| Supe | hey ctuser | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| Nafallo | jacobw: stanstead have started charging for them, the evil bastards. | 00:00 |
| Nafallo | I had to smuggle my contacts in some deep pocket of my bag last time. | 00:01 |
| jutnux | The_Fred: #android | 00:01 |
| jutnux | Anyways, now going all, bye. | 00:01 |
| jacobw | Nafallo: that is evil :( | 00:01 |
| jacobw | bye jutnux | 00:01 |
| Supe | see ya jutnux | 00:01 |
| Supe | thanks for help | 00:01 |
| The_Fred | jutnux, thanks, but i've got the android side up and running (reding sensors, sending button click events, etc, its how to capture the data on ubuntu that has me stumped for now | 00:02 |
| Supe | guys | 00:09 |
| Supe | if i'm doing a boot repair, would you recommend terminal or graphical? | 00:09 |
| Supe | this is for my dual boot etc. | 00:09 |
| jacobw | erm | 00:10 |
| jacobw | what is giving you the choice? | 00:10 |
| Supe | https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RecoveringUbuntuAfterInstallingWindows | 00:10 |
| jacobw | terminal is easier | 00:11 |
| Supe | ok cool | 00:11 |
| Supe | is this likely to erase my current ubuntu installation? | 00:12 |
| ali1234 | no | 00:12 |
| Supe | i've not touched the partitions when installing windows - oly my windows | 00:12 |
| Supe | great | 00:12 |
| Supe | do i want to repair the swap or linux partition? | 00:13 |
| ali1234 | the linux partition | 00:13 |
| Supe | thanks | 00:13 |
| Supe | says error - can't find a device for /boot/grub - is /dev mounted? | 00:14 |
| Supe | i did - "sudo grub-install /dev/sda5" | 00:15 |
| Supe | any ideas? | 00:17 |
| Supe | i can do a pastebin if it helps | 00:17 |
| ubuntubhoy | the easy way is this in terminal | 00:18 |
| ubuntubhoy | sudo mount /dev/sdaX /mnt | 00:18 |
| ubuntubhoy | sudo mount --bind /proc /dev/proc | 00:18 |
| ubuntubhoy | sudo mount --bind /sys /dev/sys | 00:18 |
| ubuntubhoy | sudo mount --bind /dev /dev/dev | 00:18 |
| ubuntubhoy | sudo chroot /mnt | 00:19 |
| ubuntubhoy | sudo grub-install /dev/sda | 00:19 |
| Supe | on the second line - it says /dev/proc does not exist | 00:19 |
| ubuntubhoy | sudo update-grub | 00:19 |
| ubuntubhoy | dont know what you have done to this point, so you may need to reboot | 00:19 |
| Supe | so far | 00:19 |
| Supe | i've just put in liveusb | 00:20 |
| Supe | terminal | 00:20 |
| Supe | sudo fdisk -l | 00:20 |
| Supe | and then your first line you gave me | 00:20 |
| ubuntubhoy | K | 00:20 |
| ubuntubhoy | oops | 00:20 |
| ubuntubhoy | change the /dev/ to /mnt/ | 00:20 |
| Supe | pastebin.ubuntu.com/795495 | 00:21 |
| ubuntubhoy | sudo mount --bind /proc /mnt/proc | 00:21 |
| ubuntubhoy | etc | 00:21 |
| Supe | ah | 00:21 |
| Supe | that's going through now so far, thanks | 00:22 |
| Supe | putting the rest int | 00:22 |
| Supe | in | 00:22 |
| Supe | ah | 00:24 |
| Supe | encountered an error | 00:24 |
| Supe | let me pastebin it | 00:24 |
| Supe | pastebin.ubuntu.com/795503 | 00:25 |
| ubuntubhoy | thats fine | 00:25 |
| ubuntubhoy | your good to reboot | 00:25 |
| Supe | oh, it's worked? | 00:25 |
| Supe | i haven't done the sudo update-grub | 00:25 |
| Supe | should i do that right? | 00:26 |
| ubuntubhoy | yeah | 00:26 |
| Supe | ok | 00:26 |
| Supe | lets see if this works | 00:26 |
| Supe | while i was downloading ubuntu i got my gfx driver all installed on windows - so i'm hoping this all works perfectly now - both OS | 00:27 |
| Supe | thanks ubuntubhoy - it looks to have worked, grub bootloader there now | 00:27 |
| Supe | you're a legend :) | 00:27 |
| ubuntubhoy | nope | 00:27 |
| ubuntubhoy | I have just made an arse of it that many times myself | 00:27 |
| ubuntubhoy | I know the getout code now :D | 00:28 |
| Supe | haha | 00:28 |
| awilkins | I used to keep multiple partitions on a USB stick | 01:05 |
| awilkins | One FAT32 to swap files back and forth, then a LiveCD | 01:05 |
| awilkins | You have to put the FAT32 first because Windows figures "USB stick, only has one partition on it, oh, this isn't a filesystem I know, derp, derp" | 01:06 |
| directhex | not only windows that does that. PS3 will only use first partition on usb | 02:37 |
| Supermanintights | I did something similar | 03:09 |
| Supermanintights | I used to just set the fat32 to drive a:/ and the ps3 recognised it, as my other partition was NTFS - drive J:/ | 03:09 |
| Seeker` | morning | 03:45 |
| popey | Good morning all. | 09:11 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Morning popey | 09:16 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | et al. | 09:16 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Sounds nice - The OLPC XO 3.0 to be launched next week at CES: http://www.powermanagementdesignline.com/electronics-news/4234013/Marvell-and-One-Laptop-per-Child-Unveil-the-XO-3-0-Tablet | 09:21 |
| mungojerry | morning | 09:22 |
| mungojerry | i think somebody just let the cat out of the bag regarding canonicals surprise for CES | 09:23 |
| * popey wonders where | 09:29 | |
| popey | mungojerry: interesting ☺ | 09:32 |
| popey | mungojerry: care to elaborate? | 09:33 |
| mungojerry | popey, bbc article re ces, wanna link | 09:34 |
| popey | ya | 09:34 |
| popey | http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16415136 | 09:34 |
| mungojerry | http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16415136 | 09:34 |
| mungojerry | yarp | 09:34 |
| popey | ☺ | 09:35 |
| popey | thanks for that | 09:36 |
| popey | not sure it says anything we didnt already say does it? | 09:36 |
| mungojerry | It has made the leap to promote an early prototype of a Ubuntu-based connected television as well as to show off the netbooks and laptops normally associated with its code. | 09:37 |
| mungojerry | hadn.t heard any concrete mention of actual device previously | 09:38 |
| mungojerry | especially alongside quotes from jane silber | 09:38 |
| mungojerry | we.ve all seen mockups of various bits and bobs, maybe i.m readin | 09:40 |
| mungojerry | too literally | 09:40 |
| popey | interesting | 09:42 |
| ubuntubhoy | need some help guys - I have a netbook with messed up a partition table after recovering with testdisk | 09:48 |
| ubuntubhoy | gparted wont read it as it says that the extended patition goes beyond the end of the disk | 09:48 |
| ubuntubhoy | I want to wipe the lot apart from 1 data partition | 09:49 |
| ubuntubhoy | whats the best way to set about it | 09:49 |
| ubuntubhoy | also cant copy to an external device | 09:49 |
| AlanBell | so what is running on that? http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/57717000/jpg/_57717084_ubuntuwebbook3.jpg | 10:00 |
| ubuntubhoy | the question has changed, how do I delete an extended partition and all the logical partitions within from the terminal ? | 10:14 |
| ubuntubhoy | leaving any preceeding primary partitions intact | 10:14 |
| dwatkins | carefully ;) | 10:17 |
| ubuntubhoy | yeah | 10:17 |
| dwatkins | seriously, you can use fdisk or gparted, assuming either understands the partition table (i.e. if it's not GPT) | 10:17 |
| ubuntubhoy | am I best clearing the table with testdisk & only adding the primary parts back | 10:17 |
| ubuntubhoy | dwatkins, gparted wont read it | 10:18 |
| dwatkins | I'd get the partition mountable you want to copy data from, make two copies and wipe the disk. | 10:18 |
| dwatkins | ubuntubhoy: how about fdisk? | 10:18 |
| ubuntubhoy | it reads it fine | 10:18 |
| dwatkins | ok cool, then you can manipulate it with fdisk in theory | 10:18 |
| ubuntubhoy | but iirc it will only delete the logical, not the extended | 10:18 |
| dwatkins | I don't remember fdisk having that restriction. | 10:19 |
| ubuntubhoy | when I list it only shows primary & logical | 10:19 |
| ubuntubhoy | not the extended container | 10:19 |
| ubuntubhoy | infact your right | 10:20 |
| ubuntubhoy | just checked again | 10:20 |
| ubuntubhoy | that should do it | 10:20 |
| dwatkins | cool | 10:20 |
| dwatkins | always have two copies of anything important | 10:20 |
| ubuntubhoy | looking at it too long without actually reading | 10:20 |
| dwatkins | I know the feeling :) | 10:21 |
| ubuntubhoy | will copy the data to a primary part before the extended | 10:21 |
| ubuntubhoy | wipe the rest & re-install everything | 10:21 |
| dwatkins | I'd strongly suggest putting it on a separate device and backing up externally to somewhere in another building/town/solar system if possible | 10:25 |
| dwatkins | you never know... | 10:25 |
| ubuntubhoy | if I had the option it would make the whole thing a load easier | 10:27 |
| dwatkins | can't you can an internet connection from the machine? | 10:27 |
| ubuntubhoy | the really importent stuff is on my dropbox account | 10:27 |
| dwatkins | ok cool | 10:27 |
| ubuntubhoy | but there is some other stuff that would be 'handy' to hold onto | 10:27 |
| ubuntubhoy | but not vital | 10:27 |
| dwatkins | there's also wetransfer.com for temporary storage, if you're desperate | 10:28 |
| dwatkins | although it's meant for sending files, it can take a single file up to 2 GB. | 10:28 |
| ubuntubhoy | internet aint the best here | 10:28 |
| ubuntubhoy | would take a life time for 30G | 10:29 |
| dwatkins | ah I see | 10:29 |
| dwatkins | I was surprised how small 16 GB USB flash drives can be, practically the size of the port plus 4mm | 10:29 |
| occupy64k | I'm running my entire web site off of a 16GB flash drive | 10:30 |
| occupy64k | Makes it easy to create backups | 10:30 |
| dwatkins | I used to run my server off a 4GB CF card in an IDE adapter. | 10:30 |
| dwatkins | indeed, occupy64k | 10:30 |
| dwatkins | also, nice nickname ;) | 10:30 |
| occupy64k | thanks | 10:30 |
| dwatkins | who needs more than 640k... | 10:31 |
| occupy64k | well I'm still not using the whole 16GB and there's plenty of headroom remaining | 10:31 |
| dwatkins | I'm looking forward to getting a Raspberry Pi and running it off a small flash drive. | 10:31 |
| dwatkins | What services do you run on the machine, occupy64k? Just apache? | 10:32 |
| occupy64k | No, many things. Mediawiki, bitcoin, bookmarks, calendar, taskwarrior, FTP, photos | 10:33 |
| dwatkins | neat | 10:33 |
| occupy64k | and email | 10:33 |
| occupy64k | with Roundcube | 10:33 |
| dwatkins | I liked the look of Roundcube when I looked into it. | 10:33 |
| occupy64k | It's ok. Not as many features as gmail, but I don't need all those things | 10:34 |
| dwatkins | My new server is a flash-based netbook, its / has 16 GB | 10:34 |
| occupy64k | My lesson from the last couple of years is that it's easy to run your own server, and provides many benefits | 10:36 |
| dwatkins | this reminds me, I have a minimalist homepage to update :) | 10:36 |
| brobostigon | good morning everyone, | 11:03 |
| dwatkins | hi brobostigon | 11:04 |
| brobostigon | hi dwatkins | 11:05 |
| dwatkins | how goes it? | 11:06 |
| brobostigon | dwatkins: not so good, about the same yesterday, my eczema isnt better, and still feeling ill. and you? | 11:06 |
| dwatkins | bah and bah, I can relate to that a little as I have very dry skin on my hands and have just gotten over a really lengthy cold | 11:07 |
| brobostigon | ok. | 11:07 |
| dwatkins | a nurse friend of mine reccomended Hydromol, it's waxy but seems to help. | 11:07 |
| dwatkins | moving to Scotland seems to have completely dried-out my knuckles | 11:08 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | dwatkins: Stop dragging them along the ground when you walk ;-) | 11:09 |
| dwatkins | lol, oook | 11:09 |
| brobostigon | dwatkins: my creams are all ointment like, so very similer. | 11:09 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | I'm off to replace the door mirror on my Volvo. Seems a bit moot now that someone drove into the other door and fscked the wing too. Car will probably a write-off when they examine it in a week. :-( | 11:10 |
| dwatkins | my brother avoids orange juice as he believes it's a trigger | 11:10 |
| dwatkins | bah, TheOpenSourcerer :( | 11:10 |
| bigcalm | Miss-read as "he believes it's a tiger" | 11:10 |
| dwatkins | rawr | 11:11 |
| bigcalm | Morning peeps :) | 11:11 |
| brobostigon | morning bigcalm :) | 11:12 |
| gordonjcp | TheOpenSourcerer: doesn't sound terribly hard to fix | 11:12 |
| brobostigon | dwatkins: in theory, any of my allergies including weather, could trigeer, inclusive of state of mind. | 11:12 |
| gordonjcp | TheOpenSourcerer: hassle them to give you Cat C or Cat D writeoff and sell it back to you | 11:12 |
| gordonjcp | TheOpenSourcerer: you'll *probably* get it back for scrap value or a little more, and get your insurance payout | 11:13 |
| gordonjcp | then you just stick another door and wing on from a scrappy | 11:13 |
| dwatkins | hey bigcalm | 11:13 |
| kvarley | Which tool should I use to filter the output of ifconfig to show only the local ip address of eth0? I have heard of awk, is that an appropriate tool? | 11:13 |
| gordonjcp | TheOpenSourcerer: then what you do is every time you look out your window at your repaired car sitting on the driveway you think "haha, up yours, insurance company!" | 11:14 |
| MartijnVdS | kvarley: you shouldn't parse ifconfig output | 11:17 |
| MartijnVdS | kvarley: maybe "ip addr" output | 11:18 |
| MartijnVdS | kvarley: but ifconfig is obsolete | 11:18 |
| popey | +1 | 11:18 |
| dwatkins | is there a simpler way than parsing "ip addr", MartijnVdS? | 11:18 |
| dwatkins | e.g. something in /proc which just returns the IP address | 11:18 |
| MartijnVdS | dwatkins: maybe | 11:18 |
| * dwatkins does a grep -R | 11:19 | |
| MartijnVdS | /proc/net/fib_trie has something | 11:19 |
| MartijnVdS | Doing the same ioctls/syscalls as "ip" does isn't an option I guess :) | 11:20 |
| kvarley | MartijnVdS: Found this nice little bit of code online =] "ifconfig | sed -n -e 's/:127\.0\.0\.1 //g' -e 's/ *inet addr:\([0-9.]\+\).*/\1/gp'" | 11:20 |
| MartijnVdS | kvarley: ifconfig is obsolete, and won't show all IP addresses on the interface if there are more | 11:20 |
| kvarley | MartijnVdS: Hmmm, what would be the "best" way? | 11:21 |
| MartijnVdS | kvarley: what do you want to know, and why? :) | 11:21 |
| dwatkins | MartijnVdS: I'm thinking of the need to find out the current IP address from bash, I guess looking up the current hostname might be an option | 11:21 |
| MartijnVdS | dwatkins: that might not match | 11:22 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | gordonjcp: What's Cat C/D mean? | 11:22 |
| dwatkins | Yeah, I was just thinking the same, MartijnVdS | 11:22 |
| kvarley | MartijnVdS: My local IP address so I can SSH/SSHFS/SCP in from my netbook when the .local domain name doesn't work | 11:22 |
| kvarley | MartijnVdS: I suspect I could use python to get it =] | 11:22 |
| gordonjcp | TheOpenSourcerer: cat C is that is not badly damaged but uneconomical to repair | 11:22 |
| gordonjcp | TheOpenSourcerer: ie. the parts and labour would be too expensive | 11:22 |
| MartijnVdS | kvarley: reverse tunnel ;) | 11:23 |
| MartijnVdS | kvarley: 1 second while I look that up | 11:23 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | That sounds about right - The car's probably only worth ~£1k | 11:23 |
| dwatkins | kvarley: does your router not use the machine's hostname? | 11:23 |
| MartijnVdS | kvarley: http://www.howtoforge.com/reverse-ssh-tunneling | 11:23 |
| gordonjcp | TheOpenSourcerer: cat D is that it *is* economically viable to repair it, but there is some other factor that makes it not viable | 11:23 |
| gordonjcp | TheOpenSourcerer: if it's a bolt-on wing then you can change it in about half an hour | 11:23 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Well, someone can. Not me ;-) | 11:24 |
| popey | heh | 11:24 |
| popey | was about to say that ☺ | 11:24 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Dunno if a 98/9 V70 has bolt-on wings or not. | 11:24 |
| gordonjcp | TheOpenSourcerer: can you open up a PC case to fix things? | 11:24 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Oh Yes. | 11:24 |
| gordonjcp | well then | 11:24 |
| gordonjcp | same thing | 11:24 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Bit different. | 11:24 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Cars are dirty and big. | 11:25 |
| gordonjcp | yeah, you're using a 10mm socket instead of a philips screwdriver | 11:25 |
| gordonjcp | open up the bonnet and see if there's a little line of bolts in the channel at the edge of the bonnet opening | 11:25 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | And you have to scrabble around on cold concrete floors. | 11:25 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Rather give someone money to that kind of thing. | 11:25 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | s/do | 11:25 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Mind you I have just managed to replace the door mirror without breaking the replacement or me ;-) | 11:26 |
| gordonjcp | fair enough | 11:27 |
| gordonjcp | also it's more ecologically friendly to keep your old car going than it is to buy a new one | 11:27 |
| dwatkins | I thought if the insurance company wrote off a car it meant they will never insure it again. | 11:28 |
| gordonjcp | no matter what you drive, it takes a lot more energy to make a car than it will ever use in its lifetime | 11:28 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Indeed it is, but mine does drink petrol like | 11:28 |
| gordonjcp | dwatkins: nope | 11:28 |
| gordonjcp | TheOpenSourcerer: evens o | 11:28 |
| gordonjcp | *even so | 11:28 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | It's a 2.4L Turbo and a big and heavy car. | 11:28 |
| gordonjcp | TheOpenSourcerer: you need a truly collossal amount of energy to smelt all the steel | 11:29 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | I'd like to get something a big smaller/more economical. The wifey wants a 7 seater people/child mover. | 11:29 |
| gordonjcp | TheOpenSourcerer: wee diesel mpv then ;-) | 11:29 |
| occupy64k | Do you have 7 moving children? | 11:29 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | we need 2 cars. Currently an A Class and my Volvo. | 11:30 |
| gordonjcp | TheOpenSourcerer: if you're going to get a diesel car get a French one | 11:30 |
| gordonjcp | they've been at it longer than everyone else | 11:30 |
| gordonjcp | except maybe Mercedes | 11:30 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | occupy64k: Nah but we have 2 and she does school runs and list shares. | 11:30 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | There are some pretty good lease deals on new Mercs right now... | 11:30 |
| occupy64k | With fuel costs as they are it makes sense to minimize redundant seats | 11:31 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Quite fancy the idea of a Golf TDi though. | 11:31 |
| gordonjcp | I like my Mercedes Vito | 11:32 |
| gordonjcp | although it's getting replaced with a Citroën Dispatch later this month | 11:32 |
| * popey hugs his V70 diesel | 11:32 | |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Our A class has been a good and reliable car. Mind you so has the Volvo. Both are about 10yr old now. | 11:32 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | what kind of mpg do you get popey ? | 11:33 |
| * Laney hugs his 18 speed hybrid | 11:34 | |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Try taking wife, 2 kids and a car full of baggage on that though Laney | 11:35 |
| Laney | nah, they just have their own + panniers | 11:36 |
| Laney | the fun of the cycle touring holiday /o\ | 11:36 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Hmmm... | 11:36 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Oooh - Tesco slips up? http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/8f98e7ba-38a1-11e1-9d07-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1iltRda7j | 11:36 |
| dwatkins | I hear the Nissan Leaf is pretty good, although I'd be concerned about running out of power on a long journey. | 11:36 |
| popey | TheOpenSourcerer: no idea, 30 something | 11:37 |
| popey | i rarely drive it these days now I wfh | 11:37 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | dwatkins: Where "long" means 60miles or so. | 11:37 |
| dwatkins | TheOpenSourcerer: ouch :-/ | 11:37 |
| gordonjcp | dwatkins: yeah, I can't see me ever finding an electric car to be practical | 11:38 |
| dwatkins | I like the idea of electric cars, especially as the batteries can be swapped-out for a fast "recharge" but until the range is at least a couple hundred miles, I guess they won't be so popular. | 11:38 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | popey: You still interested in a community workspace idea? Might need to talk about it a bit more over a beer sometime. | 11:38 |
| popey | YES! | 11:38 |
| dwatkins | I'm lucky - my drive to work is about 4.5 miles, but I have no way of charging an electric car as I live in a 3rd floor flat. I plan to start cycling this year. | 11:38 |
| gordonjcp | dwatkins: you could charge it at work | 11:39 |
| popey | 'better way' is the better way to do electric cars | 11:39 |
| popey | you dont charge it | 11:39 |
| gordonjcp | dwatkins: you could buy a petrol generator to plug it into | 11:39 |
| dwatkins | gordonjcp: perhaps, yeah | 11:39 |
| popey | you drive into a station and swap batteries | 11:39 |
| popey | takes same time as a fuel-up conventional car | 11:39 |
| gordonjcp | popey: I can't really see that working | 11:39 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Hydrogen Fuel Cell FTW! | 11:39 |
| dwatkins | popey: yeah, I don't believe there's a swapping-station in Edinburgh but yes | 11:39 |
| popey | better place, not better way | 11:40 |
| popey | dwatkins: yet | 11:40 |
| gordonjcp | popey: how do you design a connector that is easy to connect and disconnect, can handle hundreds of volts at hundreds of amps, and remains safe even when being sprayed with salty water? | 11:40 |
| popey | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3Os25gP4yA | 11:40 |
| dwatkins | popey: yeah, I imagine that'll change as petrol and diesel get more expensive | 11:40 |
| occupy64k | Those connectors are common in industry | 11:40 |
| popey | you dont | 11:40 |
| popey | they rip the battery out and put another in | 11:40 |
| gordonjcp | popey: right, but *how* | 11:40 |
| gordonjcp | there must be some means of connecting it to the rest of the car | 11:41 |
| popey | watch the video | 11:41 |
| gordonjcp | popey: I tried already, someone else pointed it out | 11:41 |
| gordonjcp | is there a transcript or something, or possibly a version in english? | 11:42 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | We went to this http://www.ecovelocity.co.uk/ a few months ago. Electric cars are still not ready for prime time IMHO. Fuel Cells will be the way I reckon. | 11:42 |
| gordonjcp | maybe, maybe not | 11:43 |
| gordonjcp | hydrogen is difficult to handle | 11:43 |
| occupy64k | There are losses in electrolysis | 11:43 |
| gordonjcp | it leaks out of everything you put it in | 11:43 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | so is petrol. | 11:43 |
| gordonjcp | gas is the future | 11:43 |
| dwatkins | TheOpenSourcerer: fuel cells would be great, yeah | 11:43 |
| dwatkins | I read about a fuel cell which uses tiny pieces of iron to store power somehow | 11:44 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | Places like Iceland can create Hydrogen at virtual zero cost (in energy). | 11:44 |
| dwatkins | The Hydrogen capital of the world... | 11:44 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | A few years ago that was their plan. | 11:45 |
| gordonjcp | popey: I can't actually see anything in that video that shows how they change the batteries | 11:46 |
| TheOpenSourcerer | I need to wash out all my pots this weekend and prepare for the great Chilli Sowing :-D | 11:46 |
| popey | gordonjcp: it shows them dropping the battery out the bottom of the car and a door closing | 11:51 |
| gordonjcp | popey: yup | 11:52 |
| gordonjcp | I don't trust it to be safe | 11:53 |
| gordonjcp | it doesn't show how the electrical connections are made | 11:53 |
| AlanBell | looks like they are made by the car inside the closed compartment | 11:58 |
| gordonjcp | AlanBell: yeah | 11:59 |
| gordonjcp | I don't like the look of that | 11:59 |
| AlanBell | or it might be inside the battery | 12:00 |
| AlanBell | so the car might latch to the connectors while they are off, then the battery internally makes them live | 12:00 |
| gordonjcp | yeah, but then they're still live when they're dangling under the car | 12:01 |
| gordonjcp | getting sprayed with salty water as you drive on wet slushy roads | 12:02 |
| AlanBell | it is a closed compartment | 12:02 |
| popey | they've changed the design a lot since the first generation of that car | 12:03 |
| popey | previous videos had a massive flat battery that covered most of the underside of the car | 12:03 |
| popey | and they never had a closing door before | 12:03 |
| popey | also the battery charge stations are powered by renewable electricity | 12:03 |
| dwatkins | heh that video gives me adverts for the Nissan Leaf | 12:07 |
| gordonjcp | gas is the answer | 12:08 |
| gordonjcp | we're never going to run out of it | 12:08 |
| dwatkins | I thought gas was similarly limited as oil. | 12:08 |
| gordonjcp | oil running out is going to be a problem for electric cars | 12:08 |
| gordonjcp | dwatkins: no, you can always make more | 12:09 |
| dwatkins | oh cool, so we just use geothermal energy and solar/wind power to make gas... | 12:09 |
| gordonjcp | once oil gets scarce, electric cars are going to be just as stuck as fossil fuel driven ones | 12:09 |
| gordonjcp | dwatkins: mostly I'd use cows... | 12:09 |
| dwatkins | how come, gordonjcp? because electricity has to be generated somehow? | 12:09 |
| gordonjcp | dwatkins: no, because where are you going to get lubricating oils and plastic components from? | 12:10 |
| occupy64k | there is plenty of untapped hydrothermal energy | 12:10 |
| dwatkins | ah yes, plastics etc. are also an issue - I guess we'd best start recycling the great pacific garbage patch with bacteria. | 12:10 |
| gordonjcp | dwatkins: yup | 12:10 |
| gordonjcp | dwatkins: an electric car takes just as much energy to make as a petrol car | 12:10 |
| ubuntubhoy | wish me luck - time to re-boot and delete these bloody partitions | 12:10 |
| gordonjcp | and that's the *real* energy cost | 12:10 |
| dwatkins | I read about a kid who developed a bacteria to do this, not heard of any commercial projects yet. | 12:11 |
| gordonjcp | the fuel it takes is irrelevant | 12:11 |
| dwatkins | hope all goes well, ubuntubhoy | 12:11 |
| dwatkins | gordonjcp: yeah, and I guess solar/wind don't make up for oil by a long way | 12:11 |
| occupy64k | electric vehicles can also be very durable, since electric motors are simple and easy to recondition | 12:12 |
| dwatkins | less moving parts, I imagine. | 12:12 |
| occupy64k | far less | 12:12 |
| dwatkins | no explosions | 12:12 |
| occupy64k | with brushless motors very little friction | 12:13 |
| gordonjcp | occupy64k: yes, they can be nearly as durable as diesel engines | 12:13 |
| jacobw | morning | 12:26 |
| danfish | afternoon | 12:26 |
| popey | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Ds43EFwOcM | 12:26 |
| popey | looks really painfully slow | 12:26 |
| jacobw | the hour is not after noon | 12:26 |
| jacobw | <1pm is morning :) | 12:27 |
| danfish | in 1884 when the internal combustion engine was invented, there was an absolute flurry of tweets about the poor range of the engine, reliability etc. I've got the IRC logs somewhere.. | 12:28 |
| jacobw | hahaha | 12:28 |
| danfish | popey was very vocal even then :D | 12:29 |
| danfish | seriously, electricity via renewables will come to be the answer by the middle of the century. Maybe with a smattering of fusion (if anyone can get it to work). More solar energy hits the planet's surface every hour than the world uses in a month | 12:31 |
| MartijnVdS | .. atm | 12:31 |
| MartijnVdS | ;) | 12:31 |
| jacobw | world being humans? | 12:32 |
| jacobw | i think the trees would be unhappy if we stole their solar energy :p | 12:33 |
| danfish | jacobw: yes, americans included ;) | 12:33 |
| MartijnVdS | jacobw: World being earth | 12:33 |
| danfish | crops/trees are a pretty efficient way of using solar energy | 12:34 |
| MartijnVdS | danfish: so.. throw another log on the fire, I want to pass that car? | 12:34 |
| popey | punch trees | 12:34 |
| danfish | but then we run out of food growing space.... | 12:34 |
| gordonjcp | danfish: the thing is, electric cars have been around since before IC-engined cars | 12:34 |
| gordonjcp | danfish: and they're still not really much better than they were 50 years ago | 12:35 |
| MartijnVdS | gordonjcp: but only now is battery tech really improving | 12:35 |
| gordonjcp | MartijnVdS: but that's only half the battle | 12:35 |
| MartijnVdS | gordonjcp: thanks in part to mobile devices (phones), but also Big Money is now behing electric cars | 12:35 |
| gordonjcp | you've still got to charge the batteries, and that's always going to take ages | 12:35 |
| MartijnVdS | gordonjcp: Big caps instead of batteries then? | 12:36 |
| gordonjcp | MartijnVdS: doesn't help | 12:36 |
| gordonjcp | the problem is not what you store the electricity in | 12:36 |
| gordonjcp | the problem is that you have to move electricity around | 12:36 |
| danfish | and that's a problem how? | 12:37 |
| MartijnVdS | We have a huge infrastructure for that | 12:37 |
| MartijnVdS | it might need upgrades | 12:37 |
| MartijnVdS | but power infrastructure is a solved problem | 12:37 |
| gordonjcp | no, you're not quite getting the scale of it | 12:38 |
| gordonjcp | a gallon of diesel contains about 40kWh of energy | 12:38 |
| gordonjcp | to transfer that energy takes about a minute | 12:38 |
| danfish | local generation of energy mustn't be overlooked | 12:38 |
| gordonjcp | you tip a 1-gallon container into the tank of your car, that's you dumped 40kWh of energy in | 12:39 |
| gordonjcp | 40kW off the mains would be 166A | 12:39 |
| gordonjcp | so you'd need to charge your battery off 240V mains for an hour at 166A | 12:39 |
| gordonjcp | okay, the electric car is going to turn more of that energy into motion | 12:40 |
| MartijnVdS | So more V | 12:40 |
| danfish | or three phase | 12:40 |
| gordonjcp | MartijnVdS: okay, so then you're talking about say 2.4kV at 16A | 12:40 |
| gordonjcp | this is still not nice | 12:40 |
| MartijnVdS | gordonjcp: Check out how Nissan's Leaf charges.. | 12:40 |
| MartijnVdS | Charging an electric car overnight or while you're at work is a more viable option than having a tanker car refilling every car in the street every night | 12:41 |
| MartijnVdS | so you wouldn't need as many or as much roadside recharging | 12:41 |
| danfish | http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2011/03/24/quick-charge-battery-developments/ | 12:41 |
| gordonjcp | it'll be interesting to see how many charge/discharge cycles that can withstand | 12:43 |
| danfish | I'm running a honda civic that's done 80,000 and is more than capable of getting to 150,000. I fully intend to drive it as far as I can, and by then I fully expect an electric car for the journeys I do to be the norm | 12:43 |
| MartijnVdS | I seldom drive more than an hour away | 12:43 |
| danfish | who is it who does a podcast from his civic? | 12:43 |
| gordonjcp | MartijnVdS: I seldom drive *less* than an hour away | 12:43 |
| MartijnVdS | gordonjcp: So we have different use-cases. Maybe the car market needs to "split" into "Long-distance" and "short-distance" cars | 12:44 |
| gordonjcp | MartijnVdS: my daily commute to work and back is about half an hour each way, but most days I go there for a quick meeting and a coffee, and then go and drive a couple of hundred miles | 12:44 |
| danfish | Dave Yates from tllts | 12:44 |
| gordonjcp | MartijnVdS: exactly | 12:44 |
| MartijnVdS | I love my Smart ;) | 12:45 |
| gordonjcp | MartijnVdS: I'm being deliberately contentious because I get annoyed by the "everyone should drive an electric car" brigade | 12:45 |
| gordonjcp | MartijnVdS: an electric car will never really be able to cope with my requirements | 12:45 |
| danfish | gordonjcp: can you actually be sure that that will always be the case? | 12:45 |
| occupy64k | Never is a strong term | 12:45 |
| gordonjcp | danfish: pretty much | 12:45 |
| gordonjcp | I can easily put 1000 miles on my van in a week | 12:46 |
| occupy64k | Computers wil never need more than 640K | 12:46 |
| * MartijnVdS invents cold fusion, small enough to put on the roof of gordonjcp's car | 12:46 | |
| danfish | I have to disagree and will place that in the "there will be world need for four computers" pile :D | 12:46 |
| gordonjcp | danfish: <shrug> | 12:46 |
| gordonjcp | danfish: where I live there is very little public transport and the sites I work on are within a radius of several hundred miles | 12:47 |
| occupy64k | Aeroplanes will never play a decisive role in any future war | 12:47 |
| gordonjcp | danfish: if I didn't do the job I'm using now, I'd most likely move back up north where there is *no* public transport and everything is even further apart | 12:47 |
| gordonjcp | people who live in cities don't need cars *at all* | 12:47 |
| gordonjcp | well, assuming they also work in the same city | 12:48 |
| MartijnVdS | Oop Norf ;) | 12:48 |
| gordonjcp | even then they're likely within easy reach of public transport | 12:48 |
| gordonjcp | even as far south as maybe yorkshire there's good public transport links | 12:48 |
| danfish | gordonjcp: It will be a gradual process I suspect. I'm still waiting for my flying car ;) | 12:56 |
| daubers | Afternoon | 12:56 |
| danfish | o/ | 12:56 |
| gordonjcp | danfish: I don't see how car manufacturers are going to solve the oil problem | 12:56 |
| danfish | daubers: saw your mqtt bzr thing, nice | 12:57 |
| gordonjcp | danfish: maybe thermal depolymerisation of plastics to make the oils and greases? | 12:57 |
| danfish | gordonjcp: oils from vegetables? | 12:57 |
| gordonjcp | danfish: no good as lubricants | 12:57 |
| danfish | gordonjcp: if polymerised? | 12:58 |
| gordonjcp | they go off and just turn into gluey yuck | 12:58 |
| gordonjcp | I'm sure there's a way to do it, but it might not be very energy-efficient ;-) | 12:58 |
| occupy64k | fossil oil isn't going away any time soon. It will just become more expensive, to the point where it's no longer economical to burn. | 12:58 |
| gordonjcp | engine oil lasts a lot longer when you run on gas, which is a good start | 12:59 |
| danfish | do you think I can port debian to run on the civic? | 13:03 |
| gordonjcp | danfish: depends what's in the various ECUs | 13:05 |
| daubers | danfish: Fun toy if nothing else | 13:07 |
| gordonjcp | I wouldn't be surprised if some of the body ECUs in cars ran some sort of Linux | 13:08 |
| penguin42 | hmm, I would - I'd hope all the ECU code is safety-critical approved | 13:11 |
| AlanBell | that doesn't exclude Linux | 13:12 |
| kvarley | Wine - Error loading font! (tahoma.ttf) - Any ideas? | 13:15 |
| penguin42 | AlanBell: Has Linux got that level of approval on anything? | 13:15 |
| Seeker` | penguin42: He doesn't mean car ECUs are running ubuntu | 13:17 |
| penguin42 | Seeker`: I don't mean a distro - I mean even the kernel | 13:17 |
| AlanBell | not sure that an ECU needs that much code, more arduino level stuff, and I don't know that much about safety certs, I know a bit about QS9000 in automobile sector | 13:20 |
| jacobw | linux 2.4 is probably still used in some embedded things | 13:20 |
| AlanBell | government security certification isn't on products but on complete solutions | 13:20 |
| AlanBell | !info msttcorefonts | kvarley | 13:24 |
| lubotu3 | kvarley: 'oneiric' is not a valid distribution: hardy, hardy-backports, hardy-proposed, jaunty, jaunty-backports, jaunty-proposed, karmic, karmic-backports, karmic-proposed, kubuntu-backports, kubuntu-experimental, kubuntu-updates, lucid, lucid-backports, lucid-proposed, maverick, maverick-backports, maverick-proposed, medibuntu, natty, natty-backports, natty-proposed, partner, stable, testing, unstable | 13:24 |
| AlanBell | dammit | 13:24 |
| AlanBell | !info cheese | 13:24 |
| kvarley | AlanBell: Thanks, I resorted to copying the fonts from my windows install partition | 13:24 |
| kvarley | AlanBell: For some reason I hadn't installed them the usual way on this distro | 13:25 |
| directhex | better to nick them from windows anyway | 13:29 |
| directhex | msttcorefonts are ancient versions with most unicode missing | 13:29 |
| palnj | anyone home? | 14:24 |
| MartijnVdS | !ask | 14:24 |
| lubotu3 | Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) See also !patience | 14:24 |
| daubers | palnj: Hello | 14:26 |
| popey | moo | 14:27 |
| * daubers starts to win with c++ and makefiles | 14:28 | |
| * MartijnVdS weeps for daubers | 14:28 | |
| * penguin42 hands daubers a type 6 template ahmmer | 14:28 | |
| MartijnVdS | + sanity | 14:28 |
| penguin42 | hammer | 14:28 |
| daubers | It's only taken me a couple of hours to understand wth is going on with it :D | 14:30 |
| penguin42 | daubers: What was the problem? | 14:30 |
| AlanBell | !info cheese | 14:30 |
| lubotu3 | cheese (source: cheese): tool to take pictures and videos from your webcam. In component universe, is optional. Version 3.2.0-0ubuntu2 (oneiric), package size 45 kB, installed size 320 kB | 14:30 |
| AlanBell | oneiric version number \o/ | 14:30 |
| MartijnVdS | \o/ smart boy | 14:30 |
| MartijnVdS | bot | 14:30 |
| AlanBell | !gender | 14:31 |
| * penguin42 expected a commentary about wensledale | 14:31 | |
| lubotu3 | yes, I can confirm I am a female bot :) | 14:31 |
| MartijnVdS | hmm cheese | 14:32 |
| daubers | penguin42: That I've never tought myself how to do it properly | 14:32 |
| * AlanBell still has a pot of stilton from christmas | 14:32 | |
| * daubers still has half a wheel of bree from christmas | 14:32 | |
| MartijnVdS | Brie, I hope | 14:33 |
| daubers | Thats the welly | 14:33 |
| palnj | !hello | 15:26 |
| palnj | !bot | 15:27 |
| lubotu3 | Hi! I'm #ubuntu-uk's favorite infobot, you can search my brain yourself at http://ubottu.com/factoids.cgi | Usage info: http://ubottu.com/devel/wiki/Plugins | Bot channels and general info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Bots | 15:27 |
| palnj | !bye | 15:27 |
| lubotu3 | Au revoir! | 15:27 |
| palnj | !bot | 15:27 |
| palnj | !help | 15:27 |
| lubotu3 | Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) See also !patience | 15:27 |
| palnj | !question | 15:27 |
| palnj | !users | 15:28 |
| lubotu3 | To add new users to your Ubuntu system, follow the instructions at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/AddUsersHowto - For administrative privileges, users need to be made members of the group "admin" - See !sudo | 15:28 |
| palnj | !yum | 15:28 |
| lubotu3 | Uh, don't you mean !apt ? | 15:28 |
| palnj | !rpm | 15:28 |
| lubotu3 | RPM is the RedHat Package Management system. Ubuntu uses !APT, not RPM. RPM packages are not supported (the package "alien" can allow installing them, but it's quite dangerous and unsupported) | 15:28 |
| Azelphur | palnj: If you want to play with the bot, please take it to a PM | 15:28 |
| palnj | Azelphur: fine... | 15:28 |
| palnj | kinda quiet today, isn't it? | 15:29 |
| Azelphur | indeed | 15:29 |
| AlanBell | palnj: also you can have a look at http://ubottu.com/factoids.cgi to see the stuff it says | 15:31 |
| palnj | ah cool | 15:35 |
| Supermanintights | hey guys, i've just plugged in my vga cable to my monitor, set it up for twinview on nvidia x server settings, but my mouse won't let me go onto my second screen | 15:58 |
| Supermanintights | any suggestions? | 15:58 |
| Azelphur | Supermanintights: did you just hit apply, or save it to X config? | 15:59 |
| Supermanintights | ern | 15:59 |
| Supermanintights | i did apply first, it went weird and the timer ran out before it settled, then i pressed save to x config, followed instructions, then clicked apply | 15:59 |
| Azelphur | try save to X config, then reboot. | 16:00 |
| Supermanintights | well i've done save to x config | 16:00 |
| Supermanintights | reboot then? | 16:00 |
| Supermanintights | this is why i hated ubuntu last time with all this messing about with dual screens :( | 16:00 |
| Supermanintights | brb | 16:00 |
| Azelphur | yep :P | 16:00 |
| Supermanintights | seems to be working now, popped up with an error message at the start, but all good now | 16:02 |
| Supermanintights | thanks | 16:02 |
| Azelphur | yw :) | 16:03 |
| czajkowski | aloha | 16:06 |
| Supermanintights | ahola | 16:07 |
| AlanBell | czajkowski: \o/ | 16:15 |
| AlanBell | are you fixed? | 16:15 |
| czajkowski | hope so | 16:56 |
| jutnux | Evening all | 17:03 |
| ubuntuuk-planet | [Tony] It comes before a fall - http://tonywhitmore.co.uk/blog/2012/01/07/it-comes-before-a-fall/ | 18:10 |
| * jutnux reads | 18:14 | |
| * popey chuckles | 18:14 | |
| === avi is now known as BigRedS | ||
| Azelphur | Does anyone know how much power is safe to draw from a typical home socket? | 18:27 |
| BigRedS | 13A generally | 18:28 |
| BigRedS | that's what they're fused at | 18:28 |
| BigRedS | so (13 * 240)W if you actually want raw power | 18:28 |
| Azelphur | so about 3.1kw | 18:28 |
| BigRedS | Cooker sockets are 45A IIRC | 18:28 |
| moreati | 13 * 230 V | 18:28 |
| BigRedS | Oh yeah, 230. | 18:29 |
| Azelphur | hehe, I'm going to be cutting it close :x | 18:29 |
| BigRedS | what're you doing? | 18:29 |
| Azelphur | pondering the idea of upgrading my bitcoin rig a bit | 18:29 |
| moreati | 13 A is the maximum fuse value. I'm not 100% sure that's the rated steady state maximum amperage though | 18:30 |
| Azelphur | can I just get a bigger fuse and sling it in there? | 18:30 |
| Azelphur | Is the limit at the plug or for the entire house? (I'm not at all good at electronics) XD | 18:30 |
| directhex | there aren't bigger fuses for BS 1363 | 18:30 |
| AlanBell | the ring is probably going to trip out at 30A | 18:31 |
| danfish | not a good idea. The ring circuit will get very hot | 18:31 |
| moreati | and fitting a larger fuse almost certainly breaks the law and your house insurance | 18:31 |
| BigRedS | AlanBell: not really. Everything assumes that you've not fiddled with the innerds of the socket | 18:31 |
| BigRedS | Er, not AlanBell. Azelphur | 18:31 |
| Azelphur | Atm I'm pulling 1.7kw and it's doing ok | 18:31 |
| penguin42 | 1.7kw is nothing | 18:31 |
| Azelphur | yea | 18:31 |
| penguin42 | Azelphur: That's like 5A | 18:31 |
| Azelphur | Atm I've got 8 boards with 8 GPUs, I'm pondering the idea of switching to 2 boards with 14 GPUs | 18:32 |
| Azelphur | and some custom cases, \o/ | 18:32 |
| penguin42 | wow, there's some old junk on Amazon: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Original-C7986A-Write-Once-Optical/dp/B000093S5M | 18:32 |
| Azelphur | penguin42: haha | 18:32 |
| danfish | we had an MRI scanner installed at work recently - had to install an electrical substation to power it :/ | 18:33 |
| Azelphur | so yea, I dunno how much overhead the boards add, but if just assume I'd use the same per card wattage on the new build as I do now, it comes out at almost exactly 3.1kw | 18:33 |
| directhex | most ring mains are 30A or 32A max | 18:33 |
| Azelphur | I guess It'll be a bit less than that though, as there will be less overhead (less 2 psu's instead of 14 and 2 mobos instead of 14) | 18:34 |
| danfish | Azelphur: bare in mind 3.1kw = approcx £3100/year in lecci bills | 18:34 |
| moreati | I'm having difficulty imagining a PC emitting 3.1 kW of heat and remaining functional | 18:35 |
| Azelphur | danfish: I pay 6p/kwh | 18:35 |
| Azelphur | danfish: the 1774w I'm currently using comes to about £78/mo. | 18:35 |
| Azelphur | moreati: that's why it has a dedicated AC :P | 18:36 |
| danfish | Azelphur: that's not too bad | 18:36 |
| Azelphur | danfish: yea, perks of living in margate I guess (right next to the worlds largest offshore wind farm) | 18:37 |
| moreati | I assume your gas/heating bill is lower as a result | 18:37 |
| Azelphur | moreati: hehe :) | 18:38 |
| Azelphur | gonna be interesting building a case with airflow for 7 GPU's, ahah | 18:39 |
| penguin42 | why 1 case? | 18:40 |
| Azelphur | penguin42: because 1 board? | 18:40 |
| penguin42 | hmm - Nvidia did some external GPU systems | 18:41 |
| moreati | Is the 230 V rating of mains RMS or peak-to-peak? | 18:41 |
| penguin42 | RMS | 18:41 |
| MartijnVdS | Richard M Stallman? | 18:41 |
| moreati | root mean square | 18:41 |
| Azelphur | penguin42: nvidia isn't very good at SHA256 | 18:41 |
| moreati | it accounts of the sinsusoidal-ness when calculating power with V * I | 18:41 |
| MartijnVdS | moreati: I know what it means, it's just acronym overlap :) | 18:42 |
| moreati | MartijnVdS: Ah I missed the silent :) ;) | 18:43 |
| Azelphur | Is there any way I can cheat somehow and get more power from somewhere? | 18:45 |
| moreati | Though there is an open circuit <-> open source vs GNU-Voltage joke in there :| | 18:45 |
| Azelphur | (Should I need it) | 18:45 |
| penguin42 | Azelphur: Get another rind | 18:45 |
| penguin42 | g | 18:45 |
| Azelphur | how much does that cost to have done? | 18:45 |
| penguin42 | Azelphur: Ask an electrician, if there is enough room on your existing fuse board then I doubt more than £200??? | 18:46 |
| Azelphur | not too bad | 18:46 |
| MartijnVdS | Solar panels, windmills? | 18:46 |
| MartijnVdS | "I'm mining bitcoins with the power of NATUREW"" | 18:46 |
| Azelphur | Haha, I looked into solar and wind but I don't think there's anything I could bring into an apartment that would generate enough power to even put a dent in it | 18:46 |
| Azelphur | MartijnVdS: I know a guy with a solar powered cluster in australia that is doing that :D | 18:47 |
| shauno | a solar powered cluster here would probably take 3 weeks to finish booting :/ | 18:47 |
| MartijnVdS | shauno: and then shut down for lack of power | 18:48 |
| Azelphur | haha | 18:48 |
| penguin42 | I guess .au has some useful amount of sun | 18:48 |
| Azelphur | indeed | 18:49 |
| MartijnVdS | Yes, a nice sunny island.. and you shipped your prisoners there instead of your population.. :) | 18:49 |
| moreati | MartijnVdS: that's just the story they told us lot who got left behind | 18:51 |
| MartijnVdS | moreati: ah yes the deadly animals | 18:52 |
| jutnux | Transportation \o/ | 19:00 |
| popey | ebenink | 19:39 |
| popey | stupid screen and its not updating rubbish | 19:39 |
| MartijnVdS | thanks for your password :P | 19:40 |
| popey | haha | 19:41 |
| popey | no, thats me saying evening ☺ | 19:41 |
| MartijnVdS | ;) | 19:41 |
| SuperEngineer | heavninks folkies | 19:44 |
| moreati | good heaving to you to sir/madam | 19:45 |
| * popey has switched on sync to vblank, this may have fix0r3d it | 19:45 | |
| SuperEngineer | I have a confession to make - I've just spent half a day using LinuxMint - I beg forgiveness ;) | 19:46 |
| popey | oh dear | 19:46 |
| SuperEngineer | yeah! | 19:46 |
| SuperEngineer | ..it's ok - back to Lynx now | 19:47 |
| moreati | SuperEngineer: were you under the influence of red kryptonite? | 19:47 |
| SuperEngineer | moreati, no - just curious | 19:48 |
| SuperEngineer | but it did have ! benefit [for me] | 19:48 |
| SuperEngineer | I really liked the "WildMint" theme | 19:49 |
| SuperEngineer | well - with a bit of sudo copy - paste.... I have 10.04 runnung the WildMint theme | 19:49 |
| SuperEngineer | ...so - dear Mintaholics anonymous.... I am cured of your drug! | 19:50 |
| popey | bah, sync didnt fix it | 19:51 |
| Seeker` | hallo | 19:53 |
| * SuperEngineer thinks... time for some liquid kryptonite | 19:55 | |
| moreati | SuperEngineer: on minthadone? | 19:55 |
| MartijnVdS | Is that a minty fresh version of methadone? | 19:55 |
| SuperEngineer | moreati, ;D | 19:55 |
| SuperEngineer | MartijnVdS, superEngineer prefers mints Extra Strong - not soft[ware] ;) | 19:56 |
| MartijnVdS | SuperEngineer: So.. not methadone? | 19:57 |
| SuperEngineer | nah - not even method- done | 19:58 |
| * SuperEngineer slaps wrist for slipping back to coding language | 19:59 | |
| * popey ponders where to file a bug where brightness controls dont work | 20:01 | |
| MartijnVdS | popey: do they work after a suspend/resume cycle? | 20:02 |
| popey | dunno | 20:02 |
| popey | should i test after clean boot and after suspend? | 20:02 |
| MartijnVdS | because that's how it works on my Sony | 20:02 |
| popey | what, they only work after resume for you? | 20:02 |
| MartijnVdS | Yes, Fn+F<x> for brightness up/down only work after resuming from suspend :) | 20:03 |
| MartijnVdS | not after a clean boot | 20:03 |
| MartijnVdS | though I think it might have been fixed in Perfect | 20:03 |
| AlanBell | Precise | 20:03 |
| MartijnVdS | exactly | 20:03 |
| MartijnVdS | AlanBell: I keep mixing them up :) | 20:04 |
| AlanBell | one of these to be precise -> http://www.zooborns.com/zooborns/2009/06/ophaned-pangolin-baby.html | 20:04 |
| SuperEngineer | AlanBell, Precise[ly] | 20:04 |
| popey | i am on 12.04 | 20:05 |
| AlanBell | there are no pangolins in any zoos in the UK, and only a couple anywhere in europe | 20:05 |
| popey | AlanBell: any in budapest? | 20:05 |
| popey | or vienna? | 20:05 |
| AlanBell | Leipzig | 20:06 |
| penguin42 | AlanBell: I guess the brits tend to prefer furry things | 20:06 |
| AlanBell | penguin42: things that don't drop dead | 20:06 |
| AlanBell | they are very hard to feed apparently | 20:06 |
| penguin42 | AlanBell: Well, that does help | 20:06 |
| SuperEngineer | just seen the BBC article posted by popey re employer/CES.... nice one | 20:08 |
| SuperEngineer | http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-16415136 | 20:08 |
| popey | yeah, quite excited about it | 20:09 |
| SuperEngineer | with good reason | 20:09 |
| * penguin42 wonders if an A15 would ever end up in as an old-school package as that | 20:09 | |
| SuperEngineer | AlanBell, I am trying so hard not to reply to the "brits tend to prefer furry things" as this is a family friendly channel | 20:14 |
| SuperEngineer | ...but awww - you should be on stage! | 20:14 |
| SuperEngineer | ;) | 20:15 |
| moreati | popey: do you know if this is the first CES Canonical has exhibited at? | 20:15 |
| popey | it is AIUI | 20:15 |
| popey | we have attended before | 20:15 |
| popey | but not had something to show off / had a stand | 20:15 |
| AlanBell | first for Canonical, last for Microsoft | 20:16 |
| SuperEngineer | - and the above is this years catchphrase | 20:16 |
| moreati | AlanBell: you predict that, or they've stated that? | 20:16 |
| AlanBell | moreati: they have stated that, they are doing a corporate ragequit | 20:17 |
| SuperEngineer | what has offended them this time? | 20:18 |
| AlanBell | they won't reschedule CES to line up with Microsoft's release plans | 20:19 |
| MartijnVdS | aww poor mS | 20:19 |
| MartijnVdS | MS | 20:19 |
| SuperEngineer | [or weren't there enough copywrights to be punished if they attend] | 20:19 |
| AlanBell | in case you think I am making it up: http://www.tomshardware.com/news/CES-Microsoft-Xbox-Windows-8-Steve-Ballmer,14352.html | 20:19 |
| SuperEngineer | Canonical - quit CES now! they don't match up with Ubuntu release cycle! | 20:20 |
| popey | ☺ | 20:21 |
| AlanBell | SuperEngineer: yeah, but CES 13.04 will rock! | 20:21 |
| SuperEngineer | AlanBell, ;D | 20:22 |
| MartijnVdS | popey: Wow @ that DVD with lots of software | 20:23 |
| MartijnVdS | popey: reminds me of the pre-internet 90s when you could buy discs full of shareware | 20:24 |
| popey | yeah | 20:25 |
| popey | i used to get catalogs sent to me, and I'd order floppies | 20:25 |
| popey | one of the first shareware things I bought was a free pascal compiler | 20:25 |
| popey | loved that on my Epson 8088 10MHz CPU machine! | 20:25 |
| popey | 8086 | 20:26 |
| jutnux | Floppy Discs \o/ | 20:26 |
| MartijnVdS | We had an 8088 | 20:26 |
| MartijnVdS | "G2 Computer Systems" | 20:26 |
| * moreati goes misty eyed for the Amiga shareware wysiwyg editor Ami pro something or other | 20:27 | |
| MartijnVdS | Hercules graphics, 10MHz, Panasonic "IBM Proprinter compatible" printer | 20:27 |
| popey | Hercules! You were lucky! I had MDA! | 20:28 |
| popey | no graphics at all! | 20:28 |
| MartijnVdS | I installed an Soundblaster 2.0 in that one | 20:28 |
| MartijnVdS | popey: Awww | 20:28 |
| penguin42 | this is like the yorkshire coal sketch | 20:28 |
| * popey types set BLASTER=A220 I5 D1 H5 | 20:29 | |
| MartijnVdS | Ours had 2 20MB hard disks | 20:29 |
| popey | TWO! | 20:29 |
| MartijnVdS | popey: I5, because I7 was already in use by LPT1! :) | 20:29 |
| popey | mine had one 10MB disk | 20:29 |
| popey | ahhh of course | 20:29 |
| gordonjcp | popey: I used to keep signing up for Compuserve and AOL | 20:29 |
| moreati | IRQ, DMA and ___? | 20:29 |
| MartijnVdS | popey: My dad needed the second one for work | 20:29 |
| gordonjcp | popey: never had to buy a floppy, ever | 20:29 |
| jutnux | Casually killing a dragon on Skyrim | 20:29 |
| MartijnVdS | moreati: H5 means high DMA | 20:29 |
| MartijnVdS | moreati: for 16-bit transfers | 20:29 |
| gordonjcp | then when they switched to CDs I had plenty of bird scarers for my peas | 20:30 |
| popey | ☺ | 20:30 |
| moreati | thanks | 20:30 |
| gordonjcp | also | 20:30 |
| popey | AlanBell uses kubuntu CD's to entertain his Chickens | 20:30 |
| gordonjcp | popey: yeah, I've seen them | 20:30 |
| gordonjcp | as I just mentioned in another channel, many many years ago I installed GEM for an Amstrad 1640 on a 20MHz 286 | 20:30 |
| gordonjcp | with enough memory to run it from RAM disk | 20:30 |
| gordonjcp | holy hell that was quick | 20:31 |
| gordonjcp | I have never used such a responsive desktop since | 20:31 |
| * penguin42 went the Acorn route - BBC Master, then BBC Master with the 186 copro - DOS on that was odd | 20:31 | |
| AlanBell | the archimedes was a really fast desktop | 20:31 |
| MartijnVdS | After that 8088 my dad got a 486 off my uncle | 20:31 |
| penguin42 | AlanBell: Nod | 20:31 |
| MartijnVdS | and I got the 8088.. until it died and I got a 386-SX-25 | 20:31 |
| popey | XS! | 20:32 |
| popey | er | 20:32 |
| popey | SX! | 20:32 |
| popey | you want the DX my son! | 20:32 |
| popey | lubbly jubbly | 20:32 |
| moreati | beos is the most responsive desktop I remember using | 20:32 |
| MartijnVdS | popey: I was 14! I didn't have money yet :) | 20:33 |
| MartijnVdS | not DX money anyway | 20:33 |
| moreati | I'd forgotten 386-SX/DX existed, thought only 486 had done that | 20:34 |
| MartijnVdS | moreati: 16-bit data bus, for the cheap! | 20:35 |
| MartijnVdS | moreati: http://www.reddit.com/r/VXJunkies/ | 20:35 |
| moreati | MartijnVdS: erm, that makes no sense to me. what is a VX? | 20:37 |
| SuperEngineer | thoise would be the days when Peter Norton had the most useful & trusted software tools going | 20:38 |
| MartijnVdS | SuperEngineer: yes, lots and lots of two-letter utilities | 20:41 |
| MartijnVdS | moreati: It's meaningless treknobabble :) | 20:41 |
| MartijnVdS | moreati: and LOTS of it | 20:41 |
| moreati | Ah it's a Mornington Crescent variation | 20:41 |
| Supermanintights | hey guys, any suggestions on how to change a RAW to NTFS without losing the data? | 20:58 |
| MartijnVdS | raw? | 20:58 |
| Supermanintights | yeah, i.e. unformatted | 20:58 |
| MartijnVdS | if it's unformatted, there is no data to lose | 20:58 |
| Supermanintights | basically, I have a 2tb NTFS, with about 1.5tb data on there | 20:58 |
| AlanBell | how is there data? | 20:58 |
| Supermanintights | however it randomly changed to RAW for no reason, the data is still on there though | 20:59 |
| MartijnVdS | SuperEngineer: I'd start digging for backups | 20:59 |
| MartijnVdS | uhr | 20:59 |
| MartijnVdS | Supermanintights: | 20:59 |
| AlanBell | partition table gone? | 20:59 |
| Supermanintights | how do i check that AlanBell? | 20:59 |
| Supermanintights | and MartijnVdS - i don't have enough free space anywhere to back it up/recover - so i'm hoping to fix it without having to backup/format | 21:00 |
| AlanBell | step back a bit, why are you saying it is RAW? where are you seeing that? how do you know the data is there? | 21:00 |
| Supermanintights | sec | 21:00 |
| Supermanintights | i'll see if i can take screeny | 21:00 |
| MartijnVdS | Supermanintights: no I mean.. I hope you have a backup of that data, because if the partition table goes, you'll probably lose the entire disk | 21:00 |
| MartijnVdS | Supermanintights: If not now, then soon | 21:01 |
| Supermanintights | i know data is there because it happened to me before on a differnet HDD - I had to use recovery software on windows, but that took 2 days, and it was just 700gb | 21:01 |
| * AlanBell wonders what lessons we can learn from this | 21:01 | |
| MartijnVdS | Supermanintights: testdisk can find/restore partition tables | 21:01 |
| Supermanintights | just plugging hdd in now | 21:01 |
| jutnux | Did you not learn to backup most important bits of your data? | 21:01 |
| Supermanintights | most of what is on here IS the backup of what I recovered last time | 21:02 |
| Supermanintights | it happened a few weeks later | 21:02 |
| AlanBell | https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DataRecovery | 21:02 |
| MartijnVdS | this is why I don't buy USB disks anymore :| | 21:02 |
| Supermanintights | AlanBell, which aspect of that guide best applies to me? | 21:07 |
| Supermanintights | any idea? | 21:07 |
| MartijnVdS | https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DataRecovery#Lost_Partition ? | 21:13 |
| AlanBell | Supermanintights: no idea at all really, but it looks like an interesting page to read | 21:13 |
| AlanBell | so disks contain partitions, there are backups of the partition table scattered over the drive. | 21:13 |
| AlanBell | if the whole disk appears to have no partitions then recovering one of the backup partition tables sounds like a good idea | 21:14 |
| AlanBell | if one partition appears to have no filesystem in it then it is a different issue | 21:14 |
| Supermanintights | hmm, why/how can it just go from working ntfs to RAW as it if it's totally unpartitioned | 21:14 |
| ali1234 | what, what's not true | 21:14 |
| MartijnVdS | AlanBell: there are no backups of the partition table | 21:14 |
| funkyHat | There's a backup with GPT, but not with MBR | 21:15 |
| MartijnVdS | just partition contents, from which approximate (or perfect, depending on the filesystem) partition boundaries can be recreatede | 21:15 |
| AlanBell | did I misremember something? | 21:16 |
| Supermanintights | hmm, i can't open terminal - the little taskbar on the left of my screen won't show | 21:16 |
| jutnux | Cntrl+Alt+T | 21:17 |
| Supermanintights | ta | 21:17 |
| Supermanintights | so the usb drive looks to be MBR i think | 21:17 |
| funkyHat | AlanBell: perhaps you're thinking of filesystem metadata within ext*? | 21:20 |
| AlanBell | yeah, might be | 21:21 |
| AlanBell | whatever it is I am thinking of there are quite a lot of them | 21:21 |
| funkyHat | Well even GPT only writes its headers at the beginning and end of the device, and MBR is definitely only at the start | 21:22 |
| Supermanintights | hey guys | 21:43 |
| Supermanintights | i'm running testdisk | 21:43 |
| Supermanintights | what partition table type would I select - intel, efi gpt, mac, none, sun, xbox | 21:43 |
| Supermanintights | intel right? | 21:43 |
| ubuntubhoy | yeah | 21:44 |
| Supermanintights | ta | 21:44 |
| ubuntubhoy | how many times have you re-partitioned the drive ? | 21:44 |
| Supermanintights | erm | 21:44 |
| Supermanintights | none | 21:44 |
| Supermanintights | it was just used out of the box as ntfs | 21:44 |
| ubuntubhoy | quick analyse should do then | 21:44 |
| Supermanintights | i think | 21:45 |
| Supermanintights | i did quick search | 21:45 |
| Supermanintights | instantly it told me i can do deeper search or write | 21:45 |
| ubuntubhoy | but did it list the original setup | 21:48 |
| Supermanintights | don't know - i can get the gist of what it wants to do, but i don't understand it all that well | 21:48 |
| Supermanintights | i just click next til it works.. for better or worse | 21:49 |
| Supermanintights | right now i'm running the deeper search | 21:49 |
| ubuntubhoy | how big is the drive | 21:49 |
| Supermanintights | 2tb | 21:49 |
| Supermanintights | looks like it might take a while | 21:49 |
| ubuntubhoy | could take a while | 21:49 |
| ubuntubhoy | yip | 21:49 |
| Supermanintights | currently says "read error at 391/191/63 (lba=6293510) | 21:49 |
| penguin42 | not good | 21:51 |
| SuperEngineer | can it not just mark that block as bad & move on? | 21:52 |
| AlanBell | funkyHat: I was thinking of ext superblock backups | 21:58 |
| Nafallo | badblocks can | 21:58 |
| SuperEngineer | errrmmm... open Disk Utility and see if any SMART data for the drive exists? | 22:09 |
| SuperEngineer | [simple idea I know, but KISS principles always as 1st option!] | 22:11 |
| monsterwizard | Oh wow we have a super hero | 22:15 |
| monsterwizard | superengineer" | 22:15 |
| monsterwizard | I'd read that comic | 22:15 |
| * SuperEngineer blushes | 22:15 | |
| SuperEngineer | have fun folks, see you tomorrow [time for zeds] ;) | 22:29 |
| Supermanintights | back - it's still going, however that's the only error message it's come up with so far | 22:37 |
| Supermanintights | 14% done =/ | 22:37 |
| jutnux | And it's been like 5 hours | 23:49 |
| hamitron | what has? | 23:52 |
| jutnux | Superman's HDD recovery | 23:54 |
| penguin42 | ^ attempted | 23:54 |
| hamitron | doesn't sound very "super" ;/ | 23:54 |
| Supermanintights | well i've lost the ability to look at my task bar on the left, and see what applications are running (alt tab) | 23:55 |
| Supermanintights | so i daren't try find out too much | 23:56 |
| Supermanintights | too depressing when it's only probably on 25% or something | 23:56 |
| hamitron | :/ | 23:56 |
| Supermanintights | ah, 31% - and different read errors coming through now | 23:56 |
| Supermanintights | 51615/53/22 - lba=829198335 | 23:56 |
| hamitron | is the beta of 12.04 worth trying yet? | 23:58 |
| penguin42 | hamitron: Seems to mostly work for me | 23:59 |
| hamitron | cool | 23:59 |
| penguin42 | hamitron: Of course it might eat your cat | 23:59 |
| hamitron | my cat only complains anyway | 23:59 |
| hamitron | ;) | 23:59 |
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