[07:54] good morning [08:58] good morning [09:00] Morning yaili. How was the move? :) [09:01] nigelb: good, thanks [09:02] :) [09:14] Good morning. [11:39] hey mainerror [11:40] MrChrisDruif: Yes === oreneeshy_ is now known as oreneeshy === MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch === MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow === oreneeshy_ is now known as oreneeshy === ckpringle_ is now known as ckpringle === oreneeshy_ is now known as oreneeshy [16:59] meeting coming up in a few minutes... [16:59] I'll try to attend it with my mobile [17:02] * MrChrisDruif is semi present [17:04] greetings all [17:05] #startmeeting [17:05] Meeting started Wed Dec 7 17:05:18 2011 UTC. The chair is wendar. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlanBell/mootbot. [17:05] Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired [17:05] o/ [17:06] I've started collecting introductions, so we all know who eachother are [17:06] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesignTeam/Introductions [17:06] anyone new this week, like to say hi and let us know what you're interested in? [17:08] Hi, I'm Blake Winton, the UX lead for Thunderbird. I don't really have a lot to say here, so I'll mostly be lurking. ;) [17:08] welcome, bwinton :) [17:09] everyone, feel free to edit the introduction I pasted in for you (straight from earlier meetings) [17:09] or, add one if I missed you [17:09] [TOPIC] current projects [17:10] The two main things we're working on at the moment are a quick design review of the 4digits game, and more generally on design tools. [17:10] (tools/worklflows) [17:11] Any updates on the tools front over the past week? [17:13] What I'd like to do today is more of a practical working session, that actually involves both projects. [17:14] Specifically, the next step on 4digits is to start taking screenshots, marking them up, and figuring out what we want to improve. [17:14] But, we're struggling a bit with tools. [17:15] One suggestion is inkscape, but it's hard for multiple people to collaborate over an inkscape doc. [17:15] A bunch of people have been trying out different tools in the past few weeks. [17:16] Do you have some suggestions? [17:17] AlanBell: could Pencil help here? Or, the same collaboration limitations? [17:19] o/ just saying "hi" === MrBadWiki is now known as DrDruif [17:21] hi DrDruif, welcome [17:21] Thanks [17:21] would you like to introduce yourself? [17:22] I'm on a mobile with only touchscreen input, so I'll keep it short [17:23] My normal IRC name is MrChrisDruif, I've joined ubuntu beginners about a year ago and more recently I've become active again with ubuntu tv and tablet [17:24] AlanBell already knows me as well as a few others [17:25] I've got no history in graphics or design, but I'd like to learn about it. [17:25] That's it for now =) [17:25] very cool, glad you could join :) [17:26] * DrDruif celebrates the joys of modern technology =) [17:27] AlanBell: I'm thinking we're going to end up using google docs for now. [17:28] Hello! [17:28] For text files? (I've missed a part of the meeting) [17:28] Hi Omega [17:29] I'm Omega, I've been using Ubuntu for a while, I've no background in graphics nor design either! What I am interested in is the thought that goes after design :) [17:29] Etherpad also works pretty well for text files and multi person editing [17:29] s/after/behind [17:30] You can even see who changed what [17:30] DrDruif: for images, particularly for marking up screenshots of an app to highlight areas for design improvements [17:30] Alright [17:30] DrDruif: Etherpad for images would be awesome :) [17:31] doctormon was working on some ideas for that [17:32] Indeed, but if everyone just wished it would be available/useable in etherpad, then nobody will do it. The devs of etherpad should know about it [17:33] Good to hear about doctormon is doing something about it =) [17:33] the devs of etherpad work for Google now, doing something else. Maybe the Etherpad Lite folks though [17:35] And the code from google wave? Is that any useable? [17:35] mhall119: that's true, doctormon mentioned it last week (was looking for a link), I'll check in with him and see if it's usable yet [17:35] mhall119: it may be a "next project we can use this" thing [17:36] DrDruif: was that code ever open sourced? [17:37] It's free to download, but only for a limited time. They've abandoned the project [17:37] And they'll want to remove it from their servers [17:39] I didn't party any notice to it, because it was to no use for me (not a dev as well) [17:39] Party is pay [17:39] Did I miss the meeting? [17:40] And I hope it's still available [17:40] Still going mainerror [17:40] Great. [17:41] I'll look it up when I'm back home if there is any interest [17:41] DrDruif: interesting, did they release the code with the idea that someone else might pick it up and maintain it? [17:42] I'd have to look it up [17:42] DrDruif: oooh, look http://incubator.apache.org/wave/ [17:43] So, they handed it over to Apache [17:43] If you say so, I'd have to look it up [17:44] I just ran across it from http://code.google.com/apis/wave/ [17:44] mainerror: so, we're talking about what tools to use for 4digits === Ronnie2 is now known as Ronnie [17:45] Yup. Just read the transcript. [17:46] I'm still thinking we're going to end up on google docs for now, so we're not blocking the tiny project on tools. [17:46] Agreed [17:46] +1 [17:47] I'd be happier with open tools, but we're working on those at the same time, and will have them for later projects. [17:47] +1 [17:48] We can use the Drawing function. [17:49] mainerror: ah, trying it out now... [17:49] yeah, looks workable [17:49] https://docs.google.com/drawings/d/1rSPWpmu6L6APUUzsxL2OySNmCbabF3QXRVOnZTNf-s4/edit [17:49] This is an example. [17:50] People can now join my session with this link and participate. [17:51] At least I hope they can. [17:51] Can anyone confirm it? [17:52] Maybe later [17:53] Oh yea, to edit it you have to be logged in with the current settings. [17:54] https://docs.google.com/document/d/1fkV98vNooG8y8BlAeZ5WAL-5tT-57FpC2MD8qI0tS94/edit?hl=en_US [17:54] Now everyone can edit it. [17:54] yah, zigactly, lovely [17:55] =) [17:55] and, the drawings can be tied together in a text document, so you can walk through the app in sections [17:55] with some description between [17:56] * DrDruif is on sake [17:56] So until we have our own tool I think this is a good option. [17:57] Alright. What is next on the agenda? [17:58] yup, I'm getting real-time updates as we edit [17:59] mainerror: someone mentioned this week that they were interested in participating, but weren't sure what tasks were on offer [18:00] I think it'd be useful to start collecting together "ways you can get involved in design with Ubuntu" [18:01] we have the two projects, a little game, and moving forward tools [18:01] but, that's just what's new [18:02] there's icons for projects, teams, and websites [18:02] there's the tv/tablet/phone projects [18:02] and lots of other pieces volunteer designers have already been doing [18:03] That's where I'm focusing attention [18:04] Tv and phone that is [18:04] For that problem I would like to propose the use of https://trello.com/ [18:05] The Community team is trying it out as well. [18:05] Trello? [18:05] looks cool, is it open source? [18:06] Uhm, I'm not quite sure if it is to be honest. [18:06] doesn't look like it, too bad [18:07] https://trello.com/board/community-team/4e6febfb247e35000000aab1 [18:07] but, again, use what you've got, build something better :) [18:07] This is the community team trello board. [18:08] The problem is that right now I couldn't tell what someone could work on. [18:09] We need something where people always know whats going on. [18:09] you can't tell from the community team's trello board? [18:09] or, you can't tell from the design side, and it's easier with the trello board? [18:09] I'm talking about us right now. [18:09] You can tell from the community trello board. [18:09] agreed, right now it's tough to find a design task to pick up [18:10] I'd be happy to try out trello [18:10] I mean we could also make use of the harvest site. [18:10] Was it called like that? I'm not sure. [18:10] you mean http://harvest.ubuntu.com/? [18:11] Yup, that's the site. [18:11] like, add a "design" tab at http://harvest.ubuntu.com/opportunities/ [18:12] Yea, that'd be an option I guess. [18:12] looks like it's organized by package [18:12] we have more freeflowing tasks [18:12] Opportunities? I'm interested [18:14] DrDruif: it's a site that helps people find bugs to work on [18:14] Well the harvest site should be open source I guess. We could investigate on that and find out if we could use it for us. Self-hosted and modified. [18:14] mainerror: yes, that's a good tool to follow up on [18:14] also, ubuntu brainstorm [18:15] Indeed although UB would need a heavy redesign if you ask me. Not that it'd stop us from using but still. [18:16] contributing design work to existing tools is certainly in scope for the group [18:16] it's a collaborative thing [18:16] I'm dining of. I'm at a dinner (japanese) [18:17] brainstorm is more "post a design problem, and post alternative solutions, then get review and feedback on the solutions" [18:17] but, it's very text oriented at the moment [18:17] still, potential, down the road [18:18] jono (if you're listening): have you been using trello? any thoughts on how well it works? [18:19] Oh I actually meant a redesign of its UI. Get rid of some clutter, get it in line with the official Ubuntu webdesign guidelines. [18:20] that's in scope too, if the maintainers are amenable to collaborating on it [18:20] * mainerror nods [18:20] I know nuthinking has been trying to get in touch with the brainstorm maintainers [18:21] (to volunteer some design time) [18:21] wendar: I am leaving the office [18:21] wendar: but [18:21] wendar: I can tell you that while there should be resources to update its look and feel [18:22] wendar: there aren't resources to improve its functionalities [18:22] wendar: do you need any other information before I leave? :) [18:22] Well I'd be happy with the look and feel improvements already. [18:22] nuthinking: that's great, thanks! [18:22] ok, I go home then! ;) Bye everyone! [18:23] Bye. [18:23] yeah, the functionality is useful now [18:23] wendar, I haven't used it much, but Jorge has :-) [18:23] he seems to like it [18:23] Oh yea, if you guys want an invite in the Ubuntu Design Trello team, please send me your email address. [18:25] mainerror: I was just going to ask if you'd created one already :) [18:25] mainerror: sure, I'll join and try it out [18:27] Any other topics for this week? [18:27] Not from my part. [18:27] I just wanted to tell you about Trello. :) [18:28] :) [18:28] cool, thanks everybody! [18:28] #endmeeting [18:28] Meeting ended Wed Dec 7 18:28:23 2011 UTC. [18:28] Minutes: http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-design/2011/ubuntu-design.2011-12-07-17.05.moin.txt [18:29] Oh yea. The screenshot in the Google Drawing doc is for this bug report. [18:29] 891804 [18:29] bug 891804 [18:29] Launchpad bug 891804 in software-center (Ubuntu) "Software Center wastes space" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/891804 [21:31] Hi everyone [21:32] wendar, did [21:32] Hello. [21:33] I miss much after I left? [21:33] hi [21:33] mainerror, hi [21:33] MrChrisDruif: nope [21:33] we talked a bit more about brainstorm [21:34] Brainstorm.ubuntu.com ? [21:34] yup, mainly just about "updating" the design to go with the other ubuntu sites [21:35] Alright [21:35] and jasox and I are going to start collecting screenshots of 4digits [21:35] Did we go into the theme of moinmoin on wiki and help? [21:35] nope, didn't go into that [21:36] did you have a question/idea there? [21:36] What is 4digits actually? ^_^ [21:36] I didn't check the website tbh [21:36] I'll check it later [21:37] Well, two things actually [21:39] The new theme recently added lines above every header, which can be added manually. I think it's *not* a god idea to force it with every header [21:40] And when is ubuntu planning on changing the theme on help? [21:41] I think the new theme is ready for prime time on help [21:46] ? [21:48] I'll be back in a bit. Mobile internet probably isn't responding and need to ride my bike [21:48] You mean the login header? [22:04] Good evening [22:34] Was every message I send received here? [22:34] About my ideas about the moinmoin theme? [22:35] MrChrisDruif: yes [22:36] Alright, I wasn't getting any response, but I'm blaming that on my mobile/carrier network [22:36] I think there just wasn't anybody around to respond [22:37] wendar was around at the time I think [22:37] Btw, I'm finally home =) [22:38] http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/12/07/%23ubuntu-design.html#t21:35 [22:40] Haha, mainerror responded just after I left =) [22:42] mainerror; no I didn't mean the login header (single sign-on thing you meant right?) I'm talking about the actually wiki pages. You can have different "headers" or what their name might be [22:42] That are those == Title 2 == things etc... [22:54] ?? [22:57] Nobody?