jonathanhindiashams: el meeting hyb2a hena ?!14:56
ashamsjonathanhindi, it should be, but no one around so far!14:56
jonathanhindino irc channel for the council sa7 ?!14:57
ashamsyes, sure :)14:57
jonathanhindiwho is attending? All of us ?!14:57
ashamsno, it should be all but Anas14:58
jonathanhindiI have to go on 6:00 :(14:58
ashamsI suspect if we''l have a meeting at all :(14:59
jonathanhindime too !15:00
ashamsEl balad wal3a, I felt shame to send a reminder :-(15:01
jonathanhindiGamal, told me seconds.15:03
ashamsWazery said he'll be here in minutes15:05
jonathanhindimgamal:  Welcome15:06
mgamaljonathanhindi: thanks15:07
ashamsmgamal, welcome man15:07
mgamalwelcome, ashams15:08
jonathanhindiytbka wazery15:08
mgamalashams: can you post a link for the agenda?15:11
mgamalthanks jon15:11
ashamsoh no, just renamed it: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EgyptTeam/Meetings/Agendas/2012-02-0315:12
ashamssorry jonathanhindi :(15:12
ashamsI always on the bad time15:12
jonathanhindiashams: no problem15:12
ashamsMenopia, hi o/15:17
MenopiaHi guys :D15:17
Menopiahi ashams :)15:17
ashamshi dude :-)15:17
Menopiawhat's going on?15:17
jonathanhindiok guys lets start because i have to leave at 615:18
ashamsso, it's first meeting and thus things are a little weird15:18
Menopiabut where ahmed toulan15:18
ashamshe won't attend15:18
ashamsok, let's proceed with first item15:19
ashamsCouncil: Responsibilities of Council15:19
Menopiawhat is the agenda :D:D15:19
jonathanhindiMenopia: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EgyptTeam/Meetings/Agendas/2012-02-0315:19
Menopiathanks jonathanhindi15:19
jonathanhindiashams: please proceed !15:19
jonathanhindiMenopia: urw15:20
ashamsas suggested by community council, it's 1)Solve conflicts, 2)approve process change15:20
ashamsdo we need more?15:20
ashamsthis is just warming up15:20
mgamalI don't think so15:20
jonathanhindiashams: monitor focus groups15:20
ashamsgood point15:20
ashamswhich drive us to council form15:21
mgamalthe less responsibilities the council has, the more space there is for the community to breathe15:21
ashamshow should we form council, from FGs15:21
ashamsFGs' admins be council members by nature?15:21
Menopiasorry guys, but can we call anas as he told me that he wants someone to remind him and I don't have his number15:21
ashamsok, I'll do it15:21
ashamshow can ppl join council?15:22
Menopiaapplying for it, and let the community to vote15:23
ashamswe already agreed upon Official members of Ubutnu-EG(Membership can be granted through preparing application > meeting > Approval or refusal)15:23
jonathanhindiashams:  By elections from any fg, But we need to put a detailed procedures for forming the council, and how people can apply15:23
ashamsshould we restrict it to FG members?15:23
ashamsMenopia, i like this approach too15:24
mgamalashams: I prefer having it open for any member15:24
MenopiaI agree with jonathanhindi15:24
ashamswhat if non-fg member wants to join council?15:24
jonathanhindiashams: nop i mean that he/she must be a working in ubuntu egypt for a while at least 1 year, and an official member of ubuntu egypt15:24
mgamalashams: I don't think there is a problem with that15:25
ashamsjonathanhindi, that approach shows 2 problems15:25
mgamalbtw guys, what are the membership procedures for ubuntu-eg?15:25
ashams1) how can we measure if some1 is workin in ubuntu-eg for that long15:25
jonathanhindiashams: from the membership application.15:26
ashams2) like mgamal said, what is ubuntu-eg membership?15:26
ashamsbeing reg'd doesn't mean s/he's active enough!15:26
MenopiaI think we need a wiki page to describe this procedure15:26
jonathanhindiashams: When you were talking about the council responsibility, you say that the council will approve memberships I am wrong ?15:27
ashamshow can ppl gain ubuntu-eg membership and should we complicate it like so?15:28
ashamsjonathanhindi, actually I can't remember :P15:28
mgamalI guess for that we can just follow the same procedures for the global ubuntu membership15:29
mgamalwat do you guys think?15:29
ashamsok, if ubuntu-eg membership, how can ppl join? who should accept their membership?15:29
Menopiaashams, it's not very complicated, any active person can make an application with his work and we the council approve him or not15:29
jonathanhindiashams: gain it by applying to it, and in the application must have some easy procedures like the ubuntu global memberships. mgamal you hit my point :),15:29
jonathanhindiMenopia: I think this is a good working plan15:30
ashamscool, we agreed then :)15:30
ashamsshould we move to next point?15:30
jonathanhindifor me yes15:30
MenopiaI think so15:31
ashamsCouncil Term. 6 months, longer or shorter?15:31
Menopiait's enough15:31
Menopiain my opinion15:31
jonathanhindiashams: me too, its ok for 6 month, every release cycle15:32
Menopiaand the voting can be done in every release party15:32
ashamswooow, that's coooool15:32
ashamsI love this idea :-)15:33
mgamalI object15:33
mgamalpublic voting on IRC15:33
mgamalnot all members can attend live meetings15:33
mgamaltransparency people, transparency15:33
MenopiaSo I think mailing list is better than irc15:33
jonathanhindiMenopia and ashams i think we must divided between our internal events and external events, I agree with mgamal voting on irc15:34
ashamslet's vote: <medium> <value>15:35
ashamsIRC +115:35
jonathanhindiIRC +115:35
MenopiaIRC +115:35
jonathanhinditab mien b2a el mo3tried :D15:35
ashamsalmost done :)15:35
Menopiashould we but the IRC in the beginning ?15:35
Menopiamowafka :D15:36
ashamsmgamal, IRC +1?15:36
mgamalIRC +115:36
ashamsnext point?15:36
jonathanhindiashams: i think the voting should happen before the release day with 2 weeks at least15:36
Menopiajonathanhindi, why?15:36
ashamsto leave 1 week for FG elections15:37
jonathanhindiMenopia: I am looking forward, kman people who work in the council are almost the most active members in the community and they should be preparing for the release party15:38
ashamsgood reason, even15:38
ashamsmgamal, 2 weeks before release?15:38
jonathanhindiMenopia: so kol mkan badri kol mkan a7san15:38
mgamalshouldn't the new council be formed _after_ every release?15:39
mgamalI am asking :)15:39
Menopiajonathanhindi, aha I got it15:39
jonathanhindiMenopia and ashams i think after will solve my concern :)15:39
jonathanhindibut i prefer before :D15:40
ashamsso we settled on after?15:40
mgamalI guess we can hold the votes before the  release but the new council should assume responsibility after the release :)15:41
MenopiaTotally agree mgamal,15:41
jonathanhindimgamal: ana kont baktib keda :D15:41
ashamsit's done15:41
ashamsnext point?15:41
mgamalin that case it doesn't matter when we vote15:41
Menopianext point :)15:41
mgamalwe can vote on the release day itself15:41
mgamalnext point15:41
ashamsthat's the next point, release date gets changed every time15:42
ashamswe need stable dates for elections15:42
ashamsend of april and end of oct?15:42
jonathanhindi6 months from the past election date15:42
jonathanhindilast **15:43
ashamsjonathanhindi,  this way it can shift on the long run15:43
Menopiaagree with ashams,15:43
ashamsshift a bit earlier or later15:44
jonathanhindibut that way we can make sure that every council got the same time as the last one15:44
Menopiaend of april and end of oct15:44
mgamalvotes everyone?15:45
ashamsvote: 6months period -------------- OR ------- end of april, end of oct ?15:45
mgamalend of april, end of october +115:45
jonathanhindiashams: i think it is the same :D15:45
jonathanhindi+! end or april, end of october :D15:45
jonathanhindi+1 *15:45
Menopiasorry +1 end of april, end of october15:45
ashamsok , done15:45
jonathanhindiNumber of council members.15:46
mgamalnumber of members?15:46
ashamshow many ppl should be their on council?15:46
ashamshahaha :-)15:46
jonathanhindi5% of the community official members15:46
ashamsmind blowing thing ;)15:47
mgamal5 are enough15:47
mgamalonce we have many members in FGs we can have delegates from each FG15:47
mgamalso I say for now 515:47
jonathanhindimgamal: good point15:48
ashamsjonathanhindi 5 or 5% ?15:48
jonathanhindi5liha 5 :)15:49
ashamsI think 5% is the future, but now it's too advanced :)15:49
ashamsso 5, done?15:49
Menopiaok :D15:49
jonathanhindiashams: i was think with the future in mind when i was saying 5%15:49
ashamsjonathanhindi, I could read that ;)15:50
mgamalinitial FGs15:50
ashamsE)Website Maintainers15:50
ashamsF)Social Media15:50
ashamsThose are intial FGs we agreed upon on ML15:50
ashamsany objections15:50
jonathanhindiwho is the bankers ?!15:51
ashamsmoney holders :P15:51
Menopiaand where is the media15:51
mgamalI guess you mean treasurers15:51
ashamsMenopia, Social Media15:51
mgamalone suggestion15:51
mgamalSocial Media, Marketing, and sponsorts can be lumped into one group15:51
ashamsmgamal, ma 2olna keda, jonathanhindi 2al nefsel, sa7 ya 3am?15:52
jonathanhindimgamal: i think when people are trying to get sponsors is very different from social media maslan !15:52
mgamalwe can start with PR now, once we grow we can diversify15:52
jonathanhindiana 2wlt eno social media can be with marketinhg15:53
ashamsjonathanhindi, so you have a good memory !15:53
jonathanhindimesh 3rief i don't agree hwa fi haga 3'lat, bas mesh adier a5li el social media m3 el sponsors maslan15:54
ashamsso merge socail media with marketing, or make all into PR?15:54
ashamsor leave separate?15:54
jonathanhindi+1 for mege social media with marketing15:54
mgamallet's leave sponsors separate15:54
mgamal+1 for jonathan's suggestion15:55
ashamsheh, the same meaning in diff words15:55
ashamsMenopia, agree on this ^15:55
mgamalthe spokespersons15:55
mgamalshouldn't they be part of PR too?15:56
jonathanhindimgamal: ana mesh 3rief lazmitha brdo15:56
ashamswhat about?15:56
ashamsjonathanhindi, mgamal it's expansion for council15:56
ashamswe have limited no of council15:56
ashamsbut we need to sear into governorates15:56
ashamslike alex15:56
ashamswe have branch there15:56
ashamsbut I suspect if a council member will be there15:57
ashamsso, it's a major obstacle15:57
jonathanhindiashams: good point15:57
ashamsso, done?15:57
mgamalstill spokespersons can be part of PR regardless of their location15:57
ashamsok vote: merger spokespersons into PR? +1, -1 or +015:58
jonathanhindihwa fien el pr you mean the sm with the marketing is named pr. sm and marketing should be renamed marketing not pr15:59
mgamalwhatever the name is16:00
mgamalsm, marketing, and spokespersons in one group16:00
jonathanhindispokespersons is not relavent to marketing that's what i mean16:00
ashamsGuys it's almost 6;00, do you want to continue?16:01
mgamalI have no problem with that16:01
jonathanhindiashams: momkin 10 mins kman16:01
ashamsC)PR: Marketing + Social Media + Spokespersons16:01
ashamsE)Website Maintainers16:01
ashamsfinal shape?16:01
MenopiaMOWAFKA :D16:02
ashamsBankers = treasurers :)16:02
ashamsjonathanhindi, what happened?16:02
ashamsjonathanhindi, so we kick marketing?16:02
ashamsor kick spokespersons?16:03
jonathanhindinop but i think marketing must not be with spokespersons16:03
ashamsso, can we intiate now, then we separate when we figure out more about the nature of such FGs?16:03
ashamsHow can persons join FGs?16:04
mgamalby simple announcement16:05
ashamswe almost agreed on: Anyone with history in that specific job(to preserve quality) and Activity on it.16:05
ashamsare we done with this?16:06
jonathanhindiI think when applying to the membership he/she choose his preference. according to his/her experience should be part of the fg16:06
jonathanhindibrb phone16:06
Menopiajonathanhindi, ana kont baktb kda :)16:06
mgamalhere is what I think16:06
mgamalany volunteer can join the FG he wants16:07
ashamsbut Quality ya man!16:07
mgamalas of that moment he is an FG member16:07
mgamalashams: what is the specific job of an FG?16:07
ashamsaccording to each FG16:07
ashamsif Support, they give support on our mediums16:08
ashamsthat's for example16:08
mgamalso FGs must be joined by people who are willing to do that activity, no?16:09
Menopiain any time16:09
mgamalthe question is. Are "FGs" elite groups of people who already did activities, or is it the way people do activities from?16:09
Menopiathe way people do activities from in my opinion16:10
mgamalsame here, Menopia16:10
mgamalwhat I envision basically is that all ubuntu-eg members are members of one FG  or another16:10
ashamsno, they are active ppl who want to do specific job, but bearing in mind that they should be at some good experience as they wil represent ubuntu-eg16:10
Menopiaashams, you have a point16:11
mgamalok, so should we take votes?16:11
ashamseach FG has it's own members16:11
jonathanhindimgamal: please tell me votes on what?16:12
mgamalon the nature of FGs16:12
MenopiaI think it is better if we leave it with no voting and anyone, this way we can grant that new members are participating freely16:13
mgamalagree with Menopia16:13
ashamsbut quality!16:14
Menopiathe representation can't be made if he/she is not an official member16:14
jonathanhindiquality matters, i think we could find a balanced solution16:14
ashamsthose will officially represent the whole team16:14
Menopiathe quality is in the hands of the FG leader16:14
mgamalso the question again is are FGs "elite groups" or "voluntary groups"?16:15
Menopiaone of his responsibility is to grant that any work he approve meets the quality, and the community can guide him16:15
jonathanhindiMenopia: if you are a fg leader of spokespersons and all the members fear public speaking. and you need 2 of them to present something at the moment, what you are going to do?16:15
mgamalthe members should've not joined spokespersons group to begin wihth16:16
ashamsI vote on elite +116:16
mgamalmembership should be voluntary for this reason16:17
jonathanhindiento la5btoni16:17
mgamalso let's take votes, elite or open16:17
ashamsme tooooooo16:17
ashamselite +116:17
jonathanhindican you give me one moment ashr7lkom haga16:17
ashamsguys, I have to go, so sorrrry16:18
jonathanhindiI don't think when we are searching for quality we can check it by the ability of the person to learn not only his past experience, so why not open, because we need at least to check if he can learn the job or not. bas keda16:18
Menopiajonathanhindi, e7na momken nestasny el sposkespersons fg mn enaha tb2a open16:19
ashamswhat about make it open but joiners should show some experience16:19
mgamalhard to do16:20
jonathanhindila2 the same time if you are talking about social media and the members don't have a fb account what you are going to do? thats all it is about a skills and abilities16:20
mgamalI guess this needs a separate discussion16:20
mgamalcan we leave this to the next meeting?16:21
ashamsyes plz16:21
ashamsgtg, and will read logs later, sorrrrrrrrry16:21
jonathanhindiI have to go too16:21
jonathanhindiso can we meet again to continue the agenda !16:21
mgamalbefore you leave16:21
ashamswhat about next friday?16:21
mgamalthat's too far16:21
mgamalcan we make it tomorrow, 5 pm?16:22
ashamstab monday?16:22
jonathanhindibefore wednesday i am not free16:22
mgamalnext Friday is good for me then16:22
jonathanhindiNext wednesday or next firday16:22
MenopiaI agree with tomorrow and Monday16:22
ashamsnext friday, IRC or in person?16:23
ashamsfriday, 5 pm?16:23
jonathanhindiblash fi nos el youm16:24
ashamstab when, 8 pm, is ok with Menopia and mgamal ?16:24
jonathanhindi5las 5 ok16:24
ashamsok 5 then16:25
Menopia5 wala 816:25
mgamal8 is ok16:25
mgamal5 is ok16:25
mgamalboth are ok :16:25
mgamaleven 10am is ok on Friday16:25
ashamsso we settle to 516:25
mgamallet's take votes16:26
ashamsfriday 5:00pm ..Irc16:26
jonathanhindi10 am 7ellw awey16:26
mgamalFriday, 5pm, IRC? +1 if you agree,16:26
jonathanhindi10 am please :D16:26
Menopia10 mafesh moshkla16:27
mgamalor should that be WAFAQ AL-COUNCIL now? :P16:27
ashamsya3ni 10 am?16:27
jonathanhindi10 am16:27
ashamswe took time to decide time more than meeting itself16:27
ashamswe could hav efinish agenda by now :D16:27
ashamshave finished*16:28
jonathanhindiok 10 am yala byebey :D16:28
ashams10 am +116:28
mgamalwhat? what?16:28
jonathanhindi10 am +116:28
Menopiamgamal, I am like you I thought it was PM16:28
ashamsMenopia ?16:28
ashamsok i really gtg16:29
mgamalok, let's discuss this on the ML16:29
ashamsI'll read the logs and will be there isA, any time you choose16:29
jonathanhindidecided on the ml16:29
ashamsshit, we couldn't decide time on IRC and moved it to ML, that's EPIC :D16:30
thelinuxerashams: mgamal Menopia how r u guys :)16:30
Menopiaana 2a3ed16:30
Menopiamsh mashy :D16:30
Menopiathelinuxer, how are you man16:30
thelinuxerMenopia: fine .. done with the meeting ?16:30
Menopiawa7shnyy :D16:30
thelinuxerwenta kaman ya man .. law kan meeting bara kont geet ba3do ashofko :)16:31
mgamaljonathan and shams had to leave so we have moved some discussions to the next meetoing16:31
thelinuxercool  i didn't know eno el meeting fe3lan 7aye7sal :D16:31
thelinuxerkont gebt moot bot walla 7aga16:31
Menopiaana ha2om akol wagy :D:D16:32
thelinuxerMenopia: cool16:32
thelinuxerMenopia: wb17:03
thelinuxermgamal: Menopia got my email ?17:10
thelinuxeri just sent u an email can u check ur inbox ?17:11
Menopiaand I agree17:11
thelinuxerthat's cool Menopia17:12
thelinuxermgamal: and we shouldn't worry a lot about transparency17:12
thelinuxercause it's a third party tool and we can't actually control anything but the dates and the emails-addresses17:13

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