dgroosHi high voltage -- what time's the meeting?18:17
dgroos* highvoltage18:18
highvoltagein around 40 minutes, dgroos18:18
highvoltageanyone here for the Edubuntu meeting?19:02
highvoltagestgraber, dgroos, mgariepy, alkisg: around?19:04
highvoltageI guess I'll start off by mentioning some news19:04
dgroosa round and as usual, a square ;)19:04
highvoltage- Edubuntu 12.04 will be an LTS version19:04
highvoltageWe went through the process with the Technical Board and they approved it on Monday19:04
dgroosnice! congrats.19:05
highvoltageI put together a quick blog post about it for the edubuntu blog: http://edubuntu.org/2012-01-10/edubuntu-lts-status19:05
highvoltage- stgraber has been cleaning the python build dependencies for packages shipped with Edubuntu19:05
highvoltagewe don't have any legacy python dh scripts anymore19:05
* alkisg waves19:06
highvoltageanyone else have any news to share?19:06
highvoltageone of our goals for 12.04 is also to create some bite size tasks for Unity lenses19:07
highvoltagethey're reasonably simple to create and may be really useful in education19:07
dgroosUnity lenses?19:07
highvoltageyep, let me see if I can find a link with more info...19:07
dgroosbtw, how easy will the JRE install, be?19:08
dgroos(from your blog post)19:08
highvoltagewell, here's a somewhat technical page describing lenses: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/Lenses19:08
highvoltagedgroos: very easy, the java we're shipping now will just be an apt-get / software center install away. you won't need additional archives or anything fancy.19:09
highvoltagedgroos: basically, lenses allow you to display data you have on your system (or on the internet) in a specially organised way19:10
highvoltagedgroos: have you seen Ubuntu TV? it's main interface is actually a unity lense.19:10
dgroosNot yet, but will check it out.  Is this a way that we could do edubuntu-menu type stuff?19:11
highvoltageyou could probably implement something like per-grade menus with that19:11
dgrooscould it be per-group menus? (user groups)19:12
highvoltageI'm wondering if we should do weekly meetings again too19:12
perea better way is probably to use desktop-profiles.19:12
highvoltageI think we kind of lost momentum doing it monthly19:13
pereit would allow per-group menu reordering.19:13
highvoltageindeed, desktop-profiles work great for that19:13
dgroosThanks, I'll check into these as well.19:13
highvoltageI've been looking at our artwork situation last week19:14
perehttp://packages.debian.org/squeeze/i386/education-menus/filelist show a desktop-profiles package reordering KDE and Gnome menus.19:14
dgroospere: thanks.19:15
highvoltageI think that we should actually stick with the wallpaper we used in 11.10. We had great feedback on it and we never really extended it to the whole system. I think it might actually be best to extend that artwork and polish it up more rather than changing it19:15
highvoltageWill talk about that on-list to see if there's any ideas/objections/etc19:15
highvoltagepere: I haven't had much chance yet to try to integrate an edubuntu machine into a debian-edu network yet19:16
peretoo bad.  squeeze/beta2 is very good now. :)19:17
highvoltagepere: but I've gotten some big hairy sticky things off from my todo list so I should get to it sooner now19:17
dgrooswill there be any changes in users and groups tool--sorry I've dropped out of the loop.19:19
highvoltagewell, even if we get it right with some documentation on what users have to do, I guess it won't be that bad. if we have something working then we can get it *great* for the next release(s)19:19
highvoltagedgroos: nothing planned as far as I know. aparently the kde users and groups tool is a lot better and someone even suggested that we ship that, but I doubt it would happen19:20
highvoltagedgroos: I guess when we have freeipa in ubuntu we'd probably use that in edubuntu19:20
dgroosI did end up using their tool a couple of years ago due to a bug in the GNOME tool.19:21
perehighvoltage: in theory all you should need to integrate a ubuntu machine into a skolelinux network should be to install libpam-sss and libnss-sss, and the rest will happen automatically. :)19:21
dgroosCool.  How about LDAP tool?  I mean a tool that doesn't take too much sys knowledge?19:22
highvoltagepere: I'll try that and paste that back if it doesn't work :)19:22
highvoltagedgroos: that's what freeipa does as well. you get user management and ldap/kerberos/etc all in one19:22
peredgroos: jxplorer seem to be the best gui for ldap editing.19:22
highvoltagedgroos: and on the client side you install sssd and then you pretty much have authentication against it and cached credentials / kerberos tickets / etc.19:23
perein Debian Edu/Squeeze, we set up a LDAP backed Kerberos server out of the box, and use sssd for the laptop setup to allow laptops to work also without connection to the LDAP/Kerberos server.19:25
highvoltageanything else that anyone wants to bring up? I guess alkisg, mgariepy and stgraber is busy elsewhere atm :)19:25
highvoltagepere: I didn't realise it did all of that already. When I have a working setup I'll document it for the edubuntu website too19:25
peream I allowed to talk about Debian Edu?19:25
highvoltagepere: as much as you want!19:26
perehighvoltage: it does all that and more. :)19:26
dgroosI think it's great the collaboration that has started between the diff distress.19:26
perein Debian Edu, we have automatic configuration of Nagios and Munin, where clients register with the server and the server automatically start to monitor the services on the clients.19:26
perethis is done using the sitesummary package.19:26
highvoltageI've never heard of that19:27
perewe also provide KDE, Gnome and LXDE as desktop solutions.  KDE get most work, but the others seem to work fine as well.19:27
highvoltagelooking at the package description it looks like it could be useful for a bunch of stuff19:27
pereSee <URL: http://narvikskolen.no/munin/localdomain/localhost.localdomain.html#Sitesummary > for the munin count for the city of Narvik. :)19:28
pereThe admin set site to be the name of the school, and the stat show how many computers report in from each school. :)19:28
dgroosWow--mucho info.19:29
perehttp://lists.debian.org/debian-edu-announce/2012/01/msg00000.html is the announcement for beta2 of Debian Edu/Squeeze, which I hope to have ready in a few weeks.19:30
highvoltageI'm a bit unsure, is this the first squeeze release for debian-edu? or just the point release update?19:30
perewe also provide LTSP setup out of the box, with either thin clients (X terminals running everything on the server) or diskless workstations (workstations running everything locally but with no disk - root is NFS).19:31
perewhen we are done, it will be the first squeeze release for debian edu.19:31
pereprogress has been slow since I got my second kid. :)19:31
highvoltageI guess we can announce that on the Edubuntu website too when it's ready, if that's ok19:32
pereabsolutely. :)19:32
pereone nice feature is our roaming workstation profile, which is the laptop setup with connections to the LDAP/Kerberos server.19:32
highvoltageI'm sure I've seen you post it before in #debian-edu, but where's the link to the iso that should be tested?19:32
pereI made it autodetect everything in a way that allow me to install it at the university of oslo network and get it to connect to the uio.no infrastructure instead.19:33
dgroosThat is an important feature for schools that allow integration of student laptops into their network.19:33
pereI made a pam module that create a local home directory for the user on the first login, and after that the user can take the laptop with him and log using the cached password.19:33
perehighvoltage: at the end of <URL: http://lists.debian.org/debian-edu-announce/2012/01/msg00000.html > are the links to the ISOs.19:34
perewe also look up the networked home directory and provide a KDE and Gnome shortcut to the SMB exported home directory.  Thanks to Kerberos, this worked flawlessly at the university. :)19:34
pereI could just click on the link and get direct access to my university home directory. :)19:35
dgrooscool, very useful.19:36
pereI guess that is enough adverticement for now. :)  There are heaps of other nice stuff in Debian Edu, so check it out. :)19:36
highvoltagethat's pretty neet19:36
* alkisg wants to try debian-edu in a school some time, but didn't have the chance to do it yet19:37
highvoltagepere: yeah features like that are a bit harder to just find by yourself though. thanks for mentioning it :)19:37
alkisghighvoltage: about the weekly vs monthly meetings... why not every 2 weeks?19:37
highvoltagealkisg: well, I just sent a mail to the list about it. I think perhaps every week but with alternating times19:37
highvoltagealkisg: this timezone is hard for some people in your timezone because it's in the evening, so perhaps there should be an earlier slot too19:38
highvoltagealkisg: but I guess every 2 weeks would be fine too19:38
alkisgNah, at 9 a.m. here teachers are at schools so they couldn't attend meetings. It might help people in other timezones though19:39
highvoltagealkisg: perhaps we could try that first19:39
highvoltagewell 9:00 UTC would be around 11am for you19:39
alkisgAh 9 UTC, not 7 UTC... same thing though19:39
highvoltagebut yes, they'd still be at school19:39
perefor me it need to be after the kids are in bed, so 19:00 UTC was fine.19:40
alkisgIt'd be interesting to try alternate meeting times, yup19:40
highvoltageso perhaps we should keep the last wednesday of the month at 19:00 UTC19:40
highvoltageand then have another one the second wednesday of the month on another time19:40
highvoltagewe've had a few people say before that 19:00 never works well for them19:41
highvoltageso it would be nice to have an alternate time19:41
dgroosI can only do it now since I'm not teaching this year.19:41
highvoltageyeah I think you, dinda and flint asked for alternate times a few times19:42
highvoltageok, I'll update that to the list too19:42
highvoltageI have nothing more, anything else before we wrap up?19:42
alkisgSome small news about epoptes, a new version with groups support will be released soon, I hope stgraber can import it even though we're past debianimportfreeze19:43
highvoltagecool, that's a nice feature19:44
dgroosFor sure.19:44
highvoltagepere: have you seen epoptes before?19:44
highvoltagepere: it's similar in some of its functionality to italc, we're moving away from italc to epoptes in edubuntu: http://www.epoptes.org/19:46
perehighvoltage: nope.  the italc alternative I know about is controlaula.19:47
pereI have not investigated any of them.19:47
perethe german group in Debian Edu use italc, and the spanish group use controlaula.19:47
perehighvoltage: why do you move away from italc?19:48
highvoltagepere: stgraber pointed out some concerns over its supportability over the long term. epoptes seems to have less crud and it's very actively maintained by alkisg19:49
alkisgAnd the reason we developed epoptes in the first place was that italc crashed in more than 50% of our systems...19:50
peredoes it work for non-linux machines?19:50
alkisgIt works on most Linux DEs, but not on non-linux machines19:51
pereright.  I have vague memories of icalc or controlaula working on windows and mac, but might be mistaken.19:51
alkisgItalc does work on windows. The problem is that it's not maintained on linux...19:51
alkisg...e.g. logout/reboot/shutdown has not been working on linux for years19:52
dgroosI always found iTALC unstable and if a teacher can't depend on something, better to not to even try it.19:53
dgroosThat's why I like epoptes.19:53
pereright.  did any of you try <URL: http://packages.qa.debian.org/c/controlaula.html >?19:54
highvoltageI've only heard of it before but haven't seen it19:55
alkisgI did, and while it has a lot of features, it's too focused on the specific installations done in Spain...19:55
alkisgI don't think I got it working, and I had to format to get it properly removed :(19:55
alkisgBut that was 2-3 years ago, haven't looked at its progress since19:55
highvoltagescreenshots look java'y19:55
highvoltageI need to go, can we call it a meeting?19:57
alkisgThank you highvoltage :)19:57
dgroosI like the, "…share information and files easily".  Reminds me of the coccinella I just read about --use jabber?19:57
dgroosThanks highvoltage as always.19:57
highvoltageand thanks alkisg, dgroos, pere and tedmasterweb for being here :)19:58
highvoltageI'll paste the meeting notes and log to the edubuntu-devel list tomorrow19:58
peredgroos: yes, coccinella use the jabber protocol.  I just sponsored it into Debian.19:58
perehighvoltage: see you later. :)19:59
dgroosthat was you!  It is way cool.19:59
peredgroos: its maintainer hang on #debian-edu (irc.debian.org).19:59
dgroospere: does controlaula use it?19:59
peredgroos: no idea, but I doubt it.19:59
dgroosI'll be watching it--I'm also watching how plone implements XMMP, it opens up lots of possibilities.20:00
pereyeah, XMPP looks very promising. :)20:01
perechat, audio, video and whiteboard in one protocol.  but not one tool yet. :)20:01
dgroosMy studies focus on how software can scaffold group collaboration and bring it to a level higher then available due to limitations of students' cognition/social levels.20:02
dgroosSure.  Hey, I've been wondering, do you know CmapTools/CmapServer, pere?20:02
peredgroos: nope.  what do they do?20:02
dgroosThey are a great combo but not open source--though they are free.  They allow for20:03
dgroosindividual or group/synchronous mapping.20:03
perebtw, regarding school settings.  you might be interested in <URL: http://people.skolelinux.org/pere/blog/Changing_the_default_Iceweasel_start_page_in_Debian_Edu_Squeeze.html >. :)20:04
dgroosFor example, here's one I just made to show the steps of a unit I taught and the research I did on it: http://ci-cmap.oit.umn.edu:8009/rid=1K5NH8JPQ-1YGSKFB-Q70/Knowledgebuilding2.cmap.jpg?rid=1K5NH8JPQ-1YGSKFB-Q70&partName=htmljpeg20:04
pereright, so a kind of mind mapper?20:05
perefreemind is the only one we have slightly looked at for Debian Edu.20:06
pereI did not track that, so I do not know what was concluded regarding it.  I notice it is not included in our DVD.20:06
dgroosThe CmapServer part is a web server, allowing both synch. editing as well as instant publishing to the web.20:07
dgroosI've tried out free mind but I don't see how to easily do this...20:07
dgroosthat is, making the links between the nodes.20:08
dgroosI wonder if XMPP would be the platform on which to build an open source concept mapping/mind-mapping tool.20:10
dgroosAny thoughts?20:10
dgroos*on that :)20:10
perenope, outside my area of expertice. :)20:13
dgroos'k thanks, thought I would ask, you never know… :)20:14
pereI just sponsored the package on request.  I do not know much about XMPP.20:15
pereif you want a package in Debian, my offer is listed on <URL: http://www.hungry.com/~pere/debian-sponsoring.html >. :)20:15
dgroosCool, I'll check it out.20:16
dgrooshighvoltage: ping?21:06

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