[05:12] <Guest38077> oops
[05:27] <nick_issues> how long am I going to have to wait for it to time out
[06:37] <Kilos> morning all
[06:37] <Kilos> Maaz, coffee on
[06:37]  * Maaz washes some mugs
[06:41] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for Kilos!
[06:41] <Kilos> Maaz, ty
[06:41] <Maaz> You are welcome Kilos
[06:43] <Kilos> later
[07:23] <superfly> hi Kilos
[07:25] <Kilos> hi there superfly dLimit and others
[07:27] <Kilos> gonna try irssi on this xubuntu as xchat is stom
[07:38] <dLimit> Goeie more
[07:38] <Kilos> dag se
[07:39] <Kilos> hi Banlam 
[07:39] <Banlam> gday
[07:42] <Kilos> yay
[07:51] <Kilos> gc morning
[07:51] <gc> hi there
[08:03] <Kilos> hi nlsthzn 
[08:03] <nlsthzn> Hey uncle Kilos 
[08:15] <Kilos> later guys
[09:52] <Kilos> Maaz, coffee on
[09:52]  * Maaz flips the salt-timer
[09:52] <Kilos> inetpro, hiya
[09:52] <nlsthzn> maaz should flip the coffee timer :/
[09:52] <Kilos> ha ha ha
[09:53] <Kilos> i wonder why he didnt answer you nlsthzn 
[09:53] <Kilos> should must mean something else to him
[09:53] <nlsthzn> Like life I guess he has dedided to ignore me :p
[09:53] <Kilos> still no news on permit?
[09:54] <nlsthzn> nope... and today if our "Friday" if you like and I am supposed to start working again Saturday >.<
[09:56] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for Kilos!
[09:56] <Kilos> Maaz, ty
[09:56] <Maaz> You are welcome Kilos
[10:28] <Kilos> eish nlsthzn  thats not nice
[10:28] <nlsthzn> :(
[10:29] <Kilos> is there no one you can fone to get things moving
[10:29] <Kilos> or get your works head to call the permit peeps
[10:31] <nlsthzn> :) it is now in the hands of the goverment - the Critical National Infrastructure Authority (CNIA) - Basically the army :/
[10:32] <Kilos> eish and they in no hurry if they like saudi
[10:32] <nlsthzn> I have heard horror stories...
[10:32] <Kilos> tell
[10:35] <nlsthzn> :) well I have heard of two seperate instances where guys where waiting for months to get their passes... lucky for them they where Arab (not local but still from the ME) so I am sure they will get away with it...
[10:35] <nlsthzn> for a South African I doubt I will still have a job if that happens :/
[10:36] <Kilos> eish
[10:36] <Kilos> and you not allowed to do pj's either without a permit hey?
[10:37] <nlsthzn> pj?
[10:37] <Kilos> private jobs
[10:37] <Kilos> or do pc repairs etc from home
[10:39] <nlsthzn> oh I can do what I like I guess... then again I am stuck in the middle of nowhere and there is basically nothing else to do ... lol ... oh well... I guess the wait continues and the Rum is finished @#$@#$
[10:39] <Kilos> ai
[10:40] <Kilos> that never helped anything for more than a night
[10:40] <nlsthzn> lol... but it tastes good and if you have enough it lasts many nights 
[10:40] <nlsthzn> just kidding however
[10:41] <Kilos> lol
[10:41] <nlsthzn> we have been unable to get out liquor licenses as well... this company is full of ****
[10:41] <Kilos> them peeps dont drink at all i think
[10:42] <Kilos> im sure boet said alcohol was illegal in saudi
[10:43] <nlsthzn> yup
[10:43] <nlsthzn> here it is allowed
[10:43] <nlsthzn> tollerated is a better word I guess
[10:43] <Kilos> lol oh yours are the decadent ones
[10:44] <nlsthzn> they allow it for non muslims in any case :)
[11:04] <Kilos> bbl
[12:57] <zeref> hmmmm
[14:30] <Kilos> afternoon all
[14:30] <Kilos> nearly home time
[14:31] <Kilos> Maaz, coffee on
[14:31]  * Maaz puts the kettle on
[14:34] <Kilos> hi psydroid 
[14:35] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for Kilos!
[14:35] <Kilos> Maaz, ty
[14:35] <Maaz> You are welcome Kilos
[14:59] <Kilos> bb tonite
[17:57] <Kilos> eveningall
[17:57] <Kilos> sjoe disappearing space bar
[18:00] <superfly> hi Kilos
[18:00] <Kilos> hiya superfly 
[18:15] <Symmetria> http://www.zastore.co.za/displays.php
[18:15] <Symmetria> should I go buy myself one of those
[18:16] <Symmetria> I really want one of those, look at the resolution, but holy shit, look at the price tag
[18:25] <zeref_debian> hmmmm
[18:26] <Symmetria> heh, seriously, thats probably the best monitor Ive seen for sale in .za
[18:29] <zeref_debian> sigh
[18:29] <zeref_debian> Symmetria: get it :)
[18:31] <zeref_debian> hmmm, everytime debian boots time starts at 18:22
[18:48] <magespawn> evening all
[18:56] <Kilos> hiya magespawn 
[18:57] <superfly> hiya magespawn
[18:58] <magespawn> Whats up peeps?
[18:59] <Kilos> prices
[18:59] <Kilos> they reckon petrol going up another 64c a litre most likely so everythings prices gonna join in
[19:04] <Kilos> Maaz, coffee on
[19:04]  * Maaz washes some mugs
[19:04] <magespawn> Well if that is not the best news I have had all day then I do not know what is.
[19:04] <Kilos> ha ha ha. you so funny at times
[19:05] <Kilos> petrol alone is on its way to crippling us
[19:06] <Kilos> otherwise the sun shone down lekker all day
[19:06] <magespawn> On the plus side, we can all get a lot fitter, and telecomute will become a way of life
[19:07] <Kilos> yeah
[19:08] <Maaz> Coffee's ready for Kilos!
[19:08] <Kilos> otherwise xubuntu xchat still sucks
[19:08] <Kilos> Maaz, danke
[19:08] <Maaz> Bitteschön
[19:09] <Kilos> im sure there is something busted in my conf files
[19:09] <Kilos> but dpkg cant sort it either 
[19:09] <Kilos> yet
[19:09] <Kilos> will fix it or die trying
[19:10] <Kilos> hows things with you magespawn 
[19:11] <magespawn> Trying to get filezilla ftp server running at home
[19:11] <Kilos> why dont you use ubuntu server software
[19:12] <Kilos> is filezilla related to firefox?
[19:12] <Kilos> dunno where i got that idea
[19:14] <magespawn> I think was/is an add on for firefox
[19:14] <magespawn> This is on the windows machine but it is running apache and other open source server software
[19:15] <Kilos> and firewall and antivirus. sigh
[19:16] <Kilos> if its a local server for you ok but if you gonna let other peeps in i wouldnt trust it too far
[19:16] <Kilos> lo Banlam nuvolari 
[19:18] <Symmetria> lol
[19:18] <Symmetria> my damn puppy almost broke the glass sliding door attacking a ghecko 
[19:18] <Symmetria> again
[19:19] <Kilos> lol
[19:19] <Banlam> g'devening
[19:19] <Symmetria> lol, the ghecko gets on the other side of the glass and she growls and barks at it
[19:19] <Symmetria> and will sit there for hours watching it
[19:19] <Banlam> aren't animals adorable
[19:19] <Banlam> while you watch the dog
[19:19] <Symmetria> http://valhalla.clue.be/~vort/doggie4.jpg
[19:19] <Symmetria> look at that lol
[19:20] <Symmetria> I piled all sorts of shit infront of the door to stop her jumping up against it
[19:20]  * Banlam takes a pic of Symmetria watching his dog watch the gecko
[19:20] <Kerbero_> lol
[19:20] <kbmonkey> lo nuvolari Kilos Banlam Symmetria 
[19:20] <Kerbero_> banlam you stalker
[19:20] <kbmonkey> Kerbero_ o/
[19:20] <Symmetria> banlam lol my dog will haunt you
[19:20] <Kilos> hi kbmonkey welcome to ubuntu-za
[19:20] <Symmetria> she's spawn of satan
[19:20] <Symmetria> :p
[19:20] <Symmetria> have you seen her spawn of satan photo?
[19:21] <magespawn> Kilos it is just for home use at the moment
[19:21] <Banlam> Symmetria, yeah saw it last night
[19:21] <Symmetria> http://valhalla.clue.be/~vort/doggie3.jpg <[19:21] <Kerbero_> hello all
[19:21] <Symmetria> hehe
[19:21] <Banlam> what's her name btw?
[19:21] <Symmetria> Morocca, she was named by her previous owner 
[19:21] <Banlam> how long have you had her?
[19:21] <kbmonkey> i just boosted my wifi signal by coiling hi quality audio flex around the antenna. it works a treat
[19:21] <kbmonkey> thereifixedit :D
[19:21] <Symmetria> lol but she responds if you call her anything, she always knows when she's being called, I could stand outside and yell, COME HERE BREADBOARD and she'd still come :p
[19:22] <Symmetria> banlam only a week :)
[19:22] <Banlam> lol
[19:22] <Banlam> oh :P
[19:22] <Banlam> previous owner?
[19:22] <Kilos> hi Kerberos[home] 
[19:22] <Symmetria> some chick in capetown who advertised to rehome her on gumtree :p
[19:22] <Kerberos[home]> kilos :)
[19:22] <Banlam> why did she not want her?
[19:23] <Symmetria> lol I asked the chick why she was rehoming her, she said that when she got the pup she hadnt done enough research into the breed and the dog was 2 difficult to handle and had 2 much energy to cope with 
[19:23] <magespawn> And the gecko is on the outside.
[19:23] <Banlam> lol
[19:23] <Symmetria> banlam heh, she's a cross between a weimaraner and an australian kelpie, meaning that she has 2 base instincts, one is to herd things and the other is to hunt them
[19:23] <Symmetria> and she has endless endless energy
[19:24] <Kilos> open the door and teach the dog the gecko is outside
[19:24] <Symmetria> kilos haahah no, she already hunts way 2 many lizards, frogs and everything else that moves :P 
[19:24] <Kilos> hehe
[19:25] <Symmetria> I scolded her for chewing on something she wasnt meant to, she went outside for an hour, came back inside with a dead bird in her mouth, dropped it at my feet and lay down with it between her paws, as some kinda "I'm sorry" gift 
[19:25] <Kilos> frogs make then foam at the mouth then you think your dog is going mad
[19:25] <magespawn> Get a Jack Russell, and watch them tear the place apart.
[19:25]  * Kilos is a staffie fan
[19:25] <Symmetria> heh magespawn the difference between a jack russell and this one, a jack russell typically won't figure out how to open every door of every cupboard and the fridge :P
[19:25] <Symmetria> and is also 2 small to figure out it can jump on almost any table if there is something to steal :p
[19:26] <magespawn> Yup too small and a bit thick
[19:26] <Symmetria> had this pup 2 days and put a lock on the fridge, was the same deal with my weimaraners 
[19:26] <magespawn> Very good tracking dogs used for anti-poaching
[19:26] <Kerbero[home]> weimeraners!
[19:27] <Symmetria> heh kerbero lol they are my favorite breed 
[19:27] <Kerbero[home]> o
[19:28] <Symmetria> I had 2 previously before this one
[19:28] <Symmetria> except those didnt have kelpie in them
[19:28] <Kerbero[home]> hehe
[19:28] <Symmetria> lol though this pup is like 90% weimaraner, and the only kelpie bit in her seems to be her energy levels
[19:29] <Kerbero[home]> rather you than me
[19:29] <Symmetria> lol, she's awesome :)
[19:29] <Kerbero[home]> never thought about getting a cat?
[19:29] <Kerbero[home]> and taking over the world?
[19:30] <Symmetria> weimaraners are rather neurotic dogs, but their rep is just because people dont know how to handle them, they require someone who knows what they are doing 
[19:30] <Symmetria> cause typically a weimaraner gets incredibly attached to its owners, and they kinda freak out if they dont get enough attention or if their owners disappear for 2 long
[19:31] <Symmetria> and when a weimaraner is bored or not getting enough attention lol, you have trouble, they will tear shit up until someone gives them attention
[19:33] <Symmetria> heh I see the gauteng municipality wants to land itself in court
[19:34] <Symmetria> for violating the ECA :p
[19:38] <Kilos> ECA?
[19:39] <Kilos> dont give me a link please
[19:39] <Kerbero[home]> i also wondered
[19:39] <Kerbero[home]> :P
[19:40] <Kilos> Symmetria, ^^
[19:40] <kbmonkey> electronic communications act Kilos 
[19:40] <Kilos> ty kbmonkey you well lad. meds working?
[19:41] <kbmonkey> found it haliarious how the SOPA site used a background on their website that was not attributed to the artist
[19:41] <kbmonkey> blerrie hypocrites
[19:42] <Kilos> its like adverts. all use sexy chicks and sell completely unrelated products
[19:44] <Kilos> hilarious
[19:44] <Kilos> that looks closer
[19:44] <Kilos> Maaz, spell hilarious
[19:44] <Maaz> Kilos: Looks good to me
[19:48] <kbmonkey> clever bot
[19:52] <magespawn> How did they violate the ECa?
[19:52] <Symmetria> heh ECA = the telecommunications law 
[19:52] <Symmetria> magespawn because they banned more fiber deployments in gauteng 
[19:52] <Symmetria> and the ECA specifically says that any license holder has the right to lay fiber on *ANY* public land 
[19:52] <Symmetria> providing that htey clean up after themselves and give reasonable notice
[19:53] <Symmetria> it is *INCREDIBLY* clear about the rights of license holders and the johannesburg municipality has no legal right to refuse anyone the right to lay fiber
[19:53] <Banlam> what are there reasons for refusing them?
[19:53] <Banlam> *their
[19:53] <Symmetria> banlam they came out and said there is a blanket modatoriam on any new fiber in joburg 
[19:54] <magespawn> So the licensee can just go ahead then
[19:54] <Symmetria> that no one else other than themselves is allowed to lay anymore
[19:54] <kbmonkey> never realized there are quite a few unix shell accounts available online
[19:54] <Banlam> so their reason for this, is so the municipality can continue to lay fibre without any one lese?
[19:54] <Banlam> anyone else*
[19:54] <Symmetria> magespawn technically yes, but they could just dig it up again :P the licensees will see them in court shortly Im sure
[19:55] <Symmetria> apparently there is an urgent application for an interdict against the modatoriam being heard tomorrow in court
[19:55] <Symmetria> banlam basically thats what I believe it translates to, they arent stating what their reason is, but thats what it comes down to
[19:55] <magespawn> What a joke
[19:55] <Banlam> ic
[19:56] <magespawn> So somebodies brother can get the tender
[19:56] <Kilos> not moratorium
[19:56] <Symmetria> basically, they gonna get taken to court
[19:56] <Symmetria> and sued 
[19:57] <Symmetria> and are gonna lose and get saddled with a huge bill by the courts
[19:57] <Symmetria> cause they are getting sued for lost revenue and costs 
[19:57] <Kilos> Maaz, spell modatorium
[19:57] <Maaz> Kilos: Suggestions: Moratorium or moratorium
[19:57] <Symmetria> including I believe the salaries of the 4000+ people who cant work as a result of this
[19:57] <magespawn> Such a waste of time and public money
[19:58] <Banlam> what's wrong with moratorium?
[19:58] <magespawn> Bet they cannot go after the officials money directly
[19:58] <Banlam> nvrmnd
[19:58] <kbmonkey> that's some rigmarole
[19:58] <Symmetria> magespawn heh, the gauteng muncipality is going to find itself liable 
[19:58] <Symmetria> heh, the costs involved in putting 4000+ people outta work for a week
[19:59] <Symmetria> are... huge
[19:59] <magespawn> Which means the gauten g public
[19:59] <Symmetria> heh, on the higher end, you're looking at 15k per person, on the low end, a grand a person, so anywhere between 10 and 100 million worth of costs right there 
[19:59] <kbmonkey> do you think this would have not happend Symmetria if telecoms were privately owned?
[20:00] <kbmonkey> okay that's may be a rhetorical question ;) 
[20:00] <Symmetria> kbmonkey well, a lot of telecomms is privately owned
[20:00] <Symmetria> the problem is that the muncipalities want a piece of that pie 
[20:01] <kbmonkey> so I have it wrong that govt has 49% of rights in that pie
[20:01] <magespawn> Illegally
[20:01] <kbmonkey> like they always do. for the people.. like hell
[20:02] <Kilos> night all. sleep tight
[20:02] <Symmetria> kbmonkey yes
[20:02] <Symmetria> that is incorrect
[20:02] <magespawn> Through telkom but they r3fuse tus fiber because theymeed to recoup the cost of copper
[20:02] <Symmetria> a.) the government doesnt own much of neotel at all
[20:03] <Symmetria> and b.) the government shareholding of telkom is FAR less than 49%
[20:03] <Symmetria> its closer to like 36 I think
[20:05] <magespawn> But the 
[20:05] <magespawn> Major problemis the wasting of time and money
[20:05] <kbmonkey> okay so they dropped some shares. I shouldn't blurt out old info, could be disasterous
[20:06] <Symmetria> kbmonkey they aint owned 49% for a LONG time
[20:07] <Symmetria> direct government share holding is 38% 
[20:07] <Symmetria> though there is also the elephant consortium and thats where stuff gets confusing cause they own a whack of shares as well
[20:08] <Symmetria> fact is though, telkom is skirting the edges of bankcrupcy 
[20:08] <Kerbero[home]> you should just go bankrupt
[20:08] <Kerbero[home]> *they
[20:08] <Kerbero[home]> wow that is a bad typo
[20:08] <Symmetria> kerbero thats distinctly possible if they are made to pay the fine they are facing
[20:08] <Kerbero[home]> o
[20:08] <magespawn> lol
[20:08] <Symmetria> they are facing a fine of almost 3.5 billion 
[20:09] <Kerbero[home]> so telkom is maybe going to pay a fine?
[20:09] <Symmetria> kerbero they have already been found guilty 
[20:09] <Symmetria> the only question is how big is the fine gonna be
[20:09] <Kerbero[home]> hmm
[20:09] <kbmonkey> internet revolution!
[20:09] <Symmetria> and the recommendation from the tribunal that found them guilty is around 3.5 billion rand 
[20:09] <magespawn> Which will come from joe public again
[20:10] <Kerbero[home]> but i don't understand or did not follow, what is telkom guilty of
[20:10] <Kerbero[home]> except for that people out of work
[20:10] <Kerbero[home]> what did they do
[20:10] <Symmetria> kerbero anti-competitive practices in the DSL market 
[20:10] <Symmetria> basically inflating the price of IPC to keep other ISP's outta the game 
[20:10] <magespawn> They do not have that kind of money, do they?
[20:10] <Symmetria> well, that was the primary issue
[20:10] <Kerbero[home]> ahh
[20:11] <Kerbero[home]> ok
[20:11] <Symmetria> magespawn, heh, they USED to have that kinda money, they dont have any more
[20:11] <magespawn> And that still did not work anyway.
[20:11] <Symmetria> how it works is that the fine is based on 10% of annual revenue for the year in which hte offense happened
[20:11] <Symmetria> the year in question here happened to be before they sold vodacom
[20:11] <magespawn> Ouch
[20:11] <Symmetria> which means their annual turnover included the revenue flows from their 50% holding of vodacom
[20:11] <Symmetria> which was telkom's cashcow
[20:12] <magespawn> What are the options? Get vodacom to pay their share?
[20:12] <Symmetria> when Telkom sold off that 50% share in vodacom, they also had a TON of cash, and their shareholders wouldnt let them keep it
[20:12] <Symmetria> it was paid out by and large as a dividend
[20:12] <Symmetria> magespawn zero options there 
[20:12] <magespawn> Of course
[20:12] <Symmetria> vodacom isnt liable 
[20:13] <Symmetria> heh, the funny part is, Telkom had no real option but to sell vodacom, but without vodacom they are kinda screwed cause telkom made up more than 70% of their profit 
[20:13] <Symmetria> but they *HAD* to sell it, that wasnt optional at all 
[20:14] <Symmetria> heh you guys know the reason behind the sale of vodacom btw? the real reason?
[20:14] <Symmetria> its kinda a funny story :p
[20:14] <Symmetria> Vodacom board if I remeber correctly, was made up of 2 Telkom members, 2 Vodaphone members and 2 internal members inside Vodacom itself (or something like that, with that kinda distribution)
[20:15] <Symmetria> the guys inside vodacom decided they didnt like telkom
[20:15] <Symmetria> so they were always gonna vote with the other guys 
[20:15] <Symmetria> and basically, telkom as a result completely lost all control of what amounted to most of their revenue :P 
[20:15] <Symmetria> (well, thats the story out in the market, and I'd say chances are, its probably pretty accurate)
[20:16] <magespawn> Lol
[20:17] <Kerbero[home]> well done
[20:17] <magespawn> Brb
[20:18] <magespawn> Back
[20:19] <magespawn> Was 50% owned by Vodafone ?
[20:29] <Symmetria> magespawn something like that yeah
[20:31] <magespawn> Ahh well then
[20:31] <magespawn> Off to bed later all