[00:35] <Riddell> shall I put the oneiric packages of 4.7.90 in the beta PPA?
[00:35] <Riddell> it means people wanting calligra also need 4.7.90
[00:50] <apachelogger> Riddell: well, beta is beta ;)
[00:53] <Riddell> so it is
[01:01] <Riddell> hmm, copied oxygen-icons but not appeared yet
[01:02] <Riddell> oh, delayed copied
[01:22] <ybit> shadeslayer: sent
[01:22] <ybit> Now to start working on some ideas I have for KDE
[01:28] <ybit> topic
[01:30] <ybit> IIRC, kubuntu has some type of build system for developers, hmm...
[01:30] <ybit> What determines which apps are in the nightly trunk?
[01:30] <ybit> How do you decide something should be part of kubuntu btw..
[01:30] <ybit> E.g. first things first, I want to improve kickoff just a bit
[01:34] <ybit> Ohai, btw, I'm Heath Matlock, from Florence, AL, 26 years old, study Spanish, at school for an electronics A.Sc degree, and soon to be B.Sc in CS/Math
[01:35] <ybit> I'm terrible at programming, but you have to start somewhere, I'm comfortable with Python, functional programming concepts from Haskell (haven't written enough Haskell code to feel proficient), and er... that's about it 
[01:36] <ybit> I've also been using linux since like Red Hat 6 or 7
[01:36] <ybit> Went through about 50+ gentoo stage 2 installs (went through stage 1 once and never cared to do it again)
[01:37] <ybit> So hi
[03:01] <ybit> nadie, nada?
[03:33] <ScottK> ybit: It's not the best time of the day.
[03:34] <ScottK> ybit: Most of the developers are on European time, so you've got to get here earlier.
[03:57] <valorie> ybit: you might want to write to kubuntu-devel
[03:58] <valorie> that gets everybody, not just us channel denizens
[05:06] <ScottK> Riddell: FYI, akonadi has branched in preparation for a new major release: https://projects.kde.org/projects/kdesupport/akonadi/repository/show?rev=1.7
[05:06] <ScottK> This is the one I expect you'll need for kdepim 4.8.
[13:18] <ScottK> Who's our current web site guru?
[13:30] <jussi> is it not ryanakca ?
[13:31] <ScottK> He's doing the maintenance stuff, but I'm not sure about the design work.
[13:31] <ScottK> I guess I should have been more specific.
[13:56] <ryanakca> ScottK, jussi: Aye, I've moved away from design work. I think DarkwingDuck does that now. Or at least, he was planning on porting our wiki theme to Drupal a few months ago.
[14:00] <ScottK> Darkwing: ^^^?
[14:00] <ScottK> Need someone to reply to the thread on kubuntu-devel
[14:02]  * ryanakca looks
[14:09] <ryanakca> ScottK: The gist of it is that anybody who wants to create a Drupal theme is free to do so, and that so long as someone (KCC?) sings off on it, it's just a matter of prodding the sysadmins to install it.
[14:10] <ryanakca> s/sing/sign/; although I'd like to see the KCC sing ;)
[14:10] <kubotu> ryanakca meant: "ScottK: The gist of it is that anybody who wants to create a Drupal theme is free to do so, and that so long as someone (KCC?) signs off on it, it's just a matter of prodding the sysadmins to install it."
[14:10] <ScottK> ryanakca: Something like that, but someone needs to explain that these people are welcome to contribute and how to communicate with the relevant people, etc.
[14:11] <ryanakca> ScottK: Alright, I'll do that when I get back from my dentist appointment.
[14:11] <ScottK> Thanks.
[14:11] <ryanakca> Darkwing: Were you still planning on porting the wiki theme to Drupal?
[15:16] <cnd> ScottK, I'm working on bringing in the upstream XI multitouch implementation
[15:16] <ScottK> XI?
[15:16] <cnd> it will break qt because it's different from what we had in our prototype implementation so far
[15:16] <cnd> X Input
[15:17] <ScottK> Let's not do that please.
[15:17] <cnd> I think the easiest thing would be to comment out the patch for multitouch for right now
[15:17] <cnd> and then I will rewrite the patch
[15:17] <ScottK> How does this relate to what's in Qt 4.8?
[15:17] <cnd> it doesn't?
[15:18] <ScottK> Weren't you working with Qt upstream on the multi-touch stuff?
[15:18] <cnd> yes, but it was all blocked on getting upstream X Input merged into X.org
[15:18] <cnd> that's what is happening now
[15:18] <ScottK> I see.
[15:19] <ScottK> So it'll be in Qt5 then.
[15:19] <cnd> but there were changes in the protocol and implementation
[15:19] <cnd> I'd like it to be in qt asap
[15:19] <cnd> likely whenever their next release is
[15:19] <ScottK> Qt 4.8 is released.
[15:19] <cnd> yeah
[15:19] <ScottK> It's the last Qt4.x.
[15:20] <ScottK> So Qt5 is your next chance, but they are coming up on an API freeze soon.
[15:20] <cnd> this doesn't modify API or ABI
[15:20] <ScottK> OK.
[15:20] <cnd> the public interfaces are all there
[15:20] <ScottK> If you wanted to, this would be your chance.
[15:20] <cnd> it's just hooking up plumbing underneath
[15:20] <cnd> yeah
[15:20] <cnd> the key right now for me is ubuntu
[15:20] <cnd> I need to get the latest XI support in
[15:21] <cnd> but it will break qt unless the patch that's currently there is commented out
[15:21] <ScottK> Sure, just don't want to miss a one time opporitunity to break ABI on Qt if it's relevant.
[15:21] <ScottK> How long to get a revised patch?
[15:21] <cnd> middle to end of january
[15:21] <cnd> due to holidays and such
[15:22] <ScottK> My understanding is that the goal this cycle was not to have regressions during development.
[15:22] <cnd> there's no way around this feature regression for the time being
[15:22] <cnd> unless you want to cause a chain of dependencies being held back for quite a while
[15:23] <ScottK> Also, wouldn't it make more sense to land a major change like the new XI right after the holidays than before?
[15:23] <cnd> a chain that we want to get into ubuntu and ensure is stable
[15:23] <cnd> we're not landing it before, but likely right after
[15:23] <ScottK> OK
[15:24] <cnd> would you like me to propose a merge request to comment out the patch?
[15:24] <ScottK> No.  That'd be a trivial change.
[15:25] <ScottK> I think you should write to ubuntu-devel about the plan for the transition (including this) so that it's clear everyone is aware of it.
[15:25] <cnd> sure
[15:26] <ScottK> If there's consensus this is the right way to go, then making the change is a detail.
[16:24] <Riddell> hi
[16:25] <ScottK> Hello Riddell
[16:26] <ScottK> I sponsored kde4libs and meta-kde while you were gone since doko was complaining.
[16:28] <Riddell> ah thanks ScottK, internet got cut off at just the wrong time last night
[16:29] <_Groo_> hi/2 
[16:30] <_Groo_> little problem in oneiric 4.7.90, ninja ppa
[16:30] <_Groo_> The following packages have unmet dependencies:   plasma-netbook: Depends: libkactivities-bin (>= 4:4.7.90-0ubuntu1) but 4:4.7.90-0ubuntu1~oneiric1~ppa3 is installed.   plasma-desktop: Depends: libkactivities-bin (>= 4:4.7.90-0ubuntu1) but 4:4.7.90-0ubuntu1~oneiric1~ppa3 is installed.
[16:30] <_Groo_> which breaks a lot of stuff :D
[16:32] <Riddell> _Groo_: ah fooey
[16:32] <_Groo_> Riddell: yeah, :D
[16:32] <_Groo_> Riddell: needs to change the control file, or bump the aktivities version
[16:32] <Riddell> simple control file change
[16:33] <_Groo_> Riddell: yeah yeah but it needs a recompile right? you cant change the control file of a built package, correct?
[16:33] <_Groo_> Riddell: btw the new pnm works fine now
[16:33] <_Groo_> good job :)
[16:38] <Riddell> _Groo_: yes
[16:40] <_Groo_> Riddell: k
[17:25] <Riddell> 4.7.90 is all compiling, just arm being slow I think
[17:27] <ScottK> Yep
[17:28] <ScottK> Also the put all the armhf buildd's on manual earlier today which killed the armhf kde4libs build and it had to be restarted.
[17:28] <ScottK> That's not going to help.
[17:28] <Riddell> hmm but calligra doesn't work with new marble I think
[17:31] <Riddell> _Groo_'s fix for kde-workspce in beta ppa
[17:31] <Riddell> (not in ninjas)
[17:31] <Riddell> waiting on compile
[17:31] <Riddell> I think I'll move onto Amarok
[17:40] <_Groo_> Riddell: what fix?
[17:43] <Riddell> to install plasma-desktop
[17:48] <_Groo_> Riddell: oO im not making the fix, im at work, i cant dput from over here, i just warned you :D
[17:48] <_Groo_> Riddell: miss communication ^^
[17:49] <_Groo_> Riddell: ahh wait... you said its compiling in beta ppa is that it?
[17:49]  * _Groo_ is confused...
[17:50] <Riddell> yes
[17:50] <Riddell> I made the fix
[17:50] <Riddell> just waiting for it to compile
[17:53] <_Groo_> Riddell: will it be in ninjas?
[17:54] <Riddell> no in kubuntu-ppa/beta
[17:54] <_Groo_> Riddell: will you move it to ninjas? :P or i need to add that ppa too
[17:55] <_Groo_> Riddell: btw it would be nice to add gtk3-engines-oxygen to the builds
[17:55] <_Groo_> Riddell: my desktop is much more pretty that way :D
[17:55] <Riddell> yes I think that's on the precise todo
[17:56] <_Groo_> Riddell: did you guys fixed the bug that it wasnt creating the gtk3 manifest? 
[17:56] <_Groo_> the xml description file was missing...
[17:56] <_Groo_> last time i checked
[17:57] <_Groo_> so the theme wasnt being applied to the gtk3 themes
[17:59] <yofel> _Groo_: we don't have the gtk3 engine either, so that needs packaging first
[17:59] <_Groo_> yofel: i did my own package: gtk3-engines-oxygen                    20111005-oneiric~ppa1
[18:00] <yofel> as I have in neon - but it still needs manual since kcm_gtk doesn't set anything for gtk3
[18:00] <yofel> *manual setup
[18:00] <_Groo_> yofel: yep thats the bug
[18:01] <_Groo_> yofel: the stupid xml isnt created
[18:02] <_Groo_> yofel: took me some time to figure that one out
[18:02] <_Groo_> yofel: i usually blame apachelogger first, then the packager (me) and then the developer
[18:02]  * yofel just read oxygen-gtk3's README ^^
[18:04] <_Groo_> yofel: that was my last try :D if everything else fails RTFM
[18:05] <_Groo_> yofel: btw can you test one thing real quick?
[18:05] <_Groo_> yofel: make a new activitie and choose globe as the default desktop
[18:06] <_Groo_> yofel: then wait a few seconds or try to turn it around... it SHOULD crash plasma-desktop
[18:06] <_Groo_> that was a bug introduced in 4.7.x that i thought it was fixed in 4.8... i need confirmation...
[18:07] <yofel> hm, no globe here, where was that again?
[18:07] <ryanakca> Was the 11.10 release goal of porting the wiki theme to Drupal defered to 12.04, or has it been abandoned?
[18:09] <yofel> _Groo_: ah, found it - crashes as soon as I select globe and click apply
[18:09] <yofel> no backtrace possible though
[18:09] <_Groo_> yofel: its a nasty bug
[18:10] <_Groo_> yofel: im gonna check if theres a bug report, can you add a me too if i need to open a new one?
[18:13] <_Groo_> yofel: bug 274109
[18:14] <_Groo_> kde bug 274109
[18:14] <_Groo_> yofel: btw are you using dual monitor?
[18:14] <yofel> nope
[18:15] <_Groo_> yofel: k cause i do.. so its not in that code
[18:15] <_Groo_> yofel: can you add a me too pls?
[18:15] <Riddell> ryanakca: I suspect it's been abandoned
[18:16] <Riddell> ryanakca: the number of e-mails pointing out the website is out of date is increasing, I guess I'll keep writing nice polite replies saying the number of things that need to happen to change it
[18:17] <ryanakca> Riddell: *nod*, I'm writing a reply to the email on the ML at the moment
[18:17] <yofel> _Groo_: not without a backtrace at least, and drkonqi doesn't do a thing for some reason
[18:17] <Riddell> ryanakca: ta
[18:17] <ryanakca> Riddell: I'm willing to point that porting the theme is a TODO item that someone can volunteer for if they'd like
[18:17] <_Groo_> yofel: well it very easy to reproduce.. so let the devs crash their own desktops :D
[18:21] <_Groo_> yofel: just confirm the damn bug report! :D
[18:21] <yofel> uh, no?
[18:22] <yofel> I don't go around confirming random crash reports until I'm sure I'm getting the EXACT same crash
[18:22] <_Groo_> yofel: bug nazi!
[18:23] <yofel> I've been in the bugsquad too long :P
[18:23] <_Groo_> yofel: ahh so it was you who sent death threats to me!
[18:23] <yofel> lol
[18:23] <yofel> probably not ^^
[18:26] <Mamarok> no Amarok 2.5 packages available yet? At least there is no announcement
[18:26] <Mamarok> ditto for KDE 4.7.4 btw
[18:27] <ScottK> Mamarok: 4.7.4 is in the updates PPA.
[18:28] <ScottK> Need to make an announcement.
[18:28] <Mamarok> ScottK: I know, but you should announce it in the news
[18:28] <ScottK> Agreed.
[18:28] <Mamarok> and Amarok 2.5 is out :)
[18:28] <ScottK> Riddell's working on it.
[18:28] <cmagina> ls
[18:28] <Mamarok> nice, thanks :)
[18:28] <cmagina> heh, wrong window :)
[18:29] <Riddell> Mamarok: 45% done but then I need to do oneiric
[18:29] <Riddell> precise package isn't much good today, needs a MIR
[18:29] <Mamarok> it's Oneiric that we need most
[18:30] <Riddell> firing up the ec2 machine
[18:30] <Mamarok> I wonder: why did Kubuntu install the Nvidia drivers on my system if I don't have it, only an Intel graphic card?
[18:30] <Riddell> I think it does that for all installs
[18:31] <_Groo_> Mamarok: its called thinking ahead
[18:31] <Mamarok> very strange, why installing something that is not needed?
[18:31] <_Groo_> Mamarok: once you feel the pain of intel graphics youll go screaming for nvidia
[18:31] <Mamarok> _Groo_: then it should also install the Radeon drivers
[18:31] <_Groo_> Mamarok: believe me... you DONT want to go radeon...
[18:31] <Mamarok> _Groo_: I hate Nvidia with passion :)
[18:32] <_Groo_> Mamarok: i was the "happy" owner of a rs485...
[18:32] <Mamarok> I have two laptops, one with Intel only and one with dual Radeon/Intel, both work perfectly fine
[18:32] <_Groo_> Mamarok: ppl in the radeon channel remember me
[18:32] <_Groo_> Mamarok: they used to make fun i was the only active user in the entire world that still used that *hit
[18:32] <_Groo_> rs485 was designed by drunken ati monkeys
[18:33] <Mamarok> well, I dind't have as much problöems with my Radeon card than others had repeatedly with Nvidia
[18:34] <_Groo_> yofel: what video card? nvidia?
[18:34] <yofel> yes
[18:35] <yofel> and kubuntu-full will install the nvidia and ati drivers even if you have an intel card
[18:36] <Mamarok> yofel: how come it didn't install ati drivers for me?
[18:36] <_Groo_> yofel: desktop-effects are enabled?
[18:37] <_Groo_> yofel: globe doesnt crash lamarque desktop... go figures...
[18:40] <ScottK> Mamarok: Announced.
[18:40] <Mamarok> ScottK: great!
[18:41] <ScottK> Riddell: 4.7.3/4 announcement on kubuntu.org done.
[18:42] <yofel> _Groo_: I saw
[18:43] <yofel> Mamarok: no idea, it does recommend both fglrx and nvidia-current in oneiric (doesn't anymore in precise)
[18:45] <Riddell> oh groovy thanks ScottK, I would have got to it eventually but not soon enough I think
[18:50] <yofel> yay, the marble crash is thanks to nvidia - fun -.-
[19:06] <Darkwing> ryanakca, ScottK Yes. I have two family reunions this week and next. After that I'm back on full swing.
[19:10] <ryanakca> Darkwing: Mind if I forward some people interested in helping to you?
[19:10] <Darkwing> ryanakca: of course not. :)
[19:11] <ryanakca> Darkwing: Excellent, I'll do that ;)
[19:14] <_Groo_> Riddell: ping
[19:14] <Riddell> hi _Groo_ 
[19:14] <_Groo_> Riddell: workspace borked in the build
[19:14] <_Groo_> Riddell: :( so muhc time waiting and it failed!!! damn you LP!
[19:15] <Riddell> mm, so I see
[19:17] <Riddell> hmm, all installing here
[19:17] <_Groo_> Riddell: ?? 
[19:18] <Riddell> working out what's gone wrong
[19:18] <_Groo_> Riddell: btw how do i do to make armel packages? im interested in porting plasma live to the hp touchpad...
[19:20] <Riddell> _Groo_: launchpad doesn't do them so you'd need to have your own arm machine or ask ScottK if he'll give you access to one
[19:20] <_Groo_> Riddell: its the  version in libkactivities6 (= 4:4.7.90-0ubuntu1~oneiric1~ppa3)
[19:21] <_Groo_> Riddell: can i emulate arm at reasonable performance with my i7?
[19:22] <Riddell> I've no idea about emulating arm
[19:28] <Riddell> it's because I didn't copy kde4libs, dug
[19:28] <Riddell> dh
[19:28] <Riddell> blurg
[19:29] <Riddell> ok can retry kde-workspace soon
[19:29] <Riddell> gosh amarok is slow to compile on these ec2 machines
[19:31] <_Groo_> Riddell: i actually have a job interview tomorrow to work at brazil datacenter at amazon :) wish me luck :D
[19:31] <_Groo_> now i can destroy the world from the inside buahahahahah
[19:32] <_Groo_> hey mr groo whats that you are seeding into AEC? ahhh its a little script.. i call it, skynet
[19:47] <_Groo_> Riddell: are we there yet? are we there yet? are we there yet? :D
[19:55] <yofel> _Groo_: I use https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ARM/RootfsFromScratch for armel, it's rather slow though
[19:55] <yofel> as it uses qemu
[19:56] <_Groo_> yofel: yeah might not be the way to go :(
[19:57] <yofel> it's fine for my use cases, but with the system it's running on, building kdelibs takes about a day
[20:22] <EvilResistance> hi, i'm relaying something from #kubuntu to here, if you dont mind.  since its a question about what version(s) of Qt should/could be included in Precise
[20:22] <EvilResistance> assuming this is the right place (the MOTUs directed me this way)
 is qt 4.8 source compatible with 4.7?
 could kubuntu update to qt 4.8 now, and then do kde in january
[20:24] <debfx> EvilResistance: qt 4.8 is source and binary compatible
[20:24] <ScottK> We're planning on shipping 4.8.
[20:25] <EvilResistance> i see.  i guess i can point the guy who originally asked to you guys then, or just relay your statements to him.  :P
[20:25] <EvilResistance> (considering, of course, that I keep an eye on the precise repos somewhat obsessively... :P)
[20:26] <EvilResistance> (I kind of had that feeling :P)
[21:12] <ScottK> Riddell: I think 4.7.90 is fully built on i386 and amd64.
[22:43] <zorael> Is the beta ppa missing libkactivities-bin >= 4:4.7.90-0ubuntu1 (plasma-desktop dependency), or did I simply muck something up on my end?
[22:44] <zorael> The available libkactivities is *~oneiric1~ppa3 and as such doesn't fly
[22:46] <Riddell> I think it's ok now, let me check
[22:47] <Riddell> zorael: yes apt-get update and dist-upgrade and let us kno how it works fo ryou
[22:48] <zorael> Riddell: yeah, works now, thanks
[22:49] <Riddell> zorael: have you tried running the full desktop
[22:49] <Riddell> ?
[22:49] <zorael> Riddell: a careless dist-upgrade removed plasma-desktop, so I'm only now reinstalling it D:
[22:50] <zorael> no, crashes. I'm probably still running an old kded though
[22:50] <Riddell> can you log out and in?
[22:51] <zorael> sure, one moment
[22:52] <zorael> Riddell: plasma-desktop started as it should, no errors or crashes yet
[22:53] <yofel> Riddell: a test upgrade on oneiric gave:
[22:53] <yofel> Unpacking ktouch-data (from .../ktouch-data_4%3a4.7.90-0ubuntu1~ppa3~oneiric1_all.deb) ...
[22:53] <yofel> dpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/ktouch-data_4%3a4.7.90-0ubuntu1~ppa3~oneiric1_all.deb (--unpack):
[22:53] <yofel>  trying to overwrite '/usr/share/icons/hicolor/scalable/apps/ktouch.svgz', which is also in package ktouch 4:4.7.3-0ubuntu0.1
[22:55] <yofel> installs fine otherwise now
[22:56] <Riddell> zorael: groovy
[22:56] <Riddell> yofel: ack thanks
[23:50] <Riddell> well amarok will take a while to compile in https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-ppa/+archive/backports/
[23:50] <Riddell> and then it needs testing