[05:50] <snadge> yo!
[05:51] <snadge> smspillaz in da house? :p
[07:06] <alkisg> Hi, is there any option for unity alt+tab switch to NOT group similar windows? It's a real pain to switch between 2 gedit windows with the keyboard...
[07:06] <alkisg> I press alt+tab once to have the windows list, then 10 times to cycle between my other windows, then wait 2 seconds in the gedit button so that the 2 gedit window previews are shown, and then try to read the thumbnail to decide which is the gedit window I'm in and which one is the other I want to get to.
[07:19] <alkisg> I installed the compizconfig-settings-manager and saw some options for the unity switcher there, but there was no option to never group similar windows
[07:20] <snadge> alkisg: try alt ~
[07:22] <alkisg> snadge: thanks a lot, that solves half of my problem. The other half is when I want to switch from e.g. pidgin to one of those 2 gedit windows, where the "never group windows" option would be necessary.
[07:22] <alkisg> *handy, of course not necessary, I can live with taking 10 seconds to find the correct window :)
[07:23] <snadge> well.. as annoying as unity is.. often people come unstuck with it
[07:24] <snadge> because they're trying to do force it to do something an old fashioned way
[07:24] <snadge> when theres a newer much simpler way of doing it
[07:24] <snadge> i find using workspaces more effectively works around that problem
[07:25] <alkisg> I tried to use workspaces a couple of years ago, but I didn't manage to increase my productivity with them
[07:25] <snadge> you would alt tab until you get to the gedit icon. then press the down key, and select the gedit window you want
[07:25] <snadge> then alt tab will switch between pidgin and that particular gedit window
[07:27] <alkisg> snadge: if you have some more time, could you tell me how are you using workspaces? Do you have discrete usage patterns, i.e. "programming" "surfing" and put the windows for each pattern to one workspace?
[07:27] <snadge> the idea behind the grouping is that it makes it easier to find the application you want to switch to.. if you have 10 programs open and each program has 6 or more windows associated with it.. it becomes confusing
[07:27] <snadge> basically yes
[07:27] <alkisg> Because I have e.g. 10 apps open at all times, but no discrete way to split them into workspaces, and I like to always work with maximized apps....
[07:27] <snadge> i dont have any applications overlapping
[07:28] <snadge> and i know which workspace has the app/window that im looking for
[07:28] <snadge> so i just use ctrl-alt and arrow keys to pan between the different workspaces
[07:28] <snadge> so i never have to use alt-tab
[07:28] <alkisg> How many workspaces are you actively using?
[07:28] <snadge> at the moment 8
[07:28] <snadge> at home.. only 4
[07:29] <alkisg> So at most you have to press 4 shortcuts to switch to the one you want...
[07:29] <alkisg> Not bad
[07:29] <snadge> you just get used to it after a while.. i dont even think of it that way
[07:29] <snadge> ill just go.. ctrl-alt up right right
[07:29] <alkisg> You basically replaced "alt-tab" with "workspaces" :)
[07:30] <snadge> yeah that way i dont have to bother with overlapping windows.. which is annoying
[07:30] <snadge> i basically ignore the unity panel.. although.. if i have to find a window that i've lost
[07:30] <snadge> i'll sometimes use that
[07:30] <snadge> i also use it to launch commonly used applications
[07:31] <alkisg> What I was doing so far, was to remember how many times to press alt+tab to go to a set of 3-4 apps that I'm concurrently using. For the rest of them, I looked at the bottom panel, and used the mouse.
[07:31] <snadge> i basically used gnome 2 the same way.. the biggest thing that upset me with the transition to gnome 3
[07:31] <snadge> was the lack of panel applets
[07:31] <alkisg> Now, when I have to switch between 3 windows (say, pidgin, gedit, console), it's a pain, I haven't figured out how to best do it yet
[07:32] <alkisg> Yes, it's the first time for me to miss the panels (from 10.04 directly to 12.04, I like LTS releases :))
[07:32] <snadge> have pidgin, gedit and console on seperate workspaces ;)
[07:32] <snadge> also
[07:32] <snadge> if you press the windows (mod) key.. you will see numbers show up on the top 10 items on the panel
[07:33] <snadge> so you could number pidgin, gedit and console
[07:33] <snadge> and just hit mod+8, mod+9, mod+0 for example
[07:33] <alkisg> I've seen that but I didn't get to use it yet. I think that's the best course for me... alt+number, and then alt ~
[07:34] <snadge> its mostly old people that have the issue with how the desktop is changing
[07:34] <alkisg> I'll just have to organize my mind to map from console to 1, pidgin to 2, gedit to 3, firefox to 4 etc
[07:34] <snadge> im 30 myself.. and at first, it grossly offended me the radical change.. and the regression in functionality
[07:35] <snadge> but i've been using unity now for a few months
[07:35] <alkisg> Yes after 20 years of the same desktop concept (i'm 38), it's difficult to change, especially if it requires more seconds to do a tasks
[07:35] <snadge> and i like it now.. i dont care about gnome 2 anymore
[07:35] <snadge> i dont miss it at all
[07:35] <alkisg> I do like the extra screen space, it's the task switching and lack of directly seeing which apps are running that bothers me
[07:36] <snadge> linus torvalds felt the same way apparently.. strongly enough to switch to xfce
[07:36] <alkisg> I guess I'll get used to it, and find other ways to do quickly the things I do frequently... :)
[07:36] <snadge> right.. i also recommend reading a guide on unity shortcuts
[07:36] <snadge> i dont have one off hand.. but i googled for it.. and learned tips and tricks from that
[07:37] <snadge> its slower at first.. but after you find more efficient ways to do things.. it becomes much less annoying
[07:37] <snadge> xfce is just way too horrible for me to even consider using
[07:37] <snadge> but i guess if you absolutely must have a traditional task switcher.. its one of the few remaining options
[07:38] <snadge> i just figured.. why try to fight it ;)
[07:38] <alkisg> I put 11.04 to my daughter's and wife's laptops
[07:38] <snadge> i think that still has "gnome-classic" option from memory
[07:38] <alkisg> They both had me revert their laptops to 10.04 within a week
[07:39] <snadge> 11.10 has dropped support for gnome classic.. thats when i was forced to make the switch
[07:39] <alkisg> I then tried gnome-classic in my daughter's laptop, she could live with it
[07:39] <snadge> i like unity now.. i honestly think its better than gnome-shell
[07:39] <smspillaz> snadge: kind of, but pretty busy atm, whats wrong ?
[07:39] <alkisg> Dropped support? Wow :(
[07:40] <snadge> smspillaz: just checking up on the silly workspace switching focus issue ;)
[07:40] <smspillaz> I haven't had time to look at it yte
[07:40] <smspillaz> been on planes / sick etc etc etc
[07:40] <snadge> bugger :/
[07:40] <snadge> maybe someone should report an issue on launchpad for it? or you'll get to it eventually? :p
[07:40] <smspillaz> I'll get to it eventually
[07:41] <snadge> alkisg: i know this is going to sound treasonous.. but centos still uses gnome 2
[07:41] <snadge> and will be supported for many years
[07:41] <alkisg> (09:39:43 πμ) snadge: i like unity now.. i honestly think its better than gnome-shell ==> but do you honestly think it's better than gnome-2's panels?
[07:41] <snadge> but .. i honestly think unity is worth investing the time into learning how to use efficiently
[07:42] <snadge> well.. like i said, i dont miss gnome 2.. i spent about a week or two being frustrated by it
[07:42] <snadge> but that was many months ago, and i simply dont care now
[07:43] <snadge> it would've been nice if both the gnome-shell and the unity devs.. provided more assistance for people who dont wish to radically alter the way they've been doing things for years.. its quite a rude shock for many people
[07:43] <alkisg> I will... I'm in charge of deployments in about 250 schools, so I want to really push myself to like unity. If I can't, then maybe we'll try KDE or LXDE...
[07:43] <snadge> yes.. its better.. yes, i can see why they've made the decisions they have.. but they've had time to get used to it, and they're desktop interface "experts"
[07:44] <snadge> other people just load it for the first time.. and go "what the *expletive*"
[07:44] <snadge> and its a very common reaction to get angry and start screaming blue murder
[07:44] <snadge> i can't believe that was never considered important
[07:45] <snadge> the kids will have much less issue with unity or gnome shell.. i guarantee that
[07:45] <snadge> kids brains are much more adaptive
[07:45] <alkisg> Hmmm not sure about that . My 11 year old daughter, ubuntu user since 3 years, reported that she likes them in this order: "gnome-2, gnome-classic, KDE, unity". Now I have kubuntu in her laptop, and lubuntu in the other one...
[07:46] <alkisg> The other one adapted to lubuntu very quickly, the first one cried until I replaced unity :P
[07:46] <snadge> perhaps i meant kids with zero exposure to traditional desktop windowing systems
[07:46] <snadge> or kids that use macos x
[07:46] <alkisg> It's very difficult to find them nowadays though
[07:47] <alkisg> Maybe, no experience with macos X
[07:47] <snadge> if you think unity is bad.. have you tried gnome-shell? .. ergh
[07:47] <snadge> thats a definite wtf were they thinking
[07:47] <alkisg> No thanks :D I don't even care to see how it looks!
[07:47] <alkisg> Hehe
[07:48] <snadge> perhaps you should try it.. then you'll be like.. hey this unity is actually pretty good ;)
[07:48] <alkisg> Hehehe don't tell that idea to my wife, she'll have me looking at fat ugly women all the time :D
[07:49] <snadge> same with OS X.. it still confuses the daylights out of me.. granted i've only used OSX for a grand total of like 2 minutes
[07:49] <snadge> but it horrifies me
[08:09]  * alkisg settled in using win+number to launch AND switch to his favorite apps. Fortunately if I'm in gedit, pressing win+3 once gets me to the more recent pidgin window I used, and if I press it twice, it shows me the pidgin window list, so I like that.
[08:09] <alkisg> Thanks again snadge :)
[13:34]  * mhall119 wonders what davidcalle is up to with google+
[13:45] <smoser> could someone other than me please look at bug 905854
[13:46] <smoser> unity-2d is leaking serious memory. by tomorrow it will top firefox as largest memory consumer on my desktop.
[14:21] <smoser> didrocks, it would seem to me that the bug above is critical, i'm really just hoping to see someone acknowledge it at this point.
[14:21] <didrocks> greyback: ^
[14:22] <didrocks> smoser: I'm adding it to next milestone
[14:22] <didrocks> to ensure it's tracked
[14:22] <smoser> thanks.
[14:22] <didrocks> so, it's only in the panel, isn't it?
[14:22] <didrocks> no leak from the dash, launcher ?
[14:23] <didrocks> smoser: do you have something like indicator-multiload (the cpu indicator) or the weather one?
[14:24] <smoser> i do run indicator-multiload :-(
[14:25] <smoser> didrocks, here's a pastebin of top sorted by 'M'
[14:25] <smoser> http://paste.ubuntu.com/809674/
[14:25] <greyback> smoser: thanks for report, am looking into it
[14:25] <smoser> so, yes, for me, its only unity-2d-places that goes crazy
[14:25] <didrocks> smoser: ok, this one is a known indicator issue, can you just try to remove it and see if it still leaks?
[14:26] <didrocks> just to ensure you are hitting that issue
[14:26] <smoser> didrocks, i can do that, yes.
[14:26] <smoser> but i really like indicator-multiload
[14:26] <didrocks> smoser: thanks :)
[14:26] <smoser> :)
[14:26] <smoser> logging out
[14:26] <didrocks> greyback: let's wait to get more feedback
[14:26] <greyback> didrocks: indeed, am watching
[14:27] <smoser> didrocks, is there a bug open for indicator-multiload ?
[14:27] <didrocks> smoser: yeah, I'm looking for it
[14:27] <didrocks> https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-multiload/+bug/779717
[14:28] <didrocks> it's fixed released, but cjwatson got some other issues last cycle
[14:28]  * didrocks looks again
[14:30] <didrocks> smoser: no, didn't find anything more, if it's multiload, we can recycle your bug report :)
[14:33] <didrocks> JohnLea: hey, small question: alt + F1 is used to enter the keynav mode, previous, escape and alt + F1 was then used to quit the keynav mode. It's not anymore the case (Alt + F1 doesn't wort to quit this mode), is it wanted ?
[14:35] <greyback> didrocks: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-2d/+bug/885304/comments/5
[14:36] <JohnLea> didrocks; it should be possible to escape the Alt+F1 keynav mode both by pressing Esc and by pressing Alt+F1 a second time.
[14:36] <didrocks> JohnLea: greyback: thanks! it's then a regression :)
[14:37] <didrocks> (in 3d)
[14:42] <smoser> didrocks, greyback i disabled indicator-multiload and commented in the bug. thanks for your help. i'll report back in a few hours to see if my memory is growing
[14:42] <didrocks> smoser: keep us in touch!
[14:42] <greyback> smoser: please let me know what you find
[16:02] <Andy80> Kaleo: ping!
[16:40] <LLStarks> smspillaz, can framebuffers between two gpus be handled easily by a compositing wm? https://github.com/Bumblebee-Project/bumblebeed/issues/37
[16:47] <smspillaz> LLStarks: not afaik, thats not really my area of expertise
[16:47] <smspillaz> The only way to do it would be context sharing, athough context sharing between two gpus on first principles would be really ugly because of the fact that the internal layouts are different
[16:48] <smspillaz> in addition, gpu1 cannot access memory on gpu2 without a copy and internal representation reorder
[16:48] <LLStarks> would it be possible without a dma buffer sharing technique?
[16:49] <smspillaz> LLStarks: it would be really really slow
[16:49] <smspillaz> LLStarks: best to ask the same question to jaytaoko he knows more than me
[16:49] <smspillaz> (a LOT more)
[16:49] <LLStarks> thx
[16:50] <smspillaz> LLStarks: btw, my answer was more along the lines of "you can handle it, but it wouldn't really be easy ... or fast"
[16:52] <smspillaz> LLStarks: I know that, eg, "prime" which was airlied's implementation of optimus required you to run a compositing window manager, but I'm pretty sure what it did was bring up the X server on gpu 1, and then run anything requiring opengl on gpu 2, so the compositing window manager was necessary so that pixmaps can be pulled out of the X server and into gpu memory
[16:52] <smspillaz> though thats not really the same as framebuffer sharing
[16:54] <smspillaz> LLStarks: of course, you're best to ask airlied about the specifics of prime, but I'm pretty sure it required extensive server patching so that the x server ran in a "dummy" screen and the real work was done by gpu 2
[16:54] <smspillaz> gpu muxing is so stupid I want it to die
[16:57] <LLStarks> i've been talking to airlied, not a lot of answers. makes testing almost impossible.
[16:57] <smspillaz> he's not really assigned to work on prime full time, it was more of a hack
[16:58] <LLStarks> it doesn't look like a hack anymore. thousands of lines of code are going into it
[16:58] <smspillaz> well, it was originally :)
[17:12] <om26er> greyback, hey! seems bug 827414 stays in unity-2d, alot of people are confirming
[17:14] <greyback> om26er: hey. Thanks for ping
[17:15] <om26er> so it was fixed in both lenses at one stage. /me wonders why it stayed in unity-2d
[18:23] <om26er_> andyrock, can you look at bug 884323
[18:23] <om26er_> and Hi andyrock :D
[18:23] <andyrock> Hi
[18:23] <andyrock> working on other stuff right now
[18:23] <andyrock> and i have an exam tomorrow :/
[18:24] <om26er_> alright, I had one today :D
[18:25] <andyrock> one tomorrow
[18:25] <andyrock> and another one in five days
[18:25] <andyrock> :/
[18:25] <andyrock> let me give a look to the bug btw
[18:26] <andyrock> i think that the but is a bit more generic
[18:27] <andyrock> i mean we should not display the minimize button if the window cannot be minimized
[18:27] <om26er_> yeah or maybe do the same as dash
[18:27] <om26er_> i.e. minimize button be greyed out
[18:28] <andyrock> yep
[18:28] <andyrock> let me give a loook
[18:30] <andyrock> om26er_, i can find a app with a screenshot preview :)
[18:30] <andyrock> can you help me?
[18:30] <andyrock> :)
[18:31] <om26er_> hrm?
[18:31] <om26er_> andyrock, here to help but about what exactly?
[18:31] <andyrock> help me to find an app with a screeshot in the usc
[18:32] <andyrock> maybe it's usc bug
[18:32] <om26er_> empathy
[18:33] <om26er_> i just opened and usc have the screenshot for empathy so could be a problem specific to you
[18:33] <andyrock> om26er_, btw i can reproduce the bug with other modal dialog
[18:33] <andyrock> *dialogs
[18:33] <andyrock> assign me the bug pleas
[18:33] <andyrock> *please
[18:33] <om26er_> sure thing,
[18:33] <om26er_> thx andyrock :)
[18:33] <andyrock> but we should talk about this stuff
[18:33] <andyrock> in the #ubuntu-unity
[18:33] <andyrock> freenode channel :)
[19:56] <mhall119> pretty soon #ayatana is going to redirect to #ubuntu-unity
[19:56] <mhall119> thumper: ping
[21:07] <bschaefer> hey mhr3, here is the update that #711199 bug. https://code.launchpad.net/~brandontschaefer/unity/fix-711199
[21:09] <bschaefer> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/90406656/no_results.png what it looks like
[21:15] <mhr3> bschaefer, yea, i saw, but there's a big branch coming which will change the home lens, so i'll be better to do it afterwards
[21:16] <mhr3> *it'll
[21:16] <bschaefer> mhr3, yeah I saw that was getting worked on. That is why I waited on that one, but all the other lenses work!
[21:16] <bschaefer> though one thing came up only on first login though.
[21:17] <bschaefer> in LensVeiw it calls Search("") and OnSearchFinished gets called with 0 results (even though they exist)
[21:17] <bschaefer> gets emited*
[21:18] <bschaefer> you edited that function so I thought you might have looked at it (gets a link)
[21:19] <bschaefer> mhr3, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity/trunk/view/head:/plugins/unityshell/src/LensView.cpp#L350
[21:19] <mhr3> that shouldn't happen
[21:19] <bschaefer> I think it is getting called to earlier; the Search ("")
[21:20] <bschaefer> when I removed it everything was working fine but was hesitant to commit it so i used a different fix.
[21:20] <mhr3> i know that mikkel was having issues with the view_types, but he might have fixed it already :)
[21:21] <bschaefer> sweet! I should email njpatel about that to see if it is even needed.
[21:21] <mhr3> bschaefer, i'll make a note to look at it during the review
[21:21] <bschaefer> alright thanks. I tested it and nothing changed with removing  it (the initial_activation calls):)
[21:23] <mhr3> bschaefer, what you want to test then is killing the lenses
[21:24] <mhr3> afaict it should be using the last search_string, not just ""
[21:25] <mhall119> does Unity 5 allow dynamic loading/updating of lenses?
[21:25] <bschaefer> so killing them and restarting to see if it loads correctly?
[21:26] <mhr3> bschaefer, good test would be searching, killing them and then just switching the views
[21:26] <bschaefer> mhr3, well the search_string at first is "" which is why I check if results == 0 && search_string != "" so I don't get that start up problem
[21:27] <bschaefer> mhr3 ooo yeah what do you think should happen when there are 0 results to begin with? (like if i have no music)
[21:27] <mhr3> i really dont like such workarounds
[21:27] <bschaefer> mhr3, I dont either, but I like getting rid of that early call the Search which cases a problem; but want to talk to someone else about it
[21:27] <mhr3> bschaefer, maybe the lens should say, oh dear, poor you, go buy some music :)
[21:28] <bschaefer> mhr3, haha
[21:28] <bschaefer> I just havn't put any on the VM
[21:28] <mhall119> davidcalle: ping
[21:29] <bschaefer> mhr3, so Ill test that out more with killing lenses and get back. Ill move the branch to needs fixing also for the merge
[21:29] <bschaefer> mhr3, thanks!
[21:29] <mhr3> bschaefer, just set it to "work in progress"
[21:30] <bschaefer> mhr3, opps to late. Umm but set it to work in progress :)
[21:30] <davidcalle> mhall119, pong
[21:31] <mhall119> davidcalle: hey, just wanted to check in and see how things were going for you getting your scopes into USC
[21:31] <davidcalle> mhall119, going pretty well. I'm getting a branch ready to send for this w-e.
[21:32] <mhall119> davidcalle: awesome, let me know if there's anything I can do to help
[21:32] <davidcalle> mhall119, magic packaging :)
[21:32] <mhall119> either with the code itself, or with the ARB/process side
[21:33] <mhall119> did Ken vandine help with the packaging?
[21:33] <davidcalle> mhall119, no, everything is fine. Stéphane Graber did most of the work and now I have a good template.
[21:33] <mhall119> ah cool, stgraber is excellent
[21:33] <davidcalle> He is.
[21:38] <davidcalle> mhr3, about the results-hint, I'm wondering at what point should I set it.
[21:39] <davidcalle> mhr3, reply-hint*
[21:39] <mhr3> davidcalle, before calling search.finished () would probably be a good idea?
[21:40] <davidcalle> mhr3, sure :) But I'm asking because I don't have any success with it.
[21:40] <mhr3> davidcalle, well you won't see anything in the dash now
[21:40] <mhr3> it's not hooked up yet
[21:41] <mhr3> davidcalle, bschaefer has a branch for it though
[21:41] <davidcalle> mhr3, oh, it explains a lot :)
[21:50] <joey> mhall119 & jono -  Hi
[21:50] <joey> I just got a request to close down #ayatana and put a migrate to #ubuntu-unity
[21:50] <jono> joey, yup
[21:50] <joey> Can either of you confirm that?
[21:50] <jono> joey, I can
[21:50] <joey> sweet
[21:50] <joey> The topic on this channel will be deleted.
[21:51] <joey> I was thinking of doing a soft-redirect (entrymsg plus custom topic) for a bit until the email that you've probably sent makes its rounds
[21:53] <mhall119> \o/
[21:53] <mhall119> see you all over there
[21:55] <jono> joey, can we put a re-direct in in a week or so
[21:55] <jono> mhall119, can you blog about the move to the new channel?
[21:56] <joey> jono: I think so. We need freenode staff to do that
[21:56] <jono> thanks joey
[21:56] <joey> jono: my pleasure
[21:56] <jono> :-)
[21:56] <mhall119> jono: sure thing
[21:59] <joey> popey: ok you should be able to op here now
[22:00] <popey> that works then
[22:00] <popey> thank you for your continued awesomeness joey
[22:00] <joey> I am here to serve
[22:00] <joey> I'll let you akick and clear folks popey
[22:03] <popey> thanks
[22:15] <balloons> I guess this is the end