[05:41] <Mirv> hi! any insight into if the DDTP syncing with Debian is working? I've a gut feeling it has not been working during the precise cycle, but would like to hear if others share this notion.
[07:17] <andrejz> morning, dpm! I am in contact with Lubuntu packager and he is wondering if any integration has been developed between launchpad and pootle as they would like to upload launchpad translations back upstream
[07:17] <andrejz> I know one can easily export po files into bazar branch but i was wondering if anything else is also available
[07:24] <dpm> hi andrejz, good morning! no, there isn't any integration with other external web online tools apart from branch imports/exports
[07:25] <vibhav> dpm: I created the Ubuntu Hindi Localized CD Image but its based on 12.04 beta 1
[07:31] <dpm> vibhav, ah, cool
[07:43] <andrejz> dpm do you know anything about plans for  Launchpad to get author based commiting of string or have an estimate how difficult it would be to implement?
[07:44] <andrejz> if the answer is positive they i can chip in into the newly started wine debate about online translations tools
[07:59] <TLE> andrejz: AFAIU canonicals plans (in which they are willing to invest development resources) for launchpad translations can be summarized as: None
[07:59] <TLE> nul, nada, kein
[09:06] <artnay> TLE: sad but true
[09:10] <yurchor> andrejz: Hi! Regarding to Universe translation wiki page, hardinfo is not even marked for translation on code base level, how it can be translated through LP?
[09:19] <andrejz> yurchor in that case it can't. I don't know the implementation in detail but the idea is when the upstream package is uploaded into universe repository po files are extracted and put into Launchpad for translation.
[09:20] <andrejz> once langpack is generated and installed po files get into your locale directory and the package can use them
[09:20] <andrejz> so this can only work for upstreams which use gettext for now
[09:21] <yurchor> andrejz: A-ha... Thanks. hardinfo is cmake-based project and it does not generate pot during compilation (there is no translation markup in the code). So it should be reported upstream first.
[09:23] <andrejz> yurchor indeed
[09:25] <yurchor> andrejz: Then... what is wrong with geany (already on LP), banshee, gbrainy and tomboy (have healthy upstreams)?
[09:27] <andrejz> nothing is wrong with them I've just been busy with other things. The ubuntu packagers need to do minor changes in order for this to work.
[09:28] <andrejz> i started contacting them on friday to see if they are willing to do the necessary changes but given we are close to release it's probably going to be implemented for 12.10
[09:30] <yurchor> Ok. Thanks for the answers.
[09:39] <andrejz> dpm, yurchor just pointed out geany is available for translation in launchpad as upstream project. In this case message sharing can be implemented easily, correct?
[09:44] <trijntje> andrejz: could project that use .ts files for translation be made translatable via launchpad? I'm thinking of virtualbox
[09:45] <yurchor> trijntje: Not without changing project itself (lconvert should be used for po<->ts conversion).
[09:47] <trijntje> thats too bad, I really hate working in qt-linguist. In addition to the fact that the upstream translations for virtualbox are really bad
[09:48] <yurchor> trijntje: It's not a real problem: organize yourself a project on Transifex and send the results to upstream (very friendly btw).
[09:50] <trijntje> yurchor: I will send the results back upstream, but that wont be in time for the LTS. Which means these bad translations will be used for 5 years :(
[09:52] <yurchor> trijntje: To be honest, the translation of VB to your language did not become bad yesterday, right? ;) This is not the last LTS ever, isn't it?
[09:53] <trijntje> true ofcourse, but there were other more important translations to do first
[09:54] <trijntje> well, too bad I guess, its not the last LTS ever as you say ;)
[09:57] <andrejz> trijntje don't worry, many people who use non-ose virtualbox install a new version later on
[10:01] <artnay> doesn't oracle still require one to fill out their agreement? I guess that's the reason why translations suck; people don't want to have anything to do with oracle
[10:01] <andrejz> so your translations should reach them
[10:05] <andrejz> artnay: i don't know about that, never tried to translate it ;)
[10:10] <yurchor> artnay: MIT license. It's not more than LP requires (BSD with no attribution). And some people hate Rosetta for this... ;)
[10:12] <yurchor> \https://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/Contributor_information
[10:12] <dpm> yurchor, which people don't like the LP license and why?
[10:13] <dpm> andrejz, yeah, sharing can be enabled easily if the upstream project uses lp for translations
[10:14] <artnay> yurchor: ok, I thought it was the same case as with OOo
[10:15] <yurchor> dpm: Me for example. BSD licensing makes proprietary software developers think that all free translations are BSD-licensed and use QA-controlled translation memories from free projects in their commercial products.
[10:16] <yurchor> I had a deal with some folks of this kind.
[10:17] <artnay> dpm: is it okay if I send you the link to ubuntu-docs po once again? only 344 left to translate... :-)
[10:19] <dpm> yurchor, fair enough, I can relate to that concern. But this is rather a problem of many PO files in most projects not stating a license at all, not Launchpad using BSD
[10:19] <dpm> artnay, of course, just send it my way
[10:19] <dpm> brb, irc client kind of broken...
[10:23] <trijntje> I use vbox a lot, so I dont mind doing something back ;) And FOSS projects can still use the translations, if I'm not mistaken
[10:30] <dpm> hey all, I need some help here from someone who's translated Unity in full: when you press and hold the Super key, and then the help overlay appears, are the keyboard key names translated for you?
[10:32] <andrejz> dpm i don't have ubuntu right here but i looked at it yesterday and as far as i remember all were translated (those that we translate - we don't translate Alt and Shift for example)
[10:32] <dpm> I'm trying to find out what to do with bug 971332
[10:33] <dpm> artnay, enjoy! :)
[10:33] <dpm> http://91.189.93.101/
[10:34] <andrejz> dpm i thinik the reason is shortcuts are split into parts and it's not obvious how they fit together untill you look at them in action
[10:35] <dpm> so I guess it's a non-bug? I.e. i18n could be improved, but if everything is translatable, then it's ok for now
[10:36] <andrejz> dpm i only see the link you pasted partially translated
[10:36] <andrejz> even though documentation is now 100% in slovenian
[10:36] <dpm> andrejz, just a sec, I updated the Finish ones only. Let me update all the rest
[10:38] <andrejz> to brag a bit we are again at 0 remaining strings :)
[10:40] <andrejz> dpm can you point me to the link for translation of documentation screenshots?
[10:50] <dpm> andrejz, it's http://176.34.113.223/ubuntudocs-devel/, but neither TLE nor I have had the time of updating it. But I think the docs team didn't have the chance to update the original screenshots, either
[10:52] <andrejz> maybe it would be wise to get in contact with them and post announcement on ubuntu translations once images are ready to be translated
[11:42] <mdke> dpm: I think that the screenshots have now been updated for precise in our bzr branch
[11:42] <dpm> mdke, ah, cool, thanks!
[11:42] <mdke> hi by the way
[11:43] <dpm> ;)
[11:43] <dpm> ok, let me update the screenshots site
[11:46] <vibhav> Can anybody help me i18ning a project?
[11:47] <dpm> vibhav, could you point us to the project and where you need help?
[11:48] <dpm> artnay, andrejz, ok the http://91.189.93.101/ site is now updated with your latest translations
[11:48] <andrejz> thx dpm
[11:48] <dpm> no worries
[11:48] <dpm> the screenshots one is giving an error, but I won't have time to investigate it, unfortunately, so it will probably remain unusable
[11:51] <vibhav> dpm: sure
[11:52] <vibhav> dpm: http://sourceforge.net/projects/slantededge/
[11:52] <vibhav> Ive hosted it at Launchpad so that I can use Rosetta to get it translated
[11:53] <dpm> vibhav, could you give us a direct link to the code, so that we can have a look at it?
[11:54] <andrejz> dpm i sent emails to 3 more packagers (banshee, gbrainy and geany)
[11:54] <andrejz> will wait for their responses before i continue so i don't get drowned in traffic
[11:54] <vibhav> dpm:
[11:54] <vibhav> http://slantededge.cvs.sourceforge.net/viewvc/slantededge/
[11:56] <dpm> mdke, it seems not all of the unity-* screenshots have been updated (the unity-overview.png one is the most visible needing an update).
[11:56] <dpm> http://91.189.93.101/unity-introduction.html
[11:56] <dpm> cool, thanks andrejz
[11:56] <dpm> vibhav, ok, will try to have a look later on, it's lunch time now, thanks
[11:58] <mdke> dpm: ok, I'll look into it
[12:11] <trijntje> gbrainy isnt translated in lp right? It's upstream is gnome
[12:13] <andrejz> yes it is
[12:14] <andrejz> trijntje the idea is to make it translatable in Launchpad just like Nautilus is, for example
[12:18] <trijntje> andrejz: I'm sorry, I thought were talking about programs that have lp as upstream
[12:21] <andrejz> trijntje: this new feature is possible for all upstream packages which use gettext, both the ones which translate upstream in launchpad and not
[12:21] <andrejz> but of course if upstream uses Launchpad for translations better message sharing can be implemented.
[12:28] <vibhav> Does anybody here know internationalization?
[12:28] <vibhav> else*
[12:33] <dpm> vibhav, looking at the code, you'll basically need to:
[12:34] <vibhav> yes?
[12:34] <dpm> - #include gettext.h in all source files that need internationalization
[12:35] <dpm> - mark all strings needing translation as such with the _() macro. E.g _("This is a translatable string")
[12:35] <dpm> - On your main.c file, you'll need to initialize gettext
[12:35] <dpm> - And finally, your Makefile should be modified to build translations
[12:35] <dpm> That's at a high-level view
[12:36] <dpm> you can have a look at an example by downloading the hello-world package in Ubuntu
[12:36] <vibhav> you mean GNU hello?
[12:36] <dpm> yes, that's the one
[12:36] <dpm> there you can see how every of these steps are done in code
[12:37] <dpm> the only part that will be a bit harder will be to modify the Makefile
[12:38] <vibhav> dpm: How Do I initialize the makefile?
[12:38] <vibhav> Sorry
[12:38] <dpm> no worries, but that's a very vague question :)
[12:38] <vibhav> dpm: I mean , how do I initialize gettext
[12:42] <dpm> vibhav, that's this part:
[12:42] <dpm> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/hello/precise/view/head:/src/hello.c#L59
[12:43] <dpm> so in code you should:
[12:43] <dpm> 1. Include the gettext header:
[12:43] <dpm> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/hello/precise/view/head:/src/system.h#L33
[12:44] <dpm> (note how it defines the _() macro too)
[12:44] <dpm> 2. Initialize the default locale and the translation domain
[12:44] <dpm> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/hello/precise/view/head:/src/hello.c#L55
[12:44] <dpm> In short:
[12:45] <dpm> setlocale (LC_ALL, "");
[12:45] <dpm>  /* Set the text message domain.  */
[12:45] <dpm>   bindtextdomain (PACKAGE, LOCALEDIR);
[12:45] <dpm>   textdomain (PACKAGE);
[12:45] <dpm> where PACKAGE and LOCALEDIR will be preferably defined in your Makefile (although you can also hardcode them)
[12:46] <dpm> PACKAGE is the translation domain and is generally the name of your app, in lowercase
[12:46] <dpm> LOCALEDIR is "/usr/share/locale" in Ubuntu and Debian
[12:47] <dpm> You'll also need rules in your Makefile to:
[12:47] <dpm> - Create a .pot file that contains all translatable strings
[12:47] <dpm> - build all the .mo files from the .po files translators (or Launchpad) will provide
[12:48] <dpm> the .pot file is called a translation template and will be what you'll be uploading to Launchpad, and what will allow translators to see what they need to translate
[12:49] <dpm> there is only one .pot file, but there are multiple .po files, one per language, and they are text files that contain the translations
[12:50] <dpm> when your app builds, it will need to create binary .mo files from the textual .po files. The .mo files are what your app (through gettext) will use to load translations at runtime
[12:51] <dpm> Ah, also, you'll need to modify the source tree to include a po/ directory. That's where you should put the template file (.pot) and the translations (.po), all together in the same dir, in a flat layout
[12:51] <dpm> vibhav, I think that should be enough to get you started. If you need more help, feel free to ask
[12:53] <sagaci> looks like a classroom session
[12:55] <vibhav> dpm: thanks1
[12:55] <vibhav> !*
[12:56] <dpm> :)
[12:56] <dpm> yw
[12:59] <vibhav> Thouhg I knew the .pot concept
[13:03] <vibhav> dpm: Im still confused about modifying the makefile part
[13:04] <dpm> vibhav, which particular part are you confused about?
[13:04] <vibhav> The whole
[13:04] <vibhav> WHat do I add in the makefile?
[13:05] <vibhav> And how do I get a .pot file?
[13:06] <dpm> vibhav, at the high level, I think you'll just need to add 2 new rules to your makefile:
[13:07] <dpm> - One to create the .pot file
[13:07] <dpm> - One to build the .po files
[13:07] <vibhav> What are they?
[13:07] <dpm> what are what?
[13:07] <vibhav> the rules that need to be added
[13:08] <vibhav> lemme look at the hello makefile
[13:08] <dpm> hm, I can give you the overview and provide advice, but I unfortunately do not have the time to write them myself
[13:08] <dpm> I would recommend looking at the generated Makefile from hello
[13:08] <dpm> you might even be able to copy and paste them
[13:09] <dpm> although you'll probably need to modify them a bit if you're not using the same macros and m4 files the hello example uses
[14:31] <andrejz_> hello dpm!
[14:31] <andrejz_> i am on 12.04 now and some strings are indeed untranslated
[14:32] <andrejz_> in the overlay menu
[16:45] <dpm> thanks for the feedback andrejz_
[16:46] <andrejz_> dpm, can you post the link to the original bug report? maybe i can comment
[16:48] <dpm> sure, bug 971332
[16:55] <dpm> you realize you've been doing too much multitasking when at the end of the day you see a draft e-mail reply you started writing first time in the morning...
[16:55] <dpm> so after sending it means...
[16:56] <dpm> time to call it a day.
[16:56] <dpm> see you all tomorrow!
[16:56] <andrejz_> see you tommorow