[00:00] <bjsnider> it's kind of built for an it environment
[00:12] <Zoffix> *sigh* why I can't copy/paste text from Ubuntu Software Centre ~_~ Who designs this?
[00:13] <Zoffix> MCR, doesn't look like I can install the 2.4 :/  Tells me dependency on bintuils < 2.21.53.20110811, but what 12.04 got is 2.22-6
[00:17] <MCR> Zoffix: Sry 4 that. I did not test the packages yet as I am compiling from source and I did not build the package, but I have reported your findings. Hope and guess it will get fixed soon.
[00:18] <Zoffix> :)
[00:48] <craigbass1976> Where do I find my browser history for epiphany?  I don't see it in the UI anywhere and running a find on ~/ didn't show me anything either.
[00:50] <craigbass1976> And in a totally unrelated vein... if I'm running updates/upgrades all along, am I going to end up with the stable release of 12.04 eventually, or will I have to reinstall?
[00:50] <Zoffix> craigbass1976, will end up with stable
[00:52] <craigbass1976> Zoffix, spiffy.  Thanks.
[00:53] <Zoffix> craigbass1976, and don't have Epiphany installed, but try pressing CTRL+H, maybe?
[01:01] <Zoffix> craigbass1976, yeah, CTRL+H or click the "Web" menu (top/left) and it's right there....
[01:03] <craigbass1976> Duh...  I should have known Ctrl+H.  I don't see the Web menu though.
[01:03]  * Zoffix shrugs
[01:03] <craigbass1976> unless you're talkng about the gear icon, but that had no history in it, or a few other things I'm used to seeing in other browser menus.
[01:04] <Zoffix> craigbass1976, no, the gear icon is on the top right (at least for me), but the web is on the top left.
[01:04] <craigbass1976> I'm also trying to block everything so that I can search google and get  "non-personalized" results
[01:04] <Zoffix> craigbass1976, Oh, it might be because I have classic gnome instead of the default Unity....
[01:05] <craigbass1976> Zoffix, aha...  I'll have to check it out on my laptop then (fedora) and see if it's any different
[01:08] <glosoli> hmm
[01:08] <Zoffix> craigbass1976, you could just ask it not to give personalized results: https://www.google.com/preferences?hl=en
[01:08] <glosoli> Precise Pangolin picks wrong sizes for windowses
[01:08] <glosoli> does anyone have this ugly problem
[01:08] <glosoli>  ?
[01:09] <craigbass1976> Zoffix, I don't trust them.
[01:09] <glosoli> sometimes I just open program and if it's not minimized it may we way out of height  or something like that
[01:09] <Zoffix> craigbass1976, though I see you'd need a google account to do so..
[01:09] <craigbass1976> :)
[01:09] <Zoffix> :)
[01:09] <craigbass1976> I'm in the process of switching to Blekko anyway.
[01:10] <Zoffix> I think I should switch to something else too... Lately google keeps giving me completely unrelated results.
[01:11] <Zoffix> ... Like searching for forests near my city it gave me results for "forecasts" for my city without even that "did you mean" thing >_<
[01:11] <glosoli> invisible me ;/
[01:12] <Zoffix> glosoli, I saw your question, but I have no clue. I'm using classic gnome with no effects session and running openbox. I have a problem with focusing new windows, but not the sizing :)
[01:13] <glosoli> Zoffix: aaa ok might be compiz problem then :)
[01:17] <Zoffix> Great. Ubuntu One seems to ignore the bandwidth limits :|
[01:19] <glosoli> Zoffix: hmm, you mean if you set limit it doesn't care ?
[01:19] <Zoffix> glosoli, yeah, and it's a reported bug, as I just found out.
[01:20] <glosoli> Zoffix: I am looking forward to Google Drive :)
[01:21] <Zoffix> Never heard of it...
[01:22] <glosoli> Zoffix: it would be more like Drop Box probably :) but will offer 5GB free storage
[01:22] <Zoffix> Never heard of Drop Box either.... I'm guessing some place to upload your stuff?
[01:24] <glosoli> Zoffix: you might have a look at DropBox website, it is similar to Ubuntu One, but it synces only catalogs which are in DropBox catalog, you can even paste image and get public link for it or any other file, you just move to drop box folder in nautilus or whatever file manager you have, and you can copy public link or whatever depended on your configuration :)
[01:24] <glosoli> Zoffix: ubuntu software center has it :) works with Precise
[01:25] <Zoffix> *shrug* I have no use for it, really.. I'm just playing around with Ubuntu One.. Gonna store my drawings in there, in case my computer explodes :)
[01:26] <glosoli> Zoffix: well same you can store in DropBox, but you can get public links for it easily, anyway, it depends on your needs :)
[01:26] <glosoli> Ubuntu One is cool thing :) but i like dropbox more
[01:37] <WilsonBradley> test
[01:42] <WilsonBradley> is this group working?
[01:42] <WilsonBradley> It says I was disconnected
[01:43] <Zoffix> WilsonBradley, I can see you type....
[01:43] <WilsonBradley> thanks
[01:47] <tidux> is it normal for Firefox to instacrash on http://reddit.com/r/asoiaf/ on a live CD?
[01:49] <Zoffix> I don't think crashing is ever normal :)
[01:49] <Zoffix> The link works fine off an installed system though.
[01:55] <tidux> Zoffix: weird, what do you think is causing it?
[01:55] <tidux> it's not WebGL - I disabled that and it still crashes
[01:55] <Zoffix> I have no idea
[01:57] <tidux> yeah, wow
[01:57] <tidux> it seems like a third of the pages I view cause a crash
[01:57] <tidux> that's seriously not cool
[01:57] <tidux> ಠ_ಠ
[02:04] <tidux> hmm
[02:04] <tidux> looks like bad squashfs blocks
[02:04] <tidux> that's odd
[02:07] <WilsonBradley> For some reason I lost my [System Settings] and [Advanced Settings] don't come up anymore ;-(
[02:09] <Zoffix> WilsonBradley, where?
[02:11] <WilsonBradley> Ubuntu 12.04
[02:11] <WilsonBradley> for example; clicking on the topright icon and going to System Settings
[02:11] <WilsonBradley> doesn't do anything
[02:12] <WilsonBradley> or via menu
[02:13] <WilsonBradley> I can try and initiate it via terminal
[02:14] <tidux> WilsonBradley: works for me on Beta 2
[02:14] <tidux> are you up to date?
[02:14] <WilsonBradley> ya, update everyday
[02:14] <WilsonBradley> it was working until 2-3days ago..
[02:15] <WilsonBradley> whats the command in terminal? I can try that
[02:15] <WilsonBradley> I tried it under another account and it's not coming up
[02:15] <Zoffix> WilsonBradley, gnome-control-center --overview
[02:16] <WilsonBradley> The program 'gnome-control-center' is currently not installed.  You can install it by typing:
[02:16] <WilsonBradley> apt-get install gnome-control-center
[02:16] <tidux> now that's weird
[02:16] <tidux> sounds like you accidentally removed it
[02:17] <WilsonBradley> ya, thats strange
[02:17] <tidux> oh yeah, question about font rendering
[02:17] <WilsonBradley> installing it now
[02:17] <tidux> why isn't the lcdfilter patch pushed upstream to libcairo or gtk?
[02:17] <WilsonBradley> That was it :-)
[02:17] <WilsonBradley> comes up now
[02:17] <WilsonBradley> tanx
[02:19] <WilsonBradley> Im trying to learn how to debug problems in Ubunt crashes.. If you were going to check for any errors from bootup to now, what log file would you focus on?
[02:22] <tidux> just run "dmesg" and pipe it to a pager
[02:22] <tidux> that's what it's for
[02:22] <tidux> if you want the file directly, it's /var/log/messages on Debian
[02:22] <tidux> Ubuntu might have changed that with the switch to Upstart
[02:23] <trism> /var/log/kern.log
[02:45] <WilsonBradley> Thanks, will look though kern.log for any errors.
[03:15] <tyler_> hello
[03:15] <tyler_> anyone know how to download virtualbox on 12.04?
[03:17] <WilsonBradley> Go to site and download latest
[03:17] <WilsonBradley> build and then terminal
[03:17] <WilsonBradley> make
[03:18] <WilsonBradley> research manual install. I think there is even a .deb release on their site
[03:19] <Logan_> tyler_: Can't you just do sudo apt-get install virtualbox?
[03:19] <WilsonBradley> ya , or try that
[03:32] <tyler_> meh, i downloaded the 11.10 version and it worked so w,e. aha.
[03:35] <micahg> virtualbox 4.1.10 is in the archive
[03:57] <Zoffix> Man, this is retarded! In 10.10 when opening a file with something weird, you had to know the name of the executable. In 12.04, they added a list of apps, BUT THEY REMOVED the the type-the-name field... Jesus.
[03:58] <Zoffix> This is definitely my last version of Ubuntu... 12.04 is worse than Vista, interface-wise.
[03:59] <jiohdi> kde seems to work well in 12.04
[03:59] <Zoffix> Hell, it's worse than Vista after I spent 14 hours tweaking it.
[03:59] <Zoffix> jiohdi, maybe I'll give that a whirl.
[04:00] <jiohdi> I found unity hideous, but I gave kde a try and I like it now
[04:00] <jiohdi> I also added a cairo dock
[04:00] <Zoffix> I found unity horrid, and I switched to gnome classic.
[04:01] <jiohdi> with gnome I found compiz a nightmare, but kde has its own compositing that works
[04:01] <micahg> Zoffix: are you sure that was an Ubuntu change and not a GNOME one?
[04:05] <Zoffix> micahg, no, I'm not, but I spent 8 hours last night trying to install Ubuntu, and 14 hours today trying to set it up the way I like it.... I've been on Ubuntu since Edgy first came out, and every release seems to introduce more and more instabilities and more and more features get missed...  How do you change a system in one release so much that a user who's on your system 12 hours a day/5 days a week has trouble configuring printers and other stupi
[04:05] <Zoffix> d stuff?
[04:05] <Zoffix> If you can call it "configuring"... The new printers dialog only offers you to add users to printers.
[04:06] <Zoffix> Anyway, Ubuntu is what it is because people who made this like it, so I guess it's not my place to say what should and should not be the way it is. I just need to switch after this release times out.
[04:06] <micahg> Zoffix: weird, I can still configure my printer in the system settings
[04:07] <Zoffix> micahg, I can only add (not even sure WHAT it actually adds) and if I click "Options", the only thing I get there is users setup :/ *shrug*
[04:07] <micahg> Zoffix: right click in the printer itself
[04:07] <Zoffix> It's irrelevant though, I already configured through CUPS web interfdace.
[04:07] <Zoffix> micahg, right click does nothing
[04:07] <Zoffix> (I'm on Gnome classic no effects though, not unity)
[04:07] <micahg> Zoffix: you should get a menu with properties
[04:07] <micahg> oh, no idea then
[04:08] <Zoffix> Maybe a bug *shrug*
[04:08] <micahg> Zoffix: if you're on GNOME classic, then it's basically upstream GNOME design decisions
[04:08] <Zoffix> At least it relieves me to know that a menu is at least supposed to be there.
[04:08] <micahg> if GNOME isn't working, you might try KDE, LXDE, Xfce
[04:09] <Zoffix> Last time I tried KDE I hated it.... Forget why, but I know I did...
[04:09] <micahg> sorry, working for you I mean
[04:10] <micahg> might be worth trying it in a live session to see if you like the new version
[04:10] <jiohdi> I did not like kde last time either, but since I have been using it about two weeks now, its grown on me
[04:10] <Zoffix> Oh, trying through liveCD is a good idea. Thanks!
[04:14] <KM0201> i've never liked KDE, but just cuz a friend was telling me how awesome kde4 was (and i figured it couldn't be any worse than unity or gnome 3).. i tried it.  after you disable all the crap, it's not to bad.  i still don't care for it (mainly because it installs 80 gazillion apps.).. but it's not bad
[04:14] <KM0201> xfce4, is awful.. very buggy, and seems like it's trying to get into the "most bloat" competition that Gnome 3 and KDE4 are engaged in... LXDE, is just down right sexy simple
[04:21] <alex_mayorga> just restarted after a kernel panic, what do I do to file a report?
[04:30] <alex_mayorga> !panic
[04:37] <^Lem^> hi all, just wondering if anyone is experiencing issues with Unity still eating drag and drops? e.g. text files on the desktop, drag to a gEdit window, then as the unity panel goes into fade mode, drop the file .. the drag/drop event seems to get lost?
[04:39] <^Lem^> i might add that it requires fairly precise [;)] timing, the drag/drop event gets lost only as the unity panel is fading, not after it's completed the fade
[04:56] <keithclark> volume is fine on my speakers, but low and distorted on my headphones.  Any fix?
[05:03] <frybye> Hi - is the HUD- system already present in 12.04 and if so - how does one use it?
[05:05] <keithclark> frybye, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_WW-DHqR3c
[05:06] <keithclark> frybye, start there and explore
[05:06] <frybye> keithclark: yeah I found that thing - but excuse me - there is no indication of how the person making the video is doing all this stuff? Which combination of keys or whatever...?
[05:08] <frybye> for instance - right at the start it says "invoke the HUD!" but gives no information on HOW to do that?
[05:09] <keithclark> hud is called upon by alt key
[05:10] <frybye> just "alt" on it's own?
[05:10] <keithclark> yes
[05:10] <frybye> i c - thanks..l.
[05:10] <keithclark> then start typeing what you want to do within the application that you are in
[05:11] <keithclark> Like in gedit, hit the alt key then start typing s....a....v...
[05:11] <keithclark> you will see saving options
[05:11] <frybye> so I hit alt und then type close konversation but it does not do it or ...?
[05:12] <ivan> how do I install a 32-bit package on my 64-bit Precise?
[05:12] <ivan> libfreeimage3, specifically
[05:13] <keithclark> frybye, never used konversation, sorry.
[05:13] <ivan> oh, I forgot to apt-get update after adding the foreign arch
[05:14] <frybye> keithclark: ok I figured it - forgot that I am using a german 12.04 here - so i need to hit alt and then type beenden - not   close
[05:14] <frybye> sorry.. my fault...
[05:14] <keithclark> frybye, so you are good to go?
[05:15] <frybye> keithclark: yeah great stuff - thanks...
[05:15] <keithclark> frybye, no problem.  It's all new to me too!
[05:15] <Onlyodin> ivan, possibly try `apt-get install libfreeimage3:i386`
[05:15] <frybye> keithclark: not that i woiuld like the menus to dissapear alltogether...
[05:15] <keithclark> frybye, no, but an interesting addition
[05:15] <ivan> Onlyodin: ah! thanks. just found that on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricOcelot/TechnicalOverview/Beta1 as well
[05:16] <frybye> one dosent always know in advance what one needs etc.. but there you are...
[05:16] <Onlyodin> ivan, no problems
[05:16] <keithclark> frybye, agreed
[05:18] <ivan> libfreeimage3 depends on libilmbase6:i386 and libopenexr6:i386, and adding those to my apt-get install is going to remove all of kubuntu and systemsettings and userconfig
[05:18] <ivan> I don't need kubuntu, but what about those other two?
[05:19] <KM0201> what other to? xubuntu and lubuntu?
[05:19] <KM0201> *two
[05:20] <ivan> systemsettings and userconfig
[05:21] <Onlyodin> They sound somewhat important to me
[05:25] <ivan> System Settings GUI seems to launch without systemsettings :-)
[05:30] <ivan> should I be able to have both libfreeimage3 and libfreeimage3:i386 installed? Because I can't.
[05:30] <ivan> seems they both install to the same /usr/lib files
[05:34] <ivan> is there any workaround for the really weird mouse shaking issue with Precise in vmware workstation?
[05:34] <ivan> the visible cursor itself doesn't jump around, but all applications act as if the cursor jumps around randomly in a 10x10 px area
[05:44] <tertitten> probably not supported, but are there are repository that lets you get full gnome3.4, Empathy, etc?
[05:44] <EvilResistance> i think you'll break 95% of Ubuntu with full Gnome 3.4
[05:46] <keithclark> Anyone with a solution to really quiet headphone volume with distortion compared to good speaker volume/quality?
[06:16] <alex_mayorga> keithclark: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingSoundProblems perhaps?
[06:31] <keithclark> alex_mayorga, I'll give that a try
[06:32] <DroidDev32> i am trying out beta 2 with my desktop that has a redeon 6770 graphics card in it. Should i use the proprietary drivers or is the default driver better?
[06:43] <keithclark> alex_mayorga, hmm, didn't seem to find a fix there. Maybe a new bug?
[07:40] <anthropos> occasionally when running gnome-shell my text input will become EXTREMELY slow (5 + second delay), but the application picker, etc. is still very responsive and gnome-shell is not using a lot of cpu or memory
[07:41] <anthropos> has anyone else experienced this?
[07:41] <anthropos> a restart fixed it.
[07:41] <anthropos> (restarting the entire computer, not gnome-shell)
[07:54] <demonboy> hello guys i am having issues ( i think ) not sure... i get this ( http://paste.ubuntu.com/909791/ ) when opening nvidia control panel (1st section of paste) and when i try to save to x i get the messages displayed in the 2nd part of the past
[07:54] <demonboy> is this something to worry about or can i restart x and be fine
[07:57] <demonboy> anybody
[08:40] <trijntje> has the release of precise been postponed to may?
[08:42] <Trewas> trijntje: it's best not to even open a web browser during the international day of trolling aka april 1st
[08:43] <trijntje> Trewas: damn, your right ;)
[08:43] <trijntje> in my defence, I was quite sceptical of the claim :P
[08:45] <Trewas> heh, and it might even be a good idea
[09:55] <madrazr> Hello everyone, I am Unity 2D on Ubuntu 12.04 Beta 2, this HUD thing comes up in a while when I try to change the windows by Alt+Tab
[09:55] <madrazr> this is pretty annoying
[09:55] <madrazr> how do I make that not happen?
[09:55] <madrazr> can some one help me please?
[09:55] <madrazr> *I am using
[10:15] <brobostigon> madrazr: you can change it, in compiz config settings manager, which you will probebly have to install.
[10:16] <madrazr> brobostigon: I changed key bindings to Alt+Super
[10:16] <madrazr> but I still see this problem
[10:16] <brobostigon> no idea then.
[10:17] <brobostigon> have you restarted compiz, so it reloads all this config to be sure?
[10:17] <madrazr> brobostigon: I have not done that, let me try
[10:17] <brobostigon> ok.
[10:18] <madrazr> brb logging out and re-logging in
[10:21] <madrazr> brobostigon: no luck
[10:22] <brobostigon> no idea then, ask someone else. sorry.
[10:23] <madrazr> brobostigon: NP, thanks for helping though
[10:23] <madrazr> if some one else knows this, please help
[10:23] <brobostigon> :)
[10:26] <dubaco> hej
[10:26]  * dubaco is upgrading
[10:27] <dubaco> english eller svenska?
[10:36] <dubaco> what language is good here?
[10:37] <spacebug-> english
[10:38] <UrB> for swedish I'd guess there is #ubuntu-se or something like that
[10:38] <madrazr> dubaco: although I am not a native English speaker myself and have a broken English, I always felt English is the universal language, or at least works in "most" of the places
[10:39] <dubaco> ok:( i have broken swedish anyway
[10:39] <dubaco> and chinease is more universal now
[11:00] <dubaco> it said it would take 8 hours to upgrade
[11:00] <dubaco> from ubuntu 11.04 to 14.04
[11:01] <dubaco> i have a 100 Mb/s connection
[11:01] <philinux> dubaco: You mean 11.04 to 11.10.
[11:02] <dubaco> no
[11:02] <dubaco> i am upgarding to the newest version
[11:02] <dubaco> the beta 2 thing
[11:02] <philinux> dubaco: So you mean 11.10 to 12.04. 14. whatever is 2014
[11:04] <dubaco> 12.04 sorry
[11:04] <dubaco> no i wrote an entire operating system for ubuntu and updated all the code by myself... - lol
[11:04] <philinux> dubaco: upgrades always take forever. I always do a clean install
[11:06]  * dubaco has an asus eeepc 1015pn and wonders if 12.04 has a netbook remix
[11:07] <philinux> dubaco: remix gone now
[11:07] <dubaco> why?
[11:07] <dubaco> i have a 10' screen
[11:08] <philinux> dubaco: Unity
[11:08] <dubaco> unity does not fix everything
[11:09] <philinux> dubaco: But remix has long gone
[11:09] <dubaco> a lot of the menues on the desktop version wont allow me to resize them on my netbook
[11:09] <philinux> dubaco: Research MyUnity
[11:10] <dubaco> so "do you want to delete your files from this device" and the options are hidden as the screen is too small
[11:10] <philinux> dubaco: http://www.unixmen.com/myunity-3-0-comes-with-a-new-interface-and-ubuntu12-04-support-ppa-ubuntu/
[11:11] <philinux> dubaco: I have an acer 1410 11.6 " screen and unity is just fine. I've shrunk the launcher to 32 wide
[11:14] <dubaco> here goes for a reboot
[11:19] <anonisnaas> Need help disabling network-manager to ise Wicd on gnome-shell, every attempt seems to just crash GS after login :/ Any GS 3.4 users here?
[11:36] <slipttees> Hi
[11:36] <penguin42> Hey
[11:36] <slipttees> where I setup my keyboard layout Thinkpad T60?
[11:37] <slipttees> keyboard type...
[11:38] <penguin42> slipttees: I'm running kubuntu here, so things are a bit different - but under system settings isn't there a Keyboard Layout option?
[11:38] <slipttees> only language... i need choise model, no country
[11:39] <slipttees> penguin42: understand?
[11:39] <penguin42> slipttees: I don't think there is anything to choose the model - why would you need to choose the model?
[11:39] <anonisnaas> slipttees System/Settings/Keyboard Layout/Layout tab
[11:40] <anonisnaas> If you preview before adding a keyboard it will show you the layout
[11:40] <slipttees> penguin42: my keyboard is Brazil, Brazil = Ç but is an Laptop Lenovo Thinkpad T60
[11:40] <slipttees> then some key are different.
[11:41] <anonisnaas> slipttees, use the preview button to show you the different layouts
[11:41] <anonisnaas> There's no option to pick a model
[11:41] <slipttees> penguin42: in ubuntu 11.10 i select IBM-T60,R60 keyboard
[11:42] <slipttees> anonisnaas: brazil option won't have mey keyboard
[11:43] <slipttees> anonisnaas: IBM keyboard
[11:43] <slipttees> why remove keyboard models?
[11:43] <anonisnaas> Try portugese, there's are 13 diff keyboard types
[11:44] <anonisnaas> one of them should work for you
[11:44] <slipttees> manufacturer keyboard
[11:44] <slipttees> anonisnaas: no one work fully for me =/
[11:45] <penguin42> slipttees: I don't know how Brazillian keyboards work; in the UK there is basically one layout so we never have to understand that - but if none of the layouts work for you submit a bug
[11:45] <anonisnaas> slipttees, you might want to a file a bug
[11:45] <slipttees> penguin42: but i Have Ç
[11:45] <slipttees> mey keyborad is abnt2
[11:45] <slipttees> my*
[11:47] <slipttees> anonisnaas: penguin42: if it have manufacturer keyboard setting like 11.10 i would not have problem
[11:49] <anonisnaas> slipttees, I agree, unfortunately that's part of gnome desktop now
[11:50] <penguin42> slipttees: File the bug - it'll need someone who understands keyboard layouts like that to deal with it
[11:50] <slipttees> =/
[11:53] <slipttees> sorry, but between these and other free software that still has some resistance by new users.
[11:53] <mikeconcepts> Trying to make web cam work in skype...Please look at my script to run skype that tries to run v4l, what's wrong with it http://pastebin.com/JhzJEH7q
[11:53] <penguin42> slipttees: There are lots of Brazillian linux users, so file the bug and I'm sure someone will be able to make something work for you
[11:54] <penguin42> slipttees: T60's are quite popular as well
[11:54] <slipttees> =/
[11:55] <slipttees> i have 200 computer with ubuntu in my company. penguin42
[11:55] <slipttees> i'm use only LTS version
[11:55] <slipttees> all computer have IBM keyboard
[11:56] <slipttees> As is my keyboard? I'm thinking about changing linux here.
[11:56] <penguin42> slipttees: Well, your choices are basically to file a bug, and hope someone triages it; you could purchase support with canonical.com and pay them to fix it if you're desperate
[11:57] <slipttees> Muhauhuahau
[11:57] <slipttees> i'm not desperate
[11:58] <slipttees> I'm just disappointed with ubuntu..
[11:58] <astraljava> You're not desperate, but thinking of changing linux. Hmm...
[11:58] <slipttees> little things that make a difference.
[11:58] <astraljava> 200 installations on a new distribution, you _don't_ call that desperate?
[11:58] <slipttees> astraljava: still use 10.04 LTS.
[11:59] <penguin42> slipttees: 10.04 LTS will go out of support in a while
[11:59] <kklimonda> meh, in another 12 months on desktops
[11:59] <penguin42> slipttees: Is the issue you have called 'dead-cedilla' ?
[11:59] <astraljava> slipttees: So? You might wanna calculate the cost of switching distributions first, and compare that to the support contract with C, before you make the decision.
[11:59] <slipttees> penguin42:  key Q won't have /
[11:59] <UrB> T60 as in Thinkpad T60?
[11:59] <slipttees> W no have ?
[12:00] <penguin42> slipttees: Remember, I've never seen one of these keyboards - so I don't know if that's bad!
[12:00] <slipttees> UrB: Lenovo T400
[12:00] <UrB> slipttees: damn - I've been seeking high and low for someone to verify/refute this -> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bluez/+bug/950413
[12:01] <UrB> I think T60 is one with the same chip - as are some other same era Thinkpads too
[12:01] <slipttees> UrB: keyboard abnt2
[12:02] <slipttees> UrB: take a picture. Wait a minute...
[12:03] <UrB> mine is X41, with scandinavian keyaboard
[12:04] <slipttees> UrB: ubuntu 11.10 I use IBM layout and T60 model
[12:04] <slipttees> work fully. :)
[12:04] <Lordveda> Is Precise now usable and stable on a production personal notebook???
[12:05] <Lordveda> I need to ask what is meant by a Production machine?
[12:05] <kklimonda> Lordveda: hard to tell
[12:05] <UrB> slipttees: I don't have any (keyboard) issues with 12.04 either
[12:05] <slipttees> UrB: but the smart developers remove this option.
[12:05] <kklimonda> it depends on your hardware, and what applications are you using
[12:05] <Lordveda> Does it mean a heavily used server or what?
[12:05] <slipttees> UrB: I'm just disappointed with ubuntu..
[12:05] <kklimonda> slipttees: because it has bugs?
[12:06] <slipttees> no an bug
[12:06] <Lordveda> kklimonda: I think a beta2 with many freezes in codes and interface would be very stable for use right?
[12:06] <UrB> int9keyboard - I guess that is my kb-model?
[12:06] <slipttees> remove simple features
[12:06] <kklimonda> slipttees: what did they remove?
[12:06] <penguin42> slipttees: If you stop moaning, and file a bug saying that it breaks a feature for a large chunk of brazillian users it might get fixed!
[12:06] <Lordveda> kklimonda: I use GNOME3 / eclipse / games , etc.
[12:07] <slipttees> kklimonda: keyboard setting
[12:07] <kklimonda> slipttees: it's there, what exactly is missing from it?
[12:07] <slipttees> kklimonda: now, i won't select manufacture keyboard.
[12:08] <slipttees> kklimonda: i have thousand IBM keyboard.
[12:08] <kklimonda> slipttees: then report it and describe your usecase
[12:08] <kklimonda> although it's a bit too late for doing such tests if you have 10.04 deployed on that many machines
[12:09] <PaulW2U> Lordveda: : Take a look at bug #969589. I can't even log into 12.04 using lightdm at the moment
[12:09] <slipttees> where is the philosophy of "ubuntu"
[12:10] <slipttees> forgot?
[12:10] <Lordveda> PaulW2U: I think this issue can be temporarily corrected by using gdm instead.
[12:11] <mjjc1337> does anyone experience problems when trying to run gnome-shell in 12.04? it runs gnome-fallback instead
[12:11] <kklimonda> slipttees: there is nothing about "thou shall not remove features" in the ubuntu philosophy
[12:11] <PaulW2U> Lordveda: Yes, I know that, but it's a severe bug at this late stage of the development cycle.
[12:12] <anonisnaas> mjjc1337, no problems here
[12:12] <slipttees> kklimonda: I'm talking about people
[12:13] <UrB> mjjc1337: do you have any external PPAs activated? I've borked my install twice with them beyond repair (with my skills)
[12:13] <kklimonda> slipttees: what do you mean?
[12:13] <Lordveda> PaulW2U: Is the ubuntu developer team determined to use lightdm instead of gdm for good??
[12:13] <Lordveda> I mean as the default choice
[12:13] <slipttees> kklimonda: sorry, but I think you do not think in the end User.
[12:13] <anonisnaas> mjjc1337, only problem I have running shell is if I try to install wicd instead of network-manager
[12:14] <mjjc1337> UrB, I've just installed Ubuntu 12.04 Beta 2 and first thing I did was installing gnome-shell
[12:14] <UrB> ok, then it's a real problem
[12:14] <kklimonda> slipttees: no, I just don't quite understand what you are trying to say
[12:14] <PaulW2U> Lordveda: Probably and even kubuntu as a version of lightdm under development
[12:14] <UrB> mjjc1337: any errors in .xsessionerrors
[12:15] <kklimonda> slipttees:  "think of the end users" is a poor argument when talking about removing features - it would be a much better argument to say that you have to set a keyboard model to get the correct layout
[12:15] <Lordveda> I don't know why not to keep gdm as the default for ubuntu since it is gnome-based distro and to keep kdm for kubuntu being a KDE-based distribution
[12:16] <Lordveda> Plus let the users decide if they want that Login manager or the other.
[12:16] <kklimonda> slipttees: but it's still possible to do that, only the interface is gone. And while the question of whether removing this ui has been a good decision is still out, you can definitely still configure your keyboard model
[12:17] <mjjc1337> UrB, no big thing in .xsession-errors, but here's the output of /usr/bin/gnome-shell: "Xlib:  extension "GLX" missing on display ":0.0"."
[12:17] <UrB> oh, would seem gfx-card driver related then as in no hw-acceleration
[12:17] <kklimonda> Lordveda: because gdm was harder to tweak and extend to provide features developers wanted
[12:19] <slipttees> kklimonda: little things that make a difference.
[12:19] <Lordveda> kklimonda: simply because gdm is now more integrated into the Gnome3 way of thinking not in what the ubuntu devs are thinking off
[12:19] <UrB> back to the bluetooth bug I pasted earlier: R52, T43, T43p, X32, X41, X41 Tablet, X61, X61s, Z60m, Z60t <- all those Thinkpads have the same bluetooth chip - no-one here have any of those around?
[12:19] <kklimonda> Lordveda: sure, but that's an issue too as we don't ship gnome-shell as a default desktop anymore so tight integration with it is not helping
[12:20] <kklimonda> slipttees: in most cases the option to change keyboard model is completely useless, and confusing because most keyboard models are not on this list.
[12:20] <slipttees> too kklimonda, i know this a develop preview
[12:20] <mjjc1337> UrB, that's weird. I'm running it on Dell XPS 15 with two graphic cards (nVidia and Intel HD). I'm always turning off nVidia because of power regression. Also, gnome-shell runs well on Debian Lenny.
[12:20] <Lordveda> kklimonda: I wonder why isn't Gnome-shell the default desktop and why to stick to Unity?
[12:20] <Lordveda> I feel that Gnome shell is far more modern than is Unity.
[12:20] <kklimonda> slipttees: to this day I have no idea what's the difference between pc102 and pc105, and which should I choose
[12:20] <slipttees> kklimonda: okay... sorry for everything
[12:20] <slipttees> bye
[12:21] <kklimonda> slipttees: you don't actually want a discussion from what I see
[12:21] <slipttees> kklimonda: precise have options select macnufacture keyboard?
[12:21] <kklimonda> slipttees: yes it has
[12:21] <UrB> mjjc1337: I ran out of knowledge here, but to me it seems like missing hw-accel - maybe someone wiser on this can refute it
[12:21] <kklimonda> it's just not exposed in the interface
[12:21] <slipttees> manufacture*
[12:22] <kklimonda> you have to edit /etc/default/keyboard and restart (either computer, or proper services)
[12:22] <slipttees> why we make a interface for that?
[12:22] <kklimonda> Lordveda: because Ubuntu developers responsible for those things believe that they can provide a nicer desktop based on Unity
[12:23] <slipttees> made**
[12:23] <Lordveda> kklimonda: I think that forks are not quite good.
[12:24] <kklimonda> slipttees: made? are you asking why has the option to change the keyboard model been removed from the ui? I don't know, I assume that it was confusing for most users
[12:24] <kklimonda> Lordveda: unity is not really a fork
[12:24] <Lordveda> I think tweaking the Gnome-shell which is based on Javascript is much more effective + adding extensions for the shell.
[12:24] <slipttees> kklimonda: confusing?
[12:24] <slipttees> Muahaha
[12:24] <slipttees> okay okay
[12:24] <Lordveda> kklimonda: I am not a developer to tell sorry.
[12:24] <slipttees> >x
[12:24] <kklimonda> slipttees: yes, even now I have no idea what's the difference between pc102 and pc105, and why isn't there my keyboard on that list
[12:25] <slipttees> kklimonda: u are american/
[12:25] <slipttees> ?
[12:25] <kklimonda> slipttees: no
[12:25] <UrB> re. Unity vs Gnome-Shell - I am ok with Unity being the default shell as long as installing optional one is not made unecessarily hard
[12:26] <kklimonda> slipttees: but my national layout doesn't require me to change the keyboard model
[12:26] <slipttees> kklimonda: have custom keyboard?
[12:26] <kklimonda> slipttees: no
[12:27] <slipttees> kklimonda: then you do not know how much it sucks to use a keyboard unconfigured.
[12:27] <kklimonda> slipttees: well, my keyboard layout uses AltGr to input national characters
[12:28] <kklimonda> I don't have to change keyboard model to do that
[12:28] <PaulW2U> UrB: Me too. Unfortunately Unity and Gnome Shell share settings such as theme and scrollbars. Hopefully that will change.
[12:28] <slipttees>  / ? example kklimonda ?
[12:28] <kklimonda> slipttees: for example altgr+l gives ł or altgr+c gives ć
[12:28] <kklimonda> slipttees: (altgr being the right alt key)
[12:29] <slipttees> Alggr+Q gives / and altgr+w gives ?
[12:29] <slipttees> but i have key / ? for taht
[12:29] <slipttees> that
[12:29] <kklimonda> slipttees: no, my layout is different
[12:30] <OldManMagnus> 12.04 has gone from being pretty stable to wobbly as hell recently. :(
[12:31] <fyrfaktry> rock solid here. <shrug>
[12:31] <OldManMagnus> weird.
[12:31] <slipttees> kklimonda: MUAhahahaha
[12:31] <kklimonda> slipttees: so the best thing you can do is to report your issue on Launchpad, and describe why you need this option
[12:32] <MCR> OldManMagnus: I had experienced it the other way 'round. Runs quite nice here now.
[12:32] <OldManMagnus> i was having weird flickering on the menubars, just installed the amd drivers (via system settings) and now i can't even log in. :(
[12:33] <OldManMagnus> anyone know how to remove the amd drivers from the command line?
[12:33] <kklimonda> OldManMagnus: jockey-text
[12:33] <slipttees> kklimonda: no, I'll leave it
[12:33] <kklimonda> jockey-text -l  will list drivers, and you can disable the right one with jockey-text -d
[12:34] <slipttees> one ubuntu no work for app
[12:34] <ttl-> Running  12.04 beta 2 from a live CD and found somthing strange, tail -f /var/log/syslog of /var/log/kern.log is not printing new lines
[12:34] <ttl-> of=or
[12:34] <kklimonda> slipttees: if you don't want to report it, are not willing to work on a fix itself, and find paying canonical (or someone else) for fixing it hilarious, then there is very little we can do for you
[12:34] <MCR> OldManMagnus: http://www.upubuntu.com/2012/03/how-to-install-amd-ati-catalyst-123.html#more
[12:34] <slipttees> the authentication failed.
[12:35] <slipttees> kklimonda: no pay,  himself solve this.
[12:35] <slipttees> :)
[12:35] <MCR> OldManMagnus: fglrx can be tricky ;)
[12:35] <UrB> slipttees: making the regression bug report if easy - 10 minutes top
[12:36] <UrB> then you can complain about the bug being neglected instead ;)
[12:37] <Lordveda> I need to ask about the Keyboard input methods: What is the difference between them?
[12:37] <MCR> OldManMagnus: I am usually using sudo sh ./amd-driverinstaller-12-3-x86.x86_64.run --buildandinstallpkg Ubuntu/precise
[12:37] <OldManMagnus> MCR: i'll try that
[12:37] <OldManMagnus> brb. rebooting.
[12:38] <kklimonda> Lordveda: you can configure different input methods to write in "exotic" languages like japanese or korean, where normal keyboard is not good enough
[12:39] <MCR> Anyone problems with Eclipse not starting on 12.04 ?
[12:40] <Lordveda> kklimonda: I type in arabic and latin (english and french), so would I use any special keyboard input method other than the X window based keyboard layouts?
[12:41] <UrB> MCR: which version of Eclipse?
[12:41] <kklimonda> Lordveda: no idea, I don't have much experience with it - I did play with inputing japanese characters to see how it works.
[12:41] <kklimonda> Lordveda: it's of no use for "latin" layouts
[12:41] <OldManMagnus> well, i've got the amd drivers uninstalled, so now i can log in, but there are no menus at all. just a wallpaper and a mouse pointer. D:
[12:42] <kklimonda> Lordveda: in Japanese you have to compose characters from other characters
[12:42] <MCR> UrB: 3.7.1-1
[12:42] <UrB> MCR: at least the Indigo downloaded from Eclipse homepage and then extracted worked on mine
[12:42] <UrB> haven't tried the one from repositories
[12:42] <MCR> UrB: which version is that ?
[12:42] <UrB> 3.7.2 I think
[12:42] <MCR> ah, ok - thx
[12:42] <OldManMagnus> i think i'm going to leave 12.04 till it's released and settled down a bit. :)
[12:43] <slipttees> kklimonda: UrB: http://ubuntuone.com/2srwESmQWDuuLS1YB6PRui
[12:43] <slipttees> see this please
[12:48] <slipttees> kklimonda: see key /?º  ??
[12:48] <slipttees> for me does't exist
[12:50] <kklimonda> slipttees: have you tried editing /etc/default/keyboard to see if setting the correct XKBMODEL fixes it?
[12:51] <kklimonda> (eventually variant or layout)
[12:52] <slipttees> kklimonda: Manufacture: IBM Model: IBM ThinkPad R60?T60/R61/T61
[12:56] <dubaco> hi i was playing open arena just now on 12.04 and it has borked my screen settings - resolution is way too big (things are fuzzy and big
[12:57] <kklimonda> slipttees: you can try putting
[12:57] <kklimonda> XKBMODEL="thinkpad60"
[12:57] <kklimonda> XKBLAYOUT="br"
[12:57] <kklimonda> into /etc/default/keyboard and see if it makes things work after reboot
[12:58] <dubaco> i will reboot and see if that helps
[12:59] <kklimonda> eventually use setxkbmap, but I don't know the correct syntax off the top of my head
[13:08] <Lordveda> kklimonda: So if I am not using east asian / Japanese languages I won't be needing any of these keyboard input methods?
[13:09] <Lordveda> I mean the ibus and so.
[13:10] <kklimonda> Lordveda: in this case if you don't know what it is you don't need it, if you needed it you'd probably already look end up looking for it ;)
[13:19] <slipttees> kklimonda: hey
[13:21] <slipttees> kklimonda: well done: http://ubuntuone.com/6JRVyMpYPeA7vezxJpMX2f
[13:21] <slipttees> :D
[13:22] <kklimonda> slipttees: sorry, the link is broken ;)
[13:23] <slipttees> kklimonda: moment...
[13:23] <slipttees> re-upload
[13:23] <slipttees> kklimonda: http://ubuntuone.com/6tLSN25hCULekqrtFgJwsA
[13:23] <slipttees> :D
[13:25] <slipttees> kklimonda: brainstorm?
[13:28] <kklimonda> slipttees: I don't think it should be connected to the layout, as all layouts should be using the same keyboard model
[13:28] <kklimonda> slipttees: but it's a start
[13:29] <slipttees> kklimonda: can add this on Keyboard interface?
[13:38] <Lordveda> Why isn't there a permanent devel true for ubuntu just like Debian unstable and Fedora Rawhide?
[13:38] <kklimonda> slipttees: I don't think it's a proper solution (for the reason I've given - this icon should not be visually linked to the keyboard layout) so I doubt it would be accepted in this form
[13:38] <Lordveda> I mean a true branch
[13:38] <kklimonda> Lordveda: becase that's not how ubuntu is being developed
[13:39] <slipttees> kklimonda: humm
[13:39] <Lordveda> kklimonda: How is Ubuntu developed that is contradictory with this way?
[13:43] <astraljava> Lordveda: Ubuntu has clear release dates, and set feature targets for each 6 months release, so there's no point in having a rolling release.
[13:43] <astraljava> Lordveda: Also many deliverables, which would be pretty hard to coordinate if this wasn't the case.
[13:43] <jtaylor> debian hasn'T got a rolling release either
[13:43] <jtaylor> they will freeze in june and then unstable will be what precise is now
[13:43] <slipttees> jibel: Hey
[13:44] <astraljava> jtaylor: Ok, poor choice of words.
[13:44] <astraljava> jtaylor: I meant that Debian doesn't have a known release date for the next one when the current is being released.
[13:45] <astraljava> As where Ubuntu knows very closely when the next dev cycle is ending.
[13:45] <jtaylor> I meant Lordveda#s comment "like debian unstable"
[13:45] <astraljava> s/closely/precisely/ (no pun intended)
[13:46] <jtaylor> ^^
[13:52] <Zoffix> Hey. How to turn off those dumb new scrollbars? I found this article, but I don't want to relogout/reboot: http://www.tuxgarage.com/2011/04/disable-overlay-scrollbars-in-ubuntu.html
[13:53] <kklimonda> Lordveda: we simply don't need a place to upload new versions of software most of the time, as we sync a lot of packages from debian anyway so most of our work (outside of main) is integration and testing
[13:53] <Zoffix> The guy in the comment said to use export LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=0, but that did jack for me :/
[13:53] <slipttees> jibel: http://ubuntuone.com/6tLSN25hCULekqrtFgJwsA
[13:53] <kklimonda> Zoffix: you have to relogin/reboot for LIBOVERLAY_SCROLLBAR=0 to take effect, otherwise it will only affect your current shell
[13:54] <Zoffix> That sucks.
[13:55] <kklimonda> Zoffix: you can also remove packages that ship those scrollbars
[13:55] <kklimonda> it wouldn't require reboot/relogin but it's a more drastic solution
[13:55] <Zoffix> kklimonda, I already did, I believe, but it seems I still need to reboot.
[13:55] <kklimonda> Zoffix: no, but you have to restart each application that uses them
[13:58] <Zoffix> Ha. Ha. Ha. Turns out the "Reset" button is actually a "Logout" button..
[14:00] <Zoffix> It feels like this beta2 is actually alpha1
[14:01] <Zoffix> It feels like this beta2 is actually alpha1
[14:01] <Zoffix> oops.. Sorry, focus bug..
[14:02] <kklimonda> beta is supposed to have bugs
[14:02] <kklimonda> otherwise it wouldn't be called beta ;)
[14:02] <Zoffix> Sure, but I thought I read that now everything is "locked" or something, and only critical bugs will be fixed...
[14:03] <Zoffix> An improperly renamed button isn't really critical *shrug*
[14:04] <kklimonda> not really, we are still fixing all the bugs we can find and reproduce
[14:04] <Zoffix> Ah, that's cool then.
[14:04] <kklimonda> but in this case it's more likely that the button is properly labeled but something else is broken so reboot doesn't work
[14:10] <itaylor57> !info xfce
[14:16] <Dr_willis> its xubuntu-desktop i belive.
[14:16] <Zoffix> Well, you were right. I rebooted and the button now works as advertised. (and my scrollbars are now normal too).
[14:16] <Dr_willis> may be a smaller package.
[14:19] <Lordveda> By the way, how to downgrade if the upgrade isn't working fine in a proper way??
[14:23] <eye-gor> Lordveda: I think reinstall
[14:24] <tomodachi> there is no downgrad path i n debian pased distros
[14:25] <tomodachi> at least not that i think is supported officially
[14:29] <jtaylor> use snapshots
[14:29] <jtaylor> e.g. via lvm or better zfs or btrf
[14:29] <jtaylor> I think for btrfs there should be a btrfs-upgrade with it automated
[14:31] <jtaylor> for zfs there is apt-clone (not the packaged one)
[14:52] <Xunil> Hi, is there currently any way to install wine and "circumventing" the gettext-bug in 64-bit ubuntu 12.04?
[14:55] <neclimdul> so... i tried to install skype and no apt-get and aptitude seem to be totally hosed
[14:56] <mateobur> hello
[14:56] <mateobur> HUD is not working for me
[14:56] <mateobur> I press <Alt> and nothing...
[14:57] <neclimdul> http://paste.ubuntu.com/910206/
[14:57] <neclimdul> everythign i do just ends with libcomerr2 errors
[14:59] <jtaylor> try dpkg -r libcomerr2:i386
[15:00] <neclimdul> jtaylor: ok, done. now i ran a couple commands and its asking for me to run apt-get -f install which just tries to reinstall it
[15:01] <jtaylor> try removing skype that pulls this thing
[15:10] <neclimdul> jtaylor: something else must be doing it as well. purging skype says there's no package but its still trying to do it
[15:25] <bjsnider> neclimdul, is that libcomerr2 deb in /var/cache/apt/archives/ ?
[15:25] <neclimdul> bjsnider: libcomerr2_1.42-1ubuntu2_i386.deb
[15:26] <bjsnider> yeah so install it manually with dpkg -i
[15:27] <neclimdul> bjsnider: well apt-get can install it just fine. i think the problem is somehow my system is halfway between adm64 and i386
[15:28] <bjsnider> if you install it and then ask for skype what happens?
[15:31] <Zoffix> I hear noise when I play audio (a crackling sound, as when you take off a staticy sweater). It wasn't there yesterday, any idea on how to fix?
[15:31] <neclimdul> skype depends on ia32-libs; however: Package ia32-libs is not installed.
[15:32] <kklimonda> neclimdul: and try installing ia32-libs ?
[15:34] <neclimdul> well that did something
[15:34] <neclimdul> will tell you how it goes in a few
[15:36] <Zoffix> Never mind, I ran alsamixer -Dhw and moved the PCM slider and the problem is gone (the solution from this thread: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=987252)
[15:37] <neclimdul> Zoffix: sounds like the level was too high
[15:37] <neclimdul> kklimonda: downloaded some files then the same error
[15:39] <kklimonda> ah, error
[15:40] <kklimonda> neclimdul: you are in for a ride ;)
[15:40] <kklimonda> neclimdul: first lets try removing it
[15:41] <kklimonda> neclimdul: see if that helps: dpkg --force-depends -P libcomerr2:i386
[15:41] <kklimonda> and then apt-get -f install
[15:42] <kklimonda> purging should remove all content from dpkg database
[15:42] <kklimonda> maybe just removing package wasn't enough, and something was left out
[15:43] <neclimdul> mhm
[15:44] <neclimdul> kklimonda: well it didn't try to reinstall libcomerr2 this time. it did list a bunch of :i386 packages though. then when i accepted it gave the same no filename for libcomerr2  error
[15:44]  * neclimdul can paste if helpful
[15:47] <kklimonda> neclimdul: try reinstalling both libcomerr2_1.42-1ubuntu2_i386.deb and libcomerr2_1.42-1ubuntu2_amd64.deb from /var/cache/apt/archives
[15:47] <kklimonda> god, those multiarch errors are something new
[15:48]  * neclimdul blames skype
[15:49] <neclimdul> kklimonda: i might know more about what went wrong but i was lazy and installed it by clicking on the .deb in dolphin and muon didn't give me any useful output
[15:51] <neclimdul> well the 64bit version isn't in the cache but i did have it lying around from hacking earlier :)
[15:52] <kklimonda> (make sure both have the same version)
[15:53] <neclimdul> libcomerr2_1.42-1ubuntu2_i386.deb and libcomerr2_1.42-1ubuntu2_amd64.deb
[15:53] <neclimdul> look the same
[15:54] <kklimonda> yeah
[15:55] <neclimdul> kklimonda: after installing them run apt-get -f install again?
[15:55] <kklimonda> yeah
[15:56] <eye-gor> I cant believe we are going live with ambiance theme like this > https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/light-themes/+bug/925895/comments/62
[15:56] <neclimdul> well selecting and unpacking this time. looks promising
[15:57] <kklimonda> eye-gor: why? it actually looks good
[15:57] <kklimonda> more readable than in 11.10
[16:00] <neclimdul> kklimonda: wow it finished! thanks!
[16:03] <eye-gor> kklimonda: No way looks good. Ambiance is a dark theme why the mismatch
[16:04] <eye-gor> kklimonda: Ambiance is 11.10 is really nice
[16:08] <neclimdul> kklimonda: everything looks good. upgrades ran and skype installed without hickup.
[16:08] <kklimonda> neclimdul: great
[16:08] <neclimdul> going to part but i'm on freenode all the time. if someone wants details or something i'll hold onto this console log, just pm me
[16:09] <kklimonda> eye-gor: ambiance wasn't really a dark theme before
[16:09] <kklimonda> it has some dark elements
[16:10] <Daekdroom> I think the current approach makes sense.
[16:10] <Daekdroom> and it took me little time to get used to the white context menus
[16:10] <kklimonda> they'll most likely create a dark version because Gtk+ 3.0 supports both and some applications look good with a dark theme
[16:11] <kklimonda> but dark theme never really worked for majority of gtk apps
[16:11] <Daekdroom> I remember there used to be a dark version of Ambiance in maverick that they were trying to use in some apps, but it never made it past Beta.
[16:12] <kklimonda> yeah, there was a dark variant in development
[16:12] <kklimonda> but I can't think of applications that made use of it then
[16:12] <kklimonda> totem supports it since 3.0
[16:12] <kklimonda> and gnome boxes (or whatever it's called)
[16:13] <kklimonda> and I can think of quite a few good uses for the dark variant so I expect Canonical to create it during 12.10 cycle
[16:13] <eye-gor> Hope so cos that awesome bar does not look good.
[16:13] <Daekdroom> GNOME Terminal would look much better in black.
[16:14] <eye-gor> Daekdroom: Mine is. ;)
[16:14] <kklimonda> Daekdroom: it actually had dark tabs at some point
[16:15] <kklimonda> and it didn't look that good imo
[16:15] <eye-gor> I got white on black with transparency
[16:15] <Daekdroom> I don't think the current white tabs fit it very well.
[16:15] <hggdh> anyone noticing /usr/lib/indicator/app-menu/hud-service resident memory increasing in time? Mine has reached 850M
[16:15] <Daekdroom> You have a black titlebar, then white tabs, then a purple box....
[16:15] <Daekdroom> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-appmenu/+bug/967879
[16:16] <hggdh> Daekdroom: muchos thanks
[16:19] <hggdh> it is, actually, just another memory-hungry appl, like thunderbird and chromium-browser and firefox
[16:21] <kklimonda> https://plus.google.com/115547683951727699051/posts/MuB3MkCnieK lol
[16:21] <Daekdroom> hggdh, nope.
[16:22] <Daekdroom> There is a memory leak in there.
[16:22] <Daekdroom> Because the RAM usage increases over time and the only way to recover it is to kill the process.
[16:22] <hggdh> Daekdroom: I know. My point there is with these four, I am able to run out of memory in 24 hours
[16:25] <kklimonda> hggdh: well, I did have a compiz memory leak in 11.10
[16:25] <kklimonda> compiz leaked something around 1M per second
[16:25] <kklimonda> or even faster
[16:25] <hggdh> kklimonda: I remember :-)
[16:25] <kklimonda> now that was a resource hungry app ;)
[16:25] <hggdh> heh
[16:26] <hggdh> I agree, I cannot repeat it with thunderbird -- my rate there is around 1G per 8 hours
[16:26] <kklimonda> hud-service shouldn't really use that much memory
[16:27] <kklimonda> every time someone asks on irc if my hud-service is leaking I check it, and it never is ;)
[16:27] <kklimonda> although I almost never use it
[16:27] <kklimonda> I'm still trying to figure out how to integrate it into my workflow
[16:30] <hggdh> I do not either, but it seems I hit the Alt key quite frequently (and have them to close HUD)
[16:31] <kklimonda> hggdh: do you press alt by itself that often, or are you hitting another bug where alt+key brings hud?
[16:32] <ironhalik> I dont think HUD provides the same quality jump for UI as dash/launchy/win7 search bar does
[16:32] <kklimonda> hud was unusable to me at the beginning as I was apparently pressing keys too fast resulting in hud opening on every alt-tab
[16:32] <kklimonda> I'm pretty sure they will be refining it as they go
[16:32] <hggdh> kklimonda: usually hitting in combination (Ctrl-Alt-arrows, Ctrl-Alt-Shift-arrows, Crtl-Alt)
[16:32] <kklimonda> but that begs the question why throw it into LTS :/
[16:32] <hggdh> and Alt-Tab, of course :-)
[16:33] <kklimonda> I'd still prefer LTS releases to be focused entirely on stability issues
[16:33] <kklimonda> aka no new features (other than Firefox! ;))
[16:33] <kklimonda> hggdh: that sounds like a bug
[16:33] <hggdh> aye
[16:33] <ironhalik> well, faster unity is a welcome feature ;>
[16:33] <kklimonda> hggdh: neither of those combinations bring hud for me and I press them really fast
[16:33] <kklimonda> ironhalik: sure, they could work on performance too
[16:33] <hggdh> kklimonda: I am not that fast :-)
[16:34] <Daekdroom> Apart from the UI updates, I think Rhythmbox over Banshee is the only new 'feature'.
[16:34] <hggdh> and it does not happen always
[16:34] <kklimonda> hggdh: I'd actually expect it to be the case when the faster you press those combinations the bigger chance is some timeout is not being reached and hud opens
[16:34] <kklimonda> hggdh: maybe you use some VM?
[16:34] <spacebug-> hggdh: I also seemd to press alt often and I brought up the HUD so I disabled the shortcut for that but of course you can change it to another key instead. I'm using alt+(number) in irssi to change window and that made me often bring up the HUD =)
[16:35] <kklimonda> there was this ugly bug when all alt+key sent to VM actually opened hud
[16:35] <kklimonda> I don't know if that's fixed but it was so bad that you couldn't even alt-tab ;)
[16:35] <hggdh> kklimonda: no, this is on my bare-metal. I rarely use Ubuntu desktop on a VM
[16:35] <kklimonda> because it stole key focus from VM and opened the hud
[16:35] <hggdh> yes
[16:35] <hggdh> but I do use VM a lot for server images, and the focus issue is there
[16:36] <spacebug-> kklimonda: alt+tab bug is fixed and so is the bug that made the current application catch the keystroke for changing desktop
[16:36] <kklimonda> spacebug-: great :)
[16:36] <spacebug-> yeah ;)
[16:36] <kklimonda> now only if they fixed like 4 different issues with unity and workspaces I hit all the time :(
[16:36] <spacebug-> kklimonda: like?
[16:37] <kklimonda> spacebug-: for example when I set window to use left half of the screen on the left workspace, switch to the right one, and then use super+# to switch back to the application it changes workspace instead
[16:37] <kklimonda> (i.e. application moves from the left workspace to the right one)
[16:38] <kklimonda> it's probably related to the fact that even if a very small part of the window is on the workspace unity considers that the entire window is there and just gives it focus
[16:39] <kklimonda> so I've also found myself often wondering why nothing is happening when I try to change application just to notice a tiny part of the window showing on the top of my current workspace
[16:39] <spacebug-> kklimonda: that does not happen for me
[16:40] <hggdh> happens here
[16:41] <kklimonda> spacebug-: just create a nautilus window on the bottom-right workspace, move it down a little so part of its window is "below" the desktop and switch to the top-right workspace
[16:42] <kklimonda> spacebug-: when you press alt-tab you'll notice that you can switch to nautilus, and when you do that it will move between workspaces
[16:43] <itaylor57> KM0201, xfce is working well
[16:43] <spacebug-> now I get what you mean
[16:43] <KM0201> itaylor57: you're lucky.
[16:43] <KM0201> it drove me nanners
[16:43] <spacebug-> kklimonda: is that really a bug or a design thing?
[16:43] <kklimonda> spacebug-: it's definitely not what I'd expect
[16:43] <itaylor57> KM0201, what are you using these days?
[16:43] <KM0201> lxde
[16:43] <itaylor57> ahh
[16:44] <spacebug-> if a window is on multiple desktops then how should it be handled?
[16:44] <KM0201> for... about 6-7mo I think.. I love it
[16:44] <kklimonda> spacebug-: but the problem is it often happens without your input
[16:45] <spacebug-> kklimonda: well you had to press alt+tab to switch to the application for it to change workspace right?
[16:45] <spacebug-> but that also makde it move so the menu/titlebar is on the active workspace
[16:46] <kklimonda> spacebug-: yes, but I was expecting unity to switch to the correct workspace, and not application moving between workspaces
[16:47] <kklimonda> spacebug-: for example it happens sometimes when another bug makes unity place the window so part of it is outside of the screen (and so it's placed between workspaces)
[16:47] <kklimonda> spacebug-: in this case window moving between workspaces on alt-tab is completely confusing
[16:47] <spacebug-> you dont even have to use multiple workspaces just move a windows more that half it size up the screen and alt+tag and it will move it down to show the menu/bar
[16:47] <digikwondo> hi foks.  running 12.04 with gnome classic. how do i delete shortcuts from the panel. when i rightclick i only get launch and properties.
[16:48] <spacebug-> well actuallt that is doing the same so forget what I said
[16:49] <spacebug-> kklimonda: you might be right there. I rarely have widows on multiple workspaces so I never think about that
[16:50] <kklimonda> (I wonder if I actually reported this one)
[16:51] <spacebug-> but yes unity handles windows strange sometimes. Like if you are on one workspace and start a client machine in virtualbox and while that machine is booting up you switch to another workspace, then when the machine has botted up it will bring its window to the active workspace but you will not be able to alt+tab to it. It's like it does not know witch workspace it is on. You can though use ctrl+alt+tab (switch thorough all
[16:51] <spacebug-> applications on all workspaces) to get to it
[17:07] <Jacsjees> hi team i got a message in my 12.04 asking to do a partial update but it fails on the mid way I am not able to update my system can some one help please
[17:08] <Dr_willis> try a simple 'sudo apt-get update' 'sudo apt-get upgrade' then 'sudo apt-get dist-upgrade'  perhaps?
[17:08] <Dr_willis> its possible theres some issue that may get fixed over the next few days also.
[17:09] <Jacsjees> E: Could not get lock /var/lib/apt/lists/lock - open (11: Resource temporarily unavailable)
[17:09] <Jacsjees> E: Unable to lock directory /var/lib/apt/lists/
[17:09] <Dr_willis> you got another apt/package manager tool going perhaps.
[17:10] <andre_> I'm using Gnome 3 classic. How can I get rid of the bottom panel, i like using only awn.
[17:10] <Jacsjees> I dont see any please help me kill any if active from terminal
[17:10] <andre_> BTW, for any devs in here. 12.04 is awesome. Works great with my SSD and it recognize my sound card with no issues.
[17:11] <Daekdroom> andre_, try Alt + Right Click
[17:11] <Daekdroom> If you are using compiz, Super + Alt + Right Click
[17:13] <andre_> Daekdroom, that let's me get rid of one of them. But then the other delete panel is dimmed.
[17:13] <Daekdroom> I think that's because you can't delete all panels.
[17:15] <spacebug-> in gnome-terminal when pressing F10 I get same menu as clicking right mouse button. This is after disabeling F10 for "Menu shortcut key". Using mc I dont want that menu at all. Any way to disable that behaviour?
[17:18] <Dr_willis> spacebug-,  check the terminal settings again. I normally disable that also.
[17:18] <Dr_willis> spacebug-,  or i often make a launcher just for mc in a xterm, or other terminal app.
[17:18] <spacebug-> I have checked and nothing strange in keybindings
[17:19] <spacebug-> this started in 11.10 I think
[17:19] <spacebug-> Dr_willis: yes xterm works so well
[17:20] <Arnold> spacebug-, I guess because GNOME Terminal is a GNOME application, it respects the keybindings that it's being set within GNOME (and for Unity, in that case).
[17:21] <digikwondo> hi foks. quite irritating thing. i draged a tab in firefox to the top panel. its now a shortcut i cannot remove. right click gives "launch" and "properties"
[17:21] <digikwondo> running 12.04 with gnome classic.
[17:21] <Dr_willis> spacebug-,  not on a ubuntu box to check.  I use mc so much. i always make a custom xterm -fn XXXXXX -e mc   launcher. :)
[17:21] <Arnold> digikwondo, try Alt + Right-Click on it
[17:21] <spacebug-> ;)
[17:22] <digikwondo> Arnold: nothing happens....  just shows a longer description
[17:23] <Arnold> digikwondo, it should offer you with more options if you hold Alt while right-clicking.
[17:23] <digikwondo> Arnold: nope it wont . on my 10.04 machine it does but not in 12.04 with gnome-classic session
[17:24] <digikwondo> installed "gnome-panel" through software center. should i try reinstall ?
[17:24] <Arnold> digikwondo, that's because this behavior was altered within GNOME 3 which was added since Ubuntu 11.10
[17:24] <Arnold> Let me check it from my end by recreating your scenario.
[17:25] <digikwondo> Arnold: thanks mate ;)
[17:25] <Daekdroom> Try Super + Alt + Right Click, digikwondo
[17:25] <Daekdroom> Compiz uses Alt + Click for something else, so if you are using compiz as window manager, you'll need Super too
 Try Super + Alt + Right Click, , this worked! Thanks! been bugging me for days!
[17:26] <Arnold> Heh, I'm using mostly the non-Compiz one, so.. that's why it worked :P
[17:27] <Arnold> So in any case, whether it's Mutter or Metacity, it's only Alt+Right Click, so I guess only Compiz adds that extra Super key as prerequisite.
[17:29] <Dr_willis> we need s superduperkey next.....
[17:29] <spacebug-> lol
[17:30] <Dr_willis> Super-alt-ctrl-Omega-ultimate-long-press-pinch
[17:30] <Dr_willis> wife: 'How do i zoom in on this video on your tablet'   me: 'Pinch the screen'      her: 'wont i break it?'
[17:31] <Dr_willis> just using terms to describe all these actions these days.. is going to require a whole new language. :)
[17:33] <Roasted> hello!
[17:33] <Roasted> is anybody running 12.04 on a netbook by chance?
[17:35] <kklimonda> Roasted: I am
[17:35] <Roasted> kklimonda, what are the specs of your netbook?
[17:35] <Roasted> how would you say it runs?
[17:37] <Dr_willis> ran ok on my EEE netbook
[17:37] <kklimonda> Roasted: atom 1.66 with HT, some ghetto gpu supported by the i915 driver and a slow disk
[17:37] <Roasted> 3d, 2d?
[17:37] <Roasted> kklimonda, runs decent?
[17:37] <kklimonda> Roasted: unity 3d is not really usable when you start launching too many applications
[17:37] <kklimonda> Roasted: unity-2d works much better
[17:38] <Roasted> I just ask because I have two netbooks here. One is 1.5ghz AMD E240 single core with no HT, its kind of sluggish once I open 2-3 apps
[17:38] <Roasted> but my other netbook, Intel Atom 1.6ghz with HT and N10 chipset and SSD (albeit, not a super snappy one) works a bit better
[17:38] <Dr_willis> i tend to use lubuntu on my netbooks.
[17:38] <Roasted> Dr_willis, I think I might start doing that as well
[17:38] <kklimonda> Roasted: definitely worth switching to unity-2d
[17:38] <Roasted> I sure am growing to like Unity though.
[17:38] <Roasted> kklimonda, oh I'm on Unity 2D. :P
[17:39] <Roasted> kklimonda, the 1.5ghz single core with no HT just kinda chugs though
[17:39] <Dr_willis> with the little screen, and what i do on the netbook. lubuntu runs fine.
[17:39] <kklimonda> oh, I do have 2gigs of ram
[17:39] <Roasted> I think I do as well
[17:39] <Roasted> both of them have 2gb I believe
[17:39] <kklimonda> Roasted: what's using the most cpu? there is a bug with firefox and hud-service making them use a lot of cpu
[17:39] <Roasted> I don't use Firefox...
[17:39] <Roasted> :/
[17:40] <Roasted> it's hard to tell right now because my keyboard just stopped working on the 1.5ghz unit
[17:40] <Roasted> 2nd one I've replaced
[17:40] <Dr_willis> I use my netbook as a video player :) so its always vlc taking my cpu
[17:40] <Roasted> I just wanted to ask in here quick
[17:40] <kklimonda> Roasted: the truth is those older netbooks are really underpowered
[17:41] <Roasted> yeah, I hear ya
[17:41] <kklimonda> their performance is good when you are running a single application
[17:42] <vatueil> hi, i want to install acpi-support on a server but it depends on x11-xserver-utils. is that really necessary?
[17:42] <Roasted> looks like unity 2d can spike up to about 30% if I hit the super key twice to enable it and disable it
[17:43] <penguin42> vatueil: Oh that's bizarre
[17:44] <hggdh> vatueil: what UBuntu version?
[17:44] <penguin42> vatueil: Oh I see, I think it contains a mix of scripts, some of which probably do things to X, hence the dependency
[17:44] <kklimonda> vatueil: all it really brings in is a couple of libraries
[17:44] <vatueil> penguin42:  12.04 nightly
[17:44] <vatueil> penguin42:  yeah but still i'd prefer if it didn't :) it seems to me that it should just recommend the x11 dependency
[17:45] <Zoffix> Hey, is there a way to autorestart a program if it crashes? I'm using openbox that keeps crashing, and I can only come up with so many ways to restart it without any window manager....
[17:45] <kklimonda> it's actually a decent argument
[17:45] <Roasted> ahh and there's a 90% spike
[17:45] <Roasted> but toned down
[17:45] <Daekdroom> lightdm is not starting for me during boot. I have to go to tty1 and use 'sudo service lightdm start'. Reinstalling lightdm and unity-greeter packages did not work for me. Any thoughts?
[17:45] <Zoffix> Err... Just thought of something; I could use this line in a terminal:    openbox --replace; openbox --replace;openbox --replace; and when one instance crashes, the other will be run. Duh!
[17:46] <penguin42> Daekdroom: Anything in /var/log/lightdm ?
[17:46] <gobatar> hi all, wireless setup problems on my HP pavilion, broadcom device is not working.. Any suggestions? thax
[17:46] <Daekdroom> lightdm.log      x-0.log          x-1.log          x-0-greeter.log  x-1-greeter.log
[17:47] <penguin42> Daekdroom: So, after reboot and before you've manually started lightdm has any of those files been written?
[17:47] <kklimonda> hggdh: you think moving xorg-xserver-utils from Depends to Recommends at this point is something core devs would at consider? It seems to be using xset in one of the scripts
[17:48] <Daekdroom> Be back in two minutes
[17:49] <hggdh> kklimonda: the depends is warranted -- it *is* using xset. The question is how important is this on a server, and if xorg-xserver-utils could be made a dependency of another core X11 package
[17:50] <hggdh> kklimonda: I personally always thought X11 dependencies on a server to be crap
[17:50] <hggdh> but I am not sure this would be accepted for 12.04 at this point in time. It might be considered for +1
[17:51] <kklimonda> hggdh: it seems that it's using xset to blank/restore the screen when X is running
[17:51] <hggdh> kklimonda: ah, I was downloading the source now :-)
[17:51] <penguin42> kklimonda: Does it test for X running before doing that, or just does it do it anyway?
[17:51] <hggdh> there is NO sense in using X to blank a screen on a server
[17:52] <Daekdroom> penguin42, yes, there are files there.
[17:52] <penguin42> Daekdroom: So, any of them got any fun failure messages in?
[17:52] <penguin42> hggdh: It depends on your definition of a server; some people run servers that do things like run tape drives with backup management software on the local head
[17:53] <penguin42> hggdh: Or leave a head running a display of nagios or the like
[17:53] <hggdh> penguin42: for me, old school and all that, a server does not have X. It it is running X, it is not a server, it is a beefed up desktop.
[17:54] <penguin42> hggdh: Yeh, that's just what I'm disagreeing with
[17:54] <hggdh> penguin42: this is even more true on Precise, were we consolidated the kernel images
[17:54] <hggdh> there might be other reasons to have X support, like tunneling -- some software out there simply cannot be installed without X
[17:54] <Daekdroom> penguin42, no specific failure messages, but there are some weird things there.
[17:55] <penguin42> Daekdroom: pastebin?
[17:55] <Daekdroom> 1 moment
[17:55] <penguin42> hggdh: But I agree you shouldn't require it when unneeded
[17:56] <hggdh> penguin42: oh, yes, of course I do agree. I just do not know if this will be accpeted at this point in time. This *may* have other consequences.
[17:56] <Daekdroom> penguin42, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/910433/
[17:56] <hggdh> I am looking at the bug history now to find why this was done
[17:57] <Daekdroom> Ah. There's something weird at the beginning of x-0-greeter.log too. I'll pastebin it.
[17:58] <hggdh> penguin42: I think this is there mostly historically -- the change was introduced on Breezy; at this point in time, pretty much only laptops had ACPI support (really)
[17:58] <Daekdroom> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/910437/
[18:00] <kklimonda> penguin42: it does seem to be checking if X is running (looking for /tmp/.X11-unix/*) before actually calling xset so it should be safe to remove it unless there are other scripts that depend on utils from xorg-xserver-utils
[18:01] <vatueil> kklimonda:  +1 that's exactly what I was hoping for
[18:01] <vatueil> just check if x is installed and if not don't call the x commands. they are IMO not really related to the other ACPI features
[18:02] <penguin42> Daekdroom: Those look like it successfully starting; are you sure that's before you started it manually? It just seems to have authentication complete fo ruser marcos, so seems to be logging you in, and has a starting session ubuntu-2d
[18:02] <penguin42> kklimonda: Nod
[18:02] <Daekdroom> penguin42, I haven't used ubuntu-2d in quite awhile.
[18:02] <Daekdroom> and I copied the folder to my /home from tty1.
[18:02] <Daekdroom> after rebooting.
[18:03] <kklimonda> hggdh: also, aren't we dropping acpi-support anyway soonish? I kinda remember someone (slangasek?) mentioning it ;)
[18:03] <kklimonda> (soonish != in precise cycle of course)
[18:03] <vatueil> kklimonda:  what would it be replaced with?
[18:03] <kklimonda> vatueil: I don't know
[18:03] <hggdh> kklimonda: yes, I am raking my memory -- I have this dimm feeling it was going out
[18:03] <kklimonda> systemd? ;)
[18:04]  * hggdh shudders
[18:04] <kklimonda> systemd seems to be replacing pretty much everything these days ;)
[18:04] <penguin42> Daekdroom: Hmm, I'd be tempted to nuke the content of that lot and try again and see what new is written
[18:04] <hggdh> can it replace Thunderbird?
[18:05] <kklimonda> hggdh: it's not really that bad - it has its quirks, but I'd be happy for Ubuntu to replace upstart with systemd if it'd make other distributions follow ours (and RHELs) suit.
[18:05] <Daekdroom> penguin42, so I should erase all the files there and do it again?
[18:05] <kklimonda> I can already imagine a brave new world where each distribution doesn't use its own init system ;)
[18:05] <hggdh> vatueil: you can test it if you want -- download the package, force-install it, and observe...
[18:05] <penguin42> Daekdroom: That's what I'd be tempted to do - just so you can see what errors are being written when it fails
[18:05] <Daekdroom> kk
[18:05]  * hggdh is not responsible for any breakage resulting from above suggestion
[18:06] <vatueil> hggdh:  sorry it's a production server :) can't really do that
[18:06] <kklimonda> actually, there is a nifty dpkg tool created just for this usecase
[18:06] <kklimonda> it fakes dependencies
[18:06] <hggdh> vatueil: actually, I am happy you will NOT do it
[18:06] <kklimonda> vatueil: well, do it on a testing machine first
[18:06] <vatueil> kklimonda:  oh that's interesting. what's its name?
[18:06] <hggdh> vatueil: I will do it on one of my test servers
[18:06] <kklimonda> vatueil: let me think..
[18:07] <kklimonda> equivs
[18:07] <kklimonda> vatueil, hggdh ^
[18:07] <vatueil> hggdh:  thanks! let me know if it works (and it would be really awesome if that change would make it into 12.04)
[18:07] <kklimonda> god, the name is so obscure
[18:07] <kklimonda> but it's a very... clean solution to the wrong problem ;)
[18:07] <hggdh> heh
[18:08] <kklimonda> and it's more or less oficially sanctioned by debian devs to solve problems like "why is php depending on a http server"
[18:09] <vatueil> kklimonda:  ah i think i saw some of those packages somewhere once, e.g. "http-server-dummy"
[18:09] <hggdh> ugh -- full list of depends for acpi-support: acpid consolekit libck-connector0 libpam-ck-connector libx86-1 pm-utils radeontool toshset vbetool xinput
[18:10] <hggdh> and this is on a server running Precise
[18:10] <vatueil> hggdh:  well radeontool and toshset is only recommended i think
[18:10] <vatueil> hggdh:  but +1 on the ugh
[18:10] <kklimonda> indeed
[18:10] <Daekdroom> penguin42, it didn't write anything.
[18:10] <kklimonda> Recommends: toshset, radeontool, xinput, wireless-tools
[18:11] <penguin42> Daekdroom: Makes you wonder if it ever tried to start at all
[18:11] <Daekdroom> I think it's getting stuck somewhere in the boot.
[18:11] <Daekdroom> Yeah.
[18:11] <Daekdroom> Is it /var/log/boot.log where I can check that?
[18:11] <penguin42> Daekdroom: I'm guessing lightdm starts after something else and has a dependency and whatever that was stopped - perhaps initctl or some other upstart debug will tell me - I'm not good at debugging upstart
[18:12] <kklimonda> Daekdroom: can you paste dmesg somewhere?
[18:12] <kklimonda> Daekdroom: I've had a weird oops in kernel which prevented lightdm from starting (probably some weird upstart dependency issue) but didn't actually affect boot ;)
[18:12] <hggdh> vatueil: yes, you are correct.
[18:13] <penguin42> there is some new debug/logging in the new upstart in pp I think, can't remember how it works
[18:14] <kklimonda> penguin42: oh? that would be nice, the logging I know was pretty... hard to actually read ;)
[18:14] <yofel> the old way was adding --verbose to the kernel command line
[18:14] <yofel> haven't heard of anything newer yet
[18:14] <kklimonda> god I still remember debuging issues where the underlying problem was broken /etc/network/interfaces not bringing loopback up..
[18:16] <penguin42> Daekdroom: /var/log/upstart perhaps?
[18:16] <Daekdroom> kklimonda, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/910464/ the problem is clearly at those last two lines
[18:16] <Daekdroom> Oddly I don't have gdm installed
[18:17] <andre_> Ok, i was in here a bit earlier asking about how to remove the bottom panel in Gnome 3 classic.
[18:17] <andre_> I got it.
[18:18] <andre_> kill all gnome-panel processes, then open term and sudo mv /usr/bin/gnome-panel /usr/bin/gnome-panel.bck
[18:18] <andre_> that'll get it for good, then you can use AWN or Cairo. I'm an AWN guy. Anyhow, that's it.
[18:19] <yofel> Daekdroom: what's your default display manager?
[18:19] <Daekdroom> yofel, lightdm
[18:19] <kklimonda> andre_: that's not really a way to remove the bottom panel
[18:19] <andre_> kklimonda, how's that?
[18:19] <Daekdroom> It'll come back as soon as you upgrade the gnome-panel package, andre_
[18:19] <kklimonda> I'd call it a hacky wacky solution
[18:19] <kklimonda> andre_: next gnome-panel update will restore this file
[18:20] <andre_> Daekdroom, well, that is true, but I can always neglect to upgrade that file or do the same thing when it does get upgraded.
[18:20] <kklimonda> andre_: when I was using gnome2 there was a gconf key which you had to modify to stop it from launching gnome-panel
[18:20] <Zoffix> Hey, how can I restore the screenshot app we had earlier, the one that opens the window and asks where to save or gives you an option to copy to clipboard?
[18:20] <andre_> I'd also assume that it wouldn't be getting much updates since they're moving on with Gnome3 shell.
[18:20] <Daekdroom> Zoffix, are you using Unity?
[18:20] <Zoffix> Daekdroom, no, gnome classic
[18:20] <andre_> kklimonda, I know about that one , but it doesn't exits in gnome 3 classic.
[18:20] <jbicha_> you could create a new .session that won't autostart gnome-panel
[18:21] <andre_> jbicha_, hmm... how's that?
[18:21] <kklimonda> andre_: but I'd look for the similar solution for the post gnome2 world
[18:21] <Daekdroom> Zoffix, it still works that way for Unity, but Gnome developers asked for Ubuntu to not touch on how it works for other Gnome sessions (saving directly to a folder)
[18:21] <hodgy> Hi
[18:21] <andre_> kklimonda, no where to be found yet. i've looked. That bottom panel was driving me insane.
[18:22] <Zoffix> Daekdroom, mkay, seems like Gnome really regressed majorly. I don't see how saving to a folder is more useful than having all the options opened to your fingertips *sigh*
[18:22] <hodgy> I just installed the 12.04 beta, anything neat I should look at? I'm running it in virtual box
[18:22] <Daekdroom> Zoffix, it's something to do with their new approach to key shortcuts.
[18:23] <jbicha_> andre_: look in /usr/share/xsessions and /usr/share/gnome-session/sessions
[18:23] <kklimonda> Zoffix: what does launching gnome-screenshot -i does ?
[18:23] <kklimonda> does does* sigh
[18:25] <Zoffix> kklimonda, better than nothing, definitely. Almost the same as the old way, except now I get too many options. I guess you can't win, lol. Thanks.
[18:25] <Zoffix> Now I have trouble finding how to disable sound effects....*sigh*
[18:25] <kklimonda> I wonder how it works in gnome-shell
[18:25] <Zoffix> I think I might as well just install KDE.. same learning curve anyway, it seems with all the changes.
[18:26] <kklimonda> because there it uses some dbus calls to take screenshots
[18:26] <kklimonda> I wonder if gnome-shell actually handles indicating to the user that screenshot has been taken (and where it went)
[18:27] <kklimonda> Zoffix: well, you can always switch to Unity - learning curve is definitely better here, then when you switch to KDE ;)
[18:27] <jbicha_> Zoffix: how are you trying to start gnome-screenshot?
[18:27] <Zoffix> jbicha_, by pressing PrintScreen button
[18:28] <jbicha_> Zoffix: yeah, try looking for Take Screenshot in the Activities Overview, or run gnome-screenshot -i
[18:28] <Zoffix> kklimonda, I hate unity. It completely annuls my working habits I used for years (both at home and at work).
[18:28] <kklimonda> damn, it makes me wondering what kind of habits do people have :D
[18:28] <kklimonda> I've been using gnome for years and switching to unity took little to no effort on my part
[18:28] <Zoffix> kklimonda, I have 20 workspaces.....
[18:28] <Zoffix> ...'nuf said I think :)
[18:28]  * yofel only had to adjust his habits slightly when he switched to KDE in karmic
[18:28] <kklimonda> Zoffix: geez
[18:29] <yofel> haven't really tried unity in precise yet
[18:29] <kklimonda> Zoffix: how do you group applications to so many workspaces?
[18:29] <kklimonda> yofel: it's definitely better than in 11.10
[18:31] <Zoffix> kklimonda, xchat in workspace 1, Firefox in workspace 2, image viewer with black screen in w3 to "turn off" monitor when I'm reading/studying. Then evolution in the last workspace, virtualbox in the before-last. The rest I use to open nautiluses/terminals/gftp, etc. I leave them open until all my workspaces are full, then I go and close anything I don't want.
[18:31] <Zoffix> kklimonda, and I live nautiluses/terminals open instead of closing right away, because I often need to go back to the dir I had them open on.
[18:31] <kklimonda> Zoffix: hmm, you run one application per workspace?
[18:32] <Zoffix> kklimonda, not really. If I'm trying to set something up, I have a terminal open on the same window as workspace. Right now I'm studying, so I have a separate workspace for my electronic lesson books and work books (LibreOffice documents).
[18:33] <kklimonda> Zoffix: mhm, makes sense - although seems a bit excessive
[18:33] <Zoffix> I can also see in the workspace switcher if some app finished running (like copying files or synaptic installing stuff).
[18:33] <yofel> that's the workflow KDE suggest with activities, but I can't really get used to that
[18:34] <Zoffix> kklimonda, well, I guess I could do with about 5 workspaces, but then I'd have to go on my "closing stuff I no longer need" more often.
[18:34] <Zoffix> The other thing I dislike in Unity is that I only get the icons of open windows on the side, and not their titles.
[18:35] <kklimonda> I run irc+im+mail on first workspace, webbrowser and random stuff on the second one, VMs with related apps on the third, and development tools on the fourth..
[18:35] <Zoffix> (and I trying running gnome-panel, but that's when everything started crashing left and right)
[18:36] <Zoffix> I have development tools run on a second monitor at work. That monitor has about 6 workspaces... Same concept, except each workspace is a separate project, for which I open quanta/kdevelop and a terminal.
[18:36] <kklimonda> although now that workspaces are a bit buggy the entire workflow took a hit
[18:36] <kklimonda> damn you beta
[18:36] <Zoffix> Speaking of which, I see quanta is no longer in the repos; what do people use for webdev these days?
[18:37] <kklimonda> I switch between vim and wing ide depending on what I'm writing
[18:37] <kklimonda> although I don't really do frontend stuff
[18:38] <penguin42> kklimonda: vim, lots and lots and lots of vim instnaces :-)
[18:38] <kklimonda> penguin42: ah, that's why I'm trying to switch to emacs
[18:38] <yofel> uh, vim has tabs and split windows you know...
[18:39] <kklimonda> with vim I always end up having it running in background with the file I'm trying to edit opened and I get a prompt
[18:39] <kklimonda> yofel: I've never really gotten used to vim window splitting and tabs
[18:39] <yofel> I use tabs a lot, window splitting not that much - there I had to remap the keys as the defaults hurt my hands
[18:39] <penguin42> kklimonda: Yeh I know some people who use the gvim, personally I just use lots of separate gnome-terminal tabs and terminals (and get lost in them)
[18:40] <yofel> hehehe
[18:40]  * yofel used to have lots of gnome-terminal windows open too back when he used gnome
[18:40] <yofel> now I'm using yakuake with byobu running inside
[18:40] <penguin42> yofel: Actually, at home it's konsole's; at work I still use Gnome
[18:41] <kklimonda> byobu is weird
[18:41] <kklimonda> I'm trying to use it on the servers and inside VMs
[18:41] <kklimonda> but then I quit it by accident
[18:41] <kklimonda> or forget to open a new window and just connect to the server again getting cloned byobu session..
[18:42] <hggdh> it is a question of getting used
[18:42] <kklimonda> I guess it's just taking some time to get used to it
[18:42] <kklimonda> yeah
[18:42] <yofel> works fine for me, just had to file a few bugs about the changes in byobu 5
[18:42] <yofel> but yeah, that happened to me in the beginning too
[18:43]  * penguin42 wishes it was more integrated with the konsole/gnome-terminals
[18:43] <kklimonda> also, do you have some nice tricks not to get lost with all those servers and VMs? hggdh? ;)
[18:43] <penguin42> kklimonda: I know people who use different colour backgrounds for their terminals for different hosts/users
[18:44] <kklimonda> last night I've removed a package from my desktop and not from the correct machine ;)
[18:44] <penguin42> kklimonda: sudo shutdown -h now   on the wrong machine is the worst - especially if it's remote or someones server :-)
[18:44] <hggdh> kklimonda: what I ended up doing is forcing some organisation on myself: I have one base tab for each remote I am working on, and I name it
[18:44] <kklimonda> hggdh: base tab?
[18:44] <yofel> penguin42: I did sudo pm-suspend once :(
[18:45] <kklimonda> penguin42: "ok, everything is done - now to reboot.. sudo shutdown -h now.. ABORT ABORT ABORT!! damn, and now I have to walk really fast" ;)
[18:45] <yofel> my organization is having the local byobu session always running in the first yakuake tab. Others are remote connections
[18:45] <penguin42> kklimonda: Nod! I once tried submitting a suggestion to shutdown and friends to require the hostname as the 1st parameter if it was interactive, people didn't like that - but they did point me to the molly-guard package
[18:45] <yofel> If I need another non-byobu terminal I run konsole
[18:45] <__rahul__> just upgraded to beta 2 and network keeps dropping continuously. anyone else have the same problem?
[18:46] <penguin42> __rahul__: Fine here; what type of nyetwork?
[18:46] <kklimonda> penguin42: wow, looks just like what I need
[18:46] <kklimonda> penguin42: I wonder if there is something similar for ifdown ;)
[18:46] <__rahul__> wifi
[18:46] <yofel> penguin42: thanks for pointing that out, didn't know about that either :)
[18:47] <hodgy> What is this I hear about gnome coming back to the new Ubuntu LTS?
[18:47] <penguin42> kklimonda: Remember, your level of stupidity increases every time you add a guard; you'll find a new way of killing the remote machine
[18:47] <kklimonda> hodgy: nothing, we do have a nice looking gnome classic session though (although it's not really gnome 2)
[18:47] <hggdh> kklimonda: each session has a name
[18:47] <hodgy> kklimonda: what do you mean it's not gnome2?
[18:48] <hggdh> kklimonda: the name is related to the target (server name, AWS, KVM, etc)
[18:48] <dubaco> !unity
[18:48] <kklimonda> hodgy: we have a session that looks similar to how gnome2 looked like but it's based on gnome3 packages so it's not the same)
[18:48] <kklimonda> hggdh: session?
[18:48] <hodgy> Gnome3 bothered me
[18:48] <dubaco> !notunity
[18:49] <hggdh> kklimonda: tabs? what happens when you Ctrl-C on byobu
[18:49] <hggdh> shell?
[18:49] <kklimonda> hggdh: ah, so you are using byobu
[18:49] <kklimonda> hggdh: a single tab per server?
[18:49] <hggdh> kklimonda: hell yes
[18:49] <kklimonda> and then they display server name?
[18:49] <kklimonda> in the tab
[18:49] <hggdh> kklimonda: as many as necessary, but all named after the server
[18:49] <__rahul__> Also, wireless connection asks for network key every time it connects. Have had this problem since 11.10
[18:49] <kklimonda> hggdh: oh wait, you run byobu locally?
[18:50] <hggdh> kklimonda: you Ctrl-$, and rename the tab
[18:50] <hggdh> yes
[18:50] <hggdh> and remotely when I need, but I NEVER net byobu sessions
[18:50] <hggdh> s/net/nest/
[18:50] <kklimonda> hggdh: damn, that sounds really awesome and way too complicated - I'm going to spend 8 hours on the train tomorrow so I'll try playing with it a bit :)
[18:51] <kklimonda> hggdh: yeah, this way madness lies ;)
[18:51] <hggdh> kklimonda: you have to get trained. But it beats Ctrl-A/(N|P) to find your session
[18:51] <hggdh> and I usually have from 9 to 15 sessions running at the same time
[18:52] <kklimonda> hggdh: do you have byobu locally configured to start when you login/open a new tab? or do you launch it by hand?
[18:52] <hggdh> I have it set to launch manually -- there is a problem with auto-launch (the screen size is inherited by all other connections)
[18:52] <hggdh> so I open roxterm, and lauch byobu
[18:53] <hggdh> then I run a bash script to set all the base sessions I need (still to set it under tmux, I am tweaking it still)
[18:53] <dubaco> unity stays on screen in 12.04 and wont go hide away
[18:53] <kklimonda> dubaco: unity?
[18:54] <dubaco> !unity
[18:54] <hggdh> dubaco: install myunity, run it, and configure the dash to vanish
[18:55] <kklimonda> hggdh: hmm, it may actually work :)
[18:56] <hggdh> kklimonda: again, it is a question of keeping on it, until it get to ba automagic. The only tweak still to do is clouring the tabs differently, so that I is more visible on WHICH tab I am at any point
[18:58] <kklimonda> hggdh: roxterm tabs?
[18:59] <hggdh> kklimonda: I *also* use the roxterm tabs when I need (for example, I get to go to a remote server where I want byobu running)
[18:59] <kklimonda> hggdh: ah, so you do everything that inside a local byobu?
[18:59] <kklimonda> wow ;)
[19:00] <hggdh> most of the times, yes
[19:00] <kklimonda> hggdh: care to take a screenshot one day so I can actually imagine how it would look like? :)
[19:00] <hggdh> but I am still to really RTFM -- I cannot jump directly to a byobu window if it is above 9
[19:01]  * Zoffix is liking KDE so far... shiny
[19:03] <Zoffix> Or not.. anyone knows how to make task manager to show windows only from the current workspace? I tried toggling the "..from current screen" and "...from current desktop", but they don't seem to do anything.
[19:04] <Zoffix> Never mind, needed to switch the workspaces for option to take.
[19:05] <hggdh> kklimonda: http://imagebin.org/206326
[19:07] <kklimonda> hggdh: do you open a single shell per server, or are those actually some sort of containers? /me knows really little about tmux/byobu :(
[19:08] <hggdh> kklimonda: it depends on the work I am doing. If, for example, I am getting to go twice to (say) batuan, I will have one tab called bataun, and another batuan-2
[19:09] <hggdh> for the KVM tabs, right now these are containers -- usually the same KVM, multiple sessions
[19:09] <hggdh> (right now kvm-1 and kvm-2 are in use, kvm-3 is actually sitting on a shell on my laptop)
[19:10] <kklimonda> what's the # at the end of the name for?
[19:10] <kklimonda> oh well, it's probably from tmux
[19:10] <kklimonda> time to dig docs ;)
[19:10] <hggdh> it signals there is new output waiting to be seen
[19:10] <hodgy> My 12.04 is being wobbly wtf
[19:11] <hodgy> It's sliding around, like... if I move my mouse it begins to sldie windows inside the workspace
[19:14] <Drakeson> Is there a way to disable the "blurry glass" effect from the Dash?  Dash already takes too long to appear.
[19:16] <kklimonda> Drakeson: you can do it using ccsm
[19:17] <kklimonda> but it doesn't seem to be working properly
[19:17] <kklimonda> Drakeson: also, why do you think it's actually blur that delays the dash?
[19:18] <anadon> dd is broken.  Ideas for getting it back in working order?
[19:18] <anadon> dd from coreutils
[19:18] <kklimonda> anadon: what do you mean by broken?
[19:20] <anadon> it outputs corrupted data.
[19:20] <anadon> I've checked the MD5's, tried multiple devices and multiple images, but it doesn't manipulate them correctly and the result is a corupted image.
[19:20] <anadon> kklimonda: up
[19:21] <Larcer> booting up the 12.04b1 cd, i get a blank screen and my monitor turns off. in other distros i've usually needed to use radeon.modeset=0 but here the screen blanks even before i have the option to do that... any ideas?
[19:21] <kklimonda> anadon: I don't really think dd manipulates data in any way
[19:21] <kklimonda> anadon: maybe the target disk is broken?
[19:21] <anadon> it streams it from one place to another and it shouldn't chANGE IT.  tHAT IS NOT HAPPENING, THOUGH.
[19:21] <kklimonda> anadon: can you confirm that it was working in the previous release?
[19:22] <anadon> kklimonda: tried 4 different .iso's and 4 different devices.
[19:22] <anadon> I use it regularly for copying .iso's to usb drives.
[19:23] <Drakeson> kklimonda: the blur effect other than taking [an unknown extra amount of] time, looks dreadful when you are not using a compositing window manager.
[19:24] <kklimonda> anadon: ok, open a bug, add the command line you writed (actually save the entire history from the session) check dmesg for errors and give a link to the image with its md5
[19:24] <anadon> kklimonda: ok
[19:24] <kklimonda> Drakeson: so you mean unity-2d?
[19:24] <Drakeson> yep
[19:25] <Drakeson> oh my bad, I forgot to mention that it is unity-2d.
[19:28] <Drakeson> Is unity-2d also customizable? (gconftool, gsettings, etc.)
[19:29] <kklimonda> it is, but you can't change dash blur
[19:29] <kklimonda> Drakeson: I'd poke people on #ubuntu-unity during work week
[19:29] <kklimonda> Drakeson: anyway, what kind of hardware can't handle compositing? ;)
[19:30] <Drakeson> kklimonda: Thanks. I'll do that.
[19:30] <bjsnider> answer: old junk
[19:31] <Drakeson> Hardware is not bad actually.  There is a mutual exclusion between compositing window managers and developer friendly window managers.
[19:33] <kklimonda> Drakeson: you can always run xcompmgr to get just compositing
[19:36] <Drakeson> kklimonda: But xcompmgr sucks!  Looking at /usr/share/doc/xcompmgr/changelog.Debian.gz now.  6 releases in total (2004, 2004, 2005, 2008, 2010, 2012).  I would not recommend xcompmgr to anyone!
[19:37] <Drakeson> Of course, that was supplementary evidence.
[19:38] <Drakeson> Why is "aptitude changelog <package name>" broken?
[19:40] <Drakeson> Actually, s/Why is/Is/
[19:40] <kklimonda> hard to tell, probably no one who uses it cares about this function :)
[19:40] <kklimonda> apt-get changelog works fine
[19:42] <BlessJah> kklimonda: :]
[19:46] <Drakeson> kklimonda: thanks.
[19:50] <imnichol> Is anyone else having an issues with the dash taking several seconds to display anything the first time that it's opened?
[19:58] <Drakeson> imnichol: Yes, I do.
[19:58] <imnichol> Do you know if there's a bug report?
[19:59] <Drakeson> No, I didn't try (as I am not sure if I want to keep Dash).
[19:59] <hovgaard>  I tried boot from both desktop and alternat beta2 image of kubuntu on i686 processor but both images complains of me having a non PAE CPU???
[19:59] <imnichol> hovgaard, how old is your computer?
[19:59] <hovgaard> can i send kernel params at boot so it wont boot pae kernel?
[19:59] <hovgaard> is i686 cpu
[19:59] <hovgaard> old one
[19:59] <penguin42> hovgaard: Yes, Precise needs PAE; however xubuntu still has a non-PAE kernel
[19:59] <micahg> hovgaard: try lubuntu or xubuntu
[20:00] <hovgaard> ahh cool thx
[20:00] <hovgaard> I will do
[20:00] <penguin42> hovgaard: Out of interest, do you know exactly which CPU it has?
[20:00] <hovgaard> thx alot
[20:00] <hovgaard> I can check it once i get it up
[20:00] <hovgaard> but uname -a gives report i868
[20:00] <hovgaard> i686
[20:01] <hovgaard> but extactly which cpu I eill post one I boot it in xubuntu
[20:01] <micahg> yes, not all i686 are PAE compatible
[20:01] <hovgaard> i will post once i boot ..
[20:02] <hovgaard> Yeah PAE = larger ram size adressable?
[20:02] <hovgaard> I am install for a friend already told him go trash it but he just looks unhappy every time I tell him :-)
[20:02] <penguin42> hovgaard: How much RAM does it have?
[20:03] <hovgaard> penguin42: I didtn see yet
[20:03] <hovgaard> But I was able to install beta1 on it
[20:03] <penguin42> hovgaard: OK, try xubuntu, if it's OK you can try installing the kubuntu packages, but if it's that old it may struggle
[20:03] <hovgaard> then upgrade and now it boots and hangs
[20:03] <hovgaard> :-)
[20:03] <hovgaard> Yeah I will give xubuntu
[20:04] <hovgaard> thanks alot for the quick answer and help soo cool
[20:05] <hodgy> Could anyone help me figure out why my thumbdrive will boot on my desktop but not my laptop? I'm trying to put 12.04 on my laptop
[20:05] <penguin42> hodgy: What's the laptop and how did you make the thumbdrive?
[20:05] <hovgaard> Is it both desktop i386 and alternate images of xubuntu that has non PAE?
[20:06] <penguin42> hovgaard: I'm pretty sure the desktop one has non-PAE
[20:06] <hovgaard> Ie can i just snatch i386 deskop image
[20:06] <hovgaard> oki cool thx
[20:06] <hovgaard> I will go for that one
[20:06] <hodgy> penguin42: The laptop is a Lenovo z560(sandy bridge), I used the universal usb creator from the ubuntu site
[20:07] <penguin42> hodgy: OK, so new hardware - what happens when you try and boot it on it?
[20:07] <hodgy> The z560 is a year old
[20:08] <hodgy> It says: Syslinux 4.05 EDD 4.06 -pre1 Copyright (C) 1994-2011 H. Peter Anvin et al
[20:08] <penguin42> and that's the last thing you see?
[20:08] <hodgy> And has a blinking cursor, but i cannot type in it
[20:08] <hodgy> yes it is
[20:08] <penguin42> ouch
[20:09] <hovgaard> hodgy:  wow that was early fail
[20:09] <penguin42> hodgy: OK, if that thumb drive boots on another machine the only suggestion I have is to bug report it - please tell us  the bug number on here
[20:09] <hodgy> Is it possible a bios update would help?
[20:09] <hovgaard> hodgy:  that sounds nasty
[20:09] <hodgy> What bug number?
[20:09] <penguin42> hodgy: What else is plugged into the laptop at the time you try to boot it? Is the thumb drive plugged directly into the laptop?
[20:10] <penguin42> hodgy: Create a bug for it, and tell us the bug number when you create it
[20:10] <hodgy> Just my thumb drive, nothing else plugged in
[20:10] <hodgy> Oh alright, how do I go about doing that?
[20:10] <penguin42> hodgy: Do you have a launchpad account?
[20:10] <hovgaard> hodgy How did you make the usbstick?
[20:10] <hodgy> universal usb installer, but i have had the same issue with unetbootin too
[20:10] <hodgy> I used unetbootin to put windows 7 on the same computer though
[20:10] <hovgaard> hodgin try dd
[20:11] <hodgy> I honestly have no clue how dd works, or what it is. And my main system is a windows box
[20:11] <hovgaard> sudo dd if=path/to/image of=/dev/yourstick bs=4098
[20:11] <hovgaard> ahh oki on linux no dd
[20:11] <hovgaard> ups on win
[20:11] <hovgaard> :-)
[20:12] <hodgy> Well I just installed 12.04 on my testing box
[20:12] <penguin42> hovgaard: bs=1024k should do - 4098 is a bit of an odd number
[20:12] <hovgaard> oki bs=1024 :-)
[20:13] <hovgaard> bs=4096 :-)
[20:13] <hovgaard> less odd :-)
[20:13] <hodgy> Im installing graphics drivers on my testing box, then ill reboot and try dd
[20:14] <penguin42> hodgy: Once you have a launchpad account, please report it at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+filebug?no-redirect
[20:14] <hovgaard> hodgy:  dd is a cool kitty
[20:14] <penguin42> hodgy: Make sure to state the model of laptop, how you wrote the thumb, and the way it failed
[20:15] <hodgy> Alright, let me go look at launchpad
[20:15] <penguin42> hodgy: Then tell us the bug number
[20:15] <hodgy> brb connecting from testing box
[20:22] <hodgy> okay just got irssi back on this system, in on 12.04 on my testing box so i can use dd
[20:23] <hovgaard> hodgy:  :-)
[20:25] <hodgy> Alright, so how does dd work again, and do I have to install it?
[20:25] <hovgaard> Weird xubuntu didnt allow me to uncheck encryption of home folder :-) Funny for a low cpu usage distro :-)
[20:25] <hovgaard> hodgy go to the Download folder
[20:25] <hovgaard> and type
[20:26] <hovgaard> sudo dd if=./name_of_your_image of=/dev/_device_name_of_usbstick bs=1024k
[20:26] <hovgaard> sudo fdisk -l           will give you name of all your harddisk and usb devices
[20:27] <hovgaard> becarefull not pick your main harddisk :-)
[20:28] <hovgaard> so if your usb stick is /dev/sdb the add that
[20:28] <hovgaard> or /dev/sdc
[20:29] <hovgaard> depends on how many disks in your computer
[20:30] <hodgy> sudo dd if=./12.iso of=/dev/sdb bs1024k
[20:30] <hodgy> That look right?
[20:30] <hovgaard> almost
[20:30] <hodgy> Before I run it, or am I doing it wrong
[20:30] <hovgaard> sudo dd if=./12.iso of=/dev/sdb bs=1024k
[20:31] <hovgaard> jus be sure
[20:31] <hovgaard> that sdb is your USB stick
[20:31] <hovgaard> otherwise you fucked
[20:31] <hovgaard> :-)
[20:32] <hodgy> It is I checked in disk utility
[20:32] <hodgy> should it be mounted or unmounted?
[20:32] <micahg> !ohmy | hovgaard
[20:32] <yofel> unmounted
[20:32] <hovgaard> ups :-)
[20:33] <hodgy> dd: unrecoginized operand 'bs1024k'
[20:33] <hovgaard> or is it ohmy :-)
[20:33] <hodgy> Try dd --help for more info
[20:33] <hovgaard> you need bs=1024k
[20:33] <hovgaard> forgot '='
[20:33] <hodgy> facepalm
[20:33] <hodgy> Thanks lol
[20:34] <hodgy> Okay I hit enter, and it's not showing anything yet, is this a lengthy thing?
[20:34] <hovgaard> hodgy:  You have been dd blessed :-)
[20:34] <hodgy> Im on an athlon x2 4200+ lol
[20:34] <hodgy> 2gb ddr2
[20:34] <hodgy> and a 3450
[20:35] <hodgy> 700+1 records in
[20:35] <hodgy> 700+1 records out
[20:35] <hovgaard> means it is happy and done
[20:35] <hodgy> 734310400 bytes (734mb) copied
[20:35] <hodgy> Woot, gonna try it on lappy now
[20:35] <hovgaard> so plug in and boot
[20:36] <hodgy> Booting
[20:36] <hodgy> Well it seems to be
[20:36] <penguin42> (that was a bit fast wasn't it?)
[20:36] <hodgy> Ubuntu screen just came up
[20:36] <hovgaard> penguin42:  Yup was fast
[20:37] <penguin42> hodgy: Before you pulled that stick did you make sure the light on it went out ?
[20:37] <hovgaard> On my dell i3 it would just took 2m44 sec to dd xubuntu iamge
[20:37] <hodgy> I didnt check a light
[20:37] <hodgy> My lenovo is a i3 380m, with intel hd graphics hooray sandy bridge, and 4gb ddr3
[20:37] <hodgy> its a snappy laptop
[20:38] <penguin42> hodgy: Be careful, it might not have actually finished writing to the USB stick; best thing to do is after the dd finished type the command    sync     wait for that to come back, then wait for any lights to stop blinking on the usb stick
[20:38] <hovgaard> hodgy: hope not to snappy :-)
[20:38] <penguin42> hodgy: Yeh but USB sticks are rarely that snappy whatever they're plugged into (unless it's USB3)
[20:38] <hovgaard> penguin42:  just sync no device names?
[20:38] <penguin42> just sync
[20:38] <hodgy> It said 9.1mb/s
[20:38] <hovgaard> penguin42:  nice one didnt know that one :-)
[20:39] <hodgy> A popup hit me woot
[20:39] <hovgaard> hodgy: is on a rool :-)
[20:39] <hodgy> Ubuntu 12.04 has experienced an internal error, if you note further problems try restarting
[20:39] <penguin42> hovgaard: It tries to push stuff out to disk - it doesn't 100% guarantee it's all got there
[20:39] <penguin42> hodgy: OK, go back, do that dd again, but this time do the sync, wait a few seconds and make sure the light stopped flashing then try again
[20:40] <penguin42> hodgy: I suspect it didn't all make it to the stick
[20:40] <hovgaard> sync only tries? Hmm then what command would gurantee :-)
[20:40] <hodgy> Alright I will do it again
[20:40] <penguin42> hovgaard: I'm not sure there is one
[20:41] <hovgaard> penguin42: Ohh well at leat sync is better than no sync
[20:41] <hovgaard> leat = least
[20:41] <penguin42> hovgaard: Hence why I add the wait for the lights to stop flashing and wait a few seconds
[20:42] <hovgaard> penguin42: Yup I just never saw any blinking after dd returned :-)
[20:42] <hodgy> It stopped blinking about 2 seconds after it completed
[20:42] <hodgy> now run what command?
[20:43] <hovgaard> hodgy:  I think your download of the image is corrupt
[20:43] <hovgaard> download new image
[20:43] <hovgaard> delete old one first
[20:43] <yofel> wait
[20:43] <guntbert> !md5sum
[20:44] <yofel> check the image checksums
[20:44] <yofel> as guntbert says
[20:44] <hodgy> No the download works fine
[20:44] <hovgaard> guntbert:  you got a point md5 to the rescue
[20:44] <hovgaard> but still 2 sec of dd = nonesense
[20:44] <guntbert> hodgy: do test it
[20:44] <hodgy> the pop up came from adding network, I had the image run in a VM for a while to play with
[20:44] <hodgy> dd took way longer then 2 seconds lol
[20:44] <yofel> some drives are that fast, and it depends on how much it cached
[20:45] <hovgaard> hodgy: ahh oki I thought you did dd in 2 sek
[20:45] <hodgy> No I meant when dd returned the completion, it stopped 2 seconds after lol
[20:45] <hovgaard> yofel:  I want a hot puter that can dd 720mb in 2 sec :-)
[20:46] <hodgy> So what is the command I run to double check that dd worked?
[20:46] <hovgaard> just sync
[20:46] <yofel> hovgaard: connect an SSD over usb3 and it should be possible I think ^^
[20:46] <hovgaard> to give dd extra time to ease out
[20:46] <hodgy> i ran sync, nothing returned
[20:46] <yofel> well, back to reality
[20:46] <hovgaard> yofel: Cool I am on ssd but usb 2 :-)
[20:46] <penguin42> hodgy: Yeh that's ok, but it tooik a few seocnds?
[20:46] <hovgaard> for my stick
[20:46] <hodgy> yes
[20:47] <hodgy> yes
[20:47] <penguin42> hodgy: Good, now if the lights stopped flashing on the USB stick - try it
[20:47] <hovgaard> hodgy:  I am ahead of you now I just completed xubuntu install on OOOOOOOOOOOOld cputer
[20:47] <hovgaard> lol
[20:48] <penguin42> hovgaard: Have you figured just how crusty it is?
[20:48] <hodgy> I do have to backup a shitload of stuff
[20:48] <hodgy> my my
[20:48] <hodgy> I almost have my 320gig hdd filled
[20:48] <hovgaard> penguin42:  I will after a one year long boot to xubuntu :-)
[20:49] <hovgaard> lspci | grep CPU to get the cpu info?
[20:49] <hovgaard> dmesg  | grep CPU to get the cpu info?
[20:49] <hovgaard> I meant
[20:50] <guntbert> hovgaard: lshw
[20:50] <hovgaard> oki cool lshw new trick more nice sync and lshw :-)
[20:50] <yofel> or cat /proc/cpuinfo
[20:50] <hovgaard> Good cmd day today
[20:50] <hovgaard> :-)
[20:51] <hovgaard> yofel: Yeah good one to
[20:57] <hovgaard_> penguin42: Oki cpu = Intel Pentium M  1.7 Ghz cpu family = 6 model = 13
[20:57] <hovgaard_> Auch 512 k RAM
[20:58] <hodgy> Is there any way I could make 12.04 navigatable fully without a mouse? besides stuff like web
[20:58] <hovgaard_> I should have forced my friend to dump it :-) lol
[20:58] <hovgaard_> But xubuntu rocks it install just smooth
[20:58] <zmaj> hi.. Who know way how to install old ati ( RV50) driver on latest ubuntu (12.04) ?
[20:59] <jbicha_> hodgy: 12.04 should be fully keyboard navigable, it's a bug if it isn't
[20:59] <hodgy> I mean from programs too
[20:59] <Amaranth> zmaj: If you don't have Radeon HD video you have to use the open source driver
[20:59] <hodgy> My mouse is terrible for this computer, so it'd be neat to do it that way
[21:00] <zmaj> Amaranth: and where to find that driver?
[21:00] <Amaranth> zmaj: Its installed and configured automatically, you already have it
[21:01] <hovgaard_> What is the xubuntu version of yakuake?
[21:01] <zmaj> nope... Actualy, after installation I was have Galeon ( or similar) but after update, I have Unknown driver
[21:02] <zmaj> Also, I have LCD monitor, but ubuntu says it's unknown too
[21:03] <penguin42> hovgaard_: Oh that's not too bad a machine - I've tried it on worse :-)
[21:03] <penguin42> hovgaard_: That is assuming you mean 512*M*B ram
[21:03] <Amaranth> zmaj: Sounds like you're having other issues
[21:03] <zmaj> Amaranth:  can you tell me how to find what is a problem?
[21:04] <Amaranth> zmaj: pastebin your /var/log/Xorg.0.log
[21:05] <zmaj> Amaranth:  sec please, to copy
[21:05] <hovgaard_> penguin42:  It is :-) 512 MB
[21:05] <hodgy> Athlon tm 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 4000+
[21:05] <hodgy> how old am i
[21:07] <hovgaard_> penguin42:  Do you know if its possible to do divx playback on i486DX machine?
[21:08] <penguin42> hovgaard_: No I don't; frankly I'm not sure there is any good use for an i486DX this day and age
[21:08]  * penguin42 disappears for a while
[21:08] <hovgaard_> penguin42:  And yes you guessed that is my friends second machine lol
[21:09]  * yofel had an old pentium1 166MHz with 148MiB RAM running as an svn server for a while
[21:09] <penguin42> hovgaard_: See, I thought my dads machines were bad; and I've got  a P90 as a firewall, but heck it's at bottom of the spec for even debian
[21:09] <yofel> was running debian though
[21:09] <zmaj> Amaranth: http://pastebin.com/QahzFgGj
[21:12] <Amaranth> zmaj: You tried to install fglrx
[21:12] <zmaj> yes... after I loose Driver
[21:12] <zmaj> but nothing
[21:12] <Amaranth> zmaj: sudo apt-get purge fglrx*
[21:12] <zmaj> sec please
[21:13] <Amaranth> It looks like you are using the radeon driver though
[21:13] <Amaranth> Which is the open source driver for your hardware
[21:14] <Amaranth> Having fglrx installed is likely at least breaking OpenGL (and thus Unity, gnome-shell, etc)
[21:14] <zmaj> Amaranth: I have
[21:14] <zmaj> 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 12 not upgraded.
[21:15] <zmaj> that was a last line.
[21:16] <Amaranth> Alright, well according to your xorg log everything is setup and working correctly
[21:16] <Amaranth> It even shows you have full 2D and 3D acceleration
[21:16] <Amaranth> You're using VGA to connect your monitor, apparently
[21:17] <zmaj> how to check 3D?   yes... VGA
[21:17] <Amaranth> zmaj: What was your actual problem? I suspect with VGA it'll always say Unknown Monitor in the UI
[21:19] <zmaj> no one 3D game wont's work
[21:19] <Amaranth> zmaj: Is unity working?
[21:19] <zmaj> actualy nothing 3d wont work
[21:20] <Amaranth> Have you restarted or at least logged out since uninstalling fglrx?
[21:20] <Amaranth> Well no, clearly not
[21:20] <zmaj> unity... what you call unity? A menu from left side who freeze when I start Eclipse..
[21:21] <zmaj> I was try to start Cube from unity menu... won't work
[21:21] <Amaranth> zmaj: Restart your computer now that you have fglrx removed and see if it still doesn't work
[21:21] <zmaj> I was try tu install fglrx several days before...
[21:21] <zmaj> I was restart PC, of course..
[21:24] <zmaj> Amaranth: It's here some way to check 3D ?
[21:26] <zmaj> Amaranth: I must to say, I have here one more Log file 1.log
[21:26] <Amaranth> zmaj: How did you try to install fglrx?
[21:27] <Amaranth> zmaj: Did you download something from a website?
[21:27] <zmaj> also I have Old.log
[21:28] <zmaj> NO man.... this time I am not install fglrx
[21:28] <Amaranth> When you did try to install it, how did you do so?
[21:29] <zmaj> that you see is from auto first time installation
[21:29] <Amaranth> I know you don't think you have it now but either you haven't restarted since uninstalling or you still have it
[21:29] <Amaranth> So I don't know how to help you, sorry
[21:29] <zmaj> you see.. after unsusecfull installation of fglrx, and ATI driver, i was make brand new installation
[21:30] <zmaj> oh no... sory... yes I am..
[21:30] <zmaj> sec to see...
[21:31] <zmaj> nope, I havent any Ati or fglrx installation in download section
[21:31]  * yofel wonders how apt's package status database and the dpkg database can get out of sync o.O
[21:34] <zmaj> Amaranth: what is here curentlly working 0.log  or 1.log
[21:49] <Steevca> I have just upgraded from 11.10 to 12.04 and my network isn't working.It's reporting that the device isn't ready.
[22:07] <Quaydon> Does anyone know where the libglut3 and libglut3-dev packages have gone?
[22:11] <itaylor57> !info libglut3-dev
[22:12] <glosoli> !info gimp
[22:12] <jtaylor> did that every really exist? it was an empty package in lucid
[22:13] <jtaylor> you probably want freeglut3-dev
[22:14] <Quaydon> ahh ok. So in lucid libglut3-dev "empty"? Does that mean it just pointed to freeglut3-dev?
[22:15] <jtaylor> yes
[22:15] <jtaylor> http://packages.ubuntu.com/lucid/libglut3-dev
[22:19] <Quaydon> Im still learning. So this means that on ubuntu 10.04 and 12.04 will have /usr/lib/libglut.so if their respective packages are installed?
[22:19] <jtaylor> yes
[22:19] <jtaylor> freeglut3 should work in lucid and precise
[22:20] <Quaydon> cool beans, Thanks for answering my questions :)
[22:41] <roasted> hello!
[22:50] <hovgaard_> new xubuntu install cant acces old data from olduser since home folder encrypted how to unencrypt? The old user isnt even created on system?
[22:52] <roasted> Hello!
[23:02] <Andolf> where should I start reading to know how to install/check compiz on fresh 12 install?
[23:04] <Andolf> ping...
[23:12] <worrow> anyone have issues with no sound in ubuntu 12.04 beta 2 in virtual machine?
[23:13] <bastidrazor> worrow: when i boot my sound is muted. is that possibly your case?
[23:14] <worrow> double checking
[23:15] <worrow> bastidrazor,  thats too funny. I checked all volume levels but the system.
[23:15] <worrow> thank you so much
[23:15] <bastidrazor> worrow: good deal :)
[23:15] <penguin42> I'm sure mute buttons are there just to confuse people :-)
[23:16] <bastidrazor> +1 for commonness :) :)
[23:16] <worrow> lol
[23:16] <Marcellina> Hello.
[23:16] <worrow> not sure why by standard it is muted
[23:17] <worrow> ok off to do some tests adding this room to favs
[23:17] <Marcellina> I'm trying to compile wine1.5 on "Precise Pangolin" but it's not working.
[23:18] <Marcellina> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wine1.4/+bug/944321
[23:18] <Marcellina> Same goes for wine1.5 and I don't know how to setup a 32-bit chroot to compile it.
[23:28] <Marcellina> How comes that dev packages are not cross-architecture co-installable on Precise?
[23:32] <Marcellina> Never mind, I'll use getlibs.
[23:34] <Marcellina> "getlibs: command not found"
[23:39] <Fudge> is control f4 supposed to also close a window as well as a tab
[23:40] <Fudge> using firefox oops
[23:47] <timothy> Hello
[23:48] <timothy> my ubuntu 12.04  beta 1 cant connect to my wireliess network
[23:49] <snadge> is this supposed to happen?
[23:49] <snadge>   PID USER      PR  NI  VIRT  RES  SHR S %CPU %MEM    TIME+  COMMAND
[23:49] <snadge>  2998 davidb    20   0 2470m 1.7g 1496 S    1 59.8  57:36.29 hud-service
[23:49] <timothy> nope
[23:49] <Daekdroom> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-appmenu/+bug/967879
[23:49] <timothy> :L
[23:50] <snadge> lol i like the (i think) part
[23:50] <timothy> the unity devs still refuse to implement click to minimize on the unity bar?
[23:50] <snadge> naw.. its supposed to use 1.7 gigs of ram ;)
[23:50] <Daekdroom> I like how its priority is 'undecided' :P
[23:50] <penguin42> yeh, I was about to set the priority, bu tit looks like it's been assigned to someone to fix, so I'll leave it
[23:50] <timothy> "able to move unity bar" REJECTED
[23:50] <Daekdroom> timothy, they're thinking of something else for the future.
[23:51] <snadge> well if i have enough ram.. i'll click on me too :P
[23:51] <timothy> well. i have the patch and im lovin it :::d
[23:51] <Daekdroom> 12.10, that is
[23:51] <timothy> is the HUD in the repos?
[23:51] <Daekdroom> Yes.
[23:51] <timothy> sudo apt-get install HUD?
[23:51] <Daekdroom> It's part of unity.
[23:52] <snadge> can you paste code in launchpad? ie.. proportional font?
[23:52] <timothy> E: Unable to locate package HUD
[23:52] <snadge> is there some kinda markup for that ;)
[23:54] <timothy> no package for HUD
[23:55] <Daekdroom> The package for HUD is 'unity' >.>
[23:55] <Daekdroom> It was included in 5.4 iirc
[23:56] <snadge> hmm.. someone with 8gb of ram in their laptop.. how times have changed
[23:57] <snadge> maybe devs should have some ram stolen from them so they notice these things a bit sooner ;)
[23:58] <Daekdroom>  I found it amusing someone reported unity-music-daemon uses 1G for them.
[23:58] <Daekdroom> Because rhythmbox lists 58,000 songs.
[23:58] <snadge> haha
[23:59] <snadge> thats what i love about object oriented programming
[23:59] <Daekdroom> and hell, it has lazy loading.
[23:59] <snadge> i bet each song is represented by a song object.. with 50 methods and buffers etc associated with each
[23:59] <Daekdroom> So it doesn't start unity-music-daemon until you try using the music lens. Waiting for that to load must take forever.