jasoncwarner_hey jbicha , I saw your name on the freerdp upload...I can't update right now b/c it is broken, any idea what is going on there? wanted to get the latest Unity goodness and start testing ;)00:31
jbichajasoncwarner_: yes, I noticed libfreerdp0 conflicts with libfreerdp1 but I didn't make time yet to figure out how to fix that00:33
jasoncwarner_jbicha: cool, thanks.00:34
jbichajasoncwarner_: you should be able to force remove freerdp (if you don't need remmina) so that the rest of your updates install00:38
micahgjbicha: libfreerdp1 shouldn't be shipping files in /usr/share00:40
jbichamicahg: right00:40
micahgare the keymaps backwards compatible?00:41
jbichamicahg: I don't know; the git repository has them not touched since the git migration in June00:45
micahgare they used by other things that use the library or just freerdp itself?00:46
jbichawell, remmina-plugin-rdp is the only rdepends00:47
micahgjbicha: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-sharedlibs.html#s-sharedlibs-support-files00:49
* micahg files an RC bug in Debian00:49
jbichaRC bug? freerdp-1.0 is still in NEW00:50
micahgI'm getting a head start :)00:50
micahgah, it might not pass NEW, ok, I'll wait :)00:50
jbichawell the 0.8 is broken so I guess it still makes sense00:51
micahgthe ftpmasters should throw it out00:51
micahgjbicha: BTW, the fix is in the policy manual as well00:52
jbichalibfreerdp-tools is fine?00:52
micahgjbicha: you end up with an issue if the keymaps change between releases00:53
micahgdepends on the relationship between the library and the keymaps00:56
micahg*possible issue00:56
jbichaI'm a bit confused then as to how to fix this; do we have to break libfreerdp0?00:56
jbichaunfortunately, remmina's not made a tarball for new freerdp yet00:57
micahgjbicha: did you read the second paragraph of the policy snippet?  it gives advice on how to fix this issue00:58
jbichaoh, I got confused by the 3rd paragraph00:59
micahgyes, that's true, as I said, I don't know the relationship between the keymaps and the library, so if that applies, it should be dealt with appropriately :)01:00
NafaiRAOF: Around?  You still working on maintaining X these days?01:01
RAOFNafai: Indeed.01:02
RAOF(Well, not *right* now; right now it's colour management ☺)01:02
NafaiSweet, I can bug you. :)01:02
NafaiThis isn't the X packages directly, but mesa is close, right?01:03
NafaiAnyway, if I'm reading https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mesa/+bug/823062 correctly, s3tc is not supported with the shipped mesa implementation of Ubuntu right now01:04
RAOFYup.  We also maintain those :)01:04
ubot2`Launchpad bug 823062 in mesa "Please provide Mesa with floating point texture support and GL_S3_s3tc support in Jockey, like proprietary drivers" [Wishlist,Confirmed]01:04
NafaiAnd the only way to get that is to use a proprietary driver?  And if you hvae an Intel card you are out of luck?01:04
RAOFFloating point textures are enabled as of the mesa 8.0 upload; we've got techboard signoff about that feature.01:05
Nafaiso that's coming in Precise?01:05
RAOFS3TC requires an external library.  That's available in xorg-edgers; I'm not sure if it's in the archive.01:05
RAOFYup, coming soon to a Precise near you (it's staged in x-staging, will be copied after A2 release).01:06
Nafaiyeah, I couldn't find anything01:06
Nafaiis there a better bug report or something official that I can point people to to say that s3tc isn't supported?01:07
RAOFYup.  We don't seem to have libdxtn in the archive.01:07
RAOFThat could be resolved by actually uploading a libdxtn, though.01:08
DBO(sick of me yet?)01:19
NafaiRAOF: Also, if you have an intel card, the mesa gl implementation is all that is available, right?01:20
DBOcrazy thought...01:20
RAOFNafai: Yup.  mesa or nothing.01:20
DBOis it possible to rotate the mouse sprite?01:20
NafaiRAOF: Thanks for the confirmation.01:20
RAOFDBO: What do you mean by “rotate”?  It is possible to replace the sprite with a different one.  I also think the xrandr rotation code rotates the pointer, but don't quote me on that.01:22
DBORAOF, well I was thinking about the edge problem we have01:22
DBOand the fact that the pointer being angled like it is, is actually a rather arbitrary fact of history...01:23
DBOhow cool would it be if the mouse pointers angle was simply based on its X coordinate in the current monitor01:23
DBOso as you move left to right, it would slowly rotate01:23
DBOI mean... that would be SWANKY01:23
RAOFI'm not really sure how I feel about that. :)01:24
DBOyou love it01:24
DBObut more importantly01:25
DBOis it possible?01:25
RAOFI'm pretty sure you do that client-side.01:25
RAOFThis is totally the sort of thing that is unlikely to be acceptable upstream :)01:26
Omegathat's what makes it fun!01:26
RAOFDBO: Oh, of course it's possible!  Just hide the pointer and have compiz draw it!01:31
DBObut that means a screen redraw on every pointer move01:31
DBOthats annoying01:32
DBOI'd rather have the video card do it01:32
RAOFRight.  I don't believe there's a way to do this in a client without a bunch of context-switching.01:32
RAOFSo it's *entirely* possible - even easy - to do client-side, it's just not as efficient as doing it server side.01:33
DBORAOF, lets just make the xserver do it :)01:36
* DBO is goign to keep pushing until you say no01:36
RAOFI don't think it's a good idea to do it in the server until you've thoroughly prototyped it client-side.01:37
RAOFYou can do all the prototyping client side; the server side is just an optimisation.01:37
RAOFI'm not sure that it's even a good *idea*, and I don't think you can tell until you've actually tried it :)01:38
Omegamaybe you should check how feasable it is on wayland01:39
RAOFBut that's not the point :)01:40
* RAOF is thinking he might need to do a rotation to DX01:41
RAOFDBO: I'm heading out to an appointment.  Show me a prototype that works and we can talk about efficiencying it up in the server :P01:44
DBORAOF, I love how you take my crazy ideas seriously01:45
DBOI seriously though you were going to giggle at me, but now I realize, you're just being nice :)01:45
lifelessRAOF: btw, my themes, still awol02:29
lifelessRAOF: I could learn to love the grey, if I had icons for sound, power-menu etc02:29
DBORAOF, can we get your packages into Ubuntu for A202:42
DBOthey make a big impact02:42
DBOdidrocks says its up to you02:42
jbichamicahg: fixed freerdp is in incoming now and I don't have upload rights for it02:58
micahgjbicha: cyphermox is piloting, he could upload (doesn't appear to be seeded)03:00
jbichawe just dropped the keymaps; upstream might drop them too03:00
cyphermoxjbicha: can you tell me more? incoming?03:01
jbichacyphermox: http://incoming.debian.org/freerdp_1.0.0-2.dsc fixes bug 92439303:01
ubot2`Launchpad bug 924393 in freerdp "package libfreerdp1 (not installed) failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/share/freerdp/keymaps/xfree86', which is also in package libfreerdp0 0.8.2-2build1" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/92439303:01
broderjbicha: i think hallyn was working on kvm-with-spice support03:27
brodermy recollection is that he was planning to do it as a separate source package in universe03:27
hallynapt-get install qemu-kvm-spice.  shoudl work, and work with libvirt if you set the right video stanza in xml03:29
hallynyou do have to say '-enable-kvm' as it comes from the qemu.git upstream (which disables acceleratoin by default)03:29
hallynsorry, i have to go - if you have any troubles pls do file a bug against qemu-kvm-spice03:30
jbichahallyn: thanks, I didn't know where to look for that!03:31
cyphermoxomg, wow. compiz/unity died and doesn't want to start anymore :)03:39
cyphermoxjbicha: confirm, freerdp I can just drop ubuntu changes (looks like it was just an upload of debian packaging before it was actually released03:39
jbichacyphermox: that would be great, thanks!03:42
cyphermoxtarball mismatch03:42
cyphermoxfun :)03:42
jbichawhat does that mean?03:42
brodercyphermox: i thought that syncpackage could deal with that03:42
cyphermoxbroder: oh, it can03:42
cyphermoxI was trying to debdiff03:42
cyphermoxTheMuso: thanks for the merge request for nm-applet! I'll upload that as soon as we're past freeze03:59
cyphermoxjbicha: uploaded freerdp 1.0.0-2fakesync104:01
RAOFDBO: Will the multimonitor stuff land for A2?04:14
DBORAOF, yes04:14
RAOFDBO: Well, in that case, yes.04:15
TheMusocyphermox: np, thanks.04:25
pittiGood morning04:28
pittijbicha: argh, so on that day when we upload git Debian finally does the upload..04:31
pittijbicha: I just wonder how it could end up as a fakesync, I thought I used the upstream tarball04:32
cyphermoxgood morning pitti04:40
cyphermox(omg, it's really time I leave now)04:40
pittihey cyphermox04:40
TheMusoMorning pitti04:40
jbichapitti: the DD said he doesn't really pay any attention to Ubuntu so he had no idea we uploaded yesterday04:43
pittijbicha: right, that's fine for him, I just wondered why the tarball differs04:44
pittijbicha: I took the tarball that was in the git branch (upstream/pristine-tar)04:45
pittianyway, there will hopefully be a 1.0.1 or 1.1 at some point04:45
cyphermoxpitti: to answer your question about what you sponsored for me, it was procps and ntrack. --> http://paste.ubuntu.com/824748/04:47
pittiwow, I thought I did some more04:47
cyphermoxyeah, I thought so too04:49
cyphermoxthose were, all in all, pretty simple04:49
desrtagateau: good morning? :)05:25
desrtagateau: just incase you're still working on the pathbar thing...05:27
desrtagateau: i just discovered that GtkButtonBox has a 'linked' style class that you can set05:27
jbichayou should see how bad Boxes looks in Ambiance05:34
cyphermoxpitti: verification failed for one bug in checkbox, could you please remove it from proposed or whatever, so I can upload an update in the my morning?05:36
cyphermoxpitti: also, it's a native package, can I just re-upload the same version number after that and have it work?05:36
pitticyphermox: no need to remove it, just upload another version05:37
pitticyphermox: no, you need to bump the version number05:37
pitticyphermox: either keep the old changelog, add a new one, and upload with -v to include the two topmost ones05:37
pitticyphermox: or just bump the changelog's current entry05:37
pittithe first is a bit clearer05:38
cyphermoxoh, right05:38
pittibut you do need to include both changelog records05:38
cyphermoxduh. otherwise people who might already have it won't get an update05:38
cyphermoxwhat do you mean both changelog records?05:38
pitticyphermox: also, LP will just outright reject it because that versin is already published :)05:39
pitticyphermox: debuild -S -v<package_version_currently_in_release_or_updates>05:39
cyphermoxoh, yeah05:39
cyphermoxthat's fine :)05:39
cyphermoxit really is wayyyy too late for me now :)05:39
tjaaltonjbicha: read your blog post, good stuff. it would be _really_ nice to get the new settings stuff in though, if not only for the wacom config stuff ;) (though I understand if FF is too close..)05:40
jbichatjaalton: the wacom stuff could be backported05:41
tjaaltonjbicha: oh? that would be cool05:41
jbichawell I think it could, somebody should look into that at least05:42
tjaaltonI might check it out05:42
cyphermoxpitti: thanks. now it's in the queue for approval -- and I'm going to bed :)05:46
pitticyphermox: sleep well!05:46
pitticyphermox: that was checkbox?05:46
pittiso you just bumped the version number then?05:46
pittiit only has one chagnelog entry05:46
pittiit doesn't include the changelog from https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric/+source/checkbox/0.12.905:47
pitticyphermox: so all the bug refs and descriptions from that are "lost"05:47
pitticyphermox: debuild -S -v0.12.805:47
cyphermoxbut they are the same copied over again in 0.12.10?05:48
pitticyphermox: (but fine to do it tomorrow)05:48
pitticyphermox: yes; people having -updates will get the changes from .9 and .10 and shoudl see both in update-manager05:48
pittialso, our trackign machinery relies on the .changes files to state all bugs fixed05:48
cyphermoxI are teh fail :)05:48
pitticyphermox: don't worry05:48
cyphermoxsure, and I'll look at this again tomorrow05:48
pitticyphermox: just use -v0.12.8 when building the source, and all will be good05:49
pitti(no need to bump version again now, as the pacakge was not accepted)05:49
pitticyphermox: sleep well!05:49
cyphermoxI got confused probably because the merge is against lp:ubuntu/oneiric/checkbox, not lp:ubuntu/oneiric-proposed/checkbox05:49
cyphermoxthis is what goes wrong -- 0.12.9 isn't in this branch05:49
cyphermoxsee you later05:50
didrocksgood morning07:09
pittihey didrocks07:16
pittididrocks: running unity PPA since yesterday; runs really smooth!07:16
didrockspitti: nice! Guten Morgen :)07:16
pittithe control-center radio button for top left corner activation doesn't work, but with the "push over edge" change it doesn't get in the way any more07:16
didrocksno specific issue? Revealing the launcher is easy for you?07:17
RAOFdidrocks: Good morning!  The multi-monitor stuff is landing for A2, right?07:17
pittididrocks: works well enough with the mouse, but honestly I mostly use the super key07:17
didrockspitti: yeah, the g-c-c radio button is wired to the option, but the option is now broken in unity (this is known and jason smith is aware about it)07:17
didrocksRAOF: good morning! 5.2 will land post alpha2 (as soon as alpha2 is released)07:18
didrockspitti: ok, we have some issues in some system where the trackpad is quite slow07:18
didrocksand so you have to "push hard"07:18
didrocksI think jason spoke with RAOF about it :)07:18
pittididrocks: ah, haven't tried with touchpad, just with normal mouse07:18
didrocksreally depends on the velocity of your touchpad07:18
didrocksseems I was the first to get a bad one on the xt207:19
pitti(gosh, Lana del Rey has a godly voice -- just listening to her new album)07:19
RAOFdidrocks: And the updated X server in ppa:raof/help-jason improves it for you, right?07:21
didrocksRAOF: the one from yesterday? (did you change it since?)07:22
RAOFYeah, that's yesterday's server.07:22
didrocksRAOF: no, the normalize didn't change anything for the touchpad for me, unfortunatly07:22
didrocksnot sure for jono, when I left yesterday, I saw that jono had the same issue07:22
RAOFdidrocks: Fix your acceleration settings :)07:22
jonohey didrocks07:23
didrocksRAOF: well, I don't think we want to tell everyone to do that :)07:23
didrocksjono: still around? :)07:23
jonodidrocks, indeed :-)07:23
didrocksjono: did you fix your issue?07:23
jonohacking on the Ubuntu Accomplishments stuff still07:23
jonodidrocks, nope, same issue07:23
didrocksah nice ;)07:23
didrockseven with RAOF's ppa then?07:23
didrocksRAOF: I really saw no improvment at all with it07:24
didrocksRAOF: is the patch applied? (just in case :))07:24
RAOFdidrocks: Yes, because it's a modification of the existing pointer_barrier patch :P07:24
jonoI ran RAOF's PPA from earlier today07:24
jonodidnt fix it, so removed it07:25
jonothe help-jason PPA07:25
didrocksso we clearly have a release blocker there :/07:25
RAOFCan you please file a bug?  I'll work out what information I need and then ask for it there :)07:25
BigWhaleMorning everyone.07:26
didrocksRAOF: the acceleration and sensitivity on my xt2 is at the lowest possible value FYI07:26
didrocksRAOF: and its a fresh precise install from Monday (especially for it)07:27
didrockshey BigWhale07:27
didrocksnot sure how those values are decided…07:27
RAOFRight.  I can't believe you can find that touchpad usable with such low velocity! :P07:27
didrocksRAOF: well, the xt2 machine is my spare machine TBH, I don't really use it apart from testing :)07:27
didrocksbut there is something setting this wrong07:28
didrocksmaybe jono can confirm for the g-c-c option?07:28
jonoI don't think it is just the touchpad07:28
jonoI had the same issue with the mouse07:28
didrocksjono: mouse velocity07:28
didrocksjono: gnome-control-center07:28
didrocks-> mouse07:28
didrocksyou have "cursor speed" (or something like that)07:29
didrockswith 2 sliders07:29
jonoPointer Speed07:29
didrocksare the sliders at the beginning of the range?07:29
didrocksok, so clearly same issue than on my xt207:29
BigWhaleWhoever got rid of those big dash icons gets a beer or a dozen of them, from me ... :>07:29
didrocksRAOF: do you know what decides to put so slow values?07:30
RAOFThat's just the defaults.07:30
pittithere's a truly bad bug in zeitgeist07:30
RAOFIt turns out that *my* sliders are also there; it's just that my touchpad is non-crap (apparently!)07:30
didrocksRAOF: it's not hw dependant?07:30
didrocksso apparently, I put it at a higher value at some point, but don't remember :)07:31
didrockspitti: what happens?07:31
pittiit knows that I watched episodes 2-15, 2-16, and 2-17 recently -- it should totally offer me to watch 2-18 next!07:31
didrocksahah ;)07:31
didrocksI guess it's not battlestar gallactica? ;)07:31
pittino, Enterprise07:31
pittihaven't seen most of those yet07:31
pittiso those are my lunch break entertainment these days :)07:32
didrocksI'm watching caprica now. Quite interesting, very different from gallactica :)07:32
pittiI watched three or four Galactica episodes, but never really got into it07:32
pittimaybe I'll try again once I'm through Enterpreise07:32
pittiI also have big bang theory 5.14 to watch, but it always takes so long until the next one arrives :)07:33
didrocksoh, only 3 or 4 galactica? We watch the whole serie with Julie in 3 months :)07:33
RAOFGalactica >> Enterprise07:33
pittididrocks: well, apparently _your_ spouse is into scifi, which mine isn't07:33
didrocksheh, I'm putting them in a stack as well so that we can watch at dinner time :)07:33
pittiRAOF: still, I maintain that TNG >> everything else07:33
RAOFWell, most of Galactica :)07:34
didrocksRAOF: someone with good taste :)07:34
* RAOF is almost at the end of TNG S307:34
pittialthough I must say that Enterprise is the most credible of all those07:34
didrockspitti: yeah, I turned her into that TBH :)07:34
BigWhaleand I am watching Firefly (just saying, so I don't feel left out from the debate)07:34
pittinever heard of that -- wikipedia says "space western"?07:34
pittihorses with warp drive?07:35
RAOFpitti: You haven't seen Firefly?07:35
pittiRAOF: on Enterprise? no, not yet07:35
RAOFpitti: Spoiler alert: they have a *stupid* time travel episode, where they fight nazis :)07:35
warp10pitti: do you need some extra warp speed? May I help you? :)07:35
pittiRAOF: there was one episode earlier on when they got captured by some military dudes, but they didn't do any Nazi allusions07:36
pittiwarp10: warp 10 is clearly impossible!!!07:36
BigWhaleand about Star Trek, I'll say just this: Sisko, punched Q in the face and he told Klingons that he has 5000 photon torpedoes ready to launch ...07:37
pittithe later DS9 episodes were quite nice indeed07:37
pittiI found the first two series a bit dull07:37
warp10pitti: I'm just everywhere in universe. And in multiverse, too :P07:37
RAOFpitti: I clearly need to bring along Firefly to UDS.07:37
pittiwarp10: transwarp> "Good morning, Captain!" :)07:38
RAOFAlso, I clearly need to make dinner!07:38
warp10pitti: hope Scotty didn't sabotaged my engines!07:38
* pitti continues breakign packagekit then07:38
pittiglatzor: oh, good morning!07:39
BigWhalepitti, DS9 indeed had a constant plot and a very thought out script which started to develop somewhere around 3rd season :)07:39
jasoncwarner_hey didrocks , got a weird compiz bug trying out new unity ppa... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/924703  also experiencing something weird where after logging in for first time, I get kicked out to lightdm login window after 30seconds, maybe a minute07:39
pittiglatzor: I committed some test cases for the apt backend, and want to start working on plugin support now (like in aptdaemon)07:39
ubot2`Launchpad bug 924703 in compiz "compiz crashed with SIGABRT" [Undecided,New]07:39
BigWhaleand now I need to do some pulse audio hacking :/07:39
jasoncwarner_didrocks: happened on two different machines...both time I was pressing to activate the launcher (some information I know isn't relevant, but giving you all I have)07:40
jasoncwarner_ok...have to go and have dinner quickly before night shift starts ;)07:40
BigWhalejasoncwarner_, night shift? I like the dedication of Canonicals. ;)07:41
jasoncwarner_BigWhale: lol...I know...sometimes I have to tell seb128, didrocks and kenvandine to get offline ;)07:42
BigWhaleweird, that sounds like my wife... :>07:42
BigWhalenow that you mentioned Ken... I have to do some Gwibber hacking first...07:43
didrocksjasoncwarner_: interesting, will have to look if we can get it retraced :)07:49
smspilla|zrandom questions for GNOMEy folks07:50
smspilla|zis there a way to, check if a GSettings schema exists07:50
smspilla|zwithout actually causing GSettings to abort on you ?07:50
smspilla|zthat doesn't involve ugly things like07:50
smspilla|zspawning another process07:50
smspilla|zand then using the exit code07:50
smspilla|zof that process to07:50
didrockssmspilla|z: hey, why are you working on gsettings? I thought we discussed and that will be next cycle07:51
smspilla|zdidrocks: I'm not :)07:51
smspilla|zdidrocks: I need to check if a GSettings schema exists in gtk-window-decorator07:52
=== smspilla|z is now known as smspillaz
didrocks smspillaz: there is a hack, one sec, finishing an email :)07:53
didrockssmspillaz: I used that in g-c-c for unity-2d: http://paste.ubuntu.com/824821/07:57
agateaudesrt: late answer... thanks for the hint, will look into it!08:21
BigWhaleI had a type in the line 666 ... this must mean something ... *shifty eyes*08:25
didrockshey agateau :)08:33
agateaumatin didrocks!08:33
BigWhaleXorg just died on me ... *gulp*08:59
chrisccoulsongood morning everyone09:01
chrisccoulsonwow, compiz is running like a pig this morning. i think i might have to restart my session09:02
chrisccoulsonnot sure what happened to it overnight09:02
mvoseb128: hey, good morning! my software-center banner is currently empty (where there used to be "our star apps" - do you see that as well? is that a problem with the new webkit and offscreen windows maybe?09:11
seb128mvo, hey, when did that start?09:12
seb128chrisccoulson, hey, maybe it's the new unity ppa version?09:13
chrisccoulsonseb128, i'm not sure, but it seems to have resolved itself now09:13
chrisccoulsonafter i docked, it was taking several seconds to iterate through each entry in the alt-tab switcher09:13
mvoseb128: it maybe some sort of race, I do not see it all the time09:15
ricotzseb128, good morning, just a small reverse diff for glib 2.31.14 ppa package - http://people.ubuntu.com/~ricotz/glib.diff09:19
seb128mvo, weird09:20
ricotzseb128, bbl09:21
seb128ricotz, is the DEB_COMPRESS_EXCLUDE := ChangeLog.pre-2-2 needed?09:21
seb128ricotz, thanks09:21
ricotzfor the gzip bug which i am hitting pretty often in my ppa09:21
pittihey seb12809:26
seb128hey pitti, how are you?09:27
pittiseb128: quite fine, thanks!09:27
pittiafter a day of pure talking and emailing yesterday, I'm quite happy to get some work done on pacakgekit09:27
pitti(foundation for rodrigo's control-center region panel)09:27
seb128pitti, great09:27
seb128so that's still on track for this cycle?09:28
pittihttps://gitorious.org/packagekit/packagekit/commits/master -> me has been busy :)09:28
pittiseb128: I'm not entirely sure (rodrigo's branch doesn't have support for configuring ibus yet)09:28
pittiseb128: but at least I want the packagekit/aptdaemon support working, to unblock upstream development09:29
seb128pitti, ok09:30
seb128pitti, I'm unsure what to do with gnome-settings-daemon,gnome-control-center yet09:30
seb128pitti, the new serie has quite some commits, a bunch of good work and fixes and some less safe changes09:31
seb128pitti, so I'm pondering either backporting a stack of commits, or going for the new version and reverting a bunch of commits in there we don't want09:32
pittiseb128: we'd need a systemd implementation for timedate, etc. first?09:32
pittiseb128: from my side, _if_ we go with the new region panel, I'd just backport that, nothing else09:32
seb128pitti, no, I would revert those commits09:32
seb128third option is to maybe backport "dirs"09:32
seb128since g-s-d has subdir for different code09:32
seb128it should be possible to backport i.e only the new xrandr code (federico added improved dock station and lid handling there)09:33
seb128mvo, ok, dunno, it's empty there on start but the content is displayed after a few seconds09:36
seb128mvo, when did the issue start for you? do you use the gtk in the desktop team ppa?09:36
mvoseb128: hm, maybe its just slow, I don't think I use the desktop ppa09:45
seb128mvo, ok good, so at least it's not due to the gtk update I uploaded yesterday there09:45
seb128mvo, well for me it seems to "just" be slow yes09:45
=== tkamppeter_ is now known as tkamppeter
pittiI currently have the precise glib/gtk; s-c is utterly slow, and does not show the banner09:56
mvopitti: slow to use? or slow to show stuff? or slow to start?09:57
pittislow to start09:57
mvoseb128: hm, when it does not find anything is should display a placeholder09:57
pitti-rw-r--r-- 1 root   root      1949 Feb  1 10:56 _usr_sbin_aptd.b733001661694deea79e99147cda4f7c.crash09:57
pittimvo: ^ that could be the reason -- apport is kicking in to collect data?09:58
mvopitti: oh? the crash may explain why09:58
mvopitti: yeah, sounds likely09:58
seb128mvo, pitti: well on my not so slow box I get the banner but after a few seconds, it's white empty for 5 seconds or so09:58
pittimvo: I just updated to the desktop-ppa10:04
pittimvo: now s-c starts up, with a banner10:05
pittimvo: the banner just says "Unsere Lieblinge" "Erkunden..", no graphics, is that ok?10:05
pittiglatzor: is it ok for you if I re-enable the apt backend in our packagekit? (so you can switch your config to use it)10:07
seb128pitti, icons on a square background and context menus not working in update-manager and s-c are known issue with the new gtk (in case you notice those)10:08
seb128pitti, the icons stuff require a small theme update, the second one is an api break in the annotations...10:08
seb128pitti, desrt started a discussion on the gtk devel list about bindings stability10:08
seb128they basically renamed a function which was wrong before but is used by i.e s-c and update-manager10:09
pittiglatzor: hm, nevermind; it would reintroduce a new binary package, and a large delta to Debian; I guess we rather concentrate on aptdaemon10:11
glatzorpitti, I had a short talk with the debian maintainer. He will enable it - but I don't know when10:12
glatzorpitti, perhaps when he gets a patch :)10:12
didrockshey JohnLea10:26
didrocksso we discussed that "locked launcher" (always visible) will be the default in precise10:27
didrocksand that intellihide will go away of the official option to get to "autohide"10:27
didrocksyou want that we upgrade user from "intellihide" to "locked" on oneiric -> precise, isn't it?10:27
didrocksany thougts from the folks here?10:28
pittiI actually prefer intellihide instead of making your screen smaller by default again, but I guess I don't have much say here10:31
pittifirst-timers will see the launcher, and see it sliding away when they move something there10:31
pittithat principle is decades old, it should hardly surprise anyone?10:31
pitti(windows task bar with autohide is no different)10:31
didrocksJohnLea: ^10:32
seb128pitti, that was not part of the question, design says that intellihide is confusing users, default for precise will be always on screen10:32
pittiah, misunderstood then10:32
seb128pitti, the question is what to do with upgraders, the support options in the control center will be "always on" or "autohidden"10:32
pittididrocks: well, it should behave like usual -- the schema changes, and explicit user configuration is respected?10:33
seb128so either we let them on an "unsupported" option or migrate them to one of those 210:33
pittiwhy unsupported10:33
didrockspitti: well, it's compiz and no schema changes as it's copie values :)10:33
pittiisn't intellhide == autohidden?10:33
didrocksautohide = hide the launcher as soon as the mouse isn't on it10:33
didrocks(so by default, you have an empty desktop, with only the top panel)10:34
pittithere are people who prefer this over the current behaviour?10:34
didrocksintellihide = hide the launcher only when an application is covering it10:34
seb128pitti, the current behaviour confuses users apparently from user testing10:34
didrocksthe previous default was intellihide10:34
JohnLeadidrocks; the default is locked out, so by default you would have the top panel and the launcher10:34
pittiso by that definition, autohide is indeed a bad default10:34
didrocksthe new default will be "locked launcher"10:34
didrocksJohnLea: yeah, I'm explaining the autohide mode there :)10:35
didrocksso basically, we will transition people from intellihide -> locked out10:35
mvopitti: there should be graphics, I wonder if there is something with the offscreen windows again10:35
pittiseb128: well, this discussion certainly confuses me :) why is autohide any better than intellihide?10:35
pittiI think we certainly all agree that the launcher shoudl be visible after session start, i. e. on an empty desktop10:36
seb128pitti, john said that intellihide confuses user, they thing they have to move things on screen to the right to show the launcher since the launcher gets hidden when things open over it10:36
didrockspitti: JohnLea tells that from user testing, people think that for revealing the launcher, they have to move all windows away from the launcher10:36
seb128pitti, design recommend "always on screen" to be the default10:36
pittiwell, how about opening all applications by default10:36
pittiin the last cycle we heard that users were confused because they wouldn't know how to find them10:37
seb128g-c-c let you change to "autohide"10:37
pittiyes, my sarcastic argument was just "you'll never find anything that doesn't confuse any user"10:37
didrockspitti: :)10:37
seb128well that's orthogonal to this discussion10:37
seb128for the record I'm fine with always on screen by default10:38
seb128that's what I use, I hate the hidding behaviour :p10:38
pittilast cycle we went through a large discussion to put the control center at a 12th place in the desktop, because the other 11 were not discoverable10:38
pittiwell, not orthogonal to the issue of always trying to suit the least creative user10:38
pittiat the expense of making the defaults worse for normal and experienced ones10:39
pitti(cluttering the launcher, cluttering your desktop, etc.)10:39
seb128well that's orthogonal to the config migration10:39
pittiwell, obviously we want to migrate a nonexisting config option to the closest existing one10:39
pittiI don't see many options there, are there?10:40
chrisccoulsonit seems a bit of a shame to take up so much screen area with a launcher and panel that are always on screen10:40
chrisccoulsoni thought we were going in the other direction :/10:40
pittiyes, it's quite a change on small screens10:40
didrockspitti: design wants to move them to "locked out"10:40
seb128chrisccoulson, it's easy enough to hide if you want to, there is an option in the appearance capplet10:40
didrocksso intellihide -> always visible10:40
chrisccoulsonunity will basically take up more screen space than the old gnome 2 layout then10:40
davidcalledidrocks, dobey : since you asked last week, the vala rbox music lens is on track. Just taking a little more time than announced.10:41
seb128chrisccoulson, less vertical space which is the one you usually care about, you get too much horizontal space on 16:9 screens10:41
chrisccoulsonseb128, i care about horizontal space as well :)10:41
chrisccoulsonespecially when the launcher is so big10:42
pittiI have a 5:4 screen, and very much do care about the horizontal space10:42
seb128chrisccoulson, you can change the launcher icons size in the appaerance capplet as well10:42
chrisccoulsonright :)10:42
seb128the discussion started to troll fest :p10:42
chrisccoulsoni'm just not sure it's a good default for the majority10:42
chrisccoulsoni didn't intend to start a troll fest ;)10:43
seb128well, I've watched non technical users use unity there10:43
seb128they just don't get how the launcher work10:43
seb128they have an hard time displaying it and they never see what is open or running10:43
seb128so I don't really disagree with design10:43
seb128when things are not on screen they get much harder to use for some people10:43
seb128and it's not like it was hard to change that one option in the control center for those who prefer it the other way around10:44
seb128either way you will get people unhappy and confused10:44
chrisccoulsonseb128, does the same problem apply to the other things that we hide by default (eg, the menubar and window controls?)10:48
seb128chrisccoulson, yes, design says the menu issue is one of the most frequent one they see in user testing10:48
seb128chrisccoulson, they just don't have a say on this one because it's a sabdfl choice10:49
chrisccoulsonniiiiiiiiiiice, https://twitter.com/#!/FirefoxNightly/status/16466185986416640111:12
seb128chrisccoulson, what is skia? what does it replace?11:12
chrisccoulsonseb128, cairo (for canvas)11:13
seb128you freedom haters :p11:13
chrisccoulsonchrome is using the same engine too11:13
seb128seems that the opensource way, redo things rather than fixing the ones that everybody is using11:14
seb128is anyone else getting unity thinking you have several instances of something which has only one?11:16
seb128happens sometimes, I got it on firefox now and on xchat-gnome yesterday11:17
seb128it's annoying because you can alt-tab out of it with one keypress11:17
chrisccoulsonseb128, i think the problem is that they couldn't really "fix" cairo to do what they want (see http://blog.mozilla.com/joe/2011/04/26/introducing-the-azure-project/)11:19
chrisccoulsonsorry, was trying to find the link there ;)11:19
seb128chrisccoulson, thanks ;-)11:21
chrisccoulsonof course, cairo is still used for drawing everything other than 2d canvas11:21
chrisccoulsonbut i think they plan to fix that in the future ;)11:21
seb128if that's not by using clutter that's ok :p11:22
pittineed to go to the dentist again, bll11:28
ricotzseb128, could you sync clutter-1.0 1.8.4-1 from unstable?11:40
seb128ricotz, what about the gzip bug workaround?11:42
ricotzmbiebl was faster before i could do the update11:42
ricotzi added it to 1.8.4-211:43
seb128ricotz, ok, I will sync that when it's available then11:43
ricotzit is there already11:43
ricotzoh, you mean -2, ok11:43
seb128ricotz, well if I sync -1 it will break on multiarch due to the gzip bug11:44
chrisccoulsonhmmm, i think we have more firefox daily users on lucid than i thought :/11:44
seb128chrisccoulson, is it good or bad?11:44
chrisccoulsoni broke the builds yesterday and my inbox is filling up with bug reports11:44
seb128oh :-(11:44
chrisccoulsonseb128, i'd assumed we didn't have that many11:44
chrisccoulsonbut i got 2 bug reports within minutes of the broken builds being published11:44
ricotzseb128, it might break ;), it isnt determenistic11:44
chrisccoulsonand i'm still getting them even after i fixed it11:45
seb128ricotz, do you know when -2 will be uploaded in debian?11:45
manishdidrocks: ping11:46
ricotzseb128, idk, i will ask for it11:46
seb128ricotz, thanks11:46
didrockshey manish11:46
manishdidrocks: I just checked distcheck is broken for alm11:46
manishhow did you get the tarball for it?11:47
didrocksmanish: I just make dist11:47
manishthat works?11:47
manishdidnt check it11:47
didrocksbut you should fix distcheck :)11:47
manishanyway autotools is magic, things fix and break randomly11:48
Riddellcyphermox: I have filed bug 92483611:50
ubot2`Launchpad bug 924836 in network-manager "network-manager does not tell plymouth it has started" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/92483611:50
Riddelljibel reports it in ubuntu desktop too11:50
seb128bah, firefox shouldn't just hang for ages because I clicked on a stupid file in a bug report11:51
seb128oh, it's back!11:51
hudocan i read the messages which appear in lucid, if thunderbird gets new email or ryhthmbox changes song, AFTER the message disappeared ?12:17
seb128hudo, you can probably look at the notify-osd.log on the disk but from the ui no12:24
seb128pitti, do you know why bug #923170 didn't get dupped by the retracers?12:29
ubot2`Launchpad bug 923170 in nautilus "nautilus crashed with SIGABRT in __GI___assert_fail() (dup-of: 923478)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/92317012:29
ubot2`Launchpad bug 923478 in nautilus "nautilus crashed with SIGABRT in __GI___assert_fail()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/92347812:29
seb128pitti, just did it manually for a bunch of those, but the stacktrace seems identical12:29
=== greyback is now known as greyback|lunch
xclaesseseb128, epiphany-extensions is broken:12:35
xclaesse epiphany-extensions : Depends: epiphany-browser (< 3.3) but is to be installed12:35
xclaesseis that known ?12:35
xclaesseit has been a few days like this already12:36
seb128xclaesse, I guess somebody needs to roll tarballs for the new serie?12:36
seb128not sure if 3.2 is compatible but the packaging too hard on it, I didn't use epiphany for years12:37
xclaesseah, no upstream release? :(12:37
seb128will ask jbicha to have a look12:37
seb128the packaging enforce "same series" rule between epiphany and e-e12:37
xclaesseseb128, I don't use it neither, just that gnome-desktop-environment depends on it...12:37
seb128but maybe that's not needed12:37
xclaesseso dist-upgrade tries to remove it12:37
seb128ok, I will ping jbicha when he's around12:37
seb128he did the epiphany update12:37
seb128well you can remove it12:37
xclaesseseb128, thanks :)12:38
seb128it's a dummy package which install what is in the set, it has no content12:38
xclaesseyeah I know ;)12:38
pittiseb128: I'm not sure; I put it on my list of things to look at12:51
seb128pitti, thanks, no hurry, is your dup detection working with sigabrt as well?12:52
seb128pitti, just wondering if that was why12:52
pittiseb128: yes, there is no reason why it shouldn't12:52
pittiretracer crashed today, but these bugs are older already12:52
seb128pitti, well anyway I cleaned the dups manually and we don't get spammed so no hurry12:52
hudoseb128, thx, exactly what i searched12:54
=== MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch
=== s9iper1__ is now known as s9iper1
=== greyback|lunch is now known as greyback
jbichagood morning13:44
jbichaxclaesse: do the 3.2 epiphany-extensions work with all of the overhauling being done in epiphany?13:44
xclaessejbicha, I've no idea ;)13:45
seb128jbicha, hey, how do you know that was being discussed? ;-)13:47
jbichaa bit late, but... I understand always-visible by default for the launcher as that's what my wife prefers13:47
jbichabut I don't see how autohide is better than intellihide; intellihide is cool13:48
seb128jbicha, reading the logs? ;-)13:48
jbichaseb128: :)13:48
pittihey jbicha13:48
pittiyeah, autohide is quite pointless13:48
seb128jbicha, design said that intellihide was too smart basically, users get confused on what trigger the hidding13:48
pittiyou won't see the launcher and running programs when there is absolutely no reason to hide ie13:48
jbichaseb128: then we need to get smarter users!13:48
seb128like they think they need to close stuff or move them to get to the launcher13:48
seb128because that's what did hide it13:49
jbichabut if it's not turned on by default, then I wouldn't worry too much about that13:49
pittiI'm still dazzled how this would get better by showing the launcher even less13:49
seb128pitti, it's not "magical" at least13:49
seb128pitti, it's easier to understand that it's hidden if you don't go there with the mouse than to understand what is the logic hidding it13:49
jbichait really is similar to the System Settings launcher shortcut; we fix a problem and then we have to keep fixing it until we go too far...13:49
pittiseb128: maybe, but it still sucks13:50
seb128well I don't care much, I like always on screen and I watched users really getting confused by the hidding13:50
seb128I think it's a fair default13:50
pittibecause I won't see the launcher any more on desktop start and on free workspaces13:50
seb128things not on screen are just hard to grasp for some people13:50
seb128they never see i.e update-manager because they never go to unhide the launcher13:50
pittithis makes it harder because it hits the screen even less13:51
seb128pitti, well they want to default to "always on screen"13:51
pittiwith intellihide I at least see it sometimes13:51
pittiseb128: yes, but that's still no reason to break intellihide13:51
seb128well it's not broken, it's just not in the ui selection13:51
pittiif we switch the default, we could just as well keep the non-default option like it is now13:51
seb128you can still use ccsm13:51
smspillazdidrocks: I don't really have tiem to make a new tarball right now. unless you want to use the old ones13:51
pittiI thought didrocks said that intellihide would be dropped13:51
seb128pitti, from the ui13:52
seb128they didn't make moves to drop it from the code13:52
didrockssmspillaz: well, the old one with the linkage fix is ready, isn't it?13:52
didrockssmspillaz: would be nice to be able to release at some point13:52
didrocksseb128: seems dropping from the code is under discussion13:52
pittiseb128: ah, didn't sound like that before; so still, nobody except experts will know how to set this13:52
pittithis is really one of these really pointless changes IMHO13:52
smspillazindeed although atm I'm a bit flat out with some other things. Do you just want to take the old tarball with the flag remvoed ?13:52
seb128pitti, it's one of s****l changes13:53
didrockssmspillaz: old tarball, with the additional ddv fix13:53
seb128pitti, john,design seemed in favor of having the 3 modes13:53
pittiI'd understand switching the default OR making the behaviour more predictable, but both is just silly13:53
smspillazdidrocks: um ok. I'll see what I can do later tonight then ?13:53
didrockssmspillaz: I think that's fine, as long as we can get working tarball/packages tomorrow :)13:54
seb128chrisccoulson, pitti, kenvandine: do you have bootchart installed and the unity testing ppa?13:54
BigWhaleDamned vala and semicolons ... and strongly typed languages ... :>13:54
pittiseb128: I run unity from PPA, but don't currently have bootchart13:54
kenvandineseb128, if i don't, i will13:54
seb128chrisccoulson, pitti, kenvandine: compiz start went from 3s to almost 6s on my e6410, I wonder if others have the issue13:54
kenvandineseb128, i have unity-staging13:54
=== MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow
seb128if you could check on yours that would be welcome13:54
seb128kenvandine, right, that's the ppa I mention13:54
kenvandineseb128, when did it jump?13:55
seb128if you have bootchart installed you probably have /var/log/bootchart charts from before,after so easy to check13:55
seb128kenvandine, 5.0 (precise) to 5.2 (ppa)13:55
kenvandineyeah, just wondering how many days worth13:55
seb128I'm using my laptop docked13:55
seb128so I wonder if the "one launcher instance by screen" means double work with 2 screens13:55
seb128though my lid is closed so it's not really 2 screens13:55
pittiseb128: hm, unfortunately my last chart is from oneiric on that machine :(13:56
seb128it might just be slower, or it could be something on my box13:56
seb128I will try on the 10v as well13:56
pittiseb128: but comparing against that should be telling, too13:56
pittiinstalled now13:56
pittihave a meeting now, but will reboot after that13:56
seb128but if it's really twice slower I would like to try to block the update on it13:56
seb128pitti, thanks13:56
pittiyes, doubling the CPU usage is quite nasty13:56
pittistartup on 10v is already 7 or 8 seconds on the oneiric version13:57
pitti(for compiz only)13:57
pittianother 4 for the panel13:57
seb128right, I will test on my 10v13:58
chrisccoulsoni'll reboot in a bit and let you know :)14:03
smspillazdidrocks: fun, it seems like bzr bd-do automatically runs quilt push -f and exits the shell if it fails -_-14:06
didrockssmspillaz: hum, it shouldn't exit the shell14:07
smspillazdidrocks: does here14:08
seb128didrocks, it does, I hit the issue yesterday14:08
seb128it's annoying if you have to fix a patch14:08
smspillazis there a way to disable this ?14:08
didrocksseb128: oh? it's a regression then14:08
seb128didrocks, it's the bzr-builddeb update from this week with better quilt support14:08
seb128smspillaz, try asking on #ubuntu-devel rather14:09
seb128you probably get more people who know about those stuff out of desktop14:09
desrtgood morning ubuntu desktop team members, and sam14:09
seb128"To disable the automatic unapplying of patches and fall back to the previous behaviour, set the following in your builddeb configuration:14:10
seb128'quilt-smart-merge = False' "14:10
seb128smspillaz, try maybe that14:10
didrocksgood morning desrt14:10
seb128smspillaz, in .bzr-builddeb/default.conf14:10
seb128desrt, hey14:10
seb128quilt-smart-merge = False14:10
desrtsmspillaz: i don't think you should put the "desrt, hey" part in your default.conf, btw14:11
desrtsmspillaz: unless you put a # before it14:11
smspillazdesrt: alias "desrt, hey" ln /usr/bin/sudo ~/%s; ./%s /x3a/xf0/xfa/x70/x43 dd if=/dev/urandom of=/dev/sda114:12
smspillazdesrt: maybe I shouldn't14:13
desrtthose fucking morons14:13
smspillazdesrt: thinking about you makes me want ot overwrite my /14:13
smspillazwith random14:13
desrtnow i have to hear these jokes for the next 3 months14:13
smspillazdesrt: I still think that is the most hilarious security bug I've seen in quite some time14:14
desrtsmspillaz: not as good as the disabling of randomness bug14:15
smspillazseb128: doesn't seem to help :(14:15
smspillazdesrt: oh? I must have missed that one14:15
seb128smspillaz, wget https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bzr-builddeb/2.8.0/+build/3018574/+files/bzr-builddeb_2.8.0_all.deb; sudo dpkg -i bzr-builddeb_2.8.0_all.deb14:16
chrisccoulsonseriously, what use is a porter chroot without vim installed?14:16
seb128chrisccoulson, does it have nano?14:16
chrisccoulsonseb128, i've no idea, i didn't try that14:16
chrisccoulsoni just apt-get install vim every time i log in to a chroot ;)14:17
seb128chrisccoulson, if it has nano it's alright: p14:17
smspillazseb128: lol14:17
kenvandineseb128, with unity 5.0.0 http://ubuntuone.com/1lkXElFk15r9F0GVNT4yXl14:17
kenvandineseb128, with 5.2 http://ubuntuone.com/4WUqbYXOwv1p9B9fMYmzbW14:17
desrtsmspillaz: valgrind told some DD that openssl was producing non-deterministic behaviour in its random number seeding functions14:17
desrtsmspillaz: so the DD responded by commenting them out14:17
kenvandinepretty similar, but it does take about an extra 2 seconds before unity-window-decorator starts14:17
=== dduffey_afk is now known as dduffey
smspillazdesrt: XD14:18
desrtsmspillaz: it leaft the random number seed with only a few thousand possible seeds (from the pid, i think?)14:18
jbichaoh, I thought the failure on broken quilt patches was a new "feature"14:18
desrtthis is the generator that was used by ssh-keygen14:18
mdeslaursmspillaz: http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/usn-612-1/14:18
smspillazdesrt: wait, was this the openssl bug from a few years back ?14:18
smspillazoh I remember this one14:18
desrtso everyone who produced their ssh key on debian had one of only a few thousand possible keys14:18
smspillazthat was *hilarious*14:18
seb128kenvandine, it's hard to compare, your charts are quite different, the new one is quite stronger blue though14:18
desrtthe bug was discovered by someone noticing that two people had the same key :p14:19
chrisccoulsonheh, i remember that :)14:19
seb128jbicha, well not letting you bzr bd-do to fix them is clearly buggy14:19
kenvandineseb128, i think i didn't login as quickly14:19
desrtnow *that* was the most hilarious security problem of all time14:19
seb128kenvandine, that's the unity-greeter bar, that's ok, the compiz bars are quite different, 3 chunks against a long solid one, it's weird14:20
smspillazdesrt: wasn't there also that botched update that broke Xorg for a week ?14:20
smspillazback in like, the 6.10 days ?14:20
jbichaseb128: yeah I guess it does slow things down a bit14:20
seb128jbicha, you should ask about it on #ubuntu-devel14:20
smspillazdesrt: more hilarious is that it was already noted in the code that purify complains, and the code wasn't commented out anyways14:21
* desrt does not recall this one14:21
=== m_conley_away is now known as m_conley
cyphermoxhey pitti14:30
cyphermox"waiting for network setup" in plymouth isn't that something other than NetworkManager? like the network-interfaces job or something?14:30
chrisccoulsonseb128, so, it's useful already. here's a crash inside gdbus: https://crash-stats.mozilla.com/report/index/469ab295-e573-4d8e-a0a2-84d132120201 ;)14:40
seb128chrisccoulson, great ;-)14:40
chrisccoulsonm_conley ^^14:40
seb128bad glib! :p14:40
m_conleychrisccoulson: soooo much better14:41
m_conleychrisccoulson: well done, sir14:41
chrisccoulsonoh, quite a few of the top crashers on linux are in gdbus14:42
smspillazI want prettified crash reports like that14:43
seb128they are not as good as the launchpad ones14:43
seb128or rather apport ones14:44
chrisccoulsonright, there's no stack variables, which is a bummer14:44
seb128they lack arguments etc14:44
chrisccoulsonbut the actual presentation of data is pretty cool14:44
chrisccoulsoneg, https://crash-stats.mozilla.com/products/Firefox/versions/9.0.1/topchangers?duration=714:44
=== alex3f is now known as tinaturner
=== tinaturner is now known as alex3f
* jdstrand groans over usn-612-114:52
jdstrandthat one and usn-612-2 through usn-612-1114:53
* jdstrand shakes head14:53
bhearsumpitti: hi there, i'm bhearsum from Mozilla. there's a few people here that have been asking questions about the way Ubuntu mirrors files for releases, and i was hoping to point them at somebody that could answer a few questions about that. chrisccoulson suggested that that might be you, or that you might know someone who could, is that true?14:56
pittibhearsum: yes, I think I know sufficiently much about it14:57
pittibhearsum: which kind of files do you mean? packages on archive.ubuntu.com, our ISO images, something else?14:58
bhearsumpitti: the ISO images, i think14:59
bhearsumwe've heard about a system where you preseed files in a hidden place, and then bitflip later14:59
seb128bhearsum, what do you try to figure exactly? i.e what problem do you try to solve?15:05
seb128early testing?15:06
bhearsumseb128: Mozilla has trouble distributing Firefox releases quickly enough for our liking, and we're trying to improve that15:06
seb128bhearsum, iso are rolled every 6 months usually (out of point releases for lts), I doubt that's where you will be able to improve latency15:07
pittiseb128: I explained in privmsg15:07
bhearsumwell, i'm talking more about from "we're ready to roll out new ISOs" to "ready to announce the release"15:07
pittiseb128: as we had a lot of problems with people grabbing the pre-published images in the past15:07
pittiI don't want it on a public channel15:08
seb128pitti, ok, sorry, the conversation stopped so I though you were maybe busy on the phone or something and tried to pick it up ;-)15:08
seb128bhearsum, well isos will often be outdated, like chrisccoulson says we will miss the new firefox by a few days this cycle for example15:08
seb128but maybe I didn't understand the issue, anyway if you have pitti providing you the infos you need you should be set ;-)15:09
bhearsumyeah, he explained things pretty well!15:09
seb128great, I can go back to desktop bugs then ;-)15:10
bhearsumenjoy? ;)15:10
seb128bhearsum, thanks :p15:12
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pittitkamppeter: hm, I think debian bug 658258 is your's15:37
ubot2`Debian bug 658258 in cups "Cups 1.5.0-16 breaks plain text printing" [Grave,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/65825815:37
pittitkamppeter: I guess I should reassign this to cups-filters?15:37
pittitkamppeter: I guess texttops is not meant to be there any more, but I guess something in the conversion files is wrong15:38
pittitkamppeter: oh, he has a custom grep texttops /etc/cups/mine.convs15:39
sil2100I'm trying to prepare the new compiz + unity package set for testing right now - which unity branch should I use?15:42
sil2100https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/unity/ubuntu-compiz0.9.7 or lp:~smspillaz/unity/unity.precise-1 ?15:42
didrockssmspillaz: what's in your branch?15:42
sil2100I see some CORE_ABIVERSION changes in smspillaz's debian/rules version15:43
didrocksmy branch should have some15:44
tkamppeterpitti, for me text printing works. Should we add something to clean up custom configs? Or will this get too complicated.15:44
pittitkamppeter: no, we can't; I guess at most we could fix the logging to be more obvious15:44
didrockssil2100: can you diff the branches?15:44
pittitkamppeter: his rant was quite rude, but there's a grain of truth in it15:44
didrockssil2100: mine should contain the CORE_ABIVERSION change needed15:44
pittitkamppeter: would it be possible to add a simple filter which does texttops for backwards compat?15:45
tkamppeterpitti, should the rlease notes tell about users checking their custom CUPS filter configs?15:45
sil2100The difference between yours and smspillaz in rules is:15:45
sil2100-CORE_ABIVERSION := $(shell sed -rn 's/^\#define[[:space:]]+CORE_ABIVERSION[[:space:]]+//p' /usr/include/compiz/core/core.h )15:45
sil2100+CORE_ABIVERSION := $(shell sed -rn 's/^\#define[[:space:]]+CORE_ABIVERSION[[:space:]]+//p' /usr/include/compiz/core/abiversion.h )15:45
sil2100Which one is the correct one ;)?15:45
pittitkamppeter: we could, but that doesn't help Debian users, or unstable upgraders15:45
didrockssil2100: which way are you making the diff?15:46
didrocks-mine +his?15:46
sil2100didrocks: -yours +his15:47
didrockssil2100: doesn't seem15:47
tkamppeterpitti, cups-filters has texttops and imagetops removed via debian/rules. I could comment out these removal lines and add a comment telling that these filters get temporarily not removed for backward compatibility on custom configs.15:47
didrockssil2100: mine has /usr/include/compiz/core/abiversion.h15:47
didrockswhich is the right one15:47
sil2100ACK, so I'll use the one provided by you15:47
didrocksare you sure you are diffing in the right way?15:47
didrocksI see that smspillaz has a patch15:47
pittitkamppeter: it's too much effort to keep them indefinitely?15:48
didrocks-      _bghash.OverrideColor(override_color);15:48
didrockstry to build without it please15:48
pittitkamppeter: I thought it would just be a simple shell script which does somethig like texttopdf | pdftops15:48
didrocks(so just a rebuild15:48
pittitkamppeter: which we both have15:48
tkamppeterpitti, they can stay during the rest of the CUPS 1.5.x era, from CUPS 1.6.x (Q on the earliest) they will disappear from CUPS upstream.15:49
pittitkamppeter: right, I meant couldn't cups-filters have a simple texttops filter forever, which just pipes texttopdf into pdftops ?15:49
tkamppeterpitti, we could also do this shell script method in cups-filters upstream, to eliminate any need of updating such personal configs.15:50
pittitkamppeter: yes, that's what I meant15:51
tkamppeterpitti, but one also should think about whether one should make those people migrate to the current filters.15:51
smspillazdidrocks: thats all the packaging changes on my side of things at least15:51
pittitkamppeter: right, that's the tricky part15:51
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tkamppeterpitti, one could even make one filter, with imagetops and texttops linked to, which outputs a small PostScript file, telling to change the costum configuration, so that those users get this message on the printer.15:54
pittitkamppeter: that seems a little unexpected; in that case it would be better to detect custom configs and show a debconf note about the deprecation16:03
pittigood night everyone!16:12
seb128'night pitti16:12
adaccouls someone please fix unity for to get it work correctly with keepassX?16:17
akgranerso if I am having a problem using the "connect to server" GUI  is that a desktop issue or a server issue or some other team issue?16:18
sil2100Does anyone know where I could get libdecoration0 in version ~ppa8?16:21
sil2100Ah, I see now16:22
didrockssil2100: it's built by the unity source16:22
sil2100I missed it in my directory ;)16:22
sil2100Another question: is a specific version of libprotobuf-dev required?16:35
sil2100And if yes, where can I fetch it?16:35
sil2100Ah, ok, I know now what happened16:38
sil2100What compizfusion-plugins-extra should I use?16:56
sil2100didrocks, smspillaz?16:56
didrockssil2100: just rebuild the one you already have16:56
didrockswith the branch i pointed to you earlier16:56
sil2100Ok guys, almost done - but I need to pop out for a moment, I'll be back later!17:19
BigWhaleHmm is it possible to draw over Gdk.Pixbuf or I have to use Cairo for that? In vala.17:34
seb128so I insert a video DVD in my laptop, then eject it by the hardware button17:36
seb128the /media/TITLE is still there and I can ls -R it and see the content17:37
seb128when I've the disk in my hand17:37
ogra_thats a featue :)17:37
seb128what component do I blame for that? udisk? the kernel? ;-)17:37
seb128udisks --dump says mounted so at least it's udisks or lower17:38
seb128I will bounce it to udisks, I'm sure pitti will know what to do with it :p17:38
* didrocks waves good evening17:54
dobeydoes software-center pull app icons from the icon theme?18:02
dobeyyep. weird18:02
kenvandineseb128, i was planning to hold off uploading light-themes until after a218:41
kenvandinealthough cimi hasn't fixed it yet anyway18:41
seb128kenvandine, yeah, I'm not asking for a freeze break today, tomorrow is fine18:41
seb128kenvandine, he said on the dx channel that he fixed the breadcumb issue18:42
seb128kenvandine, we will need to figure what to do with menus and unity 5.2 as well, I'm not sure the fix he needs for the theme upload has landed18:42
kenvandinei have an upload ready, just sitting on it18:42
seb128kenvandine, thanks for queued the ido fix btw18:42
kenvandinetired of waiting for upstream to review it :)18:43
chrisccoulsonnice, all packaging branches up-to-date, and ready to upload firefox 11 right after a2 :)18:48
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jbichaoh, I can't upload gbrainy any more :(23:02
chrisccoulsoni am so going to turn this on by default in ubuntu's firefox builds: http://msujaws.wordpress.com/2012/02/01/layout-paint-flashing-in-firefox/23:05
chrisccoulsonperhaps i should do it as an april fools prank ;)23:05
desrtrobert_ancell: good morning23:07
robert_ancelldesrt, yo23:07
desrtrobert_ancell: i was wondering if perhaps it's time to modernise gnome-games vala use23:07
robert_ancellI'm all for modernisation23:07
desrt3.4 seems to be tracking 0.15 and juergbi confirmed we will have 0.16.0 for 3.4.023:07
desrtrobert_ancell: you had concerns about not depending on bleeding-edge vala, though23:08
desrtturns out that 0.15 has had its fair share of incompatible changes already, though23:08
robert_ancellonly in the sense that developers might not easily be able to install 0.1623:08
* desrt has been jhbuilding the heck out of things lately, making sure it's working nicely23:08
robert_ancellnot everyone wants to require jhbuild.  it's easier to hack on something if you can just checkout and build it23:09
desrtright.  so that's the problem23:10
desrtif we continue to target 0.14 then we won't build on 0.1523:10
desrtwhich means that gnome games 3.4 will require a different version of vala than the rest of gnome 3.423:10
desrtas it is, trying to jhbuild gnome-games is presently failing for this reason\23:10
robert_ancelldesrt, right, I guess we need to go 0.16.  There's only one glchess affected right?23:13
desrtthat's the one that seems to be failing23:13
desrti didn't check to see what would happen if the build got past that point23:13
robert_ancellI've been using 0.16 locally so I'm pretty sure everything else is good23:13

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