=== albrigha is now known as Guest67837 [05:09] Good morning [05:12] morning pitti [05:13] good night :) [05:17] cyphermox: sleep well! [05:32] pitti, what's the word on the street for Beta 2? [05:33] rickspencer3: lots of fixes got wrapped into last night's rebuild; so now we're waiting for tests [05:33] pitti, were all the fixes for bugs found in testing? [05:34] rickspencer3: yes, looks like it [05:34] interesting [05:34] many were in armel, maas (brand new on server), ltsp, etc. [05:34] ok, thanks pitti [05:35] and some in ubiquity itself [05:45] good morning [05:46] hey didrocks [05:46] TheMuso: good morning, how are you? [05:47] TheMuso: still online by any chance? [05:47] pitti: Just. What can I do for you? [05:47] guten morgen pitti! [05:48] TheMuso: it seems a lucid->precise upgrade is rather insistant on keeping at-spi instead of replacing it with libatk-adaptor [05:48] TheMuso: so my question is, would it be technically correct to say that libatk-adaptor provides: at-spi? [05:48] Interesting. I haven't seen any bugs filed as such... [05:48] TheMuso: i. e. do they provide the same functionality and perhaps APIs? [05:48] TheMuso: I just filed bug 966845 [05:48] Launchpad bug 966845 in update-manager "lucid->precise upgrade wants to remove ubuntu-desktop" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/966845 [05:49] pitti: It provides the same functionality in that it is a GTK module so that GTK a11y is exposed via dbus to at-spi2. [05:49] TheMuso: it's detected by the auto-dist-upgrade tester [05:49] at-spi also provides a GTK module for atk to do the same thing. [05:49] s/atk/gtk./ [05:49] TheMuso: before it didn't get that far because of other upgrade path failures which we fixed until yesterday [05:49] SO yes, same functionality, no in terms of API, as the only binary code in there is a GTK module. [05:49] Right. [05:50] So yes, I guess we can set up libatk-adaptor to provide at-spi. [05:50] TheMuso: there are still programs in precise which depend on at-spi, such as gok [05:50] * TheMuso nods,. [05:50] TheMuso: would these break if the real at-spi suddenly disappears? [05:50] Yes, since they use CORBA. [05:51] TheMuso: looks like the other rdepends are just python-pyatspi [05:51] Right. [05:52] which has a versioned dependency, and thus won't strictly be broken by a Provides: [05:52] Right. [05:52] TheMuso: does gok have a replacement which works with the at-spi2 stack? [05:52] pitti: The only replacement I know of is still under development and not yet recommended for general use. [05:53] karibu or some such, can't remember how its spelt atm. [05:53] hm, it's also holding back python-pyatspi2 in favor of keeping python-pyatspi [05:53] TheMuso: caribou, yes [05:53] right, not far off the mark. :) [05:54] TheMuso: so, that puts us in a difficult position -- we need at-spi2 for most stuff, but we need to keep at-spi for gok, but you can't install them at the same time [05:54] pitti: Well python-pyatspi2 does provide python-pyatspi in a technical sense, as afaik the API is exactly the same. [05:54] TheMuso: oh, that helps indeed [05:54] pitti: Right. IMO we dump gok completely. [05:55] We still support lucid on teh desktop for another year, and hopefully by then, caribou will be good enough for general use. [05:56] TheMuso: ah, so would you mind filing a removal bug for gok? better if it comes from someone who actually knows this [05:57] pitti: Can do that tomorrow, unless you feel its time critical, in which case I can do it now. [05:57] ah, gok has always been in universe [05:57] TheMuso: nah, that's fine [05:59] Ok will take care of that tomorrow, and will get patches ready for the at-spi2 packages, we are currently synced with debian in terms of the at-spi2 stack, so will get the changes included there also. [05:59] TheMuso: ok, I'll do an upload with the two new Provides: then, if it's alright with you? [05:59] oh sure go ahead. [06:00] TheMuso, hey, someone reported some accessibility related bugs yesterday, is there a way I should tag them or such so that the accessibility team sees them? [06:00] TheMuso: oh, if you want to do that in Debian, then please do that [06:00] rickspencer3: Are they filed against the appropriate packages? [06:00] pitti: Feel free to upload, but I'll get them into debian too. [06:00] rickspencer3: tag them a11y as well. [06:00] TheMuso, I believe they are filed correctly [06:00] searching for bugs with the a11y tag will show all a11y bugs. [06:01] rickspencer3: Ok. [06:01] thanks TheMuso, I'll add the tags [06:01] np [06:01] TheMuso: there ought to be a 2.4.0 upgrade anyway, corresponding to the GNOME 3.4 release? [06:01] pitti: There is, its in debian, my plan was to sync it post beta. [06:01] nice [06:01] s/was/is/ [06:02] TheMuso: ok, so if you are fine with this, I'll assign that bug to you? [06:02] can't upload now anyway due to the freeze [06:02] Sure, np. [06:02] I added a summary to the bug [06:02] TheMuso: done, thanks [06:02] TheMuso: and good night! [06:16] didrocks: so it seems that unity workaround reset quite a bit more than just the plugin list? this morning I re-instated launcher autohide, keybindings, FFM, etc. [06:16] pitti: in fact, it can be a side effect [06:16] anyway, as long as it also covered the important bit, good enough [06:17] pitti: meaning, the side effect will be to reset everything you changed since the last time you changed the session [06:17] ah [06:17] (to another compiz session) [06:17] compiz is doing that: [06:17] -> you reset the plugin list in /apps/compiz-1 [06:17] if you do nothing, then, nothing load [06:17] (because you don't have a plugin list) [06:18] so, you need to force "switching to a new profile" [06:18] -> I set the "foo" profile [06:18] then, compiz load [06:18] see that the current profile should be unity [06:18] ah, settings are per-profile [06:18] and copy /apps/compizconfig-1/profiles/unity back to /apps/compiz-1 [06:18] (so, you didn't get the copy of /apps/compiz-1 to /apps/compizconfig-1/profiles/unity before) [06:19] that's why you can loose those settings [06:19] in case you didn't know, the gconf backend is funny: [06:19] let's say, you are on an existing profile "default" and go to the profile "unity" [06:19] keeps me trained where to change stuff :) [06:20] is takes /apps/compiz-1, copy all keys to /apps/compizconfig-1/profiles/default [06:20] then take /apps/compizconfig-1/profiles/unity and copy it back to /apps/compiz-1 [06:20] and finally set a *!schema!* in /apps/compizconfig-1/ to current_profile -> unity [06:20] do not wonder why you have a lot of writings on profile change :) === Zdra is now known as xclaesse [07:37] good morning [07:46] hey chrisccoulson, how are you? [07:47] hi didrocks, i'm good thanks. how are you? [07:47] tkamppeter: I assigned you bug #857663 for reviewing as you are probably the best person to look if the backport of the fix is needed/correct :) [07:47] Launchpad bug 857663 in cups "cups crashes on SIGHUP if printer classes are defined" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/857663 [07:47] I'm fine thanks ;) [07:51] hello mvo [07:52] mvo, I am currently working on an lp#899001 [07:53] mvo, it seems that there is a bug in python-apt detecting multi arch. apt_pkg.config.value_list["APT::Architectures"] returns an empty list. Also the option is set if apt-config dump is called [07:53] glatzor: its a bug in apt [07:53] glatzor: there is a apt_pkg.get_architectures() call that you can use [07:53] glatzor: that will return the native arch first and the foreign ones as the subsequent ones [07:54] glatzor: alternatively you could skip packages with ":" in the apt cache in the first search pass [07:58] hey mvo, guten MOrgen [08:00] hey pitti, guten morgen [08:05] hey [08:07] a Seb! [08:07] *hug* [08:07] hey pitti, wie geht's? [08:07] gut, danke! [08:08] we could use some help with testing current ISOs (respun last night), so if anyone feels like it.. [08:11] Goooood morning! [08:11] pitti, I might have a try later on by my installs are not useful usually they are on the most tested ones (i.e i386 desktop CD) [08:12] hey Sweetshark [08:12] I don't have the bandwith and disk space to store dvd images [08:12] seb128: we only have 1/6 tests for desktop i386 ATM [08:12] pitti, ok, will do some extra ones for it then [08:13] * pitti downloads the amd64 DVD [08:13] yeah, but at least 1.5 GB is a lot better than the 4.5 we used to have [08:15] mvo, please see bug 966916/ [08:15] Launchpad bug 966916 in python-apt "Doesn't detect multi arch setups correctly" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/966916 [08:15] mvo, please see bug 966916 [08:15] pitti: to reiterate from yesterday: to simulate a "do-release-upgrade -d" with a ppa as close as possible, do a) add the ppa b) manually tweak the apt sources to precise c) apt-get dist-upgrade [08:15] right? [08:15] Sweetshark: sounds about right [08:15] Sweetshark: mvo might know how to include the PPA in a do-release-upgrade run [08:15] glatzor: oh, awsome [08:18] Sweetshark: you can add [Sources]\nAllowThirdParty=True to /etc/update-manager/release-upgrades.d/foo.cfg [08:18] mvo: cool thanks! [08:19] mvo: I like that better than an "almost, but not quite like" dist-upgrade to see if I killed the bug. [08:19] glatzor: commited [08:23] glatzor: so that means that now cache["apt:amd64"] works as well [09:00] ping pitti, could you take a look at bug 957746 ? [09:00] Launchpad bug 957746 in ubuntu-defaults-builder "ubuntu-defaults-builder: setting language does not take effect" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/957746 [09:01] trijntje: probably a bug in gfxboot or otherwise, but I can reproduce locally and check with Colin [09:03] jibel, pitti: bug 916291 just changed to "Fix commited" [09:03] Launchpad bug 916291 in libreoffice "failed to upgrade from Oneiric to Precise: ERROR: Cannot determine language! - exit status 134" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/916291 [09:03] \o/ [09:03] thanks Sweetshark [09:03] * Sweetshark takes a deep breath. [09:03] Sweetshark: so again, if you want to upload now, please upload to precise-proposed [09:03] then it can already build now [09:03] jibel: testing most appreciated. [09:04] the auto upgrade tests will test it as soon as it's in the archive [09:04] pitti: k, I wonder if we should wait for 3.5.2 though. rc2 is already tagged. [09:05] Sweetshark: if it's more than two days away, I'd say upload it now [09:05] OTOH there is nothing like a bit of good old builder hugging ... [09:05] it breaks pretty much every oneiric upgrade [09:06] pitti: it might be. and if we want to have exactly the same tarballs as debian there might be another day of delay just for that. [09:07] jibel: Could you give that bugfix a testrun? instructions are in the bug. [09:08] pitti: thanks! The easiest way is probably to build the example package, since the bug also occurs there [09:09] Sweetshark, sure, I can do that this afternoon [09:09] ... if there is no respin of Beta 2 :) [09:09] pitti: btw who do I need to take hostage on UDS to get more discspace on the ppas? LibreOffice fails on a lot of those bc of that. Thats also something that is driving ricotz nuts, I guess. [09:10] jibel: thanks a lot, that is awesome. [09:10] * Sweetshark goes hunting for more dupes of 916291. [09:11] Sweetshark: hm, RT ticket I'd sayy [09:11] pitti: omg!1!! [09:14] pitti: fwiw I already talked to some guys on IRC (lamont for example IIRC), but all I got was unhelpful 'make your package smaller' replies -- or at least the problem isnt fixed. Thats were the evil hostage-taking plan for UDS comes from. [09:15] heh [09:15] perhaps try bribing them with beer first? [09:16] * Sweetshark likes the fact that the libreoffice bug list is lead by two 'critical/fix commited' bugs. [09:16] pitti: we are talking libreoffice here. needs stronger booze. [09:46] pitti: Ok, I wait until jibel confirms the fix this afternoon and will put a build in proposed then. [09:46] Sweetshark: cool, thanks [09:47] pitti, thanks for the resolution of this https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=672030 [09:47] Gnome bug 672030 in libgnome-desktop "gnome-settings-daemon always prevents suspend on macbookpro5,3" [Normal,Resolved: notgnome] [09:47] BigWhale: not uploaded yet, but in bzr [09:47] de rien! [09:47] pitti, I was about to do some testing and writing patches today. I guess not. :) [10:00] did anyone of you have any problems with having multiple keyboard layouts on the same machine and switching between them? [10:00] I have three, and switching works fine [10:01] (us, de, us Dvorak) [10:01] hum, ok - are there any g/dconf keys I could reset to try setting it up from scratch to see if I can get it back to working? [10:02] gsettings reset org.gnome.libgnomekbd.keyboard layouts [10:02] dholbach: control-center's keyboard capplet controls this, might be easier there [10:02] org.gnome.libgnomekbd.keyboard layouts ['us', 'de\tnodeadkeys', 'us\tdvorak'] [10:02] that's how it looks like for me; what is it for you? [10:03] alrightie - I'll let you know if I can get it back to work - it's my girlfriend's laptop: Norwegian and German I think [10:03] dholbach: xprop -root _XKB_RULES_NAMES [10:03] dholbach: that's what's actually in the X server [10:04] it shoudl be a combination of that gsetting and /etc/default/keyboard [10:05] pitti, how do I update /etc/default/keyboard? manually? [10:05] dholbach: there might be some dpkg-reconfigure thing, but usually it's set by the installer [10:05] we don't have an "apply system-wide" button for that yet [10:05] ah ok [10:06] _XKB_RULES_NAMES(STRING) = "evdev", "pc105", "no", "", "" -- but in /etc/default/keyboard it's XKBLAYOUT="de" [10:07] the norwegian layout does not seem to work at all [10:07] what does gsettings say? [10:09] pitti, layouts [], model , options [] [10:09] all empty [10:10] dholbach: hm, did you choose the layout in lightdm perhaps? [10:10] I can't quite remember - my girlfriend seems to have a tried a number of options [10:10] dholbach: env | pastebinit - [10:11] http://paste.ubuntu.com/903661 [10:12] hm, no layout there [10:12] so it looks something picks it from the locale, or some other magic method I'm not aware of [10:12] in the keyboard capplet there is just "Norwegian" now [10:18] didrocks, thanks. I think the fix should be done and should not cause problems. It is a backport from newer versions of CUPS and later releases of Ubuntu never caused the same complaint. Also it seems that the CUPS features of printer classes is broken by the bug. I recommend to issue an SRU for CUPS on Lucid. [10:19] tkamppeter: can you handle it, please? :) [10:19] mvo, could you please have a look at https://code.launchpad.net/~aptdaemon-developers/sessioninstaller/multiarch/+merge/99693 [10:20] mvo, furthermore I have added some sanity checks to InstallPackageNames (introducing a new error dialog - which would require a string freeze exception) [10:21] mvo, you can find those in trunk [10:26] pitti, I can't get it to work - I readded the layout, added a new one, removed it again and now it shows ["no"] as layouts, still it's the German layout [10:27] I could try editing /etc/default/keyboard [10:27] dholbach: what does xprop say? [10:27] "evdev", "pc105", "no", "", "" [10:29] hm, that's about everythign you can ask from settings-daemon [10:30] ok, I'll update etc/default/keyboard and restart and see what happens [10:31] dholbach: at this point I'm afraid you need to bother the X.org guys :/ no idea [10:31] dholbach: what does "doesn't work" mean exactly? i. e. what kind of breakage? [10:31] it is the German layout it's using [10:31] not the Norwegian one [10:33] ok, I'll go and ask in #ubuntu-x === alan_g is now known as alan_g|afk [10:40] didrocks, no problem. [10:40] dholbach, does it work if you set fr and de? [10:40] dholbach, i.e is that no specific? [10:40] tkamppeter: thanks :) [10:42] seb128, do I need to restart my session for it to have an effect? it seems like changing it does have no effect at all [10:42] → french does not work [10:42] dholbach, how do you change it? [10:43] indicator menu? keybinding? [10:43] in the keyboard capplet [10:43] dholbach, hum, can you try with the indicator? [10:44] seb128, no effect [10:44] dholbach, does "setkxbmap no" works? [10:45] hum [10:45] where do I get the command from? [10:46] x11-xkb-utils is installed [10:46] hum hum [10:47] nevermind [10:47] seb128, that makes it work [10:47] let me restart the session to see if it sticks [10:47] and then readd German to see if switching between the two works [10:48] no, after restarting the session the setting is gone again [10:52] dholbach, right, setkxbmap is only for the running session, it doesn't change any setting [10:52] but it suggests the issue is not xorg [10:52] aha [10:52] it's g-s-d [10:52] I've a similar bug on my session in fact [10:52] but I never bothered debugging it [10:52] the keymap is always french [10:52] whatever i pick in the indicator [10:52] is there any way how I can clear out whatever old settings there is to "start from scratch" and see if I can reproduce the issue? [10:53] :-/ [10:54] dholbach, try to gsettings reset org.gnome.libgnomekbd.keyboard [10:55] hum [10:56] hum [10:56] no, ctrl-W doesn't delete words in xchat-gnome :p [10:56] dholbach, reset-recursively rather [10:56] gsettings reset-recursively org.gnome.libgnomekbd.keyboard [10:56] alright [10:56] gsettings reset-recursively org.gnome.libgnomekbd.desktop [10:56] could be useful as well [10:57] seb128, I believe, gtk does have emac binding support [10:57] ritz, right [10:58] seb128, no dice :/ [10:59] interestingly enough lightdm still shows "no" in the upper right corner and the capplet still lists "Norwegian" [10:59] dholbach, reset org.gnome.desktop.a11y.keyboard maybe [10:59] org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.keyboard [11:00] trying all the keyboard stuff :p === MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch [11:01] nope, still doesn't work [11:02] dunno then [11:02] g-s-d is a piece of crap :p [11:05] seb128, ++ [11:12] ok, so it seems whatever I change changes XKB_RULES_NAMES and updates dconf keys accordingly - it just has no effect on the actual keymap being used [11:12] it sticks to German (for whatever reason) [11:13] if I file a bug about that, where do I file it? [11:13] seb128, pitti: ^ [11:13] it annoys my girlfriend to no end :) [11:15] seb128, ^ just imagine you would have to use a German keyboard all the time :-P [11:21] heh, i'm sure if seb128 had his way, we would ship with only support for french keyboard layout ;) [11:22] I'll file it on g-s-d for now and reassign if necessary [11:23] dholbach, ok === Zdra is now known as xclaesse [11:24] dholbach, you can probably add an autostart which do the setxkbmap call if she only wants to use no [11:24] dholbach, as a workaround [11:25] yes [11:25] seb128, pitti: any info missing on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/967034? [11:25] Launchpad bug 967034 in gnome-settings-daemon "Updating keymap information does have no effect" [Undecided,New] [11:26] dholbach, no, as said I've the bug on my account so I can probably get the infos I need, debug it there [11:26] ok [11:26] out of the fact that keyboard stuff are harder than they should and I've little clue about them to debug ;-) [11:29] thanks everyone for helping debug it [11:30] I added an autostart bit for now [11:57] re [11:58] pitti, wb [11:58] dholbach: thanks, looks complete enough to reproduce [11:58] seb128: FYI, please don't restart the retracer again, I just got it to fail on the bug I want to fix [11:59] pitti, ok [12:01] hi [12:02] in the last few days, when updating from http://es.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ oneiric-updates/main, I get packages that are not signed [12:02] has the .es server been hacked? [12:02] or just missing signatures? :D === MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow [12:26] pitti: Am I using the wrong commands to build the image? I describe the commands I use in the original bug description of bug 957746 [12:26] Launchpad bug 957746 in ubuntu-defaults-builder "ubuntu-defaults-builder: setting language does not take effect" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/957746 [12:27] trijntje: that's what I'm using as well; currently building an image for -nl [12:28] trijntje: and will then follow up to the bug [12:28] trijntje: did you check the language in gfxboot? [12:28] trijntje: and the locale? [12:28] (locale in the live session, I mean) [12:28] trijntje: and did you install the nl langpacks, too? [12:31] pitti: I did check the language in the live environment in the 'language selector' [12:31] I don't know what 'gfxboot' is so I didnt check that. [12:32] trijntje: if you press a key at the very beginning, when you see the "human = keyboard" graphic [12:33] trijntje: all ubuntu-defaults-image can do is to set the default there, and from there it'll be taken to the live system [12:33] trijntje: my NL cd finished building, and it's correct in gfxboot [12:34] and the live system is in Dutch [12:35] pitti: I use unetbootin to put the iso on a usb, since vbox keeps crashing here. Could that be the cause? [12:37] trijntje: followed up to the bug [12:37] trijntje: that shouldn't be it really, as long as it boots [12:37] I just used kvm -m 1024 -vga std -cdrom binary-hybrid.iso [12:38] no images listed for testing http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/210/builds/14369/downloads [12:49] pitti: It looks like the problem is caused by unetbootin, when I use the kvm command you provided I do get a localised live environment === alan_g|afk is now known as alan_g [13:47] * mterry waves good morning to this unusually quiet channel! :) [13:50] hey mterry [13:51] hey mterry, cyphermox! [13:52] mterry, do you miss the noise? ;-) [13:52] or rather the vibrant activity of desktopers arguing over bugs ;-) [13:53] :) [13:53] Just wanted to make sure some disaster didn't befall Europe or something while I wasn't paying attention [13:54] quiet == good; being stuck for two hours in dissecting nested EBRs from the bug that seb128 handed me :) [13:55] it has been very quiet :) [13:56] pitti, no need to thanks me, it's my please :p [13:56] hey kenvandine [13:57] Sweetshark, I finished the upgrade test with the ppa enabled [13:57] Sweetshark, not only the system upgraded successfully to Precise but libreoffice even starts when I click on the launcher ;) [13:57] jibel: soo ... did it work? [13:57] Sweetshark, congrats! [13:57] \o/ [13:57] jibel: merci [13:57] \o/ \o/ [13:57] Sweetshark: upload! upload! upload! [13:57] jibel: big thanks indeed! [13:58] pitti: hrhr [13:58] look at all these empty builders yearning for something to do === zyga is now known as zyga-afk [14:18] ricotz, there? [14:19] desrt, do you run gnome-keyring 3.4 (the gnome3 ppa version)? [14:19] i have gnome3 ppa, yes [14:20] desrt, can you run seahorse for me and see if you have the expender sign showing up next to the login keyring? [14:21] seb128: it seems that it just shows that keyring by default [14:21] desrt, is there an expender in the name column? [14:21] no [14:21] desrt, can you change themes and back? [14:21] on the view menu there is a new option 'by keyring' [14:21] that cause a sidebar to pop up [14:21] desrt, pick anything, an a11y theme if you want [14:22] desrt, then back to the one you use [14:22] desrt, does it make an expender sign be displayed? [14:22] no.. [14:22] ok :-( [14:22] on a call right now. we'll talk in a bit. [14:23] desrt, ok, ping me back [14:28] desrt, unping, I managed to run the new seahorse with some dpkg-deb -x and LD_LIBRARY_PATH, they list all items in a flat list [14:28] Empathy removes profiles that are not supported? Cause telepathy-haze was removed, installed it again, but MSN accounts are gone :( [14:29] desrt, it doesn't help me for bug #963862 [14:29] Launchpad bug 963862 in seahorse "The keyring "login" doesn't display any keys or saved passwords." [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/963862 [14:30] i.e https://launchpadlibrarian.net/98029912/seahorse.png should have ">" in the column [14:30] that broke between gtk 3.3.18 and .20, the expender is only shown after a theme change [14:30] seb128: off [14:31] seb128: http://imgur.com/wdiya [14:31] desrt, yeah, doesn't help me, but thanks [14:32] seb128: upgrade to new seahorse :D [14:32] desrt, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/98029912/seahorse.png should have a > next to keyring [14:32] ugh, seahorse is a mess in precise :( [14:32] seb128: ya.. i downgraded and was able to see your problem [14:32] desrt, well, still gtk 18 -> 20 broke working software so I want to figure if that's a gtk regression there [14:33] seb128: probably is... but keep in mind "lortie's law" [14:33] benjamin has been being rather aggressive about that lately [14:33] desrt, you should also run the last version of everything? :-) [14:33] seb128: hum? [14:33] desrt, "lortie's law" [14:33] no [14:33] "if you are not running the last version it's your fault" ;-) [14:34] how did he word it... [14:34] " 'it used to not crash' is no excuse " [14:34] he came up with it after i pushed that change to glib that caused all gtk programs to crash [14:34] and refused to revert it [14:34] ie: if you (as a user of my library) are doing stupid things, then i won't hesitate to break you with changes to my library [14:35] desrt, right, which is why I'm trying to figure now if seahorse was doing something stupid [14:38] seb128: is there a reason you didn't upgrade seahorse? [14:39] desrt, it depends on the new gnome-keyring [14:39] ah [14:39] dare i ask...? :) [14:39] i only mention it because the new UI actually looks really nice [14:39] desrt, it was separate in several sources and stefw admitted the fallback mode could be broken since there was quite some refactoring and he mostly tested shell integration [14:40] desrt, if you ask why we didn't update gnome-keyring [14:40] right... gcr came in this cycle [14:40] desrt, i.e seemed like work with regression potential for no real win [14:40] makes sense [14:40] it's _really_ late now, in any case [14:40] pitti would have a heart attack :) [14:40] well, there were several actual regressions, and a major rewrite [14:40] yeah, and this expender bug is not worth the update :p [14:41]