-tca> You will be able to change it pretty easy, since most of the changes will happen to unity greeter itself
[17:14] <madnick> Yeah, the more "massive" work is getting webkit up and interacting with the user
[17:14] <madnick> LightDM hopefully ownt change badly
[17:15] <madnick> But I think ill wait until we get a CD alteast
[17:16] <madnick> The best part is that, when it does work, someone with much greater graphical skills than me can just design freely using CSS :P
[17:23] <knome> charlie-tca, at what time today will you announce the nominations?
[17:24] <charlie-tca> madnick: we don't get the cd until alpha1, which is Dec 1
[17:24] <charlie-tca> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/ReleaseSchedule
[17:24] <charlie-tca> knome: I did not schedule a time. It's just an email to the ML
[17:25] <knome> charlie-tca, i know. i was just asking if you had planned a time :)
[17:25] <knome> lol, i'm using all 16MB's of the 7635MB google mailbox...
[17:27] <madnick> :)
[18:33] <xrdodrx> hi charlie-tca, I unfortunately couldn't make it to the session today in #ubuntu-classroom but I'm curious about plans on using Xfce 4.10 in Xubuntu 12.04...as Xfce 4.10 is a major release it would be good to push it in with the newest LTS, and it includes a lot of useful features such using thunar for the desktop...according to the Xfce roadmap Xfce 4.10pre1 should be out as early as 2011-11-06...
[18:34] <xrdodrx> roadmap: http://wiki.xfce.org/releng/4.10/roadmap
[18:37] <charlie-tca> xrdodrx: we will put Xfce 4.10 in Precise if possible. We have to wait and see if the dates move first. Xfce has a habit of not having enough developers to make things happen when they want them to.
[18:37] <charlie-tca> We can't put a pre-release version in without making sure it won't cause too many issues.
[18:39] <mr_pouit> the desktop plugin of thunar isn't ready for the moment
[18:40] <xrdodrx> charlie-tca, would testing out/compiling the pre releases when they come help?
[18:44] <charlie-tca> no
[18:44] <charlie-tca> We will not put them in unless mr_pouit okays it. He is the authority on what we do.
[18:45] <charlie-tca> xrdodrx: I would suggest asking mr_pouit 
[18:48] <mr_pouit> for the moment, only 2 components (+xfce4-dev-tools) had 4.9.x pre-releases
[18:48] <mr_pouit> so it's a bit too early
[18:48] <mr_pouit> no more than 10~20% of what is planned on the roadmap has been done ;-]
[18:49] <charlie-tca> We just have to wait until it gets to the point wwe can look at it.
[19:18] <xrdodrx> mr_pouit, do you work with xfce upstream? 
[19:38] <charlie-tca> xrdodrx: mr_pouit is an Xfce developer and founding member of the xfce foundation
[19:39] <xrdodrx> i see
[19:39] <xrdodrx> sorry guys, i thought the roadmap was more binding than it was apparentely :)
[19:39] <xrdodrx> keep up the good work, i'll help in any way i can :D
[19:39] <charlie-tca> no problem. We just went through the same situation with the upgrade to Xfce 4.8
[19:40] <charlie-tca> Your questions and assistance is desired. We might find there is a way to make things happen, if the right question is presented. 
[19:41] <charlie-tca> time frames on 4.8 moved for about a year or so, trying to get all the pieces together enough to have it usable. 
[19:41] <charlie-tca> We have hopes it will be smoother for 4.10
[19:42] <xrdodrx> charlie-tca, How did it go for 4.8? I started using Xfce [and Xubuntu] at that version and had never used it prior
[19:43] <charlie-tca> bumpin g
[19:43] <charlie-tca> well, bumpy
[19:44] <charlie-tca> We did push 4.8 into natty before it went final
[19:45] <charlie-tca> but the times move so much, we really had to wait over 6 months past our original goal
[19:46] <charlie-tca> That's one of the reasons xfce-places-plugin did not get into natty by default.
[19:46] <charlie-tca> It just wasn't ready yet
[19:46] <xrdodrx> I see...that's unfortunate. :( I imagined that with GNOME 3 maybe Xfce would get a little more love ;) but most of that love was from end users, not developers 
[19:46] <charlie-tca> We were only able to test it for a a couple of weeks, too
[19:47] <charlie-tca> yeah, unfortunately, increasing users doesn't help development so much
[19:47] <charlie-tca> Most of the Xfce developers are volunteers, just like for Xubuntu, and their time is very limited
[20:01] <Unit193> If anyone else missed it and really wanted to attend: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/10/20/%23ubuntu-classroom.html#t16:00
[20:07] <mr_pouit> well, i'm only an xfce contributor (not developer ;-)
[20:23] <xrdodrx> Unit193, i read it over, and here i was all this time pronouncing xubuntu "ecks ubuntu"
[20:23] <xrdodrx> :P
[20:23] <Unit193> I say X ubuntu, I claimed not to know (but I did), now that's gone down the drain...
[20:24] <Unit193> I liked how honest he was
[20:24] <madnick> I say X Ubuntu :(
[20:24] <madnick> Zoobuntu is right, right? ;)
[20:24]  * knome says *ksu-buntu"
[20:25] <knome> i don't care how you pronounce it
[20:25] <knome> as long as you use it
[20:25] <xrdodrx> well Unit193 i just assumed it was "ecks ubuntu" because "xfce" is pronounced "ecks eff sea ee" http://wiki.xfce.org/faq#about_xfce
[20:25] <knome> and enjoy it
[20:25] <xrdodrx> :P
[20:25] <knome> ksu-buntu is much more natural when you speak finnish
[20:25] <Unit193> Only thing I didn't quite agree with, Thunderbird isn't exactly lightweight, but it's the best (for a GUI client)
[20:25] <knome> (or kzo(o)-buntu)
[20:26] <knome> Unit193, true.
[20:53] <knome> charlie-tca, is the agenda correct at Xubuntu/Meetings?
[20:53] <charlie-tca> yes?
[20:53] <knome> charlie-tca, i was just wondering because the agenda says: Nominations will close October 20, 2011, and the community election will be held at the meeting on October 23, 2011. If there are issues with this, please let us know between now and October 20. 
[20:53] <charlie-tca> madnick: yes
[20:54] <knome> charlie-tca, i mean, it's good to have that in the minutes since that was current on the last meeting, but in the agenda for the next meeting? :)
[20:54] <charlie-tca> and that was put up since nominations opened
[20:55] <charlie-tca> Most of the people realize that if they are reading it past the 20th, it expired.
[20:56] <knome> i realize that too, but i just wondered if the agenda was correct otherwise because of that point
[20:56] <charlie-tca> yes, it is correct
[20:56] <knome> okay
[20:57] <charlie-tca> I put the announcement out. 
[20:57] <knome> also can we maybe move the election more to the beginning of the meeting - maybe not the dead beginning, but you realize the meeting starts at 1AM local time...
[20:58] <charlie-tca> I realize the meeting time is not optimum for all users. However, The updates should be quite quick, since we released Xubuntu 11.10
[20:59] <knome> maybe move the old business after the governance?
[20:59] <charlie-tca> Since we are world-wide, the meeting will be at bad times for a lot of people
[20:59] <charlie-tca> Are you planning on being long winded about something?
[20:59] <charlie-tca> I expect the entire meeting to be under 1 hour, easily.
[21:00] <knome> i hope that's true too
[21:00] <knome> i do have one more little thing for other business (which i'm about to add in a sec)
[21:00] <charlie-tca> Since we can not finalize anything until after UDS, I don't see old business taking much time.
[21:01] <knome> i was just asking if it was possible to change the order, that's all
[21:01] <knome> i that's not possible, fine
[21:03] <charlie-tca> We keep the format as close to the same each time as possible, because it helps everyone trying to attend and follow along. 
[21:03] <knome> btw, since we seem to have more traffic in #xubuntu-offtopic, and a few not-so-nice situations, do you think you could add operator privileges for me there as well?
[21:03] <charlie-tca> Juggling the order does make it harder for those who attend each meeting
[21:03] <charlie-tca> I thought you never went in there?
[21:04] <knome> i've been there now, since we've had a lot of users come in @#xubuntu and chatting about gnome and stuff
[21:04] <knome> this is pretty much after oneiric release
[21:04] <knome> that's why i am asking this now, not then
[21:05] <charlie-tca> okay, you got your cheat sheet handy for adding ops?
[21:05] <knome> just a sec
[21:05] <knome> i need to check how to do that...
[21:06] <charlie-tca> I am looking, will make the changes
[21:06] <knome> the flags you want to add is +votriA
[21:07] <knome> can you also add me +r in #xubuntu-devel (able to unban)
[21:08] <charlie-tca> sure, what was the command?
[21:08] <knome> just one more moment... :)
[21:09] <knome> /msg chanserv access #xubuntu-offtopic add knome +votriA
[21:09] <knome> should do it
[21:10] <knome> and the same for #xubuntu-devel 
[21:10] <charlie-tca> should be done for offtopic
[21:10] <knome> looks correct :)
[21:11] <knome> and works too
[21:11] <knome> thanks
[21:11] <charlie-tca> got them all done
[21:11] <charlie-tca> Thanks for your help
[21:11] <knome> yep, that's correct
[21:11] <knome> thanks, it's much appreciated
[21:13] <knome> looks like i have ops in channels i didn't know
[21:13] <charlie-tca> did I do it?
[21:13] <knome> nope
[21:13] <charlie-tca> Whew!
[21:13] <knome> heh :)
[21:13] <knome> unless you edited the access list for #ubuntu-fi-en
[21:15] <charlie-tca> Don't think so
[21:15] <knome> me neither
[21:15] <knome> i can't remember when i last joined that channel though
[21:17] <knome> now i did, said something quite strange and parted :)
[21:27] <knome> one thing we should probably think once we get the new website running is articles about xfce/gnome difference, and lightdm, as i said earlier :)
[21:28] <knome> many people seem to be wondering about that, or just look lost
[21:34] <charlie-tca> They are lost. They read a blog about how Xfce is exactly like Gnome2, and they install it. Then they find out "oops, it isn't the same. Why not?"
[21:34] <knome> yeah.
[21:35] <knome> which blog says xfce is like gnome2?
[21:35] <knome> we should comment those too
[21:36] <charlie-tca> about half the ones being written
[21:36] <charlie-tca> I tend to not bother tracking them. I have other more important stuff I am concerned with
[21:37] <charlie-tca> I asked several times for someone to volunteer to track these things, and got no response.
[21:43] <knome> frankly, i think i've missed that, but on the other hand, work on this fall hasn't allowed me much "extra" foss work
[21:44] <knome> the best we can do is write an article, or two, or more, on that
[21:44] <knome> (seems like it)
[21:45] <charlie-tca> Yes, got someone volunteering to write one?
[21:45] <knome> i can do that once we get the website up
[21:45] <knome> i'm willing to write to yet an another blog... (i only contribute to three now)
[21:45] <knome> :)
[21:49] <charlie-tca> Okay. I will see everyone later. Back to vacation here.