[16:13] wendar: ajmitch: stgraber: ping [16:14] Someone on G+ is asking for some clarification about what his package should put in /opt/ [16:14] https://plus.google.com/108728447943307421833/posts [16:15] can one of you give him an answer, of give me the answer and I'll give it to him [16:15] http://paste.ubuntu.com/884992/ is you can't see that [16:16] mhall119: in most cases, it's simply everything except the .desktop file [16:17] mhall119: we also now allow /usr/share/doc/ but it's debhelper's default anyway so I don't think I ever saw someone actually put them in /opt (we always had to do it for them) [16:40] stgraber: so the binary goes in /opt/ too? [16:41] and the .desktop just points to it there? [16:43] mhall119: yes [16:44] stgraber: how about icons? Do they all go into /opt/ too, and if so does GTK know to find them there if you reference them by name instead of path? [16:44] mhall119: "everything" :) [16:44] ok [16:44] thanks, I'll let him know [16:44] mhall119: you need to put the path in the .desktop for it to work [16:45] for Exec only, or Exec and Icon? [16:46] both [16:46] gtk doesn't know to look in /opt and we don't really want it to either [16:47] the whole idea behind using /opt is to avoid having any of them automatically found/loaded by the OS unless you're calling them by their path [16:47] ok [19:42] mhall119: there are more details at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppReviewBoard/Review/Guidelines [19:43] I forgot to ask about chairs for the next meeting at the end of last month's meeting [19:43] (I've added it back into the end of the agenda, so I'll remember in the future) [19:44] Anyone want to volunteer? [19:44] * ajmitch checked next meeting date [19:44] we're keeping it at the same UTC time? [19:44] yeah, same time [19:44] ok, I can do it then [19:44] cool, thanks! [19:44] next month I'll be back to UTC+12 [19:45] love those international daylight saving time shifts :) [19:46] yeah, it's just great :) [19:46] I recovered some lost action items [19:46] oh, what'd we miss? [19:46] apparently our "emergency" meeting in January wiped out several pending action items [19:46] I had one to ask about the deprecation cycle for python-support [19:46] ok, I did follow up with dpitkin at least :) [19:47] (I've just emailed doko and barry to check in on that) [19:47] lfaraone had one about python-support in Quickly [19:48] actually, in python-distutils-extra, which Quickly uses [19:48] https://bugs.launchpad.net/python-distutils-extra/+bug/894582 [19:48] I asked about #927588, #915902, #926032 to see if he'd prioritise getting those 3 fixed [19:48] you had one about asking (someone, I'm not sure who) about ARB packages depending on backports [19:49] but, I'm pretty sure the answer to that one is "no" [19:49] at least, if it came to a vote, I'd be against ARB packages depending on backports [19:49] right, I asked broder & michag about the state of that, it's ok for runtime dependencies, but there's a LP bug that blocks build-dependencies [19:50] ah, okay [19:50] I remember, it was a question of whether it was even possible for ARB packages to depend on backports [19:50] should we keep a note of that somewhere? [19:50] right, but we mostly wanted it for the case of new libraries being added via backports, iirc [19:51] yup [19:51] https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/888665 is the LP bug, it's due to it using an ancient forked sbuild [19:51] so, to say if it's safe, and non-disruptive, we could have an ARB depend on a backported library [19:52] if it's a new library, and not an updated version of an existing library in the old release [19:52] it'd just be hard to build against that library [19:52] so, at this point we'd be stuck with runtime python libraries [19:53] and no build-time C, etc libraries [19:53] actually a new library would likely work [19:53] since the PPA can have backports dependencies turned on, and the backports version would be the only version to satisfy the requirement, it ought to work :) [19:54] i.e. it's hard to give a one-size-fits all answer [19:54] yeah [19:54] How about this addition to the ARB guidelines: right after "If your app depends on external libraries, please make sure that your app runs on the current versions shipped in Ubuntu." [19:56] we do currently have "Applications must be able to be built with tools & libraries in the Ubuntu archive. Apps may bundle additional libraries they depend on, but may not include new versions of already packaged libraries." [19:56] we add "(We're open to considering dependencies on backported libraries, on a case-by-case basis, only if the backport is a new library and not an updated version of an existing library.) [19:56] ok [19:57] that leaves it open for the devs to either bundle the library or backport it [19:57] with the same effect, they can only depend on existing libraries, or a new library [19:57] but not updated versions of existing libraries [19:58] that's fair - no depending on a new version of Qt & boost :) [19:58] * wendar shudders ;) [19:58] it'd be nice to get the LP bug fixed, but it's not a simple fix that just anyone can pick up & do, I suspect [20:11] wendar: so I didn't really get round to doing any ARB work last night (wasn't feeling great), but I've pushed the icon change I did yesterday to the staging PPA & my branch, if you have time to take a look [20:12] once we vote on it I'll need to know the right buttons to push in myapps to get it published :) [20:13] ajmitch: sure, I'll take a look [20:13] thanks [20:17] ajmitch: in override_dh_gencontrol, you do need to keep that cp line [20:17] ajmitch: it's obtuse, but what that does is copy the image *outside* the package directory [20:17] ajmitch: so it can be added to the package metadata [20:18] (stgraber had to fix one of my earlier packages) [20:18] right, that is a bit special [20:18] but this is why I'm checking with you first, thanks :) [20:19] it does mean I have to bump the ppa version again, which is a bit of a pain [20:19] you can use $CURDIR [20:20] see http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~allison/+junk/extras-framingham/revision/13 [20:21] in which case I ought to put it in the debian/directory as well [20:26] I like the way you've used patches for all changes outside the debian/ directory [20:27] in the debian/changelog, merge his changes and yours into one changelog entry (since there's only one Extras release) [20:27] you can note who did what with [ Author Name ] [20:28] and a quick scan of postinst and postrm, I wonder if they could be removed? [20:29] we don't technically allow custom maintainer scripts, but this looks like standard desktop stuff [20:29] probably automatically generated [20:29] this is what I was checking with stgraber - they're boilerplate postinst/postrm [20:31] with debhelper 8, a lot of stuff that used to be in generated maintainer scripts is now handled automatically behind the scenes [20:32] yeah, I was debating whether they'd be needed at all due to the non-standard directories [20:32] not sure that's the case with these specific pieces, but seems worth checking [20:32] ah, yeah, I noticed one of the commands was acting on /usr/share/icons/gnome [20:33] which we don't modify [20:33] so, that one could certainly go [20:33] the mime database is modifying /usr/share/mime, which we don't modify [20:35] right, stripped out all but #DEBHELPER# [20:35] let's see, update-desktop-database modifies the cache of MIME types handled by desktop files, so that can go too [20:35] cool, yeah, makes sense [20:37] ajmitch: overall, it looks great. I'd +1 it. [20:37] good, it's nearly all cielak's work, so thank him for a good submission :) [20:37] thanks, cielak! [20:38] no problem, did my best to get it as good as I could ;) [20:48] cielak: it does make our lives easier, I'll put this up for vote & we should be able to get it uploaded :) [20:48] nice! thanks for handling that :) [20:51] * ajmitch could really do with some more RAM, running a couple of VMs doesn't help when firefox & chrome are both open [21:14] ajmitch: yeah, both firefox and chrome are total memory hogs, very annoying [21:22] especially the way I use them, where I often can't see the icons on the chrome tabs because I have so many open :) [22:08] wendar: just checking, you marked the next meeting as the 23rd rather than the 30th? [22:09] ajmitch: well, that's what Ubuntu Fridge says [22:09] ajmitch: but it could be wrong [22:09] that seems a bit broken, it's meant to be the last friday of the month [22:09] ajmitch: is it supposed to be... ah yea [22:09] who sets up the fridge calendar entry? [22:09] Fridge won't let me do anything more complicated than "3rd Friday" [22:09] great :) [22:09] anyone who has access can edit it [22:10] it doesn't allow 5th friday? [22:10] go ahead and update the wiki page [22:10] I suspect it would just drop off the calendar when there is no 5th friday [22:10] what we want is the -1th friday :) [22:11] the 30th actually works better for me this month, I won't have to rush out after the meeting to drive to Seattle [22:14] * ajmitch can see where to add an event, but it looks to only be editable by its creator, sorry :) [22:39] ajmitch: I think I actually can't edit it anymore, I only had admin priviledges on my canonical google account, which is gone now [22:39] ajmitch: but, I'll find someone else to edit it [22:39] now that is a pain [22:40] your membership application is coming up in a meeting today, isn't it? [22:40] ah, yeah [22:40] if I get membership I'll see about getting calendar editing access again [22:41] or, you or stgraber could get it [22:47] * ajmitch shall try & be around at meeting time [23:45] stgraber: thanks for looking at harmonySEQ - the postinst/postrm aren't empty unless debhelper is not putting anything in them - I thought that I'd leave in the #DEBHELPER# tags for now [23:47] ajmitch: it's probably safe to remove them entirely [23:47] ajmitch: I've been erring on the side of "rip it out" for ARB apps, just on the general principle of "they're supposed to be dumb and simple" [23:48] fair enough [23:48] I don't think there are any dh calls in the package at this time which put anything in postinst [23:52] * ajmitch shall see if he can get it to ~ppa99 before it even makes it into extras [23:55] I see you've got a couple of other testimonials from some well-known ubuntu contributors now