[04:17] <pitti> Good morning
[04:17] <TheMuso> Morning pitti.
[04:33] <cyphermox> pitti: good morning
[04:36] <cyphermox> I´m actually surprised at how well I can navigate the interface even when it´s in a language I don´t understand. thank god menus and icons don´t move around too much
[04:38] <BigWhale> I am not sure that morning before 8am is good. :> Nevertheless, good morning all.
[04:41] <cyphermox> BigWhale: I share your (pain?)
[04:41] <cyphermox> BigWhale: haven´t gone to sleep yet
[04:41] <BigWhale> Ouch :))
[04:42] <cyphermox> :)
[05:45] <didrocks> good morning
[06:41] <pitti> bonjour didrocks
[06:41] <rickspencer3> bonjour didrocks, pitti
[06:41] <didrocks> guten morgen pitti, how are you?
[06:41] <didrocks> hey rickspencer3
[06:41] <pitti> hey rickspencer3
[06:42] <pitti> didrocks: I'm great, thanks! we had a nice party last night, the official housewarming
[06:42] <didrocks> oh great! :)
[06:42] <rickspencer3> pitti, hast du schoene Geschenke gekreigt?
[06:43] <pitti> rickspencer3: no, we didn't (and didn't expect to, really)
[06:43] <rickspencer3> lol
[06:44] <rickspencer3> pitti, the fact that I wrote a sentence in German did not surprise you at all?
[06:44] <rickspencer3> you are unflappable
[06:44] <pitti> rickspencer3: it did actually
[06:44] <pitti> no body language through IRC :/
[06:44] <rickspencer3> lol
[06:44] <pitti> rickspencer3: and I thought you'd be learning French
[06:44] <rickspencer3> pitti, well, I thought I was, but it keeps coming out German
[06:44] <pitti> but so much the better, then we can switch #u-desktop to German at last!
[06:45] <pitti> rickspencer3: don't worry, it's fine :)
[06:45] <rickspencer3> I think I put in the wrong language CD to listen to at night
[06:45] <pitti> seb speaks German as well, and didrocks will pick it up in no time
[06:46] <didrocks> no way :-) I have few remaining bits after 5 years of German at school
[06:46] <pitti> didrocks: Deutsch ist einfach
[06:47] <didrocks> pitti: Ich spreche keine Deutsch
[06:47] <didrocks> I even found latin more accessible even if you have more rules :)
[06:50]  * RAOF speaks more German than French, but it's been *many* years since he did either!
[06:53] <didrocks> smslave: got a backtrace for you, this time, the patch compiles, which is better than yesterday to fix that regression :) however, just testing the case it's now supposed to fix, I can get it crashing: bug #879253
[06:53] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 879253 in compiz "latest patch for -proposed crashes compiz" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/879253
[06:58] <didrocks> waow, with my isp box, you can remove the blu-ray zone locking by using the konami cheat code
[07:08] <smslave> fun
[07:09] <smslave> /usr/bin/compiz (core) - Warn: failed to receive ConfigureNotify event on 0x3c03bdf
[07:09] <smslave> /usr/bin/compiz (core) - Warn: failed to receive ConfigureNotify event on 0x3c03bfb
[07:09] <smslave> /usr/bin/compiz (core) - Warn: failed to receive ConfigureNotify event on 0x3c03bed
[07:09] <smslave> I wonder why we're still getting that
[07:13] <smslave> didrocks: that looks pretty nontrivial. I'll have to have a look into it when I get time to
[07:13] <smslave> nice catch though
[07:14] <didrocks> smslave: hum, ok, so we'll leave the regression in oneiric for now
[07:14] <didrocks> smslave: was pretty trivial to get TBH, it's just testing the area of code you changed :)
[07:15] <smslave> right, the test plan didn't really cover that case
[07:22] <didrocks> the test plan should tell then to test with more severity the part you are touching :)
[07:22] <smslave> sure
[07:23] <smslave> didrocks: this is a random stab in the dark, because I'm on a certain proprietary OS *cough* so I can concentrate on some uni work I'm doing
[07:23] <smslave> didrocks: but can you try changing scale.cpp:722 to read
[07:23] <smslave> foreach (CompWindow *w, cScreen->getWindowPaintList ())
[07:24] <smslave> I can try it later if you're busy though
[07:24] <didrocks> smslave: I've already lost 2 hours compiling it when it FTBFS, then, this one, then getting debug symbol and having the stack, so I prefer you take your time once you will have some to look at this!
[07:24] <smslave> sure
[07:24] <didrocks> yeah, prepping design tracker for next week
[07:25] <smslave> ok
[07:25] <didrocks> (spot 2 issues, writing test cases…)
[07:25] <smslave> I mean, the only thing that comes to mind right now is that this is a race condition when windows are destroyed, but I'll have to give it another look I guess
[07:25] <smslave> odd that I've never seen this before though
[07:27] <didrocks> smslave: the test case is pretty straightforward and I get it 6 times on 6 trial
[07:27] <didrocks> I guess you just saw the window appearing now and didn't try to click then
[07:38] <rodrigo_> morning
[07:42] <smslave> didrocks: yeah
[07:43] <didrocks> good morning rodrigo_
[07:43] <rodrigo_> hi didrocks
[07:54] <chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
[07:56] <didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
[07:57] <mvo> hey chrisccoulson
[07:57] <chrisccoulson> hi mvo didrocks
[07:57] <chrisccoulson> how are you?
[07:57] <didrocks> I'm fine, thanks, and you?
[07:57] <chrisccoulson> yeah, good thanks
[07:58] <chrisccoulson> just about to get the chromium builds going again
[07:58] <chrisccoulson> finally!
[08:00] <rodrigo_> hi chrisccoulson, mvo
[08:01] <pitti> hey rodrigo_
[08:01] <pitti> good morning mvo
[08:01] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson
[08:01] <rodrigo_> hi pitti
[08:02] <chrisccoulson> hi rodrigo_ and pitti
[08:03] <mvo> good morning rodrigo_, pitti
[08:03] <mvo> rodrigo_: your diff from last night looks good for the system-settings stuff, I would like to add a regression test before uploading but I can do that during the merge
[08:07] <rodrigo_> mvo, ok
[08:07] <chrisccoulson> it's all seb128's fault ;)
[08:08] <seb128> hey
[08:08] <chrisccoulson> hi!
[08:08] <seb128> chrisccoulson, what did I do again?
[08:08] <chrisccoulson> seb128, nothing. i was just messing around ;)
[08:08] <chrisccoulson> good morning btw
[08:08] <seb128> switching to tb? yeah that was a mistake, the software is good but the ui is just crappy :p
[08:08] <chrisccoulson> lol
[08:08] <seb128> chrisccoulson, good morning, how are you?
[08:10] <chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i'm good thanks
[08:12] <didrocks> salut seb128, ça va ?
[08:12] <pitti> bonjour seb128
[08:12] <seb128> lut didrocks, ca va! et toi ?
[08:12] <didrocks> seb128: ça va :)
[08:14] <seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
[08:14] <pitti> seb128: pretty good, thanks!
[08:14] <pitti> seb128: we had a nice house-warming party yesterday, some 10 people plus tons of pizza, beer, and wine :)
[08:15] <seb128> waouh, sounds great!
[08:15] <pitti> seb128: I updated our pygobject/g-i stack in debian and synced
[08:15] <pitti> seb128: Debian experimental has a gtk+3.0 3.2.1 package which is ready for upload, so we can also merge with that?
[08:15] <seb128> did you make lot of friends already there, or did you invite neightbors etc?
[08:16] <pitti> seb128: yesterday we mostly had colleagues from my wife over, plus one of our neighbors
[08:16] <seb128> pitti, yeah, we should merge glib and gtk, glib should be closed from a sync, gtk maybe a bit less
[08:16] <pitti> seb128: gtk certainly has lots of DXish stuff, yes
[08:17] <pitti> seb128: so my current plan is to finish pygobject (need to test 3.2.1 in debian first, as it currently segfaults)
[08:17] <rodrigo_> hey seb128
[08:17] <pitti> seb128: then update glib-networking, and I'm also happy to loo at merging/syncing glib
[08:17] <seb128> hey rodrigo_
[08:17] <pitti> "look"
[08:17] <rodrigo_> mvo, do you want me to mark the 2 bugs as SRUs?
[08:18] <seb128> pitti, ok, feel free to do it, I was planning to have a look to glib,gtk for sru and merges then next week but if you beat me to it I will not complain ;-)
[08:18] <pitti> seb128: I won't get to GTK today, I think
[08:18] <mvo> rodrigo_: yeah, please do
[08:18] <pitti> seb128: but we should wait with that until we have new glib anyway IMHO
[08:18] <seb128> pitti, I'm still a bit torned between oneiric srus and bug triage and precise work
[08:19] <seb128> I did syncs yesterday for things that were good to sync
[08:19] <rodrigo_> mvo, done
[08:20] <seb128> pitti: what is good is that apparently we can sync things using an orig.tar.xz even if we had the same version using .tar.bz2
[08:20] <pitti> seb128: sure
[08:20] <pitti> it's a different file, so it doesn't conflict
[08:20] <seb128> well I was unsure if you could replace the orig for a same version
[08:20] <seb128> I never changed the orig format in a revision before ;-)
[08:22] <pitti> seb128: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus are the bugs that were on the oneiric RC radar, but seems none have a solution available righ tnow
[08:23] <seb128> pitti, the list is quite small
[08:24] <seb128> pitti, oh btw I did catch robert_ancell yesterday evening
[08:24] <rickspencer3> seb128, excuse me for interrupting, but I have a quick question about desktop files
[08:24] <seb128> we will do a mini "SRU sprint" for lightdm on monday
[08:25] <seb128> rickspencer3, hey, you are always welcome to ask questions or just chat with us ;-)
[08:25] <rickspencer3> seb128, if I want to run an app with an environment variable, can I just add it to the exec line of the desktop file?
[08:25] <rickspencer3> Exec=LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=0 photobomb
[08:25] <rickspencer3> ^ didn't work
[08:25] <seb128> rickspencer3, no
[08:25] <rickspencer3> unity won't launch the app
[08:25] <seb128> you should rather have a command with sh -c "...."
[08:26] <rickspencer3> Exec=sh -c LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=0 photobomb
[08:26] <rickspencer3> ?
[08:26] <seb128> try sh -c "LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=0 photobomb"
[08:27] <rickspencer3> yeah!
[08:27] <rickspencer3> seb128, thanks
[08:27] <seb128> rickspencer3, yw ;-)
[08:27] <rickspencer3> I was actually helping someone in #ubutnu-app-devel
[08:27] <rickspencer3> :)
[08:27] <seb128> hehe
[08:34] <pitti> seb128: ah, so Robert will stay up late and you'll get up earlier on Monday?
[08:34] <seb128> pitti, no, we are both arriving sunday in Orlando
[08:34] <seb128> pitti, dx sprint next week
[08:34] <pitti> ah, right
[08:35] <seb128> pitti, so we will sit together and look at lightdm during one of the hacking slot on monday
[08:35] <pitti> seb128: ♪ sprinting by the pool ♫ ♬
[08:35] <seb128> shush :p
[08:35] <seb128> (it's a secret!=
[08:35] <seb128> working hard!
[08:35] <seb128> ;-)
[08:35] <seb128> (ok, next to the pool with a cocktail, but still working hard :p)
[08:36]  * pitti pats seb128
[08:37] <pitti> seb128: oh, btw, didn't you say you would take the Fridays off?
[08:41] <seb128> pitti, yeah, I skipped this one because there was some stuff I wanted to finish and get ready before travelling
[08:42] <seb128> but I will probably be off at some point during the afternoon to get ready before travelling
[08:42] <seb128> i.e I've some shopping to do, maybe getting an haircut, etc
[08:42] <pitti> get one for Greece as well!
[08:43] <didrocks> seb128: haircut, you are cheating! copying me :-)
[08:43] <seb128> :p
[08:45] <rickspencer3> seb128, didrocks if either of you guys wear glasses, get them in Florida
[08:45] <rickspencer3> omg eye glasses are expensive in France
[08:46] <rickspencer3> :)
[08:46] <seb128> lol
[08:46] <seb128> rickspencer3, should I get my sun blocker in floride as well? ;-)
[08:46] <didrocks> rickspencer3: indeed, learnt that quite recently the hard (money) way :/
[08:46] <rickspencer3> seb128, yes
[08:46] <rickspencer3> I will be buying tubes of sunblock in FL!
[08:46] <seb128> ;-)
[08:46] <seb128> didrocks, apparently sunblocker is expensive in France
[08:47] <didrocks> rickspencer3 wants to get a new black market job? selling sunblock in France :)
[08:47] <didrocks> in winter, not sure that will be successfull
[08:47] <rickspencer3> tres cher
[08:48] <rickspencer3> je suis grille!
[08:48] <seb128> lol
[08:48] <didrocks> :)
[08:51] <chrisccoulson> when does everyone fly to FL?
[08:54] <hrw> hi
[08:54] <hrw> what displays desktop in unity x11 session?
[08:55] <hrw> cause it looks funny when nothing renders desktop
[09:04] <didrocks> hey hrw, what do you mean, what shows the desktop icons?
[09:04] <didrocks> and the wallpaper?
[09:05] <seb128> didrocks, sunday
[09:05] <seb128> ups
[09:05] <seb128> chrisccoulson, sunday
[09:05] <pitti> chrisccoulson: next Sat
[09:06] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm flying next saturday too
[09:06] <chrisccoulson> seb128, so, you get 2 weeks of nice weather ;)
[09:06] <seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah!
[09:06] <seb128> pitti, I assigned you bug #874299, basically it's a request to backport http://git.gnome.org/browse/pygobject/commit/?id=611f58b99851328653af4930f188c33eccaa9f6f
[09:06] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 874299 in pygobject "in gedit external tools' names can not be edited" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/874299
[09:08] <didrocks> people living in the cold and rainy part of Franche really deserve 2 weeks of nice weather sometimes :)
[09:08] <seb128> ;-)
[09:09] <didrocks> France*
[09:09] <didrocks> (just saying :p)
[09:09] <seb128> didrocks, it's not fair that you get 2 weeks of Florida as well!
[09:09] <didrocks> seb128: well, I don't get 2 extra slacking days, it's just justice! :)
[09:09] <seb128> ;-)
[09:18] <hrw> didrocks: yes, that stuff
[09:18] <hrw> didrocks: I use setup without any tool drawing desktop and get lot of crap on screen due to that.
[09:18] <sroecker> hi, is there no "file copy notification" anymore in unity?
[09:18] <didrocks> hrw: it's nautilus which is drawing it by default
[09:18] <didrocks> hrw: if you have nothing refreshing the wallpaper, yeah, it will get blurry
[09:19] <hrw> didrocks: fixing it is not planned? I do not plan to have nautilus installed
[09:19] <didrocks> hrw: you can ask g-s-d to draw the background
[09:19] <seb128> ok, I'm out to buy some food and other stuff, be back in an hour
[09:19] <didrocks> hrw: you need something to draw the background
[09:19] <didrocks> hrw: there is no "fix" there
[09:19] <didrocks> or something to fix
[09:19] <hrw> ok
[09:28] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, what about people living in the UK, which is the cold and rainy place of europe? ;)
[09:28] <sroecker> ah, found a bug for that. bug 851606
[09:28] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 851606 in unity-2d "unity-2d multi-window selector does not show 'file copy' dialog" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/851606
[09:29] <hrw> btw - with systray whitelisting enabled to 'show all' there is no way to click on apps
[09:30] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: are they using euros? :-)
[09:30] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, no, thankfully!
[09:30] <chrisccoulson> :)
[09:30] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: so you don't need sun! :)
[09:30] <chrisccoulson> lol
[09:31] <didrocks> hrw: something to ping the dx team about on #ayatana
[09:31] <hrw> xthx
[10:15] <pitti> oh, mterry didn't commit his glib upload
[10:16] <pitti> done now
[10:19] <pitti> seb128: btw, bzr-builddeb in precise supports .xz; I just synced svn-buildpackage for the same reason
[10:19]  * pitti installs the two debs from precise
[10:37] <pitti> seb128: glib> our remaining difference is debian bug 634099 now, which has an open problem wrt. the debug package
[10:37] <ubot2> Debian bug 634099 in src:glib2.0 "Please transition glib2.0 for multiarch" [Normal,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/634099
[10:43] <seb128> re
[10:43] <seb128> pitti, great
[10:43] <seb128> 3°C there, brrrrr, no icecream on the way back from the supermarket for me
[10:44] <Laney> does pristine-tar have proper xz support yet?
[10:44] <seb128> pitti, speaking of glib desrt remained me that we should drop our patch to fallback the gio dir to the old location
[10:51] <smslave> didrocks: can't reproduce your crash :(
[10:52] <smslave> opened two terms, minimized, launcher icon -> scale, clicked on the unminimized one and it didn't crash
[10:53] <smslave> didrocks: however, I think there is a case where if a window is closed while in scale mode it will cause scale to crash in the same way, so maybe my idea might fix that
[10:53] <pitti> Laney: works fine in git-bp at least
[10:53] <pitti> seb128: to the non-multiarch path you mean?
[10:53] <didrocks> smslave: really?
[10:53] <pitti> (me @ lunch, bbl)
[10:53] <didrocks> seb128: do you want to test this in a ppa?
[10:54] <Laney> pitti: it works, but only because it stores the entire file AFAIK
[10:54] <seb128> pitti, yes
[10:54] <Laney> i.e. it doesn't do proper deltas for xz yet
[10:54] <smslave> didrocks: I'll see if I can get it this other way
[10:54] <didrocks> smslave: that's still weird, it doesn't seem to be hardware dependant
[10:54] <smslave> it is not hardware dependent
[10:54] <didrocks> so, if seb128 can confirm, I can push this in a ppa
[10:54] <smslave> but it is a race condition
[10:55] <didrocks> hum, ok
[10:55] <chrisccoulson> cjwatson, so, i can disable the firefox test suite to "fix" this powerpc hang for now
[10:55] <chrisccoulson> but firefox will definitely *not* work on powerpc
[10:55] <chrisccoulson> at all ;)
[10:55] <chrisccoulson> it will just hang on startup like the test suite does
[10:55] <seb128> didrocks, I'm happy to break my 10v for you ;-)
[10:57] <smslave> didrocks: weird, don't even see it in that case O.o
[10:58] <smslave> didrocks: nevertheless, I can add a patch which *might* fix it
[10:58] <Laney> chrisccoulson: how does iceweasel build for debian? looks like they run some kind of testsuilte there
[10:59] <chrisccoulson> Laney, what version are they building?
[10:59] <Laney> 8.0~b3
[10:59] <chrisccoulson> no idea, but it doesn't work at all here
[10:59] <Laney> yeah, thought it might be interesting to see if there is a relevant difference
[11:00] <Laney> i notice some patches relating to tests for example http://patch-tracker.debian.org/package/iceweasel/8.0~b3-2
[11:02] <smslave> didrocks: ok, at least this approach doesn't break anything
[11:02] <didrocks> smslave: ensure you run it for a couple of days and let's see together on Monday
[11:04] <smslave> didrocks: ah, reproduced it in a different way I know what it is now
[11:07] <didrocks> great :)
[11:21] <chrisccoulson> Laney, it doesn't look like they run all the tests that we do
[11:21] <chrisccoulson> still, i'm confused why any of them work
[11:21] <chrisccoulson> the way the test fails here looks like a fairly fundamental problem with the JS engine, which should break everything really
[11:22] <chrisccoulson> powerpc is a pain with it only being a tier-3 platform (https://developer.mozilla.org/en/Supported_build_configurations)
[11:29] <smslave> urgh, weird crap going on
[11:29] <smslave> bbiab
[12:13] <aquarius> I'd like to run a particular xmodmap command on my machine on boot, so that it applies to the login screen as well as when logged in. Where should I put it? :)
[12:18] <seb128> pitti, should I mark https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-boot-speed superseded by https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-desktop-boot-speed ?
[12:19] <seb128> aquarius, /etc/X11/Xsession.d ?
[12:19] <chrisccoulson> ooh, me subscribes to that one ;)
[12:19] <seb128> chrisccoulson, ;-)
[12:20] <pitti> seb128: yes, looks like duplication
[12:20] <seb128> pitti, I did it please let me know if that was wrong
[12:20] <seb128> ok, great
[12:20] <pitti> thanks
[12:20] <seb128> yw
[12:21] <seb128> pitti, I assigned https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-lock-screen to robert_ancell
[12:21] <seb128> he said he would work on that next cycle, it has to do with lightdm as well
[12:22] <seb128> mdeslaur, ^ I subscribed you to that as well I hope it's ok
[12:23] <seb128> mdeslaur, I know how much you love screen locking ;-)
[12:23] <mdeslaur> seb128: yes, thanks
[12:23] <aquarius> seb128, that looks like a good place, thanks!
[12:23]  * aquarius remaps the caps lock key to "r" to fix the broken r key. I need a new laptop.
[12:23] <ogra_> oh, that will be fun typing on thatr
[12:25] <seb128> pitti, how do I get https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-vnc to not be on UDS topics?
[12:25] <pitti> seb128: unset the uds-p
[12:25] <seb128> pitti, just by deleting the uds-p sprint?
[12:25] <pitti> yes, can you? I can do it for you if you can't
[12:25] <seb128> pitti, just did it
[12:25] <seb128> I put denied
[12:25] <pitti> great
[12:25] <seb128> pitti, we pretty much sorted it on the list already, there is no much to discuss
[12:25] <pitti> oh, we did?
[12:26] <seb128> pitti, yeah, bryce did testing on various hardware and confirmed it was a nvidia driver issue in old version that got fixed and an fglrx issue still there, he took action to get it escalated to amd
[12:26] <seb128> pitti, that's pretty much what we can do about it, so not a lot to discuss
[12:27] <pitti> seb128: I thought there were voices on teh bug report that it also happened on intel
[12:27] <seb128> pitti, those seem marginal issues
[12:36] <seb128> pitti, well anyway there might be still issues but it doesn't seem the sort of things that are well suited for an UDS session
[12:36] <seb128> it rather requires a call for testing and evaluation of the feedback and deciding
[12:37] <pitti> seb128: correct
[12:38] <seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, I see that you found the way to https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-calendar-integration ;-)
[12:38] <chrisccoulson> lol
[12:38] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I was afraid that you were trying to walk away from it since you didn't comment or anything on the list ;-)
[12:38] <chrisccoulson> are you spying on me? ;)
[12:39]  * rodrigo_ lunch
[12:43] <seb128> chrisccoulson, you know me ;-)
[12:43] <seb128> chrisccoulson, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-mozilla-upgrade-experience, stop blaming it on the package manager
[12:43] <seb128> it's an issue that we don't lock the session or log out to "apply the updates"
[12:45] <chrisccoulson> seb128, it's a package manager bug :P
[12:45] <chrisccoulson> we should be able to update running applications without breaking them
[12:46] <seb128> yeah, I'm not sure it's possible to solve for the archive out of "locking" the session
[12:46] <chrisccoulson> if we could do that, then we could have silent security updates ;)
[12:46] <seb128> never going to happen, for how long does the old version need to keep working?
[12:46] <seb128> weeks?
[12:47] <pitti> weeks would render security updates pointless
[12:47] <pitti> the entire reason why we do the updates is that you can't keep your browser running in the wild any more
[12:47] <seb128> like the glade to gtkbuilder example you gave is a good example (we could work around this one by keeping the old glade though), but let's say the .ui changed in the new version with the same location
[12:48] <chrisccoulson> no, it wouldn't be weeks. you'd still get notified after an upgrade to prompt a restart. what i'm saying is that we shouldn't break running applications by doing an upgrade
[12:48] <chrisccoulson> which upstream already seem to manage ok ;)
[12:48] <seb128> chrisccoulson, what you advocate for is having all programs being one blob with static-built-libraries
[12:48] <pitti> what's that do to with libraries?
[12:48] <chrisccoulson> it's more complicated than that
[12:48] <pitti> you can change or remove .so files underneath a running program just fine
[12:49] <pitti> s/program/process/
[12:49] <seb128> right
[12:49] <pitti> firefox might execve() new processes, of course
[12:49] <chrisccoulson> yeah, those aren't the problem. the problem is anything which isn't mapped in to a programs address space
[12:49] <seb128> the interface glade,.ui is closer from real issues
[12:49] <seb128> or images
[12:49] <chrisccoulson> eg, xul files, html, js, xml etc
[12:49] <seb128> or documentation
[12:49] <chrisccoulson> and glade/ui files, as seb128 mentioned
[12:49] <seb128> chrisccoulson, well I'm sure we can solve it case by case, but it would take years to fix every program in the archive
[12:49] <seb128> I'm not convinced it's the best use of our efforts
[12:49] <chrisccoulson> the way that upstream installers work is that they don't remove the old copy until you restart the app
[12:50] <seb128> we should just "lock" the session while applying the updates
[12:50] <pitti> we could apply updates on logout/shutdown
[12:50] <pitti> but then some people would never do them
[12:50] <pitti> and that would be annoying if you are in a hurry
[12:50] <chrisccoulson> yeah
[12:50] <seb128> chrisccoulson, it means system tools have to watch users process, seems a can of issues sort of situation
[12:50] <pitti> so I never liked that much
[12:51] <pitti> chrisccoulson: what was the original problem, OOI?
[12:51] <chrisccoulson> pitti - with firefox?
[12:51] <pitti> my firefox seldomly breaks when I installed a security update, it just keeps nagging me about "restart me!" (which is fine, I think)
[12:52] <seb128> chrisccoulson, the other issue is what happens if one user restart firefox and another user is still logged in with the old version running? when do you overwrite the files? does the restart for the 1 user get back the old version?
[12:52] <chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, it breaks if you try to open, say, the preferences window. ie, anything which requires it to read more resources
[12:52] <pitti> well, at least it tells you so
[12:52] <pitti> which is already more than we do in any other program
[12:52] <chrisccoulson> seb128, i'm not sure how to handle the multi-user case. i don't even think upstream handle that well. but then, i think that's an edge case for most devices
[12:53] <chrisccoulson> these are mozilla's plans for updates btw - https://wiki.mozilla.org/Background_Updates
[12:54] <chrisccoulson> their current update system sucks actually, as it checks/applies updates at startup
[12:54] <chrisccoulson> i think the proposal there is similar to the chrome model on windows
[12:54] <seb128> chrisccoulson, well I think 1- we will never manage to make it work accross the archive, so by see it's not a package manager issue, 2- the cost is way higher than the benefit seeing the number of things that don't work on our desktop
[12:55] <seb128> it's a very hard problem ;-)
[12:55] <chrisccoulson> indeed
[12:55] <chrisccoulson> but it sucks that people experience this every 6 weeks
[12:55] <pitti> 2- full ack
[12:55] <chrisccoulson> and we get bug reports from it too
[12:55] <chrisccoulson> well, actually, not anymore
[12:55] <pitti> 1- it's also not a problem for most other packages in a stable releases, as security updates don't change the interface, glade files, library structre, etc.
[12:55] <seb128> chrisccoulson, well, then we should do a better job telling them that once the update is applied their browser *needs* to be restarted
[12:55] <chrisccoulson> as i blocked apport from reporting bugs ;)
[12:56] <pitti> the problem only really hits firefox because it's a combined features/security/libraries/infrastructure files update
[12:56] <seb128> well, it hits users on cross Ubuntu version dist-upgrades
[12:57] <seb128> but I think we should really message that those require a restart
[12:57] <pitti> well, yes, but in that case really all bets are off
[12:57] <pitti> we can't possibly keep the entire old system around
[12:57] <jdstrand> my wife hits this all the time
[12:57] <seb128> jdstrand, firefox?
[12:57] <seb128> jdstrand, or in other cases?
[12:57] <jdstrand> "Jamie, firefox is broken!"
[12:57] <jdstrand> firefox
[12:57] <seb128> we should not display a banner
[12:57] <jdstrand> "Jamie: please restart it"
[12:57] <kenvandine> mine too, but it was usually the compiz stacking problem in natty :)
[12:57] <seb128> we should display on top of the firefox screen "click there to restart"
[12:57] <jdstrand> "Oh, ok, it is working again. Thanks!"
[12:58] <kenvandine> firefox doesn't work really meant she couldn't click on anything :)
[12:58] <jdstrand> heh
[12:58] <kenvandine> perhaps the requred restart button should prevent you from doing anything else until you restart firefox
[12:58] <didrocks> jdstrand: sounds like a "The IT Crow" answer :)
[12:58] <seb128> or we should just make update-manager say "your browser is about to be updated, please step away from it we will apply the update and restart it for you"
[12:58] <jdstrand> heh
[13:01] <seb128> pitti, should we deny https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-remove-safely-remove for UDS or has the situation changed and it's worth discussing?
[13:01] <seb128> pitti, I've updated the whiteboard with notes from when we added the option saying why we needed both
[13:02] <pitti> seb128: thanks; indeed, this hasn't changed; I un-uds-p-ed it
[13:02] <pitti> and set definition to obsolete
[13:02] <seb128> thanks
[13:13] <didrocks> Ubuntu GNOME Shell Remix: http://linux.softpedia.com/progDownload/Ubuntu-GNOME-Shell-Remix-Download-74925.html
[13:14] <didrocks> would be interesting to know what's in it and ensure there is no malware…
[13:19] <seb128> didrocks, those people should be hit with a cluestick until they understand it would benefit everybody if they were working with Ubuntu for doing a such remix ;-)
[13:20] <didrocks> seb128: cluestick? always the soft method, isn't it? :-)
[13:21] <seb128> indeed ;-)
[13:27] <seb128> didrocks, could you check if bug #878859 is your touchpad issue?
[13:27] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 878859 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome applications grab mouse input when the menu bar is shift-clicked while gnome-settings-daemon is running" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/878859
[13:27] <didrocks> seb128: sure, let's see
[13:27] <seb128> can't confirm the bug there but since you have it sometimes on your config...
[13:28] <didrocks> seb128: I doubt about it as my mouse is most of the time in the middle of the screen once blocked
[13:29] <seb128> ok
[13:29] <seb128> didrocks, well maybe shift is an hint, do you keyboard navigate menus?
[13:29] <seb128> though that wouldn't be a shift action
[13:30] <seb128> well still nfc about those people about touchpad lock issues, it never happened there
[13:30] <didrocks> seb128: no, not in that case
[13:30] <didrocks> seb128: I just tried, even with deactive trackpad while typing
[13:30] <seb128> didrocks, ok, it was worth checking, thanks
[13:30] <didrocks> no effect
[13:30] <didrocks> yw
[13:31] <didrocks> never happens on my laptop, quite often on my netbook
[13:31] <seb128> didrocks, one of those time when it happens could you try to sudo evtest on a vt?
[13:32] <didrocks> seb128: sure, will do next time
[13:32] <seb128> then maybe try to kill running softwares and see if that unblock it
[13:32] <didrocks> seb128: I tried that
[13:32] <didrocks> no clue
[13:34] <seb128> gnome-settings-daemon, syndaemon, unity, dunno what else is running ;-)
[13:34] <seb128> didrocks, thanks
[13:34] <seb128> didrocks, ok
[13:35] <seb128> didrocks, but you never got it without the "disable while typing"?
[13:35] <didrocks> seb128: right now, I didn't, but I don't use my netbook extensively
[13:35] <didrocks> seb128: will probably have a better feedback on Sunday
[13:35] <didrocks> if I have crisis on plane :)
[13:36] <seb128> ;-)
[13:50] <seb128> didrocks, don't freak out about the SRU bugs closing for your GNOME updates, I pocket copied most to precise to clean version and get a bit extra testing
[13:50] <seb128> didrocks, they didn't move to -updates before the week delay by error ;-)
[13:51] <seb128> cyphermox, ^ same for the evo ones
[14:09] <seb128> ricotz, there?
[14:09] <seb128> ricotz, how is glib 2.31 working for you? do you have it in a ppa somewhere?
[14:13] <ricotz> seb128, hi, works fine
[14:13] <ricotz> you can find it here https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/staging/+packages
[14:15] <ricotz> there arent any real changes, besides symbols update and *-doc.install changes
[14:15] <seb128> desrt, hey, there? do you recommend running glib 2.31.0 or git snapshots for testing?
[14:15] <desrt> 'testing'?
[14:16] <desrt> like, for personal use or for what goes into the archive for p-?
[14:16] <seb128> desrt, if I and other want to run 2.31 until UDS to see how it works on our oneiric laptops
[14:16] <desrt> oh. either is fine
[14:16] <desrt> not too much changes on master since
[14:16] <desrt> i'd go with 2.31.0 i guess
[14:16] <seb128> desrt, thanks
[14:17] <desrt> all problems should be fixed thanks to rico =)
[14:17] <seb128> ricotz, is there any chance you put a 2.31 somewhere which is not a daily build and reply on the desktop list to the GNOME version discussion with a pointer to it?
[14:17] <seb128> i.e gnome3 ppa for precise would do
[14:18] <desrt> 'precise' is a terrible release name
[14:18] <desrt> completely fails to roll off the tongue
[14:18] <seb128> ;-)
[14:18] <seb128> Sweetshark, hey
[14:18] <desrt> oneiric wasn't great either.  'natty' was awesome.
[14:18] <ogra_> desrt, you need chewing gum
[14:18] <ogra_> that makes it easier
[14:19] <desrt> that sounds rather imprecise...
[14:19] <ogra_> exactemente :)
[14:19] <ricotz> seb128, can do, but probably later, i guess you want a oneiric and precise upload then
[14:19] <seb128> Sweetshark, pitti: so some people pointed that libreoffice configure.in has a --disable-gnomevfs
[14:19] <pitti> oooh! so, away with the build dep?
[14:19] <seb128> well, I'm not sure if that would regress some functionalities
[14:19] <seb128> it's pointed on https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=41678
[14:20] <ubot2> Freedesktop bug 41678 in Libreoffice "Use GSetting instead GConf" [Enhancement,New: ]
[14:20] <seb128> it has flags for gconf and gnomevfs
[14:20] <seb128> not sure what would be different or miss if we build without those
[14:22] <seb128> http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/gitweb/?p=libreoffice.git;a=blob;f=libreoffice.spec;h=5ed5443d004ae9382f6a88751b8d1f54edb2fea1;hb=HEAD
[14:22] <seb128> Sweetshark, pitti: so fedora builds with "--disable-gnome-vfs --enable-gio"
[14:23] <seb128> seems good ;-)
[14:23] <pitti> *want* *want* *want*
[14:23] <seb128> yeah, same here
[14:23] <seb128> ;-)
[14:23] <Sweetshark> seb128, pitti: I still have a disabled gvfs patch lying around, which I have to figure out (what it did, if it was obsolete or need to be reproduced)
[14:23] <Sweetshark> seb128, pitti:km will do
[14:24] <seb128> Sweetshark, can we just steal the fedora patch if they have one?
[14:24] <Sweetshark> seb128, pitti:k, will do ;)
[14:24]  * pitti hugs Sweetshark
[14:24] <seb128> Sweetshark, thanks!
[14:24] <pitti> Sweetshark: on the pro side, accessing files on samba and what not will actually work then :)
[14:25] <Sweetshark> seb128: IIRC no need to steal it is upstream already, but I did get around to check what that means depwise for us. But since you two hop around like happy bunnys, I gues it makes stuff simpler ;)
[14:26] <seb128> Sweetshark, well I don't know much what it does, just that fedora is building with those option so they probably tested them and it probably works for them
[14:27] <seb128> the --enable-gio is in the upstream gio configure.in
[14:27] <seb128> so that's not a distropatch it's an upstream option
[14:27] <Sweetshark> seb128: yeah, I know
[14:28] <seb128> Sweetshark, well the other day you told me it would require non trivial work to drop gnome-vfs and switch to gio, but anyway if we can do it great ;-)
[14:30] <seb128> jjardon, hey, gnome-media being deprecated (I think it's you who wrote that on the wiki?), we still use gnome-sound-recorder
[14:30] <Sweetshark> seb128: no, I said caolan (aka redhat) is working on it upstream and I dont know the status ;)
[14:31] <chrisccoulson> g'ah, i officially hate chromium already
[14:32] <seb128> Sweetshark, ok, seems like we should just turn the flags early on for next cycle and see how it goes
[14:32] <gentoo_drummer> I used the command line installation since i hate unity and installed xfce. the system is incredible fast, even quicker than my debian and i was wondering if someone could tell me how can i get the default ubuntu font rendering?
[14:33] <seb128> gentoo_drummer, try #ubuntu
[14:33] <gentoo_drummer> overpopulated
[14:33] <Sweetshark> seb128: yep, thats already on my blueprint.
[14:33] <seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
[14:33]  * kenvandine really needs to start looking at blueprints
[14:33] <seb128> gentoo_drummer, well we don't take trolls and it's not an user support channel
[14:34] <gentoo_drummer> any of you guys used the command line installation before?
[14:34] <gentoo_drummer> just need to get a clean base system with xfce and ubuntu font rendering
[14:34] <gentoo_drummer> that would be fantastic..
[14:34] <seb128> gentoo_drummer, wrong channel
[14:34] <seb128> try #ubuntu
[14:35] <gentoo_drummer> doesnt this fall into the desktop dept.
[14:35] <gentoo_drummer> ?
[14:35] <seb128> no
[14:35] <seb128> desktop is unity that you hate
[14:35] <seb128> well that channel is
[14:35] <seb128> try #ubuntu or #xubuntu for xfce
[14:36] <cyphermox> seb128: ok, thanks
[15:24] <seb128> "   * dh_installdeb: Support debian/package.maintscript files,
[15:24] <seb128>      which can contain dpkg-maintscript-helper commands. This can be used
[15:24] <seb128>      to automate moving or removing conffiles, or anything added to
[15:24] <seb128>      dpkg-maintscript-helper later on. Closes: #574443
[15:24] <seb128>      (Thanks, Colin Watson)"
[15:24] <seb128> \o/
[15:24] <seb128> i.e
[15:24] <seb128> http://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/pkg-gnome/desktop/unstable/gnome-screensaver/debian/gnome-screensaver.maintscript?view=markup&pathrev=30792
[15:24] <seb128> like it ;-)*
[15:25] <seb128> not having to deal with snippet in different pre,post maintainer scripts
[15:25] <seb128> just dumping a line in a file
[15:25] <chrisccoulson> nice
[15:25] <chrisccoulson> it's a shame my packaging still needs to support lucid ;)
[15:30] <didrocks> seb128: hum, is that new? I don't see the difference from what we have for a year?
[15:31] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, we had dpkg-maintscript-helper, but we still had to add the correct snippets to each maintainer script to handle all cases
[15:31] <seb128> didrocks, well what I was doing until now is adding those sort of snippets:
[15:31] <seb128> if [ "$1" = configure ] && dpkg --compare-versions
[15:31] <seb128>  dpkg-mainscript-helper...
[15:31] <seb128> fi
[15:32] <seb128> in the 3 to 5 maintainer scripts
[15:32] <didrocks> hum, it was just if [ "$1" = configure ] && dpkg-mainscript-helper … <verions>… fi
[15:32] <didrocks> but yeah, we won 3 lines for configure check then, nice :)
[15:32] <seb128> right, in 3 or 5 files
[15:32] <didrocks> ah
[15:32] <seb128> which you had to create and remember which ones
[15:32] <didrocks> ok, got it
[15:32] <didrocks> it's a standard location now
[15:33] <seb128> it's 1 file now
[15:33] <didrocks> that's nice :)
[15:33] <seb128> which deals with all the right pre,post* to copy the snippet in
[15:33] <seb128> yeah ;-)
[15:33] <seb128> especially when like me you never remember which pre,post scripts you need to patch :p
[15:33] <seb128> I did tend to just put it in the postinst but that's buggy ;-)
[15:34] <didrocks> seb128: what, you didn't put in your bookmark http://wiki.debian.org/DpkgConffileHandling ? ;)
[15:34] <seb128> http://wiki.debian.org/DpkgConffileHandling suggests it was "only" 3 to patch
[15:34] <seb128> didrocks, yeah, I did, I can delete that bookmark now :p
[15:35] <chrisccoulson> i basically copied the entire snippets directly from dpkg-maintscript-helper for firefox ;)
[15:36] <chrisccoulson> which sucks
[15:36] <didrocks> yeah it started in maverick
[15:36] <didrocks> no luck for chrisccoulson :)
[15:37] <seb128> hehe, no luck tomorrow either for chrisccoulson with the 5 years of desktop support
[15:38] <chrisccoulson> yeah, my job just got harder ;)
[15:38] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: but you love it!
[15:38] <chrisccoulson> of course :)
[15:38] <chrisccoulson> easy is boring
[15:38] <chrisccoulson> ;)
[15:38] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: on the other way, we can say "you just support one version of firefox" after all
[15:38] <didrocks> slacker! :)
[15:38] <chrisccoulson> heh
[15:38] <seb128> yeah, "one source", "one version"
[15:38] <seb128> that's easy and boring ;-)
[15:39] <seb128> chrisccoulson, and your upstream is a solid one which does testing ;-)
[15:40] <didrocks> what, that exists? :-)
[15:40] <didrocks> nobody warned me!
[15:43] <seb128> yeah, me neither!
[15:44] <rickspencer3> 5 year desktop LTS
[15:44] <rickspencer3> what?
[15:44] <rickspencer3> j/k
[15:45] <didrocks> rickspencer3: sure you never heard about it! :-)
[15:45] <rickspencer3> heard about what?
[15:45] <didrocks> (this is where the boss normally says "oh btw, you're fired" ;))
[15:45] <rickspencer3> didrocks, seriously, except for chrisccoulson, this is a good thing
[15:46] <rickspencer3> didrocks, lol
[15:46] <rickspencer3> never!
[15:46] <rickspencer3> I would fire myself first
[15:46] <didrocks> rickspencer3: who cares about chrisccoulson! :)
[15:46] <ricotz> seb128, glib uploaded, https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team/+archive/gnome3/+packages?field.name_filter=glib2.0&field.status_filter=published&field.series_filter=
[15:46] <rickspencer3> hey
[15:46] <didrocks> more seriously, yeah, it's a huge selling point for the LTS :)
[15:46] <ricotz> seb128, perhaps someone could bump the build priorities
[15:47] <seb128> pitti, ^
[15:47] <chrisccoulson> lol
[15:48] <chrisccoulson> hi rickspencer3!
[15:48] <rickspencer3> hi chrisccoulson
[15:48] <rickspencer3> I'm feeling very nostalgic for some reason
[15:48] <rickspencer3> remembering when you first joined the team
[15:48] <rickspencer3> it seems like only 2 years ago
[15:48] <pitti> seb128, ricotz: done
[15:48] <seb128> pitti, danke
[15:48] <ricotz> pitti, thanks :)
[15:48] <chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, it wasn't even 2 years ago ;)
[15:48]  * pitti dances around happily, got a pygobject bug fixed after 4 h of debugging
[15:49] <chrisccoulson> i think it was march wasn't it?
[15:49] <rickspencer3> pitti, congrats!
[15:49] <seb128> pitti, \o/ what was it? the debian segfault bug?
[15:49] <pitti> seb128: no, unrelated; SystemError when using gdbus-codegen generated libraries
[15:49] <seb128> ok
[15:49] <pitti> seb128: the debian segfault thing looks fishy to me, also happens with old pygobject
[15:50] <pitti> seb128: could be my sid chroot which is busted
[15:52] <tshirtman> plop
[15:52] <tshirtman> if i may ask for some support
[15:52] <seb128> hi tshirtman
[15:52] <didrocks> tshirtman: no really support, but bug in your case :)
[15:52] <tshirtman> hi seb128
[15:52] <seb128> you should try #ubuntu for support
[15:52] <tshirtman> well, i think it's a bug, yeah
[15:53] <seb128> go ahead, describe your issue ;-)
[15:53] <tshirtman> i was on natty, and using nvidia driver, my card is one of the blacklisted ones
[15:53] <tshirtman> so no unity 3D for me
[15:54] <tshirtman> i upgraded to oneiric recently, and still blacklisted, so i tried to uninstall nvidia to use Nouveau
[15:54] <tshirtman> because nouveau is enought on my other config
[15:54] <tshirtman> but even removing everything in jokey, i was still using nvidia driver
[15:54] <tshirtman> i removed my xorg.conf, no luck
[15:55] <didrocks> so it seems disabling the nvidia driver in jockey isn't the same that starting a live cd on nouveau, isn't it?
[15:55] <tshirtman> (rebooted every times, of course)
[15:55]  * ogra_ hand tshirtman a jacket ... its cold dude !
[15:55] <tshirtman> and yeah, with a live CD, and using /etc/environment, i can force unity, and use it
[15:55] <tshirtman> althought it's a bit slow, i really prefer the 3D unity
[15:55] <tshirtman> ogra_: thanks but no thanks ;)
[15:56] <ogra_> :)
[15:56] <didrocks> pitti: do you have any idea what can be different between a new livecd setup and removing the nvidia driver in jockey? ^
[15:57] <tshirtman> now i removed all installed nvidia packages, and still unity won't start, bitchin' i miss some GLX extension
[15:58] <tshirtman> (gnome-shell either, it kicks the classic version in)
[15:58] <seb128> tshirtman, what is your libGL alternative on?
[15:58] <tshirtman> so i think something is still different than with live CD
[15:58] <seb128> update-alternatives --list i386-linux-gnu_gl_conf
[15:58] <seb128> i386 or whatever your arch is
[15:59] <tshirtman> /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/mesa/ld.so.conf
[15:59] <seb128> dpkg -S /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/mesa/ld.so.conf
[15:59] <tshirtman> output: libgl1-mesa-glx:i386: /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/mesa/ld.so.conf
[15:59] <pitti> seb128, didrocks: safe travels!
[15:59]  * pitti waves good bye for the weekend, 'nuff for today
[16:00] <mterry> pitti, so I was looking at syncing pilot-link, which we have been keeping a delta for to switch a Breaks line from udev (<< 0.136-1) to udev (<< 136-1) because before 141-1, we used different numbering.  Since lucid has udev 151, I'm going to drop that delta and sync; just wanted to double confirm that that logic is sound.
[16:00] <seb128> pitti, thanks, have a good w.e!
[16:00] <mterry> pitti, oh, nm.  good bye!  :)
[16:00] <seb128> tshirtman, dpkg -S libGL
[16:00] <pitti> mterry: ack
[16:00] <didrocks> thanks pitti! enjoy your week-end!
[16:00] <mterry> pitti, thanks!
[16:01] <tshirtman> seb128: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/496146/
[16:01] <seb128> tshirtman, try removing the ia32-libs?
[16:02] <tshirtman> sudo apt-get remove ia32-libs ?
[16:02] <seb128> it's weird that you had i386-linux before
[16:02] <tshirtman> ia32-libs-multiarch:i386 too?
[16:02] <seb128> but you seems to be on x64
[16:02] <seb128> didrocks, ^ help
[16:02] <tshirtman> yeah, i think i am on x64
[16:02] <seb128> or somebody on x68
[16:02] <seb128> x64
[16:03] <didrocks> I'm not on x64
[16:03] <tshirtman> so i remove, and reboot to see if it changes something?
[16:03] <seb128> well, I would try that
[16:03] <tshirtman> ok
[16:04] <didrocks> seb128: I guess we can steal a dx machine next week as they are almost all on x64 & nvidia
[16:04] <seb128> is anyone on x64 to run "update-alternatives --list i386-linux-gnu_gl_conf"
[16:04] <seb128> ups
[16:04] <seb128> ignore that
[16:04] <seb128> there is i386 in that alternative name
[16:04] <didrocks> seb128: right, /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/mesa/ld.so.conf
[16:05] <seb128> tshirtman, could you open a bug with ubuntu-bug xorg-server?
[16:05] <didrocks> but why it's using i386 one?
[16:05] <seb128> that should add your Xorg.0.log etc
[16:05] <didrocks> shoudln't it be nouveau on amd64?
[16:05] <didrocks> (well, the amd64 version of nouveau, I mean)
[16:06] <seb128> didrocks, dunno how multiarch works
[16:06] <Amaranth> tshirtman: Changes to libGL should not require restarting your computer or even X
[16:06] <seb128> we need somebody who has a 64bit install to do a ls /etc/alternatvies/*gl**
[16:06] <Amaranth> So long as the DDX (xorg driver) initialized correctly
[16:06] <tshirtman> back, no changes
[16:06] <seb128> ls /etc/alternatives/*gl*
[16:07] <seb128> tshirtman, open a bug using "ubuntu-bug xorg-server"
[16:07] <didrocks> tshirtman: I'm all for requisiting a dx machine next week :)
[16:07] <Amaranth> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/715240/
[16:07] <seb128> ups
[16:08] <Amaranth> (most people won't have the egl line)
[16:08] <seb128> tshirtman, open a bug using "ubuntu-bug xserver-common" I guess
[16:08] <Amaranth> I don't think, anyway
[16:08] <tshirtman> http://paste.pocoo.org/show/496149/
[16:08] <tshirtman> there is some 64 in this
[16:09] <tshirtman> should i try to change with update-alternatives?
[16:09] <seb128> tshirtman, can you pastebin your /var/log/Xorg.0.log?
[16:09] <tshirtman> http://paste.pocoo.org/show/496150/
[16:09] <tshirtman> :)
[16:10] <tshirtman> have a nice read :D
[16:10] <Amaranth> tshirtman: You know about pastebinit, right?
[16:10] <tshirtman> nope :)
[16:10] <Amaranth> You can just run cat /var/log/Xorg.0.log | pastebinit and it'll give you a link to the pastebin
[16:10] <tshirtman> nice :)
[16:11] <didrocks> Amaranth: even pastebinit /var/log/Xorg.0.log
[16:11] <Amaranth> didrocks: TIL
[16:11] <tshirtman> useless use of cat :P
[16:11] <Amaranth> [    57.613] (EE) [drm] failed to open device
[16:11] <didrocks> that's how you end up cat <file> | grep ;)
[16:12] <Amaranth> tshirtman: Do you still have the nvidia kernel module?
[16:12] <CarlFK> pitti: check-language-support doesn't return anything, but I am still getting the 'incomplete language support' message
[16:12] <Amaranth> didrocks: I still do that :/
[16:12] <didrocks> Amaranth: come on! :-)
[16:12] <tshirtman> nope, i removed everything nvidia-*
[16:12] <Amaranth> tshirtman: lsmod | grep nvidia
[16:12] <Amaranth> Also I guess use lsmod to make sure nouveau is loaded
[16:12] <tshirtman> my friend on 64bit have the same result as me on the ls /etc/alternatives... except the _egl one, that he has not
[16:13] <Amaranth> Because it's failing to find /dev/dri/card0 or a similar device
[16:13] <tshirtman> Amaranth: already dif both of that, no nvidia, and a few nouveau
[16:13] <Amaranth> afaik you only get the EGL one if you've installed something that provides libegl1-x11
[16:13] <Amaranth> so most people wouldn't have that, since most people aren't doing GLES stuff on their desktop
[16:14] <tshirtman> well, i probably installed that to compile openglES stuff
[16:14] <tshirtman> well, i'm using things that use it
[16:14] <tshirtman> and that i need to compile
[16:15] <Amaranth> alright, so the root of our problem here is that you either don't have a /dev/dri/card0 (bug in the nouveau kernel module or udev) or it has the wrong permissions (bug in udev)
[16:15] <Amaranth> no drm means no 3D
[16:15] <tshirtman> nothing in /dev/dri
[16:16] <seb128> tshirtman, http://nouveau.freedesktop.org/wiki/TroubleShooting#Xorg_fails_to_start_with_.22.28EE.29_.5Bdrm.5D_failed_to_open_device.22
[16:16] <seb128> not sure if that's useful
[16:17] <Amaranth> it's going to be one of those first two
[16:17] <Amaranth> perhaps pastebin your dmesg
[16:17] <tshirtman> Amaranth: i think i had a message like "removing all drm/dri" when i removed nvidia-*
[16:18] <tshirtman> or was it kms?
[16:18] <tshirtman> >_< not sure anymore
[16:20] <tshirtman> oh, ubuntu-bug xserver-xorg think i installed the nvidia drivers manually in the past, that may be true :$
[16:22] <tshirtman> damn you "/etc/modprobe.d/nvidia-installer-disable-nouveau.conf"!
[16:24] <ricotz> seb128, are you able to restart this build? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cogl/1.8.0-1/+build/2851052
[16:25] <tshirtman> ok, it was this file
[16:25] <tshirtman> so thanks for ubuntu-bug for being clever
[16:25] <tshirtman> to*
[16:26] <Amaranth> That's a pretty impressive find
[16:26] <tshirtman> not sure i have to file a bug, i had installed nvidia module manually long ago
[16:26] <Amaranth> tshirtman: So for that one you'll probably want to just restart after removing that file
[16:26] <Amaranth> tshirtman: Also maybe reinstall libgl1-mesa-dri
[16:27] <tshirtman> well, it pointed to the /var/log/nvidia-installer.log
[16:27] <tshirtman> and in this the nvidia installed kindly explained about that modprob file
[16:28] <tshirtman> so i have unity running, quite slowly, but it run :)
[16:28] <tshirtman> s
[16:28] <seb128> ricotz, no, I'm not buildd admin
[16:28] <tshirtman> and yeah, Amaranth i just had to reboot after rm of the guy
[16:29] <Amaranth> tshirtman: So it's working now?
[16:29] <tshirtman> yep
[16:29] <ricotz> seb128, ok, np
[16:29] <Amaranth> Guess that was a support thing rather than a bug thing after all ;)
[16:30] <bjsnider> tshirtman, you installed nvidia using the nvidia-installer?
[16:30] <tshirtman> yeah, sorry for the mess
[16:30] <tshirtman> bjsnider: yeah
[16:30] <tshirtman> i don't remenber either why and when, it's been some time
[16:30] <Amaranth> bjsnider: Didn't have those fancy SRU nvidia updates back then
[16:30] <bjsnider> you woul have to run the .run file again with --uninstall
[16:31] <bjsnider> to completely remove it
[16:31] <tshirtman> damn, i have to find again :)
[16:31] <bjsnider> i think that's the flag
[16:31] <bjsnider> we've had x-updates since lucid and i had teh vdpau ppa since before that
[16:32] <tshirtman> is it possible to tell when a system was installed? it may be 2 years old
[16:33] <tshirtman> ok, thanks for all anyway :)
[17:06] <broder> hmm...are there concrete plans for how the extended hw support in precise is going to work? is it just kernel backports? kernel and mesa/ddx/etc. backports?
[17:19] <hallyn> is there supposed to be a way to get the indicator-messages to support twitter?  am I just blind, or is that not yet supported?
[17:24] <kenvandine> hallyn, gwibber uses indicator-messages
[17:24] <hallyn> oh, i see, so i should use that.  thanks
[17:24] <kenvandine> np
[17:25] <hallyn> (i get confused how it all fits together :)
[17:25] <kenvandine> :)
[17:25] <hallyn> but I"m liking it
[17:25] <kenvandine> great
[17:25] <ogra_> kenvandine, is there a howto somewhere, ho to add new apps to the indicator ? i just switched to sylpheed and would like to have some way to use the panel icon
[17:26] <kenvandine> yeah, what language is sylpheed written in?
[17:26] <ogra_> well, its the predecessor of claws
[17:26] <ogra_> C i would guess
[17:27] <ogra_> it also offers to execute a custom command if mails arrive
[17:28] <ogra_> (curenty i have a notify-send in there to get at least something while the app is minimized)
[17:29] <kenvandine> there isn't a command for it, you would use libindicate
[17:29] <kenvandine> i thought there were examples on the wiki, but not finding them
[17:29] <ogra_> well, if there are, i will find them, its not urgent or something
[17:29] <kenvandine> :)
[17:30] <kenvandine> there are API docs on developer.ubuntu.com for libindicate
[17:30] <kenvandine> and we have lots of examples in the archive
[17:30] <kenvandine> :)
[17:30] <ogra_> k, thanks ! :)
[17:30] <kenvandine> you can look at xchat-indicator as a reference
[17:30] <ogra_> will do
[17:30] <kenvandine> np
[17:31] <hallyn> is banshee suddenly, after awhile, jumping to 250% cpu (and never slowing down) a known bug, or do i need to (gather info and) report?
[17:31] <kenvandine> hallyn, i haven't seen that happen
[17:31] <kenvandine> not known afaik
[17:32] <hallyn> drat.  happens daily for me.
[17:32] <hallyn> ok, next time it happens i'll try to report :)
[17:32] <kenvandine> :)
[17:32] <kenvandine> thx!
[17:32] <hallyn> if cpu will let me
[17:32] <hallyn> (i only ever notice bc cpu temp goes very close to where it shuts down)
[17:32] <kenvandine> wow
[18:39] <dobey> mterry: uhm. do you know where exactly that 302 error is coming from? i doubt it's a server issue exactly. looks like something is not handling redirects when it should
[18:41] <mterry> dobey, I could believe it.  duplicity is handling the errors, but doesn't have a case for 302
[18:41] <mterry> dobey, when does U1 give back 302 for the Files API?
[18:42] <dobey> mterry: no idea
[18:44] <mterry> dobey, I haven't seen the error myself.  I understand the theory behind 302, but not sure when a files api consumer would expect them.  I shouldn't think they would happen there
[18:50] <dobey> mterry: i guess my point is that it shouldn't matter, because any HTTP based client should handle 302 correctly. does deja-dup log the Location header or anything?
[18:51] <mterry> dobey, no, this happens in duplicity (the command line backup program that deja-dup uses) and it doesn't log it either
[18:52] <dobey> ok :-/
[19:22] <mterry> dobey, is there a situation where U1 would give back a 500 status without an oops-id?
[19:22] <ubot2> https://lp-oops.canonical.com/oops.py/?oopsid=id
[19:24] <dobey> mterry: possibly, but i don't really know anything about the server side of the REST stuff as i haven't worked on it
[19:25] <mterry> dobey, ok.  a user just hit one, but I'd always seen an oops id
[19:26] <dobey> mterry: i think a rollout is happening today/now, so maybe weird timing issue and it got hit. not sure
[19:27] <mterry> dobey, k
[21:06] <kenvandine> WOOT!  87% speedup in pulling the gwibber messages over dbus
[23:07] <m4n1sh> jbicha: when you get time can you please look into this https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/totem/+bug/879702
[23:07] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 879702 in totem "Please update packaging so that it add zeitgeist-dataprovider plugin in totem-plugins package" [Undecided,New]