TheMusoslangasek: Ok so I am working on the separate libpulsedsp package for pulse, however it turns out that pulseaudio-utils has lintian overrides for libpulsedsp.so. How can these effectively be used in the case of a multi-arch same package like libpulsedsp?00:10
slangasekTheMuso: you can use a wildcard for the path, so */libpulsedsp.so in the libpulsedsp package00:19
TheMusoslangasek: Thats not what I was thinking of. I am aware of the wildcard, but the override file is owned by both the amd64 and i386 version of the package... How does that get resolved?00:20
slangasekTheMuso: as long as the file contents are the same, the file is shared00:21
TheMusoslangasek: Oh ok great.00:22
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TheMusoAnybody else on oneiric using sbuild and schroot for precise finding that dbus is starting in their chroot for any packages depending on dbus?01:08
broderooh, does that mean that upstart chroot support is working now?01:12
TheMusoI don't know.01:15
TheMusoBut I earlier found that I still had lots of chroots mounted, because they had running processes in them.01:15
broderhmm...so schroot tries to kill off all processes in the chroot before unmounting it01:16
broderbut /etc/init/dbus.conf has respawn01:16
TheMusoHaven't looked into it, but that sounds possible.01:17
broderdoes your chroot have a /usr/sbin/policy-rc.d file?01:19
TheMusojust a sec, I'll check.01:25
TheMusoI don't appear to.01:27
broderyou probably want one01:27
brodersomething like "#!/bin/sh\nexit 101"01:27
broderand chmod +x it01:27
TheMusoOh ok.01:28
broder(see also the invoke-rc.d manpage)01:28
brodermk-sbuild should handle all of that setup, though, for future reference01:29
TheMusoI find mk-sbuild a bit too generic for my needs, so I've got scripts that derive from it. I'll just extend them. :)01:30
Laibschgood morning01:49
Laibschdoes the verification-done-lucid tag also trigger the "green" state in http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/pending-sru.html?01:49
RAOFI believe the answer to that is ?yes?.01:50
LaibschOK.  I set it on a bug about 17-18 hours ago, but it did not trigger anything so far.02:07
pittiGood morning03:48
ajmitchmorning pitti03:50
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slangasekTheMuso, broder: yes, chroot support works in upstart now, and policy-rc.d is the right workaround for a build chroot :)05:16
micahgTheMuso: can you extend the core-dev membership in ubuntu-audio-dev05:27
TheMusomicahg: sure05:29
TheMusomicahg: For what reason?05:30
TheMusoIn any case, it should never expire, so changing.05:31
micahgTheMuso: because I got a nice e-mail asking to have it extended :), thanks for the permanent membership :)05:33
dholbachGuten Morgen Berlin! :)07:01
gs_hello all. I am doing a project in which I need to read .deb files. Is there any library or interface available which I can use in my program to read these files. If this is a wrong channel Please forgive me and if you could suggest me some other channel for query regarding apt ?07:04
gs_hello all. I am doing a project in which I need to read .deb files. Is there any library or interface available which I can use in my program to read these files. If this is a wrong channel Please forgive me and if you could suggest me some other channel for query regarding apt ?07:04
gs_Please reply07:04
dholbachgs_, which information do you need?07:06
RAOFgs_:  You'd be looking for libapt and friends.  Or just extracting them; they're simple archives.07:07
StevenKgs_: If you're an Ubuntu machine, 'man 5 deb' tells you about .deb files07:07
StevenKIf you're *on* an Ubuntu machine07:07
RAOFOr if you *are* an Ubuntu machine that would work, too.  (If you *are* an Ubuntu machine, awesome!  Please tell us where the AI research has succeeded ?)07:10
gs_dholbach: I need information regarding some library or interface which can be used for reading debian files07:11
gs_Actually I am writing a system restore like application for ubuntu07:12
gs_which will save the current state of packages and then restore them when needed07:12
gs_RAOF: ok. using these libraries I can get list of the files which a package is intending to install ? and If i need details about the contents of those files then ?07:14
dholbachgs_, sorry, I meant: which information in the packages are you after?07:14
RAOFgs_: Probably, but I wouldn't do it that way; I'd just expand the .deb and list the files in the data.tar.*07:14
gs_dholbach: I am looking for list of files in the package and their contents so that I can determine what changes have occur to the system07:14
gs_RAOF: so we can convert .deb file in tar.gz archive ?07:15
RAOFgs_: Note that what you want to do is impossible in general; the packaging can (and will in some circumstances) use programatic means to create or modify files on the filesystem.07:15
ajmitchalso the original .deb may not be on the system still07:15
RAOFgs_: The .deb file contains two .tar.* files; control and data.07:15
ChipzzRAOF: md5sums?07:16
ajmitchiirc not every package has a list of md5sums07:16
ChipzzRAOF: this isn't very ingrained in debian, but IIRC in rpm based distro's ALL files have their md5sum stored07:16
gs_RAOF: like when we open a deb file in gdeb we can get the list of all files so I thought there might be an existing library for doing that07:17
Chipzzajmitch: yes and that's a defect imo07:17
RAOFgs_: Yes, there is; tar.07:17
RAOFChipzz: Does the rpm packaging format not have a way of generating files at install time?07:17
Chipzzajmitch: regardless, merely pointing out that RAOF's statement is incorrect and it is possible in theory07:17
ChipzzRAOF: at does; it also has the concept of ghost files which debian lacks07:18
gs_OK. So there is a tar and then how will I read that tar ? After extracting it ?07:18
gs_Ya I know the package file might not be on the system. In that case I think I would need to download the package file from internet ?07:18
RAOFChipzz: No, it's not possible in theory.  I've worked on packages whose postinsts process existing files on the filesystem and incorporate state from other files, then write out a new conf file.07:18
RAOFChipzz: That package cannot have a pregenerated md5sum for all the files it generates.07:19
ajmitchgs_: in terms of libraries, I know of python-debian which you can use to inspect the contents of a .deb07:19
ChipzzRAOF: that statement is simply silly; you can't account for /home/* either07:19
gs_ajmitch: Could you please give me some link related to that library ?07:20
RAOFChipzz: True, but that's not owned by the package manager.07:20
ChipzzRAOF: you could argue that config files aren't either07:20
gs_Could you please provide me some suggestions regarding how to implement a system restore like application for ubuntu07:20
gs_I have two approaches07:21
gs_in one approach I will use a copy-on-write and save-on-delete approach07:21
gs_so that I will take care of all the files in system directories07:21
ajmitchgs_: I'd have to look on google for info about it, but the package is just named 'python-debian', I don't know what is available as a library for other languages07:21
RAOFIf you're allowed to use magical filesystems, then btrfs + apt-snapshot-btrfs does all this for you; it takes a snapshot of the system state on each apt transaction that you can roll back to.07:22
gs_ajmitch: ok I will search for that thanks for helping.07:22
gs_ok thats quite nice, how much space would that system occupy ?07:23
gs_But that would require user to reinstall the whole system with "/" on brtfs ?07:23
RAOFIt's copy-on-write, so roughly the changed set size.07:24
RAOFIt would indeed require / to be a btrfs partition.  It also has other constraints (there need to be appropriately named subvolumes, home needs to be a subvolume)07:24
gs_ok, that would be not good as users need a reinstall for using the system07:25
gs_If I implement that approach in my program would that be possible07:25
gs_I can put hooks to the filesystem07:25
gs_so whenever a file is written I can make a copy07:26
gs_Or I can have this package approach07:27
gs_in this approach I will create a package whenever user creates a restore point07:28
gs_I will use this package to restore the system to an earlier state07:28
ajmitchif you're looking at creating a package, take a look at dpkg-repack07:28
gs_Ok thanks and could you please provide some feedback on my approach07:29
RAOFI suspect it might be easier to do something similar to a combination of etckeeper and oneconf+snapshotting.07:29
RAOFie: store a list of all the packages which are installed + all the modified stuff (/etc /var)07:30
gs_RAOF : ok, like these files are in /var/lib/dpkg/info07:32
gs_now for the modified stuff /etc /var is it better to create a separate package or implement a copy-on-write approach?07:32
Chipzzgs_: imo your approach is not the best approach anyway07:33
Chipzzfiles in /usr aren't interesting anyway07:33
micahgslangasek: you made a change to pygments back in jaunty that suggested python-chardet shouldn't be a recommends: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pygments/0.10-1ubuntu2, python-chardet is now in main, do you still feel it shouldn't be a recommends?07:33
Chipzzif those change, the change is probably invalid, and you probably want to restore from the package anyway, so you probably shouldn't care about these07:34
gs_chipzz : So please could you provide me some suggestions in how can I improve this07:34
slangasekmicahg: I feel nothing about it, do whatever you think is best ;)07:34
micahgslangasek: thanks :)07:34
Chipzzyou probably want to focus on config files, and maybe files in /var07:34
ChipzzI would look into ucf and try to integrate with that07:35
gs_ok so files in /var are more imprtant and /etc also07:35
Chipzzand figure something out for other files in /etc that aren't managed by ucf07:35
* ajmitch rather likes etckeeper07:36
gs_sorry but what is ucf ?07:36
Chipzzdpkg --get-selections will give you a list of packages installed07:36
Chipzzapt-cache show ucf?07:36
Chipzz/srv, /usr/local and /opt are interesting candidates too07:37
gs_ok thats easier07:37
gs_but like if some of the files installed by a package are damaged then ? Do I need to recopy those files or reinstalling the package would be a better option ?07:38
Chipzzusers aren't supposed to write in /usr, since that's owned by the package management system; if they do, they're probably wrong, for example they have compiled from source and installed in /usr, which is a cause of havoc anyway, and most likely the kind of situation you want to recover FROM, not TO07:39
Chipzzgs_: like I pointed out, if those files are damaged, you can restore them from the package; which is exactly why they are not interesting07:39
gs_Ok so I would ignore the files present in /usr07:41
gs_or better I could clear /usr to a fresh installed system state07:41
gs_and if the files in /bin or /sbin are damaged then ?07:42
gs_I would get a list of installed packages and then reinstall those packages ?07:42
gs_Better I need to see which packages have missing files07:42
gs_and so those only *system packages* need to be downloaded and reinstalled ?07:43
gs_Also is there any documentation describing exact steps performed by the system when any package is installed ?07:48
gs_or I could  see that by browsing apt-get or dpkg code ?07:48
fhdHow is the Ubuntu stance towards Vala? Good idea for apps primary targeting Ubuntu?08:57
fhdDon't want to alienate. The typical choices seem to be C++ or Python.08:58
cjwatsonfhd: well, it's listed on developer.u.c - http://developer.ubuntu.com/resources/programming-languages/vala/09:16
cjwatsonfhd: I believe Unity lenses are typically written in Vala, for example09:17
fhdcjwatson: Java is also listed, haven't seen many Java apps in Ubuntu09:24
fhdcjwatson: But if the Unity guys use it...09:25
cjwatsonfhd: it depends where you look09:45
DavieyI can't understand why ruby-stomp has seeminly never been in Ubuntu.  Is it blacklisted?10:41
Davieyhttps://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ruby-stomp , no publishing history10:42
DavieyBeen in sid since Jan 200910:42
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geserDaviey: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libstomp-ruby ; the source package got recently (this month) renamed from libstomp-ruby to ruby-stomp10:44
cjwatsonDaviey: it's not blacklisted, but attempting to sync it says http://paste.ubuntu.com/720566/10:44
cjwatsonwe have what might politely be called an abysmal lack of crowdsourcing for this kind of thing10:45
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cjwatsonso basically somebody needs to say "yes, dear archive admins, please throw away the existing Ubuntu-specific package and replace it with this one with a different source package name from Debian"10:45
cjwatsonwell, not Ubuntu-specific, Ubuntu-modified10:46
Davieycjwatson: it needs AA intervention, or can i just sync with --force?10:47
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Daviey(geser: thanks)10:48
cjwatsonDaviey: you can syncpackage it if you've checked that none of the Ubuntu modifications are still needed10:48
cjwatson(although it'll land in the NEW queue, but that's trivial)10:48
Davieycjwatson: Great, thought so - thanks10:49
cjwatsonit wasn't just an upstream update, James made some packaging changes too10:49
DavieyYeah, seems i sponsored it :)10:50
cjwatsonunfortunately I'm not sure syncpackage notices the Ubuntu modifications to matching binary packages10:51
cjwatsonwhich is IMO a syncpackage bug if true10:51
cjwatsonyeah, doesn't require --force, buggily10:52
\shhmm...anybody with upload powers can use syncpackage now? (instead of using requestsync)10:55
Daviey\sh: Yes, but requestsync is still needed for sponsored sync's10:56
\shDaviey, sure, what I mean is i.e. for universe uploaders who are doing the merge/sync  run now10:57
Daviey\sh: yup10:57
\shDaviey, nice :)10:57
Daviey\sh: $ syncpackage -d (wheezy|sid) -r precise foobar10:58
cjwatsonwe should update docs and stuff10:58
cjwatsonthere are still some limitations, e.g. not usable for sponsored syncs10:58
Davieyand no karma.. "oh well"10:59
\shDaviey, no need to sign ? or does it do it automagically?11:00
cjwatsonno need to sign11:01
cjwatsonit doesn't sign, it copies the publishing record from Debian11:01
DavieyIncidently there is the 'beta' webui method, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+localpackagediffs .. a bit whizzy for some.11:03
\shlet's try :)11:05
\shso I need --force to overwrite ubuntu modifications11:06
\shcjwatson, what does this mean: syncpackage: Source package gauche-c-wrapper is blacklisted.11:13
cjwatsonan obscure way of saying that it has Ubuntu modifications which need to be reviewed.  Use --force11:14
cjwatsonDaviey: please don't use or recommend that - it doesn't and can't apply Ubuntu-specific policy11:15
cjwatson(well, s/can't/won't/ perhaps)11:15
Davieycjwatson: wow, it doesn't do ACL?11:15
cjwatsonthere is more policy than ACL11:15
cjwatsonit can't do things like handling packages with Ubuntu-specific modifications with more care11:15
cjwatsonuse the API tool and pretend the UI doesn't exist11:16
Davieycjwatson: You mean it doesn't give a warning to say, "Are you sure you want to overwrite ubuntu changes?"11:17
cjwatsonessentially because the way to detect that isn't particularly consistent across derivative distributions and Launchpad officially doesn't know about it11:18
DavieyDoes syncpackage care greater than checking for 'ubuntu' in the version string?11:20
cjwatsonthat's what it does, but Launchpad doesn't do that11:20
cjwatsonin general we can do much more sophisticated things using an API tool because we don't have to make them fully general for all derivative distributions11:21
cjwatson(+localpackagediffs was designed principally for Ubuntu derivatives and requested by Linaro, not for us)11:22
cjwatsonoh, syncpackage also detects fakesync-requiring situations, I don't think +localpackagediffs does (or if it is it's less helpful about it)11:22
cjwatsonand syncpackage allows you to sync from suites other than the single nominated "derivative parent" suite (currently Debian testing)11:23
cjwatsonand deals with closing bugs which I don't think +localpackagediffs currently does11:23
Laneythink it got that one11:24
Laneywell, you can't nominate an additional bug11:24
cjwatsoncould be11:24
TLEpitti: hey, we saw some lang packs in -proposed, are they all good to go?11:25
pittiTLE: good for testing, anyway, yes11:27
pittiGerman looks fine11:27
TLEpitti: great, thanks11:27
SpamapSslangasek: re bug 859075 , I have laid no claim to it, though I do think its something wrong with the order in which we bring down the network and unmount things.11:35
ubottuLaunchpad bug 859075 in sysvinit (Ubuntu) "Oneiric does not shutdown" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/85907511:35
dokopitti, bdmurray: why do we still get reports like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/882445?12:16
ubottuLaunchpad bug 882445 in Ubuntu "package openjdk-6-jre 6b23~pre10-0ubuntu5 failed to install/upgrade: ErrorMessage: dependency problems - leaving unconfigured" [Undecided,New]12:16
pittiwe can write a pattern for it, to avoid further reports12:16
pittiI'm fairly sure I've seen that --fsys-tarfile bug somewhere12:17
pittilet's take bug 77317212:18
ubottuLaunchpad bug 773172 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "corrupted filesystem tarfile - corrupted package archive" [Undecided,Expired] https://launchpad.net/bugs/77317212:18
pittidoko: added bug pattern, closed as dupe12:21
dokopitti, thanks12:24
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zygadid postgresql change the default listen port for 9.1?12:35
zygait was 5432 and now I can see 543312:36
pittizyga: no; presumably you still have an 8.4 cluster around which is on 5432; check pg_lsclusters12:36
zygapitti, so after having both installed I need to tweak something to get the default port back12:36
zygayeah, I have 5433 used now, I removed my 8.4 cluster earlier today12:37
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DavieyAnyone know of a prior example of an SRU introducing a new src package?13:38
Daviey(as a dep)13:38
DavieyOr rather, the SRU requiring a new source package which is a dep.13:38
SpamapSDaviey: meaning the src package would effectively be "NEW" for -proposed ?13:42
DavieySpamapS: yes sir13:43
tumbleweedtalking of this, can an AA process bin-NEW for my botan1.8 SRU?13:50
geserDaviey: I guess you would need a good rationale for this13:54
Davieygeser: that some upstreams are really bad at following their own policy? :)13:54
Davieyright, soren? :)13:55
SpamapSDaviey: how big is this new dependency? Might it work embedded in the source?14:00
sorenSpamapS: I dont' see how that would be preferable.14:01
SpamapSsoren: if its a 1 file python module or something that is better.14:01
sorenDaviey: We have had kernels come in this way. Backported kernels from newer releases back to the most recent LTS.14:01
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DavieySpamapS: yeah, checked that.. it's not just one .py14:03
DavieySpamapS: but embedding a whole module, need to start worrying about upgrade paths.14:03
sorenSpamapS: Even then, it seems questionable.14:04
sorenPrecise will have it in a separate package. That's what we'll test.14:04
sorenAnd once validated, will backport to Oneiric.14:04
sorenI'm just not sure I think breaking two rules (embedding "foreign" libraries in other source packages + not staying close to how you're solving the same problem in the dev release) is necessarily better than breaking something that isn't even a rule, AFAICT (uploading new source packages to -proposed).14:06
cjwatsonyeah, I'm not aware of a rule against new source packages in -proposed; it's certainly unconventional but not forbidden TTBOMK14:09
cjwatsonif the purpose of the fix meets the SRU rules, then I wouldn't exclude it simply on the basis of requiring a new package14:10
cjwatsonalthough it would have to have a good reason14:10
soren...and avoiding embedding it in the source package that depends on it isn't that good a reason, IMO.14:11
sorenDidn't the openss{l,h} blacklist stuff come in its own source package?14:12
cjwatsonalbeit through -security not -proposed, but whatever14:12
sorenYeah, but that usually has a higher barrier of entry, not lower.14:13
sorenAnyway, I think we agree :)14:13
slangasekSpamapS: well, a) one of the commentors is having the problem with USB disks, not network mounts, b) we've been through all this before with network-manager being killed before umountnfs.sh and that's been fixed - so if something's regressed I think it's on the NM side of the equaton14:36
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WismonHi, I'm new to Ubuntu development (bug fixing) and fixed a bug the other day, uploaded my branch to Bazaar and made a merge request. I'm just wondering what the next logical step would be? I read about the sponsoring process but have to admit I don't really get how it works in reality. I just don't know if I should simply wait for now or if there's something more I should do. Maybe someone more knowledgeable than m15:09
Wismone can point me in the right direction?15:09
Wismon</wall of text>15:09
SpamapSslangasek: I do think that eventually we'll find the problem outside of sysvinit. I have it assigned to sysvinit because thats where the debugging has led the investigation thus far15:10
slangasekSpamapS: ok15:10
RiddellWismon: is the package has a likely team or person who might upload it you can politely ping them15:11
WismonRiddell: Hmm, I think I found one person... Thank you, I'll try that!15:16
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kirklandmterry: hiya16:08
mterrykirkland, hi!16:08
kirklandmterry: fyi, ecryptfs-verify-private just landed in precise16:08
mterrykirkland, oh, that didn't get into oneiric?16:08
kirklandmterry: nope, sorry16:08
kirklandmterry: needed an FFE16:09
kirklandmterry: i never filed it, don't know if anyone else did either16:09
kirklandmterry: was it you who was asking for this?16:09
kirklandmterry: or someone else?  seb maybe?16:09
mterrythat means it's probably easy to break your system in oneiric by enabling autologin (the patch I added to gnome-control-center used verify-private if available)16:10
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barry@pilot in17:33
=== udevbot_ changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Precise open for uploads | Ubuntu 11.10 Released! | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not app development) | build failures -> http://bit.ly/or6CHJ | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for hardy -> oneiric | #ubuntu-app-devel for application development on Ubuntu | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://bit.ly/lv8soi | Patch Pilots: barry
smoseram i the only one having problems ssh to bazaar.launchpad.net ?17:38
smoser(ie, i can't push a branch)17:39
smoser$ ssh bazaar.launchpad.net17:39
smoserssh_exchange_identification: Connection closed by remote host17:39
jelmersmoser: it appears to be fine here ("No shells on this server.")17:41
smoserit doesn't like me from 2 different systems (same key/user, but its not just my laptop thats foobarred)17:41
* micahg hugs barry for the mail to UDD17:41
* barry is glad he remembered!17:42
Davieysmoser: odd, i am getting the same.. I used to get No shells on this server.17:45
Davieydave@voodoo:/tmp/test$ bzr push lp:~davewalker/+junk/delete_me17:45
DavieyCreated new branch.17:45
Davieydave@voodoo:/tmp/test$ ssh davewalker@bazaar.launchpad.net17:45
Davieyssh_exchange_identification: Connection closed by remote host17:45
smoserothers in #launchpad  are echoing my issues.17:45
Davieysmoser: but push seemed to work17:46
smoserit was refusing 30 seconds ago17:46
smoserbut now seems good.17:46
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rbasakslangasek: I was just looking at bug 881579 and noticed that you did a merge today, but the bug is still present. It's a missing '\' in debian/samba.if-up21:19
ubottuLaunchpad bug 881579 in samba (Ubuntu Precise) "syntax error in /etc/network/if-up.d/samba" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/88157921:19
rbasakslangasek: I was going to fix it but if you're working on it anyway...21:19
slangasekrbasak: hah, fail.  Sorry for not noticing that.  Feel free to fix, I've moved on to other things already21:31
rbasakslangasek: well I'm going to need you to sponsor it anyway... :)21:31
slangasekrbasak: ok, pushing21:45
rbasakslangasek: thanks!21:46
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TheMuso@pilot in22:02
=== udevbot_ changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Precise open for uploads | Ubuntu 11.10 Released! | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not app development) | build failures -> http://bit.ly/or6CHJ | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for hardy -> oneiric | #ubuntu-app-devel for application development on Ubuntu | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://bit.ly/lv8soi | Patch Pilots: barry, TheMus
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