| jono | good thanks, you? | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| ScottL | doing well, getting kids dinner then i'm working on some studio stuff | 00:00 |
| astraljava | ochosi: If you have a little time sometime soon, please have a look at bug #952462, Colin mentions Xfce session handling in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntustudio/+bug/952462/comments/4 | 11:32 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 952462 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Ubuntustudio 12.04 installer has unreadable text" [Medium,Confirmed] | 11:32 |
| mr_pouit | astraljava: you need to do like mythbuntu-live-autostart/xubuntu-live-settings | 11:54 |
| mr_pouit | micahg: thanks, I hope it'll be ok for the next beta. | 13:16 |
| astraljava | mr_pouit: Thanks, I also learnt this from a later comment on the bug. I'll look into this tonight, hopefully. | 14:07 |
| astraljava | Anyone in here using thunderbird as an email app and keeping Indicator plugin in use as well? I find the indicator fails to keep syncronized with the unread mail information from t-bird, thus erratically showing the envelope as blue even when all mail has been marked as read. | 15:01 |
| micahg | mr_pouit: yeah, next beta should be doable | 15:13 |
| ochosi | astraljava: i guess lionel's reply is what you want/ed :) | 15:23 |
| astraljava | ochosi: Sure is, thanks. :) | 15:23 |
| === yofel_ is now known as yofel | ||
| * knome fires up the desktop pc and we're good to go | 18:59 | |
| Unit193 | @ping | 19:02 |
| meetingology | pong | 19:02 |
| Unit193 | Ready, just not identified. | 19:02 |
| knome | okay, so who's here for the meeting? | 19:02 |
| Unit193 | I am. | 19:02 |
| pleia2 | \o | 19:03 |
| mr_pouit | o hai | 19:03 |
| knome | #startmeeting Xubuntu Community Meeting | 19:04 |
| meetingology | Meeting started Wed Mar 14 19:04:05 2012 UTC. The chair is knome. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology. | 19:04 |
| meetingology | Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired | 19:04 |
| knome | #topic Team Updates | 19:04 |
| knome | #subtopic Package and Development | 19:04 |
| knome | meetingology, | 19:04 |
| knome | errrh | 19:04 |
| knome | mr_pouit, | 19:04 |
| mr_pouit | nothing much apart from bugfixes: xfdesktop4, xfce4-cellmodem-plugin, shimmer-themes, xfce4-settings and xfce4-xkb-plugin | 19:05 |
| knome | mr_pouit, can you repost with #info? thanks :P | 19:05 |
| mr_pouit | micahg working on lightdm-gtk-greeter and blueman, should hopefully be ok for beta 2 | 19:05 |
| mr_pouit | I hate you :p | 19:06 |
| knome | it's mutual | 19:06 |
| knome | i hate myself too | 19:06 |
| mr_pouit | #info nothing much apart from bugfixes: xfdesktop4, xfce4-cellmodem-plugin, shimmer-themes, xfce4-settings and xfce4-xkb-plugin | 19:06 |
| mr_pouit | #info micahg working on lightdm-gtk-greeter and blueman, should hopefully be ok for beta 2 | 19:06 |
| mr_pouit | voila :) | 19:06 |
| knome | thanks | 19:06 |
| knome | anything else? | 19:06 |
| knome | #info PAE kernel is requested for xubuntu precise i386 | 19:07 |
| mr_pouit | yeah, that too | 19:07 |
| knome | err!!! | 19:07 |
| knome | #info NON-PAE kernel is requested for xubuntu precise i386 | 19:07 |
| * knome 's brain is a bit numb | 19:07 | |
| knome | #subtopic Bugs, Testing, Docs | 19:07 |
| micahg | how many users do we expect to need that? | 19:07 |
| knome | micahg, no idea, but it's easier to install PAE | 19:08 |
| Unit193 | You should be able to go from a mini and install xubuntu-desktop. | 19:08 |
| knome | Unit193, yes... but in that case, we're offering alternate too | 19:08 |
| knome | Unit193, so those who need alternate, could go via mini too | 19:08 |
| knome | there's an item for this on other business, we can continue this later in the meeting :) | 19:09 |
| knome | anything on bugs, testing, docs? | 19:09 |
| pleia2 | ah, yes | 19:09 |
| pleia2 | #info I'm in the process of improving the testing docs, hopefully a blog post too so we can have more testers for beta2 | 19:09 |
| pleia2 | . | 19:10 |
| knome | something else? | 19:11 |
| pleia2 | that's all from me | 19:11 |
| knome | ok... | 19:11 |
| knome | #subtopic Marketing, Art, Web | 19:11 |
| knome | i suppose there's not yet anything new from the marketing stuff? | 19:12 |
| pleia2 | #info Submitted web form request to confirm we can make Xubuntu products, no response | 19:12 |
| pleia2 | it's been over 2 weeks now | 19:12 |
| pleia2 | so nothing new :( | 19:12 |
| knome | :/ | 19:12 |
| knome | yeah, let's hope we get forward before precise release | 19:12 |
| pleia2 | I'll try again, maybe it just got lost | 19:13 |
| knome | btw, if we change our logo, we need new stickers | 19:13 |
| knome | or at least new sticker sources :) | 19:13 |
| knome | #subtopic General updates | 19:14 |
| knome | anything else? | 19:14 |
| pleia2 | I think that's it | 19:15 |
| knome | me too, it should be quiet after all the freezes... | 19:15 |
| knome | #topic Other Business | 19:15 |
| knome | #subtopic Seeding GThumb | 19:15 |
| knome | okay, so now that ristretto is working again, do we feel like we still should seed gthumb? | 19:16 |
| mr_pouit | yeah, for importing photos from cameras? | 19:17 |
| knome | but most of the cameras work as uh, filesystems | 19:17 |
| knome | there was a term for this | 19:17 |
| mr_pouit | mass storage? | 19:18 |
| knome | that | 19:18 |
| knome | so does most of the cameras support that or not? | 19:20 |
| mr_pouit | I think we still need gthumb for other cameras that use ptp | 19:20 |
| mr_pouit | (but I'm not really into that sort of things, so I can be wrong ;-) | 19:20 |
| knome | okay, it's not too large, is it? | 19:21 |
| knome | and btw, what's the current iso size status? | 19:21 |
| mr_pouit | we're not oversized anyway | 19:21 |
| mr_pouit | amd64: 694M, i386: 679M | 19:22 |
| mr_pouit | (today) | 19:22 |
| knome | mmh, so not too tight | 19:22 |
| knome | (thinking about P+1 too) | 19:22 |
| knome | so let's still seed gthumb | 19:22 |
| knome | or does somebody disagree? | 19:22 |
| knome | no? okay... | 19:23 |
| knome | #subtopic New logo | 19:23 |
| knome | so, there's a proposal for a new logo | 19:23 |
| knome | reasoning is: | 19:23 |
| knome | it's easier to drop in to various places graphically | 19:23 |
| knome | it works better on small sizes | 19:23 |
| knome | it's brighter and more saturated | 19:24 |
| knome | and it looks good too. | 19:24 |
| knome | comparisons can be found at: http://temp.knome.fi/xubuntu/precise_logo/ | 19:24 |
| knome | comments? | 19:25 |
| pleia2 | it's good :) | 19:25 |
| knome | yes, i personally prefer the closed shape very much | 19:26 |
| knome | is anybody disagreeing? i wanted to bring this to the meeting to raise discussion and to hear if somebody disagrees | 19:28 |
| * knome just confirmed with skaet that we are okay to do the logo changes after UIFe | 19:29 | |
| mr_pouit | so no exception needed? | 19:29 |
| knome | mr_pouit, i'm checking with skaet | 19:30 |
| knome | #action knome, ochosi and mr_pouit to work on getting the new logo everywhere | 19:31 |
| meetingology | ACTION: knome, ochosi and mr_pouit to work on getting the new logo everywhere | 19:31 |
| * micahg prefers the old logo | 19:31 | |
| micahg | the new one makes it hard to tell what it is | 19:32 |
| knome | mmh. i wonder if that's true for those too who doesn't already know the xfce logo | 19:33 |
| mr_pouit | (I like it on the plymouth theme) | 19:33 |
| knome | mr_pouit, "probably best to submit a UIFe" | 19:33 |
| knome | mr_pouit, if you need help with that, just ask me | 19:34 |
| knome | mr_pouit, or, if you want me to do that :P | 19:34 |
| micahg | and the whiskers look like a bunny is hiding in the background | 19:35 |
| knome | mr_pouit, the new or old? | 19:35 |
| knome | micahg, in the old logo, the whiskers are barely visible | 19:36 |
| micahg | right :) | 19:36 |
| knome | except in BIG sizes | 19:36 |
| mr_pouit | knome: the new one (and yes, please file the UIFe please :P) | 19:36 |
| knome | but that's not really a problem with the new logo either... there *is* a gap :) | 19:37 |
| knome | mr_pouit, yeah, skaet ACK'd, now just need to send email to docs team | 19:37 |
| knome | mr_pouit, okay, we need to upload *this week* :) | 19:38 |
| micahg | knome: I think the gap makes it look funny | 19:38 |
| knome | micahg, yeah, but the gap existed on the old logo too | 19:39 |
| micahg | doesn't look like it | 19:39 |
| knome | huh? | 19:39 |
| knome | in http://temp.knome.fi/xubuntu/precise_logo/logo_comparison.png ? :) | 19:39 |
| micahg | oh, yeah, on that one you can see it | 19:40 |
| knome | yeah, it's a small one on both, but there is one on both | 19:40 |
| micahg | was looking at the website logo | 19:40 |
| knome | ah :) | 19:40 |
| knome | yeah, the website logo is actually the reason why we decided to change | 19:40 |
| knome | micahg, so, do you still think there new logo is weird? | 19:44 |
| micahg | yes | 19:44 |
| knome | i mean, there's some drawbacks on both ones.. | 19:44 |
| micahg | but I've been using Xubuntu for 4 years and am very familiar with the old look | 19:44 |
| knome | is it about the whiskers, or the mousehead-shape? | 19:44 |
| micahg | both | 19:45 |
| knome | mmh | 19:45 |
| knome | any suggestions how could we make it less weird? | 19:45 |
| knome | for the mousehead, i don't think there's much to do except small changes to the shape, since the idea is to have a closed-shape logo | 19:46 |
| micahg | thinner whiskers, add back legs? | 19:46 |
| knome | would make the shape inside the circle smaller | 19:46 |
| knome | also, i suppose it would look weird to have legs but almost no body at all :) | 19:47 |
| knome | anyhow, do we think we're ready to vote? | 19:48 |
| knome | small changes are doable before uploading, i'll be working on this tomorrow anyway | 19:48 |
| * micahg seems to be alone in this view though | 19:48 | |
| Unit193 | micahg: I wasn't fond of it either. | 19:48 |
| knome | i could look about making the gap for whiskers bigger | 19:49 |
| knome | Unit193, and this is exactly why i asked you to say this earlier | 19:49 |
| micahg | I don't think the gap should be bigger, rather the whiskers thinned out | 19:49 |
| knome | mmh. | 19:50 |
| knome | i can look what i can do without making them disappear again on small sizes :) | 19:50 |
| knome | or, then we could just have two versions, but that's in a way suboptimal | 19:50 |
| knome | Unit193, do you want to express what *you* think is not right with the new logo? | 19:51 |
| Unit193 | Not really, that's why I held my fingers, so to say. | 19:51 |
| knome | micahg, are you completely dissatisfied with the new look? | 19:51 |
| micahg | knome: idk, I'd probably get used to it over time, I just prefer something closer to the old one | 19:53 |
| knome | micahg, yeah. it's not that i don't like the old one, it's just a near-nightmare graphically to drop in to various places :) | 19:53 |
| micahg | knome: can we go the other way and pull the full mouse in? | 19:54 |
| knome | micahg, that makes it completely unrexognisable on small sizes | 19:55 |
| knome | micahg, which is why we didn't do that at 10.04, when we changed the logo the last time | 19:55 |
| micahg | what does upstream do about this? | 19:55 |
| knome | i suppose xfce uses the X from the logo | 19:55 |
| knome | and mouse only on bigger sizes | 19:55 |
| knome | micahg, do you think the whiskers are too fat in the website comparison already? | 19:58 |
| micahg | yes | 19:59 |
| knome | what about plymouth? | 19:59 |
| knome | imo they are quite right there... | 19:59 |
| knome | but maybe that's because it's inverted :) | 20:00 |
| knome | the actual sizes are pretty much the smae | 20:01 |
| knome | #action knome to look the whisker-size | 20:01 |
| meetingology | ACTION: knome to look the whisker-size | 20:01 |
| pleia2 | that's my favorite action item ever | 20:01 |
| knome | hehe | 20:01 |
| knome | if there is nothing new to add to the discussion, let's vote yay/nay | 20:02 |
| knome | #vote New Xubuntu logo (+1) or the old one, please! (-1) | 20:02 |
| meetingology | Please vote on: New Xubuntu logo (+1) or the old one, please! (-1) | 20:02 |
| meetingology | Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me) | 20:02 |
| knome | +1 | 20:02 |
| meetingology | +1 received from knome | 20:02 |
| pleia2 | +1 | 20:02 |
| meetingology | +1 received from pleia2 | 20:02 |
| knome | mr_pouit, micahg, Unit193 | 20:03 |
| micahg | -1 | 20:03 |
| meetingology | -1 received from micahg | 20:03 |
| Unit193 | -0 | 20:03 |
| knome | Unit193, i suppose -0 isn't +0 :D | 20:04 |
| knome | but mmh... | 20:04 |
| Unit193 | +0 | 20:04 |
| meetingology | +0 received from Unit193 | 20:04 |
| Unit193 | Meany... | 20:04 |
| knome | mr_pouit, you still lurking around or should we proceed? | 20:05 |
| knome | #endvote | 20:05 |
| meetingology | Voting ended on: New Xubuntu logo (+1) or the old one, please! (-1) | 20:05 |
| meetingology | Votes for:2 Votes against:1 Abstentions:1 | 20:05 |
| meetingology | Motion carried | 20:05 |
| pleia2 | not exactly overwhelming support :) maybe a discussion for the list? | 20:06 |
| knome | pleia2, we need to push the changes this week, according to skaet, who's now on the chan | 20:06 |
| * pleia2 nods | 20:06 | |
| knome | mr_pouit said earlier that he likes the new logo on plymouth | 20:06 |
| pleia2 | ok | 20:06 |
| knome | also, ochosi would have given +1, if he was attending | 20:07 |
| pleia2 | good enough | 20:07 |
| knome | (that's said at #shimmer though, but it's recorded) | 20:07 |
| knome | what ochosi also said is probably true; if we're changing the logo, we probably should do that with 12.04 | 20:08 |
| knome | and i have to agree with that. pushing a new logo for LTS+1 is quite bland :) | 20:08 |
| knome | #info knome promises to work on any suggestions to make the new logo better tomorrow | 20:09 |
| knome | #subtopic PAE kernel | 20:09 |
| knome | okay, so non-PAE kernel is requested for xubuntu precise i386 | 20:09 |
| knome | was there some discussion people wanted to have about this? | 20:09 |
| knome | apparently not anymore... :) | 20:10 |
| * micahg wonders if Windows 8 supports non-PAE | 20:11 | |
| knome | #subtopic Open action items from previous meeting | 20:11 |
| knome | ouch | 20:11 |
| knome | heh | 20:11 |
| knome | well | 20:11 |
| knome | ubuntu desktop doesn't | 20:11 |
| knome | and i agree it makes sense to have a derivative that does | 20:11 |
| micahg | well, no ubuntu-desktop supports it, just not in the installer :) | 20:11 |
| knome | mmh, right | 20:12 |
| knome | but yeah, how do you install the system if the installer is PAE-only | 20:12 |
| micahg | as do we | 20:12 |
| micahg | install 11.10 or a netboot install | 20:12 |
| knome | yeah, but let's say 13.04 is out | 20:12 |
| knome | you don't want to install 11.10 | 20:12 |
| knome | or even when 12.10 is out | 20:13 |
| knome | it doesn't make much sense | 20:13 |
| micahg | 13.04 probably will not have a non-PAE kernell, 12.10 might not either | 20:13 |
| knome | having non-PAE kernel doesn't do any harm, right? | 20:13 |
| micahg | knome: you install 11.10 and upgrade to 12.04 | 20:13 |
| knome | i mean, you can always switch to PAE kernel after installation | 20:13 |
| micahg | 12.04 will probably be end of the line for non-PAE kernels | 20:14 |
| knome | that's a smaller bad than having to install+upgrade | 20:14 |
| knome | yeah, but otoh, 12.04 is LTS, so it makes sense to support non-PAE there | 20:14 |
| knome | if 12.10 is PAE-only, then it is, and we have to live with it | 20:14 |
| pleia2 | it would be nice to have the same support as regular ubuntu in this regard | 20:14 |
| pleia2 | so keep non-pae with lts, then drop it after | 20:15 |
| micahg | knome: well, if the installer work happens anyways and it won't break anything, I wouldn't mind shipping the non-PAE kernel | 20:15 |
| micahg | pleia2: the Ubuntu ISOs for 12.04 will ship the PAE kernel for i386 | 20:15 |
| knome | micahg, we've filed a bug today and cjwatson is the assignee, and will work it out | 20:15 |
| pleia2 | micahg: oh, oops | 20:15 |
| pleia2 | maybe we should too :\ | 20:15 |
| micahg | so, if it's not too much work and won't break anything, I don't mind either way | 20:16 |
| knome | pleia2, except in that case, those users with processors that do not support PAE will need to install 11.0 and upgrade to 12.04 | 20:16 |
| micahg | knome: which is either a 10+ year old desktop or a 5+ year old laptop/netbook | 20:16 |
| knome | if it's too much work or breaks things, i'm sure we'll hear about this and can rethink | 20:16 |
| pleia2 | knome: as I understand it, the number of users this impacts is on the low side (and it's not like we'll have a fleet of people installing xubuntu servers) | 20:16 |
| micahg | pleia2: right, that's why I'm ambivalent about the whole thing | 20:17 |
| knome | micahg, yes, but we say on our website that xubuntu works on older hardware too | 20:17 |
| knome | pleia2, the number of users who need alternate is on the low side too | 20:17 |
| micahg | knome: it will work :), just depends what you define as old, you can't run Xubuntu on a P1 | 20:18 |
| pleia2 | my p3 laptop won't run pae, but my p3 laptop also kernel panics when I look at it wrong | 20:18 |
| knome | micahg, but you do agree with me that we can use non-PAE if it just works? :) | 20:18 |
| knome | mr_pouit +1'd non-PAE | 20:18 |
| knome | he's going to love me for highlighting him so many times... | 20:19 |
| micahg | knome: yes, as those installinig 32 bit xubuntu vs 64 bit will probably have less than 3GB RAM | 20:19 |
| knome | okay, good | 20:19 |
| knome | #info cjwatson will look at using non-PAE kernel with xubuntu precise i386, knome to follow-up with him if problems arises | 20:20 |
| knome | so, now the old action items | 20:21 |
| knome | #action pleia2 and knome to work on t-shirt designs and come up with a proposal on the design and the webstore to plug in | 20:21 |
| meetingology | ACTION: pleia2 and knome to work on t-shirt designs and come up with a proposal on the design and the webstore to plug in | 20:21 |
| knome | carried on | 20:21 |
| knome | #action knome to design flyers | 20:21 |
| meetingology | ACTION: knome to design flyers | 20:21 |
| knome | carried on | 20:21 |
| knome | wallpaper is finalized | 20:21 |
| knome | madnick provided code | 20:21 |
| knome | shortcuts are in | 20:21 |
| knome | wallpaper is in the repo | 20:21 |
| knome | xfce package revs ok | 20:22 |
| knome | #action pleia2 to raise publicity on triaging, testing and docs | 20:22 |
| meetingology | ACTION: pleia2 to raise publicity on triaging, testing and docs | 20:22 |
| knome | #action pleia2 to gather content for flyers | 20:22 |
| meetingology | ACTION: pleia2 to gather content for flyers | 20:22 |
| knome | and wikipage is set | 20:22 |
| knome | #endmeeting | 20:22 |
| meetingology | Meeting ended Wed Mar 14 20:22:38 2012 UTC. | 20:22 |
| meetingology | Minutes (wiki): http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/xubuntu-devel/2012/xubuntu-devel.2012-03-14-19.04.moin.txt | 20:22 |
| meetingology | Minutes (html): http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/xubuntu-devel/2012/xubuntu-devel.2012-03-14-19.04.html | 20:22 |
| knome | thanks everybody for attending | 20:22 |
| * knome needs to lay on the sofa for a while | 20:23 | |
| knome | i'll update the minutes after that | 20:24 |
| pleia2 | thanks knome :) | 20:25 |
| Unit193 | Great, thanks knome. | 20:25 |
| mr_pouit | (yeah, sorry, that was dinner time, a bit complicated to skip :P) | 20:31 |
| Unit193 | Why would you? | 20:31 |
| mr_pouit | to vote during the meeting ;D | 20:32 |
| * mr_pouit hides | 20:32 | |
| knome | minutes are up | 21:10 |
| knome | bbl | 21:10 |
| pleia2 | tweeted | 21:20 |
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