=== smoser` is now known as smoser [12:12] G'mornin' [12:31] morning [12:32] and why did you give brousch your share of volcano tacos? There's other people here too, y'know [12:33] although I probably won't be getting many more volcano tacos until after the beefy crunch burritos go away again [12:35] OK, wtf is up with an article about alternate Android launchers that doesn't show screenshots? http://www.webopedia.com/quick_ref/android_homescreen_launchers.html [13:01] party [13:10] rick_h__: you back? [13:12] not until sat [13:13] ah, so no party yet [13:13] you're missing all the snow [13:15] crap, someone go shovel out my wife please :) [13:16] right, i'll be there in 3 hours [13:16] i don't think detroit are got much [13:20] Nah. Hardly anything. Just enough to make everybody drive like near-sighted grannies [13:21] but the rain/snow mix did make some less-traveled roads slippery [14:03] rick_h__: We got a smattering at best by us [14:04] snap-l: ah cool thanks [14:04] when I left the 10 day had no snow [14:04] so hoped she didn't get stuck shoveling [14:04] Unless Clarkston got hard-hit, she'll be fine [14:06] Just enough to say it snowed, but not enough to shovel [14:06] at least not yet. [14:07] though currently it's not snowing [14:11] cool [14:53] Where do I file my petition to request more snow? [14:58] tjagoda: in the gassy depths of ur anus [15:08] omg, this is what i feel like when snap-l starts talking music http://amultiverse.com/2012/01/13/horace-greenstein-scary-owl-lawyer-purchases-music/ [15:18] Reminds me of HIgh Fidelity [15:18] (the movie) [15:18] And yes, I'm guilty of that. I'll admint it. [15:22] Beige Lines? LOL [15:23] and yeah, that does remind me very much of High Fidelity [15:24] I was not aware Multiverse was still running. I thought it was stopping or something. If not, I have nfc why I unsubscribed the feed... I loved that strip [15:26] wheee, I'm slap happy after this week and coming up on demo time [15:27] ...ummm...we...did stuff......ugh [15:28] yawn [15:32] So what massive improvements have you made to LP, rick_h__ ? [15:34] He could tell you, Wolfger, but then he'd have to kill you. [16:16] rick_h__: How does it feel to be a superstar? :) [16:24] Didn't rick_h apply to cannonical like 6,000,000 times? [16:27] tjagoda: I think we all have. [16:27] At least I feel like I have. [16:28] I just haven't hit critical-mass-awesome-levels like rick_h__ has. ;) [16:28] There are no work from home network admin jobs. =( [16:29] Actually, at SF>net there were [16:29] But when something went pear-shaped at the data center, someone had to go in to fix shit [16:38] heh, I ripped out an old JS framework, implemented a YUI combo loader, and saving about 600k and 1-3seconds on page load time :) [16:38] heh, snap-l must not have hit my old code yet if he's being nice to me [16:38] rick_h__: Show-off [16:38] rick_h__: Haven't hit any of the web development stuff yet. [16:38] rick_h__: Though I have some opinions on your venv setup. ;) [16:40] Yay 1-3 seconds [16:40] I always remembered launchpad being slooow. [16:41] snap-l: hah! [16:41] see, there we go [16:41] what did I mess up? [16:50] rick_h__: just not a fan of where the venv is placed in relation to the code [16:50] see pm [17:06] Going to burger king and getting onions rings with no onion ring sauce inspires the fury of 10,000 burning suns within my soul. [17:25] That's just indigestion [17:35] tjagoda: there's such a thing as "onion sauce"? [17:36] I trust tjagoda to know everything I need to know about fast food [17:43] s/everything/more than/ [17:49] I am a single man [17:49] Fast Food is my break from Ramen noodles [17:49] =p [18:03] http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=fYTPhuPuF20 [18:03] good to see "little brother" is still watchign the watchmen [18:10] snap-l: how do organize your venvs? mine tend to look like this http://paste.mitechie.com/show/490/ [19:04] huh, I hadn't noticed that lodgeIt sets a cookie and then if someone replies to your paste while you were away, it tells you at the top when you come back. [19:23] brousch: I put my venvs under ~/.virtualenv [19:23] and then use virtualenvwrapper to keep trak [19:23] track, even [19:26] where does your code go? [19:26] in a directory outside of the env [19:26] dev is under projects [19:27] deployment is wherever is conventional [19:27] but the venv is separate from the codebase [19:28] so if I want to have a webapps venv, I can [19:28] or if I want each web app to have a separate venv, I can configure that with apache [19:28] (note: this assumes you have access to change apache config) [19:29] That way, if someone broke into your app, they couldn't easily inject malicious code into your venv environment [19:29] (at least, not by using ../../etc [19:31] interesting [19:32] Call me old-fashioned but I don't like putting libraries within easy reach on a web server. [19:32] That's one thing that irritates me no end with PHP [19:33] especially when the way to fix a problem (from the developers themselves) is to run chmod 777 [19:33] I want to punch babies when I see that [19:37] ugh. This day can be over now [19:37] Wolfger: That good, eh? [19:37] why do things always go South on a Friday? [19:37] chmod 777, the Windows solution to *nix permissions problems [19:38] wow. that was a delay. I typed that a while ago [19:41] This just made my day: http://www.businessinsider.com/judge-tells-oracle-its-6-billion-claim-against-google-android-is-a-joke-2012-1 [19:42] I relaly think Oracle should just get stuffed. [19:43] If Google did something wrong, they should pay up... but the judge is absolutely right that 6.1 billion is a ludicrous claim for damages [19:44] At least show your work. [19:45] That's all the judge is asking [19:45] Uh... no. He's asking them for a new figure, per the article [19:50] Right, because they haven't shown how they arrived at the original number [19:51] Although I really hope that Google didn't have a conversation about licensing the JDK prior to not licensing [19:51] because that'll suck [19:53] I think those are the e-mails mentioned [19:54] and I didn't get from the article that they *haven't* show their work, my interpretation was that the judge didn't like their work. [19:55] "until Oracle comes up with a reasonable method" says to me that he saw their method and found it unreasonable [19:55] If you file for damages with just a number and no work at all to show how you got that number, you should just get laughed out of the courtroom entirely. [19:56] but, that's 6 of one or a half-dozen of the other. Either way, same end story. [19:56] am i crazy for thinking this is an insane way of keeping track of the days of week and times a store is open? http://paste.mitechie.com/show/491/ [19:57] brousch: No, you are crazy for other reasons entirely [19:58] i didn't write that. i'm trying to make sense of it [20:00] brousch: I'd say it's insane if it doesn't use built-in date/time libraries [20:00] I gave up trying to make sense of it when the example was "assuming a week = 10 minutes" [20:00] I don't gather if it does or doesn't from the description [20:01] i think it stores these things as minutes from sunday at midnight [20:01] wtf [20:01] I'm sure somebody thought they came up with some very clever solution to their problem... [20:02] so clever that I understand neither the solution nor the problem it's trying to solve [20:02] the problem is they want to know when a particular store is open or closed [20:03] so this is how they store the open and closed times [20:03] not very flexible either. some places' hours change with the season and holidays [20:04] time zones? [20:04] ah well, all i really need to do right now is fudge in a record so my store appears to be open right now [20:04] time zones are somewhere else i guess [20:05] it's all grand rapids right now, so they haven't worried [20:05] I mean, if info is stored in terms of "minutes from midnight Sunday", you would need to know the time zone differential between the store and the server. [20:05] ah, ok [20:06] and on that note.... time to call it a week. [20:06] this store is closed :-) [20:06] it's only 3pm slacker [20:06] 3pm? [20:06] * rick_h__ is packing so he can get up at 3am and head to the airport [20:07] wee [20:07] yea, party party [20:07] man I can't wait to get home [20:07] but someone mentioned that monday is a holiday so !!!!!!!! [20:09] not for me [20:09] though it is my last day of paternity leave [20:09] (don't remind me that I'm actually working some have-to stuff that is due EOW right now) [20:09] greg-g: oh, well good to get back [20:10] yeah [20:10] it'll be nice to get back into the swing of things, really [20:10] felt really out of it lately [20:11] yea, it'll be good [20:14] they're also using these things called jsonfields where they type json into a django admin text field [20:14] what? jsonfields? [20:14] they're using it to store addresses and contact info. that seems lazy [20:15] wtf, I ranted on django here. We're building some new crap with it and I'm very unhappy [20:15] you type json into the text field, it stores as a string, then converts to dict when it's reetrieved [20:15] seems very fragile and lazy [20:16] i mean, you have to type the json exactly right or it'll be broken when you use it [20:17] to be fair, jsonfield is not in django core, it is some thing various people have hacked up [20:18] yea, gotcha [20:18] well I'm tired and very ranty [20:18] it doesn't make sense to me [20:18] I'm not a fan of "these are all the freaking reasons NOT to use django...ok so what are your reasons for?" [20:18] "umm, it's very popular. There's a large base of people that use it" [20:18] make an address table, make a contacts table, link them in like normal [20:19] brousch: probably because they just want a key value type store and it's used over an API [20:19] rick_h__: "it looks good on a resume" [20:20] there is an api, but they don't use it yet [20:20] Just save a UNIX time-stamp and use seconds. ;) [20:21] brousch: then go tell them that "this one angry dev I know wants to know WTF is up with this POS" [20:21] heh [20:21] well i'll do that monday [20:22] this is a site for a local startup/charity. i don't know who actually created this mess [20:22] ask at the next grwebdev [20:23] I'm sure someone knows [20:23] but it's _really_ hard to find an experienced django dev in GR, so i suspect it was a n00b [20:23] monday is grpug [20:23] the startup owner will be there, so i can ask him [20:24] "who developed this, and did they leave their crack pip behind?" [20:24] s/pip/pipe/ [20:25] but really, why not just store a street address as a string? why break it up into pieces and save it as json? [20:27] sorry for the rant. it really has me going wtf [20:28] WEll, and what happens when you have a PO box? [20:28] or deal with addresses from another country? [20:29] I'm sure a Canadian zip code will break shit [20:33] technically this is for restaurants, so they're likely to have a real address. [20:33] but surely there's a standard and rrobust way of storing addresses in a django database [20:35] ok, i guess not, but i see a couple of alpha/beta things for it [21:10] addresses are funny things [21:10] so many parts and depends on where you are [21:13] Yeah, it's not something that you can slice and dice like that and expect to work [21:13] kind of like 7 digit phone numbers [21:14] 70015551212 = ??? [21:14] actually, i borked that [21:14] was thinking 7 for external line [21:14] 001 for country code [21:15] 555 area code, 5551515 for the whatever you call the last 7 digits of a phone number [21:15] i expected a module you could plugin to handle addresses anywhere in the world. this the world wide web [21:16] I thought this was the internets, where we could still use 7 bit ascii [21:16] probably easy :) [21:16] fuck, I'm in the wrong area then [21:25] cool, checked in for flight tomorrow [21:25] with little images on my phone [21:33] rick_h__: doesn't canonical use django in a few places already? [21:34] rick_h__: That's pretty neat. [21:35] brousch: yes, a ton [21:35] doesn't make it less wrong :) [21:36] django does everything! [21:36] * rick_h__ hangs head [21:37] i'm a little ashamed to admit i am enjoying poking around in it again [21:37] luckily rick_h__ is thousands of miles away and cannot kick me in the head [21:38] I'm too tired to fight any more [21:38] woohoo! [21:38] and I'm going to be stuck with it [21:38] I don't get to develop the project, but I'll have to maintain it [21:38] django orm is the bizziggidzomb [21:39] ok, now you're just poking me [21:41] when do you take off? [21:42] actually trying to get the paths and django settings hooked up right in this app was driving me bonkers. [21:43] 6am, cab leaves 3:30am, currently 11pm [21:43] coming up on that is [21:43] go to bed [21:43] can't [21:44] watching the guys play illumnati or something [21:44] they're attacking the federal reserve, whatever that means [21:46] boo, can't pull this up http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/ofwfj/the_top_10_javascript_mvc_frameworks_reviewed/ [21:49] it just says "Jquery winning!" [21:59] illuminati the card game? :) [21:59] Steve Jackson Games. [21:59] snap-l: yea, some card game with "mega bucks" and rolling of die [22:00] Yeah, you play illuminati, and can control different branches and items like the boy scouts, the Gnomes of ZUrich, etc. [22:00] I've been meaning to pick that up [22:00] yea, they've got MTV and a bunch of stuff [22:00] kind of crazy to listen to honestly [22:01] It's all about influence. [22:01] Surprised they're playing it. Seemed like the popularity was more in the 1990s. [22:01] But cool nonetheless.