[00:36] <micahg> http://robert.ocallahan.org/2011/11/end-of-plugins.html
[00:37] <micahg> chrisccoulson: any chance of a fix before EOD tomorrow for the upgrade issue?
[17:09] <chrisccoulson> hmmmm, i really should start packing for berlin
[18:16] <skomorokh> the ppas have me confused... is there a stable ppa for 11.10 with xulrunner?
[18:22] <micahg> skomorokh: no
[18:22] <micahg> xulrunner is no longer supported in Ubuntu
[18:24] <skomorokh> got that part, didn't understand that it meant there wouldn't be anything in the ppa either
[18:28] <micahg> we're not encouraging its use anymore, Debian has xulrunner built in the iceweasel package in unstable (8.0 ATM) and you could probably throw that in a PPA, but no guarantee that it'll build
[18:29] <skomorokh> is mozilla deprecating it?
[18:31] <micahg> not inherently
[18:31] <micahg> we just can't support it
[18:33] <skomorokh> well that makes for an awkward transition to... whatever those of us who develop against it are going to do wrt packaging going forward. have you heard of any plans or groups organising?
[18:35] <micahg> nope, I know that Conkeror got their app working with Firefox directly
[18:36] <skomorokh> whee. um, is that libmozjs package sticking around do you think?
[18:37] <micahg> yeah, we build that from its own source now
[18:38] <micahg> the current one is based on Firefox 4's spidermonkey
[18:39] <skomorokh> at least they distribute 64bit binaries now.
[18:44] <chrisccoulson> the "we just can't support it" is more like "we don't want to support it, when we could be spending our time on more productive things" :-)
[18:44] <chrisccoulson> spending more than half of my time maintaining something that's used by probably less than 1% of our users isn't fun ;)
[18:44] <skomorokh> well, it's pretty silly to only provide security patches alongside api changes
[18:45] <micahg> chrisccoulson: I meant can't as in we don't have a team of people dedicated to porting the apps to the new APIs every 6 weeks as a security update
[18:45] <chrisccoulson> right
[18:46] <skomorokh> sort of discourages developing any sort of non-toy software against it.
[18:46] <chrisccoulson> we don't want a team of people doing that, even if they were available :)
[18:48] <skomorokh> so presumably when the reality of this 6 wk lifecycle starts to hit home around ff 12 or 15 and there is some kind of LTS (well, not even... 6-8 months) version, you'll not mind packaging that?
[18:49] <chrisccoulson> hah - the first respondent to https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+question/178255 clearly didn't read the question :-)
[18:50] <chrisccoulson> Q: "When will they be published?", A: "What is the output of: lsb_release -a; uname -a"
[18:58] <micahg> skomorokh: there will be an ESR for Firefox that we'll package for the LTS releases only, but we're not going to be packaging xulrunner anymore
[18:58] <micahg> ESR= Extended Support Release
[19:06] <skomorokh> micahg: even if there's a xulrunner ESR?
[19:07] <micahg> skomorokh: yes, we have limited resources (Firefox and Xulrunner have the same base)
[19:08] <micahg> the ESR packages will be in a PPA only, not in the distro proper
[19:08] <skomorokh> for firefox?
[19:09] <micahg> yes, for Firefox only and only for LTS releases
[19:10] <micahg> *supported LTS releases
[19:13] <skomorokh> cool, thanks for the clarification.
[19:13] <skomorokh> and for packaging any of it :)
[19:15] <micahg> but, it won't be xulrunner that you can build apps of off, unless it's like conkeror that can run off of firefox
[19:19] <skomorokh> the ESR one won't?
[19:19] <micahg> right
[19:20] <skomorokh> but... isn't that what xulrunner is, a thing that runs an app with xul & misc other moz apis?
[19:20] <skomorokh> what kind of xulrunner-esr would that even be :S
[19:24] <micahg> well, it would be a stable branch for 36/42 weeks, but we don't have the resources to maintain it, so, I'd suggest trying the Debian packages or the upstream binaries, see https://accounts.google.com/ServiceLogin?service=groups2&passive=1209600&continue=http://groups.google.com/group/mozilla.dev.planning/browse_thread/thread/c77e35586cc8ebfa&followup=http://groups.google.com/group/mozilla.dev.planning/browse_thread/thread/c77e35586cc8ebfa
[19:24] <micahg>  for one thread from mozilla.dev.planning discussing xulrunner
[19:26] <skomorokh> ty
[19:26] <micahg> skomorokh: it's a shame, it was an awesome platform
[19:27] <skomorokh> it's not like it doesn't exist anymore... it has just become slightly disorganised, no?
[19:27] <micahg> well, I suggest reading the thread to see Mozilla's view on it
[19:28] <micahg> it's hard to summarize in a few lines
[19:28]  * micahg hopes he got the right thread
[19:28] <skomorokh> ya, i will... just hard to believe that it's completely past tense as a platform
[19:29] <micahg> this link might be better: http://groups.google.com/group/mozilla.dev.planning/browse_thread/thread/c77e35586cc8ebfa/d550942989a45578?q=xulrunner&lnk=ol&
[22:11] <chrisccoulson> bhearsum, oh, how come csb isn't in http://hg.mozilla.org/releases/mozilla-beta/file/fc6b1f33a497/browser/locales/all-locales ?
[22:11] <chrisccoulson> (it's in shipped-locales though)
[22:11] <chrisccoulson> is that intentional?
[22:12] <bhearsum> hmm
[22:12] <bhearsum> probably an oversight
[22:12] <chrisccoulson> ah, ok
[22:12] <bhearsum> i don't think all-locales gets consumed by anything on mozilla-beta
[22:12] <bhearsum> and our l10n guy is throttled with Fennec Native UI stuff :(
[22:12] <chrisccoulson> ah, perhaps i should stop using it for pulling translations :)
[22:13] <chrisccoulson> i'm looking forward to running the fennec native UI!
[23:13] <MangoBoy> Hi
[23:14] <MangoBoy> Is there a other plugin for divx streams then gecko mediaplayer. mplayer cant fastforward and cuts of and stops if stream breaks..
[23:18] <MangoBoy> It cuts of and stops and dropps what is already buffered  if stream breaks instead of try to buffer more