[00:00] <agoodm> (I need 12.04 for track pad to work correctly and some other stuff)
[00:00] <agoodm> not yet... I could really do with fixing this one if that makes any sense though
[00:00] <dogmatic69> agoodm: even from power off, or is it from suspend / hibernate?
[00:01] <hamitron> I'd create a 2nd home directory, then tweak /etc/passwd to test
[00:01] <agoodm> I havent tried from suspend yet
[00:01] <dogmatic69> no, I figure something funny was saved in your session after suspend.
[00:02] <dogmatic69> see what is in startups. you can click the power button top right and 'startup applications'
[00:02] <agoodm> startup applications has 6 apps ive added
[00:02] <agoodm> the two most recent ive unchecked 'just in case'
[00:03] <dogmatic69> maybe remove them one by one and see
[00:03] <dogmatic69> or remove all and add them one by one
[00:30] <agoodm> Just to update the kind folks that were helping me earlier;
[00:30] <agoodm> I managed to track down the application that was screwing up my startup
[00:31] <agoodm> the method I used may be useful for other people in the future...
[00:31] <agoodm> I added gnome-terminal -x top to the startup applications
[00:31] <agoodm> then rebooted
[00:32] <agoodm> when my machine rebooted and I logged in obviously a terminal with top opened right up as it was grinding to a halt, the application that was frozen at the top of the list was skype, after 3 minutes of unresponsiveness I noticed skype was closed
[00:33] <agoodm> I completely tested by unckecking skype from startup; and all was OK
[00:33] <agoodm> the fix was to uninstall skype completely and reinstall it
[00:33] <agoodm> very weird issue!!!
[06:33] <mattt> morning
[07:26] <daubers> Morning
[07:26] <MartijnVdS> \o
[08:10] <czajkowski> aloha
[08:10] <TheOpenSourcerer> Afternoon czajkowski
[08:15] <diplo> Morning all
[08:25] <MooDoo> morning all
[08:26] <dwatkins> hiya
[08:37] <AlanBell> morning all
[08:42] <JamesTait> Good morning all!
[08:54] <brobostigon> good morning everyone.
[09:02] <dwatkins> hi folks, we have snow in Edinburgh
[09:02] <dwatkins> looks like it's just us, though.
[09:03] <Gary> we have nice sun here in essex
[09:04] <mumper> moin
[09:04] <dwatkins> moin moin, mumper
[09:06] <mumper> dwatkins: Hi
[09:10] <MartijnVdS> All we get is rain :(
[09:10] <brobostigon> we have bright sun here.
[09:11] <brobostigon> scattered clouds.
[09:14] <dwatkins> that's it for snow here, I reckon, just a bit wet outside now.
[09:15] <gord> stop talking about snow, if we just ignore the cold weather it will go away and we can go back to getting to summer
[09:15] <MartijnVdS> ooh.. I see blue outside!
[09:16] <MartijnVdS> between the clouds!
[09:16] <dwatkins> not in the next week or so according to http://www.yr.no/place/United_Kingdom/Scotland/Edinburgh/long.html
[09:17] <MartijnVdS> http://buienradar.nl/weerbericht_Nederland_komende_5_tot_9_dagen.aspx?bron=3 \o/
[09:17] <MartijnVdS> snow predicted for next Saturday
[09:17] <MartijnVdS> ಠ_ಠ
[09:18] <MartijnVdS> but also 10°C.. it's climate change gone wild
[09:20] <dwatkins> If I zoom in on those characters I see boxes wioth 'Kannada' and '0C80 0CFF'
[09:21] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/%E0%B2%A0%E0%B2%A0-look-of-disapproval
[09:21] <dwatkins> The seasons are also shifting, scarily. It was bad enough that the south of England nicked our weather recently ;)
[09:21] <popey> ʘ‿ಠ
[09:21] <bigcalm> Clock work orange
[09:21] <dwatkins> MartijnVdS: I suspected that was what you meant ;)
[09:21] <gord> you guys are the worst, you are going to anger the weather gods, who are already constantly pretty angry at the uk anyway
[09:21] <MartijnVdS> (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
[09:21] <bigcalm> Morning peeps :)
[09:21]  * dwatkins goes to find his metal armour so he can hike up Arthur's Seat and shout insults at the weather dieties
[09:22] <dwatkins> deities, perhaps
[09:22] <MartijnVdS> Deities schmeities
[09:23] <shauno> You'd think someone living below sea level would have a little bit more respect for the rain gods
[09:24] <dwatkins> MartijnVdS is spongebob squarepants? ;) (I know, he lives inside a reclaimed area fo the sea)
[09:24] <MartijnVdS> shauno: We stole that land from the sea gods anyway.
[09:24] <MartijnVdS> dwatkins: ...
[09:25] <dwatkins> ah, so you've already angered Poseidon...
[09:26] <dwatkins> Today I copied and pasted a facebook status meme... http://hastebin.com/raw/coyusabohu
[09:29] <dwatkins> I don't normally do this, but I thought it was quite an amusing response to the constant copying and pasting of such things.
[09:29] <MartijnVdS> it's like "I'm a signature virus"
[09:30] <dwatkins> yes, at least it's not as bad as the 'please manually delete your data' virus.
[09:31] <MartijnVdS> honor system viruses 8-)
[09:32] <bigcalm> Bacon o/
[09:32]  * popey had bacon
[09:33] <brobostigon> :)
[09:33]  * dwatkins wants bacon now
[09:33]  * brobostigon has bacon in the fridge,
[09:34]  * dwatkins will be obtaining some on the way home
[09:35] <bigcalm> Your parcel is on the vehicle for delivery, due between 10:55 - 11:55
[09:35] <popey> hehe
[09:35]  * bigcalm stares out of the window
[09:35] <popey> "Out for delivery - 10 April 2012 7:58:33 "
[09:35]  * popey stares out his window too
[09:36] <bigcalm> What goodies have you ordered?
[09:36] <bigcalm> Or is this your replacement ipad?
[09:36] <popey> no, ipad arrived last week
[09:36] <bigcalm> Was it a 1 or 3?
[09:37] <popey> 1
[09:37] <bigcalm> Ah well :)
[09:37] <popey> like for like
[09:37] <popey> good enough for me ☺
[09:37] <popey> today xbox + kinect is arriving
[09:37] <bigcalm> Ooo
[09:38] <bigcalm> Which is cheaper than having the old xbox repaired?
[09:38] <dwatkins> popey: did you get the Star Wars one?
[09:38] <popey> no
[09:38] <dwatkins> I treated myself, it makes R2D2 sounds when you open the disc tray :D
[09:39] <bigcalm> How sweet
[09:39] <gord> that star wars kinect game should be burnt, we, as humanity should refuse its inclusion to our culture
[09:39] <bigcalm> dwatkins: I bet it gets old quickly
[09:40] <dwatkins> bigcalm: I could describe the number of R2D2 related things I have, that might give you an idea how unlikely that is ;)
[09:40] <popey> i dont actually rate star wars
[09:44] <popey> yay, just "found" another HP microserver in the garage ☺
[09:45] <dwatkins> popey has a magical garage which spawns computer hardware.
[09:46] <popey> i do
[10:00] <davmor2> morning all
[10:05]  * oimon wonders if there is possibly an uglier gui than calibre
[10:09] <gordonjcp> oimon: xastir
[10:10] <oimon> gordonjcp, motif style apps are indeed ugly
[10:23] <bigcalm> I can has microserver!
[10:23] <bigcalm> It looks so cute
[10:23] <davmor2> bigcalm: Yay! now to find out how you do setting it up Muhahahahahahahaha
[10:26]  * popey has USB stick with 12.04 server alternate on it
[10:26] <bigcalm> You make it sound like it's a bad thing
[10:26] <bigcalm> I have a USB DVD drive if need be, but I also have 12.04 on a USB stick
[10:27] <gord> should really start moving my various installs over to 12.04 soon, i was stupid and didn't install the previous lts, lots of downloading to do
[10:27] <diplo> heh gord same here :)
[10:28]  * diplo wants another 2 x 2 tb drives but really can't afford it yet
[10:28] <gord> in my defence, it was mostly to get at better alsas so i could get proper hdmi audio support on my revos
[10:29] <diplo> heh, my revo is still on 9.04/10, can't remember which
[10:29] <diplo> Was waiting for 12 to update
[10:46] <dogmatic69> I have some folders mounted over the network with sshfs and when clicking to open something it always pops up saying run in terminal / open etc.
[10:46] <dogmatic69> even for images or txt files
[10:46] <dogmatic69> how can I get it to just open?
[10:51] <oimon> dogmatic69, i don't have that problem (browsing with nautilus)
[10:51] <dogmatic69> I am using nautilus too
[10:51] <oimon> (browsing remote ssh )
[10:51] <bigcalm> Oh, that's handy
[10:51] <bigcalm> Checked my account and I've been paid already
[10:51] <bigcalm> Same day that my server arrived
[10:52] <oimon> looks like i have the worlds slowest usb stick
[10:53] <oimon> 1mb/s
[10:54] <AlanBell> both new chickens are laying already \o/
[10:55] <diplo> Quite happy already then AlanBell
[10:55] <diplo> from my little knowledge
[10:55] <diplo> Got to be settled in first normally ?
[10:57] <AlanBell> they seem quite keen to provide me with yummy eggs
[10:57] <diplo> :)
[10:57] <bigcalm> AlanBell: ex-PoW chickens?
[10:58] <diplo> Anyone got any idea if you can tell if a CentOS server is awaiting a reboot ? Or ubuntu, I'm guessing htey do it the same way
[10:59] <bigcalm> Log in as an admin or root and it might tell you along with the motd?
[10:59] <popey>  /var/run/reboot-required
[10:59] <popey> on ubuntu
[10:59] <diplo> Cheers popey
[11:00] <diplo> nah nowt there
[11:00] <diplo> Was for bigcalm the second one :)
[11:01] <diplo> Still looking in /var/run, it's not the end of the world anyhoo :)
[11:01]  * bigcalm puts on some REM
[11:07] <AlanBell> bigcalm: no, I thought about ex-pow types, but they are a bit harder to introduce to others, you kind of need two pens or they get beaten up
[11:08] <BigRedS> diplo: compare uname with menu.lst?
[11:09] <diplo> Worth a try thanks
[11:10] <bigcalm> AlanBell: :(
[11:10] <bigcalm> Is it lunch time?
[11:10] <Neoti> can anyone help with this zoneminder problem :  i have a Grandstream GXV3601_HD IP Cam, and trying to get it to work with Zoneminder, i have added it as a remote/monitor with the url as http://192.168.201.48/goform/stream?cmd=get&channel=0, which i got from Grandstream, if i put this in a webbrowser i see the stream as mjpeg, if i put the stream in zoneminder i get nothing, also if i run eithereal at the same time i dont s
[11:11] <bigcalm> I've been paid, might sneak in a sub
[11:12] <MooDoo> bigcalm: i've been paid, might sneak in a laptop for the misses :s  not that i know what type to get here lol
[11:13] <bigcalm> Heh
[11:13] <davmor2> bigcalm: no I was thinking more of the do you go 12.04 or 10.04, if you go 12.04 do you use some of the funky new tools to make it work or do you stick with manual config of config files etc
[11:13] <bigcalm> I just bought myself a server, need to calm down on spending now ;)
[11:13] <davmor2> MooDoo: me owlde mucka 'ow am ya
[11:13] <bigcalm> davmor2: are there known hardware issues?
[11:14] <MooDoo> davmor2: cracking, deciding on a lappy to get the misses.
[11:14] <bigcalm> I guess I could install 10.04 and then upgrade to 12.04 next month
[11:14] <popey> thinkpad, no other laptop exists
[11:14] <popey> bigcalm: i am putting 12.04 on my microserver right now
[11:14] <bigcalm> But that seems like wasted effort to me
[11:14] <popey> +1
[11:14] <bigcalm> popey: oo, you rebel
[11:15] <popey> i have nothing left <12.04 other than my vps
[11:15] <MooDoo> popey: ooo quite cheap at the moment too
[11:16] <davmor2> bigcalm: no it's just the decisions you have to make
[11:16] <bigcalm> MooDoo: I just bought this: http://www.serversplus.com/servers/tower_servers/hp_tower_servers/658553-421
[11:16] <bigcalm> MooDoo: 100 quid cashback. So will end up having paid about 150 quid
[11:17] <MooDoo> bigcalm: cool, no screen and a bit big for my misses knee ;) lol
[11:17] <bigcalm> Oh, you were referring to popey talking about laptops
[11:17] <bigcalm> I shall go back to sleep
[11:17] <MooDoo> bigcalm: :)  might have to get one myself though lol
[11:18] <oimon> chromium doesn't work on my eee  pc :(
[11:18] <bigcalm> I've got one to replace my Revo
[11:18] <bigcalm> The Revo will then go to my parents to replace their Viglen MPC-L
[11:18] <bigcalm> Anybody want 2 PoS Viglen MPC-L?
[11:18] <oimon> now someone needs to mention joggler
[11:18] <gord> no but i'll take the revo ;)
[11:18] <bigcalm> oimon: I have one on my bedside table
[11:19] <bigcalm> gord: go fish :P
[11:19] <gord> i'm fully willing to accept any and all revos going!
[11:19] <bigcalm> oimon: the joggler is waiting for a useable Android ISO
[11:19] <gord> android on intel with pulsebo graphics, fun times
[11:20] <bigcalm> Revo makes me think of Reavers from Firefly
[11:20] <oimon> makes think of psion revo
[11:20] <oimon> ahhh
[11:24] <oimon> wow, seen this helicopter fail? http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xp0poa_helicopter-shakes-itself-apart-on-landing-in-brazil_news?fb_action_ids=10151503105660187&fb_action_types=video.watches&fb_source=other_multiline&error_reason=user_denied&error=access_denied&error_description=The+user+denied+your+request.#_=_
[11:24] <gord> i don't think you need like, 90% of that url
[11:25] <oimon> yeah
[11:25] <oimon> sorry
[11:25] <oimon> too much effort
[11:26]  * bigcalm finds lunch before he throws up :S
[11:26] <bigcalm> Damn this stress
[11:30] <davmor2> bigcalm: what stress :P
[11:31] <bigcalm> 2 4 day weeks in a row
[11:32] <davmor2> bigcalm: you could of done work on you're day off then it would of been 2 5 day weeks
[11:33] <bigcalm> davmor2: I did work every day of the 4 day weekend
[11:33] <bigcalm> I will sleep better once this project is live
[11:33] <davmor2> bigcalm: so why are you complaining ;)
[11:38] <davmor2> popey: for the next few days can you use update manager for updates please and let me know out of those times how often you see the window with the progress bar in it, trying to find out if it is just me or not
[11:39] <gord> new ubuntu wallpapers are nice, i should really submit a bunch of pictures of my cat every time they do these things
[11:39] <popey> davmor2: sure
[11:39] <davmor2> popey: ta
[11:40] <popey> which dialog though?
[11:40] <popey> oooh, crash
[11:40] <popey> if i click "check" I get a dialog
[11:41] <bigcalm> I really need jockey to be fixed. My laptop can't cope with Minecraft on the generic ATI driver
[11:41] <davmor2> popey: reported it
[11:42] <popey> i am applying updates, i see a dialog with a progress bar
[11:42] <popey> whats the problem?
[11:43] <davmor2> popey: I don't always,  I'm guessing it is a race condition but it's hard to replicate and might just be my system,  I see the progress bar in the icon on the launcher just not the dialog window
[11:46] <davmor2> popey: It's more just confirmation that it's my system or not
[11:46] <davmor2> popey: also bug #977956 I'm guessing for your crash
[12:01] <gordonjcp> HP microserver users, can you remember (or for that matter can you check) if it has a serial port or not?
[12:02]  * popey looks at the one on his desk
[12:02] <dwatkins> http://h18004.www1.hp.com/products/quickspecs/13716_na/13716_na.HTML gordonjcp?
[12:02] <popey> nope
[12:03] <dwatkins> time for a USB serial adapter, I assume
[12:03] <popey> or pcie card
[12:03] <gordonjcp> dwatkins: I haven't got web access
[12:03] <dwatkins> gordonjcp: ah ok
[12:04]  * gordonjcp is at work which has the most astonishingly broken internet connection
[12:05] <dwatkins> can you not even ssh -D to proxy to something, gordonjcp?
[12:07] <gordonjcp> dwatkins: not really, since it's not actually passing any traffic
[12:10] <gordonjcp> dwatkins: I imagine it'll come back at some point, but at the moment I have a whopping 1200bps to play with
[12:13] <gordonjcp> I can't believe a communications company fails this hard at communications
[12:39] <dogmatic69> random bug
[12:40] <dogmatic69> all my nautalis windows have some how moved half off the top of the screen
[12:43] <dwatkins> gordonjcp: I know the feeling, I work for a software company ;)
[12:50] <mattt> love the timing of this hose pipe ban
[12:51] <dwatkins> haa, a hose pipe ban? It's been tipping it down all day here.
[12:51] <bigcalm> Sadly it doesn't work like that :)
[12:52] <bigcalm> Rain on the day of the ban is only useful if you have a water butt
[12:52] <MooDoo> dwatkins: wrong type of rain.
[12:53] <dwatkins> I'll go for a hike to check we have plenty of water in the reservoirs.
[12:56] <mattt> i know this rain isn't substantial :)
[12:56] <mattt> but the timing was funny, felt like they just announced it then the weather turned
[12:57] <dwatkins> I've heard many people visiting the UK say that they think it rains all the time here.
[12:57] <mattt> it does up north, no?  :)
[12:58] <dwatkins> heh, I thought it rained all the time in Wales - when I last drove west across the Severn Bridge, it started raining the second we finished crossing it :)
[12:58] <MooDoo> mattt: sorry, can't hear you as the rain is hitting the window
[13:00] <gordonjcp> London has less rainfall than Rome, apparently
[13:00] <BigRedS> when I worked inthe bike shop we had all sorts of stats about london rainfall to help with the prostelytising
[13:00] <BigRedS> I think it rains an awful lot more than the statistics suggest
[13:01] <awilkins> I don't think "inches of" matter much compared to "total fraction of normal travelling time experiencing some manner of precipitation"
[13:01] <dwatkins> I think statistics can be interpretted in many ways ;)
[13:02] <BigRedS> awilkins: IIRC, something like 14 commutes a year are rained on
[13:02] <BigRedS> the stats were all that sort of thing
[13:02] <awilkins> Only 14, blimey
[13:03] <BigRedS> yeah, and we did end up conceding that it was basically right
[13:03] <awilkins> Mind, I live Oop North
[13:03] <BigRedS> for a start, all of us only ever cycled anywhere, and one of us bothered to own a jacket
[13:03] <dwatkins> awilkins: North of England, or North of Hadrian's Wall? ;)
[13:03] <BigRedS> well, a waterproof one
[13:03] <awilkins> dwatkins, Wigan, commuting to Leeds
[13:04] <oimon> can someone explain instagram to me: do you have to have the app to browse someones photos?
[13:04] <awilkins> Fortunately my waiting time at Stalybridge station is limited to once a day
[13:04] <MooDoo> oimon: yes i think you do, unless they are using a wordpress or similar script to dislpay the images.
[13:04] <dwatkins> awilkins: ah I see, I cycle to work in Edinburgh ;)
[13:04] <awilkins> Stalybridge is at a high altitude and is frequently quite cold / snowy / windy
[13:05] <dwatkins> oimon: I don't think so, it's just an easy way to put photos on facebook and add effects that make them look like they were taken in the 70s
[13:05] <oimon> i think flickr are complete numpties for missing a trick on that. all they had to do was create an app with additional filters. the infrastructure for sharing photos already existed, and so did userbase
[13:05] <MooDoo> flickr are getting rid of staff as well
[13:05] <oimon> dwatkins, is that because iphone had crap filter effects?
[13:05] <shauno> flickr's missed a *lot* of tricks since yahoo took them over.  it feels like it's been left to rot
[13:06] <oimon> if flickr released an app like taht even now, i'd use it
[13:06] <MooDoo> smugmug need one too
[13:06] <oimon> i can only wonder what their staff are actually doing
[13:06] <dwatkins> oimon: for 'crap' read 'none' ;)
[13:07] <gord> i think flickr are more interested in the more professional side, not on the 8 million crappy phone pictures of someones party side
[13:07] <oimon> gord, that seems to be worth $1billion to facebook somehow
[13:08] <gordonjcp> right, sod this
[13:08] <gordonjcp> AlanBell: you're an OpenERP-er, aren't you?
[13:09] <gord> sure, but thats because the facebook demographic is people who want to look at 8  million crappy phone pictures of someones party. flickr's demographic is more about looking at good photographs, i doubt they want the flood of terrible phone pictures they would get with something like that
[13:09] <gordonjcp> what would be a rough ballpark price for getting someone in to set up an OpenERP system for a smallish company, say a dozen employees or so?
[13:09] <gordonjcp> setup and training, ideally
[13:09] <AlanBell> hi gordonjcp
[13:09] <AlanBell> depends a bit on what they do
[13:10] <gordonjcp> let's assume it's a small company that sells radios and radio systems, with sales from about a tenner up to maybe 30 grand
[13:10] <oimon> gord, you make it sound like flick have a plan/clue
[13:10] <AlanBell> gordonjcp: so a bit of stock management and accountancy stuff, but not manufacturing
[13:11] <gordonjcp> exactly
[13:11] <gordonjcp> any "manufacturing" would be one-off knocking up of wee custom boxes for interfacing things, rather than large-scale production
[13:11] <AlanBell> any international stuff (import/export/customs/shipping)
[13:12] <gordonjcp> not really, no
[13:12] <gordonjcp> or, "chance would be a fine thing..."
[13:26] <popey> bigcalm: switched 160GB HDD for 120GB SSD in my HP Microserver :D
[13:26] <popey> SSD CRAZY!
[13:27] <MooDoo> SSD rocks.
[13:27] <Seeker`> SSD \o/
[13:28] <Seeker`> I need to put one in my mythfrontend
[13:28] <popey> my xbmc frontend has one too
[13:28] <Seeker`> my desktop and my backend have them
[13:28] <Seeker`> just not upgraded my frontend in a while
[13:29] <gord> is there much need for an ssd in an xbmc frontend?
[13:29] <oimon> make backups :P SSD seem to die horribly and die young
[13:30] <bigcalm> popey: haven't decided if my Microserver is to get an SSD or not
[13:30] <AlanBell> I am tempted to get either an SSD or a hybrid for my laptop
[13:31] <AlanBell> what do you think of this? http://www.ebuyer.com/321969-momentus-xt-750gb-sata-2-5in-7200rpm-hybrid-8gb-ssd-in-st750lx003
[13:31] <bigcalm> I was going to get an SSD for the revo when 12.04 came out. But I've spent my money getting a Microserver :D
[13:31] <Seeker`> gord: you can get away with a very small SSD, which is about the same price as a x00GB HDD
[13:31] <bigcalm> And now I need 2 new front tyers!
[13:32] <popey> bug 978032
[13:33] <davmor2> popey: you are back in the era of the psion aren't you with your ssd fetish
[13:33] <gord> Seeker`, sure, if you are building from scratch
[13:34] <popey> psion?
[13:34] <davmor2> bigcalm: I can point you to a cheap but good tyre place in wolvo if that helps
[13:34] <popey> AlanBell: do you need 750GB in your laptop?
[13:35] <popey> he says with only 11GB free in his
[13:35] <davmor2> popey: http://www.gpsinformation.org/dale/psion/psion5_big.jpg
[13:35] <AlanBell> popey: I appear to have used 242GB
[13:35] <bigcalm> davmor2: ta, but tyers are just expensive for my car
[13:36] <davmor2> popey: it had software carts that were called ssd long before it was cool :)
[13:36] <popey> AlanBell: http://www.ebuyer.com/260707-ocz-240gb-vertex-3-ssd-2-5-sata-iii-6gb-s-read-550mb-s-write-520mb-s-vtx3-25sat3-240g
[13:36] <popey> thats what's in my laptop
[13:36] <mgdm> Blimey
[13:37] <mgdm> that's more than I paid for my laptop
[13:37] <popey> yeah, its not cheap
[13:37] <popey> stupid fast though ☺
[13:37] <gord> wanted to get an ssd for the laptop, but decided to fund a holiday later in the year instead :(
[13:37] <gord> an x220 just isn't complete without an ssd
[13:37] <bigcalm> popey: you bought that?
[13:38] <bigcalm> Oh my
[13:38] <popey> ya
[13:38] <bigcalm> popey: rounds are on mr money bags come the 14th July
[13:38] <bigcalm> :P
[13:40] <popey> :p
[13:40] <popey> technically my company bought it :p
[13:41] <bigcalm> Yay no vat
[13:42] <dwatkins> I looked at SSDs, then bought a hybrid disk that's bigger ;)
[13:42] <popey> i cant recall where but I saw some horror stories about those hybrids which put me off
[13:43] <AlanBell> I am a bit suspicious about the lack of loads of the things
[13:44]  * daubers ponders going home and going to bed
[13:45] <gord> who needs storage space when you have the cloud ;)
[13:45] <MooDoo> o/ me
[13:46]  * AlanBell likes lots of virtualbox machines
[13:46] <dwatkins> Well, mine is made by Seagate, and it's in my laptop, but I see your points. popey - if you find the source, I'd be interested to hear more
[13:46] <AlanBell> I could cope with fewer actually on the laptop
[13:48] <dwatkins> gord: until you can run a virtual machine off the cloud, me ;)
[13:48] <gord> what about that ubuntu demo we had
[13:50] <gord> even then, you could completely have a central box that does all the virtual machine stuff with storage, then vnc/whatever into that
[13:50] <gord> been tempted to do that before
[13:50] <AlanBell> sometimes that works
[13:51] <AlanBell> often I want a local VM running some kind of server, and I access it with a web browser running on the host
[13:51] <AlanBell> which I could do in other ways
[13:52] <dwatkins> I tend to leave my VMs on a server (vmware 2.0) and access them via the web interface
[14:07] <BigRedS> dwatkins: isn't the cloud just a bunch of virtual machines?
[14:09] <dwatkins> BigRedS: yeah, but if you could mount a remote filesystem (there are several attempts at making one from a gmail account, and I think Google are considering releasing a FS client) that would be handy
[14:10] <dwatkins> when people say 'the cloud' they just mean 'online', it may be the data is on just one machine, they don't know either way.
[14:10] <BigRedS> I thought Google closed down whatever gmailfs used?
[14:10] <dwatkins> I gather Google store data in a very complex way, backed up on multiple systems etc.
[14:10] <dwatkins> ah ok, that'll be why I havn't heard of it recently
[14:10] <BigRedS> but, yeah, I was being a tad facetious :) Lots of our customers like the term 'cloud'
[14:10] <dwatkins> indeed, as do ours (probably our own fault for releasing software which mentions it specifically)
[14:11] <BigRedS> we're wondering whether we could get away with calling old-fashioned rent-a-homedir shared hosting 'the cloud'
[14:11] <BigRedS> oh, we've avoided using the term, and are wondering if that's why we're not selling vms very quickly
[14:11] <dwatkins> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_File_System - Despite having published details on technologies like the Google File System, Google has not released the software as open source and shows little interest in selling it. The only way it is available to another enterprise is in embedded form..."
[14:12] <BigRedS> Oh, yeah, I didn't realise anyone was expecting that
[14:12] <dwatkins> expecting?
[14:12] <BigRedS> A few years ago there was a fuse thing going round for mounting gmail mailboxes as filesystem
[14:12] <BigRedS> s
[14:12] <BigRedS> that's what I thought you meanty
[14:12] <BigRedS> *meant
[14:12] <dwatkins> yeah, I'd heard of it a while ago, doesn't surprise me they shut it down
[14:13] <dwatkins> I thought there was talk more recently of a client to mount your google homedirectory, not sure if I dreamed it, though
[14:13] <BigRedS> Oooh, chromeOS style
[14:13] <BigRedS> That'd be nifty; have drop-box style access to whatever the homedir equivalent is on chromeos
[14:14] <BigRedS> assuming that doesn't do a wave
[14:14] <dwatkins> indeed, although I can see there being many potential pitfalls relating to the amount and type of content
[14:14] <dwatkins> "Your home directory has been disabled because ti contains too much pink" ;)
[14:15] <BigRedS> Actually, it doesn't make sense for chromeos to see it as a block device. It'd just be an object store like s3 or something
[14:15] <BigRedS> haha
[14:15] <Myrtti> pink mentioned
[14:15] <dwatkins> Myrtti: it was a pterry misquote ;)
[14:15] <dwatkins> the demon in the camera box said he'd run out of pink in the harem or something
[14:15] <dwatkins> anyway *ahem* moving on
[14:16] <dwatkins> I gather you can write APIs to access the Amazon store, but you can't mount it directly, I think there are some clients, not sure how mature/stable they are
[14:17] <BigRedS> s3? there's a fuse driver for it
[14:17] <dwatkins> nifty, I thought you couldn't use it from the UK but perhaps that's changed.
[14:17] <BigRedS> Yeah, I've a few machines using it to backup I think
[14:18] <BigRedS> i'm supposed to be using s3sync instead now, but I don't think everyone is
[14:19] <dwatkins> ...which is apparently no longer being developed
[14:21] <BigRedS> dwatkins: you mean it's stable? :)
[14:21] <BigRedS> (which the fuse s3 driver isn't)
[14:21] <dwatkins> haha, I wouldn't go that far
[14:21] <BigRedS> well, it's unchanging :)
[14:21] <dwatkins> I see what you did there, BigRedS
[14:22] <BigRedS> I'm a debian user, I like things that aren't updated much
[14:22] <dwatkins> The phrase "EU bucket support" suggests I could use it, I shall investigate further this evening.
[14:29] <oimon> anyone tried using bumblebee video card swtiching?
[14:30] <popey> i dont have a dual card system, so no
[14:30] <oimon> i do , but finding documentation rather lacking
[14:35] <czajkowski> AlanBell: seen the chicken that liked to stand on one leg http://pix.ie/czajkowski/2809009/in/album/437977
[14:35] <oimon> there is something seriously odd with this vaio laptop. when booting into bios mode it chugs out serious heat and fan goes crazy
[14:36] <diplo> Isn't that normal VAIO behaviour
[14:36] <diplo> I had one that was like that all the time, and bosses new one is like it as well
[14:36] <BigRedS> yeah, when it comes to space heating, Sony seems to be the new Apple
[14:36] <diplo> Seem to run hot and fans go all the time
[14:37] <bigcalm> On my current phone plan, I can pay 200 quid and have a HTC One X. Don't know if I want that now or wait for the SGS3 to come out :(
[14:37] <bigcalm> Could have the SGS2 for 190 quid
[14:37] <dwatkins> I've not had a phone plan that gives me a phone for years, I just buy them outright and get a SIM-only deal.
[14:38] <diplo> Me to dwatkins
[14:38] <davmor2> czajkowski: prod just cause I havent
[14:38] <diplo> Except I'd like a more powerful phone, next thing on the savings list
[14:40] <czajkowski> davmor2: herrrro
[14:43] <dwatkins> I was very hesitant to get a smartphone, I prefer discrete devices in general.
[15:17] <AlanBell> czajkowski: nice chicken
[15:17] <AlanBell> czajkowski: I got some new ones, I have 4 now
[15:18] <czajkowski> AlanBell: yay
[15:18] <czajkowski> AlanBell: we wer up at Bunratty, then out to the cliffs of moher and down to lahinch for munchables
[15:18] <AlanBell> I see you went to the cliffs  of moher
[15:19] <AlanBell> Bunratty is interesting
[15:19] <czajkowski> yup was a lot of fun
[15:20] <AlanBell> so you are still out there?
[15:20] <czajkowski> me yuip till the 22nd
[15:26] <dogmatic69> in bash what is this $$? BACKUP=/tmp/backup.$$
[15:30] <BigRedS> $$ is teh PID of the current process
[15:30] <dogmatic69> ah
[15:31] <dogmatic69> so they using it like a random number there
[15:31] <BigRedS> well, to get a uniqueish filename, yeah
[15:31] <MooDoo> 40 on sunday :S eeeeeeeeeeeeek
[15:31] <BigRedS> it's a pretty common way to do it, so you can be fairly sure that no other process is creating filenames ending with your PID
[15:32] <BigRedS> 'cause using random numbers is more open to collision
[15:33] <dogmatic69> ye
[15:33] <AlanBell> MooDoo: 0x25
[15:33] <dogmatic69> :( apt-get install -> E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)
[15:34] <AlanBell> err, 0x28 even
[15:34] <MooDoo> AlanBell: that's the one.
[15:41] <bigcalm> How does one install a server only type setup?
[15:41] <bigcalm> I don't want the GUI installed and running all the time
[15:42] <BigRedS> bigcalm: with the alternative install CD
[15:42] <BigRedS> I think there might even be a server one...
[15:42] <bigcalm> Aha, thank you
[15:42] <AlanBell> there is a server install cd
[15:42] <AlanBell> I have lots of them
[15:42] <GirlyGirl> bigcalm: Not the alternate install cd, either the server or minimal cd
[15:43] <BigRedS> Doesn't teh alternate CD do it? I'm sure that's all I've ever used
[15:43] <BigRedS> but I don't think I hav3e for a long time
[15:43] <AlanBell> that has a text mode installer and can do the OEM install and some more complicated RAID setups, not sure if it can do no-gui though
[15:44] <BigRedS> ah, fair enough. Maybve I've just mis-remembered
[15:45] <bigcalm> Some overlapping text when viewing http://mirror01.th.ifl.net/releases//precise/ in chromium
[15:47] <AlanBell> bigcalm: right until you launch the developer tools, then it fixes itself magically :(
[15:48] <AlanBell> or refresh
[15:48] <bigcalm> Refreshed and it fixed itself
[15:48] <bigcalm> What an odd page
[16:10] <bigcalm> Do you think that 12.04 is ready to use in anger on my home dev server and just upgrade as and when needed. Or wipe and reinstall come 26th?
[16:15] <dogmatic69> bigcalm: I am using the desktop version and its ok. I am sure the server has less problems because there is no unity
[16:15] <bigcalm> :)
[16:21] <popey> yes bigcalm
[16:21] <popey> just upgrade
[16:22] <gord> i think that means you can #blamepopey if everything goes wrong ;)
[16:23] <davmor2> gord: I thought that was compulsory
[16:23] <popey> seems it
[16:35] <AlanBell> anyone got a few minutes to fill in this consultation document? http://consultation.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/openstandards/
[16:41] <bigcalm> Server is up and running \o/
[16:41] <bigcalm> It's noisier than the Revo :(
[16:43] <StevenR> bigcalm: take the fans out. You probably don't need those.
[16:44] <StevenR> bigcalm: either that, or get lots of revos and cluster them
[16:45]  * bigcalm rolls his eyes
[16:46] <AlanBell> imagine a beowulf clus . . . oh, that meme is out of date
[16:46] <bigcalm> Just a little :D
[16:53] <popey> bigcalm: how many disks in it?
[16:53] <bigcalm> 1 atm
[16:53] <bigcalm> I'm pondering raid
[16:55] <popey> i have 5 disks in mine
[17:06] <bigcalm> Do I want to go ott and get this? http://www.crucial.com/uk/store/mpartspecs.aspx?mtbpoid=B9C4F5D5A5CA7304
[17:07] <davmor2> bigcalm: it is on the plus side a lot more flexible though
[17:08] <bigcalm> Quite a bit cheaper here: http://www.pixmania.co.uk/uk/uk/9050842/art/crucial/ram-memory-module-2-x-4-g.html?srcid=369
[17:08] <bigcalm> Just want to make sure I order the right stuff
[17:12] <shauno> what's the most sensible way to type foreign accents?  I'm struggling to find most of what I need
[17:15] <davmor2> shauno: look up the key code in a charater map
[17:17] <shauno> I can't reach ç with the compose key?
[17:17] <mgdm> compose + c + comma
[17:19] <shauno> ah, so they're there, I just have to find them.  that's a start then :)
[17:24] <mgdm> acute accents are compose + ' + letter, grave are compose + ` + letter, circumflex is compose + ^ + letter, umlaut (or whatever it's called is compose + " + letter, etc :)
[17:27] <bigcalm> I was wrong, the pixmania link is for non-ecc ram
[17:30] <bigcalm> Do I really need ECC?
[17:35] <mgdm> bigcalm: probably not
[17:39] <bigcalm> mgdm: home dev server, if it makes any difference
[17:39] <mgdm> I'd guess if it was running a RAID with stuff you cared about on, then maybe
[17:48] <dogmatic69> where would i submit a bug for evolution?
[17:54] <davmor2> dogmatic69: open a terminal and type "ubuntu-bug evolution
[17:54] <davmor2> "
[17:54] <dogmatic69> k, just making sure that is the correct place
[17:55] <dogmatic69> davmor2: should I search for existing bugs first? some projects dont like dups
[17:57] <davmor2> dogmatic69: you can have a look by all means, it's always nice unless it is really old then you can do an up-to-date one
[17:59] <dogmatic69> cool
[18:16] <daubers> Evening
[18:17] <shauno> I wonder how crazy I'd have to be to just write my own kxb map
[18:17] <davmor2> daubers: hello dude
[18:17] <davmor2> shauno: highly
[18:25] <AlanBell> Daviey: how did you get on with packaging openERP?
[19:14] <OmNomDePlume> Dammit, Liverpool scored.
[19:15] <dogmatic69> what was that app that you can access any pc/OS from the same kb
[19:16] <dogmatic69> can anyone guess a name?
[19:16] <bigcalm> Synergy
[19:16] <dwatkins> synergy? vnc?
[19:16] <dwatkins> (with x2vnc, at least)
[19:16] <dogmatic69> synergy is the one :)
[19:16] <dogmatic69> thanks
[19:17] <bigcalm> :)
[19:17] <dwatkins> It's possible to secure synergy, worth doing on anything but a home network, imho, dogmatic69
[19:17] <dogmatic69> its a home network, just too lazy to reach over to my laptop
[19:18] <bigcalm> It's very useful
[19:18] <dwatkins> what OS do the two machines run, dogmatic69?
[19:18] <dogmatic69> maybe I should use a virtual desktop or something
[19:18] <dogmatic69> then I dont even need to twist my neck
[19:18] <dogmatic69> ubuntu + windows
[19:18] <dwatkins> depends what you're using them for, I have about 5 displays on my desk
[19:18] <dogmatic69> lol
[19:19] <dogmatic69> I have 1 :(
[19:19] <dogmatic69> used to have 2 buy my moms monitor died so gave her one
[19:20] <dogmatic69> tbh, I only have the windows laptop to run some SEO apps
[19:20] <dwatkins> this is a desk which needs synergy http://i.eho.st/pjnl3glv.jpg ;)
[19:20] <dogmatic69> there are none for linux
[19:20] <dogmatic69> how easy is it to remote desktop to windows from 12.04?
[19:21] <dwatkins> if it's anything like 10.04, it's as easy as typing sudo apt-get install rdesktop && rdesktop <hostname>
[19:22] <dwatkins> http://packages.ubuntu.com/oneiric/rdesktop
[19:22] <dogmatic69> nice thanks. I will try that
[19:22] <dwatkins> looks like the package still exists, so should work fine, assuming you have remote access setup right
[19:23] <dogmatic69> no rdesktop
[19:23] <dogmatic69> oh there was, just auto complete was not working
[19:25] <dwatkins> had me wondering there, dogmatic69 ;)
[19:25] <OmNomDePlume> rofl Liverpool's keeper's got sent off.
[19:26] <dwatkins> not for a hand-ball, I assume OmNomDePlume
[19:27] <dogmatic69> OmNomDePlume: who they playing?
[19:29] <OmNomDePlume> Blackburn away.
[19:29] <OmNomDePlume> dwatkins no, he took out a Blackburn player.
[19:29] <OmNomDePlume> Thing is, their #1 keeper is already suspended.
[19:30] <OmNomDePlume> And now their #2 keeper just got red carded.
[19:30] <dogmatic69> lol
[19:30] <OmNomDePlume> So in the next match, they have to play some guy who hasn't played in the Premier League for three years.
[19:31] <dogmatic69> :D
[19:31] <dogmatic69> OmNomDePlume: who do you support?
[19:32] <OmNomDePlume> FC Young Boys.
[19:33] <OmNomDePlume> It is a real team in Switzerland.
[19:33] <OmNomDePlume> Our greatest rivals: Grasshopper Club Zurich.
[19:35] <dogmatic69> lol
[19:37] <OmNomDePlume> "Kubuntu To Be Sponsored By Blue Systems, Rather Than Canonical"
[19:40] <MartijnVdS> OmNomDePlume: Startup sound will be the song 'Blue' by Eiffel 65
[22:23] <ali1234> hey remember when i was explaining why switching to a different distro over unity was a perfectly reasonable thing to do, because it was obvious canonical would not put as much resources into alternatives as those other distros do?
[22:23] <ali1234> and you were all like "lol, xfce is in the repos, what more you want?"
[22:24] <ali1234> well, i guess it turns out that merely packaging up a desktop and putting it in the repos isn't enough to get a working system
[22:26] <alexcockell> Umm - I'm not really looking forward to being forced onto Unity...
[22:27] <alexcockell> A lot of users are going to be pretty screwed - and they'll be people like me - who bought kit preinstalled...
[22:27] <ali1234> it's the only decent open source desktop with serious resources behind it imo
[22:28] <ali1234> alexcockell: wouldn't they know what they were buying?
[22:29] <popey> i guess he means people who bought a machine with 10.04 and are upgrading to 12.04
[22:30] <ali1234> i suppose. i heard opensuse is pretty easy to install tho...
[22:30] <alexcockell> Or like me - bought a machine with 8.04, accepted upgrade to 10.04...
[22:30] <ali1234> isn't it about time for a hardware upgrade then?
[22:31] <alexcockell> Thinkpad R61i should be fine...
[22:31] <alexcockell> I hope..
[22:31] <alexcockell> Or my Lenovo Ideapad S12...
[22:31] <dwatkins> ali1234: last time I used Debian, I was impressed with the integration between window managers - you could even switch between them, iirc.
[22:32] <ali1234> hopefully someone will step up and provide real long term support (ie as long as anyone wants to pay for it) for 10.04
[22:32] <alexcockell> Might it be a case of sending my machines back to Linux Emporium?
[22:32] <ali1234> after 4 years?
[22:33] <ali1234> actually i suspect that by the time 10.04 support really runs out gnome will have got their act together and made something actually usable
[22:33] <ali1234> they've already done a huge u-turn on gnome-panel from what i can tell
[22:33] <alexcockell> And will it be available via Upgrade Manager?
[22:34] <ali1234> sure
[22:34] <alexcockell> ... by the time 10.04 goes EOL?
[22:34] <ali1234> it's available now if you can stand to use the buggy gnome-panel 3.0
[22:34] <alexcockell> No.  Would want to just accept the upgrade in place like I did from Hardy to Lucid - and have the fucker work...
[22:35] <alexcockell> ... like it did... i waited 3-4 months in when accepting the updates...
[22:35] <alexcockell> .. sorry upGRADES...
[22:35] <ali1234> i have no idea what will happen if you do that
[22:35] <ali1234> i'd be suprised if it worked at all tbh
[22:35] <ali1234> though they claim they just got it working the other day
[22:36] <ali1234> major gtk upgrade was always going to cause problems
[22:36] <ali1234> it caused enough from natty to oneiric
[22:36] <alexcockell> Was meaning - that waiting for newLTS.1, meant all the real nasties were ironed out.
[22:36] <ali1234> yeah that's generally a good idea
[22:37] <ali1234> if you do that upgrade i would expect you'll end up with gnome panel still installed
[22:37] <ali1234> then you just select it on the login screen
[22:37] <alexcockell> Harks back to the behaviour in the commercial world, aka "always wait for SP1"
[22:37] <ali1234> but gnome-panel on gtk3 is currently extremely buggy
[22:38] <alexcockell> Yeah - except I'd be going from 10.04 Netbook on my S12, and 10.04 on my R61.
[22:38] <ali1234> but you've got longer than until 12.04.1 to be released, before support ends on 10.04
[22:38] <alexcockell> Yeah - I know - next March would be my final upgrade point...
[22:38] <ali1234> so about a year
[22:38] <ali1234> something will have to give before then i think
[22:38] <alexcockell> And hopefully all those improvements would be backported to 12.04....
[22:39] <ali1234> depends how you define improvements really
[22:39] <ali1234> i expect gnome panel to get some love when LTS people start upgrading
[22:39] <directhex> i used to upgrade about a month before release
[22:40] <ali1234> i used to do that too
[22:40] <directhex> now i wait until release at the earliest
[22:40] <ali1234> now i upgrade to +1 as soon as it is available
[22:40] <ali1234> since i got tired of unity being so buggy and bugs not getting fixed until the next cycle due to the development model
[22:41] <Laney> someone forgot to tell my gnome-panel 3 to be awful
[22:42] <ali1234> there's nothing wrong with it except it just crashes all the time when you try to configure it
[22:42] <ali1234> once you get that done it seems ok
[22:43] <Laney> missed that memo too
[22:43] <ali1234> i expect it has something to do with porting all the plugins from gtk 2.0?
[22:43] <Laney> a ton of them were removed
[22:44] <ali1234> all the ones i used to use are still there
[22:45] <Laney> many were ported too
[22:47] <directhex> still need to plan a migration for 10.04 users in the office
[22:48] <alexcockell> I hope the release mgt bods will have a load of transitional packages ready to ease people in...
[22:49] <AlanBell> they have been doing a bunch of 10.04 to 12.04 upgrade tests
[22:50] <alexcockell> And anything back about the results of those?
[22:51] <directhex> it's an ongoing process.
[22:56] <popey> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Precise%20Upgrade%20Testing%20Dashboard/
[22:57] <popey> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Precise%20Upgrade%20Testing%20Dashboard/job/precise-upgrade-lucid-desktop/
[23:03] <ubuntuuk-planet> [Jonathan Riddell] Kubuntu to be Sponsored by Blue Systems - http://blogs.kde.org/node/4565
[23:07] <directhex> mmmmmm cola
[23:08] <Azelphur> anyone know how long home made caramel/toffee/fudge would last?
[23:08] <directhex> Azelphur: stored how?
[23:09] <Azelphur> however is sane I guess
[23:09]  * Azelphur has his eyes on someone selling half pound blocks of them...home made...want
[23:10] <directhex> a week or two at room temperature, in proper airtight packaging.
[23:10] <directhex> longer in the fridge, even longer in the freezer
[23:10] <directhex> in all cases, wax paper is key, as is airtightness
[23:14] <Azelphur> directhex: so if I ordered like half a pound of it
[23:14] <Azelphur> I should stash a bunch of it in the freezer
[23:14] <Azelphur> and then it'd last
[23:14] <popey> https://www.samba.org/samba/security/CVE-2012-1182
[23:15] <directhex> Azelphur: yeah. waxproof paper to separate any layers of it you don't want to stick together, airtight tub.
[23:15] <Azelphur> fun :D
[23:16] <Azelphur> now the question is...which 2 do I get...caramel, fudge, toffee
[23:17] <Azelphur> can't decide D: