[01:26] <holstein> i say for JACK... 512 frames/period, sample rate 44,100, and periods/buffer 3
[01:26] <holstein> oops...
[02:16] <swamptin> Hi all
[02:16] <holstein> o/
[02:16] <swamptin> How goes?
[02:16] <holstein> not bad, and you?
[02:16] <swamptin> Sitting in work dossing
[02:17] <swamptin> trying to work out if a machine spec is compatable with UbuntuStudio before I buy it
[02:18] <holstein> the machine?
[02:18] <holstein> maybe take a live CD to it if you can
[02:18] <holstein> but, its really hard to say
[02:18] <swamptin> can't unfortunately. I'll be buying it online.
[02:18] <holstein> well, the machine doesnt matter so much
[02:19] <holstein> the interface does
[02:19] <holstein> http://www.alsa-project.org/main/index.php/Matrix:Main
[02:19] <swamptin> There's been reports of Ubuntu being fine with it, and it seems to support the chipset
[02:19] <holstein> http://www.ffado.org/
[02:19] <holstein> ubuntustudio = ubuntu
[02:19] <holstein> so it should be fine
[02:20] <swamptin> Yeah, but the real question I want answered is audio support, cause otherwise it's not really gonna work for me. So research research research
[02:20] <holstein> well, the internal sound card doesnt matter anyways
[02:20] <holstein> what interface do you have?
[02:21] <holstein> you shoul djust take that with you to the new machine
[02:22] <swamptin> Well, I have an MAudio U-Control, that used to work fine iirc
[02:22] <holstein> i like to either have a texas instruments firewire chipset onboard for my presonus firepod, or whatever firewire device i switch to in the future, or i like to be able to disable the onboard firewire and use a texas instuments PCI card
[02:22] <holstein> swamptin: USB is USB
[02:23] <holstein> so, that'll work just like it did
[02:23] <swamptin> well, that means that I have a solution to the problem if the on board sound isn't ideal :)
[02:23] <holstein> well, what im getting at is
[02:23] <holstein> onboard sound is *not* ideal
[02:23] <holstein> *all* of them
[02:24] <holstein> any of them
[02:24] <holstein> so, you dont want to try doing any pro audio with onboard sound
[02:24] <holstein> but, anything alsa uses, JACK should use
[02:25] <swamptin> Yeah, I know I want to avoid on board stuff. Just got a new desk the other week, but it ain't usb, which sucks. Works mind, works fine and dandy
[02:25] <swamptin> I'll just need to upgrade it eventually.
[02:26] <holstein> no onboard USB?
[02:26] <holstein> get a USB pci card
[02:26] <holstein> i got one for $5 US at the charity shop
[02:26] <swamptin> The audio mixing desk, sorry
[02:26] <swamptin> not desktop
[02:27] <holstein> its got some way to export i assume
[02:27] <holstein> burn CD's or something
[02:27] <holstein> import into ardour
[02:27] <swamptin> Just a phono out
[02:28] <swamptin> but that's all you need. My usb soundcard has phono in, I'm happy :)
[02:28] <holstein> i suppose
[02:28] <holstein> i wouldnt want to go analog to digital to analog to digital again
[02:29] <holstein> then to analog to hear it finally ;)
[02:29] <swamptin> hah
[02:29] <holstein> i had one with a lightpipe out
[02:29] <holstein> some kind of roland vs880 or something
[02:29] <holstein> that worked OK
[02:29] <swamptin> Well, I'm not planning on putting the BBC production standards to shame anytime soon
[02:30] <holstein> yeah, but all you need is a way to get digital into the computer, and you're not juggling clocks
[02:30] <holstein> i mean, 99% of whats wrong im project studios is just signal path
[02:31]  * holstein totally speculates
[02:31] <swamptin> true. It'll be my next upgrade plan. But I just wanted to be able to get back recording immediately
[02:31] <swamptin> You'd be right, assuming the cable lengths aren't being kept to a minimum
[02:32] <swamptin> And of course, there is a loss in quality each time you move from one format to another.
[02:33] <holstein> depends
[02:33] <holstein> but, you dont want to leave digital unless you have a good reason
[02:36] <swamptin> certainly not.
[04:18] <jasonmchristos> How do I get the lowlatency kernel installed if my boot part is (ro) ?
[04:19] <holstein> ro?
[04:19] <jasonmchristos> read only
[04:19] <jasonmchristos> at mount
[04:19] <holstein> jasonmchristos: we dont have a lowlatency kernel, so you add a ppa
[04:19] <holstein> i wouldnt worry about it though
[04:19] <holstein> you probably dont need it
[04:19] <holstein> but, you'll need to write to install a kernel
[04:19] <jasonmchristos> Well the recording has a lot of noise.
[04:20] <holstein> jasonmchristos: that wont help
[04:20] <holstein> this would get you lower latency
[04:20] <holstein> when using JACK
[04:20] <holstein> noise is introduced from your sound card likely
[04:21] <holstein> proably an internal card
[04:21] <holstein> you might here the computer in the line in or the mic
[04:21] <holstein> but, the kernel wont help with that
[04:21] <holstein> maybe some cheaper USB interface would help
[04:21] <holstein> http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/UCA202.aspx for example
[04:21] <jasonmchristos> Well when rcording without jack its a high pitched whine, when starting jack it becomes crackle.
[04:22] <jasonmchristos> Run through with me for learning purpose if you will.
[04:23] <jasonmchristos> Why the difference in noise with/without jack?
[04:23] <holstein> not sure
[04:23] <holstein> driver?
[04:23] <holstein> maybe just trying to claim access to the hardware
[04:23] <holstein> the crackle could be that you are trying to push JACK too hard
[04:23] <jasonmchristos> ALSA is selected in jack and you know that the default desktop uses pulse which is alsa based.
[04:24] <holstein> sure
[04:24] <holstein> thats plausible
[04:24] <holstein> http://gnuguitarinux.sourceforge.net/ has an RT kernel AFAIK
[04:24] <holstein> and http://www.bandshed.net/AVLinux.html too
[04:24] <holstein> they are LIVE ^^
[04:25] <holstein> we will be switching to a live installer soon as well :)
[04:25] <holstein> but, til then, you can try one of those for an ubuntu-like comparison of your hardware with a lowlatency kernel
[04:25] <holstein> but, thats not the issue
[04:25] <jasonmchristos> I found someone elses settings and changed jack frames/period to 256 from the default settings this was the only difference.
[04:26] <holstein> right
[04:26] <holstein> i would try 1024
[04:26] <jasonmchristos> Whats the signifigaec of frames/period ?
[04:26] <holstein> latency
[04:26] <jasonmchristos> Let me try and see what happens.
[04:26] <jasonmchristos> BTW, live installer = bad idea
[04:27] <holstein> yeah?
[04:27] <holstein> i think its a great way to see how the hardware works with JACK and the other software
[04:27] <holstein> i would have never made it to linux audio without the 64studio live CD
[04:28] <holstein> but, thats just my opinion
[04:28] <jasonmchristos> you arent accomplishing much
[04:28] <holstein> jasonmchristos: its this cycle we are talking about it
[04:28] <holstein> so join #ubuntustudio-devel and the mailing lists and share your opinion
[04:28] <holstein> i personally think we are accomplishing a lot
[04:28] <holstein> an avenue for folks to test hardware
[04:29] <holstein> an arguably more modern and fresher looking install experience
[04:29] <holstein> more congruence with the main ubuntu experience
[04:29] <jasonmchristos> no its counterproductive
[04:30] <jasonmchristos> its not a valid test of performance at all
[04:30] <jasonmchristos> will give the wrong impression
[04:31] <holstein> i disagree
[04:31] <holstein> what audio distros have you tried live?
[04:34] <jasonmchristos> mainly just this one tried dynebolic long ago holstein wouldnt boot
[04:35] <jasonmchristos> holstein, yeah it seems that 256 is crackle and 1024 is whin
[04:35] <jasonmchristos> whine
[04:35] <jasonmchristos> why is thia
[04:37] <jasonmchristos> must be the soundcard
[04:38] <jasonmchristos> What is latency the time it takes the DSP to output from input ?
[04:39] <holstein> bascially
[04:39] <holstein> thats not your issue though
[04:39] <jasonmchristos> Iwell the Period/Frames is listed as latency in ardour
[04:39] <jasonmchristos> and thats what changes the noise pattern
[04:40] <holstein> yup
[04:40] <holstein> but, its just an internal card right?
[04:40] <holstein> you dont want that
[04:40] <jasonmchristos> So why do you say that isnt the isue?
[04:40] <holstein> that card i linked is $30
[04:40] <holstein> US
[04:40] <holstein> get you one of thoes
[04:40] <holstein> those*
[04:40] <jasonmchristos> I have a little dragon andrea naturally speaking USB mic box.
[04:40] <holstein> it'll improve your studio *way* more than 30 bucks worth
[04:41] <holstein> yeah, not a USB mic either
[04:41] <holstein> not something you would use to conference call
[04:41] <holstein> something resembling something from a studio
[04:41] <jasonmchristos> Why would adjusting the latency cause noise pattern changes , because its internal.
[04:42] <jasonmchristos> Are you a salesman or a supporter?
[04:42] <jasonmchristos> Help me figure this out.
[04:42] <holstein> well, i have it figured out
[04:43] <holstein> you are using really inappropriate hardware
[04:43] <holstein> im not trying to sell you something
[04:43] <holstein> im trying to save you some time/energy
[04:43] <holstein> you'll never make a dollare out of 15 cents
[04:43] <holstein> that is literally the cheapest device you can get away with in my opinion
[04:43] <holstein> its USB, so its not going to pick up the internals of the machine so much
[04:44] <holstein> the whirz and buzzes
[04:44] <holstein> its supported well
[04:44] <jasonmchristos> ok looks useful
[04:44] <holstein> its got stereo line ins
[04:44] <jasonmchristos> thanks for the link
[04:44] <jasonmchristos> but i want to understand why the noise pattern changes
[04:44] <holstein> i have several internal/onboard sound cards
[04:44] <holstein> they all do something to that degree
[04:44] <holstein> lick
[04:44] <holstein> click*
[04:44] <holstein> buzz
[04:44] <holstein> whatever
[04:45] <holstein> i dont use them for anything missiong critical
[04:45] <holstein> ever
[04:45] <holstein> its like asking why your dial-up modem isnt delivering wifi
[04:45] <jasonmchristos> someone pawned my atr100
[04:45] <holstein> i mean, it *is* capable of networking
[04:45] <holstein> but, that doesnt mean you should use it
[04:46] <jasonmchristos> no im asking a simple question whats the cause of correlation between changing noise pattern and the latency setting on jack
[04:46] <jasonmchristos> if it was em interference the whine would be present on both settings
[04:47] <jasonmchristos> the craclking im guessing is because im requesting a latency quicker than the card delivers
[04:47] <holstein> the JACK driver
[04:47] <holstein> and how its communicating with the hardware
[04:47] <holstein> you can catch las over in #ardour
[04:47] <holstein> he's the main guy that wrote it
[04:47] <jasonmchristos> ok
[04:47] <holstein> you can see if he can explain more indepth
[04:47] <holstein> it never surprises me when i here that
[04:47] <jasonmchristos> ok thanks for the link to the soundcard
[04:47] <holstein> hear*
[04:48] <holstein> and i have noticed that
[04:48] <holstein> i have never found a way to make it clean enough to use
[04:48] <holstein> you wont find a JACK setting that will make that card quiet
[04:48] <holstein> so, i havent bothered to look into why it affects the sound that way
[04:48] <holstein> but, its grabbing that card
[04:48] <holstein> JACK
[04:49] <holstein> and the setttings are telling JACK what to do with it
[04:49] <holstein> and its not liking it
[04:49] <holstein> and i attribute that to the fact that it was designed to plug a mic in and do telephony at best
[04:49] <holstein> not audio recording/production
[04:52] <jasonmchristos> agreed
[04:52] <jasonmchristos> but I want to learn anyway
[04:53] <holstein> you can learn a lot about JACK and the connections from that hardware
[04:53] <holstein> you can do MIDI too
[04:53] <holstein> keep it where things are 'rendered' in the box
[04:53] <holstein> not recorded into it
[04:53] <holstein> that'll make whatever you create clean
[04:54] <jasonmchristos> which box
[04:57] <holstein> the computer
[04:57] <holstein> your computer
[04:57] <holstein> that doesnt require a fancy sound card, though it would be nice to hear it somewhat decently
[05:32] <jasonmchristos> ok this german card looks good
[05:32] <jasonmchristos> mabe i could build my own
[05:33] <jasonmchristos> but i guess the germans need some money
[05:33] <holstein> im sure you could.... the lowlatency kernel can help with xruns
[05:33] <holstein> which would explain why the crackle goes away
[05:33] <holstein> at 1024
[05:34] <jasonmchristos> right so how would i try this since my kernel is on read only
[05:35] <jasonmchristos> is that igor guy really a dev r is he a decepticon trying to swap out kernals ?
[05:35] <holstein> change to write
[05:35] <holstein> try one of the live CD's with a lowlatency kernel
[05:35] <jasonmchristos> ok fine
[05:35] <jasonmchristos> link to download the live cd please
[05:36] <holstein> depends really
[05:36] <holstein> AVLinux is debian based, but one of the bigger iso's with more features
[05:36] <holstein> gnuguitarinux is ubuntu based, and failry current
[05:37] <holstein> http://gnuguitarinux.sourceforge.net/
[05:37] <holstein> http://sourceforge.net/projects/gnuguitarinux/files/gnuguitarinux-1.1_2.iso/download
[05:40] <jasonmchristos> well ive got a ppa
[05:40] <jasonmchristos> is this guy an ubuntu studio dev?
[05:40] <jasonmchristos> its going to be quicker for me to just install a kernel
[05:41] <jasonmchristos> rather than an entire live cd
[05:42] <holstein> what guy?
[05:42] <holstein> do what you chose
[05:43] <holstein> either will let you try a lowlatency kernel with your hardware
[05:43] <holstein> i would just install a kernel from https://launchpad.net/~abogani/+archive/ppa
[05:43] <holstein> but if you dont want to break your setup, do the live CD
[05:44] <jasonmchristos> holstein, if i remember correctly if the kernel doesnt work the other kernels remain installed and you can select them from the grub menu
[05:44] <jasonmchristos> is there any setting in these new distros that delete the old kernel by default ?
[05:45] <holstein> depends on how you have it setup, but yeah... i have several kernels on most laptops i use
[05:45] <holstein> jasonmchristos: i dont know what distro you are using, and how you are using it read only
[05:45] <jasonmchristos> im using 10.11
[05:45] <holstein> i know that on ubuntu theres nothing that auto cleans kernels
[05:45] <holstein> 10.10?
[05:45] <holstein> 10.04?
[05:46] <holstein> 11.10?
[05:46] <jasonmchristos> i just during partitioning made a seperate /boot and set it to read only at mount
[05:46] <jasonmchristos> 11.10
[05:46] <holstein> then you shoul be fine
[05:47] <holstein> you can go in now and edit grub2 to show "unhide" the menu
[05:47] <jasonmchristos> ok so i guess i have to change the mount options to write
[05:47] <holstein> you can press shift there at boot, and you should see the list
[05:47] <holstein> i usually reference the grub2 wiki for how to edit that file
[05:47] <jasonmchristos> how do i download all of the necisarry packages prior to installation ?
[05:47] <jasonmchristos> i have the ppa installed
[05:48] <jasonmchristos> but i just want to download with dependancys withou installing
[05:48] <jasonmchristos> then i will reboot in write mode to install
[05:48] <holstein> should be all in the PPA
[05:48] <holstein> just the header right?
[05:48] <holstein> doesnt need much
[05:48] <jasonmchristos> needs 2 packages i think
[05:49] <holstein> right
[05:49] <holstein> the kernel and the header?
[05:49] <jasonmchristos> is there a way to tell synaptic to cache them without installing ?
[05:49] <holstein> im sure there is
[05:49] <holstein> i tyically use apt or aptitude
[05:50] <jasonmchristos> k
[05:57] <jasonmchristos> holstein, sorry to bug with a basic thing but whats the file that specifies th mount options ?
[06:01] <holstein> jasonmchristos: /etc/fstab ?
[06:01] <jasonmchristos> ty
[06:08] <jasonmchristos> later
[06:11] <jasonmchristos> http://gnuguitarinux.sourceforge.net/
[06:11] <jasonmchristos> I don't like sourcforge so much
[06:11] <jasonmchristos> I don't think they are honest with thier donations system.
[06:11] <jasonmchristos> http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/UCA202.aspx
[06:11] <jasonmchristos> Will check this out.
[06:13] <jasonmchristos> hmm, why arent these showing up in my url grabber
[20:30] <sekisushai> hello
[20:30] <sekisushai> I would like to know if it's possible to straight install kde desktop during the installation process
[20:31] <sekisushai> to have a kind of kubuntu studio..
[20:33] <astraljava> Not during the installation, but after that, sure.
[20:33] <sekisushai> so what do you advice, just install the minimum like xfce desktop
[20:33] <sekisushai> and then kde desktop ?
[20:34] <astraljava> Yes, that's what I would do.
[20:34] <sekisushai> and what about installing kubuntu and then install some package to change in ubuntu studio
[20:34] <sekisushai> at the end it's the same results ?
[20:35] <sekisushai> i mean, whatever installation cd i get, i then can change my ubuntu version by installing some package ??
[20:35] <astraljava> That way works too. Just that by default, you'll have the desktop you last installed. You will have to choose which DE you log into at the greeter.
[20:36] <sekisushai> hum ok
[20:36] <sekisushai> so fundamentally any ubuntu version can be changed easily in an other one ?
[20:36] <astraljava> Very much so.
[20:36] <sekisushai> ok
[20:36] <sekisushai> thus, i'm gonna use the ubuntustudio installation cd
[20:36] <sekisushai> thanks ;)
[20:37] <astraljava> No prob, glad to be of assistance.
[23:12] <jfb86> hello and cheers everyone!! :)
[23:13] <jfb86> i tried 11.10, and i returned to 11.04...
[23:14] <jfb86> is there anyone in that case? thx
[23:16] <jfb86> i foud differences that don't please to me. excuse my english if i don't use the right words