[03:37] Debate between Christianity and Islam :(Is the Bible God's Word?) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IlA22NNFlDw - E-mail:M4.Guest@Gmail.com [05:11] =/ [05:27] seems to have done it to all the channels === doko_ is now known as doko === Alcine is now known as jackyalcine === jackyalcine is now known as jalcine === huats_ is now known as huats === JanC_ is now known as JanC === elopio_ is now known as elopio === yofel_ is now known as yofel === niko is now known as nik0 === nik0 is now known as niko === udienz_ is now known as udienz [19:03] so...no dmb meeting then? [19:04] One moment. [19:05] bdrung, Laney, micahg, tumbleweed: ping [19:06] pong [19:06] * micahg is here [19:06] o/ [19:06] hai [19:06] (somewhat) [19:06] Perfect. Looks like we have quorum. [19:06] #startmeeting [19:06] Meeting started Mon Jan 2 19:06:58 2012 UTC. The chair is cody-somerville. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlanBell/mootbot. [19:06] Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired [19:07] #topic Review of previous action items === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Review of previous action items [19:07] #subtopic cody-somerville to write some documentation on how to endorse someone [19:08] I have a draft prepared and will be sending it to DMB mailing list today. [19:08] #topic stgraber to create desktop-extra set === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: stgraber to create desktop-extra set [19:08] stgraber is absent, will carry action item [19:09] #topic bdrung to talk to the TB about harmonising DMB members' expiration dates for easier restaffing === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: bdrung to talk to the TB about harmonising DMB members' expiration dates for easier restaffing [19:09] bdrung, you have the floor :) [19:10] sorry, i haven't asked the TB yet [19:11] Acked. Action carried. [19:12] #topic MOTU Applications: Mahyuddin Susanto === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: MOTU Applications: Mahyuddin Susanto [19:12] #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MahyuddinSusanto/MOTUApplication [19:12] udienz, Hello. Could you please indicate you're present by introducing yourself and your application? [19:12] Sure [19:13] My name is Mahyuddin Susanto, i'm 26 Indonesian. [19:13] I have been contributing to universe for almost a year, i started contributing to Ubuntu when binutils-gold transitions. [19:13] I'm doing sync, merge, SRU in Ubuntu, perhaps over 100 packages have been uploaded. [19:13] In Debian, i stated at least 2 years but for packaging i have been started for a year. I'm Debian Maintainer and my QA page is http://qa.debian.org/developer.php?login=udienz@ubuntu.com&comaint=yes. I have migrating proftpd/cacti/pdnsd from cdbs (pdnsd), dpatch (proftpd/cacti) to quilt. I'm not always use quilt but quilt is my best chioce for patching system. [19:14] I'm also packaging from strach in Ubuntu, named gkamus and aspell-id. All my packages in Debian (with co-maintained) easily sync from Debian. [19:14] .enough [19:15] why did you choose to package those things directly in Ubuntu? [19:16] Laney, it just technical problem. I've already RFS-ing both packages but i'm not got sponsorship in debian [19:19] ok [19:19] (stupid connection keeps hanging) [19:20] udienz: are you aware of the various freezes and what is appropriate to be uploaded during those times? [19:21] micahg, yes i aware, during FF i cannot import packages except those packages fixing bugs or really important [19:22] udienz, How do you determine if its really important or not? [19:22] and who can you ask if unsure? [19:22] cody-somerville, depend on bug importance, effecting many users, security bug, ftbfs [19:23] Laney, if im unsure i'll ask in #ubuntu-motu first [19:23] or #ubuntu-devel [19:24] udienz: so, after feature freeze if a lot of users were requesting a new version of a program with new features, you'd upload it? [19:25] micahg, i;m not really sure, but if new upstream version fixing many important bug, i'll ask to other dev first rather than direct upload [19:26] *i'm not sure [19:26] udienz: are you subscribed to ubuntu-devel-announce? [19:27] udienz, What role does the release team play and how can they help you? [19:27] tumbleweed, yes, also #ubuntu-discuss, #ubuntu-motu [19:27] udienz: he meant the mailing list, not irc channel [19:28] cody-somerville, during FF release team will five input wether package accepted or not [19:28] bdrung, sorry i mean list [19:29] s/ubuntu-discuss/devel-discuss [19:30] udienz: are you referring to Feature Freeze or Final Freeze when you say FF [19:31] udienz, With your recent merge of laptop-mode-tools, could you explain why you decided to do a merge instead of a sync (maybe after trying to push the change upstream?): https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/laptop-mode-tools/1.60-1ubuntu1 [19:32] micahg, Feature Freeze in first and Final Freeze while i answered cody-somerville. Sorry a little panic at here [19:32] udienz, No need to panic. :) [19:33] cody-somerville, i forget about last change :( [19:34] udienz, No problem. Good example of why its not a bad idea to note such reasons in the changelog - to make it easier to remember. [19:35] Do any other members have questions before we proceed to vote? [19:35] one quick one [19:36] jdstrand's concerns were mostly about minor details such as checking the changelog and upload destination [19:36] which file is a good one to quickly skim over before uploading? [19:37] tumbleweed, sorry. what is skim? [19:38] to read quickly, to check for mistakes [19:39] tumbleweed, i think patch files and changelog (by read at debdiff) [19:39] yes, that's a good idea, when it's short enough to be readable [19:39] I also suggest looking at the .changes file, I sometimes notice that I forgot to close bugs, when I look at that [19:40] right, it lists as one of the lines in the .changes file all the bugs closed by the upload [19:40] udienz: have you ever file for a freeze exception and when do you think it's appropriate to do so? [19:41] *filed [19:42] micahg, i'm not remember but i haven't filed freeze exceptions. I think when the changes solved important bug. Like my statement before [19:43] udienz: have you read the documentation regarding freeze exceptions? [19:44] yes === davidcalle_ is now known as davidcalle [19:47] #vote MOTU Applications: Mahyuddin Susanto [19:47] Please vote on: MOTU Applications: Mahyuddin Susanto [19:47] Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me) [19:49] bdrung is afk at the moment but has voted +1 [19:49] +1 [ and please ask the release team if you need any guidance during freezes ] [19:49] +1 [ and please ask the release team if you need any guidance during freezes ] received from tumbleweed [19:49] +1 [19:49] +1 received from cody-somerville [19:50] +1 [19:50] +1 received from Laney [19:51] +0 good work overall, but I'm a little concerned over freezes still (part of the difference between uploading to Ubuntu rather than Debian is knowing what's appropriate when as it comes up a lot more often) [19:51] +0 good work overall, but I'm a little concerned over freezes still (part of the difference between uploading to Ubuntu rather than Debian is knowing what's appropriate when as it comes up a lot more often) received from micahg [19:52] #endvote [19:52] Voting ended on: MOTU Applications: Mahyuddin Susanto [19:52] Votes for:3 Votes against:0 Abstentions:1 [19:52] Motion carried [19:53] udienz, Congratulations. Welcome to MOTU. [19:53] Thanks cody-somerville, micahg, tumbleweed, Laney and bdrung! [19:53] congrats! [19:54] #topic Ubuntu Core Developer Applications: Evan Broder === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Core Developer Applications: Evan Broder [19:54] o/ [19:54] #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EvanBroder/CoreDevApplication [19:54] broder, Please introduce yourself and your application. [19:54] Hi folks. I'm Evan, and I'm applying for core dev. I've been contributing to Ubuntu since late 2008, and I've been a member of MOTU since late 2009 [19:54] I work a lot on backports and SRUs. I try to help with sponsorship as much as I can [19:55] Past that it's a lot of pretty random stuff [19:55] I started at a SF Bay Area startup about a year and a half ago, where I'm basically working on an Ubuntu derivative, which means that I get to spend even more time working on Ubuntu now [19:56] I also setup http://lintian.ubuntuwire.org/ and have been working to improve it to make it more useful to Ubuntu [19:56] . [19:57] broder, Where do you see yourself in three years? [20:00] Hmm, I'm not really sure. In terms of Ubuntu, I really value being a part of the developer community, and I don't think that's likely to change. I definitely feel like my involvement in the community is increasing over time, and I think it's possible that I'll hit the high point of that soon, but I don't expect to completely vanish [20:02] broder, What do you feel is the most important quality of a strong leader? [20:06] I think that leadership is about solving problems, whether those are at a technical level, or personal level, or whatever, so the most important thing is to be able to understand problems, and to be able to dig below the surface of problems [20:10] I'm a bit afraid to poke your "what I like least about ubuntu" statements, as those are things we spend hours discussing over beer at every UDS [20:12] I'll admit there that my thoughts in the area aren't quite as fully-baked as I'd like, but I still feel pretty strongly about the overall concept [20:12] I think you may be right about putting more emphesis on the upstream and less on the gardening, but when we are all gardeners, that's hard [20:12] I suppose I should do something about that "put project cleansweep jobs into the sponsorship queue" task... [20:13] I'm not actually convinced that we're all gardeners, even if we're all garden*ing*. If you look at the people who are top contributors to the project, they're all very skilled developers and debuggers, too [20:13] I guess so, and we aren't here for the gardening [20:14] I do think there's an important side-point that we should be thinking as hard as we can on ways to automate or eliminate gardening [20:15] broder, Where do you think time can be found to do upstream patch review? [20:15] well, I don't think it's something we can eliminate, but automation can certainly help [20:17] cody-somerville: We've talked about incorporating operation cleansweep into the responsibilities of patch piloting. I think that's the obvious place to at least start [20:18] well, it's already part of patch piloting when people exhaust opportunities in the sponsorship queue [20:18] Any additional questions? [20:19] micahg: It's nominally part of patch piloting, but I don't think that's actually happened in practice. I think getting some items from cleansweep onto the sponsor queue is a prerequisite for that [20:19] broder: I've seen people reporting on it in their pilot reports to ubuntu-devel@l.u.c [20:20] broder: you talked about automation. do you see any places where we could add automation? [20:22] bdrung: Well, I guess one example could be the multiarch stuff. Based on my experiences multiarching the gtkmm stack, I think an initial attempt at multiarch-ification could be done by a script if it had enough awareness of common types of packaging, etc. [20:22] Obviously the output would need to be sanity checked [20:23] if we could only get upstreams to stop hardcoding paths [20:24] #vote Ubuntu Core Developer Applications: Evan Broder [20:24] Please vote on: Ubuntu Core Developer Applications: Evan Broder [20:24] Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me) [20:24] +1 [20:24] +1 received from cody-somerville [20:24] +1 [20:24] +1 received from tumbleweed [20:25] +1 good packaging work, good project leadership [20:25] +1 good packaging work, good project leadership received from micahg [20:25] +1 [20:25] +1 received from bdrung [20:25] Laney provides +1 [20:25] stgraber did as well IIRC [20:25] stgraber provides +1 [20:25] #endvote [20:25] Voting ended on: Ubuntu Core Developer Applications: Evan Broder [20:25] Votes for:4 Votes against:0 Abstentions:0 [20:25] Motion carried [20:26] broder: congrats [20:26] Thanks everybody :-D [20:26] broder, Congratulations. Welcome to Core Dev. [20:26] broder, If you have any questions about your new responsibilities, please don't hesitate to get in contact with the DMB or a fellow core developer. [20:26] * broder nods [20:26] Anyhow, that, I believe, concludes today's meeting. [20:26] broder: congrats [20:27] cody-somerville: oh, laney also gave a +1 for broder :) [20:28] ah, you included that [20:28] * micahg needs caffeine [20:28] #endmeeting === meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Ubuntu Meeting Grounds | Calendar/Scheduled meetings: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/calendar | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs | Meetingology documentation: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology [20:28] Meeting ended Mon Jan 2 20:28:12 2012 UTC. [20:28] Minutes: http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-meeting/2012/ubuntu-meeting.2012-01-02-19.06.moin.txt [20:28] Thank you folks! Look for meeting minutes and changes in launchpad later today. [20:28] broder: Congrats! [20:28] udienz: thanks, same to you === noy_ is now known as noy [22:09] cody-somerville: I created the package set during our last meeting and then updated it based on jbicha's e-mail (that I Cced to the mailing-list), so I guess we can drop that action ;)