[02:14] <cyberanger> wow, didn't think I could do all that I did from a netbook today (I know how powerful they can be, setup tweaks, but I had vlc's ncurses player playing a song, ffmpeg converting it to mp3 & scaning an external drive with clamav, at the same time, no fail)
[02:14] <cyberanger> plus ssh'd in here, for irc & email
[02:14] <cyberanger> thanks to debuntu ;-)
[02:16] <Unit193> Mutt?
[02:17] <wrst> cyberanger: is this a new distro?
[02:18] <Unit193> Debian/Ubuntu Tips & Tricks
[02:18] <Unit193> Debuntu.org: .deb packages, Unix/Linux Tutorials and Articles.
[02:18] <wrst> ahh
[02:18]  * wrst feels a little silly now :)
[02:22] <cyberanger> Unit193: yep, my mutt
[02:23] <cyberanger> wrst: that   blog is merely an inspiritation to the joke (when I said I was all debian testing, forgot about this machine aperently, fixing)
[02:29] <wrst> cyberanger, Unit193 had good weekends?
[02:31] <cyberanger> sorta good
[02:31] <Unit193> Don't think anything big Sat, but today there was much good grub :D
[02:31] <wrst> Unit193: that's what i'm talking about!
[02:32] <cyberanger> wrst: you know how I do cli installs, little diff with debian or ubuntu at that level, did this all in cli (trying to be a showoff, then vista got involved, fubar from there)
[02:33] <wrst> cyberanger: really no difference best i can tell from ubuntu cli and debian, i think debian might have less things to get in the way making it easier actually
[02:33] <wrst> and vista???
[02:33] <Unit193> I use SSH and stuff to mess with the volume on Vista, it can be funny to get people :D
[02:33] <wrst> Unit193: vista and ssh?
[02:34] <Unit193> Why not? Granted, it's not as good as Linux SSH, but it works nevertheless
[02:34] <Unit193> And it's the first OS I used SSH on
[02:34] <wrst> i have seen that it is available just didn't know what the use would be
[02:34] <cyberanger> wrst: yeah, church, not my call (virus too, made it a pain?)
[02:34] <wrst> oh yeah cyberanger i know how that goes
[02:36] <cyberanger> wrst: well, your problem is a assuming there is a use, sometimes there is no use, it was a coding challenge, and now an annoyance tool
[02:39] <wrst> :)
[02:41] <Unit193> nircmd + ssh = :D
[02:41] <cyberanger> Unit193: there's stunts you can do without nircmd too, just default stuff
[02:42] <cyberanger> my favorite two are editing the hosts file & disabiling dns
[02:42] <Unit193> cyberanger: Oh yes, but nircmd can also be used to mess with people :D
[02:42] <cyberanger> followed by the rare but cruel triggering a BSoD (doesn't take much, sadly, no bragging rights)
[02:46] <cyberanger> Unit193: indeed
[02:47] <cyberanger> just like a screw driver & a phunematic(sp) door closer, slow it down and make people think their being followed
[02:57] <binarymutant> idk if /tmp is considered a chroot enviroment...
[02:59] <binarymutant> debuntu.org ... not sure about
[03:22] <cyberanger> binarymutant: say what?
[03:23] <binarymutant> first page debuntu.org article
[03:24] <binarymutant> I think I read it wrong though
[03:27] <cyberanger> binarymutant: "How-To: Mounting /dev in a chroot environment"
[03:27] <cyberanger> that article?
[03:27] <binarymutant> yes
[03:30] <cyberanger> doesn't sound wrong to me, based on my use of chroot for remastering live discs
[03:31] <cyberanger> they're just messing with files in a chroot jail, the files happen to be in tmp instead of $HOME/livedisc/chroot (when I do it)
[03:31] <binarymutant> yeah I always do it in a dir in $HOME
[03:32] <binarymutant> $project/debian/  :D
[03:32] <cyberanger> but I don't think one has to, don't think anything is wrong with tmp, depends on if the data is temporary or not
[03:33] <cyberanger> if not, well, expect data loss
[03:33] <binarymutant> like I said, I probably just read it wrong. I thought they were saying /tmp was a chroot env
[03:58] <cyberanger> no (it might be, but that's not what they're saying, they're using it as a chroot "mountpoint" same as we use $HOME)
[15:02] <electricus> uggh. why use selinux?
[16:15] <cyberanger> electricus: good question, will AppArmor not work enough for you?
[16:15] <cyberanger> "Let me assure you that this action by the NSA was the crypto-equivalent of the Pope  coming down off the balcony in Rome, working the crowd with a few loaves of bread and some fish, and then inviting everyone to come over to his place to watch the soccer game and have a few beers. There are some things that one just never expects to see, and the NSA handing out source code along with details of
[16:15] <cyberanger>  the security mechanism behind it was right up there on that list." — Larry Loeb
[16:16] <electricus> i always disable it, but it's on by default in centos
[16:16] <electricus> i figure linux is plenty secure without having selinux
[16:16] <electricus> i've never been hacked
[16:18]  * cyberanger sees that challenge, ponders a bit
[16:20] <cyberanger> electricus: selinux is a good thing, but with LIDS, Bastille Unix & AppArmour, idk if it's a necessary thing
[16:21] <electricus> i don't know if i'm using any of those .. how can i tell?
[16:23] <cyberanger> I mean, everybody ships with defaults, I tweak them with iptables, throw in arpalert & have the alert script isolate them from the network
[16:23] <cyberanger> others really lock it down further, what are you needing to lock down, from whom
[16:26] <cyberanger> you'd have to know for Bastille Unix & LIDS, nature of their setup
[16:27] <cyberanger> apparmour.....lemme see here...
[16:29] <cyberanger> electricus: did you build your own package, pretty good bet you only had selinux
[16:30] <electricus> default install of centos6
[16:30] <electricus> sorry ubuntu guys :-)
[16:31] <cyberanger> electricus: like I said, pretty good bet you only had selinux
[16:31] <electricus> regarding another machine.. my kvm host:  I am using an additional 1tb disk as an additional volume group named vm_stor
[16:32] <electricus> i have put all my kvm guests raw disk images there on lvm
[16:33] <electricus> strangely enough though.. even though the vms are all running away.. the volume is not even mounted as far as i can tell
[16:33] <electricus> here's my mounts;  http://pastebin.com/kFTiWxZW
[16:35] <cyberanger> electricus: ~# lvs
[16:40] <cyberanger> electricus: ^ see if the volume is listed
[16:40] <cyberanger> electricus: and I'd be looking at "df -h" output, looking at what doesn't fit
[16:41] <electricus> here you go
[16:41] <electricus> http://pastebin.com/87c1pKfk
[16:42] <electricus> actually check this one out.. shows /dev/mapper too
[16:42] <electricus> http://pastebin.com/J4GstyS8
[16:42] <electricus> i'm also in the middle of a snapshot
[16:43] <electricus> i think the nuances are related to the way proxmox-ve distro has set things up
[16:43] <electricus> you manage it mostly with a web gui and i think that's why it might be a little different than the way it normally may be
[16:47] <cyberanger> electricus: no signs vm_stor in use, clearly see two out of three from pve (and reasonable to surmise the third (swap) is in use too
[16:48] <electricus> what about /dev/mapper ?
[16:49] <electricus> it's showing the disks for 102 and 103 and the snapshot in progress
[16:49] <electricus> i'm just new to all this lvm stuff.
[16:50] <electricus> i like it..but i don't know enough about it.  just keep reading ..just keep reading .. I know :-)
[16:50] <cyberanger> /dev/mapper/vm_stor-vm-102-disk-1
[16:50] <cyberanger> for example ^
[16:51] <electricus> yes
[16:51] <electricus> that is a live running vm..
[16:51] <cyberanger> electricus: lvm is one I'm still working out at times too (rsync I've got down ;-))
[16:51] <electricus> that is actually my new mail server i worked so hard on
[16:51] <electricus> haha..
[16:51] <electricus> i understand
[16:51] <cyberanger> /dev/mapper/vm_stor-vm-103-disk-1 ?
[16:52] <electricus> well what is most awesome about it is that i'm taking a full snapshot of the machine right now (while it's running) and dumping it onto external storage :-)
[16:52] <electricus> how cool is that!
[16:52] <electricus> and you can also move volumes around from machine to machine with no downtime
[16:53] <electricus> what's weird is looking at the ls -l output and it shows "brw-rw---- 1 root disk 253,  3 "
[16:54] <cyberanger> LV               VG      Attr   LSize   Origin        Snap%  Move Log Copy%  Convert
[16:54] <electricus> i'm assuming the 'b' is block device and then you have the blocks and sectors instead of size and so forth
[16:54] <cyberanger> vzsnap-proxmox-0 vm_stor swi-ao   1.00G vm-102-disk-1  11.52
[16:55] <electricus> ya..isn't that cool
[16:55] <electricus> i guess you don't mount lvm raw in the traditional sense necessarily
[16:56] <electricus> well..anyway, i'm heading to lunch
[16:56] <electricus> later
[16:56] <cyberanger> that suggests your backup is going well, it's making it's own logical volume for snapshots, I'm aware of snapshots, but I just rsync one partition (/var/www/mirror) and some files in /etc (mostly pertaining to bind9 squid & apache)
[16:57] <cyberanger> electricus: seems lvm has something else in mind, yes
[16:57] <cyberanger> and uh, good luck at a 4pm lunch
[19:00] <wrst> howdy everyone
[19:15] <cyberanger> Bonjour wrst
[19:23] <wrst> cyberanger: how you doing?
[19:45] <cyberanger> wrst: not much atm
[19:45] <cyberanger> bonjour cosmicpizza
[19:45] <cyberanger> hola average_guy
[19:45] <cosmicpizza> hey cyberanger
[19:45] <average_guy> hello cyberanger
[19:46] <wrst> cyberanger: that's a good thing i hope
[19:46] <wrst> howdy, average_guy cosmicpizza
[19:46] <cyberanger> How's everybody doing
[19:46] <average_guy> Hi wrst
[19:47]  * wrst is doing well for a monday
[19:47] <cyberanger> wrst: old chinese curse "May you live in intresting times" followed by new american curse (Great Recession inspired) "May you endlessly look for work"
[19:47] <average_guy> I'm doing pretty good today, how are you guys?
[19:48] <cyberanger> tossed with the lack of renewal on another computer project (this one is not a suprise, company wanting the work is in a rocky spott too)
[19:51] <cyberanger> average_guy: reasonably well
[19:55] <average_guy> I have talked in here much lately because I been using win7 fairly exclusively
[19:56] <average_guy> this is the first I've really messed with it
[19:57] <wrst> average_guy: don't let that keep you from commenting :)
[19:57] <wrst> how do you like it?
[19:57] <average_guy> I appreciate how well all of microsoft's applications integrate together
[20:00] <average_guy> most linux ppl are windows bashers, no me so much
[20:01] <average_guy> I prefer linux tho
[20:01] <wrst> average_guy: i'm no windows fan but to so its total crap is a little bit not exactly true
[20:01] <wrst> well vista was :)
[20:04] <average_guy> I've never actually seen vista wrst.  I've heard a lotta negative comments about it though.  Seems like it was pretty much just a test platform for a lot of the features now available in 7
[20:05] <wrst> average_guy: it was awful
[20:06] <average_guy> I am a big fan of XP.  It is the first OS I really learned inside and out
[20:06] <wrst> thing that bothers me about MS is how they do a awful release followed with a fairly solid release seems to be hwo they do it
[20:06] <average_guy> Well wrst, most linux distros are the same
[20:07] <average_guy> they do lots of small releases testing new things (like unity) and then they do a major release
[20:09] <average_guy> the diffrence is that with Microsoft, if you spent the money on an in-between release (like vista or ME) yer boned
[20:10] <average_guy> Microsoft is not too bad as long as you have a zillion dollars to spend
[20:10] <wrst> yeah average_guy and ubuntu well tell you to use the LTS on large deployments
[20:11] <wrst> *will tell
[20:11] <average_guy> Yeah wrst, Microsoft won't TELL you
[20:12] <wrst> plus you aren't out money just aggervation
[20:13] <wrst> if you stay with somthing like RHEL, Debian stable, Ubuntu LTS you are going to have a solid solid system
[20:13] <wrst> oh cyberanger I am liking debian more and more the more I use it
[20:14] <average_guy> tru, and don't get me wrong, I still believe linux is far superior
[20:15] <wrst> oh average_guy but the thing is use what works best for you :)
[20:15] <wrst> there are applications where windows may be the best choice
[20:16] <average_guy> I believe open-source is really the only way for good stable code to evolve
[21:44] <binarymutant> +1M
[22:24] <cyberanger> average_guy: I have been using debian fairly exclusively, hasn't kept me from commenting on my opinions of ubuntu & win7 (it's Microsuck, and ubuntu's going down a dead alley blind, in reguards to unity)
[22:25] <cyberanger> granted, I'm also a loudmouth, so take my comments with a grain of salt
[22:25] <cyberanger> wrst: testing or stable?
[22:27] <average_guy> I like debian cyberanger, and I take everything with a grain of salt
[22:28] <cyberanger> average_guy: lol, cool (and maybe take two grains for me then, lol) testing or stable?
[22:30] <average_guy> I have debian-stable on one of my machines cyberanger
[22:31] <average_guy> I prefer arch though
[22:31] <average_guy> this week..
[22:34] <cyberanger> average_guy: I like the similarities to arch & debian testing, seems I've got a debian leaning (after years of that, plus projects that meddle with key debian components, like apt)
[22:35] <johnhaitas> distro flamewar?
[22:38] <cyberanger> johnhaitas: so far I don't think so, but different opinions on the distros we use, perhaps
[22:38] <cyberanger> now, if I had time to get started on unity & centos, I think we could have a flamewar
[22:41] <cyberanger> why do I keep presuming I'm gonna leave a work site on time :-/
[22:42] <average_guy> I flame no distro, to each his own..
[22:42] <johnhaitas> average_guy: good policy
[22:42] <johnhaitas> average_guy: +!
[22:42] <johnhaitas> *+1
[22:42] <cyberanger> I flame every distro, equal oppurnity hater
[22:43] <cyberanger> but I like average_guy's idea better, less rage involved
[22:44] <average_guy> I'm far to apathetic to HATE anything
[22:46] <binarymutant> how can debian and ubuntu be a flame war...?
[22:46] <binarymutant> it's the same
[22:46] <average_guy> rut row
[22:46] <average_guy> wrong thing to say
[22:47] <binarymutant> oh noes
[22:47] <cyberanger> yep, he just loaded my gun
[22:47] <binarymutant> what's the diff. cyberanger ?
[22:47] <binarymutant> :D
[22:48] <cyberanger> binarymutant: for time sake on my end, I'll merely point at unity, if you can install it on debian, I'll drop that statement when I get back
[22:48] <binarymutant> cyberanger: you can install on debian :D
[22:48] <cyberanger> or manage to install iceweasel on ubuntu
[22:48] <cyberanger> within apt
[22:49] <binarymutant> you can :D
[22:49] <binarymutant> with iceweasel enable the debian sid repo and apt-get it
[22:50] <binarymutant> with unity, bzr pull it, compile, and run :D
[22:50] <cyberanger> binarymutant: I'll be more in depth when I get back on the reasons I use debian instead
[22:50] <cyberanger> (and a stunt like that is why debuntu exists wrst ^^)
[22:50] <cyberanger> bbl
[22:50] <cyberanger> meeting time, and I'm late again :-/
[22:50]  * cyberanger detaches screen, crawls out window
[22:53] <binarymutant> heh or really you could just add ubuntu's repos and apt-get it, vice-versa