[03:46] <RAOF> Oh, boo.
[03:47]  * RAOF forgot xorg-gtest wasn't actually packaged.
[03:54] <RAOF> That puts somewhat of a crimp on an otherwise damn-fine plan.
[05:11] <tjaalton> RAOF: sure is
[05:12] <RAOF> ...
[05:12] <RAOF> So it is.
[05:12] <tjaalton> :)
[05:14] <RAOF> Ta
[08:43] <wickedgrey> hello, i've got a 11.10 install with nvidia-current(-dev), and nvidia-current-updates(-dev).  originally these were the 280 drivers from ubuntu, but i recently added the x-swat PPA to get the 295 drivers.  however, it doesn't seem like the n-c-updates are in the PPA, so /proc/drivers/nvidia/version still shows 280 (even though n-c is installed and shows 295).  is there a way to fix this, or should i uninstall n-c-updates?  sorry if
[08:45] <tjaalton> means the kernel driver didn't build
[08:49] <wickedgrey> any suggestions on how to troubleshoot that?
[08:53] <tjaalton> check the dkms logs in /var/log/dkms or such
[08:54] <tjaalton> or just run dpkg-reconfigure linux-image-`uname -r`
[08:54] <tjaalton> it should complain about it
[09:05] <wickedgrey> hrm, i don't have a /var/log/dkms or anything that looks similar, and dpkg-reconfigure didn't seem to say anything about the gpu, or anything that looked like an error :(
[09:21] <wickedgrey> thanks for your help, i'm off to bed
[11:37] <tjaalton> sigh.. bug 942977
[11:37] <tjaalton> ->close
[20:45] <cnd> Sarvatt, bryceh, RAOF: I'm going to enable the right button area by default for clickpads, if that's alright with you?
[20:45] <cnd> whot also is advocating for it
[20:45] <cnd> it would fix bug 941046
[20:45] <Sarvatt> cnd: "fix" :(
[20:45] <cnd> Sarvatt, hmm?
[20:45] <Sarvatt> two finger press right click is how these things have always worked, thats going to be a hot debate
[20:46] <cnd> yeah
[20:46] <cnd> sorry
[20:46] <cnd>  I got it
[20:46] <cnd> Sarvatt, what do you think would be better?
[20:46] <Sarvatt> sounds good though, better than no right click :)
[20:46] <cnd> clickpad support, or two-finger-right-click?
[20:46] <Sarvatt> (disabling clickpad)
[20:46] <Sarvatt> on bcm5974
[20:47] <cnd> Sarvatt, why only on macbooks?
[20:47] <Sarvatt> cnd: what does clickpad get you on these bcm5974's btw?
[20:47] <Sarvatt> because none of them have button areas on the bottom
[20:47] <cnd> Sarvatt, click and drag with two separate fingers
[20:47] <Sarvatt> its not obvious
[20:47] <cnd> Sarvatt, yeah, that's the reason I'm hesitant
[20:47] <cnd> it's not obvious there's a right button area
[20:48] <cnd> Sarvatt, people like vanhoof have been begging me for clickpad support
[20:48] <cnd> and he uses the magic trackpad
[20:48] <Sarvatt> ah yeah i see what you mean
[20:48] <cnd> I'm guessing he would much rather have clickpad + right button area
[20:48] <Sarvatt> yeah but magic trackpad wouldn't be affected since its not bcm5974
[20:48] <cnd> Sarvatt, if you're going to do it to bcm5974, you should do it for hid-magicmouse too :)
[20:48] <cnd> there practically the same
[20:48] <cnd> they're*
[20:50] <Sarvatt> gotcha, no worries, disabling clickpad is the better option for my own personal usage because right click is muuuch more important than click then moving with a second finger
[20:50] <cnd> maybe I should send an email to ubuntu-devel and ubuntu-desktop
[20:50] <Sarvatt> hmm, that would be trivial to add to g-c-c, i wonder if its too late
[20:51] <cnd> Sarvatt, that's what I worry about
[20:51] <cnd> that and it doesn't really solve the problem
[20:51] <cnd> I don't want to have a checkbox for "Enable clickpad (and disable two-touch-click for right button)"
[20:51] <cnd> however you phrase it
[20:52] <cnd> I'm really just two weeks short of have the time to get it right I think
[20:52] <cnd> I could put in some heuristics to re-enable click action + clickpad
[20:52] <cnd> but it's a bit late...
[20:52] <cnd> and I have other bugs I need to get to
[22:07] <Sarvatt> cnd: click and drag with a second finger being for pinch to zoom i suppose?
[22:07] <Sarvatt> or rotate or whatever
[22:07] <cnd> Sarvatt, no
[22:08] <cnd> just being able to perform a drag
[22:08] <cnd> like dragging an icon on the desktop
[22:08] <Sarvatt> never tried doing that without just dragging the finger i'm pressing into the touchpad with i guess
[22:10] <Sarvatt> wish i never got used to this darn mac trackpad :)
[22:11] <cnd> Sarvatt, the problem is if you try to drag beyond the bounds of your trackpad
[22:11] <cnd> that's where you need to be able to do it with two fingers
[22:11] <Sarvatt> ahh low acceleration values, i do raise mine a ton from defaults
[22:11] <cnd> heh
[23:04] <bryceh> cnd, I'm kind of two minds with the clickpad changes (caveat being I haven't re-tested in a week or so)
[23:06] <bryceh> cnd, from an X perspective I think we do need to move forward with enabling the new functionality even if it regresses a bit.  Like I mentioned before, it'd be nice if it were configurable in some way, but admittedly it's too late in the game.
[23:07] <bryceh> cnd, from a user perspective, in addition to my netbook, I also have ones for my mom, dad, and mother-in-law, and I can't envision any of them learning and using the gestures
[23:07] <bryceh> cnd, on the plus side, they hate the pad in general already and pretty much all use external usb mice instead
[23:08] <cnd> heh
[23:08] <cnd> I think this is one reason they may hate it
[23:08] <cnd> it's nearly impossible to click+drag
[23:08] <bryceh> I suspect you may be right
[23:11] <cnd> I think it makes sense to enable the right button area on synaptics at least
[23:11] <cnd> that solves all issues there
[23:11] <cnd> it's really just the apple trackpads
[23:12] <cnd> if I didn't have people clamoring for clickpad support for apple trackpads, I might be tempted to enable clickpad support only for synaptics trackpads
[23:16] <Sarvatt> cnd: magic trackpads people use on their non mac laptops where they are used to having right click buttons and want a button area, or people using internal mac trackpads where they have never had a right button area though? :P
[23:17] <Sarvatt> if the touchpad clicks anywhere on the touchpad surface, it seems weird to want to click in the bottom right corner only to right click
[23:17] <cnd> Sarvatt, people using the magic trackpad aren't used to having right button areas in any OS, as far as I can tell
[23:17] <cnd> so that makes both internal and external the same
[23:21] <wickedgrey> cnd: when you say "magic trackpad" do you mean only the external one?  my macbook pro trackpad has right-click functionality in the lower right corner of the pad
[23:22] <Sarvatt> wickedgrey: did you enable that?
[23:23] <cnd> wickedgrey, magic trackpad is external
[23:23] <cnd> wickedgrey, how old is your laptop (or what is its model number?)
[23:26] <Sarvatt> hmm i guess other distros wont even notice the mac change until they pick up "Input: bcm5974 - set BUTTONPAD property" which doesn't seem to be upstream yet
[23:26] <cnd> heh
[23:26] <cnd> yeah
[23:27] <Sarvatt> oh it is upstream in 3.3
[23:28] <wickedgrey> IIRC, i did have to enable that in settings somewhere.  i got the laptop in late 2010
[23:31] <Sarvatt> cnd: if it ever got fixed in the future where 2 finger click could be right click while also  being able to drag with 2 fingers, would it be in the synaptics driver or do you think it'd need server changes? aka is there nothing stopping it from being SRUed ever if it did get fixed and we get bugs?
[23:32]  * Sarvatt hate hate hates looking at synaptics bugs, they are mostly opinion on how the default settings should be
[23:32] <cnd> Sarvatt, it would be in the synaptics driver
[23:32] <cnd> could be SRU'd but it would be a big change
[23:32] <cnd> imo
[23:34] <Sarvatt> awesome
[23:39] <cnd> wickedgrey, oh, you're probably meaning that you have right click from a tap in the lower right corner
[23:39] <cnd> we're talking about a "press" in the lower right corner
[23:40] <wickedgrey> what's the difference between a tap and a press?  sorry, not up on the jargon :)
[23:44] <cnd> wickedgrey, if you have a clickpad you have to press on the touchpad to perform a physical click
[23:44] <cnd> the touchpad physically goes up and down
[23:45] <cnd> so a tap is where you momentarily touch the touchpad surface without the touchpad physically moving
[23:45] <cnd> and a press is where you press the touchpad surface and move it physically
[23:47] <wickedgrey> ah, gotcha.  i can press for right-click, but not tap.  sorry for the derail!  :)
[23:48] <wickedgrey> (not sure if there are additional settings i could alter to change that or not)
[23:48] <Sarvatt> bryceh: did i misread the scrollback or did you forward that mesa bug to fdo? got a link handy by any chance?
[23:49] <bryceh> Sarvatt, I did forward it, one sec
[23:49] <bryceh> https://bugs.freedesktop.org//show_bug.cgi?id=46739
[23:49] <bryceh> https://bugs.launchpad.net/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/926379
[23:50] <bryceh> no responses yet
[23:50] <bryceh> however I also emailed Eugeni directly, and he confirmed they've escalated it on their end
[23:50] <bryceh> (so... I'm surprised there's no further comment today)
[23:51] <Sarvatt> bryceh: thanks a ton! yeah i didnt see anything on the lists about it
[23:52] <bryceh> I should forward a few more bugs.  Been distracted hacking on libXrandrUtils this week
[23:52] <bryceh> (up to crtcs and outputs and modes, oh my!)
[23:54] <RAOF> Woot!
[23:57] <bryceh> nvidia's seeing an influx of bugs the last couple weeks - http://www.bryceharrington.org/Arsenal/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/totals-precise-workqueue.svg
[23:58] <bryceh> -synaptics is getting a few more than usual too