[00:00] <holstein> david__: what i said was, it depends on what you are doing
[00:01] <holstein> lets say for example
[00:01] <holstein> you lay down guitar
[00:01] <holstein> then, you overdub vocal on it
[00:01] <holstein> and you have 60ms latency
[00:01] <holstein> aroudr *should* compensate when you are overdubbing and line everything up
[00:01] <holstein> ardour*
[00:01] <david__> Got it.
[00:01] <holstein> you can and should test for that
[00:02] <holstein> *IF* you have a keyboard
[00:02] <david__> I do
[00:02] <holstein> some USB keyboard, or midi controller
[00:02] <holstein> you hit the key
[00:02] <holstein> 60ms later the sound comes you
[00:02] <holstein> thats not going to be acceptable
[00:02] <holstein> but, niether is 20ms
[00:02] <holstein> if you have an internal sound card, you really cant expect much out of it
[00:11] <david__> Thank you holstein. I saved a copy of this chat so I can refer back to it.
[00:11] <holstein> david__: :)
[00:12] <holstein> JACK is *not* trivial to get running
[00:12] <david__> I might check on abgogani's ppa in the future (maybe next weekend)
[00:12] <holstein> but, its quite versitile
[00:12] <david__> (and see what I can get out of the internal sound card)
[00:16] <holstein> well, its not so much what you get out of it, its what folks potentially put into the machine through them
[00:16] <holstein> but, if you are working with MIDI, you'll be ahead of the curve in that regard
[00:18] <david__> Any experience with recovering corrupted Ardour projects?
[00:18] <david__> (It's not going well)
[00:21] <holstein> david__: sure
[00:21] <holstein> the audio should just be there
[00:21] <holstein> the fles
[00:21] <holstein> files*
[00:21] <holstein> otherwise, ask around #ardour
[00:22] <david__> Okay I'm looking through the files (It looks hopeful)
[00:22] <david__> But I can't hear them in Audacious
[00:23] <david__> (The meter bars are jumping)
[00:23] <holstein> i have no idea how your sound is set up
[00:23] <holstein> try a player you are familiar with
[00:23] <holstein> install audacity and import
[00:24] <holstein> ues VLC
[00:24] <holstein> use*
[00:24] <david__> Sound was working with Rosegarden and MIDI keyboard
[00:24] <holstein> david__: cool
[00:24] <holstein> dont live in the past though
[00:24] <holstein> you'll need to actually troubleshoot whats going on there
[00:24] <holstein> my first suggestion is to try anther player
[00:24] <david__> I would need to install all the programs you mentioned
[00:24] <holstein> VLC
[00:25] <holstein> sudo apt-get install vlc
[00:27] <david__> I installed VLC
[00:27] <david__> Same issue with sound
[00:27] <david__> (no sound)
[00:31] <david__> Thanks for your help, got to go eat.
[01:33] <david__> Is there a troubleshooting guide to get audio playback on Ubuntu Studio?
[01:33] <david__> I'm not seeing anything on
[01:33] <david__> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuStudio
[01:33] <david__> Ardour playback works, but not VLC or Audacious
[01:34] <holstein> david__: its complicated
[01:34] <holstein> theres a general audio one, and that works
[01:35] <holstein> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingSoundProblems
[01:35] <holstein> david__: could be that VLC/audacious are expecting JACK
[01:36] <david__> I've tried with and without JACK running
[01:36] <holstein> could be that when you started ardour, JACK stared, and VLC/Audacious are expecting pulse
[01:36] <holstein> could be that JACK is still running somewhere in the background
[01:37] <david__> I stopped and quit JACK but still the same
[01:37] <david__> (I used QJackCtrl
[01:40] <holstein> david__: it could still be running in the background
[01:40] <holstein> you can run top and look
[01:40] <holstein> you can restart to be sure
[01:40] <holstein> you can just try sudo killall jackd
[01:41] <holstein> david__: audacious has JACK output
[01:41] <holstein> you can check in it, and see
[01:41] <holstein> you should be able to tell it to use JACK while you have the file playing in ardour or whatever
[01:43] <david__> I just tried sudo killall jackd
[01:43] <david__> It said "jackd: no process found"
[01:44] <holstein> i think its called something else now
[01:44] <holstein> you can open a terminal and run top
[01:44] <david__> I've not used top before
[01:44] <holstein> http://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/show-all-running-processes-in-linux/
[01:44] <david__> I don't really undersand it
[01:44] <holstein> right
[01:45] <holstein> you can always just restart to be cure
[01:45] <holstein> sure*
[01:45] <holstein> then, JACK is not running
[01:45] <holstein> you can start simple
[01:45] <holstein> start with audacity
[01:45] <holstein> start with VLC
[01:45] <david__> will do.
[01:45] <david__> I'll download and install audacity first
[01:45] <holstein> sudo apt-get install audacity
[01:45] <holstein> its in the repos
[01:46] <holstein> check out #opensourcemusicians too
[01:55] <david__> holstein: After I restart it reloads all the programs I was using from before, so I'm not sure it is a good way of zapping JACK (If indeed it is still running)
[01:56] <holstein> it?
[01:56] <david__> I presume Xfce did it.
[01:56] <holstein> if you are using XFCE, and you choose to 'save session' at the end, thats what you get
[01:57] <holstein> the session saved and relaunched
[01:57] <holstein> that'll take some getting used to when i suggest restarting ;)
[01:57] <holstein> read that link though, and just see if jack is running or not
[01:57] <holstein> http://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/show-all-running-processes-in-linux/
[02:01] <david__> I actually had the "save session" unchecked the second time and but it still restarted everything, but no matter I am looking through the ps | less list
[02:03] <david__> It's a long list, but I don't see anything called JACK
[02:05] <holstein> i wouldnt expect to sort it out in one night
[02:05] <holstein> JACK is *not* trivial
[02:06] <holstein> also, there might be codecs you need to play an mp3 for example
[02:06] <david__> Just WAV
[02:07] <david__> (plus I assume VLC can play anything on Linux like it can on Windows )
[02:07] <holstein> david__: did i say assume nothing?
[02:07] <holstein> maybe that was someone else...
[02:07] <holstein> anwyays, whats the problem?
[02:07] <holstein> you cant get anything but ardour to play the .wavs from a broken session?
[02:08] <holstein> have you tried other audio?
[02:08] <holstein> something in the browser?
[02:08] <holstein> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1172535/groove.ogg should play in the browser
[02:10] <david__> No luck with the browser (firefox 8)
[02:10] <holstein> david__: what works?
[02:10] <holstein> and what doesnt?
[02:10] <holstein> now you have no audio at all?
[02:10] <david__> Ardour playback works
[02:11] <holstein> OK
[02:11] <holstein> thats JACK
[02:11] <holstein> perdiod
[02:11] <holstein> ardour uses JACK
[02:11] <holstein> so, JACK is running
[02:11] <holstein> and pulse is suspended then
[02:11] <david__> MIDI keyboard through Rosegarden
[02:11] <david__> That was before I restarted
[02:11] <holstein> so, *nothing* will play except in JACK right now
[02:11] <holstein> david__: ?
[02:11] <holstein> what about now?
[02:11] <holstein> right now
[02:11] <holstein> this minute
[02:11] <david__> Sorry
[02:12] <david__> Let me try ardour again
[02:12] <david__> (Is that what I should do?)
[02:12] <holstein> david__: sounds like a plan
[02:15] <david__> Ardour (without starting JACK first) does not playback
[02:15] <david__> But it does record
[02:16] <david__> Audacity same thing (records, but no playback)
[02:16] <holstein> i would go as far as suggesting to you to make a new user account, log in there, *dont* start JACK, and mess with the audio
[02:16] <holstein> just normal stuff
[02:16] <holstein> playing files
[02:16] <holstein> make sure the sound works at all
[02:18] <david__> I'll try, see you on the other side :)
[02:24] <guest-UGFWFC> holstein this is is david__ again
[02:24] <guest-UGFWFC> no luck with the new accound
[02:24] <guest-UGFWFC> *account
[02:24] <holstein> in what way?
[02:24] <holstein> no sound?
[02:24] <guest-UGFWFC> no sound
[02:24] <holstein> maybe you have no sound
[02:24] <holstein> maybe you have something muted
[02:24] <holstein> maybe its something in alsamixer that JACK bypasses
[02:26] <guest-UGFWFC> The system volume is max and the VLC volume is 100%
[02:26] <guest-UGFWFC> How do I view the alsamixer?
[02:26] <holstein> guest-UGFWFC: also, install pavucontrol
[02:26] <holstein> i find it helpful
[02:26] <holstein> guest-UGFWFC: you can open a terminal, and run..
[02:27] <holstein> alsamixer
[02:27] <holstein> and/or
[02:27] <holstein> sudo apt-get install pavucontrol
[02:29] <guest-UGFWFC> It looks like I can't sudo from this user account
[02:29] <holstein> guest-UGFWFC: control+alt+F7 will get you back where you are
[02:29] <guest-UGFWFC> AlsaMixer shows Master 100, Headphon 100, Speaker 71
[02:29] <holstein> you can do control+alt+F1
[02:29] <holstein> and you can sudo install, or sudo add yourself to the sudoers
[02:30] <holstein> OR, you can just go back, since we kind of know what it is now
[02:30] <holstein> guest-UGFWFC: dont trust any of those labels
[02:30] <holstein> i would go back to the other account
[02:30] <holstein> install pavucontrol
[02:30] <holstein> and see if you can sort it out from there
[02:42] <david__> Is there an UbuntuStudio equivalent to: "Go to System > Preferences > Sound ("Multimedia Systems Selector" in earlier editions of Ubuntu)
[02:43] <david__> (I'm working through https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingSoundProblems )
[02:45] <david__> @holstein: sorry I pressed Ctrl+Alt+F1 and wasn't able to get back to the desktop, so I had to switch the computer off and start over
[02:57] <holstein> david__: its the same
[02:57] <holstein> its just not gnome2 anymore
[02:57] <holstein> david__: control+alt+F7 returns
[02:57] <holstein> you can sudo reboot from there if needed
[02:57] <holstein> try install pavucontrol
[02:58] <holstein> that is similar to multimedia system selector
[03:03] <david__> I ran pavucontrol (turns out it was already installed)
[03:03] <david__> Everything is at 100%
[03:04] <holstein> ok
[03:04] <holstein> david__: so, open a terminal
[03:04] <holstein> run this
[03:04] <holstein> aplay -l
[03:05] <holstein> when you see output about your card, then you know you *should* be getting sound
[03:05] <holstein> if you dont, then, your card is not being recognized by alsa or something trickier
[03:05] <holstein> if you see if listed there as a playback option, then you know its something fiddly like what i am talking about
[03:05] <david__> Yes it lists information
[03:05] <holstein> david__: you can also just install main normal ubuntu
[03:06] <holstein> if that is what you are comfortable with
[03:06] <holstein> ubuntu = ubuntustudio = xubuntu etc...
[03:06] <holstein> there are just some pre-configured packages that you might be more used to in normal buntu
[03:06] <david__> I was using Ubuntu last week but I broke it (ardour stopped working on Ubuntu main)
[03:07] <holstein> david__: OK
[03:07] <holstein> that sounds related to me, no?
[03:07] <holstein> maybe your sound card is dying?
[03:07] <david__> gosh, I hope not
[03:07] <david__> Windows is fine
[03:07] <holstein> either way, i personally would disable it in the bios and get something more appropriate
[03:07] <holstein> http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/UCA202.aspx
[03:08] <holstein> ^^ thats like 20 bucks US
[03:08] <holstein> less hassle
[03:08] <holstein> better latency
[03:08] <holstein> cleaner signal
[03:08] <holstein> anyways...
[03:08] <holstein> that all sound related to me.. maybe its something with the latest kernel and your hardware
[03:08] <holstein> david__: have you checked for, and applied all upgrades?
[03:09] <david__> Yes, I applied all updates
[03:09] <holstein> david__: im not kicking you out of here, but...
[03:09] <david__> does the "U-control" support MIDI?
[03:09] <holstein> you can also try #ubuntu, #ubuntu-beginners
[03:09] <holstein> #xubuntu
[03:09] <david__> understood
[03:09] <holstein> #opensourcemusicians
[03:09] <holstein> this is really *not* ubuntustudio specific
[03:09] <holstein> you can cast a wider net in the #xubuntu pool
[03:10] <holstein> or general buntu channels
[03:10] <david__> Except I'm using a fresh install of UbuntuStudio
[03:10] <holstein> but, if i want an audio rig, i *never* use the internal card
[03:10] <holstein> david__: yeay
[03:10] <holstein> with upgrades applied
[03:10] <holstein> ubuntustudio = ubuntu
[03:10] <holstein> same kernel
[03:10] <holstein> same alsa versions
[03:10] <holstein> same pulse
[03:10] <holstein> if you applied an upgrade that broke soething ubuntu main ubuntu
[03:11] <holstein> that same thing will happen with ubuntustudio
[03:11] <holstein> or ubuntu
[03:11] <holstein> or xubuntu
[03:11] <holstein> whatever...
[03:12] <david__> Sound worked on Ubuntu main just Ardour was broken
[03:12] <david__> (after a few days)
[03:12] <david__> use)
[03:13] <holstein> yeah, and that makes no sense
[03:13] <holstein> you use JACK for a few days, and break it?
[03:13] <holstein> how?
[03:13] <holstein> what did you do?
[03:13] <holstein> why did you leave it?
[03:14] <holstein> whatever is going on, you have some trouble shooting to do
[03:18] <david__> It stopped working during normal use (switching between Rosegarden and Ardour). After troubleshooting for a while I hoped a fresh install would help, but I ended up with different problems.
[03:18] <holstein> yup
[03:18] <holstein> its a drag
[03:18] <holstein> david__: i think you should get the LTS
[04:01] <dbolton> holstein: I was able to get Ardour working on the regular Ubuntu (it was still installed on a separate partition)
[04:02] <dbolton> It was some corrupt Ardour files causing a problem