=== egon_ is now known as egon
=== lifeless_ is now known as lifeless
=== smb` is now known as smb
* apw yawns08:08
smbapw, morning08:13
apwsmb, moin08:13
* smb checks his clock08:13
smbapw, btw changing the workplace switch keys to super+ctrl work much better for my mind. Now maybe I should file a bug that the shortcut help screen still displays the old binding... >:-)08:16
lifelessdefinitely should do that08:17
apwsmb, heh, you should tell didrocks cirtainly, that you had to change it to stop your fingers falling off08:19
smbmeh, I probably will just get told that help screens are supposed to show the divine supposed to be configuration... Also I had the feeling that the key bindings (default) may change again after many users expressing their joy with super-shift08:19
apwyou should file a bug that you changed them an its not right, that seems sensible08:20
smbActually it was not so much the fingers, but imagination or not, it felt like that typers thing (aching things in lower arm)08:21
smbOK, maybe I really should really file it...08:22
smb...yet another one08:22
apwsmb carple tunnel, and yep a simple binding can easily cause that08:29
bullgard4Red Red offers a "Netdump" crash dump facility.  What is the nearest Ubuntu program to it?09:00
apwbullgard4 what does it do09:02
apwtake crash dumps and shove them over the network somewhere ?09:02
bullgard4"Unlike traditional crash dump facilities, this facility dumps memory images to a centralized server via the network. "09:03
bullgard4"The goal of a crash dump facility is to provide fault analysis, particularly exhaustive first fault analysis (first fault analysis is when a bug can be corrected without requiring reproducing the bug), in the case of software or hardware bugs that manifest as system crashes (in Linux parlance, Oops, BUG(), or panic). "09:04
apwwe have crash dumping indeed, not sure if there is any support for remote deliver of those immediatly when the dump is taken09:04
apwthough that is only a matter of what you put in the crash initrd09:04
bullgard4Ah! Thank you for commenting.09:05
apwi think we did have some discussions on this sort of thing, but its more a server need than anything.  so i would suggest asking on #ubuntu-server as well, they may remember or have pointers09:06
apwsmb, whats the crash package called again, i keep forgetting09:06
smbapw, crashdump?09:06
apwahh here it is linux-crashdump09:07
apwlooking for crash is a mistake it seems09:07
apwbullgard4, ^09:08
smbcrash is the tool to look at the dumps09:10
bullgard4apw: Excellent! I will get acquanted with the DEB program package »linux-crashdump« (because I have infrequently kernel crashes). -- Thank you very much.09:10
ppisatiif it's just a matters of oops&c, why don't you configure syslog to send all the stuff abroad?09:11
smbppisati, I think working crash-dump gives you the whole memory + registers of the time of the crash09:13
ppisatii see (and that being said i take swallow another coffee)09:14
* smb needs a refill09:15
smbapw, btw, there seems to be kdump-tools as well, not that I would know what the differences would be...09:15
apwsmb, seems linux-crashdump pulls all of those in09:16
smbapw, Hm, interesting, saw only kexec-tools, makedumpfile and some grub depends and a crash suggest...09:18
_rubenwhat are the chances of network being operational after a kernel crash??10:03
Kanowhen you compare10:32
Kanoyou should notice that include/generated/compile.h is missing, why?10:33
Kanois it missing because of include/config/cross/compile.h ?10:34
Kanothe problem is that you need that file when you use the debian nvidia-dkms package. it should be included in the u package as well10:35
RAOFKano: Why would you use the debian nvidia-dkms package?10:46
Kanobecause i use the kernel on debian!10:46
Kanobut thats a packageing fault, has nothing to do with the distro10:47
apwKano, likely the layout has changed and we haven't followed it, and nothing has noticed11:39
apwKano, can you file a bug against 'linux' and tell me the number11:39
Kanoagainst precise?11:52
apwKano, against linux the package, that'll go againstr precise by default yes11:53
ubot2`Launchpad bug 942569 in linux "missing include/generated/compile.h" [Undecided,New]11:56
Kanoapw: i see you updated the bug. hope you find the issue why the file is missing. i think you already cp include but maybe too early?12:59
apwKano, nope compile.h is a special and doesn't get made when you ask the kernel tree for the headers 13:00
apwwhich frankly is rather crap13:00
Kanomaybe you see how debian did that13:03
=== arges_ is now known as arges
Kanoit shows similar if as /proc/version13:06
Kanojust with defines13:06
* tgardner reboots tangerine13:06
apwKano, yep, its beyond me why it would be needed by this out-of-tree crap in the first place13:07
Kanoin theory even an empty file fixes the compile, it just has to be there13:08
tgardnerif that is the case, why not fix the OOT code ?13:08
Kanoi dont know where this file is included13:10
Kanobut you see it in the make.log as missing13:11
Kanowhat i want is that i could use the same dkms code for nv with d and u kernel13:11
Kanoif i use the code for u kernel it fails with d and vice versa13:11
ppisatitgardner: hold on before uploading the M/omap4 kernel13:18
tgardnerppisati, I'm letting the stable team upload M kernels.13:18
ppisatiah right13:19
tgardnerppisati, how about P kernels ? do you need one of those ?13:25
ppisatitgardner: i'll wait for ogasawara's rebase of 3.2.8, i saw gkh released it yesterday13:27
tgardnerppisati, 3.2.8 only contains x86 cruft, e.g., FPU corruption fixes (I think)13:28
ppisatitgardner: ok, then go ahead13:30
tgardnerppisati, ack13:30
ppisatitgardner: watch out since it's complaining about a missing module13:30
tgardnerppisati, already fixed and pushed13:30
ppisaticool, thanks13:30
tgardnerppisati, the last rebase for ti-omap4 was against Ubuntu-3.2.0-16.25. perhaps you should bring ti-omap4 up to date ? there are some YAMA patches that are relevant.13:34
* apw notes we don't produce reminder bugs for precise13:34
ppisatitgardner: ok, i'll do, hold on13:34
tgardnerppisati, reset you ti-omap4 HEAD to 3643ea0b470b40ca53d2f870df6e3ade07e11b5b before you start your rebase13:35
hertonppisati, about maverick kernel, the config change should fix the QA failure right?14:22
ppisatiherton: yep, but i had an headless installation so i'm testing the sgx binary driver (see apw's email about it)14:28
hertonppisati, ok, once you do and everything is ok, let me know, do you want to open a new tracking bug for it and push a new branch for pulling?14:30
hertonotherwise I just apply if it tested ok and I do the release process (new tracking bug etc.)14:31
Kanotgardner: dont forget to fix fglrx for 3.2.814:32
tgardnerKano, fglrx isn't my problem. I think its alberto milone14:33
hallyngah complete hang on vostro, no crash or sysrq response or anything (uptopdate precise)14:47
jwitgardner: re bug 942256, you sure that those two will work without having hv_vmbus.ko on the inclusion list?14:50
ubot2`Launchpad bug 942256 in linux "HyperV modules missing from -virtual flavor" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/94225614:50
jwioh, and this closes bug 560821 as well14:51
ubot2`Launchpad bug 560821 in linux "No hyper-v modules on linux-generic-pae/virtual" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/56082114:51
tgardnerjwi, looks like 560821 is now a duplicate14:52
tgardnerof 94225614:52
jwiyeah, not sure if microsoft renamed or killed the block driver...14:55
apwtgardner, i can have a look, as i did the bits to get the right drivers into initramfs, so i should know the list14:55
tgardnerjwi, I'm not sure what you'r first statement meant. are you implying that the 4 hv modules in the bug report are not sufficient ?14:56
apwtgardner, there are 514:56
apwhv_vmbus hv_utils hv_netvsc hv_mouse hv_storvsc14:56
jwitgardner: you only added two new files.14:57
tgardnerI thought mouse got dropped14:57
apwtgardner, oh bugger have the names changed _again_ with the update to 3.414:57
* apw hates upstream sometimes14:57
tgardnerapw, I think its now hid-hyperv14:59
tgardnerbut is it really needed for -virtual  ?15:00
jwitgardner: duh, utils and vmbus are in the initramfs - sorry for the noise.15:10
tgardnerjwi, np15:10
apwtgardner, hmmm there is a question, if you are going to use the mouse with a VM then perhaps so15:12
apwpotentially it is running connected to your X display or whatever you have in hyper-v15:13
tgardnerapw, its easy enough to add. lemme take care of it15:13
brendandherton, bjf - quick note to say that the Lucid kernel is probably going to be finished by Thursday, maybe Friday15:38
bjfbrendand: ack15:38
tgardnerapw, hid-hyperv.ko needs unknown symbol hid_allocate_device, which means more shit in the -virtual flavour. I'm thinking anyone who has X installed can also install the linux-image-extra deb to get hid-hyperv. agreed ?15:38
apwtgardner, i guess the simplest approach is to not add it, and see if anyone screams15:39
brendandbjf - point releases always put a lot of strain on our resources15:39
* ogasawara back in 2015:40
apwtgardner, bah union-mounts is rearing its ugly head again, and the overlayfs maintainer remains very quiet15:45
tgardnerapw, he's on LKML but won't respond to you15:46
apwtgardner, and union-mounts is 73 patches of doom15:47
tgardnerapw, did I see a merge request for union-mounts ?15:48
apwtgardner, i haven't seen that yet, the patch spew looked to be an RFC to me15:48
apwbut it doesn't make it any more likely we are betting the right horse15:49
tgardnerah, couldn't remember15:49
apwthat with the current issues i have with semantics for inotify15:49
apwi am all a dither as to the best way forward15:49
tgardnerapw, still the lxc guys whinging about overlayfs ?15:49
apwyeah, lots of packages rely on inotify, like upstart does so it does't see new jobs15:50
apwso a lot of things need fixing if inotify is not available15:50
tgardnerapw, have you tried aufs lately ? I saw that it gotupdated15:50
apwtgardner, i have touch tested it though its not enabled15:50
apwtgardner, i am keeping it around in case we end up having to keep it available for these use cases15:51
tgardnerapw, well, we could re-enable it and let the lxc dudes have a go at it15:51
apwphhhh, yeah we could indeed, i just didn't want to have to support both15:52
tgardnerapw, though I have to wonder why all of these apps are depending on a kernel feature that is not mainline15:52
tgardnercan we tell them all to just pound sand ?15:53
apw tgardner inotify i mainline, it just doesn't work on overlayfs15:53
tgardnerah, right15:53
apwie the apps work fine on a real root15:53
tgardnerhow does ecryptfs do it? can we steal that logic ?15:53
apwand i've gotten most of the way with overlays, adding support but there is a semantic15:53
apwdifference on overlayfs files which bugger some use cases15:53
tgardnerthe 'tail -f' case ?15:54
apwspecifically the tail type use case, monitoring a file for change case15:54
apwif the file gets copied, that consumer can get confused15:54
apwthat and my patches are vile right now15:54
=== yofel_ is now known as yofel
apws/copied/copied up to the rw layer15:55
tyhicksI missed the backscroll, but I think we're talking about why inotify doesn't work on overlayfs?15:55
apwso i have some patches which in concept resolve the lack of notity15:55
apwby mirroring the underlying notifications up15:56
apwbut that doesn't help with the semantic issues for copy_up against already open files15:56
ppisatiherton: go ahead with M/omap415:57
hertonppisati, ok15:57
apwtyhicks, ie you get a correct file size change notification, you re-fstat and the file is unchanged15:58
apwcause you are conncted to the wrong one15:58
apwtyhicks, now if that idiom is isolated to tail, then moving it to stat against the filename likely could fix it up16:00
apwbut .. is that common or uncommon idiom16:00
tyhicksI'm glancing through the code now, but it is architected quite a bit different than eCryptfs - I don't think I'll have any great ideas here16:01
apwyeah it does passthrough of the open, you can't and don't want to do that16:01
apwand perhaps our issue is we don't want to do that either16:01
apwtyhicks, so how do you handle passing on operations to the underlying layer16:02
apwi guess you don't cause you are modifying offsets and data16:02
* tgardner messes with his firewall. back in a bit.16:02
tyhicksapw: eCryptfs has duplicate inodes and dentries of everything. IIRC, overlayfs does fancy things to keep from having its own inodes, correct?16:02
apwyeah it tries to, well it has them but only when not doing open16:02
tyhicksBy duplicates, I mean for every dentry and inode in the lower filesyste, eCryptfs has a corresponding inode and dentry16:03
apwand to stop having to pass on everything to the original inode16:03
apwit is such a shame there isn't a sensbl16:03
apwwrapper for each op in the kernle, so you could just call them16:03
apwall this if (op exists) then call op, else call something else16:04
apwall being open coded, just makes life hard for slipping oneself in the chain16:04
tyhicksapw: There are wrappers for most. Are you looking for one in particular?16:05
apwmore thining about the case where you mnight want to wrap any underlying one16:06
apwwhere you dont in advance know which ops it uses16:06
apwto act as a pass through, to maintain performance 16:06
jsalisbury** Ubuntu Kernel Team Meeting - Today @ 17:00 UTC - #ubuntu-meeting16:06
apwwhilst having a real inode16:06
tyhicksOk, I'm seeing what you're saying now. opens are entirely passed through and overlayfs doesn't have its own file objects (for regular files) nor any file operations16:11
tyhicksapw: If you run into needed wrappers, let me know. There's a good chance eCryptfs could benefit from them too.16:12
apwtyhicks, right, and if we want open to follow copy_up one would need that indirection layer, but if it was there i'd feel i would want to wrap all the ops, and pass them down16:13
apwwe shall see what the maintainer says, if he says anything16:13
tyhickseCryptfs was the only stacked filesystem but if/when there are 2 stacked filesystems, requests for wrappers and vfs changes should carry a little more weight16:13
apwyeah, though there really should be no open coded 'defaults' like there are16:14
apwthey should be in forceinlined functions if anything16:14
tyhicksWhen you start getting into wrappering the file operations, it gets a little hairy because you're now dealing with data and the page cache16:16
apwyeah, it is not going to work well i suspect16:17
apw /b smb16:26
* smb wonders what /b does... bash'me16:27
smbMeh, probably send message to buffer or switch to buffer 16:28
=== arges is now known as arges_
=== jsalisbury changed the topic of #ubuntu-kernel to: Home: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/ || Ubuntu Kernel Team Meeting - Tues Mar 6th, 2012 - 17:00 UTC || If you have a question just ask, and do wait around for an answer!
apwsmb, yeah select buffer by that name17:34
* apw is feeling well below par, so i am calling it a day17:57
=== bladernr_ is now known as bladernr_afk
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=== tgardner-lunch is now known as tgardner
keestgardner: have you been skimming the seccomp_bpf threads at all? it's starting to stabilize, but the timing is really ugly what with precise beta, etc. do you have an opinion on carrying the series for precise?19:47
tgardnerkees, I have not been following with any kind of attention. I've just noticed that there has been a fair amount of activity.19:48
tgardnerkees, is chromium still the primary consumer ?19:49
=== ayan_ is now known as ayan
keestgardner: that's the trick. nothing uses it yet since it doesn't exist yet, but so far chromium and lxc (among others) are interested. RH has a libseccomp in the works, so there's lots happening, but it's not clear to me about the value of having it in precise with no consumers in precise. but if people use precise as a development platform... it'd be _really_ nice.19:50
tgardnerkees, well, this kernel will be around for awhile. do you have a patch set that comfortable with ? I'd prefer something thats gonna make it into the 3.4 merge window.19:51
tgardnerkees, on the other hand, we'll also be backporting subsequent kernels into the Precise user space19:52
keestgardner: I think redpig's v12 will be the last version (or extremely close to final). v11 comments are drawing to a close and everyone seems pretty happy with it. It's not clear to be if it'll make the 3.4 window (I _really_ hope so).19:58
tgardnerkees, there is still time. kernel freeze isn't until April 1519:59
* kees nods20:00
keestgardner: what would be your preferred schedule for pulling a patch series for precise?20:00
tgardnerkees, likely no later then April 1. that'll give us a bit of time to verify things.20:01
keesokay, great20:01
tgardnerogasawara, I do have the date correct, right ?20:01
ogasawaratgardner, kees: kernel freeze is april 5th (not 15th)20:02
tgardnerogasawara, ah, good thing I asked :)20:02
keeshah, so... middle of march then?20:02
ogasawaratgardner, kees:  if possible, I'd maybe shoot for Beta-2 Freeze, which is March 22nd.20:02
tgardnerkees, yeah, Mar 22 at the latest20:02
ogasawarakees: so yes, mid march would be ideal.20:02
=== matti_ is now known as matti
* cking -> EOD21:32
=== bladernr_afk is now known as bladernr_
* tgardner -> EOD21:45
mahmohhallyn: are armhf precise containers working?  Or can you tell me what I'm doing wrong?  If I enter the container it appears to work fine but I'm trying to execute commands externally to get info. from within - http://paste.ubuntu.com/861153/22:14
* mahmoh moves to ubuntu-devel with the question22:15
=== bjf is now known as bjf[afk]
=== albrigha is now known as Guest54222
pbuckleymahmoh: goto ubuntu-arm22:32
pbuckleyerr #ubuntu-arm22:32
pbuckleyyoull have better luck22:32
skaetogasawara, thank you!  :D  spotted update in the release notes before I sent out the request.23:08

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