[04:48] <Amoz> cjohnston, pong
[04:51] <cjohnston> Amoz: changes are live
[04:51] <cjohnston> summit.ubuntu.com
[05:07] <Amoz> cjohnston, Oh my GOD... it's HIDEOUS!
[13:13] <mhall119> daker_: how's the visa process going/
[13:13] <mhall119> ?
[13:15] <daker_> mhall119, applying for passport this week :/
[13:16] <mhall119> man, it's going to be tight for you, I hope you get it all done in time
[13:16] <daker_> mhall119, yes :/
[17:00] <Amoz> evening all
[17:02] <cjohnston> o/
[17:02] <Amoz> cjohnston, oh helo
[17:03] <Amoz> cjohnston, how are you connected to IRC? bouncer? screen?
[17:03] <Amoz> just curious if anyone has a nice setup to share
[17:05] <cjohnston> irssi on byobu
[17:05] <Amoz> ah
[17:05] <Amoz> cjohnston, it seems you sometimes can be online from your phone, without leaving/reconnecting
[17:06] <Amoz> are you using the same byobu/screen solution in that too?
[17:06] <Amoz> O_O
[17:06] <cjohnston> i have an app that i can connect to my servers irssi, yes
[17:21] <Amoz> my god
[17:21] <Amoz> isn't that kinda hard cjohnston ?
[17:21] <Amoz> screen on the cell? :P
[17:21] <Amoz> ctrl+a d
[17:21] <Amoz> etc
[17:21] <cjohnston> no
[17:21] <cjohnston> its a special aoo
[17:21] <cjohnston> app
[17:25] <Amoz> cjohnston, mind saying the name of it? :)
[17:26] <cjohnston> irssi connectbot
[17:27] <newz2000> the countdown banners are working, later today I'll get the countdown and wiki pages updated \o/
[17:27] <newz2000> things are working right on time this release
[17:28] <cjohnston> yay
[17:28] <cjohnston> newz2000: whats the URL for the banners
[17:28] <newz2000> well, you'll be able to get them all here http://www.ubuntu.com/community/countdown but for now that is a mishmash of last release's info with the first banner from this release
[17:29] <cjohnston> ahh
[17:29] <Amoz> newz2000, cool
[17:29] <newz2000> first: lunch
[17:29] <cjohnston> you don't need lunch
[17:29] <Amoz> is that the official ones?
[17:29]  * cjohnston says as his lunch will be ready in 3 minutes
[17:29] <newz2000> Amoz: yes
[17:30] <Amoz> newz2000, great
[17:30] <Amoz> :D
[17:30] <newz2000> cjohnston: you're right, I don't, but I do need to go for a walk
[17:30] <newz2000> and if I don't eat at least something then I'll get grumpy, so I'd better eat
[17:30] <cjohnston> lol
[17:30]  * Amoz takes newz2000 for a walk in the channel
[17:30] <cjohnston> wait, get?
[17:30] <cjohnston> sorry.. had to
[17:30] <cjohnston> :-)
[17:30] <newz2000> :-)
[17:30] <Amoz> lol
[17:30] <newz2000> Yeah, you should see it. It's bad.
[17:30] <cjohnston> you gonna be in CA?
[17:30] <newz2000> no, not this time around
[17:31] <cjohnston> :-(
[17:31] <newz2000> yeah, I know.
[18:31] <imbrandon> newz2000: :(
[18:31] <cjohnston> I know, right
[18:32] <imbrandon> cjohnston: someone jumped the gun on us in -accomplishments-webeditor and pulled ubuntu_website for a one theme
[18:32] <imbrandon> heh
[18:32] <imbrandon> i emailed and let em know what we had would be ready in a few days etc
[18:32] <cjohnston> nice
[18:32] <imbrandon> but thought it was funny
[18:35] <janos> hi
[18:35] <janos> is Brandon around?
[18:37] <imbrandon> me ?
[18:37] <imbrandon> ahh i just emailed you
[18:37] <imbrandon> and was just telling chris about it
[18:37] <janos> guys do you plan big changes to lp:ubuntu-community-webthemes/light-django-theme in the coming days
[18:37] <imbrandon> yes
[18:37] <janos> imbrandon: then it's definitely you ;)
[18:37] <janos> ok
[18:38] <janos> then we won't rush upgrading yet
[18:38] <imbrandon> you can have a sneek peek via the -refresh branch but even that will change alot
[18:38] <imbrandon> yea wait about a week-ish
[18:38] <imbrandon> just a few days
[18:38] <janos> no problem at all, and good to know!
[18:38] <imbrandon> its some pretty signifgant changes lots of updates
[18:39] <imbrandon> better css and MUCH easier to update again later
[18:39] <imbrandon> both for us and you
[18:39] <janos> sounds pretty awesome
[18:39] <imbrandon> liek you was talking aobut in the email
[18:39] <cjohnston> once I can talk imbrandon into doing it it will be done
[18:39] <cjohnston> lol
[18:40] <janos> well no rush guys
[18:40] <imbrandon> hahah the django part will be, will be a few more days on wordpress and drupal
[18:40] <imbrandon> ;)
[18:40] <imbrandon> janos: well we're using it for summit.u.c and some other things is whats pushing the time line so fast
[18:40] <imbrandon> so no worries there
[18:41] <janos> yeah I guess you have enough folks on your backs ;)
[18:41] <imbrandon> lol i dont , i jst growl at em
[18:41] <imbrandon> chris and newz2000 take all the heat :)
[18:41] <janos> haha, easier
[18:41] <janos> growl and sneer
[18:41] <imbrandon> :P
[18:43] <imbrandon> cjohnston: since your not on that mailing list here is what i sent btw
[18:43] <imbrandon> Thats actually a good move Janos, just got the step on me and chris as we're working on a major refresh to the community website themes ( all of them ) and this includes that problematic structure you spoke of and that is changed now and will roll out soon to this and the Django templates as well as Wordpress and Drupal templates too ( we have them all pulling from the base base templates now and done so in such a way it would have solve
[18:43] <imbrandon> But thats good, it means your about two weeks head of us there and we're all on the same page :)
[18:43] <imbrandon> fyi
[18:43] <newz2000> imbrandon: yeah, so much heat I had to take my jacket off
[18:43] <imbrandon> hehe
[18:44] <newz2000> imbrandon: iirc, you're in KC aren't you?
[18:44] <imbrandon> yup
[18:44] <imbrandon> you just north of here
[18:44] <imbrandon> i think
[18:44] <newz2000> yeah, Des Moines
[18:45] <imbrandon> yup just a little bit, what 3 or 4 hours ?
[18:45] <newz2000> I think I could make it to the Royals stadium in 3 hyours
[18:45] <imbrandon> maybe a bit more
[18:45] <imbrandon> ahh wowo
[18:45] <imbrandon> ok
[18:45] <imbrandon> yea i'm like 2 mnites from the stadiums
[18:45] <imbrandon> i live on that side of town
[18:46] <newz2000> I don't get down there too often. Most winters at this time when we have a bit of snow on the ground yet and you're getting tulips then I wish I was there, but this year everyone got spring early.
[18:47] <imbrandon>  Jordan Mantha just took a job here in KC and is herre now too
[18:47] <imbrandon> not sure if you konw or know of him
[18:47] <newz2000> I've seen the name
[18:47] <imbrandon> a long long time MOTU and edubuntu guy
[18:48] <newz2000> oh, I do remember him
[18:48] <imbrandon> its funny he loved in reno nv same time as me, and now i came back to kc and he moved here for a job
[18:48] <newz2000> stalker
[18:48] <imbrandon> he;s actually a chemistry professor, got a doctorate in it in reno
[18:48] <imbrandon> i was like wow
[18:49] <imbrandon> but yea iirc me and him are the only other ones near here, i think there is one or two more in stl
[18:49] <imbrandon> but thats a ways off
[18:50] <imbrandon> as for as "offical" conrtibutors of any kind
[18:50] <newz2000> There is a kernel guy who works in Canonical on the KS side
[18:50] <imbrandon> i'm sure there are thousands of users
[18:50] <imbrandon> oh really ?
[18:50] <imbrandon> and yea jordan is on the kansas side in olathe actually
[18:50]  * newz2000 strains to remember who
[18:50] <imbrandon> not ben is it
[18:50] <imbrandon> benc
[18:50] <newz2000> no, he's long gone
[18:50] <imbrandon> kk thought so
[18:51] <imbrandon> yea i actually worked with him at the next job he had
[18:51] <imbrandon> after canonical
[18:51] <imbrandon> it was funny as hell
[18:51] <imbrandon> got hired and then looked ( only 3 other employeees ) and benc was their kernel hacker
[18:51] <imbrandon> heh
[18:51] <imbrandon> so for a few months worked with him ( short gig )
[18:52] <newz2000> Seth Forshee in Olathe
[18:52] <imbrandon> ahh not aware of him i dont think , might have to poke him and say hi
[18:52] <imbrandon> i bet we get lots more soon though
[18:52] <newz2000> oh?
[18:53] <imbrandon> fiber is almost done being laid
[18:53] <newz2000> google fiber?
[18:53] <newz2000> :-)
[18:53] <imbrandon> we;re the pilot city for google fiber
[18:53] <imbrandon> yea
[18:53] <newz2000> Yeah, I'm quite jealous of that
[18:53] <imbrandon> 100gig for 80 bux
[18:53] <imbrandon> syncronus
[18:53] <newz2000> wow, only $80?
[18:53] <imbrandon> yup, cuty is subsidiing it ontop of google subsies
[18:54] <imbrandon> and scholls and gov and uni get it free
[18:54] <imbrandon> and its both kc mo and kc k now
[18:54] <newz2000> oh, I didn't know it jumped the border
[18:54] <imbrandon> but the tech arround here is all in kc k , olathe really, or overland park
[18:54] <imbrandon> yup yup, the mayor pulled hella strings to get it to
[18:55] <newz2000> I wonder if you'll be able to get a static IP
[18:55] <imbrandon> its gonna even hit a few major suburbs
[18:55] <newz2000> they must be doing something to keep people from running servers
[18:55] <imbrandon> on the business you can
[18:55] <imbrandon> they already said that you can they are kinda encouraging it
[18:55] <imbrandon> they want the "next gen web to be born on this netwerok"
[18:55] <imbrandon> so will allow things normally they wouldent
[18:56] <newz2000> yeah, I guess that would be hard if they locked it down
[18:56] <imbrandon> yea
[18:56] <imbrandon> but thats hella sweet for someone like me :)
[18:56] <newz2000> yeah, I've got a few servers running here in my house
[18:56] <imbrandon> i'm gonna be takin full advantagfe of it any way i can, all ready been buying xservs and mac pros to hook up
[18:56] <imbrandon> when its live :)
[18:57] <newz2000> Careful of your power bill. ;-)
[18:57] <imbrandon> heh yea
[18:57] <imbrandon> i used to work at a mom and pop isp back in the day and he had two full racks at his house
[18:57] <imbrandon> and a t3 ( mid ninties )
[18:57] <imbrandon> it was the shit
[18:57] <newz2000> no doubt
[18:57] <imbrandon> but electricity was outragious
[18:58] <imbrandon> i rember surfin on that thing, and i had to use windows cuz we couldnt get the nic or video working in redhat 3
[18:58] <imbrandon> lol
[18:59] <imbrandon> and i learned linux there actually bcause the radious server was a linux box, but mail and we was win ( ipswitch mail )
[18:59] <imbrandon> and learned how to make a squid reverse proxy
[18:59] <imbrandon> man i thought i was the bomb
[18:59] <imbrandon> lol
[18:59] <newz2000> you were. ;-)
[18:59] <imbrandon> ( i was like 16 )
[18:59] <newz2000> That's the beauty of stuff today. YOu can get an 8 core server with 16+G of RAM for $1k. Same power as 1 5 year old server and better performance than 4 of them.
[18:59] <imbrandon> and learning all that crap
[18:59] <imbrandon> yup
[19:00] <imbrandon> i rember at home hooking up a pentium 60
[19:00] <imbrandon> to a nother 486 via nic
[19:00] <imbrandon> cuz i could dial out on the 486
[19:00] <newz2000> ah yeah
[19:00] <imbrandon> but not make the modem work in the p60 in linux
[19:01] <imbrandon> so i dialed up on the 486 and surfed on the console lynx on linux
[19:01] <imbrandon> trying to find vga drivers
[19:01] <imbrandon> lol
[19:01] <imbrandon> man o man that was the days, never wanna go back again
[19:01] <imbrandon> lol
[19:02] <newz2000> It was fun having so much free time
[19:02] <imbrandon> yea
[19:02] <imbrandon> seemed like it never ended
[19:02] <imbrandon> but now i am good to have 30 inutes "free"
[19:02] <imbrandon> and even then i dont rember haf the things i said i would do when i get a moment
[19:02] <imbrandon> lol
[19:03] <newz2000> we're old. Gotta sleep now days.
[19:03] <imbrandon> lol yea
[19:03] <imbrandon> i am feeling old latly though, not tooo bad, but damn my daughter turns 16 in a few months
[19:03] <imbrandon> i thouht about that and was like ummm wow
[19:04] <imbrandon> she should still be 5
[19:04] <imbrandon> :)
[19:05] <newz2000> imbrandon: do you ever hear the term "silicon prairie" in your area?
[19:05] <imbrandon> i seen it on the cover of ink
[19:05] <imbrandon> one time
[19:05] <imbrandon> but never hear it spken
[19:06] <imbrandon> inks that city paper where the whores in the back ( did i say that out loud ? )
[19:06] <imbrandon> like thrift nickel
[19:06] <newz2000> There's a big movement here in DSM and Omaha to raise awareness of the geek computer culture
[19:06] <newz2000> and they've moved into your area
[19:06] <newz2000> Was curious if they were catching on
[19:06] <imbrandon> ahhh i bet its comming then
[19:07] <imbrandon> its probably die to in part the google stuff, they are really pushing that culture here now
[19:07] <newz2000> Check out Silicon Prairie News
[19:07] <imbrandon> and there is a google sr VP in overland park , alone in  an office ( shes hot too, shhh ) but they say they dont plan on putting an office here
[19:07] <imbrandon> i dont see how they cant
[19:08] <imbrandon> i mean it is the pilot city
[19:08] <imbrandon> :)
[19:08] <imbrandon> like have you seen getkansasonline.com ?
[19:08] <newz2000> Probably all run by contractors
[19:08] <newz2000> why on earth would I see that? :-)
[19:08] <imbrandon> yea but i mean long term stuff , i guess that too
[19:08] <imbrandon> though
[19:09]  * newz2000 looks
[19:09] <newz2000> I'm actually rendering video right now and the only thing that isn't slow is the terminal and irc
[19:09] <imbrandon> hehe take a look, google giving away free hosting and more ( like more than the normal app hosting )
[19:09] <imbrandon> to kansas business in prep
[19:09] <newz2000> oh, yeah, they're doing that here too
[19:09] <imbrandon> yea
[19:09] <newz2000> targeting small businesses with no IT staff mostly
[19:09] <imbrandon> and i think oh who is it
[19:09] <imbrandon> the money appp
[19:10] <imbrandon> yea
[19:10] <imbrandon> the money app is in on it too
[19:10] <imbrandon> ahh crap drawing a blank
[19:10] <imbrandon> quickbooks, intuit
[19:10] <newz2000> ah, yes
[19:10] <newz2000> "money app"
[19:10] <imbrandon> quickbooks spnsors bying the domain
[19:11] <imbrandon> and the cool thing is its $1 a month hosting and free for a year and you get a free .com but its not sleexzy
[19:11] <imbrandon> as in you own it from day one
[19:11] <imbrandon> and can cancle for even paying a dollar and get the dot come free and clear
[19:11] <imbrandon> shhhhh
[19:11] <imbrandon> dont let that get out
[19:11] <newz2000> I'm doing OK on domains for the moment.
[19:11] <newz2000> A few too many, actually. :-)
[19:11] <imbrandon> but like for real, i bought apple-repair-store.com that way to test it
[19:12] <imbrandon> hahah yea me too
[19:12] <imbrandon> i counded like 2 nights ago and i got 42 right now
[19:12] <imbrandon> thouht that was a great number
[19:12] <imbrandon> lol
[19:12] <imbrandon> counted*
[19:12] <newz2000> Until recently I've always used godaddy and I tell you, it is hard to let them expire
[19:12] <imbrandon> yea
[19:12] <newz2000> they mail you, call you, email you
[19:13] <imbrandon> i still use godady as registrar, been too lazy to change em
[19:13] <imbrandon> but dns etc is all at cloudflare or linode
[19:13] <imbrandon> yea and let you renew like 2 months after its done
[19:13] <imbrandon> crazy
[19:14] <imbrandon> i got 4 right now i'm intentionally letting expire and yea , its in the mid of all that mess
[19:14] <imbrandon> some .infos
[19:14] <imbrandon> i let all them go, not worth the effort
[19:15] <imbrandon> who do you use now, i need to not be lazy and stand up for sopa etc
[19:15] <imbrandon> maybe i will this week
[19:15] <imbrandon> heh
[19:15] <newz2000> gotta remember...
[19:15] <newz2000> namecheap
[19:15] <imbrandon> ahh kk, yea i've seen them round
[19:16] <imbrandon> even thought about getting a twocows reseller acct but i figured i better not
[19:16] <newz2000> I've only used them on a couple so not convinced I'll use them for everything, but so far so good
[19:16] <imbrandon> i buy tooo many already
[19:16] <imbrandon> some ppl collect pens, i seem to collect domains
[19:17] <imbrandon> and take for ever to devlop them into something
[19:17] <imbrandon> like when you get a sec check out the landing pages on pixeldrop.net and websitedevops.com , those and brandonholtsclaw.com are my current pet prohjects
[19:18] <imbrandon> and they look good but just a landing page for ohhhhh 3 months now
[19:18] <imbrandon> a mancanic never works on his own cars ? heh
[19:18] <newz2000> yeah
[19:19] <imbrandon> i do got a solid idea thogh for websitedevops.com gonna turn it into a juju devops gther forum
[19:19] <imbrandon> hopefully
[19:20] <imbrandon> least thats the plan
[19:20] <imbrandon> and i got drupal half bult for it
[19:20] <imbrandon> just need to finish
[19:20] <imbrandon> :)
[19:20] <newz2000> yes, that is my prob too
[19:20] <imbrandon> and pixeldrop still not quite sute, but something along the lines of a personal brand for me and my web stuff
[19:20] <newz2000> I have a 90% complete "best eggrool/pizza/bbq" set of apps.
[19:21] <imbrandon> :)
[19:21] <newz2000> Did you know that in the english speaking world outside the US they're not called eggrolls,
[19:21] <newz2000> they're called springrolls?
[19:21] <newz2000> So now I have to localize my app. :-/
[19:22] <imbrandon> but i liked the pixeldrop logo, actually drew it before i bought the domain and it was a nice play on the drupal drop stuff
[19:22] <imbrandon> hahaha right
[19:22] <newz2000> it is a slick logo
[19:22] <imbrandon> yea i was goofin off in photoshop and kinda accidently did something similar and then just refined it
[19:23] <imbrandon> its like the only logo logo i think i ever have done
[19:23] <imbrandon> but i like it
[19:23] <newz2000> imbrandon: what are you doing for a day job?
[19:23] <imbrandon> interviewing
[19:23] <imbrandon> :)
[19:23] <newz2000> ah. What for?
[19:23] <imbrandon> sriously i just left a drupal gig like 3 weeks ago kinda takkin it easy till uds
[19:23] <imbrandon> was the plan
[19:23] <imbrandon> :)
[19:24] <newz2000> gotcha
[19:24] <imbrandon> then after hitting the payvent hard
[19:24] <imbrandon> maybe even there a bit with some of the vendors :)
[19:24] <imbrandon> shh
[19:24] <newz2000> i know a lot of people who got jobs at/through uds
[19:24] <imbrandon> http://bholtsclaw.github.com/resume/ :)
[19:24] <newz2000> take some cards with your name/number if you can
[19:25] <imbrandon> yea, every uds i've been to they are craling with companies recruiting
[19:25] <imbrandon> esp since it will be near the valey
[19:25] <imbrandon> yea
[19:25] <newz2000> imbrandon: did you design/build this resume?
[19:25] <newz2000> oh, "yes I coded by hand
[19:26] <imbrandon> Already got some HP guy emailing me cuz of the OMGubntu stuff
[19:26] <imbrandon> lol
[19:26]  * newz2000 sees the source
[19:26] <imbrandon> yea
[19:26] <imbrandon> LOL
[19:26] <imbrandon> seee
[19:26] <imbrandon> that was worth it then
[19:26] <imbrandon> :)
[19:26] <imbrandon> i wondered if ppl looked
[19:26] <imbrandon> your the first to mention it though
[19:26] <imbrandon> but its new
[19:26] <imbrandon> like 2 weeks or less old
[19:26] <imbrandon> so not many looked yet
[19:27] <imbrandon> yea i wanna make it darker
[19:27] <imbrandon> more the blue color on brandonholtsclaw.com
[19:27] <newz2000> I was inspecting the HTTP headers for http://automattic.com/ one time and saw they've got something similar there.
[19:27] <newz2000> HEAD http://automattic.com/
[19:27] <imbrandon> but i finished it in a rush that night because i had a it recruoter in stl on my ass
[19:28] <imbrandon> stayed up till 3am and did it all in one night
[19:28] <Amoz> imbrandon, wow, did you design that?
[19:28] <imbrandon> Amoz: little photoshop and alot of Espresso.app and Zend studo
[19:28] <imbrandon> :)
[19:29]  * Amoz making a note about use imbrandon's PS skills next time he wants a website design
[19:29] <imbrandon> i r full stack dev, from css to js to core php guts , i'll tear it all down
[19:29] <imbrandon> pixeldrop.net has a bit more of my ps skills
[19:29] <imbrandon> ( one image )
[19:30] <imbrandon> the icons at the bottom of my resume i yanked from someehre
[19:30] <imbrandon> i forget where
[19:30] <imbrandon> but they are juist social icons
[19:30] <imbrandon> dime a dozen
[19:30] <imbrandon> newz2000: not seeing the header on auttomaic
[19:30] <imbrandon> what am i missing
[19:31] <imbrandon> you mean the real http header respo, or the <header>
[19:33] <imbrandon> Amoz: i'm much much more skilled at core php and php logic etc etc , and making webservers fast, but i can and do the front end stuff tooo, too many neew devs focus on one end, i like the whole stack, thus i call my self a "full stack developer" not many are , and even less are good at it, i like to think i am
[19:33] <imbrandon> :)
[19:34] <imbrandon> bending drupal and wordpress to my will is fun :)
[19:34] <Amoz> imbrandon, just curious, did you learn anything the academic way, or is everything homemade knowledge?
[19:35] <imbrandon> like the first thing i do on a drupal site is add my own preboot.inc.php to fire BEFORE drupal bootstrap.inc that normaly isnt possible but i do it and without hacking core or using php,ini prepend file :)
[19:35] <imbrandon> Amoz: home made, started in the mid nighies as a teen and never stopped
[19:35] <imbrandon> ninties
[19:35] <imbrandon> almost 34 now :)
[19:36] <Amoz> and you have a 16 yo daughter?
[19:36] <imbrandon> always refresh and renew the skills
[19:36] <imbrandon> yea i was a teen my self almost 18
[19:36] <imbrandon> heh
[19:36] <Amoz> wow
[19:36] <imbrandon> was  a little hellyeaon to say the least in my younger years
[19:36] <Amoz> don't know if this is a question I'm allowed to ask, if so just tell me, but, was it planned? :)
[19:37] <imbrandon> lots of stuff i souldne t have done etc, but wouldent trade my kiddo for nothin
[19:37] <imbrandon> ohhh no
[19:37] <imbrandon> was an oops for sure
[19:37] <Amoz> i guess one of the best oops
[19:37] <imbrandon> :)
[19:37] <Amoz> I hope you're raising her with ubuntu
[19:38] <imbrandon> some times they are , kids are a pain at times but nothing like them in the world
[19:38] <Amoz> that's what they keep tellin me
[19:38] <imbrandon> oh yea, welll on the server , she uses a macbook air at school
[19:38] <Amoz> hah, she has a server?
[19:38] <imbrandon> i think i'm still the only core dev that runs osx on the desktop
[19:39] <imbrandon> yea she has her own file server
[19:39] <imbrandon> and she piddles with web stuff
[19:39] <imbrandon> looks like geocities but shes learning
[19:39] <imbrandon> :)
[19:39] <Amoz> ^^

[19:39] <imbrandon> she actually like photograhy and photoshop more than coe though
[19:39] <imbrandon> but like her dad she CAN shell script if needed
[19:40] <imbrandon> its funny when she fixes crontabs for her mom
[19:40] <Amoz> lol
[19:40] <imbrandon> and gets a nasty look :)
[19:40] <imbrandon> i love it
[19:40] <imbrandon> ( me and her mom are divored long ago )
[19:43] <Amoz> imbrandon, ah, i see.. from one thing to another, are you developing anything with django?
[19:44] <imbrandon> i can
[19:44] <imbrandon> and i have for the community dgjango theme
[19:44] <imbrandon> 'but i dont like to
[19:44] <imbrandon> i dont really like python much happier in ruby or php
[19:44] <Amoz> why not? =(
[19:45] <imbrandon> oython like perl was not ment for the web
[19:45] <Amoz> you're not trying to explore different languages etc. ?
[19:45] <imbrandon> its an after thought and show
[19:45] <imbrandon> Amoz: heh ive used them all over the years
[19:45] <Amoz> have you done anything cool with them
[19:45] <Amoz> ?
[19:45] <imbrandon> from coldfusion to vb6 to php to perl to python to yea themall
[19:46] <imbrandon> sure
[19:46] <imbrandon> i did cartoonnetwrk.co.uk grammy.com pets.com
[19:46] <imbrandon> those are some of the big names you might know
[19:46] <imbrandon> a tons and tons of smaller sites
[19:47] <imbrandon> cartoonnetwork.co.uk and .de , my bad typo
[19:47] <Amoz> :P
[19:47] <imbrandon> i normaly get to work on one or two cool sites a year :)
[19:47] <Amoz> the design, or backend or both?
[19:47] <Amoz> for grammy and pets.
[19:47] <imbrandon> i've even done the code for ubnutnu.com in one lifetime :) huh newz2000 lol
[19:47] <imbrandon> drupal for all 4 of those
[19:48] <Amoz> ubnutnu :D
[19:48] <imbrandon> and i was the main module coder on pets
[19:48] <imbrandon> and the main speed and reliabilty engneer on grammy
[19:48] <imbrandon> and mostly theme stuff on cartoonnetwrk
[19:48] <imbrandon> but some modules with the tv schedule and stuff
[19:49] <imbrandon> oh ford.ca is another
[19:49] <imbrandon> i lead the team that did that
[19:49] <imbrandon> its not drupal
[19:49] <imbrandon> its java j2ee with sping framework
[19:49] <Amoz> heh
[19:50] <imbrandon> but yea, i've left a mark here and there on the web
[19:50] <imbrandon> :)
[19:50] <Amoz> we're doing the java ee and servlets stuff in a course right now
[19:50] <imbrandon> i code alot on lessphp ( a less implmentatino in phpp ) on github and contrib to twitter bootsrapp too
[19:51] <imbrandon> yea java stuff is ok, bug projects suck
[19:51] <imbrandon> but small compartmental ones are ok
[19:51] <Amoz> I like java :P
[19:51] <imbrandon> anymore i would use small servlets on zend server and miz the php and java as one
[19:51] <imbrandon> mix*
[19:52] <Amoz> then I found python
[19:52] <Amoz> it's amazing for smaller scripts and such
[19:52] <imbrandon> and hit your head ?
[19:52] <imbrandon> heh
[19:52] <imbrandon> maybe smaller but java is still faster
[19:52] <imbrandon> and much easier to code for
[19:52] <Amoz> of course
[19:53] <Amoz> more consistent
[19:53] <imbrandon> pythin is a nightmare to maintain
[19:53] <imbrandon> for the web
[19:53] <imbrandon> for apps its much diff
[19:53] <Amoz> what's so bad about python on the web?
[19:53] <imbrandon> but the web stuf was all strapped on a as an after thought and forces mvc even when thats not the best way to do it
[19:54] <imbrandon> python like perl was not made for it, it shows
[19:54] <imbrandon> :)
[19:54] <Amoz> how?
[19:54] <imbrandon> i'm a big fan of the right tool for the job no matter the lang
[19:54] <imbrandon> and i do use python ALOT just not on the web
[19:55] <imbrandon> what do you mean
[19:55] <imbrandon> how?
[19:55] <Amoz> you say "it shows"
[19:55] <imbrandon> how was it an after thought
[19:55] <Amoz> I suppose "why" is more appropriate
[19:55] <Amoz> why does it show?
[19:55] <imbrandon> umm the whole wsgi and force of mvc , it was not arround before then and dosent understand that bad code is good
[19:56] <imbrandon> thast the biggest reason of all really
[19:56] <Amoz> isn't that just django? MVC I mean?
[19:57] <imbrandon> if python would under stand that bad code is actually good sometimes and let the dev make the call then it would overtake php but it cant by design
[19:57] <imbrandon> Amoz: well yea but put it like this dont use django and then tell me it dont show even more that python was not inteed for the web
[19:58] <imbrandon> the hooops to jump to do simple http respo
[19:58] <imbrandon> is nuts
[19:58] <Amoz> what about another framework, not forcing MVC?
[19:58] <imbrandon> but a succefful lang of any kind needs to allow bad code, bad code is what makes the world go round
[19:59] <imbrandon> Amoz: sure but thats just putting lipstick on a pig
[19:59] <imbrandon> still dont helop my main issue
[19:59] <imbrandon> of the bad code
[19:59] <imbrandon> business want it done now, and just to have it work, they dont care if its the best way
[20:00] <imbrandon> make it work BAD way then go back and fix it
[20:00] <imbrandon> and again and again
[20:00] <imbrandon> and like it or not corp  pay for alot of web dev
[20:00] <imbrandon> so what they want goes
[20:00] <imbrandon> and if python can do it then python goes
[20:00] <imbrandon> see ?
[20:00] <imbrandon> cont*
[20:00] <imbrandon> cant*
[20:00] <imbrandon> grrr
[20:01] <Amoz> you're too quick on the keyboard ;)
[20:01] <imbrandon> nah damn small bluetooth one
[20:01] <imbrandon> fat fingers
[20:01] <imbrandon> need to go get me a replace ment
[20:01] <Amoz> I see your point, but there are a lot of companies using django, no?
[20:01] <imbrandon> no
[20:01] <imbrandon> look outside of the ubuntu world
[20:02] <imbrandon> i have not see it used ANYWHERE
[20:02] <imbrandon> like look at yahoo.com its php
[20:02] <Amoz> why do ubuntu use it then?
[20:02] <imbrandon> facebook its php
[20:02] <imbrandon> hell windows asuzure control pannel is php
[20:02] <imbrandon> :)
[20:02] <imbrandon> ubuntu likes it because most of their desktop is python
[20:02] <imbrandon> and lp was a zope app to begin with
[20:03] <imbrandon> so if all your devs know python to start
[20:03] <imbrandon> why hire others
[20:03] <imbrandon> or two sets of devs in the beginin
[20:03] <imbrandon> you dont you use python :)
[20:03] <imbrandon> makes $$ sense
[20:03] <Amoz> so maybe python is filling a gap there?
[20:04] <imbrandon> and its just stuck, but only here, look at debian its the same thing only with perl, and the whole rest of the internet is either c#.net or php evnen on windows php on iis is nice now a days
[20:04] <imbrandon> and has alot of bit following
[20:04] <imbrandon> sure but see its a niche
[20:04] <imbrandon> and sadly it will stay that way imho
[20:05] <imbrandon> because its design is some of the core propblems , e.g. they dont want to fix it
[20:05] <Amoz> so what nice PHP frameworks are there?
[20:05] <imbrandon> symphony2 zendframework2
[20:05] <imbrandon> cake
[20:05] <imbrandon> coke ignighter
[20:05] <imbrandon> code*
[20:05] <Amoz> codeigniter?
[20:05] <imbrandon> ummm and quite a few others
[20:05] <imbrandon> yea CI
[20:06] <Amoz> I've been playing around with CI a little
[20:06] <imbrandon> the first 2 are the ones most ppl use, core use zend and all alse use symphony mostly
[20:06] <Amoz> I liked the small footprint
[20:06] <imbrandon> and then drupal and wordpress are popular too
[20:06] <imbrandon> all have tiny foorpronts now
[20:07] <imbrandon> by design with php 5.3 classs register auto load lazy load
[20:07] <imbrandon> and mosule namespaces __NAMESPCE__
[20:07] <imbrandon> in 5.4
[20:07] <imbrandon> makers them all tiny memmory
[20:07] <imbrandon> even what used to be a hog like drupal
[20:07] <Amoz> okay, I didn't mean footprint then
[20:08] <imbrandon> i have a drupal 6 site i maintain that avg about 2k hits a minute, not a ton but steady
[20:08] <Amoz> I meant the actual function part
[20:08] <imbrandon> and it avg 5mb a page load mem
[20:08] <imbrandon> thats TINY TINY for drupal
[20:08] <Amoz> there's just the necessary stuff in the CI core
[20:08] <imbrandon> ah thats bad imho why even use a framework then
[20:09] <imbrandon> you dont loose anything but hdd space if you add everything
[20:09] <imbrandon> and hdd is cheap and php is text :)
[20:09] <Amoz> that's one way to see it
[20:09] <Amoz> I liked the nonbloated docs
[20:09] <imbrandon> lazy class initializatino changes the game
[20:09] <Amoz> easy to start out with it
[20:09] <imbrandon> i like no docs tbh, i just read the code ( in php )
[20:10] <Amoz> instead of having a lot of different complex parameters everywhere
[20:10] <Amoz> heh
[20:10] <imbrandon> yea but too much abstraction can be bad tooo
[20:10] <Amoz> you're not too fond of abstraction I take it
[20:10] <imbrandon> folowing a inherited classs 4 or 5 deep is a pain and when your on a deadline
[20:11] <imbrandon> and have real customers hitting the page at 10k a second likem OMGubntu.co.uk was the other day
[20:11] <imbrandon> you dont have time to pussyfoot with abstractin cuz its pretty
[20:11] <Amoz> of course not
[20:11] <Amoz> if someone is, they're doing it wrong
[20:11] <imbrandon> you need it to be easy and self documenting
[20:11] <imbrandon> the ide makes it pretty :)
[20:11] <Amoz> but having a small function for executing just the SQL query and nothing else is neat
[20:12] <imbrandon> sure but like say in my code , there is no global namespace functions othere than php core
[20:12] <Amoz> anyway, I'm off
[20:12] <Amoz> gotta go
[20:12] <Amoz> cya !
[20:12] <imbrandon> they are in a class and that class is name spaced
[20:12] <Amoz> :D
[20:12] <imbrandon> kk l8tre
[20:12] <Amoz> nice talking
[20:12] <imbrandon> u too
[20:12] <imbrandon> ttyl
[22:15] <newz2000> ok, countdown page updated, wiki next
[22:15] <newz2000> http://www.ubuntu.com/community/countdown
[22:21] <cjohnston> newz2000: only doing one of them this time? aren't normally 2 others offered?
[22:21] <newz2000> cjohnston: do shift+reload
[22:21] <cjohnston> ahh
[22:21] <cjohnston> ya
[22:21] <cjohnston> y
[22:21] <cjohnston> yay
[22:21] <Amoz|> 0_0
[22:22] <Amoz|> Did I do that?
[22:22] <Amoz|> cjohnston: django 1.4 :D
[22:22] <Amoz|> Better form wizardry
[22:23] <cjohnston> ?
[22:23] <cjohnston> i see
[22:23] <cjohnston> ya.. i want to upgrade
[22:23] <Amoz|> Me too
[22:23] <cjohnston> wont be till after Connect tho
[22:23] <Amoz|> I suppose its stupid to change stuff so big weeks before "release"
[22:24] <Amoz|> Anyway, just checkiin in
[22:24] <Amoz|> Gotta sleep
[22:24] <cjohnston> nah... we normally atleast make decent commits the weekend before
[22:24] <Amoz|> Nite fellas
[22:24] <cjohnston> and I think the past three UDS's we have made commits during the event
[22:24] <cjohnston> g'nite
[22:24] <cjohnston> I'm off... bbl
[22:24] <Amoz|> Lol
[22:24] <Amoz|> Stability ftw
[22:30] <newz2000> ok, wiki page is updated too https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Website/PreciseCountdownBanner#Winners
[22:30] <newz2000> oops
[22:38] <imbrandon> newz2000 / cjohnston EtAl: EPIC , i was altready a customer and a huge fan but they got me for good now ,  http://newrelic.com/developers
[22:38] <imbrandon> 2 min video, check it
[22:40] <newz2000> Is it a joke (the sound cutting out right in the middle) or did Flash just crash on me?
[22:40] <newz2000> even if it was a crash, that is pretty awesome timing. :-)