[00:02] <ScottK> Yes.
[00:02] <ScottK> Definitely about the backports PPA.
[00:04] <JontheEchidna> for example, new Qt releases go in there
[00:04] <JontheEchidna> which were issues w/ Qt 4.5 and, to a lesser extent, 4.6
[00:20] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: In your qapt upload, is reverting from compat 9 to compat 8 on purpose?
[00:39] <Daskreech> ScottK: So backports are available but it won't install the packages from that repo?
[01:21] <JontheEchidna> ScottK: ooh, no.
[01:21] <JontheEchidna> nice catch
[01:23] <JontheEchidna> I accidentally based that upload off my oneiric backport packaging
[01:31] <CIA-42> [qapt] Jonathan Thomas <echidnaman@kubuntu.org> * echidnaman@kubuntu.org-20120408013044-bxmw2d10sgkhyoft * debian/ (5 files in 2 dirs) (log message trimmed)
[01:31] <CIA-42> * Cherry-pick several patches from the 1.3 branch: (LP: #976159) - Add
[01:31] <CIA-42> fix_misreported_marking_errors.diff to stop marking errors being reported as
[01:32] <Daskreech> JontheEchidna: Did I understand that correctly?
[01:32] <JontheEchidna> Daskreech: they won't be considered the "candidate version" by apt even though they are a higher version
[01:32] <Daskreech> What accomplishes that?
[01:32] <Daskreech> The package or a flagging of the repo?
[01:33] <JontheEchidna> the different pockets of the main repository have different priorities
[01:35] <Daskreech> Ah repo priority
[01:35] <Daskreech> and that's just realy low priority
[01:35] <Daskreech> JontheEchidna: can ou give some advice in #kubuntu I've lost track of how wicd interacts with KDE
[01:36] <JontheEchidna> I dunno either
[01:37] <JontheEchidna> NM has always been fine for me, never messed with WICD
[01:42] <Daskreech> JontheEchidna: Just need to know if you have to remove kde-network-management if you are installing wicd
[01:42] <JontheEchidna> I don't think that's a package
[01:44] <Daskreech> !info kde-network-manager
[01:44] <Daskreech> hmm
[01:49] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: I'll reject it so you can re-upload.
[01:49] <JontheEchidna> ScottK: thank you
[01:50] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: Done.
[01:56] <JontheEchidna> ScottK: the new upload's in the approval queue
[02:09] <JontheEchidna> heh, found a website using oxygen icons: http://outputlogic.com/
[03:19] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: Accepted.
[03:19] <JontheEchidna> thx
[03:24] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: http://i.imgur.com/75TEk.jpg
[03:25] <ybit> ping
[03:26] <ybit> i voiced a concern in #kubuntu, i'm wondering where such suggestions should be addressed
[03:27] <ybit> http://paste.ubuntu.com/919879/ for the message being referenced
[03:44] <ybit> ronnoc: ping
[03:45] <ybit> i'm looking for a place to voice my observations concerning my experience with kubuntu
[03:45] <ybit> somewhere besides irc, preferably on launchpad
[03:47] <ybit> wb ronnoc 
[03:49] <ScottK> ybit: Write a mail to kubuntu-devel.  IIRC bouncy cursors are the upstream default.
[03:50] <ybit> what about default mouse speed?
[03:50] <ybit> default installed wallpapers
[03:50] <ScottK> I'm pretty sure we don't change that either.
[03:50] <ScottK> Default wall paper is definitely upstream.
[03:50] <ybit> clock not having short date by default
[03:51] <ScottK> If you apt-get kubuntu-default-settings you can see what setting changes from upstream defaults we do.
[03:51] <ybit> for kubuntu...
[03:51] <ybit> if autologin is selected during installation, you can't logout to kdm
[03:51] <ScottK> What happens if you logout?
[03:52] <ybit> i haven't tried tonight
[03:52] <ybit> it's a fresh install, i wanted to waste time on irc first
[03:52] <ybit> dist-upgrade breaks kde apps' functionality momentarily
[03:52] <ybit> for new users this can be confusing
[03:53] <ScottK> You mean upgrading from 11.10 to 12.04?
[03:53] <ybit> especially if you launch rekonq and suddenly you are presented with 30 gwenview windows, no way to group them all together and close them at the same time 
[03:53] <ScottK> I'm sure we don't do any chages from upstream that would cause that.
[03:54] <ybit> nope
[03:54] <ybit> 11.10
[03:54] <ybit> after a fresh install, i always do apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade
[03:54] <ronnoc> JontheEchidna: Thank you for Muon. Wish I could buy you a beer :)
[03:54] <ybit> i was able to test i installed kubuntu twice today aon this machine
[03:54] <ybit> the first time muon did this
[03:54] <ybit> ..before i got to it
[03:55] <ybit> i had the same problem of the package manager updating kde stuff and most everything not working
[03:55] <JontheEchidna> ronnoc: you'd have to wait until this August in the U.S. :P
[03:55] <ronnoc> ybit: You could go see if any devs at kde-devel are around and receptive. 
[03:56]  * ronnoc didn't "officially" say that
[03:56] <ScottK> ybit: For full KDE version upgrades you need to restart your session.
[03:56] <ronnoc> JontheEchidna: By then it will have accrued enough interest to be a 12-pack
[03:57] <ybit> JontheEchidna: i had two problems with muon tonight, (a) it was doing stuff and i didn't know what, it was telling me that it was configuring ijpf or some package for about 15 mins at which point i just decided to turn my machine off.. which of course i knew was bad, but nothing was working and it seemed muon was frozed... when i reinstalled kubuntu 
[03:57] <JontheEchidna> ybit: on 11.10?
[03:58] <ybit> and after doing apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade muon crashed but debug symbols weren't installed by default, in particular it didn't have muon-dbg,i should have taken better notes here, but i was unable to submit a report because the crash reporter crashed :P
[03:58] <ybit> after reboot, things have settled
[03:59] <ybit> and looking at my notes, most of the complaints are indeed kde related
[03:59] <ybit> JontheEchidna: yeah
[03:59] <JontheEchidna> the hang on large commits was fixed w/ QApt 1.2.3, I've got 1.3.0 on the QApt PPA: https://launchpad.net/~echidnaman/+archive/qapt/
[03:59] <ybit> anyway, i'm not venting, just sharing my experience
[03:59] <JontheEchidna> but you'll also need the kubuntu-backports PPA
[03:59] <ybit> even if it's probably not the appropriate place
[04:01] <ybit> ronnoc: for kde, bugs.kde.org is the best way to discuss stuff
[04:01] <ronnoc> ybit: you have an audience. We all want Kubuntu to kisck ass. :)
[04:01] <ronnoc> ybit: I know...I said that in the other channel :p
[04:02] <ybit> kubuntu has the easiest installation of all the other distros that offer kde
[04:03] <ybit> it also has apt (-get, -file)
[04:03] <ronnoc> ybit: glad you're here. Kubuntu's future actually is really bright. It's in a very good position to be in ATM.
[04:03] <ybit> opensuse ships webpin broken, i don't understand that
[04:03] <ybit> and zypper doesn't have an apt-file equivalent
[04:03]  * ronnoc returns channel to devel-type things
[04:04] <ybit> also, kubuntu's printer discovery app actually discovers wireless printers painlessly
[04:04] <ybit> dragon instead of kaffeine, ^5
[04:04] <ybit> kate instead of kwrite
[04:05] <ybit> one question though, why isn't *-dbg installed by default?
[04:05] <ybit> i can see that for a new user, it makes perfect sense for them to just click next, next, next to submit a bug
[04:06] <ybit> maybe say something in a form toward the end if they want to give further details
[04:06] <ronnoc> ybit: dng packages are really big
[04:06] <ronnoc> *dbg
[04:07] <ybit> i figured that it was to save space, but i didn't know *-dbg packages were large
[04:07] <ybit> most people have large enough HDDs anyway, how large are they?
[04:08] <JontheEchidna> CD space is the issue
[04:08] <ybit> ah
[04:08] <ybit> are they installed by default on dvd?
[04:08] <JontheEchidna> I don't think we even have enough room there
[04:08] <ronnoc> ybit: I fought this issue for years in my head (a DVD burner is less that $15 US) but it's a bandwidth issue
[04:09] <ronnoc> ybit: for people downloading the CD in places that have slow connections
[04:09] <ybit> i was playing on windows 8 awhile ago and noticed they handle reboots way more elegantly than any linux distro i've came across 
[04:10] <ronnoc> JontheEchidna: Going forward - the odds of a non-PAE computer not having a DVD burner are almost nill. Maybe the issue will come up again 
[04:10] <ybit> typically after you click the reboot button, things just seem to crash and you are dropped to a command line for a second before it shows a shutdown splash screen for a second and then it reboots, eek 
[04:12] <ybit> right, now i'm complaining :)
[04:12] <ybit> off to bugs.kde.org
[04:29]  * ybit attempts to logout and see if the auto-login = no kdm problem still exists
[04:30] <ybit> sweet, not a problem now
[04:31] <ybit> rekonq gave a crash dialog when logging out, that's about it
[11:32] <BluesKaj> Howdy folks
[18:32] <BluesKaj> bbl...stuff to do
[19:58] <Riddell> anyone tested 4.8.2 ?
[20:01] <BluesKaj> yup, running it right now
[20:04] <BluesKaj> a few minor crashes , but none after i did a clean install a few days ago... decided to get rid of corrupted config files in mysql , akonadi and whatever else was wrong, Riddell
[20:07] <ronnoc> Riddell: No issues here. Been running it for about a day before the announcement.
[20:08] <ronnoc> Only issue I'm seeing out there is people complaining about Firefox integration, or lack thereof, since the kubuntu firefox package was apparently dropped for 12.04.
[20:10] <ScottK> ronnoc: Unfortunately with the new FF rapid release model, the integration patches aren't supportable anymore.
[20:15] <Riddell> ScottK: actually the netrunner guys want to work on that and want a bit of working working out what would be needed
[20:15] <ScottK> That would be great.
[21:43] <ronnoc_> ScottK: Meaning the patches break too fast?
[22:18] <JontheEchidna> ronnoc: yes, the files that they patch change too often, usually meaning manual reconstruction of the patch
[22:37] <ronnoc> JontheEchidna: I see
[22:40] <JontheEchidna> it's not a technical matter stopping maintenance, just a lack of manpower/motivation
[22:40] <JontheEchidna> which is not helped by constant breakage
[22:41] <JontheEchidna> meaning that if somebody (like the netrunner guys) cared enough, they could pay some of their employees to maintain the patch as part of their duties
[22:44] <ronnoc> JontheEchidna: I'd donate to a maintainer. Use it or not, Firefox is fairly important and a new user isn't going to understand these intricacies.
[22:45] <JontheEchidna> well, if the thing with Netrunner works out, hopefully it won't be an issue.
[22:46] <ronnoc> In true open source fashion I think it will somehow work itself out. I may look to file a bug at Mozilla for KDE support, though I'm sure it's already been requested. 
[22:46] <JontheEchidna> yeah, Mozilla doesn't care too much about KDE
[22:46] <JontheEchidna> they didn't want to merge the original patch upstream
[22:47] <JontheEchidna> I'm fairly sure there's a wontfix'd bug lying around in their bugtracker about merging the original patch.
[22:47] <ronnoc> So they're firmly laying their support for Ubuntu and Ubuntu alone still. Seems a tad short-sighted. 
[22:47]  * ronnoc goes to look
[22:49] <ronnoc> I did read that there's a movement to add FF support for Mint KDE 13 that is gaining traction. Whether that's from Netrunner or Mint Devs I'm not sure.  
[23:39] <Daskreech> ronnoc: Why is it shortsighted?