[02:16] that dude is challenging [02:17] Yep. [02:18] But in all fairness, what threw me off the loop was starting vlc with the video device option. I did not find the audio device setting that way at all. [02:32] i hate that "im just going to get a mac" crap [02:32] i mean, you gotta learn to use those too [02:32] its just, when you drop a grand or 2, you tend to become more open to learning [02:32] Some people just aren't up to it. *shrug* [02:34] Seems to be trolling, too. [02:35] yeah. for like hours... [02:35] this was going on before my nap [02:36] Yeah. I'm done. He's all yours. [02:36] i suggested pavucontrol right when the dude came in [02:36] hehe [02:42] i just feel dirty now [02:43] i installed all this crap, and got VLC working... [02:43] whatever [02:43] i learned something, and thats cool [02:47] I didn't install anything, and still it works. *smirk* [02:47] hehe [02:48] astraljava: i didnt have pulse on this box... or VLC [02:48] it was a lubuntu install [02:48] Ahh... ok. [02:58] Installed todays version (Jan26) of the live DVD. ubiquity screen is too large to see the buttons on the bottom... there is already a bug about that [02:58] I added that it affects me. [02:59] I played with pulse and jackd... no sound here either... someone already mentioned that. The sound file player plays straight to jack just fine. [03:01] len: i copied that ln after i figured out what you were talking about [03:01] len: I hope there's a bug for that, too. I know David would be willing to fix it, if he knew about it. [03:01] not that you werent clear... i just didnt get it [03:01] i got no sound from pulse [03:01] but i got sound using JACK [03:02] Audacious? However, none of the videos ones do. Xine does, but is a pain to setup. [03:02] Sounds to me there's a problem with the pulse jack module. Can you two file the relevant bug about it? [03:03] I looked in /usr/share/xgreeters/ in Xubuntu 11.10 and there is no default.desktop there either. [03:03] But it works. [03:04] I think someone has added some functionality to lightdm and forgot to tell anyone. [03:05] The idea being there can be several files for different sessions and default points to the one in use. [03:06] Do we really need panel two on the bottom? [03:06] i dont like it [03:06] the "dock" [03:06] it seems to just take up room [03:06] i would like to have no dock, like it used to be [03:06] but, i just dont like docks [03:06] I can always add apps to the top panel [03:07] i use kupfer [03:07] foo YC20 drives jack nuts. [03:07] Has anyone used it ok? [03:08] len: not yet [03:08] something crashed on me [03:08] openshot... [03:08] wouldnt launch [03:08] If I try to play it with the virt keyboard, I get stuck keys and distorted sound... xruns? [03:09] Even when not playing it it is always giving jack logging errors. [03:09] interesting [03:10] well... these are the things i can do without.. comon... [03:10] we got time to sort some of that out i hope [03:11] I don't need it either, but if it is the first thing a new user tries, that would not leave a good taste in their mouth. [03:11] We don't have rt priv even with audio group [03:11] nah... i like YC20 [03:11] len: i think/hope the kernel will do that [03:11] what do you think? [03:12] I don't know [03:12] len: i would *love* to actually run this stuff [03:12] test it [03:12] pull out whats borked [03:12] get a nice polished finally release for the LTS [03:12] len: i got it loading up today and got *so* excited about it [03:13] The is a nice organ in there already. But for me the reality is that I would prefer to use external sound modules [03:14] My machine doesn't really have the poop to run sounds as well as record audio [03:14] len: where are you again? [03:14] anywhere near me? [03:15] im in asheville NC [03:15] I'm on the wet coast on Vancouver Island [03:17] yeah.... [03:18] holstein: Haha. Ex-wife goes there several times a year on business. [03:18] astraljava: its nice [03:18] we have LUG if you happen to tag along sometimes [03:18] You missed the ex- there. [03:18] astraljava: yeah... i did... [03:18] sorry about that [03:19] Hehe. :) No worries. [03:19] will have to fly you in special then ;) [03:19] True. :) [03:21] ScottL: i have "sound & video" then subgroups "audio/video production" [03:21] thats in 10.04, ubuntustudio [03:21] it looks much the same in xfce, just "multimedia" instead [03:21] is that OK? [03:21] i kind of like it that way [03:22] i find it less disruptive [03:25] bug #922424 [03:25] Launchpad bug 922424 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "lightdm won't start I have console(s) only" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/922424 [03:26] has been filed [03:27] Maybe someone will say, ja you have to put that link in as part of your distro [03:29] We'll sort that out. Also, the sound not working via pulse to jack. Please file that too. I'm going to pass out now, it's 5:30 am. [03:43] I tried ... launchpad coughed on me... I'll try again. [03:54] bug #918519 [03:54] Launchpad bug 918519 in Ubuntu Studio "please upload ubuntustudio package updates to archives" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/918519 [03:55] micahg, did you say you were going to upload the above bug? [03:55] not trying to pressure you, just trying to refresh my memory [03:55] ah, yes, sorry, haven't gotten to piloting yet, it's on my list, will try to do it tomorrow [03:55] okay :) [03:58] i'm wondering if this will help clear up the missing '/usr/share/xgreeters/default.desktop' issue [03:59] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lightdm/+bug/816809 [03:59] Ubuntu bug 816646 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #816809 no log in screen due to lightdm greeter not being installed" [Medium,Fix released] [04:00] this suggest that installing lightdm-gtk-greeter fixes the problem [04:07] With reguard to the pulsejack bug. I have had three or four timeout errors from launchpad. [04:07] Can someone else try? [04:12] just as a note lightdm-gtk-greeter is installed in xubuntu 11.10 (which works) but there is still no default.desktop. [04:13] I will reboot to US 12.04 and see if it is installed there. [04:32] ScottL: The live DVD install says that lightdm-gtk-greeter is already installed. [04:34] default.desktop is not listed among the installed file though. [04:41] I find nothing in the config file(s) that would change the greeters name to default either. [04:52] the changelog for lightdm-gtk-greeter shows 3 updates to the package on Jan 18th and 19th [04:52] that would be about the time it stopped working. [04:53] The changes are to lightdm [05:03] I was looking at another gtk-greeter bug to do with translations. [05:03] This comment caught my eye: [05:04] Sorry Pjotr12345 but nobody is actively working on the gtk greeter (which has been made as an example greeter, the default greeter in Ubuntu is the unity one) [05:05] So, the gtk-greeter is an example that is not being kept up and it looks like lightdm is moving on without it. [05:45] Looking at the changelog on jan 18th at 11:10 it shows: [05:45] * Move the GTK+ and Qt greeters into their own projects [05:48] Does this mean there is now a maintainer? [17:11] i think i found the problem with the lightdm stuff... [17:11] and i should have remembered this previously from something micahg had said [17:12] we are currently shipping lightdm-greeter-example-gtk in the seeds [17:12] we should probably be shipping lightdm-gtk-greeter [17:13] I was looking at the same. Should we have our own customized one? [17:16] Maybe not, neither does Xubuntu. [17:17] I'll make the change. [17:18] I'll be uploading the US stuff shortly, so just let me know when it's good [17:19] micahg: It's up now. Thanks! I copied the same line from Xubuntu's desktop. I suppose that's how it works? [17:20] Ahh... yeah, what scott-work said. [17:21] umm, where's the stuff I"m supposed to sponsor again? [17:22] bzr+ssh://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntustudio-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntustudio.precise/ [17:23] no, I know where the seed is :), scott-work had some other stuff for me to sponsor [17:23] Hehe. Sorry. :) [17:24] Any idea what that stuff was? I could perhaps dig it up for ya. [17:25] ah, found it, it wasn't showing up in the queue since it's against the ubuntu studio project [17:25] Oh ok. [18:19] micahg: uno momento, i shall find it [18:19] scott-work: I found it, it was in backscroll [18:19] oh, hehe [18:20] micahg: thank you very much for helping us, it has been a bit of a godsend [18:20] :) [18:20] sorry it's taken me all week [18:21] micahg: i doubt we would have gotten it done otherwise [18:26] w00T! [18:27] i dont care to reinstall to test changes made... [18:27] hmmm... that sounds unclear... [18:27] i *will* reinstall to test changes... let me know [19:19] announcement... [19:20] 14:12 < ochosi> that's why i created elementary-xfce [19:20] 14:12 < holstein> ochosi: nice [19:20] 14:12 < ochosi> which is a fork of elementary, complemented with xfce-specific stuff [19:20] 14:13 < holstein> ochosi: thats in the repos? or going to be? [19:20] 14:13 < holstein> and it would be cool for us to use it? [19:20] 14:13 < ochosi> atm it's part of xubuntu-artwork, but we discussed putting it in a separate package so you (and others) can use it more easily [19:21] i forget what icons we were planning on using, but these are falling in our lap, and we could help test/develop them [19:25] Yeah, as soon as they are separated, we could most certainly use them. [19:26] sounds too easy :) [19:26] and i like that! [19:26] What do you mean? [19:26] astraljava: just that someone else is doing the work [19:27] We're already using someone else's work anyhow. :) [19:27] coat-tails! [19:27] Isn't that the beauty of FOSS? [19:27] You don't have to write _everything_ by yourself. :) [20:22] ScottL: One thing that occurred to me, are we going to be providing support for upgrading from lucid to precise? [20:23] astraljava: i dont see why we cant [20:23] it should just work right? [20:23] i can try it [20:23] when the time comes [20:24] holstein: There's quite the transition, from GNOME 2 to Xfce, for instance. [20:24] sure, but that might help actually [20:24] nothing to break config wise [20:24] just new stuff [20:24] We're still using gconf, though. I'm not sure whether that amounts to anything. [20:25] astraljava: we can only try i supppose [20:25] i would think the settings would not conflict [20:25] holstein: Yep. I will try it this weekend. [20:25] But I'm just thinking, that's one aspect that probably accounts to the LTS decision. [20:26] If we're calling it that, then we probably do _have_ to provide support also for upgrading. [20:27] well, we're not doing anything to break that... [20:28] Yeah, well, one release to another is troublesome in some cases. This is a much bigger thing that we're talking about, here. [20:29] IMSNHO, we need to give it a couple of runs, before we can even promise to support it. [20:44] * micahg guesses he can't complain about changing the per-user defaults in the -default-settings package since xubuntu does it [20:45] ScottL: why do you have Thunar .po files in the default-settings package? [20:51] webchat.freenode isn't working right now :( [20:52] yup [20:52] webchat is down :/ [20:52] SLavender: why do you have Thunar .po files in the default-settings package? [20:52] but i don't like this chatzilla client, it's waaaaay too conspicuous for work [20:52] micahg: it came that way from the xubuntu sources [20:53] SLavender: would you mind if that waited until Monday until I can discuss it with mr_pouit [20:54] Why would we need them, cause we're using Nautilus, right? [20:55] micahg: i'm okay with that, no problem [20:56] but i think i agree with astraljava [20:56] so do I, I just want to be sure :) [20:56] oh, wait, you're not using Thunar at all? [20:56] micahg: we are including nautilus and using it as default (or should be) [20:57] micahg: we had previously discussed that i was nervous about pulling thunar out currently because it's so tightly integrated and you suggested just including nautilus for now [20:58] Oh okay. [20:58] I did? [20:58] This conversation is confusing. [20:58] micahg: i believe so ;) actually, i'm really pretty sure [21:04] ScottL: I got a reply to my bug report on lightdm. I have forwarded it to the mailing list. It implies that this link is set as part of the theme setup [21:05] Not that we set the link but that there is a place in the theme stuff that sets what file to look for in xgreeters [21:07] Zsync is downloading todays ISO. I'll see where things are at. [21:07] len: i think i had the old and decprecated lightdm greeter in the seeds, astraljava has already fixed it (i believe), and most likely micahg will update it :) [21:08] yeah, will get that up today [21:08] Ok I will wait till tomorrow to test it. [21:09] I had the idea it was done for today [21:09] SLavender: I assume you've tested the new packages and they work as intended? [21:10] micahg: i did build them, but was unsure of the best method to test them to be honest [21:10] which means that i did not really do a proper test of them, no [21:10] Ahh... yes, will update the bug status. [21:10] :(, I'd prefer to know they work as intended before uploading [21:10] SLavender: install the packages you built [21:11] reboot and see if everything works as intended [21:11] let me do the meta now since the others need testing [21:11] obviously doing this on a precise install would be preferable [21:11] umm...yes :), can someone else test them? [21:12] Send it to me, I'll do a fresh install. [21:12] my concern was that i was unsure how this would work as an update versus a fresh install from the image [21:12] i do admit that it sounds kinda stupid now that i type that out [21:12] well, first concern is not to break current installs, then we can fix image issues [21:13] especially considering that users most likely would be updating from previous version [21:13] so yes, i should have tested them [21:13] but we're up against the wall for alpha2 as freeze is Monday at 21:00 UTC [21:13] i can get a precise install tonight, build, and test them in ppa [21:13] ok, no worries, I'll save the other stuff for the weekend, I'll do the meta now [21:13] just ping me when you think they're good [21:19] ok, pushed up 2 packaging changes, 1 each for -default-settings and -look [21:22] do you intend to ship a separate icon theme anymore? the bzr branch just has a package with a depends? [21:22] it might make sense to just drop the package if elementary is seeded [21:23] keep in mind that xubuntu just switched to elementary-xfce, but we'll probably break that out into a separate package after alpah 2 [21:23] *alpha [21:23] micahg: ochosi was going to separate elementary-xfce as a separate package. [21:23] Haha. [21:24] right, but I'm wondering if you intend to ever ship your own icons again [21:24] otherwise, we can drop the source and rely on the seed [21:24] Yeah I don't know, really. I am not up-to-speed with the theming. [21:25] ok, can you find out for me? [21:27] I will talk to Scott about it, for sure. [21:48] astraljava: the -meta package already has the proper depends on lightdm-gtk-greeter [21:51] ok, uploading the new meta [21:51] umm, wait, why do you need compilation tools in the desktop seed? [21:52] nevermind, xubuntu has it too [21:53] micahg: I thought you wanted info on icons. Yeah I made the change to desktop seed regarding the greeter already. [21:53] astraljava: no, what I mean is that the error seems to have not been uploaded, the current meta seems to have the proper dependency [21:54] That's strange. [21:57] ok, uploaded [21:58] Thanks! I just need to find out the true cause for the X session not starting. [22:02] I go offline in an hour (for about 25 hours), but can upload stuff Sat night [22:02] it might be the lack of the new -default-settings [22:03] micahg: Ok. Thanks for everything so far! Have a nice hiatus. :) [22:03] heh, just the Sabbath :) [22:03] Well, hope it's a good one anyway. :) [23:29] Whoever: Todays Iso has an install problem. Ubiquity crashs part way through. [23:30] Are chnages made today (for tomorrow) likely to fix this? (should I wait to try that?) [23:31] Also: I tried both install from boot and install from live. They are both the same. [23:31] Both have a ubiquity crash. [23:32] I don't know of any changes that might lead to that, but I'll look into it. [23:32] Also: The option of having an encrypted drive is gone. [23:33] ubiquity doesn't seem to support that. [23:33] It does support encrypted user dir. [23:36] There was at least one user who felt an encrypted drive was a make or break for them. [23:39] I don't know if it makes any difference (crash wise) but this is the first time I printed the iso with a persistent file.