[02:16]  * eggonlea faints
[16:01]  * slangasek waves
[16:01] <ev> hiya
[16:01] <cjwatson> hi
[16:02] <bdmurray> hi
[16:02]  * stgraber waves
[16:03] <slangasek> #startmeeting
[16:03] <meetingology> Meeting started Wed Nov 16 16:03:01 2011 UTC.  The chair is slangasek. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlanBell/mootbot.
[16:03] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[16:03] <slangasek> [TOPIC] Lightning round
[16:03] <slangasek> $ echo $(shuf -e cjwatson barry doko stgraber jhunt ev bdmurray slangasek)
[16:03] <slangasek> ev cjwatson barry slangasek doko jhunt stgraber bdmurray
[16:03] <ev> eep
[16:03] <ev> can we circle back?
[16:03] <ev> still frantically typing
[16:03] <slangasek> k
[16:03] <slangasek> cjwatson:
[16:04] <cjwatson> Switched over to the new cdimage master machine.  The part of image builds that it does seems about two or three times as fast as before.
[16:04] <cjwatson> Drafted other-p-plusonemaint-priorities.
[16:04] <cjwatson> More poking at exposing a decent Germinate API for Launchpad to use.  I'm making progress but only slowly.
[16:04] <cjwatson> Finished OCaml transition.  Mostly finished Haskell transition.  Much of the way through http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/perl5.14.html.  Other odds and ends of that kind.  700 uploads this week!
[16:04] <cjwatson> Caught up on some merges.
[16:04] <cjwatson> Nibbled around the edges of multiarch cross-building a bit more.  I've started trying to attack the odd cross-architecture gzip mismatch bug ...
[16:04] <cjwatson> ..
[16:05] <barry> python-dbus porting to python 3.  many interesting decisions along the way: <http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~barry/python-dbus/py3/view/head:/PY3PORT.rst>.  status: compiles, test suite runs without crashing (yay!), but does not fully pass.  todo: make the test suite pass <wink>.  once that's done, test with real-world application, upload to ppa, email to mlist, blog.  done.
[16:08] <slangasek> followed through on some multiarching of libraries that was uploaded to Debian
[16:08] <slangasek> reviewing blueprints
[16:08] <slangasek> reviewing resumes for open positions
[16:08] <slangasek> done
[16:09] <slangasek> doko_: you're up
[16:11] <slangasek> jhunt_: why don't you go ahead
[16:11] <jhunt_> Blueprint work. Some significant Upstart Cookbook updates:
[16:11] <jhunt_> http://upstart.ubuntu.com/cookbook/#how-to-establish-fork-count,
[16:11] <jhunt_> http://upstart.ubuntu.com/cookbook/#implications-of-misspecifying-expect,
[16:11] <jhunt_> http://upstart.ubuntu.com/cookbook/#recovery-on-misspecification-of-expect.
[16:11] <jhunt_> fix for bug 771372. Review of code for setuid/setgid stanzas in Upstart.
[16:11] <jhunt_> Discussions with Patrick in QA re automated Upstart testing. Upstart job
[16:11] <jhunt_> logging rework still ongoing. Coding nominally complete - currently
[16:11] <jhunt_> debugging a failing test and working on documenting how to logically
[16:11] <jhunt_> establish the "optimal" start on condition for an Upstart job (to be
[16:11] <jhunt_> used for
[16:11] <jhunt_> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-p-upstart-convert-main-initd-to-jobs).
[16:11] <jhunt_> Patch for bug 829980 seems to be working for users, so will upstream and
[16:11] <jhunt_> re-merge into official package this week (oneiric and precise).
[16:11] <jhunt_> ∇
[16:12] <stgraber> - Testing tracker
[16:12] <stgraber>  - http://91.189.93.73 is usually up to date with what's in the branch
[16:12] <stgraber>  - Front page (list of builds) is done
[16:12] <stgraber>  - Spent half a day working on SQL optimization, got the worst page load in less than a second now (instead of 5)
[16:12] <stgraber>  - Initial work on the testcase view, should be done today
[16:12] <stgraber>  - Some work on the user/admin ACLs
[16:12] <stgraber> - Finished drafting all my blueprints
[16:12] <stgraber> - Worked on bug 823366, got a test setup and have a patch to make ifenslave work with our event driven boot (tested on 802.3ad only)
[16:12] <stgraber> - Some bugfixes in Arkose, still need to run the tests and then push the new version in Precise and SRU some of the fixes to Oneiric
[16:12] <stgraber> - Got upstart:i386 to install on an amd64 system with a patched apt (ppa:stgraber/experimental has the needed packages)
[16:12] <stgraber> - Some LXC upstream and packaging work with Serge, all of that should be uploaded to Precise soonish
[16:12] <stgraber> - TODO
[16:12] <stgraber>  - Try to get the new ISO tracker feature-equivalent to the old one by the end of the week
[16:12] <stgraber>  - Look at the new ifupdown in Debian (beta2), isolate the fix for bug 876829 and SRU to Oneiric
[16:12] <stgraber>  - Still need to get my iSCSI test setup online again and then look at the merge
[16:13] <stgraber> (done)
[16:13] <bdmurray> I was out on the 10th and 11th
[16:13] <bdmurray> tested and committed script to help manage rls-p-tracking bug tasks
[16:13] <bdmurray> setup up precise bug fixing report
[16:13] <bdmurray> wrote mailing list parser to determine where no package bug reports end up going and running a report for 2011
[16:13] <bdmurray> review of cproffit's bug workflow diagram for loco team members (bug reporters)
[16:13] <bdmurray> modification to bug bot commenting on no package bug reports routine
[16:13] <bdmurray> set up new canonistack image for the ultimate debian database
[16:13] <bdmurray> ubiquity bug triage (hardware errors and lack of free space)
[16:13] <bdmurray> .. done ..
[16:14] <slangasek> ev?
[16:14] <ev>  - Got a local retracer set up after merging in pitti's fixes.
[16:14] <ev>  - Researched RabbitMQ for coordinating retracing crash reports.
[16:14] <ev>  - Long call with Robert Collins on the crash database work.
[16:14] <ev>    - Robert is happy to help and provide guidance.
[16:14] <ev>    - Plan is to use oops-repository (Cassandra) as the database layer and API
[16:14] <ev>      for posting (with reply for more detail required), posting core dumps,
[16:14] <ev>      getting the full data out (privileged), and update an existing crash
[16:14] <ev>      (partially privileged).
[16:14] <ev>    - Also agreed to use the oops-repository dictionary format for crashes.
[16:14] <ev>    - This will make integrating with Launchpad's longer term plans of this as
[16:14] <ev>      a service for all projects an easier challenge. This may be implemented
[16:14] <ev>      as one big Cassandra cluster in a multi-tenant fashion, or on a
[16:14] <ev>      per-project basis, feeding to an API.
[16:14] <ev>    - Need to get something just sending crash signatures (or a likeness)
[16:14] <ev>      sharpish to test the scalability.
[16:14] <ev>    - Will use RabbitMQ for work queues, while still posting to a Cassandra
[16:14] <ev>      ColumnFamily to have a back up queue in case Rabbit falls over.
[16:14] <ev>    - Agreed to look at the existing long list of hardware databases created by
[16:14] <ev>      Canonical rather than creating yet another one.
[16:15] <ev>    - Came up with some plans for fractional deployment for the client.
[16:15] <ev>    - And lots, lots more :)
[16:15] <ev>  - Started looking into txstatsd and Graphite, per Robert's advice to measure
[16:15] <ev>    everything :)
[16:15] <ev>  - Proposed a branch to disable removing core files in the Launchpad retracer,
[16:15] <ev>    so that we have some profiling data to work with.  Need to follow up to
[16:15] <ev>    Martin's comments.
[16:15] <ev>  - Ported the crash reporter to C. \o/ Still need to wire up to
[16:15] <ev>    NetworkManager.
[16:15] <ev>  - Wrote a C parser for the Apport (/RFC822) report format.
[16:15] <ev>  - Call with David Pitkin about his plans for improving the 3rd party
[16:15] <ev>    application development platform.
[16:15] <ev>  - Helped Matthew understand what packages are responsible for writing to the
[16:15] <ev>    screen during the boot and shutdown process in support of his work item for
[16:15] <ev>    session consistency (bug 882296).
[16:15] <ev>  - Background research into moving from JSON to BSON. Some serious wins to be
[16:15] <ev>    had.
[16:15] <ev>  - Moved from JSON to BSON using MongoDB's C BSON library for transmitting
[16:15] <ev>    crash data to the server.
[16:15] <ev>  - Chat with Rick about helping the DX team get over the testing hump.
[16:15] <ev> (done, I think)
[16:16] <slangasek> BSON, eh?
[16:16] <slangasek> how is that different from JSON?
[16:16] <ev> it's binary
[16:16] <ev> therefore it's better
[16:16] <slangasek> ah
[16:17]  * slangasek grins
[16:17] <slangasek> doko_: around at all?
[16:17] <ev> (http://www.mongodb.org/display/DOCS/BSON)
[16:17] <barry> ev: did you see jam's performance analysis on canonical-tech?
[16:18] <ev> of BSON? I believe that's the thread I read on there about it
[16:18] <ev> the one where Robert unpacked the worked involved to send JSON vs BSON over the wire
[16:19] <barry> ev: i really only skimmed the message ;)
[16:21] <ev> barry: :) I was thinking of a different thread, but I've seen this one too :)
[16:22] <ev> I don't think it's possible to do anything but skim that thread. It put me in a coma at UDS.
[16:23] <barry> :-D
[16:23] <slangasek> [TOPIC] Bugz
[16:23] <slangasek> bdmurray: what's new and buggy?
[16:23]  * slangasek hmms and prods the bot (or his connection)
[16:24] <bdmurray> mterry brought up bug 459730 this week which cjwatson commented on at one point in time
[16:24]  * slangasek tentatively taps his connection
[16:25] <cjwatson> If mterry brought it up, he can reply to my review comment :-)
[16:26] <slangasek> technically it's not a device at all but a pipe... does it belong somewhere other than /dev?
[16:27] <slangasek> I don't think this is a high priority bug though
[16:27] <cjwatson> quite possibly; if it were somewhere other than /dev then we wouldn't have to have the debate about whether it belonged in udev.  /run would work now, perhaps
[16:28] <cjwatson> (noted that in the bug)
[16:29] <slangasek> not sure how many other packages regard xconsole as a "standard" interface, is the only thing that gives me pause
[16:30] <jhunt_> slangasek: one day, when we have opengrok... :)
[16:30] <slangasek> bdmurray: what else you got in the bug jar? :)
[16:30] <bdmurray> okay then, cjwatson do you have a thought on where the _ in bug 861048 is coming from?
[16:30] <ev> jhunt_: what the RT for the opengrok stuff?
[16:31] <jhunt_> ev: jamespage has done some packaging work. We need to assess infrastructure requirements. I'm currently working on some changes to the OpenGrok core to improve indexing.
[16:31] <cjwatson> bdmurray: I haven't had a chance to see if I can reproduce that; grub2 is supposed to turn off the cursor and then IIRC it sets a magic bit in the boot protocol to tell the kernel not to turn it on
[16:32] <ev> jhunt_: don't forget about the Canonicloud
[16:32] <ev> you can always prototype there
[16:32] <jhunt_> ev: we're using it :)
[16:32] <ev> brilliant
[16:32] <cjwatson> so by design it works; it's possible that grub isn't actually setting that magic bit or that the kernel isn't honouring it, and those are the two likely points of failure
[16:32] <ev> let me know if you get something I can set up an ssh tunnel to
[16:32] <cjwatson> I know Matthew Garrett wrote a kernel patch to do that but right now I don't recall whether it landed
[16:32] <slangasek> cjwatson: 861048 is before the first purple screen though, so before grub has rendered
[16:33] <cjwatson> oh, *before* grub?
[16:33] <slangasek> cjwatson: does that mean it's BIOS output that we can't control?
[16:33] <cjwatson> in that case the BIOS sets it and we can't do anything about it
[16:33] <cjwatson> grub turns it off as pretty much the very first thing it does
[16:33] <slangasek> ok - thought so, but wanted your professional opinion
[16:33] <cjwatson> sorry, hadn't read the up-to-date comments
[16:33] <cjwatson> I'll double-check in the code
[16:34] <bdmurray> I may have also seen an _ when resuming from hibernate - that would be a bug though correct?
[16:34] <cjwatson> (because I might be misremembering)
[16:35] <cjwatson> resuming from hibernate starts out from the BIOS too
[16:35] <cjwatson> however it's possible that we aren't turning it off as quickly there; if so that would be a bug
[16:35] <cjwatson> we may not be able to fix it completely but should do what we can
[16:35] <bdmurray> A video would help I'd imagine?
[16:36] <cjwatson> Hmm.  I may be misremembering about grub.  It does turn off the cursor, but not desperately early
[16:37] <cjwatson> It's possible we can improve things there
[16:37] <cjwatson> I've updated the bug
[16:39] <bdmurray> Additionally there was a session where we discussed text free boot and I'd tested switching to a tty1 and suspending and resuming.  Should I report a bug about that?
[16:39] <cjwatson> yes, I don't remember the exact behaviour but the behaviour we discovered in that session was a bug :;-)
[16:39] <cjwatson> :-)
[16:40] <bdmurray> okay, that answers that then
[16:41] <bdmurray> stgraber you'd talked about taking a pass through casper bugs before we went to UDS.  Do you still plan on doing that? there are a few with patches etc...
[16:41] <stgraber> bdmurray: yes, I actually have some local changes on casper (getting rid of gconf and converting to gsettings)
[16:42] <bdmurray> that's all I've got then
[16:44] <slangasek> cjwatson: related, you have a workitem on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-text-free-boot to "hunt down" a bug about grub not honouring EDID properly... bug 877278 is the right bugnum, I'm not sure if that means that workitem is done or if it just metamorphoses :)
[16:44] <slangasek> bdmurray: thanks
[16:44] <cjwatson> let's metamorphose it into that bug then
[16:44] <slangasek> cjwatson: and assign to you?
[16:44] <cjwatson> yep
[16:45] <slangasek> done
[16:45] <slangasek> [TOPIC] Blueprints
[16:45] <slangasek> Blueprints!  Drafting due Friday
[16:46] <slangasek> from what I see we seem to be on track... just be sure to get them wrapped up by then
[16:46] <slangasek> and when you're done drafting and ready for review, please be sure to mark as either 'pending approval' or 'review' so we know
[16:46] <slangasek> any questions?
[16:46] <ev> what time on friday? :)
[16:47] <slangasek> heh
[16:47] <slangasek> before you leave the office is fine
[16:47] <ev> cool
[16:47] <slangasek> but I don't want everyone dumping them on me at 5pm pacific :)
[16:47] <bdmurray> before ev leaves or I leave?
[16:47] <slangasek> bdmurray: yes
[16:48] <slangasek> [TOPIC] AOB
[16:48] <slangasek> anything else?
[16:49] <slangasek> oh, should've said during the lightning round, but just to remind you that I'm out all next week and half of the week after... hence the deadline
[16:50] <cjwatson> oh, I should book holiday before that then
[16:51] <ev> attending a big data event at Millbank tonight - some Cassandra people there, probably MongoDB folks as well. Let me know if you have questions you want passed along.
[16:51] <ev> oh and Hadoop
[16:52] <slangasek> cool
[16:53] <slangasek> #endmeeting
[16:53] <meetingology> Meeting ended Wed Nov 16 16:53:05 2011 UTC.
[16:53] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2011/ubuntu-meeting.2011-11-16-16.03.moin.txt
[16:53] <slangasek> thanks guys :)
[16:53] <ev> thanks!
[16:53] <ogra_> ev, ask if they know about calxeda and our involvement with them
[16:53] <ev> okay
[16:53] <ev> will do
[16:53] <ogra_> hadoop is the #1 usecase
[16:53] <ogra_> for that super armed server :)
[16:53] <barry> thanks!
[16:54] <jhunt_> thanks
[16:54] <ev> :)
[16:54] <stgraber> thanks!
[18:05] <nuclearbob> #startmeeting
[18:05] <meetingology> Meeting started Wed Nov 16 18:05:33 2011 UTC.  The chair is nuclearbob. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlanBell/mootbot.
[18:05] <meetingology> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
[18:05] <nuclearbob> [TOPIC] Previous items
[18:06] <nuclearbob> the only action item last week was discuss the minimum memory requirements
[18:07] <nuclearbob> we've been discussing that at the sprint this week, but we haven't reached a conclusion
[18:07] <nuclearbob> moving on
[18:07] <nuclearbob> [TOPIC] Community Efforts/Testing
[18:08] <nuclearbob> looks like I went too fast, rolling back
[18:08] <nuclearbob> [TOPIC] Previous Actions
[18:09] <nuclearbob> we have a url for the minimum memory requirements provided by the dev team that we'll be testing against
[18:11] <nuclearbob> https://help.ubuntu.com/11.10/installation-guide/i386/minimum-hardware-reqts.html
[18:11] <gema> basically, we will aim at validating whatever the minimum requirements are
[18:11] <gema> so that we are sure thing work in low memory conditions
[18:12] <gema> but we don't have a date yet as to when we will be able to start such testing
[18:12] <gema> ..
[18:12] <nuclearbob> all right
[18:12] <nuclearbob> any other previous actions before we move on?
[18:13] <nuclearbob> all right
[18:14] <nuclearbob> [TOPIC] Community Efforts/Testing
[18:15] <nuclearbob> as we're defining the preferred test case format, we'll make sure to get that published so the community can submit test cases, but we don't have the format defined yet
[18:19] <nuclearbob> anybody else?
[18:19] <nuclearbob> moving on
[18:19] <nuclearbob> [TOPIC] Automated/Systems Testing
[18:20] <nuclearbob> we're setting up a new lab this week for automated testing
[18:20] <nuclearbob> once it's running we'll be pushing test results to the public jenkins instance
[18:22] <nuclearbob> we'll have more of that available after it's setup
[18:23] <nuclearbob> anything else?
[18:24] <nuclearbob> all right
[18:24] <nuclearbob> [TOPIC] Engineering Team Bug Status (hggdh, Ursinha, pedro_, bdmurray)
[18:27] <nuclearbob> any bug status updates this week?
[18:27] <bdmurray> I've nothing special to share today just one recommendation
[18:28] <bdmurray> With the recent release of 11.10 it'd be helpful if people were to go through and review bugs that've reported and ensure they are still relevant
[18:28] <bdmurray> For further details see http://www.murraytwins.com/blog/?p=110
[18:29] <nuclearbob> sounds good
[18:29] <nuclearbob> anything else from anybody?
[18:30] <nuclearbob> all right
[18:31] <nuclearbob> [TOPIC] Other Topics
[18:32] <gema> we are going to be improving the ubuntu QA wiki soon
[18:32] <gema> there has been a lot of improvements within QA and we are changing the way we do testing so we are going to try to reflect that on the wiki
[18:33] <gema> please, feel free to add/remove things as you see fit, we are going to try to get rid of obsolete info and put in the relevant information of what we are working on at the moment
[18:33] <gema> basically, all the things we spoke about at UDS need to be reflected there
[18:34] <gema> bdmurray: we'll need to talk about how to split the pure bug-centric info from the QA info
[18:34] <gema> so that everything flows nicely
[18:34] <gema> ..
[18:35] <nuclearbob> all right
[18:35] <nuclearbob> anyone want to chair next week?
[18:35] <gema> I can do
[18:35] <nuclearbob> super
[18:35] <nuclearbob> [ACTION] gema to chair next meeting
[18:35] <meetingology> ACTION: gema to chair next meeting
[18:36] <nuclearbob> thanks everybody
[18:36] <nuclearbob> #endmeeting
[18:36] <meetingology> Meeting ended Wed Nov 16 18:36:09 2011 UTC.
[18:36] <meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2011/ubuntu-meeting.2011-11-16-18.05.moin.txt