[02:51] <doctormo> Hello everyone
[02:51] <doctormo> Service will be spotty up here in VT while I'm enjoying the holy day of Thank's Giving.
[08:23] <dholbach> good morning
[08:29] <yaili_> good morning
[10:21] <sladen> morning all.  Are there any outstanding requests for bits and pieces that I need to look for while I'm in the office today?
[11:29] <AlanBell> hi sladen and all
[11:30] <sladen> AlanBell: indeedy
[11:30] <sladen> AlanBell: what can I do for you
[11:31] <AlanBell> I have been playing with pencil for the unity on the telly project thing
[11:31] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/
[11:31] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/pencilfiles/
[11:32] <AlanBell> created a base frame for people to sketch on designs of what unity media centre television thing might look like
[11:36] <AlanBell> sladen: one last place available for the christmas meal if you or someone else in the office can make it http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1409/detail/
[11:40] <sladen> AlanBell: I'm not going to book it as the penalty is too great.  But if I happen to be in London that evening and it's still unfilled, I might come along
[11:40] <sladen> went to one in Berlin.  My impression was that they don't get, or feel the need for repeat customers
[11:41] <sladen> it's more like a theme-park novalty ride
[11:41] <AlanBell> yes, I know what you mean
[11:42] <sladen> they were rude about my Brompton, managed to upset one of my dinning companions (another vegetarian + other issues, who wanted to see the menu before hand)
[11:42] <sladen> I think sabdfl's story about the shellfish ties up with that
[11:42] <AlanBell> yeah
[11:43] <sladen> the partially-sighted community is benefitting, but other people are making the profit
[13:58] <sladen> jonobacon/wendar: were you working on some governance stuff
[14:49] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/ storyboard sketching improved
[15:40] <doctormo> The web chat had limits! 6am it turns into a pumpkin, good to know.
[15:41] <doctormo> AlanBell: Does ltp have a slot limit function yet?
[15:41] <AlanBell> ltp?
[15:41] <AlanBell> slot limit??
[15:41] <AlanBell> loco team portal
[15:42] <AlanBell> I don't know what a slot limit function is doctormo
[15:47] <Andy80> sladen: hi! I opened a bug ( https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xchat/+bug/894036 ) for XChat about using "Ubuntu Mono" as default font for it, but I've seen that the sourcecode of the Precise version was already modified to use "Monospace". The question is: since the Terminal and all the other apps use "Ubuntu Mono", should not we use it to have UI consistency? Thanks
[15:47] <webbugs> Launchpad bug 894036 in xchat (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu Mono font should be used by default in XChat" [Undecided,In progress]
[16:06] <sladen> can people with Android have a look at  http://module.create3000.de/tests/test-module.html  and see if there's double-spacing happening
[16:17] <YoBoY> sladen: you are evil, an url shortener is really useful on that case :D
[16:19] <YoBoY> but don't know what you are looking for... the display seems identical on my android and my ubuntu
[16:23] <Andy80> sladen: just replied on LP ;)
[16:31] <sladen> YoBoY: d o e s   i t   l o o k   l i k e   t h i s ?
[16:31] <sladen> YoBoY: or like this?
[16:32] <YoBoY> looks normal :) no extra spaces
[16:33] <sladen> YoBoY: interesting.  And you're definitely using the Android browser
[16:33] <sladen> Andy80: can you share with YoBoY how to get the version number information or the browser
[16:33] <sladen> of the browser
[16:33] <sladen> so we can work out which versions are affected
[16:34] <YoBoY> hum... define "android brower" ^^" i'm using the one on my smartphone, an HTC, don't know if it's the official android browser
[16:35]  * AlanBell has double spacing going on
[16:35] <sladen> YoBoY: the bug is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xchat/+bug/894036  It's been raised by somebody else (Andy80)
[16:35] <webbugs> Launchpad bug 894036 in xchat (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu Mono font should be used by default in XChat" [Undecided,In progress]
[16:35] <AlanBell> samsung galaxy s2 internal browser
[16:36] <sladen> AlanBell: s p a c e d  or normal?
[16:36] <AlanBell> s p a c e d
[16:37] <AlanBell> version 2.3.3
[16:38] <Andy80> sladen: what do I have to do exactly? how the browser is related to my bug?
[16:38] <YoBoY> version 2.2, webkit 3.1
[16:38] <AlanBell> YoBoY: settings-applications-manage applications-all-internet
[16:39] <YoBoY> yes version 2.2
[16:39] <YoBoY> thanks AlanBell
[16:41] <AlanBell> sladen: fine in mobile firefox, but no surprise there I expect
[16:41] <sladen> Andy80: There is a bug somewhere.  Your screenshot proves that.  And I've confirmed it on the Android device of the person next to me in the Millbank office
[16:41] <sladen> Andy80: this could be either  (a) a bug in the Ubuntu Mono Font.  (b) a bug in the subsetting system used by Google in order to transmit smaller files.  (c) a bug in a particular version(s) of a particular Browser(s)
[16:42] <Andy80> sladen: you're talking with the wrong person....I didn't provide any screenshot O_o I'm the one who wrote you about an XChat improvement.
[16:42] <sladen> Andy80: ah, sorry
[16:42] <Andy80> sladen: I proposed to use "Ubuntu Mono" as default font in XChat, that's all :D
[16:42] <sladen> Andy80: yes, that's a separate bug.  For that, could you just do   bzr diff file-you-modified.something
[16:43] <sladen> Andy80: with the branches deleted, I'm not able to guess what file(s) you've changed
[16:43] <sladen> Andy80: if you list the commands you've type in order to get+test the source code, I can also possibly help find the difficulty with bzr
[16:43] <sladen> Andy80: and in uploading the tree
[16:46] <Andy80> sladen: no problem, I just need two informations.... 1) which one is the proper lp:project I've to branch from and 2) which one is the proper project where I've to push. I'll take care of the modify and of the merge request.
[16:48] <sladen> Andy80: lets worry about pulling it first
[16:49] <Andy80> sladen: ok :)
[16:49] <sladen> Andy80: what did you type?   Eg.   bzr branch lp:   or   apt-get source xchat?
[16:50] <Andy80> sladen: "bzr branch lp:ubuntu/xchat" this
[16:50] <Andy80> sladen: is it the proper branch?
[16:50] <sladen> bzr branch lp:ubuntu/xchat  yes
[16:50] <Andy80> nice
[16:50] <sladen> Andy80: and then you changed some files?
[16:50] <YoBoY> sladen: ok, I can see the extra spaces on my android browser when I activate the "mobiel view", AlanBell can you check that on your browser ?
[16:50] <Andy80> sladen: not yet... or better I just started from scratch... it's just one line so I can do it now... wait..
[16:51] <sladen> YoBoY: how does one active/deactive "mobile" view.  Could you put that in the bug report?
[16:51] <YoBoY> sladen: bug number ?
[16:51] <YoBoY> don't give me again the xchat bug :p
[16:52] <sladen> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-font-family/+bug/894133
[16:52] <webbugs> Launchpad bug 894133 in Ubuntu Font Family "Android Webkit gives double-width spacing when Ubuntu Mono used as web font" [Undecided,Incomplete]
[16:52] <YoBoY> thank you :)
[16:52] <Andy80> sladen: file modified, I even did the bzr ci ......, now I need to push it somewhere
[16:53] <sladen> Andy80: do bzr revert
[16:53] <sladen> sorry
[16:53] <sladen> Andy80: do bzr uncommit
[16:53] <sladen> and then bzr diff
[16:54] <Andy80> sladen: here is the diff http://pastebin.com/24hznXxx
[16:56] <Andy80> it looks ok to me... but I wait for your word :P
[16:56] <YoBoY> ok I'm puzzled... seems my browser don't use the right police in "normal view" (can't see the magic characters)
[16:57] <YannDinendal> sladen, Andy80: shouldn't "Monospace" automatically default to "Ubuntu Mono" ?
[16:58] <Andy80> YannDinendal: I don't know.... if it's true, then my patch is useless :)
[16:58] <Andy80> no problem in that case ;)
[17:41] <sladen> Andy80: the way it was done, for the last release was to only change it via the gsettings value and the 'ubuntu-artwork' package
[17:41] <sladen> Andy80: arguably if the whole of the Ubuntu platform (Kubuntu, Xubuntu, ...) is happy with that change, then it could be chanced
[17:42] <sladen> Andy80: I'm still interested in seeing the patch that Andy80 made and proposed that
[17:42] <sladen> Andy80: to get the wider reaction from the Ubuntu platform people
[17:43] <Andy80> sladen: my  patch just modified this line: #define DEF_FONT "Ubuntu Mono 12"
[17:44] <sladen> Andy80: so, how far did you get
[17:44] <Andy80> sladen: but of course it's only for Ubuntu, not for Kubuntu/Xubuntu/Debian ecc....
[17:44] <sladen> Andy80: did you get as far as modifying that?
[17:44] <Andy80> sladen: what you mean?
[17:44] <Andy80> (excuse me, maybe my bad english :\ )
[17:45] <sladen> Andy80: you did  1.  bzr branch lp:ubuntu/xchat xchat-ubuntu-mono
[17:45] <sladen> Andy80: did you do   gedit xchat/some/file.c
[17:45] <Andy80> yes
[17:45] <Andy80> I need to commit and push now...
[17:46] <Andy80> sladen: can I commit and push? if yes... where do I push exactly?
[17:46] <sladen> Andy80: bzr commit -m 'Overide DEF_FONT to be "Ubuntu Mono 13"'
[17:46] <sladen> Andy80: or before that, do  bzr status   and check that you only modified one file
[17:47] <Andy80> yes, only that
[17:47] <Andy80> btw it's Ubuntu Mono 12, not 13 (the same as Terminal)
[17:51] <Andy80> sladen: do you think that this push could be ok: bzr push lp:~andreagrandi/ubuntu/xchat/xchat-ubuntu-mono ?
[17:52] <sladen> Andy80: I think so.  Or if that doesn't work  bzr push lp:~andreagrandi/+junk/xchat-ubuntu-mono
[17:53] <Andy80> sladen: oh no! I already tried to use "junk" url the first time and it was impossible to merge then
[17:54] <Andy80> sladen: but neither this one work.... uff: bzr: ERROR: Invalid url supplied to transport: "lp:~andreagrandi/ubuntu/xchat/xchat-ubuntu-mono": No such distribution series xchat.
[17:57] <sladen> Andy80: do you have SSH setup?
[17:57] <sladen> Andy80: to push you need to have an SSH key registered in Launchpad
[17:57] <Andy80> sladen: yes... I regularly push stuff into Unity-2D
[17:58] <Andy80> sladen: the problem is this... usually the push URL would be this one: push lp:~andreagrandi/xchat/xchat-ubuntu-mono, but this will push into the upstream one, not the Ubuntu one
[17:58] <Andy80> sladen: so I need to know the proper URL
[17:59] <AlanBell> /ubuntu/precise/xchat-ubuntu-mono perhaps?
[18:00] <Andy80> AlanBell: or maybe: /ubuntu/precise/xchat/xchat-ubuntu-mono ?
[18:01] <AlanBell> maybe :)
[18:02] <Andy80> ok... something was pushed :P let's see if I can merge it
[18:02] <Andy80> AlanBell, sladen the branch is here https://code.launchpad.net/~andreagrandi/ubuntu/precise/xchat/xchat-ubuntu-mono
[18:02] <Andy80> now I need to merge to the right one ;)
[18:05] <Andy80> AlanBell, sladen ok this should be the merge request https://code.launchpad.net/~andreagrandi/ubuntu/precise/xchat/xchat-ubuntu-mono/+merge/83332 let's hope it doesn't give any diff errors like yesterday
[18:05] <Andy80> nice! it worked :)
[18:08] <sladen> Andy80: hopefully it may start a discussion about whether to do it that way, or change the whole lot at a higher level
[18:09] <Andy80> sladen: yes.... I tried to look if there was the possibility to change this at /etc/... level, but I didn't find anything, do I ended changing it just there.
[18:11] <sladen> grep -i monospace -r /etc/fonts/conf.d/
[19:29] <wendar> sladen: for ubuntu-design? yes, the CC reviewed it in the last meeting
[19:30] <wendar> sladen: basically, the CC is the governance as we get started, and will help us grow team leadership
[19:35] <sladen> wendar: okay.  Current plan would be to work on rolling out a  design.ubuntu.com  as a planet, then progressively add people from the Ubuntu Design community has they gain recognition
[19:36] <sladen> wendar: (I'm hoping that the design.canonical.com blog would qualify at some point, for anything with the tag 'ubuntu')
[19:37] <wendar> sladen: you've talked with sabdfl and inayaili? they're moving design.canonical.com to design.ubuntu.com and opening it up to Ubuntu design community
[19:37] <wendar> sladen: or, is this the next step on that plan?
[19:41] <sladen> wendar: yes, we had another meeting today
[19:42] <wendar> sladen: cool, sounds good (and quick and easy to set up, which is good)
[19:44] <sladen> wendar: where the plan distilled to leaving design.canonical.com.  But moving all the perma-content to upstream (Unity guidlines -> unity.u.com;  Ubuntu stuff to design.u.com; etc)
[19:45] <sladen> wendar: so the Canonical Brand Guideline stuff could live there (until it gets superceded), but the Ubuntu stuff would  live on design.u.com (or somewhere else too)
[19:46] <sladen> wendar: however, I think you're way around on governance.  Clearly I've missed something proactive and productive happening there
[19:47] <AlanBell> I have put together an ubuntuish/canonicalish export template for pencil: http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/
[19:47] <wendar> sladen: sounds like a good distribution of content
[19:48] <wendar> sladen: on governance: ah, a good start, early days yet, we're still a baby team
[19:49] <wendar> AlanBell: cool!
[19:51] <sladen> AlanBell: what kinds of interfaces do you imagine people using for televisions?
[19:51] <AlanBell> http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/unitytelly/pencilfiles/ the .ep files are the pencil files, and the ubuntu.zip is a pencil export filter
[19:51] <sladen> AlanBell: eg, would they be using a mouse/
[19:51] <AlanBell> sladen: dunno, but that isn't really the point in this context
[19:51] <AlanBell> the point is that the free software wireframing tool is full of awesome
[19:52] <AlanBell> I am going to give that stuff to the #ubuntu-tv project to get them to do more concept wireframing stuff
[19:52] <AlanBell> I suspect the TV thing will end up either going nowhere, or becomming a unity theme for xbmc
[19:55] <AlanBell> so from an ubuntu-design point of view I wanted to make a wireframing/storyboard template that could be used for all sorts of things
[19:55]  * sladen spots the old favicon on people.u.com
[19:56] <sladen> anyone want to file that at  http://launchpad.net/ubuntu-branding/+filebug?field.title=people.u.c+uses+pre-2010+Ubuntu+favicon  and take the credit?
[19:56] <AlanBell> you spotted it
[21:03] <mmiicc> sladen: can you close this bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-font-family/+bug/790913 I'm not sure if I as a reporter can do that
[21:03] <webbugs> Launchpad bug 790913 in Ubuntu Font Family "UbuntuBeta Mono font looks blurry in Firefox and Chromium compared to Ubuntu Regular" [Undecided,New]
[21:10] <sladen> mmiicc: I think there was another bug I just bounced back to you from 18 months ago
[21:12] <sladen> mmiicc: marked it a dup of bug #820493
[21:12] <webbugs> Launchpad bug 820493 in Ubuntu Font Family "Mono: No hinting yet - Ubuntu Beta Mono font looks jagged in Netbeans and terrible with ClearType" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/820493
[21:15] <mmiicc> sladen: yes, that way you reminded me about this bug :)
[21:18] <sladen> mmiicc: would you be willing to help check an other ones that need re-testing
[21:18] <mmiicc> sladen: no problem
[21:18] <sladen> mmiicc: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-font-family/+bug/603049  could do with somebody firing up the font at 9pt for each of the weights
[21:18] <webbugs> Launchpad bug 603049 in Ubuntu Font Family "Hinting: hinted ~9pt is 1 pixel shorter than raw outlines" [High,Triaged]
[21:18] <sladen> mmiicc: and comparing the height between unhinted (the real outlines) and the fully manually hinted forms
[21:54] <mmiicc> sladen: how can I add more than one attachment to bug report?
[21:57] <mmiicc> sladen: nevermind, I've added zip file https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-font-family/+bug/603049/comments/24
[21:57] <webbugs> Launchpad bug 603049 in Ubuntu Font Family "Hinting: hinted ~9pt is 1 pixel shorter than raw outlines" [High,Triaged]
[22:03] <sladen> mmiicc: what's your analysis based on the screenshots?
[22:04] <mmiicc> sladen: I see difference in width but not height
[22:04] <mmiicc> sladen: but I'm not an expert :
[22:06] <mmiicc> sladen: if you have more bugs to check, I'll be back tomorrow :)
[22:06] <mmiicc> good night for now
[22:07] <sladen> mmiicc: thank you very much
[22:54] <sladen> pleia2: is there anything else needed from the office design archive before I leave the office at some point
[22:58] <sladen> oh, banner SVG