[02:37] <snap-l> jcastro: Just picked up Megadeth's 13
[02:37] <snap-l> and frankly, the first 2 minutes of this album make Metallica sound tired.
[02:37] <snap-l> Seriously, Metallica needs to learn how to be a pissed off asshole again.
[02:37] <snap-l> Because Dave has it down pat. ;)
[02:38] <jrwren> metallica has sounded tired for 20yrs
[02:41] <rick_h_droid> new megadeath? /me runs to look
[02:41] <snap-l> rick_h_droid: Also new Puscifer
[02:41] <snap-l> friend sent me a Christmas care package
[02:42] <snap-l> we get each other CDs. He got some older Christian Metal that we played on the radio show.
[02:42] <snap-l> Crucified, Believer, and Celldweller.
[02:48] <jrwren> i like celldweller.
[02:48] <jrwren> i had no idea that was christian
[02:49] <snap-l> Well, Circle of Dust was
[02:49] <snap-l> but like most Christian Artists, he got majorly fucked over by the music industry.
[02:49] <jrwren> i didnt know that was, nor that they were related
[02:49] <jrwren> like 16volt? :)
[02:49] <snap-l> Like just about every single musician out thee.
[02:50] <snap-l> I hear bands looking forward to getting signed, and I just shake my head
[02:50] <jrwren> especially with how easy it is self publish these days
[02:50] <snap-l> because it's just a matter of time
[02:50] <snap-l> jrwren: Absolutely
[02:50] <jrwren> i mean, 15+ yrs ago.... I get it.
[02:51] <jrwren> but now?  no way.
[02:51] <snap-l> I think what bands really want is exposure
[02:51] <snap-l> and someone to help foot the bill
[02:51] <snap-l> Which is why I do the show
[02:51] <jrwren> yup
[02:51] <snap-l> to help with the exposure
[02:51] <jrwren> and the labels NEVER actually help foot the bill.
[02:52] <snap-l> Oh hell no
[02:52] <jrwren> only the super naive ever actually believe that
[02:52] <jrwren> the thing that the labels have is connections. they have that networ.
[02:53] <jrwren> used to include record stores. now I guess it just includes local promoters and venues
[02:53] <snap-l> I think there's still labels that really believe they're helping artists
[02:54] <jrwren> some indies
[02:54] <snap-l> and some of them have nothing but good intentions (because they surely don't have good business sense)
[02:54] <jrwren> well you know local peeps. remember dave hedgie?
[02:54] <jrwren> fuk I hate that guy.
[02:54] <snap-l> name doesn't ring a bell
[02:54] <jrwren> he ended up working for Sony
[02:55] <jrwren> moved to NYC about 7 or so yrs ago
[02:55] <jrwren> but he was such a self centered POS of a human, he is exactly the kind of person that fits the bill for working for a record label
[02:55] <jrwren> and so he did.
[02:56] <jrwren> and so when he would sign bands or promote them or wahtever... oh the success!
[02:56] <jrwren> good intentions and no business sense sounds great.
[02:56] <jrwren> i'm all for small labels if it can help peeps.
[02:56] <jrwren> but I ralley against the majors.
[02:56] <snap-l> All the majors were small once
[02:56] <snap-l> unfortunately they're so far removed from those days.
[02:58] <jrwren> i used to get info from Bill Paskins, but since he closed up store and moved away I'm completely clueless about the industry.
[02:58] <jrwren> i've no idea what it is like now.
[02:58] <jrwren> to me, record stores died entirely 8 yrs ago when east alley closed :)
[02:59] <snap-l> Yeah, record stores aren't nearly as prevalent now
[03:01] <Wolfger> record stores still exist?
[03:01] <snap-l> Wolfger: Yep, there's several in the area
[03:01] <snap-l> Flipside, Solo
[03:01] <Wolfger> I mean, aside from as-a-dept-inside-Best-Buy
[03:02] <Wolfger> Huh. Never heard of them
[03:02] <snap-l> Solo is on Woodward
[03:02] <snap-l> and Flipside is in Clawson on 14 mile / Main
[03:02] <_stink_> snap-l: how are those places?  i drive past them all the time
[03:02] <snap-l> Flipside is decent
[03:03] <Wolfger> That's too far West for me. May as well be GR. :-p
[03:03] <snap-l> Seems to be mostly about the collectibles than actual music selection
[03:03] <snap-l> Oh, and UHF
[03:03] <snap-l> but that's more about vinyl records
[03:03] <snap-l> but there's a metalhead on staff there that keeps me opening my wallet
[03:03] <_stink_> heh
[03:03] <snap-l> Haven't been in Solo, but I keep driving by it
[03:04] <snap-l> I miss Rockabillys. Went in there just as they were starting closing down
[03:04] <snap-l> And I miss Holland CD, only because I moved away from Holland after college
[03:11] <jrwren> how is that west? where are you? sarnia?
[03:11] <Wolfger> jrwren: just about. I live in New Baltimore
[03:11] <jrwren> oh, lol, yup, that is a trek.
[03:11] <Wolfger> and with that... off to bed. Night all.
[03:11] <jrwren> i was in NB on xmas.... or drove through it
[03:12] <snap-l> later, Wolfger
[03:12] <snap-l> Sheesh, you guys and your "distance"
[03:25] <snap-l> This is great
[03:25] <snap-l> got my eye care coverate from ALU
[03:25] <snap-l> starts: 1/1/2012
[03:26] <snap-l> Last day of ALU: 1/1/2012. ;)
[03:31] <_stink_> act quickly!
[03:31] <snap-l> Yeah, no kidding
[12:12] <snap-l> g'morning
[12:24] <rick_h__> morning
[12:36] <Wolfger> total suckage: "Shareware/Freeware, Technical/Business Forums Blocked by URL Category Filter Database "
[12:36] <Wolfger> oh and good morning
[12:37] <rick_h__> what forums are these?
[12:37] <Wolfger> linuxbsdos.com
[12:38] <Wolfger> was following a story link from a Linux Today e-mail
[12:38] <rick_h__> url?
[12:39] <Wolfger> I just find it disturbing that such a category exists in the Chrysler blocked sites list
[12:40] <snap-l> Wolfger: I think they subscribe to a service for those
[12:41] <snap-l> it's to protect the company from "unlicensed" software.
[12:41] <Wolfger> McAfee
[12:41] <snap-l> Yeah, apparently you have the Great Firewall package.
[12:44] <Wolfger> it's not so great, really :-p
[13:20] <rick_h__> well, it was a good ride, but finally had to cave and get a Oreilly DoD
[13:22] <Wolfger> Really? The API book today?
[13:22] <brousch> you bought IronRuby?
[13:25] <Wolfger> I thought the API book looked interesting until I read the description. Too management-oriented
[13:26] <Wolfger> AskUbuntu drives me crazy with all the "I know it's easy to do from a command line, but how can I do it from a GUI app?" questions... http://askubuntu.com/questions/10712/how-do-i-know-if-i-am-running-32-bit-or-64-bit-ubuntu-through-a-gui
[13:27] <brousch> typing is hard. let's go clicking
[13:31] <tjagoda> Brousch will make me rich with his trademarked bumpersticker one-liners.
[13:32] <brousch> that's more like a laptop sticker than a bumper sticker
[13:32] <brousch> use a green, monospace font
[14:08] <tjagoda> awesome
[14:08] <tjagoda> he didn't demand any share of the profits
[14:08]  * tjagoda monetizes 
[14:13] <brousch> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/101667/command_line_3in.png
[14:13] <brousch> enjoy
[14:13]  * rick_h__ hangs his head
[14:14] <brousch> something wrong with it?
[14:14] <brousch> maybe the spacing between rows?
[14:15] <brousch> that'll give you a 3" sticker
[14:17] <snap-l> needs a screen font
[14:25] <brousch> i guess i have no idea what that font would be
[14:26] <brousch> i used courier new, which is the crustiest old font i could think of
[14:27] <rick_h__> dejavu mono
[14:27] <rick_h__> ?
[14:28] <brousch> looks like it should be just Courier
[14:34] <tjagoda> lol
[14:40] <brousch> slight difference using Courier http://dl.dropbox.com/u/101667/command_line_3in.png
[14:41] <snap-l> I have some blocky fonts at home.
[14:43] <brousch> here we go http://sensi.org/~svo/glasstty/
[14:53] <brousch> now it's hawt file:///home/ben/Dropbox/Logos/Command Line Sticker/command_line_3in.png
[14:53] <snap-l> erm... file link? :)
[14:54] <brousch> doh
[14:56] <brousch> same old link, but now i need to fix the cursor
[15:02] <Wolfger> brousch: ++
[15:04] <Wolfger> Need some electronics in the shirt so that the square cursor blinks. :-)
[15:04] <Wolfger> That could be a hot ThinkGeek item
[15:04] <_stink_> srsly
[15:05] <rick_h__> *sigh*
[15:05] <rick_h__> it needs to go the other way around
[15:05] <snap-l> heh
[15:05] <rick_h__> "Finding options is hard...let's man it"
[15:05] <rick_h__> and the $ needs to be a #
[15:06] <rick_h__> zsh ftw!
[15:06] <Wolfger> rick_h__: then it would lose sarcasm/parody points
[15:06] <_stink_> i can see a need for both
[15:08] <rick_h__> ok, this api book sucks
[15:09] <rick_h__> fortunately I had an error on my attempt to buy it and got it for $2 off
[15:11] <snap-l> rick_h__: yeah, it looks like the book to give to your VP, not your coders.
[15:11] <Wolfger> exactly
[15:12] <rick_h__> well it has good headings "security" "protecting your api"
[15:12] <rick_h__> but completely lacks the answer, just "yea...people can try to upload large payloads."
[15:13] <rick_h__> and ... ugh
[15:13] <rick_h__> for the python script lovers out there http://www.nicosphere.net/clint-command-line-library-for-python/
[15:17] <snap-l> hm, that's interesting.
[15:30] <brousch> damn, that cursor was hard http://dl.dropbox.com/u/101667/command_line_3in.png
[15:30] <brousch> still not quite right
[15:34] <ColonelPanic001> ...
[15:51] <tjagoda> awesome
[15:51] <tjagoda> Brousch does all the work
[15:51] <tjagoda> I just ship stickers to tens of open source geeks
[15:51] <tjagoda> I like this business model
[15:53] <Wolfger> eliminate bottom 2 rows of cursor?
[15:53] <brousch> you can ship and do accounting
[15:53] <brousch> Wolfger: it didn't go down to the lower case?
[15:54] <Wolfger> I don't think so
[15:54] <Wolfger> not sure
[15:54] <tjagoda> Is $2 a good market price for a novelty sticker of respectable quality?
[15:55] <tjagoda> If so, we only need like a million people to buy one, and we shall be rich.
[15:55] <_stink_> it worked for angry birds.
[15:55] <Wolfger> shockingly enough, I think Angry Birds has a larger market than this does...
[15:55] <tjagoda> Once the brand is established we will expand into mug sales. =(
[15:58] <brousch> snap-l is the one with all the crusty old computers sitting around. can't you fire one up and look?
[16:01] <brousch> this shows it as going to the lowercase bottom and above the upper case top. it's also solid. http://blog.fosketts.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/Hamlet-and-DEC.png
[16:02] <brousch> i think the font is too sparse
[16:03] <brousch> i don't know
[16:04] <snap-l> the font is about right
[16:18] <tjagoda> I used that as my terminal font for ages in gnome
[16:27] <snap-l> Yeah, although it's a little hard to read at smaller resolutions
[16:53] <brousch> is mdlug the same as mug?
[16:54] <rick_h__> brousch: no, definitely not
[16:55] <snap-l> mdlug is the Metro Detroit LUG
[16:56] <brousch> i thought that's what mug covered
[16:57] <brousch> or are you like us with a west MI lug and a GR lug?
[17:26] <snap-l> brousch: It's a somewhat overlapping group
[17:27] <snap-l> though MUG is the granddaddy, since it pre-dates Linux
[17:28] <snap-l> Was formed in 1986, covers UNIX(tm)
[18:05] <brousch> rick_h_: did you happen to go to karl swedberg's talk at dev day detroit? http://pres.learningjquery.com/1devday2/
[18:05] <rick_h__> brousch: no, I had no interest
[18:05] <brousch> no interest in jquery?
[18:05] <rick_h__> nope
[18:06] <rick_h__> I've moved on, done with it. It's good for some uses, but nothing I need for now
[18:06] <brousch> damn hipsters
[18:06] <rick_h__> :)
[18:06] <rick_h__> jquery is good in small batches, but I don't like it for real web apps
[18:07] <rick_h__> bookie is in slow motion because I've ported all the JS from jquery to YUI
[18:07] <rick_h__> MUCH MUCH happier now
[18:07] <brousch> did any of you non-hipsters go?
[18:07] <rick_h__> no, I think most of us went to other talks
[18:11] <rick_h__> brousch: so is there a question in there?
[18:11] <rick_h__> looking at the slides it seems your normal "don't abuse jquery/js" stuff
[18:11] <brousch> next grwebdev is all about jquery. i asked swedberg to speak and he wants to give that same talk
[18:11] <rick_h__> ah, gotcha
[18:13] <brousch> hoping to also get jonathan chaffer
[18:13] <Wolfger> call him back and say, "Thanks, but no thanks. Rick Harding say jquery is lame now."
[18:13] <brousch> what is this "call" thing you speak of?
[18:13] <rick_h__> heh, he knows my thoughts. I had a bit of a rant against jquery talking with him and snap-l and another guy
[18:13] <brousch> is that like those cassettes you used to put in boomboxes?
[18:13] <rick_h__> this was before I realized who he was
[18:14] <rick_h__> which led to a very interesting follow up conversation
[18:14] <Wolfger> brousch: "Call" is what you do when you Skype somebody
[18:14] <Wolfger> :-p
[18:14] <brousch> rick_h_: nice
[18:14] <snap-l> brousch: Frankly, he's a good speaker, and passionate, so if he wants to give the same talk, let him. :)
[18:14] <brousch> did you convince him jquery is dead?
[18:15] <rick_h__> brousch: ummm, no
[18:15] <rick_h__> but I think we were kind of close on more points than it seemed
[18:15] <snap-l> I think rick_h__ and Karl agreed to disagree
[18:15] <brousch> snap-l: i've met him several times and he presented about 9 months ago. i was mostly looking for opnions on the specific talk
[18:15] <snap-l> yeah, you weren't too far off the mark
[18:15] <rick_h__> just remember, I'm a bitter crank sick of people that can't think for themselves
[18:15] <rick_h__> jquery loves to open a set of tools to people that can't think for themselves :)
[18:16] <snap-l> rick_h__ is a two year old always asking WHY
[18:16] <snap-l> WHY are you using jQuery?
[18:16] <brousch> because karl told me to!
[18:16] <snap-l> WHY haven't you looked at other tools that may be more appropriate
[18:16] <snap-l> WHY is the sky blue, when I think it should be AMBER!
[18:17] <brousch> the interwebs say all other suck
[18:17] <brousch> rick_h_: come give a 15 minute talk on why jquery is dead
[18:17] <snap-l> 15 minute?
[18:17] <snap-l> Surely you jest.
[18:18] <snap-l> That's like asking Stephen King to write a short story.
[18:18] <brousch> usually we have four 15-20min talks on the topic
[18:18] <snap-l> What's the current hotness for presentations?
[18:18] <brousch> eh?
[18:19] <snap-l> If I were to give a 5-10 minute talk at my local user group about a command, what would I use to present it?
[18:19] <brousch> the short talks mean less pressure on each presenter, less prep time, more variety if one of them sucks
[18:19] <snap-l> I'm hijacking the conversation for a sec. ;)
[18:19] <brousch> ah
[18:19] <brousch> that apple presentation thing
[18:19] <snap-l> Keynote is right out
[18:20] <brousch> i see that, PDF, or openoffice presenter
[18:20] <brousch> or various ruby-based html5 things
[18:20] <rick_h_droid> rst plus rdt2pdf
[18:21] <rick_h_droid> python ftw
[18:21] <brousch> i like rst2pdf
[18:21] <snap-l> What about landslide?
[18:21] <brousch> Landslidewww.landslide.com/Looking for a Social CRM solution?
[18:21] <rick_h_droid> doesn't work with presentation remotes :(
[18:21] <snap-l> rick_h_droid: Ah, that's good to know if I ever decide to use a remote. ;)
[18:23] <brousch> i don't like the openoffice thing. it always frustrates me when making slides
[18:23] <brousch> rst2pdf is good, unless you have animated gifs. all good presentations have animated gifs
[18:25]  * rick_h__ disagrees, but will leave it alone
[18:25] <snap-l> hah
[18:26] <brousch> :-D
[18:34] <mydogsnameisrudy> to stinking hot out
[18:40] <snap-l> Eh?
[18:41] <snap-l>    Temperature: 48.9 F (9.4 C)
[18:41] <snap-l> That doesn't seem hot to me
[18:41] <rick_h__> yep, but warm enough that no gym today for me...bike ride it is
[18:42] <snap-l> rick_h__: Ah, nice.
[18:42] <brousch> in the dark?
[18:53] <mydogsnameisrudy> its not making ice so it sucks
[19:03]  * Wolfger looks forward to another week or so of "sucky" weather.
[19:04] <snap-l> Yeah, me too
[19:04] <Wolfger> above freezing every day for as far out as WeatherSpark forecasts :-)
[19:05] <Wolfger> Global Warming? Bring it on!
[19:05] <Wolfger> I should go start my SUV now and let it idle until quitting time
[19:39] <tjagoda> I dont understand what happened to winter
[19:39] <tjagoda> =(
[19:40] <brousch> we killed it
[19:40] <brousch> good riddance
[19:41] <jjesse> its cold in northern wisconsin still
[19:41] <jjesse> 30 degrees?
[19:41] <jjesse> and 4 inches of snow on the ground
[19:41] <jjesse> which everyone considered warm here
[19:42] <greg-g> they grow them right in Wausau (that's where my grandparents lived)
[19:43] <jjesse> there is a pretty decent microbrew here
[19:43] <jjesse> red eye breweing
[20:08] <tjagoda> I have been to Wasau
[20:08] <tjagoda> More aptly, through it
[20:08] <tjagoda> Fly into CWA when I need to go to wisconsin for work