[01:01] <nigelb> Mornin
[01:10] <ScottL> mhall119, aye, it is...this is my home computer, i guess you can figure out what scott-work is for ;)
[01:29] <nigelb> ejat: I land in the airport at 12 am. I'm hoping to be in the hotel by 1 am or so.
[01:29] <ejat> noted … im not staying at the hotel :(
[01:30] <nigelb> Ah, right.
[01:30] <nigelb> I'll be missing tonight's small gathering.
[01:30] <ejat> but its ok .. we will see how ..
[01:30] <nigelb> Yeah :)
[01:30] <nigelb> There's two full days! :)
[01:30] <nigelb> Heh, I love the weather prediction.
[01:31] <nigelb> Rain every day
[01:31] <ejat> :)
[01:31] <ejat> in the evening ..
[01:31] <nigelb> fuuuu. I can't find my umbrella.
[01:31] <nigelb> I should hunt for it.
[01:32] <ejat> like 1st day morning at uds .. raining …
[01:32] <ejat> did u need the umbrella ?
[01:32] <nigelb> UDS is different. we're almost locked in a hotel for a week :P
[01:33] <ejat> yeah ..
[01:33] <cjohnston> nigelb: the first day of uds here was raining
[01:33] <ejat> cjohnston : yeah .. thats what i told him just now ..
[01:33] <nigelb> cjohnston: The sunday before Budapest was also raining.
[01:34] <cjohnston> yup
[01:34] <nigelb> I remember walking out of the flight into rain.
[01:34] <cjohnston> i do remember that
[01:34] <cjohnston> ejat: it didnt look like he got that
[01:34] <ejat> cjohnston :)
[01:35] <cjohnston> pleia2: did that guy ever get his ltp working
[01:37] <ejat> brb
[01:47] <pleia2> cjohnston: heh, he disappears often, hoping he'll be at the mt view ubuntu hour tonight so I can force him to try it again ;)
[01:47] <nigelb> heh
[01:47] <cjohnston> ok
[01:47] <cjohnston> you should be able to tell by seeing if he shows up in the 'team' list when you go to edit the team
[01:48] <pleia2> yeah, he does now
[01:48] <cjohnston> say to add a contact or if you tried making him a meeting chair
[01:48] <cjohnston> then it should be good pleia2
[01:48] <pleia2> I think I need to do the "loco.ubuntu.com people are community and don't hate you" talk again to my team
[01:49] <cjohnston> why now
[01:49] <pleia2> "it never works" if they can't log in once
[01:49] <cjohnston> lol
[01:49] <pleia2> "first it was the wiki, now loco, canonical must hate loco teams!"
[01:49]  * pleia2 facepalm
[01:50] <nigelb> bah!
[01:51]  * pleia2 is on a train \o/
[01:52] <cjohnston> locos hate loco teams?
[01:53] <pleia2> loco.ubuntu.com
[01:54] <pleia2> but probably that too ;)
[02:12] <mhall119> nobody says they can't use the wiki, if they like beating themselves for no reason....
[02:12] <nigelb> heh
[02:49] <doctormon> mhall119: I don't understand
[02:51] <doctormon> did any of you fine people try groundcontrol in oneiric?
[03:23] <mhall119> doctormon: what don't you understand?
[03:28] <doctormon> mhall119: Your double negative sentence. It says: "Anyone says they can use the wiki, if they like beating themselves for no reason..."
[03:42] <mhall119> doctormon: yes, that is still accurate
[03:43] <doctormon> mhall119: My parsing is failing me, can you help me by rewording it?
[03:43] <mhall119> nobody is saying (they can't use the wiki)
[03:44] <mhall119> count("Don't use the wiki!") == 0
[03:44] <mhall119> `grep -Rnic "don't use the wiki" /` eq 0
[03:45] <doctormon> count("Don't use the wiki as a database!") == 1
[03:45] <mhall119> the wiki is a database
[03:45] <doctormon> So why would people beat themselves?
[03:46] <mhall119> doctormon: if they like to use the wiki for storing descrete data, they are probably masochists
[03:46] <doctormon> mhall119: That's not a database it's a scratch pad with style ;-)
[03:46] <mhall119> doctormon: ah, from the UI it is a scratchpad, from the code it is a database
[03:47] <mhall119> and it happens to be very bad at both
[03:47] <doctormon> mhall119: I'm sure even angry birds has a database in there somewhere, I wouldn't use it to store user data :-P
[03:47] <mhall119> doctormon: I'm betting Rovio does though ;)
[03:48] <doctormon> So I take it your not a fan of the wiki for decreat data mhall119?
[03:49] <mhall119> doctormon: yes, mostly because it's a one-way street
[03:50] <doctormon> I just don't like it because it's got the design of a warthog, it's as flexible as a hammer, as fast as a sleeping snail and is a crutch for a real solution to data problems we have in the community.
[03:51] <mhall119> heh, so we agree
[03:51] <doctormon> How long did we suffer the wiki before we finally got the loco directory.
[03:51] <mhall119> too long
[03:51] <doctormon> agreed
[03:51] <mhall119> we still suffer the wiki because we don't have a team reports app
[03:51] <doctormon> soon I'm sure.
[03:52] <mhall119> only if we get more hands
[03:52] <doctormon> I just added the loco-portal project using ground control, ACE.
[03:52] <mhall119> we can barely do what we want with LTP and Summit
[03:52] <mhall119> doctormon: nice
[03:52] <doctormon> If I can get some more support for ground control, we could provide the developer tool to get more people involved in the website work.
[03:52] <doctormon> All that's needed is a text editor and the ability to start the server.
[03:53] <mhall119> I need a weekend where I can hack LTP data into Meetingology
[03:54] <doctormon> what's that?
[03:54] <mhall119> that's AlanBell's new meeting bot
[04:01] <doctormon> mhall119: So you'll get meeting logs to go to the loco directory directly?
[04:20] <nigelb> mhall119: zomg. You're on bash.org!
[04:20] <nigelb> http://bash.org/?945304
[04:22] <mhall119> nigelb: lol, that was a while ago
[04:22] <mhall119> doctormon: we already have links to the logs
[04:22] <mhall119> I'm thinking of getting the agenda into meetingology
[04:22] <nigelb> heh
[04:23] <nigelb> Oh god. Taxi in 2.5 hours. Need to finish packing.
[04:23] <doctormon> interesting, anything to exorcise the wiki from day to day use :-D
[06:22] <bkerensa> Good Night Ladies and Gents!
[07:43] <czajkowski> aloha
[07:46] <dholbach> good morning
[07:46] <czajkowski> dholbach: aloha there hows you
[07:47] <dholbach> hey czajkowski
[07:47] <dholbach> a bit tired to be honest - I don't know why, but I feel like I woke up 500 times tonight
[07:48] <dholbach> how about you?
[07:50] <czajkowski> about the same went to bed at 11 but up at 12 -4 and then finally nodded off about 5 :/
[07:50] <czajkowski> it's going to be a long day
[07:51] <dholbach> yes
[07:51]  * dholbach gets another espresso
[07:59] <popey> morning
[08:10] <czajkowski> jussi: gives a shout when you're about will you please.
[08:15] <popey> i think he's taking a break isnt he?
[08:15] <popey> oh, he was around yesterday
[08:15] <popey> ignore me ☺
[08:36] <huats> morning popey !
[08:37] <popey> morning huats
[08:39] <alourie> good morning
[08:44] <jussi> czajkowski: yes?
[08:45] <czajkowski> jussi: can you fix the factoid please
[08:45] <jussi> czajkowski: sorry, no. If it doesnt sync to ubot4, only jpds can fixor it. :(
[08:46] <czajkowski> bots and me fail!
[08:46] <czajkowski> jussi: cheers
[09:12] <AlecTaylor> I am trying to model a collection of systems, their various interconnections, as well as their internal logical structures, as a message is passed through them, initiated by an actor. Is BPMN the right notation, and am I using it right? - http://i39.tinypic.com/16iut1d.png
[09:25] <nigelb> Hello!
[09:25]  * nigelb waves from airport
[09:25]  * AlecTaylor waves back
[09:46] <AlecTaylor> hi
[09:46] <AlecTaylor> I am trying to model a collection of systems, their various interconnections, as well as their internal logical structures, as a message is passed through them, initiated by an actor. Is BPMN the right notation, and am I using it right? - http://i.stack.imgur.com/r9741.png
[09:47] <AlanBell> AlecTaylor: not sure this is the right place to ask that
[09:47] <jussi> AlecTaylor: you are probably asking in the wrong place. perhaps #ubuntu-app-devel might be better?
[09:47] <jussi> hehe
[09:48] <AlecTaylor> asked there :P
[09:49] <jussi> AlecTaylor: ok. crossposting is generally frowned upon, so you may want to just be patient.
[09:49] <AlecTaylor> You asked me to post there!
[09:51] <AlanBell> AlecTaylor: thats fine
[09:51] <AlanBell> AlecTaylor: what has it got to do with Ubuntu though?
[09:52] <AlecTaylor> Ubuntu was designed, Ubuntu designs various softare and architectures
[09:52] <AlecTaylor> So I thought they may have some tips!
[09:52] <AlanBell> I would have thought BPM diagrams and swimlane stuff would be interesting discussions for a BPM forum or ISO 9000 area or something
[09:52] <AlanBell> wasn't really designed using a process approach though
[10:06] <dholbach> Sunday is UCADay!
[10:31] <AlecTaylor> AlanBell: Have a specific one to suggest?
[10:32] <AlanBell> not really, I don't do that any more
[10:32] <AlanBell> and the number of people in the open source world that would have a clue what you are on about is pretty small
[10:33] <AlanBell> there is a jbpm project that Alfresco includes and OpenERP has some BPM tools in it, you won't get much help on either of those in the Ubuntu channels though
[10:40] <AlecTaylor> mm
[13:02] <danilos> jcastro, hi, who can restore my admin privileges on summit.ubuntu.com? (actually, summit.linaro.org)
[13:26] <mhall119> danilos: what do you need admin privileges for?
[13:27] <danilos> mhall119, we want to use summit.linaro.org to start preparing for our next Connect coming up in early February
[13:28] <mhall119> danilos: oh, ok
[13:29] <mhall119> danilos: do you need access to just the schedule data, or do you need the access to the sponsorship too?
[13:30] <AlanBell> oh, linaro are not doing May?
[13:30] <AlanBell> or are they doing quarterly connects now?
[13:30] <mhall119> AlanBell: they have a shorter cadence
[13:30] <mhall119> 4 months I think
[13:31] <danilos> mhall119, I don't need access to sponsorship stuff right now
[13:31] <mhall119> danilos: check your access now
[13:31] <danilos> AlanBell, mhall119: yeah, we do  them quarterly, there'll be another one in May
[13:32] <AlanBell> ok, we won't do breaky stuff with the etherpad bit when you are in mid-connect then ;)
[13:32] <AlanBell> nigelb: ^^
[13:32] <mhall119> cjohnston: ^^ as well
[13:32] <danilos> mhall119, if I just create a linaro 'summit', how bad is it going to be if it shows up on summit.ubuntu.com? should we perhaps look for a different deployment instead?
[13:32] <Daviey> danilos: linaro don't use sponsorship through summit do they?
[13:32] <danilos> Daviey, I don't know that much
[13:33] <mhall119> danilos: depends on how much coding work you can put into summit between now and then
[13:33] <Daviey> danilos: How familar are you with summit?
[13:34] <danilos> Daviey, I've only done one non-trivial change to the code so far
[13:34] <danilos> mhall119, I don't expect us to be able to put much effort in, fwiw
[13:35] <mhall119> danilos: if you add a Linaro Connect to the system, it'll be displayed on summit.ubuntu.com's main page, but otherwise I don't think it will have any adverse effects
[13:35] <mhall119> uds.ubuntu.com will still link to /uds-p/, so that's good
[13:35] <danilos> mhall119, right, that's what I thought, how bad would that be for ubuntu
[13:36] <mhall119> danilos: not bad, and we could get a fix for that relatively easily
[13:37] <mhall119> danilos: but we'll be deploying some fixes, for both Ubuntu and Linaro, between now and Feb.
[13:37] <mhall119> we also have a planned upgrade to django 1.3 sometime soon
[13:37] <danilos> mhall119, right, we are fine with fixes which don't break stuff :)
[13:38] <mhall119> just warning you, there's a chance of short down times when we do them
[13:38] <danilos> mhall119, as for upgrade, that's fine, but let's not do it too close to February (if it can happen this year, it'd be good)
[13:38] <mhall119> danilos: we're going to do that one as soon as IS is ready
[13:38] <danilos> mhall119, ah, ok, that sounds good then
[13:43] <mhall119> jcastro: ping
[14:11] <cjohnston> danilos: i was told by multiple other people that you guys wouldn't be using summit in Feb.. Has that changed?
[14:37] <danilos> cjohnston, hum, I am surprised about that, since people who are running the connect are asking me for it
[14:38] <cjohnston> dunno
[14:50] <scott-work> jcastro: how can i get get a burndown page like yours (http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-precise/u/jorge.html) ?
[14:51] <jcastro> ok so it was explained to me that you needt o be in a group
[14:51] <jcastro> and then cjohnston said that we can't make more groups because the server gets overload
[14:51] <jcastro> you know, we should charm->EC2 this bad boy.
[14:54] <mhall119> jcastro: if only we knew someone involved with juju that could do that for us....
[14:55] <marcoceppi> Charming status would be epic.
[14:55] <marcoceppi> IMO
[14:56] <mhall119> jcastro: then convince IS to point a *.ubuntu.com domain to an AWS IP address
[14:56]  * jcastro whistles
[14:59] <jcastro> how about just
[14:59] <jcastro> setting one up
[14:59] <jcastro> for the people who can't be on status.u.c?
[15:03] <dholbach> james_w, would you mind if I take over https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/News and replace it with submissions procedures and the like?
[15:03] <jcastro> DANIEL.
[15:03] <jcastro> (Hi.)
[15:04] <dholbach> HEY JORGE
[15:04] <dholbach> HOW ARE YOU DOING?????
[15:04] <jcastro> good
[15:04] <dholbach> excellent :)
[15:04] <james_w> Not at all
[15:04] <dholbach> merci bien
[15:16] <scott-work> you down with entropy?  ya, you know me
[15:24] <dholbach> everybody got UCADay in their calendar for sunday? :)
[15:37] <akgraner> ashams, see I told ya!  ^^^^
[15:39] <ashams> yeah, you were absolutely correct ;D
[16:56] <jcastro> Joeb454: around?
[17:08] <dholbach> hey jono
[17:09] <jono> hey dholbach
[17:09] <dholbach> have a great weekend everyone - see you all next week!
[17:09] <dholbach> and don't forget UCADay on Sunday!
[17:09]  * dholbach hugs you all
[17:17] <technoviking> wish I could quit for the day 7 minutes after my boss shows up:)
[18:23] <pleia2> so, someone else owns twitter.com/xubuntu (never tweeted), but twitter claims they "may" respect trademarks, canonical owns the trademark, how/who does the xubuntu team need to nudge to at canonical to get help with this?
[18:28] <bkerensa> pleia2: trademark@ubuntu.com might work took me about two days to get a response or perhaps https://forms.canonical.com/trademark/
[18:29]  * nigelb waves
[18:29] <bkerensa> hi nigelb
[18:29] <nigelb> hey
[18:29] <pleia2> bkerensa: thanks, I'm familiar with those, was hoping for a more human response that would help me determine whether it's even worth bothering :)
[18:30] <pleia2> but if it only takes a couple days for a response that's not so bad (it used to be a black hole)
[18:30] <greg-g> hah
[18:30] <bkerensa> pleia2: Have you talked to anyone at Twitter? I hear they can take months if not longer to address issues and enforce their own policies
[18:31] <bkerensa> black holes are fun :D
[18:31] <pleia2> bkerensa: no, and that's the reason for the "may" in my comment ;)
[18:31] <greg-g> sometimes a legal dept to legal dept process can be quicker
[18:31] <greg-g> *sometimes*
[18:31] <greg-g> (as opposed to their usual customer service route)
[18:32] <bkerensa> On another note does anyone know if it is possible to get the Ubuntu banner layouts? I am going to be making a banner and hope to use the official design... Were doing a big event the first week of Dec
[18:32] <pleia2> bkerensa: I'd ask in #ubuntu-design
[18:33] <pleia2> they've been helpful with my recent requests for things like that
[18:33] <pleia2> (takes a few days, but they can usually dig out the artwork I need eventually :))
[18:33] <bkerensa> cool :D
[18:34] <pleia2> of course it's friday and they all live in the UK
[18:34] <pleia2> doh :)
[18:35] <bkerensa> :P
[18:36] <bkerensa> It could be worse... You could be approached by Debian people to put together a venue with food and beverage for two days from 9am to 5pm =o
[18:37] <bkerensa> with just two weeks to work with :P
[18:37] <pleia2> they can approach all they want, that's not going to happen :)
[18:39] <bkerensa> well luckily I was able to get PuppetLabs to sign off on venue now just trying to raise enough money to feed 25 people for 3 meals for two days =/
[18:39] <pleia2> I love Debian people (mostly I'm one of them) but too many of them have little to no respect for people who do non-developer stuff, "It's easy to do that stuff! they only need 2 weeks!" and I try not to help them with this illusion ;)
[18:41] <pleia2> it is nice that they've opened up NM though <3
[18:41] <bkerensa> pleia2: Yeah magic does not happen in two weeks so they will get whatever I can serve up
[18:41] <pleia2> puppetlabs is awesome, you have a really great relationship going on up there, kudos :)
[18:42] <Pendulum> bkerensa: 3 meals a day?
[18:42] <bkerensa> pleia2: PuppetLabs is good people
[18:43] <Pendulum> if I heard 9-5 for hours on something I'd assume that it might include lunch and snacks
[18:43] <akgraner> +1 on puppetlabs and good peoples!
[18:43] <Pendulum> not breakfast and dinner as well
[18:43] <bkerensa> Pendulum: Well I guess two since it will start at a little after breakfast
[18:44] <Pendulum> (and I've been to plenty of events where lunch was up to us to find, but that only works if there's food close to the venue)
[18:45] <akgraner> was working on my UCADay stuff and it was sounding like an acceptance speech and next I'd like to thank...boring - so I changed my thought process to how would jcastro write this  - muahahaha....:-)
[18:45] <jcastro> \o/
[18:45] <cprofitt> lol
[18:45] <cprofitt> good thinking akgraner
[18:46] <bkerensa> Pendulum: Geeks up here are spoiled unfortunately.... I was very surprised that people showed for the Ocelot release since it wasnt catered
[18:46] <bkerensa> akgraner: I'm making cards for every member who came to any of the last three events or meetings
[18:46] <akgraner> yeah - I screwed up something else I was working so - I decided to work on something else for a few minutes...this has not been my finest week as far as productivity and I go...
[18:46] <bkerensa> for UCaday
[18:47] <akgraner> bkerensa, sounds cool...
[18:49] <akgraner> I don't know what all I am going to to besides blog and email people...but I think it's going to be fun reading what people write and stuff
[18:49] <akgraner> pleia2, you know if people post a lot of stuff we'll be adding a ton of links to UWN :-)  yay
[18:50]  * pleia2 has totally ignored UWN this week
[18:50] <pleia2> :\
[18:50] <pleia2> rough week, I'll have some time this evening though
[18:50] <akgraner> I looked at it and thought I need to add some links will do that tomorrow though
[18:51] <akgraner> pleia2, no worries :-)
[21:25] <czajkowski> aloha
[22:26] <doctormon> Mem is fun http://doctormo.org/2011/11/18/chucks-away/
[22:27] <akgraner> jcastro where does one go to see all the charms that have been written so far?
[22:35] <jcastro> http://charms.kapilt.com/
[22:35] <jcastro> temporary
[22:35] <jcastro> those are the accepted ones
[22:35] <jcastro> the rest are in lp:charm
[23:10] <technoviking> in Iain Farrell still at Canonical?
[23:17] <nigelb> technoviking: Nope.
[23:18] <technoviking> nigelb: thanks