popey"Develop Android Apps, Deploy on Meego, Tizen, WebOS, Ubuntu and More"00:00
AlanBellsomehow that doesn't look very appealing to me00:14
AlanBella proprietary layer of stuff that mostly behaves like android probably00:14
ali1234github is down :C00:17
ali1234come on github, you can do it00:17
AlanBellbut it has a nice error 500 page00:17
AlanBellright, I am off to bed, it has been a fascinating evening, in which I discovered I was slightly odder than I thought I was00:18
Azelphurderp, I left the door open on my bedroom00:20
Azelphur37C in here (My rooms next to the bitcoin room)00:20
hamitrondamn mna00:21
hamitron19 C in here00:21
hamitronwith my bitcoin rig00:21
hamitrongetting stuffy now00:21
ali123427 C with the window open00:23
hamitronyou guys still got the heating on or something?00:24
hamitronI suppose your comp uses about the same power as 2 of mine Azelphur00:26
hamitronnot including the 16 monitors00:26
hamitronI am actually starting to get frustrated with a single 17" LCD screen00:27
hamitron5:4 ratio is the only good thing about it00:27
n1md4_BigRedS: Are you about?00:32
directhe`yay, Double Fine Adventure will be getting a Linux port.00:44
directhe`i guess with $1.8m pledged so far, it'd be rude not to00:53
directhe`clearly the backing rate has slowed down a lot. i wonder if it'll hit $3m before funding ends00:54
directhe`"Pledge $15 or more00:55
directhe`28829 Backers00:55
directhe`The finished game in all of its awesome glory DRM free on PC, Mac, and Linux, or via Steam for PC and Mac, exclusive access to the Beta on Steam, access to the video series, and access the private discussion community."00:55
AzelphurI dunno why steam don't get on with Linux, they must be aware that they are loosing money, with all these bundles going on01:06
ali1234because steam is mostly old games that don't have linux ports?01:06
Azelphurthat didn't stop them from a mac port01:07
ubuntuuk-planet[Chris Oattes] Ambilight clone  Software - http://www.cjo20.net/blog/?p=7301:07
ubuntuuk-planet[Jono Bacon] Ubuntu Accomplishments Update - http://www.jonobacon.org/2012/02/16/ubuntu-accomplishments-update/06:07
AlanBellapt-get morning all07:49
christelmorning :)08:02
=== alan_g is now known as alan_g|afk
dwatkinsapt-get coffee08:37
daubersE: Could not open lock file /var/lib/dpkg/lock - open (13: Permission denied)08:40
* daubers reflashes a stupid thing to make it less stupid08:46
daubersalso o/ czajkowski08:46
daubersHow's the new job?08:46
czajkowskiit's good08:48
czajkowskiin wolverhampton  this week08:52
* bigcalm makes an entrance09:05
bigcalmI'd better make an exit as well otherwise I'll be stuck here all day09:06
* BigRedS groans09:15
bigcalmBigRedS: tummy ache?09:24
JamesTaitGood morning all!09:30
=== directhe` is now known as directhex
BigRedSbigcalm: coincidentally, slightly. But more your, uh, 'humour' :)09:36
DGJonesGrr, stupid router rebooting & giving out a new ip address to the server, can't connect to irssi09:38
oimonis archive.canonical.com incredibly slow for everyone? try to wget http://archive.canonical.com/pool/partner/a/adobe-flashplugin/adobe-flashplugin_11.1.102.62.orig.tar.gz09:39
BigRedSoimon: yeah, it's not moving for me09:41
oimonBigRedS: trying to do updates and it's killing me09:41
oimonspend 15 mins trying to download it09:41
AlanBellI am spending the day making an application I wrote some years ago worse09:54
BigRedSI love it when I get to do that09:55
AlanBellhad a meeting yesterday when they listed all the stuff that they wanted to rip out09:56
BigRedSOh, normally mine is very hurried feature-creep09:56
AlanBelland the percentage scale that they want to re-map so that it goes up to 125% because the numbers they were getting didn't look high enough09:57
AlanBellI feel like dilbert09:57
czajkowskiAlanBell: fun days!09:58
=== andyloughran is now known as status
=== status is now known as andyloughran
andyloughranthe connection here is terrible... spitfire internets10:00
andyloughrananyone got any recommendations for wireless internet (microwave/radio) in Fitzrovia?10:01
funkyHatDGJones: server without a static addess? :(10:02
DGJonesfunkyHat, Yeah, something I need to get sorted10:02
czajkowskiwent to go use skype10:03
czajkowskiand it was uninstalled10:03
czajkowskihate when that happens10:03
bigcalmSkype is packaged for 12.04 now then?10:04
czajkowskiwell it was there yesterday till my macgic upgrade which cuased some disaperances10:04
DGJonesfunkyHat, It runs a desktop because it sometimes gets used for a quick bit of web browsing & that won't set a fixed ip for some reason, I may change it & put a server install on with no gui, that'll be easier10:06
funkyHatDGJones: or see if your router allows you to define permanent leases?10:06
DGJonesfunkyHat, Never been able to get that to work10:07
popeyyou can do it in network manager10:07
popeyor edit /etc/network/interfaces10:07
andyloughranczajkowski: where you working at these days?10:13
czajkowskiandyloughran: Canonical :)10:13
andyloughranand how's the lovely Wolverhampton treating you?10:14
czajkowskiyeah not bad10:14
czajkowskiif I could understand the accents would be great :)10:14
* bigcalm chuckles10:16
bigcalmYour tweet this morning made me smile10:16
andyloughranI could do a decent attempt at translating10:18
andyloughranoright duk, ows yam doin10:18
andyloughranthat means, hello dear, how are you?10:18
DJones\o/ Sorted, was nothing to do with my server, *%$^*(()& dyndns dropping the forwarding10:27
DJonespopey: Who did you switch to when dyndns did that to you?10:28
* czajkowski hugs popey 10:28
popey(that was an answer for DJones btw)10:28
DJonesI guessed :)10:28
* Myrtti has found Settlers Online. Doom impending. Productivity plummeting to even lower10:29
AlanBellhow are the wolves people getting on with the czajkowski accent?10:29
czajkowskiAlanBell: not bad, ordered my food last night and went to sleep10:29
czajkowskiand got to and from places without getting too lost10:29
AlanBellperhaps they have been preparing for your arrival with this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bc0u7peZbIk10:34
AlanBellwe should do one of those for stuff Ubuntu people say10:34
czajkowskispring cleaning lp Q&A10:35
czajkowskifound another one for Ubuntu and not LP if folks want to help https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/18778510:35
brobostigongood morning everyone,10:37
* bigcalm steams up his glasses with a pot noodle10:37
bigcalmHi brobostigon10:38
brobostigonhi bigcalm10:38
* bigcalm glares at his windows server10:38
bigcalmIt's been 'applying updates' to office for some time now10:38
bigcalmSilly thing10:38
brobostigonrunning office on a server, why ?10:39
popeyarchive.canonical.com is having an issue bigcalm10:39
bigcalmpopey: ms office10:39
popeyoh ☺10:39
bigcalmI doubt that the two are linked ;)10:39
bigcalmIt's feature freeze today, yes?10:40
christeli dunno, i could see how it was having issues if you went and installed office on it10:40
popeyczajkowski: https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/187785 google for the laptop model, well known problem10:40
popeyi linked that question to a bug report10:40
czajkowskipopey: cheers10:41
* czajkowski tickles christel hows you darling 10:41
christelnot too bad!10:41
bigcalmHow's the table?10:41
christeli LOVE the table :D10:42
ikoniathe table loves you10:42
bigcalmI think it's a bit of a wooden relationship10:45
christeli don't think i've ever spent as much time stroking hard wood as i have since it arrived10:46
bigcalmOh my10:46
bigcalmMorning davmor210:48
davmor2morning all10:49
davmor2morning bigcalm10:49
davmor2mrevell, czajkowski: I should be on for tonight and coming to the hotel for a bit tomorrow fingers crossed got the bulk of the release done10:50
bigcalmdavmor2: case the joint for pens you can half-inch10:51
davmor2bigcalm: it might be worth thinking about for a co-working space if we can get the price right10:52
bigcalmdavmor2: that's what I was thinking. Price is everything though10:53
bigcalmIt'll be coming out of my own pocket, not work's10:53
davmor2czajkowski: you heading back to the hotel once you have knocked off tonight, if so I can probably give you a lift back10:53
czajkowskicool thanks10:54
christelbigcalm: are you buying a table?10:57
bigcalmchristel: no, we already have one10:58
christelaw what are you buying10:58
bigcalm<davmor2> bigcalm: it might be worth thinking about for a co-working space if we can get the price right10:58
czajkowskibigcalm: davmor2 this place is very nice10:58
czajkowskiand not cold10:58
christelooh the place10:59
christeli see10:59
bigcalmI am always trying to buy my soul back off of the devil10:59
bigcalmczajkowski: not cold is a goooooood thing10:59
bigcalmThough I think mrevell complained the most :P10:59
oimoncan anyone help with unity? a showstopper is the buttons appearing in top left hand corner when windows are maximised. can i move them to the application instead? (i have already moved global menu to the application, but can't move the buttons)11:03
AlanBellyou are not supposed to want to do that oimon11:03
AlanBellanyhow, that isn't a terrible place for them, at least they do follow the applications when not maximised11:04
oimonmy buttons are on the right, so it's kind of essential11:04
bigcalmStop doing what you want with your OS OS11:04
oimonif i can't do it, it's a deal breaker :(11:04
AlanBellwelcome to the phrase "broken by design"11:05
=== Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away
oimonthere must be an ugly fudge around it ?11:05
AlanBellalthough in this specific instance I don't quite see the problem11:06
AlanBellyou want them shifted right 48px so they line up with the application rather than the launcher?11:06
oimonAlanBell: i want them shifted onto the app window . my buttons are on the right11:06
oimonso it's about a 1900 pixel shift11:06
AlanBelloh, buttons on the right, I see11:07
AlanBellyou are not supposed to want to do that oimon11:07
davmor2bigcalm: well Matt is smaller so maybe he gets colder quicker :)11:07
* bigcalm rolls his eyes11:07
oimonbut there must be a hack or app to uninstall that would fix it?11:08
oimonmaybe gord knows11:08
gordno way that i know of11:09
* oimon cries11:09
AlanBelloimon: I think it is a "patches welcome" thing11:09
AlanBellwhich does actually mean that a patch would be welcome11:09
oimonmy current workaround is 10.0411:09
AlanBellbut I doubt anyone tasked with working on unity would do that patch because it isn't on john lea's magic design sheets11:10
AlanBellanyone seen onboard today?11:12
mrevellbigcalm, davmor2: I grew up in the north east. I can handle cold when doing north eastern things: going to night clubs in a t-shirt in December, drinking broon ale in a t-shirt in December, and other activities in a t-shirt in December. Sitting at a laptop, though, in a cold room doesn't work for me.11:17
AlanBelloimon: https://lists.launchpad.net/unity-design/msg07858.html not specifically about button positions, but an interesting read11:19
gordonjcpmrevell: that's because you're less physically active sitting at a laptop, and therefore not burning off energy which keeps you warm11:20
* bigcalm hugs mrevell 11:20
oimonAlanBell: thanks, i'll read it. this guy wants the same thing http://askubuntu.com/questions/94105/can-i-remove-the-buttons-min-max-close-from-the-unity-panel-and-put-them-bac11:20
AlanBellsit at a laptop drinking broon ale11:20
gordonjcpmrevell: if you were sitting at a laptop in a cold room drinking newkie broon and dancing it would be a different story11:20
* gordonjcp is currently sitting in a fairly cold loading bay, taking a break from working in a ridiculously overheated workshop11:23
gordonjcpI'm also calibrating stuff that's going to live in an unheated high site so there's no point checking it at 25C when it's going to be sitting at 5C most of the time11:24
bigcalmAnother web dev company has the same phone number as us except for the last digit. This is confusing for people who dial the wrong number11:26
bigcalmI wonder if we've lost any business to the other company11:26
gordonjcpbigcalm: heh11:30
gordonjcpbigcalm: my sister used to have a telephone number one digit different from a local cinema11:30
gordonjcpquite often getting folk phoning up, "Oh hi, what have you got on tonight?"11:30
gordonjcp"Well my brother's just come round so we're going off to the pub for a couple of pints, then we're going to get a curry, then head home and watch the West Wing and play on the playstation.  How about you?"11:31
andyloughranI'm loving 'management'11:53
bigcalmIs that where everybody else works so you don't have to?12:06
daubersbigcalm: thats "deligation"12:12
gordi see managers as the people who sit in meetings so i can actually get some coding done12:15
* popey chuckles at "deal breaker" and "showstopper"12:16
daubersgord: That's what I see as my job these days :(12:17
bigcalmPermission Denied12:18
BigRedSsudo ls12:18
bigcalmMy goodness I'm tired12:19
bigcalmmrevell: davmor2: czajkowski: is tonight a bring your own booze place and does anybody intend to have a drink anyway?12:20
davmor2bigcalm: I don't know and don't drink so I won't12:20
czajkowskibigcalm: no idea12:21
bigcalmczajkowski: would you like some cider?12:22
bigcalmI'm about to go to Waitrose for a birthday card12:22
popeyget him with his expensive taste in birthday cards12:23
davmor2bigcalm: look on the website to see if they are licensed12:23
czajkowskibigcalm: I'm prolly ok tb12:23
bigcalmczajkowski: fair do12:23
bigcalmdavmor2: looking at it now12:24
bigcalmpopey: local town has a Waitrose and a Co-op... Not a lot of choice there12:24
popeyco-op ftw12:24
popeyyou in wolves?12:24
bigcalmThey are licenced12:25
davmor2popey: no he is out in the sticks of telford but not too far away12:25
bigcalmpopey: I'm near Newport, Shropshire12:25
bigcalmFrom their wine list: Dom Perignon Brut, 199812:26
bigcalm 12:26
bigcalm 12:26
bigcalm 12:26
bigcalm            Bottle £139.9512:26
davmor2bigcalm: at that price you'll be ordering a couple of bottles then right?12:28
bigcalmAt least!12:28
* bigcalm waddles off for lunch12:28
=== Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte
diploAny of you guys use Nagios ?13:09
diplouse check_by_ssh at all ?13:09
BigRedSnot knowingly, does that ssh in and ask questions?13:10
diplossh in and run commands13:10
diploso check_by_ssh -H IP -p port -C uptime13:10
BigRedSah yeah, no13:10
BigRedSwe use mon for that sort of thing13:10
diplo 12:43:07 up 91 days,  5:14,  2 users,  load average: 1.44, 1.13, 1.0413:10
diploWorks from my home box13:10
diploRemote command execution failed: reverse mapping checking getaddrinfo for 78-33-75-73.static.enta.net failed - POSSIBLE BREAK-IN ATTEMPT!13:11
diploFrom my work box13:11
BigRedSwhere are you going to?13:11
diploRunning same v of check_by_ssh13:11
diploA customer site running centos13:11
BigRedSthat looks like you're behund nat and trying to ssh to what is your public, natted, ip address13:11
diploSo i think it's  a ssh related config issue on my work box13:11
BigRedSI think you can turn that off in ssh13:11
diployeah, been trying stuff and failing13:12
diploHopeing someone else has seen it and goes 'Oh yeah' :)13:12
BigRedSI presume you can't just ssh in either?13:12
diploI can just ssh13:13
diploStill get that alert up though13:13
diploSo key pairs set up13:13
diploI'm thinking it's the warning that's causing me the issues13:13
diplo( I hope it is )13:13
BigRedShm, odd. Ah, so when you ssh you still get the warning13:13
BigRedSyeah, that would because it'd break key auth13:13
daubersAlanBell: I found out an accessibility thing I didn't know about the other day13:14
daubersdidn't realise some people reverse the mouse buttons for RSI reasons13:14
diplodaubers, we had to do that for left handers as well13:15
diploWas a horrible work around in terminal services :)13:15
daubersI knew about left handers, just didn't realise there was other reasons for it :)13:15
diplolol fixed it BigRedS13:18
diplo-q = Quiet, suppresses errors :(13:19
diploWhy didn't i try that an hour ago!13:19
AlanBelldaubers: you can use a mouse without clicking at all13:19
BigRedSdiplo: aha!13:19
daubersAlanBell: By shouting at it?13:20
* daubers has images of an office full of people shouting "MIDDLE CLICK" "SCROLL" "LEFT CLICK"13:23
popeybah, german13:26
daubers\o/ Scotty13:30
AlanBelldaubers: dwell click13:33
AlanBellonboard kind of includes it, might do a screencast of the new onboard at some point soon13:34
AlanBellonboard in the host lets me type  into a virtualbox guest which is nice13:41
=== Lcawte is now known as Lcawte|Away
=== schwuk_ is now known as schwuk
=== Lcawte|Away is now known as Lcawte
dogmatic69how can i delete files in a dir with thousands of files? rm ./* says list to long15:13
popeydelete the directory instead?15:14
dogmatic69ah, obviously15:14
diploOr a perl script15:14
diploI had to do that for a CCTV server which had thousands of images a day15:15
diplorm/ls etc couldn't handle it15:15
dogmatic69ls was working, rm not15:16
BigRedSdogmatic69: find /dir -exec rm {} \;15:16
davmor2popey: I think you'll find that is spelt "Compuuutar!"15:16
BigRedSactually, I think find as a -delete15:16
diploIt does, but i used to have issues with find as well with that many files15:17
BigRedSwell, it runs away with all your I/O and sits there chewing it, but it gets there in the end15:18
BigRedSI regularly do that to stupid web developers who put session files in wrong places15:18
diployeah, wasn't great for me.. think find took minutes and perl was in seconds15:18
BigRedSAh, I'd not even considered writing anything else15:18
BigRedSjust an unlink in a readdir loop?15:19
BigRedSHm. If I'm feeling particularly nice i'll do that next time15:19
BigRedSelse they can bloody well lose all I/O for half an hour as punishment :)15:20
diploI must chuck all these scripts into my github or something15:20
BigRedSI keep meaning to do that15:20
BigRedSand then I tidy them up15:20
BigRedSand then they stop working15:20
diploMay be useful to someone at some point.. probably not great scripts but they work for me15:20
BigRedSand so I give up for a bit15:20
BigRedSyeah, last commit was 7 months ago15:21
diploProbably when i set mine up, never commited to it yet15:21
BigRedSAnyone got a handy grub1 to grub2 dictionary?16:03
bigcalmdavmor2: Chinese!16:19
davmor2bigcalm: What?16:21
* bigcalm taps his nose16:21
davmor2bigcalm: Your nose is Chinese......are you taking your tablet's?16:23
shaunough.  don't get me started on grub216:23
AlanBellanyone know how to generate a signed PDF file from libreoffice or something?16:25
gorddavmor2, whats that funkyness to get oneiric paid apps in the precice software centre?16:26
gorddavmor2, also hello ;)16:27
davmor2gord: don't do it payments is broken in USC on precise currently should be fixed by the end of the day-ish-maybe-if-we-are-lucky16:29
gorddavmor2, right, not for buying stuff, dev stuff16:29
davmor2gord: export SOFTWARE_CENTER_DISTRO_CODENAME='oneiric'16:30
gorddavmor2, ta very much :)16:30
davmor2gord: no worries and hello16:33
bigcalmBit warm in here16:36
bigcalmAnd the heating isn't on16:36
bigcalmIs Spring approaching us?16:37
* popey wonders if AlanBell will set this up in his garden.. http://www.wired.com/underwire/2012/02/headless-chicken-solution/16:38
bigcalmMore ethical than battery hens16:40
shauno"the removal of suffering" is an interesting line.  buddhist chickens?16:42
* bigcalm wonders if he'll have chicken tonight or not16:43
bigcalmIs it worth making my Xoom think it's running the US image so that it'll update to ICS16:46
bigcalmWhat will I lose from the UK version?16:47
simondbullthat article has scared me enough to put me off going to KFC tonight.....16:47
diplobigcalm, not just custom mod it ?16:47
bigcalmdiplo: I'm trying to be good with this device16:48
bigcalmdiplo: it actually works ok for me so far. But I do want ICS16:48
bigcalmIs ICS out for the SGS2 as an OTA update yet?16:49
diploNot afaik16:50
popeypre-orders for kde spark thing16:51
diploheh, just saw that myself16:51
diploFollow Bryan as well ?16:51
bigcalmpopey: that looks nice16:52
bigcalmmrevell: did you manage to put CM on your phone?16:52
mrevellbigcalm, erm16:52
mrevellDidn't get a sufficiently round tuit.16:53
bigcalmAll tablets appear to have HDMI outputs. Anybody here hook their tablet up to a monitor or TV?16:53
bigcalmFair enough :)16:53
popeybigcalm: i have16:55
popeytransformer can run an external screen at 1080p16:55
bigcalmI should run out and get a small hdmi connector cable to play with16:56
bigcalmNot sure when I would ever use it though16:57
bigcalmMaybe if I were presenting16:57
directhexi have a mini hdmi cable. for hooking my camera up to the tv!16:58
MartijnVdSdirecthex: now you can watch your home-made uhm.. "nature documentaries" on a big screen!17:03
directhexMartijnVdS, in 3d!17:04
popeybigcalm: i bought a couple of hdmi cables and the converters for cheap from amazon17:05
bigcalmI like my HDMI to DVI cables17:06
gordamazon basic do some nice hdmi cables17:06
* bigcalm hungry17:07
bigcalmCan I hold out for another 3 hours?17:07
czajkowskiand home18:33
bigcalmczajkowski: hope you're hungry :)18:39
bigcalmI've just cooked tea for Hayley18:39
* bigcalm can smell it and it's making my tummy grumble18:40
bigcalmWill be setting off in 25 mins to find me a Mr Revell18:40
czajkowskionly in the door myself about 10 mins18:43
CTtechguy ...18:57
=== agk0 is now known as GnomeVersionOfXc
* GnomeVersionOfXc hatNoUseNickSettings18:58
daftykinsSir Patrick Moore O_.19:39
AzelphurI'm so mad right now I could flip a table, (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻) 19:44
MartijnVdS(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻19:44
* MartijnVdS has aliases for both19:44
MartijnVdSalso, coloured version of19:44
MartijnVdS*\o/* *\o/* *\o/* *\o/*19:44
MartijnVdSbut that doesn't work in this channel19:44
jacobwAzelphur: tables are people too, don't flip them :(19:51
AzelphurOh god, I had no idea tables where sentient beings, I've been so mean :(19:51
MartijnVdSAzelphur: they only hunt at night19:54
dwatkinsIt's times like this that I wish I had xchat...20:01
CTtechguydwatkins: what do you use for a chat client?20:02
AzelphurIRC I'm doing it right? :D20:09
dwatkinsCTtechguy: irssi20:10
AlanBellall about the Unity design process http://design.canonical.com/2012/02/the-unity-design-process-and-how-you-can-play-a-part-in-it/20:11
ubuntubhoyit has 'design' ??20:12
AlanBellcuriously substance abuse does not appear to be a major part of it20:12
AlanBellubuntubhoy: it has lots of design20:12
MartijnVdSAlanBell: employment by Canonical?20:12
MartijnVdSAlanBell: does it require that?20:12
AlanBellubuntubhoy: like we have lots of weather20:12
jacobwThe third sentence should be in bold20:12
ubuntubhoyAlanBell, more accident than design I think20:12
AlanBellnope, it is all carefully designed20:13
ubuntubhoyeven bad design would not come up with some of it20:13
jacobw'design' is a magic word20:13
CTtechguydwatkins: I tried that and weechatt for abit but went back to xchat20:13
ali1234the main problem with unity design as i see it is that lots of small parts are being designed with no consideration for how they interact with each other20:14
AlanBellyeah, there is this "every pixel matters" thing20:15
ali1234so you've got lots of small things that are individually defensible for the people who designed them20:15
AlanBelland sometimes the problems are bigger than pixels20:15
MartijnVdS♫ Every pixel's sacred20:15
ali1234but when you try to use them all together they just make no sense20:15
AlanBellif a pixel is wasted, sabdfl gets most irate20:15
AlanBellhttp://people.canonical.com/~platform/design/ is interesting20:16
ali1234it doesn't help that any time someone makes an argument for why something is bad they get inundated with "you hate change", "you are not a normal user" and "use something else if you don't like it"20:17
ali1234you basically have to be extremely stubborn to take any part in such discussions20:18
AlanBellthere are some wacky priorities on things20:21
ali1234man, priorities20:21
AlanBellthere are bugs like this https://bugs.launchpad.net/ayatana-design/+bug/863240 where a font is the wrong weight, but it is no issue that font resizing just plain doesn't work20:21
lubotu3Launchpad bug 863240 in Ayatana Design "Dash - the "Filter results" text is the wrong size, wrong font weight, and aligned incorrectly in both the vertical and horizontal axis" [Critical,Fix committed]20:21
ali1234what do you mean by "font resizing doesn't work"?20:24
ali1234it seems to work for me, as long as i'm not using xfce or kde20:24
AlanBellooh, it has started to work a bit20:26
MartijnVdSAlanBell: font size is in Ångstrom :p20:26
ali1234a much better example of priorities is that the sound control applet has been totally redesigned four times since the introduction of pulse audio, but pulse audio itself still doesn't work properly20:27
MartijnVdSali1234: PA works fine20:27
popeydoes it work properly in other distros?20:27
ali1234does that make it ok?20:27
popeythere's lots broken in the linux desktop, pa is just one bit20:28
ali1234there sure is20:28
=== Guest22071 is now known as gord
ali1234that is just one example20:29
popeyIt's not our remit to fix every upstream package. Never has been.20:30
AlanBellwell thats cool, only a bit of oddness remains with the font resizing20:30
gordthere should be a kickstarter type thing, but for fixing bugs20:33
MartijnVdSgord: they tried bug bounties, didn't help20:33
hcfdHey guys, I want to move my current Ubuntu installation to a new drive and boot from it instead. Currently on mdadm software RAID1 and moving to a single SSD - both filesystems ext4. If I mount the new partition, can I just use cp -R -p /* to move things over, do the fstab and GRUB thing and then I'm good? Or.. do I need to boot a liveCD so that / is unmounted first?20:33
daftykinswhy exactly does ubuntu hold onto pulse audio? i only ever hear it in conversations where it's causing trouble20:33
gordMartijnVdS, one failed attempt != flawed premise20:33
MartijnVdSdaftykins: because it works for most people20:33
daftykinsmmm true20:33
popeyit generally works20:33
gordalsa isn't that great, its missing a bunch of features of pusle that i would very much miss20:34
daftykinshcfd: it would probably be quicker from an outside environment20:34
ali1234the stated reason for using pulseaudio is that it is the only system that supports bluetooth/usb headsets20:34
ali1234but this is also the area that has the most problems20:34
MartijnVdSali1234: so fix the bugs or write a better system20:35
MartijnVdSAlso, pulse can mix my audio streams and give my per-stream volume control20:35
MartijnVdSwhich WORKS20:35
hcfddaftykins, true, but will this work? I mean if I boot a CD I'm not certain that my RAID array for / will come up properly (though likely it will)20:35
ali1234MartijnVdS: you've just committed the logical fallacy i was talking about before20:36
MartijnVdSali1234: being?20:36
ali1234that i should "fix it myself"20:36
hcfddaftykins, I'd rather avoid the downtime, even if this method I'm using takes longer.20:36
daftykinshcfd: fair point, well give it a go? all you'll lose is time :)20:36
MartijnVdSali1234: Anything more constructive than whining would do really20:36
hcfddaftykins, well, CPU and I/O time.. not *my* time -- which is what I'm trying to save ;)20:37
ali1234MartijnVdS: whining is exactly what you are doing20:37
MartijnVdS"It's bad", sure. But what part is bad? How could it be fixed?20:37
ali1234MartijnVdS: go search launchpad for pulse audio bugs, there are plenty20:37
MartijnVdSali1234: so are X bugs and Firefox bugs20:37
MartijnVdSali1234: do you propose to drop those?20:38
hcfddaftykins, sure I'll do it and find out. If it flops, I can use the LiveCD method instead :)20:38
ali1234MartijnVdS: i don't propose dropping pulse audio20:38
daftykinshcfd: sounds good :) let me know how you get on20:38
hcfddaftykins, will do. :)20:38
ali1234MartijnVdS: i propose fixing the base system before rewriting the control panel applet for the fourth time20:38
ali1234it's never going to work properly no matter how much you redisng the applet, because the core is broken20:38
hcfdLots of permissions are failing re: preserving them, but I don't think that's a big deal.. mostly stuff in /dev so far20:38
MartijnVdSali1234: I don't experience brokenness at all. Maybe it's a subset of people experiencing with exotic hard/software that has problems?20:39
ali1234MartijnVdS: is a usb microphone exotic hardware? it can't be all that exotic if the existence of such devices was a major factor in choosing pulse audio in the first place20:41
popeymy usb mic works20:41
MartijnVdSso does mine20:41
ali1234mine works20:41
daubersas does mine...20:41
ali1234until i reboot20:41
popeyall 3 in fact20:41
ali1234then it stops working20:41
MartijnVdShardware problem20:41
ali1234it isnt a hardware problem, it is a design flaw in pulse audio20:42
ali1234it cannot remember devices20:42
popeypulse audio is upstream20:42
popeytell lennart20:42
jacobwlennart /o\20:43
ali1234the best part is even if you disable all sound devices it still won't automatically select the microphone when you plug it in20:43
ali1234you just get nothing20:43
hcfdI have issues with Ubuntu 10.04LTS and Pulse... it doesn't detect the correct channels for my Envy24 / ICE1712 chip, but there's a manual fix. A pain in the ass, but, well, it works.20:43
ali1234this isn't even a bug, it is a design flaw20:43
ali1234all the bugs in pa have been fixed by now20:43
hcfdAll the bugs, or just the reported ones?20:44
ali1234well there is always new hardware coming out20:44
ali123410.04 is really old, back then PA was buggy as hell20:45
ali1234LTS doesn't get fixes except for security bugs and serious crashes20:45
ali1234i don't have a problem with that20:45
hcfdI'll probably move to 12.04LTS at the right time20:45
hcfdThing is, *my* hardware is old, and extremely common and popular amongst audiophiles.20:45
daftykinsthat'll be why i have so much trouble with PA on my HTPC then :D20:45
ali1234most of these problems are actually problems in the ALSA drivers and not PA itself20:46
daftykinslike, an unclean shutdown caused it to stop stereo analog audio working in XBMC until i fiddled with it20:46
hcfdBasically, the digital audio works perfectly on it, out of the box, but the analogue audio is totally broken until one manually fixes it20:46
MartijnVdShcfd: audiophiles? you mean those people who buy golden cables on special risers, at £100/meter, for the "better acoustic quality"?20:46
hcfdMartijnVdS, no, not those muppets.20:46
daftykinsjust those that care about quality :)20:47
* daftykins rubs FLAC20:47
hcfdSnakeoil consumers aplenty, that's for sure!20:47
=== chrisccoulson_ is now known as chrisccoulson
popeydenonlink ☺20:48
ali1234it's no coincidence that network manager suffers from similar design flaws with plaggable hardware20:48
ali1234and btw, the reason i single out ubuntu for this criticism is because ubuntu developers constantly criticise upstream projects for telling users to "fix it themselves" citing the "ubuntu is for everyone" ideal20:49
ali1234but then they use the same excuses20:49
ali1234i find this to be extremely hypocritical20:49
hcfdSuperuser cannot access ~/.gvfs folder when mounted ... damnit! daftykins, looks like I need to do this via LiveCD!20:52
hcfdBad bad bad .gvfs not conforming to spec! Root should be able to stat every inode ffs20:53
ali1234.gvfs is a different filesystem20:53
ali1234oh yeah, root can't look in to user's gvfs at all20:54
daftykinshcfd: doh!20:54
daftykinssilly thing20:54
hcfdali1234, oh okay, that explains. I see many people are having trouble doing backups and the like because of this20:55
hcfdIt is down as a bug though20:55
ali1234what are you trying to do anyway?20:55
popeyYou want to copy from one disk to another?20:55
popeyI'd use a live usb...20:55
popeywell, I did this week20:55
hcfdMove my installation on / to another disk (new SSD - OCZ Agility 3.. wooo!)20:55
popeygparted, copy/paste20:55
ali1234just reinstall20:55
hcfdCan't reinstall... / contains my /home and everything else20:56
hcfdLots of system settings customised, etc20:56
ali1234of course you can20:56
hcfds/can't/can... but don't want to :D20:56
hcfdI've patched my kernel and a bunch of crap I've forgotten how to do20:56
daftykinsi suppose you could clean install on the SSD, fully update, then move the files across in the same way20:56
ali1234that's what i do every 6 months20:57
ali1234stops my home directory getting filled with rubbish20:57
hcfdYeah.. tis Ubuntu 10.04LTS with tweaks and patches for bits of hardware that took a while to get working20:57
ali1234old home directory goes to long term storage/backup20:57
ali1234then i cherry pick stuff when i need it20:57
* hcfd nods20:58
ali1234which is usually never20:58
jacobwthe ubuntu installer won't touch /home anyway20:58
popey_if_ you choose manual install jacobw20:58
hcfdI need my current patched kernel.. I'll try the gparted way20:58
ali1234my "upgrade" procedure goes like this:20:58
jacobwok, that makes sense.20:58
hcfdCan gparted copy MBR?20:58
hcfdDo this before I reboot into gparted live then?20:59
ali1234boot install CD, move /home/al /etc /opt to backup drive, format disk, reinstall20:59
jacobwwhy would you want to copy the mbr?20:59
popeythats not a problem you can chroot to the new disk and grub-install20:59
jacobwjust grub-install /dev/?20:59
popeyjacobw: you wont have grub20:59
popeyyou need to chroot to the install to do that properly20:59
hcfdjacobw, popey, yeah fair point. Just trying to make less work for myself! hah20:59
popeyi did this on tuesday when my ssd arrived21:00
hcfdgparted and chroot it is then21:00
popeymoved from 320GB spinning rust to 240GB SSD21:00
daftykinsi do wub SSDs21:00
hcfdNice one popey21:00
daftykinspopey: which did you get? :)21:00
jacobwssds are a little bit too expensive :(21:00
daftykinsi've a 256GB crucial m4 in this asus laptop \o/21:00
popey^ that one21:01
hcfdI'm moving from 2x80GB mdadm RAID1... so crap.. to 120GB SSD. Moving to 2.5X the read speed, even with the RAID1. Pity I don't have native SATAIII else I'd have 5X speed21:01
dwatkinsI just bought a hybrid disk for my laptop, seems to work very well.21:01
hcfdpopey, I got a wee OCZ Agility 3.. 120GB, £110. Bargain.21:01
daftykinsi almost wish i had 10Gig ethernet at home to see what my SSDs could push to and from my hefty RAID array21:02
daftykinsseagate momentus XT?21:02
daubersdaftykins: Array size?21:02
daftykinsi've seen one of the first gen in use21:02
daubersdaftykins: 24 SSDs across 3 raid cards will do 6GB/s+21:03
daftykinsdaubers: still my old 6 x 1TB RAID 5, so not so much potential to test the above :D only ~600GB free on that one now :O21:03
daftykinsnice :D21:03
daubersdaftykins: Ick, that'll be slowing down nicely now :)21:03
hcfdPity I've got a bunch of slow Seagate crap RAID1... 3TB worth. Still, that stuff reads at 125MB/sec which isn't too shoddy.21:03
hcfdAnyway, I'd better power down and do this thing.  Looking forward to insane VM boot times amongst other benefits :D21:04
hcfdThanks for all your assistance guys.21:04
daftykinsah when i moved my desktop to an SSD i had my VMs on a 300GB WD velociraptor21:05
daftykinsguest OSs are like bare metal installs for boot speed etc21:05
KrimZonis it possible to customize the ubuntu main menu thing?21:09
KrimZonthe only thing I ever need to click on there is "More Apps"21:09
dogmatic69could anyone help me with renaming files and folders? what is an easy way to do this in batch?21:11
daftykinsdogmatic69: what are you working on?21:13
dogmatic69daftykins: I use CakePHP and the new version changed from floders_like_this/and_files.php to FoldersLikeThis/AndFiles.php21:14
dogmatic69want to do that, but have thousands of files21:14
daftykinsso you probably need someone that knows regular expressions to sort out a renaming plan that removes underscores21:15
dogmatic69I can prob just write a little php shell script21:15
dogmatic69the Cake framework has a underscore_text -> UnderscoreText method, Ill just read the paths, loop through and use `mv $old $new`21:16
jacobwmatch ?_? and toupper ?&?21:30
jacobwhmm, not quite21:31
jacobwhi hamitron21:31
Memranhello uk ubuntu-ers :)22:08
popeyoh look, i have hud now22:08
popeyhello Memran22:08
zleaphello Memran, popey22:09
popeymy firefox keeps locking up22:09
* popey reboots22:10
Memranhm just over 1 year left of LTS on my 10.0422:12
jacobw'bones' is so implausible22:13
jacobw10.04 is old now :)22:13
MemranI think I need to plan my upgrade]22:13
MemranI only updated to 10.04 yesterday because my 9.10 repos were all 404-ing22:15
KrimZonI'm on 10.04 here22:15
daftykinsyeah i run my HTPCs on LTS22:15
daftykinsshall have to move up from Lucid22:15
daftykinsif XBMC loves another version long time, that is22:16
jacobwi'm watching 'bones'22:16
Memranthis is my proxy server and ssh tunnel for bypassing the corporate proxy at work ;)22:16
jacobwits so implausible :@22:16
Memranbut now I want to host some webapps22:17
popeyhmm, thunderbird and firefox both locking up22:17
Memranand my app server of of choice is tomcat7, but there's no package in the 10.04 repos22:18
* Memran sighs22:18
jacobwpopey: versions?22:18
popeyon 12.0422:18
jacobwMemran: what exactly do you want to host?22:19
MemranMy web app portfolio for work references etc22:20
MemranBasically a bunch of demo sites I've made22:20
MemranIts just that I use tomcat7 on my development machine, and would prefer my server to be the same22:22
Memranit doesn't have to be, but its just that little bit more config, that I don't want to have to do :)22:22
MemranI think my upgrade from karmic to lucid was not 100% clean :|22:29
Memranthe more i investigate, the more issues i find22:29
jacobwwhat issues are you finding?22:30
jacobwyou should be able to replicate your tomcat environment22:30
Memraneg: "java -version" causing the jvm to fall over22:30
jacobwwhich jvm are you using?22:31
Memranwell i just tried to install openjdk-622:31
Memranbut synaptic spewed out lots of errors22:31
Memranso i don't think any jvm is correctly installed right now22:32
jacobwhow did you upgrade? using do-release-upgrade?22:33
Memransynaptic did it via the gui22:33
Memrani'm not particularly linux-savvy :(22:34
jacobw`cat /etc/issue`22:34
MemranUbuntu 10.04.4 LTS \n \l22:35
jacobwok, what does `apt-get -f install` say?22:36
jacobwthere's a useful tool called pastebinit, `apt-get install pastebinit` and then you can pipe any command to pastebinit and get back a pastebin url22:36
Memrank i'll get that22:37
Memranapt is spewing out *lots* of errors22:37
Memraninstalling pastebinit now :)22:38
Memranor possibly not, since apt is going nuts again22:39
AlanBellwhat is the screencast thing that is is the new hotness?22:39
jacobwok, if it can't install pastebinit just copy its output from the terminal and pastebin manually22:40
Memrani think pastebinit installed22:41
MemranI am re-running what you said before22:41
popeyI'd ran "sudo apt-get update" first tbh22:41
Memranit appears to be compaining about repo site certicicates22:42
popeyMemran: sudo apt-get update22:44
popeyand please pastebin the result22:44
AlanBellno, they are not repo certs22:44
AlanBellthey are root certs22:44
popeysudo apt-get install --reinstall ca-certificates-java22:45
Memransame errors as first pastebin22:48
Memrani can re pastebinit if you need?22:48
popeyhow much ram does your pc have Memran ?22:49
Memran265M iirc22:50
popeythat may be why22:50
Memranlet apt finish and I'll check :)22:50
popeybug 55604422:50
lubotu3Launchpad bug 556044 in ca-certificates-java (Debian) "package ca-certificates-java 20091021 failed to install/upgrade: Unterprozess installiertes post-installation-Skript gab den Fehlerwert 1 zurück" [Unknown,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/55604422:50
popeysee comment 1122:50
Memranapparently i have 512m22:54
Memranif i am reading that correctly "free -m"22:54
popeywonder if java has a small heap or something22:54
AlanBell10.04.4 just got released22:55
TheOpenSourcererI've been seeing /etc/issue updates since last night ;-)22:56
dogmatic69Memran: thats loads, Mem:          8000       7900        100 <- 100MB22:56
Memraner you lost me, sorry22:58
AlanBelllost me too22:58
AlanBellanyhow, yes you have 512MB22:58
dogmatic69Memran: free -m22:59
AlanBelldogmatic69: that was the previous pastebin22:59
Memranthats what I did, here: http://pastebin.com/9JSsTUGT22:59
AlanBelldo you need ca-certificates-java?23:02
Memrani don't know whether i need it or not23:02
AlanBellis there something you are trying to install that depends on it?23:02
AlanBellwhat they are is the public keys of a heap of companies like verisign etc, certificate authorities23:03
Memrani guess openjdk623:03
AlanBellthey are there for creating certificate signing requests and for serving up as part of a chain of certificates for SSL23:03
Memrani dont need to use it in my apps23:04
AlanBellif you are not doing SSL and you don't need your server to connect to ssl resources then you might not need that package at all23:04
Memranok, so i'll try to remove it23:05
Memranoh, it will remove all of openjdk too23:08
AlanBellok, well that won't work then :(23:09
Memrani guess i'll install sun's jdk instead23:09
Memranapt failed me!23:09
AlanBellI wouldn't install the sun thing23:09
AlanBellmaybe the new upstream oracle jdk23:10
AlanBellwhich is openjdk7 anyway really23:10
jacobwremember the java update of last month23:10
Memranwell with openjdk6 removed, apt-get update looks clean23:15
jacobwupdate should give you any problems23:16
jacobwupgrade will try to configure the package and trigger the postinst scripts that causes those errors23:16
Memrandoing that now23:17
Memrani guess it will take a while23:17
popeyI'd remove all of java and reinstall23:18
Memranits removed :)23:19
* CTtechguy is away: 23:19
* bigcalm flops23:23
* popey flips23:25
bigcalmI used to make flip flops with capacitors and leds for fun23:27
bigcalmA good night was had by all23:29
bigcalmAnd now, time for snoozy land23:29
bigcalmToodle pip23:29
hcfd_Hey, so I've got my SSD booting now23:29
hcfd_But.. when I try to login to Ubuntu 'Unable to cd to '/home/$user'23:30
hcfd_Any ideas?23:30
hcfd_'/home' isn't in fstab, and never has been23:30
hcfd_Is this just a permissions issue? I would fix it if I could but ofc I use sudo or sudo su *after* logging in23:32
hcfd_ie: I can't login as root on Ubuntu 10.04.4LTS23:32
popeydid you copy your /home directory over o the new ssd?23:32
popeyyou can login as root ☺  boot to single user mode23:33
hcfd_I did copy it over.. I think perhaps there is a permissions issue23:33
hcfd_I have not set a password for root23:34
popeyyou dont nede to23:34
popeyhold shift at boot to get boot menu and choose recovery mode23:34
hcfd_Remind me how to boot to single user mode? It usually boots to CLI asking for login.23:34
popeyor edit the kernel boot line and make it have 'single' in it23:34
hcfd_Ah recovery mode, sure23:34
hcfd_argh,corrupt graphics23:37
hcfd_okay, login prompt23:37
hcfd_Looks like it's not in single user mode?23:38
hcfd_Ahh, okay, got a root shell but the graphics are a tad messed up.. unreadable actually.23:41
hcfd_Root login now enabled..this will work, hopefully :)23:44
Memranso... there's no 11.xx LTS?23:48
hcfd_10.04 and 12.04 -- even numbers Memran23:48
hcfd_popey, so I'm in as root, permissions look fine.. no idea why I can't login as $user23:49
Memranok, i'll investigate that upgrade path :)23:49
Memranhmm is there a 12.04 availble? lol23:50
Memrani see 10.04 lts (my current) and 11.1023:52
hcfd_12.04 is out soon23:52
hcfd_April in fact (hence the 04)23:52
Memranits a date!23:53
Memranlol i never realised :)23:53
hamitronjust make sure you bring cake ;)23:53
Memranhehe :)23:53

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