[01:39] <tjagoda> Aaron Thul's facebook says he's engaged
[01:39] <tjagoda> mob him for congratulations immediately
[01:39] <snap-l> Awesomesauce!
[01:44] <snap-l> Something tells me he'll be moving to Canada
[01:47] <jrwren> O_O
[01:47] <tjagoda> I get that impression
[01:47] <jrwren> never thought hed settle
[01:47] <tjagoda> Don't think he really enjoys Detroit all that much
[01:48] <snap-l> jjhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b04RzmSJyJE&feature=youtu.be
[01:49] <tjagoda> lol
[01:50] <tjagoda> I wonder if GeekNet will tell me if they decline
[01:51] <snap-l> I think they wil
[01:51] <tjagoda> Cool
[11:23] <rick_h> morning
[12:23] <snap-l> GOod morning
[12:23] <snap-l> Apparently my alarm decided to go AWOL this morning
[12:35] <Wolfger> morning
[12:41] <Wolfger> Uh... Hmm... http://ubuntuportal.com/time-drive-a-user-friendly-utility-for-back-up-your-files-under-ubuntu/
[12:42] <Wolfger> There's a 2-day-old article about software that hasn't been touched since October 2009, and the article doesn't even link to the most recent home page for said software...
[12:57] <snap-l> Has anyone tried timedrive?
[12:57] <snap-l> I'm not sure I'd trust it yet.
[12:57] <rick_h> timedrive? never heard of it
[12:57] <snap-l> Well, whatever ships with Oneiric that asks you to back up your machine
[12:58] <snap-l> Bwahahaha. rick_h, check lococast spam. :)
[12:58] <snap-l> one of the spam bots puked up all of their responses into one post.
[12:58] <snap-l> What’s up, just wanted to tell you, I loved this blog post. It was funny. Keep on posting!
[12:58] <snap-l> Hi there, I just wanted to say, you’re wrong. Your post doesn’t make any sense.
[12:58] <rick_h> snap-l: nice, that's great. Now we can just block all of those
[12:58] <snap-l> etc.
[13:04] <snap-l> http://openmetalcast.com/2012/02/10/open-metalcast-special-episode-club-metal-9/
[13:15] <Wolfger> that's priceless
[13:39] <snap-l> Hello from the other screens.
[13:41] <brousch> hello to the other screens
[13:45] <snap-l> "@davepell: I wish all those girls who ignored me in high school could see how many tabs I have open in my browser right now."
[13:45] <rick_h> lol
[13:45] <Wolfger> ha!
[13:45] <snap-l> I'm this close to turning off extension syncing in Chrome
[13:46] <brousch> how many of those tabs have the FB pages of those girls up for stalking purposes?
[13:46] <snap-l> I swear, uninstall does not mean install it on the other browser ad nauseum. Honest.
[13:46] <snap-l> brousch: None. I'm off FB
[13:46] <snap-l> And funny enough, they're not stalking me on my blog (That I'm aware of)
[13:46] <brousch> you can't be off FB. that's being off the internet!
[13:47] <brousch> next you'll tell me you don't use IE
[13:48] <Wolfger> You can stalk people on FB without being on FB
[13:48] <snap-l> Wolfger: I have FB blocked at the router (save for https, which for some reason doesn't work)
[13:50] <brousch> you're gonna miss out on the $5 zuckerburg is sending every FB member after the IPO
[13:51] <snap-l> SOmething tells me that's not going to happen.
[13:51] <Wolfger> Did you really just put a $5 price tag on snap-l's soul?
[13:51] <brousch> i'm sure it won't, but i bet it would spread like wildfire if i sent it as an email forward
[13:52] <Wolfger> do it!
[13:52] <Wolfger> create a "Facebook IPO" page on FB and tell everybody that they have to "like" it to get the payout from Zuckerberg
[13:53] <brousch> "Mark Zuckerberg is going to make billions of dollars from Facebook's IPO, and he wants to share it with you! All you have to do is make sure your Facebook address and phone number are correct so he can send a $50 check once the deal is done."
[13:53] <Wolfger> ...and then send that e-mail to the women you want to stalk. Brilliant!
[13:54] <snap-l> brousch: Oh, my privacy is definitely worth $50. Sign me up
[13:54] <brousch> FB should do that. think of all the good info they could get from it
[13:54] <Wolfger> Hell, who in America wouldn't sell their privacy for $50 to a trusted upstanding public company?
[13:55] <Wolfger> I think only the people who laugh at such tiny amounts of cash and wouldn't bend over to pick up a $50 bill.
[13:55] <snap-l> Yeah, I mean,  they're having an IPO. That's like being part of the Better Business Bureau, isn't it?
[14:02] <Wolfger> .... http://programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/55728/as-a-programmer-what-would-you-use-a-personal-wiki-for
[14:03] <Wolfger> "either locally or online" ... WTF is the purpose of a personal, local wiki?
[14:04] <brousch> keep your code snippets and notes
[14:05] <brousch> http://www.tiddlywiki.com/
[14:06] <Wolfger> why would you use a wiki for anything that isn't a collaborative effort, is really my wtf, I guess...
[14:07] <Wolfger> You can keep code snippets and notes just fine in a non-wiki environment
[14:07] <brousch> easy to edit and search
[14:08] <Wolfger> or as the first comment says, "A wiki seems really complex. I've always used a text document"
[14:09] <brousch> that's fine if you have 1 thing to note
[14:11] <Wolfger> Heh. Well, my organizational skills are the stuff of legend (i.e. you may have heard of them, but nobody's seen them and they probably don't exist)
[14:13] <snap-l> Wolfger: Wikis are good for folks who want a simple way to organize a lot of text
[14:13] <snap-l> though personally I find them to be a bit comples for my needs
[14:13] <snap-l> complex, rather
[14:13] <brousch> evernote ftw
[14:14] <snap-l> vi + git FTW. ;)
[14:14] <rick_h> yea, sphinx + git + fabric ftw
[14:14] <brousch> right, that is not complex at all :P
[14:14] <rick_h> :P
[14:14] <snap-l> I'm not the one adding Sphinx and fabric to the mix. :)
[14:15] <snap-l> rick_h is the one lighting a cigarette with an acetalyne torch
[14:15] <rick_h> I like to start fires with gasoline, jump right to the point!
[14:15] <snap-l> hah
[14:16] <brousch> I USE NAPALM TO FIRE UP MY GRILL!
[14:16] <rick_h> I have a reputation for getting camp fires going without any problems :) off to on like a light switch!
[14:17] <snap-l> God, what's that stuff that the conspiracy theorists say was laced inthe 9/11 towers...
[14:17] <snap-l> Burns like a mother
[14:17] <snap-l> I coould see rick_h using that for his grilling
[14:17] <brousch> I DON'T HAVE A FURNACE IN MY HOUSE. I HAVE A MONKEY WITH A BLOWTORCH AND A FLATULENT ELEPHANT
[14:17] <snap-l> "Once I start a fire, I want it to stay lit, dammit"
[14:19] <Wolfger> Heh. My uncle used to light his cigarettes with an acetylene torch all the time..
[14:20] <snap-l> "Never send a boy to do a man's work."
[14:37] <jrwren> sphinx? fabric? wtf?
[14:37] <jrwren> gasoline might make a great charcoal starter
[14:44] <snap-l> Yeah, but your food will taste like a truck stop
[14:51] <Wolfger> have you ever tried to light gasoline on fire? It's not easy to do.
[14:51] <Wolfger> I don't know why people think of gasoline as being a good way to light things up.
[14:52] <jrwren> yes, I have.
[14:52] <jrwren> its pretty easy
[14:52] <jrwren> poor gasoline onto grassy ground, in a path.
[14:52] <jrwren> poor lots of it at the point on which you will be lighting it
[14:53] <jrwren> drop match.
[14:53] <jrwren> watch it burn and spread.
[14:53] <jrwren> but yes, most people have no concept of just how stable gasoline is.
[14:53] <jrwren> its why its our fuel of choice, because its NOT unstable.
[14:53] <jrwren> its not explosive
[14:53] <jrwren> it doesn't burn easy
[14:54] <jrwren> common every day things like oxygen burn easier
[14:54] <Wolfger> I tried to roast a mountain of ants one time when I was a kid
[14:54] <Wolfger> poured gasoline over them, lit a match, dropped it in the puddle... the match went out
[14:54] <jrwren> there was a puddle or was it gassy asnd?
[14:54] <jrwren> sand?
[14:55] <brousch> the ants all urinated to put out the flames quickly
[14:57] <Wolfger> it was a hard-packed sand, so a lot soaked into the ground, but there was a bit pooled on the surface
[14:58] <Wolfger> The circle of dirt where the above-ground pool used to be
[14:58] <Wolfger> which found second-life as a makeshift basketball court
[14:59] <Wolfger> and, of course, home to thousands and thousands of ants
[15:02] <snap-l> The fumes of gasoline are explosive, but the liquid itself is not
[15:02] <Wolfger> right
[15:03] <Wolfger> so don't keep mostly-empty air-tight cans of gas lying down-range. :-)
[15:03] <snap-l> Which is why I get nervous when folks say they're stockpiling gas in their shelters
[15:04] <snap-l> first off: if it's truly the rapture / end times, what makes you think you're going to be one of the ones who will make it?
[15:04] <snap-l> If it's truly the end-of-the-world, there's not going to be much left for you to be standing / sheltering in
[15:05] <snap-l> ALways found that thinking to be a bit off.
[15:05] <Wolfger> You're mixing and matching
[15:05] <snap-l> enmlighten me
[15:05] <Wolfger> rapture people plan on *not* being around after the world ends
[15:06] <snap-l> No, but they're making plans for their pets
[15:06] <snap-l> I just don't understand this concept
[15:06] <Wolfger> stockpilers of guns and fuel are planning for the end of civilization, not the end of the world
[15:06] <Wolfger> ...
[15:06] <Wolfger> pets don't need gasoline
[15:07] <snap-l> also, if any conversation gets us on the FBI watch-list, I'm pretty sure it's this one. :)
[15:07] <snap-l> UBUNTU IS AN APOCALYPTIC CULT
[15:07] <snap-l> SEND IN THE ATF
[15:07] <snap-l> WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THEY HIT RELEASE Z?
[15:07] <Wolfger> the FBI doesn't have a watch list
[15:07] <Wolfger> they have a don't-watch list. It's extremely short
[15:08] <snap-l> Wolfger: Hah
[15:09] <jcastro> rick_h: man I like this static S3 thing
[15:10] <jcastro> it's going to end up so much cheaper than just getting a VPS for a blog
[15:10] <rick_h> jcastro: yea, I've been doing a ton of s3 lately
[15:10] <rick_h> I stick all my crap there these days: I've got a bunch of shortcuts for uploading to buckets there
[15:10] <jrwren> i want to report a bug with pangolin's installer, anyone know the right lp project?
[15:10] <jrwren> hi jcastro
[15:10] <jcastro> ubiquity
[15:10] <snap-l> jrwren: DId it crash?
[15:11] <jcastro> ubuntu-bug ubiquity is what you want
[15:11] <snap-l> If it crashes, it'll try it's best to point you in the right direction
[15:11] <jcastro> rick_h: you just pushing up with s3 cmd?
[15:11] <jcastro> what kind of stuff you keeping there?
[15:11] <jrwren> snap-l: it did not crash. it doesn't work with kvm -usb -usbdevice tablet
[15:11] <jrwren> which means testdrive is not functional right now :(
[15:11] <snap-l> jrwren: Ugh
[15:12] <jrwren> i could file it with testdrive, but then someone else has ot triage it to right place.
[15:12] <snap-l> Something tells me it'll be ping-ponged if you file it with ubiquity.
[15:13] <rick_h> jcastro: http://paste.mitechie.com/show/539/
[15:13] <snap-l> But, if it's a problem with ubiquity, I'd file it there.
[15:13] <rick_h> jcastro: I haven't gotten the s3cmd thing going
[15:13] <jrwren> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubiquity  :(
[15:13] <rick_h> jcastro: I've been using that python script and a series of aliases for the common places I dump things
[15:13] <jcastro> jrwren: "type this in a terminal"
[15:13] <rick_h> jcastro: so I've got up_lp up_lococast up_mitechie etc
[15:13] <jcastro> "ubuntu-bug ubiquity" and follow the instructions
[15:14] <jrwren> jcastro: ty
[15:14] <jcastro> rick_h: is the cost low? I'm assuming it will be trivial with like, a blog.
[15:14] <jrwren> doesn't matter that its mismatched versions?
[15:14] <jcastro> Not sure, if it is it will bail right away
[15:14] <rick_h> jcastro: I dump postgres backups 2x a day for bookie http://bmark.us all the podcast files for lococast, personal backups, screenshots I use like pastebin stuff
[15:14] <jrwren> bah, i dont have X.
[15:14] <jrwren> need an Xless ubuntu-bug :)
[15:14] <rick_h> jcastro: yea, I htink s3 was some $7 last mont
[15:14] <jcastro> it runs in the terminal I thought
[15:15] <jcastro> rick_h: hah yeah, as I suspected, why have a vps
[15:15] <snap-l> Y'know, that mismatched versions thing is nice, but man, it can be a bit of a PITA
[15:15] <jrwren> yes, my bad, for some reson DISPLAY was set
[15:15] <rick_h> jcastro: yea, I've moved form the colo to dual ec2 instances
[15:15] <rick_h> jcastro: but starting to keep files on s3 for redundant/easy to share/etc
[15:16] <rick_h> jcastro: I use that index.html I linked you G+ to browse them like an apache directory listing
[15:16] <rick_h> jcastro: like http://uploads.mitechie.com/index.html
[15:16] <rick_h> hmm, broken? well lococast one http://media.lococast.net/index.html
[15:16] <jcastro> heh, awesome
[15:16] <jcastro> I don't even have EC2 for the blog
[15:16] <snap-l> rick_h: Worked for me
[15:17] <jcastro> I just use amazon to serve the http
[15:17] <jcastro> I am going to connect it to cloudfront tonight
[15:17] <jrwren> ubuntu-bug gathers some B.S. report that is entirely wrong. so how to file it??? does ubuntu-bug work from installer?
[15:17] <jcastro> you know, because I need a CDN for a blog.
[15:17] <rick_h> jcastro: yea, I was checking that out.
[15:17] <jrwren> can I ctrl-alt-F1 from installer and run ubuntu-bug ?
[15:17] <snap-l> jcastro: You might. :)
[15:17] <jcastro> jrwren: hmm not sure with that one
[15:17] <rick_h> jcastro: I need to create a new bucket for the bookie js docs and I can host it like that: http://files.bmark.us/jsdoc/index.html
[15:17] <jcastro> give it a shot
[15:17] <snap-l> 500 angry nerds have to let you know they're rather unhappy with Unity
[15:17] <snap-l> and they're rage-quitting Ubuntu
[15:17] <jcastro> heh
[15:17] <jcastro> more like the same 5 100 times
[15:18] <jcastro> rick_h: hah I love how we're all excited about serving static content
[15:18] <jcastro> I will not go into the brutal horror that it took for me to install and use ruby
[15:18] <snap-l> jcastro: RVM, or something else?
[15:18] <rick_h> jcastro: yea, I've been meaning to port my blog over to a git driven tool like that
[15:18] <jcastro> I wasted like 2 hours on rvm
[15:18] <jcastro> and then rbenv worked the first time
[15:19] <rick_h> jcastro: yea, there's a python one cofee house wifi is broken as @#$#@$ so I can't find the link
[15:19] <jcastro> I saw it
[15:19] <jrwren> for what are you using ruby?
[15:19] <rick_h> jcastro: http://www.blogofile.com/
[15:19] <jcastro> they all aren't as nice as octopress
[15:19] <snap-l> I got RVM working for Tracks
[15:19] <jrwren> arent' you a huge puppet fan anyway? puppet is ruby, is it not?
[15:19] <rick_h> that's the one I want to port to
[15:19] <jcastro> jrwren: http://octopress.org/
[15:19] <snap-l> jrwren: puppet hides ruby. :)
[15:19] <jcastro> jrwren: I'm into service orchestration now, not config management.
[15:19] <jrwren> a great tool hides its abstractions
[15:20] <jcastro> I no longer care about each individual machine
[15:20] <jrwren> jcastro: buzzword bingo? I don't even know what that means.
[15:20] <rick_h> jcastro: but yea, s3 + the index.html JS for directory listing ftw as a grat "pastebin" for files
[15:20] <snap-l> jcastro: You sound like a hipster when you say that. :)
[15:20] <rick_h> jcastro: what's the state of same machine multiple charms? That's the killer I need
[15:20] <jcastro> jrwren: puppet and chef are "I want a machine to look like this, give it to me."
[15:20] <jcastro> juju is "I want wordpress, go get me what I need."
[15:21] <jcastro> rick_h: it's close to landing. That's called subordinate charms btw if you ever need to ask.
[15:21] <snap-l> qq: these static blogs don't serve comments, do they?
[15:21] <rick_h> jcastro: awesome
[15:21] <jcastro> they do
[15:21] <jcastro> octopress has built in disqus support
[15:21] <jrwren> yes!  ubuntu-bug does work from installer. YAY!
[15:21] <rick_h> damn, I need to find a seat by power so I can get the mifi up...this is painful
[15:21] <snap-l> What id you don't want disqus?
[15:21] <jcastro> and twitter, g+, etc.
[15:21] <rick_h> snap-l: yea, most of them hook up disqus
[15:22] <snap-l> I can see that becoming a huge pain point
[15:22] <jcastro> heh, all the benefits of the static speed from S3 and then you get crushed perf wise by adding disqus
[15:22] <rick_h> jcastro: meh, at least you can make it async
[15:22] <snap-l> partially that, and partially what happens when disqus decides to change their TOS.
[15:22] <jcastro> wait, WHAT.
[15:22] <rick_h> jcastro: and when was the last time comments were productive :P
[15:22] <jcastro> oh I don't care much about their TOS.
[15:22] <rick_h> snap-l: yea, lmorchard fought that
[15:23] <rick_h> snap-l: they have an export method I believe
[15:23] <jcastro> I'm a stackexchange addict now, comments are worthless.
[15:23] <jcastro> I am trained to not care about comments
[15:23] <rick_h> heh
[15:23] <jcastro> this is quite cool though
[15:23] <jcastro> All I need to do tonight is buy a domain and set up cloudfront
[15:24]  * snap-l sees jcastro starting to  blog from jorge.stackexchange.com
[15:24] <snap-l> and comments get voted up, or flagged by the community.
[15:24] <jcastro> well, one of the reasons I liked octopress is now that I am into SE I am all about Markdown
[15:25] <jcastro> and the octo posts are just plain text Markdown
[15:25] <snap-l> Yeah, markdown is nice.
[15:25] <jcastro> hell, I'm even writing emails in markdown now, I don't know what's wrong with me
[15:25] <snap-l> also means when you make your blog memoir, it'll be easy to convert to PDF. ;)
[15:26] <jcastro> I actually like tumblr (it has markdown support)
[15:26] <jcastro> but I felt the need to dogfood the cloud more
[15:26] <jcastro> and what better way to learn than by moving all my stuff
[15:26] <snap-l> understandable
[15:26] <jcastro> plus, there's like this weird vibe when you read a tumblr
[15:26] <jcastro> sort of like finding a band on myspace, you're like "what?"
[15:27] <jrwren> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+filebug/e690dcca-53fa-11e1-a30c-002481e7f48a?  can anyone help me make this bug better?
[15:27] <snap-l> "I just made a tasty sandwich". bob liked this, sarah liked this, alice liked this.
[15:27] <krondor> I'm having way too much on octopress http://missionpenguin.com now that ruby is unscrewed on my box
[15:27] <snap-l> jcastro: God, MySpace is hell for band pages
[15:27] <krondor> disqus is heavy though
[15:27] <Wolfger> snap-l: sudo make me a sandwich
[15:28] <snap-l> "THANKS FOR THE ADD COME SEE MY NEW BAND KUMQUAT FUCKSANDWICH TONIGHT AT THE RUSTY NAIL"
[15:28] <Wolfger> LOL
[15:28] <Wolfger> ++ for "at the Rusty Nail"
[15:28] <snap-l> Wolfger: You're welcome.
[15:29] <snap-l> JoDee used to live by there. THat place is an institution of shitty bands everywhere.
[15:31] <krondor> anyone used akamai before? or have any clue how much they charge for dns?  I'm thinking too much whatever it is.
[15:31] <Wolfger> I used to drive past it all the time when I lived in Mount Clemens
[15:31] <rick_h> krondor: route53?
[15:32] <rick_h> krondor: I keep meaning to move my dns to that
[15:32] <jcastro> rick_h: oh, octo has built in gist support too
[15:32] <snap-l> OK, Google Reader has done something to make instapaper not work.
[15:32] <snap-l> Getting really close to not using Google Reader anymore
[15:32] <Wolfger> Oh dear lord... it's a little over 2 months until Penguicon, and their flier only list one guest of honor, and it's somebody who's there every year?
[15:32] <snap-l> ESR?
[15:32] <Wolfger> John Scalzi
[15:33] <krondor> rick_h: I hadn't considered route53 for non aws.  Hmm...
[15:33] <rick_h> jcastro: yea, there's actually a cool app I want to try out for that https://github.com/justinvh/gitpaste
[15:33] <rick_h> jcastro: we run one of these internal and replace the pastebin with it :P except the gitness would freak peeps out
[15:34] <jcastro> yeah but the current pastebin doesn't do any dvcs
[15:34] <jcastro> man dude, can you charm that?
[15:34] <jcastro> that'd be SLICK
[15:35] <rick_h> jcastro: the current one has no way to reply or anything...drives me nuts
[15:35] <rick_h> jcastro: yea, was thinking of trying to charm that as an open space at pycon
[15:35] <jcastro> man that would be really great
[15:35] <jcastro> you can just run it on canonistack, problem solved
[15:36] <rick_h> jcastro: heh yea. and it shold be single server since it's dbless I think
[15:36] <jcastro> I assume it just puts the paste in git repos right?
[15:36] <rick_h> jcastro: just git and whoosh for fulltext index, but not tried it out yet, just following it
[15:37]  * jcastro nods
[15:37] <rick_h> jcastro: right, it uses GitPython to create it, indexes the contents for search into whoosh
[15:37] <rick_h> uses django to web-ize the views
[15:38] <jcastro> we have a mostly functioning django charm
[15:38] <jcastro> it's about to get a whole lot better
[15:38] <rick_h> nice
[15:38] <brousch> ok, i know i should have read up on this stuff, but what does that mean?
[15:38] <rick_h> ?
[15:38] <rick_h> what does what mean?
[15:38] <brousch> "a mostly functioning django charm"
[15:39] <rick_h> you can do juju install django and get a server up and running with django ready to go. I'm assuming the charm would support extending it some how to get your app in there?
[15:39] <jcastro> it only sort of works
[15:39] <jcastro> yeah frameworks are tricky
[15:39] <rick_h> yea
[15:39] <rick_h> should be more around the app if they can get it to be python packaged
[15:40] <jcastro> yeah
[15:40] <rick_h> but it's a tough nut, why I don't have a bookie charm atm
[15:40] <jcastro> there's like 50 lower hanging fruit before I can get there
[15:40] <rick_h> but why I like that gist app, should be easy there
[15:40] <brousch> how does it know where to make the server? in a config file you feed juju?
[15:41] <jcastro> yeah
[15:41] <jcastro> either local, openstack, or ec2
[15:41] <jcastro> rick_h: man that would be an awesome charm
[15:41] <rick_h> brousch: yea, you tell it
[15:41] <jcastro> talk about juju at the next CHC
[15:41] <jcastro> I am hurting on new charms, I need a win baby!
[15:41] <rick_h> jcastro: yea, we've brought it up. I want to try to do a 'talk' on it at the long one at the end of hte month if I can get time
[15:41] <jcastro> plus if you get a charm in the store you get a free ubuntu mug and tshirt!
[15:42] <rick_h> but most things are db server, web server, etc and I don't want to fire up 3 ec2 instances for a blog
[15:42] <jcastro> right
[15:42] <jcastro> just test on canonistack
[15:42] <rick_h> thus my severe interest in the sub charm stuff :)
[15:42] <jcastro> or LXC
[15:42] <rick_h> yea, I've not messed with either yet
[15:42] <krondor> rick_h:  ++ I'd want to hear it.  I haven't played yet, but I'm very interested.
[15:42] <brousch> so a charm is the packaging of what goes on the server, and juju is what creates the server and deploys the charm?
[15:42] <jcastro> plus if you're working on a charm it's an easy expense
[15:42] <jcastro> brousch: right
[15:42] <jcastro> "apt get for the cloud"
[15:43] <rick_h> krondor: yea, when canonical was shipping me to pycon I was pitching that stuff as how to justify my way. but now it's a bit lower priority to bookie itself
[15:43] <jcastro> except instead of packages, you deploy services across multiple machines
[15:43] <jcastro> rick_h: find me charmers, we already have like 40 something, I need 100!
[15:43] <rick_h> brousch: yea, there's some talks on it
[15:43] <jcastro> brousch: right so let me just show you in commands how you deploy wordpress
[15:43] <rick_h> jcastro: I'll see if I can get time to put something together at pycon in open space format
[15:44] <brousch> i know. i just haven't looked into it because it's bigger scale than i deal with right now
[15:44]  * snap-l would be very interested in this
[15:44] <jcastro> juju bootstrap; juju deploy wordpress; juju deploy mysql; juju add-relation wordpress mysql
[15:44] <jcastro> juju expose wordpress
[15:44] <jcastro> and then you just go to the URL.
[15:44] <rick_h> yea, go read jcastro's blog posts. I particularly like the idea of "good practice" in charms
[15:44] <jcastro> then you realize, crap, I can't scale.
[15:45] <jcastro> juju deploy varnish
[15:45] <jcastro> juju add-relation varnish wordpress
[15:45] <jcastro> then point your DNS to the varnish IP instead, done.
[15:45] <krondor> rick_h:  yeah, me too.  Only I think people argue so much over those settings.. It can defintely be better than stock though for sure.
[15:45] <jcastro> or memcached, whatever floats your boat.
[15:45] <snap-l> jcastro: juju add-relation phpbb wordpress. ;)
[15:45] <brousch> all of the user passwords, mysql passwords are set in the charm?
[15:45] <rick_h> krondor: yea, but everyone admits that the default pgsql settings are complete nonsense
[15:46] <jcastro> yes, or you can set them
[15:46] <rick_h> krondor: so just getting a better default pgsql would be a huge win
[15:46] <jcastro> like juju set mysql password=blah (my syntax isn't right but that's the idea)
[15:46] <brousch> rick_h++
[15:46] <jcastro> I have a postgres hero looking at that charm right now
[15:46] <jcastro> it's going to be /epic/
[15:46] <rick_h> jcastro: yea, that'll be a good one
[15:46] <krondor> true .. back in a few (evil meetings)
[15:46] <rick_h> and that opens up a lot more LP folks since we're pgsql everywhere
[15:47] <jcastro> if any of you ever need hadoop let me know
[15:47] <jcastro> we can fire that up in ec2 in about 6 minutes
[15:47] <snap-l> Wow
[15:47] <jcastro> and as many slave nodes as you have dollars.
[15:48] <brousch> and the purpose of this thing is that people who need to scale are already doing this, but there's no standardized methods for it, so juju and charms are trying to be that standard?
[15:48] <jcastro> juju deploy hadoop-master; juju deploy hadoop-slave; juju add-relation hadoop-master hadoop-slave
[15:48] <jcastro> brousch: exactly
[15:48] <snap-l> I wouldn't say standard, but a way to lighten the load
[15:48] <rick_h> brousch: a bit, but I think the "apt-get of infrastructute" makes a lot of sense when you htink about it
[15:48] <snap-l> Seriously? Juju is trying to be a standard?
[15:48] <rick_h> "apt-get install a memcache server" and one fires up on your account in edc2
[15:49] <jcastro> ^^ then when you want 10 nodes: juju add-unit --n=10 hadoop-slave
[15:49] <jcastro> blam, a 10 node cluster, ready to crunch
[15:49] <brousch> rick_h: i'm sure it does, it's just that i have not personally encountered the need so my ignorance is holding back my comprehension
[15:49] <jcastro> snap-l: right so why would I want to set up hadoop by hand when the "archive" has it.
[15:50] <jcastro> and then we make the charms be smart out of the box, so you don't end up like this guy:
[15:50] <rick_h> brousch: yea, it's a bit nice for that VM hit/run world for our use cases
[15:50] <snap-l> Standard implies more than Ubuntu taking this up
[15:50] <jcastro> http://www.kalzumeus.com/2012/02/09/why-i-dont-host-my-own-blog-anymore/
[15:50] <rick_h> brousch: so like when I run bookie tests against pgsql I have to have a pgsql server to test against
[15:50] <rick_h> brousch: how could would it be if testing was "fire up pgsql server, conncet bookie, runtests, shut down them all"
[15:50] <rick_h> brousch: and since bookie has to work against sqlite, mysql, pgsql that's a few servers
[15:51] <rick_h> and next up is getting rabbitmq and such involved
[15:52] <brousch> i am starting to see the appeal
[15:52] <rick_h> brousch: that's my main reason, testing and such.
[15:52] <snap-l> jcastro: heh
[15:52] <snap-l> I just recently moved from Apache to Nginx for my blogs.
[15:52] <rick_h> but since you can run it against your own ubuntu cloud setup, imagine you're getting slammed today and need to fire up more app servers
[15:53] <rick_h> brousch: so a company can fire up some more instances of the app server for christmas for instance
[15:53] <rick_h> and then they rnu out of space on their internal cloud, so they start firing up more instances of the app servers in ec2 land for the day
[15:53] <brousch> right, my own ubuntu cloud setup, that old thing
[15:53] <rick_h> since it's the same "charm" it's the same version of everything, just the machines are now on ec2
[15:53] <brousch> nice
[15:53] <rick_h> so I can see it some for larger places as well as my little testing needs
[15:54] <jcastro> snap-l: right, so my argument is, if everyone says nginx is the way to do it, we should ship that ootb!
[15:54] <jcastro> basically, make smart choices, but over entire deployments (which is why you can't just do this in packages)
[15:55] <snap-l> jcastro: This desperately needs to replace CPanel.
[15:59] <brousch> thanks for explaining it. i think i at least understand what it is now
[16:00] <rick_h> brousch: yea, it's the kind of thing that starts to make more sense when you see it
[16:45] <rick_h> snap-l: https://twitter.com/#!/voidspace/status/168012381979545600
[17:17] <snap-l> rick_h: Oh, pretty
[17:19] <snap-l> Wow, it requires Twisted to run? :)
[17:19] <snap-l> Sheesh, that's not particularly light-weight. :)
[17:19] <rick_h> well it's got to perform :)
[17:19] <rick_h> oh come on, pip install :P
[17:20] <snap-l> Definitely a different use-case than what I'm checking
[17:20] <snap-l> But if I ever need to test an ISP, I'll know where to go. ;)
[17:22] <rick_h> wahoo! mission accomplished: https://twitter.com/#!/garybernhardt/status/168021339653939200
[17:23] <snap-l> http://www.reddit.com/r/java/comments/pitz0/homework_desperation/
[17:23] <rick_h> snap-l: do you just have a google alert for things with 'homework' in the name?
[17:23] <snap-l> No, I don't
[17:23] <rick_h> oh heh...that looks familar
[17:23] <snap-l> but apparently it's a similar student.
[17:25] <snap-l> Yeah, it's the same guy
[17:25] <snap-l> somehow I wouldn't think going to rediit for homework help would be productive.
[17:27] <snap-l> rick_h: https://twitter.com/#!/garybernhardt/status/168021339653939200 <- That is so true
[17:33] <snap-l> http://arstechnica.com/business/news/2012/02/critics-slam-ssl-authority-for-minting-cert-used-to-impersonate-sites.ars <- can we please stop  with the trust authorities for SSL? It's clear it's broken beyond repair
[17:34] <greg-g> :)
[17:41] <tjagoda> So, there's a twitter spambot in our LoCo portal Microblog
[17:42] <tjagoda> Either that, or somebody REALLY thinks #ubuntu-us-mi needs AppleTV
[17:42] <tjagoda> And French watches
[17:42] <brousch> you mean a spammer on identica?
[17:42] <brousch> unpossible!
[17:42] <tjagoda> http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-michigan
[17:42] <snap-l> THat's actually twitter.
[17:43] <greg-g> yeah, the spammers on twitter are harder to block since it is just a hashtag
[17:43] <brousch> beautiful
[17:43] <snap-l> Because someone figured out quickly that they can get some link juice via putting #ubuntu-
[17:43] <greg-g> identi.ca it is a group that snap-l and I moderate
[17:43] <snap-l> With an iron fist
[17:43] <greg-g> http://identi.ca/group/ubuntumi
[17:43] <snap-l> If anyone else wants admin, LMK. :)
[17:44] <tjagoda> https://twitter.com/naijand
[17:44] <tjagoda> Appears to be teh spamzor
[17:44] <tjagoda> You should go to your twitters and spam report him/her/it
[17:45] <snap-l> I did
[17:45] <brousch> i like to think that if i ever meet a spammer in real life i will kick him in the testicles once for every spam i've received
[17:46] <snap-l> I wonder if they could put in a rule that aonyone using more than one #ubuntu- tag doesn't get added to the microblogging role-call
[17:50] <tjagoda> Quickly, to the blueprints!
[17:51] <snap-l> https://bugs.launchpad.net/loco-team-portal/+bug/930297
[17:53] <tjagoda> I hopped on your Bug wagon, because I'm cool like that
[17:54] <snap-l> danke
[18:04] <tjagoda> I love when my users try to flush pandas down the IT toilet.
[18:04] <tjagoda> Also, it is now snowing lightly in Port Huron.
[18:05] <brousch> we have about 1/2" since noon
[18:07] <jjesse> it was snowing at 8:30am on the way to work
[18:08] <brousch> that was dandruff
[18:09] <tjagoda> It makes me sad that I have a decent contingent of users who believe that the internet will only work if they have a desktop shortcut which leads directly to each web page they need.
[18:09] <tjagoda> "Can you make a shortcut for xxx"
[18:10] <snap-l> tjagoda: And get indignant when you tell them to use the address bar or bookmarks
[18:10] <krondor> rick_h:  looks like I can't use route53, no DNSSEC support
[18:10] <tjagoda> Yes, as if I am telling them that they must climb up a snow covered hill
[18:10] <tjagoda> Chisel the address into a stone tablet
[18:11] <greg-g> snap-l: we're talking about the global jam hashtag right now in -locoteams
[18:11] <tjagoda> and then perform a complicated ritual involving sacrificial lambs and the gods of OpenDNS.
[18:11] <krondor> which sucks because it sure is cheap
[18:11] <rick_h> krondor: :(
[18:11] <rick_h> oh well
[18:11] <greg-g> snap-l: scroll back http://paste.mitechie.com/show/540/
[18:12] <krondor> I'm expecting akamai to call me and ask for 1 million dollars lol.  Just means I continue down the self hosted route I was looking at.
[18:12] <snap-l> greg-g: Oh for fucks sake
[18:14] <snap-l> Also, I don't know why I report anything on launchpad
[18:14] <greg-g> :)
[18:15] <tjagoda> snap-l: Launchpad is SERIOUS BUSINESS
[18:15] <snap-l> Seriously, I have nothing to contribute because it's all a dupe
[18:16] <tjagoda> I am intimidated by the dudes who smite me for duplicates
[18:16] <tjagoda> How many hours have you spent committing bugs to memory to tell me what I am a duplicate of?
[18:16] <snap-l> Gah, and one of them is a dupe that I entered. :)
[18:16] <snap-l> FML
[18:17] <tjagoda> A bug so serious I feel compelled to report it 6 times
[18:17] <tjagoda> snap-l is launchpad senile.
[18:17] <tjagoda> He'd be an excellent user study
[18:17] <snap-l> Of course it's marked as "in progress" since last year
[18:18] <snap-l> I'm sure this is getting fixed REAL SOON NOW.
[18:18] <tjagoda> Find code, prune, commit?
[18:18] <snap-l> fuck it all, I'm going to start selling viagra
[18:19] <brousch> snap-l: then you'd better gird your loins next time i see you
[18:19] <snap-l> brousch: If I'm on viagra, you'll break your foot
[18:19] <tjagoda> oh my
[18:19] <tjagoda> I need to stop reading this channel at work, the random laughter is hard to conceal under pseudo coughs!
[18:21] <tjagoda> Maybe that should be this weekends project
[18:22] <brousch> snap-l: don't use your own product. isn't that one of the rules of thumb for drug dealers?
[18:22] <tjagoda> branch the loco portal and punch the microblog in the face
[18:31] <snap-l> Hmmm.... :)
[18:31] <snap-l> I guess the mantra of "patches welcome" would apply here.
[18:32]  * snap-l stops bitching
[18:32] <Wolfger> OK, I just found out P-con has a second confirmed GoH: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Gettys
[18:32] <snap-l> Yeah, that's pretty cool
[18:33] <tjagoda> I got that GoH confirmed in 2011.
[18:34] <tjagoda> I may or may not have failed to issue any sort of press release on it however.
[18:34] <tjagoda> <---- Penguicon PR not this guy's strong suit
[18:35] <Wolfger> tjagoda: A flier was released earlier today (well, re-released... it was released a while back) and it only had "John Scalzi and more!" on it
[18:35] <tjagoda> ffs
[18:35] <Wolfger> Yeah
[18:35] <Wolfger> "This one guy who shows up every year, and more!"
[18:35] <tjagoda> "And more" was my idea. =(
[18:36] <Wolfger> I was like, oh noes, tjagoda destroyed penguicon. :-D
[18:36] <tjagoda> The current ConChair looks like he has a good grip on things
[18:37] <tjagoda> Chuck is much better at stimulating a community than I am
[18:37] <tjagoda> In no small part due to the fact that I try to avoid stimulating communities which are not entirely composed of tech people =P
[18:43] <tjagoda> Wolfger: http://www.penguicon.org/CMS/?page_id=178
[18:43] <tjagoda> ...where was the announcement?
[18:44] <Wolfger> penguicon-general mailing list
[18:44] <tjagoda> Ahhh
[18:44] <tjagoda> I never read that
[18:45] <Wolfger> So who all is going to the P-con bring-a-friend party?
[18:45] <Wolfger> ...and bringing a friend?
[18:49] <brousch> what is 12.04 code name? poopin penguin?
[18:50] <Wolfger> brousch: Precise Pangolin
[18:51] <Wolfger> I'm looking forward to Quiet Quaalude. Oh, wait, Quaalude isn't an animal... ;-)
[18:52] <snap-l> Hasn't Q been announced yet?
[18:52] <rick_h> not yet, at least I don't recall seeing it
[18:53] <Wolfger> we'll know it within 76 days
[18:53] <brousch> the global release party event is not in the loco pages yet
[18:53] <snap-l> Ah, somehow I thought it had
[18:53] <snap-l> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ubuntu_releases#Future_releases
[18:54] <rick_h> grrr, this stuff just pisses me off https://github.com/blog/1036-about-this-week-s-availability
[18:54] <rick_h> froget about spending time making crap better, just waste time trying to fend off DDOS retards
[18:54] <snap-l> Yeah, it sucks
[18:54] <snap-l> ops is a thankless job
[18:55] <snap-l> which is why it tickles me when I hear things like "Dev Ops taking over for sysops"
[18:55] <rick_h> not so much that, but just wasting ops vs real advancement/work
[18:55] <snap-l> WEll, and especially somewhere like github
[18:55] <snap-l> why not put that energy to something useful
[18:56] <greg-g> wait, you think DDOS care about usefullness/productivity/the betterment of society?
[18:56] <greg-g> oh ye of too much faith in humanity
[18:56] <snap-l> greg-g: Yeah, I'm a hippie at heart.
[18:56] <brousch> usually there's some kind of motivation
[18:56] <rick_h> greg-g: no, I mean it prevents usefullness/productivity
[18:56] <greg-g> rick_h: yeah, it does, but the DDOSers don't care is my only point
[18:56] <snap-l> rick_h: I think he was directing that towards me
[18:57] <rick_h> I'm mean that the github folks, instead of doing useful crap, are spending time/$$ getting anti DDOS gear that serves no other useful purpose
[18:57] <brousch> it's probably those sourceforge guys
[18:57] <greg-g> brousch: lolz
[18:57] <rick_h> ah, sorry, half reading
[18:57] <greg-g> me too
[18:58] <brousch> jjesse: http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-michigan/1535/detail/
[18:59] <Wolfger> Launchpad DDOS'd GitHub?
[18:59] <snap-l> brousch: Would you relate that to the global event?
[18:59] <Wolfger> Or was it the Mercurial guys? ;-)
[18:59] <rick_h> yea, I'm here to rant so it throws off the scent Wolfger :)
[18:59] <brousch> i can't. it doesn't exist
[18:59] <greg-g> "Github and its fancy social features must die!"
[18:59] <snap-l> feh, there is no release party event.
[18:59] <snap-l> n/m
[18:59] <tjagoda> I just sent an email to penguicon-general clarifying who Jim Gettys is
[19:00] <brousch> just have to remember to do it when it gets added
[19:00] <tjagoda> I partly expect to be murdered by Matt Arnold in my sleep
[19:00] <Wolfger> Heh
[19:02] <tjagoda> His responses always read as very hostile to me
[19:02] <tjagoda> That could just be perception, however
[19:03] <Wolfger> Should I find the guy in charge of scheduling, and propose an outdoor "panel" named "Burning Trevor Jagoda in Effigy"?
[19:03] <Wolfger> then at least you know who to watch out for.
[19:04] <tjagoda> roast tjagoda
[19:04] <tjagoda> It is a very bitter meat
[19:04] <tjagoda> =P
[19:06]  * Wolfger isn't going to touch tjagoda's bitter meat
[19:06]  * tjagoda approves of this 
[19:08]  * brousch washes his mind's eye with bleach 
[19:08] <tjagoda> It occurs to me that I surfaced from the nether to post in a mailing list poop fight between Matt and Jer
[19:08] <tjagoda> In what universe was that a wise course of action?
[19:12] <snap-l> none
[19:12] <tjagoda> Is there any traffic in ubuntu-us-mi?
[19:12] <tjagoda> I never read that list anymore either
[19:13] <brousch> usually just around bug jams/release parties
[19:14] <tjagoda> I like to think that IRC is what I would experience if I were to climb inside the mailing list
[19:14] <tjagoda> and read everyone's witty ass remarks that they backspace from their mailing list responses
[19:18] <Wolfger> I'm supposed to backspace those?
[19:19] <Wolfger> actually, I do that more and more lately... I must be getting old
[19:21] <tjagoda> I think the socially acceptable term is "Wise"
[19:23] <Wolfger> Wise Old Wolfger....
[19:23] <Wolfger> s/Old/Ass?
[21:15] <brousch> ok vimmers, having some trouble with y and p
[21:15] <brousch> i say '21y' and i assume it going to copy 21 lines from my cursor down
[21:16] <brousch> where is it really starting the copy?
[21:16] <Blazeix> brousch: 21yy
[21:16] <brousch> Blazeix: you win a cookie!
[21:18] <Blazeix> http://vimdoc.sourceforge.net/htmldoc/change.html#Y
[21:37] <rick_h> brousch: I find it much easier to visually highlight what I want, then y
[21:40] <snap-l> Anyone available for some CSS template work for a Joomla site?
[21:42] <brousch> ok, opinions: http://office.vdiw.net:8000
[21:43] <brousch> i gave up on mobile first, so it works pretty well for >700px wide
[21:44] <snap-l> brousch: Seems to scale pretty well
[21:44] <brousch> it technically works on mobile, but it is messy
[21:44] <brousch> is it pleasing to the eye?
[21:45] <snap-l> Yeah, it looks nice.
[21:45] <brousch> About needs more content
[21:47] <Blazeix> i really like it. adding something like `.menu-item:hover {background-color: #579;}` would make it seem more interactive
[21:47] <brousch> good idea
[21:47] <Blazeix> just imho, of course
[21:47] <brousch> you're right. i usually do a hover on menu items
[21:48] <brousch> the new site basically has all of the functional pieces of the old site, so now i feel like it can rip out the old
[21:49] <brousch> then i can actually make improvements
[21:53] <brousch> holy Zeus' poopstained undies, it looks the same in IE9
[21:53] <snap-l> brousch: COngratulations. :)
[21:53] <brousch> i didn't do anything
[21:53] <brousch> not even sass
[21:57] <brousch> ah, IE8 is a mess
[21:57] <brousch> usable, but ugly
[22:00] <brousch> hm, how many of my users will be using winxp?
[22:00]  * brousch looks around the office
[22:00] <brousch> damnit
[22:01] <brousch> thanks guys. see ya later